A Checklist To Determine That He’s Just Not That Into You, Once And For All!

Evan Marc Katz

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Two years ago, I met a guy online. We quickly found that we had a lot in common and conversation was easy. We don’t live far apart and made general plans to meet up for drinks after he got back from a trip. We kept in contact over the first couple of weeks he was gone, but by the end of this trip, the emails diminished dramatically. I soon found out he began dating a much younger girl (he’s 27, she’s 20, I’m 25) that he had known for a couple of years and was traveling with him. I was upset, but not at him, just the circumstances. We didn’t talk very regularly after that.

Flash forward to two months ago. I heard through the grapevine that he was having some relationship problems and was feeling down. I sent him a message to keep his head up, hoping things got better, out of concern. He soon got back to me and sort of ran me down on what was happening, asking for my thoughts. I gave him my honest “girl interpretation,” as his girlfriend has been dragging him around and couldn’t decide if she wanted to be together. (He’s been trying to win her back but has finally seemed to realize it isn’t going to work, and that he needs to move on.) He’s kept me updated and seemed to appreciate my honesty. We’ve chatted in general, and he almost always initiates the conversation. He even asked if we were going to be at the same event in a few months. I admit that my interest has rekindled, but I have kept my distance and just tried to be a sounding board for him out of respect.

My question is: do you think there’s a possibility for something there between us? With him talking to me about his currently ending relationship, I wasn’t sure if he just saw me as someone to talk with and just a friend or if he wanted to give me a little insight on himself. He told me he will “need time” to get over her and is not one to jump to another relationship quickly, fearing a rebound. That is OK (and admirable) to me. Am I just the nice girl who gives him straight answers? Or do you think this reconnection could lead to something down the line? Thanks for any input! –Dyana

Dear Dyana,

If you didn’t write this letter, I would have. Your issue is so epidemic that there should be a book devoted to it. A book that says the same thing over and over and over again until the message becomes crystal-clear and it sears itself on your brain, never to be forgotten. A book called, I don’t know… “He’s Just Not That Into You.”

Self-help books are fascinating for that reason. You read them, you smile, you nod, and everything you read just goes in one ear and out the other. For me, the best example is “The Power of Now”. I “get it” but I don’t live it. Pretty much every woman who writes me on this blog “gets” the concept of “HJNTIY” but doesn’t actually realize when it applies to her that He’s! Just! Not! That! Into! You! You want to know when he IS into you?

Pretty much every woman who writes me on this blog “gets” the concept of “HJNTIY” but doesn’t actually realize when it applies to her that He’s! Just! Not! That! Into! You!

He calls to say, “when can I see you again?”

He reserves plans with you every Friday and Saturday night.

He calls/texts/or emails every single day.

He calls himself your boyfriend.

He wants to make it clear you’re not seeing anyone else.

He sleeps with you regularly.

He talks about a future.

He tells you he loves you.

If you need to print this blog post out as a checklist and tape it to your bathroom mirror to remind yourself how a real boyfriend acts, that’s cool by me. Just please, stop ignoring the list and acting like your distant guy is somehow different than everyone else’s distant guy! Seriously.

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123 Comments »Filed Under Dating

123 Responses to “A Checklist To Determine That He’s Just Not That Into You, Once And For All!”

1. Curly Girl 1

   When first I heard this phrase on S&TC I felt like Charlotte did–it was a big revelation. And I definitely changed my behavior toward guys after hearing it. As in, I wouldn’t see the guy if I got the vibe that he wasn’t into me as a person but into me as a past-time. I love my guy friends, so I’ve no problem if a guy isn’t into me in that way if we have other things that make the association worthwhile. I am friends with a few guys I met online (but never slept with–important).

   This insight does go against the self-help advice to women that you used to read about being nice to guys, giving them space to sort out their feelings, etc. Which usually led to your being a doormat for some guy who didn’t want you but interpreted your being “nice” and “friendly” and “understanding” as an invitation to be used. Because let’s face it–if you think a guy isn’t that into you, if you think he’s just calling every once in awhile to sniff around, you are probably not going to respond in a nice and friendly and understanding way. And then a whole lot of guys are going to be complaining on blogs about how nasty and bitter women aare and wondering why they can’t just go out and have a good time with you.

   Then there is the situation where the guy who wasn’t that into you does a reversal after you blow him off and decides that now he’s into you. Which is really annoying, because you gave him his chance and he blew it.

   And then there are some guys who are really not so aggressive at pursuing, and those guys are just going to get trammelled once all the women use the checklist.

   Still. We gals need to use the checklist. Maybe there needs to be another checklist for more timid guys who don’t know how to show a woman they are into her.

2. lets 2

   OUCH !!!!!!!!!!

3. Ruby 3

   I have to say that I’m not in complete agreement with Evan on this one. I actually know of a similar situation where the guy ended up with the other girl. He met both women around the same time and was dating both. He decided that he had electric chemistry with Beth and broke up with Amy. They did agree to be friends. Over the course of the next year or two, Beth turned out to be quite unstable, and the relationship was volatile. They broke up and eventually the man started dating Amy again. He and Amy have now been living together for the last 5 years, and are very happy. So one might speculate that the man initially just wasn’t that into Amy, but eventually he ended up with her. This isn’t the first time I’ve seen a similar scenario played out.

   I will say that through it all, Amy kept a safe distance and didn’t allow herself to be used. When they started dating again, she asked many questions, and didn’t rush into anything. She still let the guy pursue her. So I would say that Dyana needs to set boundaries, stay in touch with this guy, but keep her options open and not count on anything.

4. Steve 4

   HIJNTIY is just common sense that is ignored

   One of the signs of the neurosis of narcissism is believing that reality, the rules or “the way things work” just don’t apply to you personally.

   It is my understanding that all people have a healthy amount of narcissism, but that it becomes a neurosis ( or a personality disorder ) when it becomes more pronounced past a certain point.

5. Selena 5

   I confess I’m baffled by someone who would initiate contact with a guy who blew her off for someone else 2 YEARS later. From the letter it sounds like they only had one date. This is just …ugh!

   TAPE THE LIST TO YOUR MIRROR Dyana.

6. Diana 6

   Are there varying degrees of HIJNTIY? For instance, how about if he’s not calling/writing every single day, but he still wants to see you every week? Isn’t it possible for the guy to be interested, but not necessarily in rapid fire mode?

   I think Curly Girl makes a good point about the more timid guys, too.

7. Joe 7

   Like Ruby, I don’t think it’s that black and white either. People grow and change over time. These two people could have been in different places two years ago; maybe they’re in the same place now. The past couple of months she’s been behaving as a sounding board, not a potential date. Assuming Dyana is interested in this guy, she does need to make it clear to him. He may not see her as anything more than a friend at the moment, but he may be open to the possibility of more. Or he could run screaming in the other direction. Who knows?

8. Curious 8

   I guess I’m thinking about my post from yesterday, about whether or not it would be OK to contact a guy I met once who didn’t follow up even though he said he wanted to. Wasn’t a problem for me, and isn’t a problem now. But I wouldn’t label it as a HJNTIY situation. There wasn’t a blow off, there wasn’t any bad feeling during the date, etc. So, someone who doesn’t pursue, you don’t know why. Maybe HJNTIY, or maybe he would be if circumstances were different. You hear a lot of stories like that. Like with EMK, not remembering the situation exactly, where he met his wife maybe online and didn’t follow up but then a year later they met in person or something…I don’t know the specifics. But how is that not a HJNTIY situation? Maybe you can instruct us here, EMK. In other words, maybe you don’t want to shut someone out unless you have a bad experience of him using you in a dating situation. But if you have a neutral experience, where nothing happened, the chance is there that something might change in the future. So you can be open without being the doormat that Curly G. is talking about. And if a guy hasn’t hurt you and you like him and are willing to be just friends, what’s the problem? As long as you don’t get into the situation on here before, where some woman was in love with her F.B. and he thought they were just friends.

9. bella 9

   I generally feel uncomfortable about leaving advice on a letter like this, because as readers, we never know the full story, or how extreme a situation it really is, or isn’t. So with that in mind, I’ll share some generalized insight that could apply universally:

   Even the guys who are timid will come after you if they want you.
   It may take them a little longer, but they’ll do it.

   They may do it in a round about awkward way, but you’ll know it’s happening when it does.

   My opinion: He’s making her the safety net. It’s way easier to end a relationship when you know there’s someone else waiting for you in the wings.

   And even though she thinks she’s genuinely being a “friend” to him now, I don’t think she is. I think she’s being the “I’ll act like a friend so that you figure out I’m awesome and cool and then you’ll fall in love with me because that’s what I really want.”

   That’s not called friendship, it’s called ulterior motive.

   And if you think I’m wrong, then why in the world would you really want to help this guy so much? Did he help you move to your new apartment and haul boxes for 6 hours? Did he take you out for drinks when you got a raise?

   You like-like him. And you want him to like-like you.
   And maybe one day that will happen.
   But for now, he sounds like a mess.

   The best part of the letter was this sentence: “He has been trying to win her back, but has finally seemed to realize it isn’t going to work and that he needs to move on.”

   Hmm. Interesting.

10. Evan Marc Katz 10

    The problem, Curious, is all the wishful thinking on the part of the women who refuse to recognize that HJNTIY.

    You can even read it in these comments – “There’s one time that a guy really WAS into this woman two years later…”, “What about shy guys – maybe they really ARE into me,” “Isn’t it possible that he could fall in love with me later after being friends for awhile?” “What if he’s taking his time, seeing me once a week”…

    Everyone’s looking for the exception instead of looking at the rule. Is it POSSIBLE that the guy who isn’t calling, isn’t seeing you regularly, isn’t committing is ENAMORED with you? Yeah. But probably not.

    Fact is: if you don’t know that he’s your devoted boyfriend right now, he’s probably not that into you.

    Ignore at your own peril, my friends.

    Much love,

    Evan

11. Diana 11

    Joe #7: Excellent point about people being in different places, but maybe meshing now due to how they have changed. It really isn’t that black and white. I think HJNTIY is a great guide, but I am not sure I would close all possible doors, provided that I curbed my expectations and emotions.

12. Selena 12

    What about this business of him telling her he would “need time” to get over his relationship, not wanting to rush into a rebound, etc., etc.? Isn’t that JNIY code for “I want to keep my options open being newly single, don’t expect me to date you exclusively, if at all”?

13. Donna 13

    Thank God for Evan. In a past post, he said Men Do Exactly As They Want To Do. And if they’re not doing it, well guess what? It’s because they don’t want to. What else do you need to know? That is such a freeing notion which has helped me tremendously. You no longer have to wonder how to make a man be “enamored” of you. They either are or they aren’t. Even they can’t explain it, but it happens pretty much right away. So move on and choose from among the ones who want you ! End of story !!!

14. Steve 14

    I think Curly Girl makes a good point about the more timid guys, too.

    Would most women want a guy that timid as a boyfriend?

15. Curious 15

    Thanks for the comment, EMK. I guess the missing piece is that these are all women who are into the guys in a one-way kinda way–and usually I’m not into people (any people–girlfriends, employers, the odd family member or two) who aren’t into me. But a lot of people interest me for different reasons, so I think I can reach out to a person for whatever reason and see how it goes. In romance, though, I pretty much sit back and wait and usually someone comes a-knockin’! (Not always the ones I want. )

    There’s also that advice that says that your best partner prospects are guys you are friends with–that you should be friends first, lovers later. That advice usually comes from female dating advisors, though. Along with “be open to all men” advice (followed by “but don’t sleep with any of them”–which is kinda difficult to pull off because of the way guys mistake being “open” with being “willing,” as was mentioned before).

    But you know who is a real friend and who isn’t, doesn’t matter what the gender is. Guess I answered my own question.

16. Ryan 16

    This guy will never be into you…

    http://www.findingmygoddess.com/

17. LeahB61 17

    Thank you Evan for the list! I will tape it to the bathroom mirror.

18. WithLove 18

    Most everybody makes great points. Donna said it perfectly though. It’s the rule to start out with….IF there is a chance things change then proceed and beware….go into it with your eyes WIDE OPEN. Don’t be afraid to walk away…..like buying a car, dont fall so in love with it that everyone in the showroom including the receptionist knows you can’t live without it. They got ya by the…well….they got ya. You can weed out alot of people if you use the same insight Donna and Evan are talking about. There can be grey areas but again, better know yourself, know them, and stay in reality to weather through that. Dyana, sounds to me like this guy is considering you a nice friend….note the word friend. If you let this relationship continue have no false dreams or hopes. Remember girl, stay in reality…not cold or removed…just apply the rule Evan spoke of…that will protect your heart. Unless there are definite changes towards those rules by him…be careful. Wishing you the best…consider the “list” your compass and barometer……..of sorts!

19. metsgirl 19

    I found this post interesting because for so looooong, I just didn’t get it. Maybe it’s because I had to turn 40 and I grew up a little….=) But now I regret all the time I wasted on men that really were JNTIM.

    Because I’m learning to articulate what I want and need from a man….I’m quite surprised how receptive (some) men can be. I just assumed all guys were jerks so I acted accordingly. There was nothing for a man to be “into” because I was willing to be the doormat just so I could be close to him. I’m not assuming to know any specifics in the letter but Dyan has a responsibility to be honest with “her friend”. I think Bella #9 really hit it when she mentioned “ulterior motives”. That’s exactly what it is. And we (women) can be great at justifying our actions / motives. Great post.

20. Carol 20

    Point taken. I’m going to cut this out and paste on my refrigerator in case I forget, try to make exceptions, or excuses.

21. Diana 21

    To Steve #14: I think it’s possible for there to be shy guys who turn out to be great boyfriends. As Evan has said before, if he’s “really” into you, he’ll call you the very next day. Well, what if he calls three days later instead? I know this sounds like a perilous excuse to Evan and others, but I am not going to judge the guy’s intentions quite that soon. Nothing in life is black and white. I take HJNTIY as sound and solid advice, yet I also listen to my own intuition.

    So what are the rules for SHE’s just not that into you?

22. Mr_Right 22

    I would think that when a guy is dating, he typically waits a day to two days, to possibly even up to a week to call back from a first date to schedule a second.

    At least, that’s what I did.

    But when I met my girl all rules were thrown out the window (darn her wonderfulness! ^_^). I got her number, instead of waiting a day like I always did I called her back that evening. At the end of the first date I called her back that evening instead of the next day to schedule a second. I realized that I was really into her and screw the rules of dating (just try not to make too big of a fool of yourself… always a key point).

23. zann 23

    THANK YOU Bella,EMK, Donna, and everyone else who gets it.

    Listen, I’m a diplomatic person, and I agree that there are very few things in life that are black and white. But the HJNTIY Checklist is one of them. I think people misunderstand what’s being said about the HJNTIY criteria. Whether you met him 2 years ago and the timing/situation was wrong, or he was about to go to Europe, or his mother just died, or his girlfriend just married his best friend, or he was fearful of getting hurt again — all of that is irrevelant & is not the point. The only thing that matters is what he’s doing right now. Is he pursuing you (right now) in a way that looks like Evan’s checklist? If not, the answer could not be clearer. But women (a/k/a me) do not go quietly into the night. Oh, no. Because even faced with these facts, here’s how you, me, and just about every other “unsure” woman on the planet will respond to those facts: “Well, no he’s not doing that, BUT….” When I finally got it through my thick head that there simply are no buts when it comes to whether or not he’s into me, my dating life and attitude towards relationships got so much better. So. Much. Better. As someone else has mentioned, it’s a huge relief, almost a blessing, to finally get real about this and stop the guesswork, the endless re-thinking of it, the hashing it out with your friends over & over. I am that woman who would take a kind gesture, compliment, or intense conversation with a guy and so completely distort it that it would literally be REBORN in my head as, “Wow. He is obviously hot for me. Clearly, we were destined to be. Yes, I will have his babies.” Pathetic. The checklist has been my guide ever since I finally read the book, HJNTIY, and it has never double-crossed me. I have yet to meet the exception to the rule, but I’m not saying it can never, ever happen for you. I just don’t plan on it happening to me. And that has made my life much less stressful, and me much less bitter, because I’m not stringing myself along wasting my time on a guy who is not & never will be on the same page as me. If I choose to ignore the writing on the wall &go into Fantasyland, then no one but me is responsible for the big let down. Amen.

24. starthrower68 24

    Dyana,

    I have great compassion for your situation as I have “been there done that, bought the t-shirt”. It finally occured to me one day, which was quite an AH-HA moment, that if a guy says complimentary things to you about you, but makes no effort to court you, then why have any interest in that guy? I refuse to chase anyone. I don’t mean to me harsh, but it’s contingent upon any man who’s interested in me to back his words up with actions and if he doesn’t, I will not give any mental or emotional energy to that situation. I value the people who value me and spend my time and energy on them. I don’t concern myself with those who do not.

    I think one thing that you need to bear in mind – and this is very important – if this guy is not that into you, don’t take it personally. Don’t think there is something wrong with you just because he’s not after you. And really, don’t try to figure him out, either. It’s best just to let sleeping dogs lie.

25. Curious 25

    Diana@21: Yeah, I was thinking about that, too. In general I believe that usually if HJNTIY, YJNTIH. (They say that masochists exist, but I don’t buy it.) You gotta look inside to find the happy spot that knows how to have good, respectful relationships with everybody. Which takes a pause, at least.

    So I don’t think that Dyana is into that guy, either. I mean, he’s not even a very good friend, and she’s gotta know that on some level. Maybe she just wants somebody and is getting a little desperate. Don’t waste your pretty!!! (Isn’t that another S&TC saying?)

26. Cilla 26

    I think there’s a certain sadness to the whole HJNTIY phenomenon. HJNTIY if he’s not calling, not emailing, not texting, not asking you out again, playing the field, sleeping with someone else, not coming home, refusing to have sex, disappearing for days on end, making you beg for time together, keeping you hanging without a commitment, flirting with other women in front of you, constantly raving about his ex … all situations from the book.

    Men do these things, and what do women do? Call it “denial,” but they’re actually giving men the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he’s really shy. Maybe he’s afraid of strong women. Maybe he’s really busy at work. Maybe he’s just getting over another relationship. Maybe he doesn’t know what real love is. Maybe his grandmother’s sick. Maybe he wants to be friends first. Maybe he was hit by a bus and he’s lying unconscious in a hospital bed. Maybe his phone is broken. Maybe he lost my number. Maybe he’s a secret agent for the CIA.

    There’s a kind of purity about giving someone the benefit of the doubt–naive and misguided in this instance apparently, but definitely more altruistic and forgiving than instantly assuming the worst about someone or just writing him off with a shrug. I’ve used the HJNTIM mantra of self-protection on more than one occasion, but I don’t find it as freeing and empowering as it’s supposed to be. I just find it kind of disappointing and pathetic. It seems like there should be a more honest and direct way for the sexes to communicate in the first place.

27. bella 27

    I was trying to think about what the rules might be for a GIRL who’s not that into a guy. And it kind of feels like the same rules apply.

    If she doesn’t reply to your texts, doesn’t call you back, doesn’t make time to see you, or makes you feel less than awesome, she’s probably not that into you.

    But I imagine it’s harder for men to figure that out, because women have a harder time “rejecting” someone. Unlike men, yes, we will give our number to someone we don’t like, or go out to dinner with him even though we don’t think he’s cute.

    But the one thing I think women don’t lie about, is body language. When we like you, we lean in and smile. When we don’t, we cross our arms, step back, or just turn around and keep talking to our friends.

    For both genders it’s all about paying attention to what is actually happening, not what you’re hoping will happen. And if it happened once, two years ago, chances are that coupon has long expired.

    If you’re over-questioning someone’s intentions (ie: going so far as to seek advice on the Internet about it), chances are, you’re clawing through muck to find one tiny, hopeful, little gem of possibility.

    Also remember: Even if someone is genuinely into you, they might not be into having a relationship. Not everyone is focused on finding “the one” at the same time and place that you are. So if you feel like there is chemistry, you may be right! However, they just might not have any desire (or ability) to build off of that and develop more.

    Therefore, like Evan says, instead of waiting for them to become available, go out and find someone who already is.

28. Steve 28

    @16 He looks like the actor who played Colonel Klink from the old Hogan’s Heros series

29. Steve 29

    @Diana Jun 25th 2009 at 11:51 am 21

    She Is Just Not That Into You (SIJNTI):

    Ask Yourself The Rhetorical Question:
    “If I was interested in somebody, would I be responding like that?”

    ( w seeking men, men seeking men, and women seeking women simply change to the appropriate pronouns )

    Complicated Version For Those In Denial Who Need It Spelled Out:

    1. She is the rare woman of both emotional maturity and backbone who just tells you that she is not interested in dating you.

    2. She always has a reason why she can’t go out with you when you ask her out.

    3. When you are hitting on her, she mentions her boyfriend.

    4. When you are hitting on her she will not give you her contact information. A variation of this is to “facebook” you, which is “sorta” like giving you contact information, but not really. Works for other types of social networking sites too.

    5. She offers to accept your invitation for a data, but only “as friends”

    What about exceptions to 1 – 5?
    Reread and do the Simple Version: and remind yourself while exceptions happen, they are rare. Remind yourself you don’t have to scrounge and go look for someone else.

30. Ruby 30

    I’m not discounting HJNTIY – not at all. Not for nothing have these words touched a deep, collective nerve. I’m just sayin’ that people and situations can change, because I’ve seen it happen. (Even Mr. Big changed for Carrie). And as I also said, Dyana shouldn’t wait around for this guy, nor should she count on anything changing. She should live her life and IF, something changes, great, if not she won’t be keeping herself on the shelf.

31. angela 31

    I agree with #13 and #24. Everyone wants to be the exception. Instead of lookimg at the rule We all have stories about the exception. To me it made things very simple and it was a liberating moment. No more wasted time. Men may say and do a lot of things but it is the followup that counts. Evan, I think one reason many women reject HJNTITY is because if they apply it to the guys they are currently dealing with or recently met. They realize that none of them really are interested. That hope and possibility of a relationship is what many women feed on from one new guy to the next.

32. casualencounters.com/blog 32

    Yeah. And the thing is that if you badger a weak-willed nice guy who is Just Not That Into You into a relationship (it happens – sex and loneliness can lead to some awful decisions), you’ll definitely end up regretting it. Like “wasted years of your life” regret it.
    .-= casualencounters.com/blog´s last blog ..Ashley Madison Review =-.

33. Mr_Right 33

    We should get a “She’s Just Not That Into You” post going.

    She’s Just Not That Into You if:

    You call her after your date, then you call her a few days afterward, and she never responds to either message.

    You get the dreaded “handshake of death” as opposed to a warm hug or kiss at the end of your first date.

    You send her a communication through a dating service and she doesn’t respond.

    She takes a very long time to respond to your emails.

    She doesn’t answer the questions posed in your email.

    If she won’t let you walk her to her car.

    If she’s not comfortable holding your hand on the first date.

    If she doesn’t want to kiss you goodnight after a few dates.

    … Geez, I’m noting a theme here.

    Ok fellas, what others can you come up with?

34. Steve 34

    @33

    - or you get a drink poured on your head, your face slapped and she calls you a pervert. I miss the personal touch by online dating

35. Diana 35

    Dyana’s situation is a classic example of a woman who is speculating and thinking far too much, and she is communicating even less. The reason why something catchy like HJNTIY works is because it not only describes a man’s interest in a nutshell [most of the time], but it provides an instant release valve for the ridiculous pressure and stress that most women put themselves through. Which begs the question? Why do this in the first place!?

    To ask yourself if he will call ~ no biggie, but women allow their emotions, which lead to their thoughts, to drive themselves crazy. When a man senses that a woman would like to hear from him again ~ and has hopefully, verbally communicated this to him rather than expecting him to read her mind ~ but she is centered and in control of her emotions enough to know that if she does not, she will be fine and go about her life as normal, this can sometimes make the man want her even more.

    It IS possible to be interested in seeing someone else again without calling them the very next day or even two days later. You don’t have to already be on cloud nine after the very first date to still be interested in someone. This is just another example of people’s expectations and how they sometimes get in the way.

36. downtowngal 36

    Hey Mr_Right #33,

    I agree w all you say except the holding-hands-on-the-first-date. I know many women (incl myself) are a little shy when first meeting someone. And if it’s a blind date/never met the guy before, just because I may feel apprehensive doesn’t mean I wouldn’t want to have a second date.

37. Sam 37

    I absolutely believe that HJNTIY is a real problem many women have. In some cases it’s so bad that I honestly believe that therapy is a solution. I am totally serious when I believe that this is a condition that should be in the DSM.

    I have a friend (age 28) who hung out with and hooked up with a few times with a guy about a year and a half ago. They were never boyfriend/girlfriend and he stopped communicating with her completely at some point. She excused his neglect of her as “he knows he’s an alcoholic, he’s trying to protect me.” She kept on texting him, calling him, emailing him, but didn’t even get a clue when he unfriended her from MySpace.

    After a year of this the guy breaks his silence and says “I’m sober now. You’re a brat. You are a bore. I want nothing to do with you. Stop contacting me.”

    Her analysis: “He is going through alcohol withdrawl.”

    Whenever I tell her to find someone else she says “You only say that because you like me” or “You sound just like my father.” She asks “why would he spend so much time with me if he didn’t like me?”

    She’s as wrong about me liking her as she is about him liking her, but that’s just an example of how delusional she is.

    I have advised her to get therapy, but all she does is go to Al-Anon. It’s good in a way that she goes to Al-Anon, but it’s a symptom of her problem, since Al-Anon is for _friends_ of alcoholics, and she isn’t his friend.

38. Steve 38

    Evan or anyone else….Is the checklist exactly the same if She’s Just Not That Into You( SJNTIY) or are there some differences?

39. Mr_Right 39

    downtowngal @ 36

    You’re right… I should change that to second date.

    And for those of you who say “Well, not even on a second date.”, I say, “Now be honest with yourselves, if there was a guy who you were really into, and he offered to hold hands on the second date because it’s a activity date, you’d hold hands with him, wouldn’t you.”

40. Curly Girl 40

    Sam@37: Most women aren’t that bad. But again. I go back to the dread marriage programming that women receive from the day they are born, that a woman’s only real option in life is to find a man to take care of her, and in return she must be doting and loving and put him first. So why shouldn’t she start demonstrating how willing she is to devote herself to him when she first meets him, before he has done anything to deserve her love? I think that many women think this behavior makes them more attractive. He’ll see how loving and giving she is, how devoted she is to him, and that will make him love her. I really do believe that this is the thought process behind that delusional behavior.

    Let’s be honest–if he were into her, this is exactly the way he would want her to behave toward him–to show her love by waiting for him, thinking only of him, acting like a fool for him.

41. Lulubell 41

    Steve #38 – I think the big picture is the same for both sexes – that you are so excited by the other person that you just can’t wait for the next contact. EXCEPT, I still let the guy make the first follow-up call (and sometimes it nearly kills me). But, I take the call, or return the call/text/email ASAP. Anything less than a phone call is just not the right sign to show you are really into someone. The same concept is true for me getting physical, that I will push things a little more if I’m swept away by a guy. The only thing I would caution about, is that it’s best to wait for the next day to ask for another date. I once gave a guy the wrong impression when he asked me out in person, because I could not remember my schedule. He thought I was hesitating about him, but it was just my memory, and then (sadly) it was hard to regain momentum.

42. rsl 42

    The whole HJNTIY issue is one I’ve been thinking about a lot lately. I’m currently in a back and forth situation with someone who, intellectually, I am well aware is just not that into me. However, my heart seems to have a hard time letting go. The issue I have with the whole theory is this: it’s supposed to be so freeing. It’s supposed to make you feel better and stop wondering. BUT… the one thing in my situation that brings me some comfort is telling myself that this man has issues and his “not being into me” as evidenced by his distant behavior is just a part of his issues- that he’s just a full-on jerk. But, when I think about the checklist above, and think that it might just be that he acts that way towards ME because of how he feels about me, it hurts. It’s horribly painful to think that he would readily do all the things on that checklist for some girl that he was into because she somehow was more worthy of his attention than me. I don’t know what the reality is with him- I guess it really doesn’t matter. But I know a lot of girls that feel this way, and therefore don’t find the theory all that freeing, because it still places the blame, or the problem, on us- as the object he is not into. Maybe I misunderstand the theory- but that’s the difficulty I am having with it. It presupposes that every person is totally emotionally healthy and able to easily complete that checklist, so long as they deem the other person worthy. And believe me- I know I shouldn’t be pining after someone who isn’t capable of a relationship anyway, but that’s a whole different issue.

43. Angela 43

    Diana you have hit the nail on the head. And its all about timing. You can meet someone who for whatever reason IJNTITY and you sense it and move on with your life. You may encounter that person at some point later on and it could happen. The thing is you do not waste your time speculating why. I still say it is so liberating, so easy. No second guessing. But to buy into it you have to really accept the premise and you don’t have to be cynical either. It becomes so matter a fact. But you really have to feel good about yourself. You know what you deserve and want and you do not settle for less.

44. Steve 44

    @rsl #42

    HIJNTIY is not about blame, it is about common sense. You look at what is going on, you ask yourself if you are getting what you want, if the answer is “no” you move on to get what you want. Its about getting what you want and being realistic. Motivation doesn’t matter. If a wo/man ( applies to both sexes ) is messed up or not, past a certain, if you are not getting behavior out of them you want, you aren’t going to get it or at least anytime soon. Plenty of fish in the sea, it makes more sense to go get what you want from someone else.

45. downtowngal 45

    rsl brings up a good point – many women tend to blame themselves for things. Most families have at least one ‘old fashioned’-thinking elderly relative who would say to the girl that there’s something she did wrong or didn’t do enough of to attract the guy. And if she did then he’d be into her.

    Some ‘experts’ have said similar things on news shows when political sex scandals broke out (he strayed because he wasn’t getting something @ home…).

    I don’t buy into any of this, just explaining why so many women would go against HJNITY common-sense.

46. downtowngal 46

    I also think that Dyana’s letter is more about asking how to let this guy know she’s intersted. Evan had a similar post about a woman who had a lt platonic friendship with a guy but developed feelings for him.

47. Janet 47

    The way our poster is acting isn’t that different from the way men act in a dating situation, but the context is a little different. Remember that old dating adage that when a women says no to sex, she really means yes but is too scared/shy/coy to say so? And there was a big push during the enlightenment about sexual harassment (1990s) that no really means no? Well, women get taught a similar thing, that when a man says no to relationship that he really means yes but is too scared/shy/coy to say so.

    In the first case the oft-used guy response to a woman’s no was “your words say no, but your body says yes.” Meaning, he was reading her body language, which might have suggested arousal or flirtation, and took that as a go signal. (Men are taught that in a seduction what he thinks is happening is more important than what she thinks or says is happening, too.) In the HJNTIY situation the guy’s behavior is just as confusing to the woman as hers is to him in the previous scenario–in the woman’s world he is in many ways saying yes to relationship–having sex with her, calling her for intimate chats, sharing details of his emotional life with her. In female terms, this is intimacy, and why would a guy engage in intimate things with a woman if he doesn’t want a relationship with her?

    In both situations the respective genders are taught ways to “get around” the other person’s ambivalence.

    Like men need to learn that a verbal “no means no,” even if she is demonstrating some interest in sex, women need to learn that a behavioral “no means no,” even if he is demonstrating some interest in relationship. Ambivalence usually means no.

48. Selena 48

    @rsl #42

    The best way to look at JNTIY is to apply it to yourself. Surely over the years there have been guys you’ve known/went out with who “just didn’t do it for you”, yes? In some cases, maybe there was something glaring wrong with the guy, in others they were perfectly nice but just not for you in terms of physical or personality attraction – whatever, the “spark” wasn’t there. Do you think every guy you weren’t really interested in should blame himself in some way? Should be hurt because YOU could feel more for some other guy than you could for him?

    When we a highly attracted to someone it can be hard to accept that it’s one sided. We hang onto every little crumb of attention and try to make it *mean* something. That’s were the self-delusion comes in.

    JNTIY IS freeing when you understand it works both ways: there are people YOU just aren’t that into either. Just happens that way. Until….it doesn’t…and you find that happy connection where the interest level is mutual.

49. Steve 49

    @45

    I don’t think that is the most reasonable way to look at it.

    It is not about “fault” as in a moral wrong. It is about wanting something and learning what you can do to get it.

    Getting anything you want involves a trial, feedback, and adjustment cycle(s). Recognizing what is not working for getting you what you want is part of the process of getting what you want.

    That is ONLY what HIJNTIY about. You want a boyfriend, Joe Blow IJNTIY, you aren’t getting a BF in Joe Blow, to get what you want you recognize this and move on to somebody else to find what you want.

    Thats it. Guilt, fault, being morally wrong is something that individuals drag into it of their accord.

50. Diana 50

    To rsl #42 ~ I have had similar thoughts about how HJNTIY could be perceived as “really” saying, “Hey, no offense, but I’m just not that into you, so something must be wrong with you cus hey, I’m really into this “other” girl.” Give me a break!

    I guess I haven’t had my morning fuel yet, but personally, I have had about a belly full of reading countless articles, blogs, etc. with everything so focused on things like, “What women need to know to keep their man,” “How women can keep him attracted to her forever,” “How to make him think he can’t live without you,” or whatever. It can create this feeling in some women that they’re not good enough, that their relationship failed because they told the man what they “thought” rather than what they “felt,” and if they DID tell him how they felt, they forgot to give him the emotional space to go process his emotional response to her feelings, and then hope that he would return and validate and emotionally connect with her about her concerns.

    There’s good scientific reasons behind some of this. The whole “Mars/Venus” series is fascinating and does tell it like it is, whether we like it or not, and that sometimes includes me.

    But with HJNTIY, please, do yourself a favor … be kinder to yourself. Maybe he’s not into you as much as another woman because she has lower standards, or maybe he has such low self esteem that he can’t believe a woman with your caliber would actually LIKE him, or maybe he’s not really into “anyone” because he’s too in love with himself. Who knows, and who cares!

    Be strong, stay focused on your needs, wants, and what makes you happy; be whole as a person; be caring and kind, polite and interesting to those you meet, try to have fun on some level during the time that you are together, then go home, relax, and let events unfold as they may.

51. Curious 51

    Steve@49: I don’t think DTG is saying anything about morals. She’s saying that the woman take on the responsibility for his not being into her. And she’s right—all sorts of people and experts out there are telling the girl that if he’s not into you that it’s because you didn’t do something rigth, that you aren’t pretty enough, that you should be this way or that way and then you’ll get the guy. Why do you think the big consumers of dating advice are women? They’re tyring to get “fixed” so that they can have a relationship. Wouldn’t need to be fixed if they weren’t broken. Now where are they getting the idea from that they’re broken? And if you think that the only reason you aren’t getting the guy is because you did something wrong or you aren’t the way you need to be, you’ll jump through hoops to change and to be more alluring and just keep trying and trying.

    Pathetic, maybe, but not a moral thing.

52. Cilla 52

    @ Diana #50 @ Curious #51

    I agree. Well said, both of you.

53. girl-with-glasses 53

    @49

    Steve, that’s a very logical point of view. As practical and workable as it is in real life, it doesn’t seem to take with most women though. Most women seem to live in their heads alot, i.e. they can happily have a relationship all in their heads, with themselves. Maybe, she’s actually attached to the long painfully drawn out ‘drama’, the emotional push-and-pull she’s doing to herself becomes addicting. ‘He’s just not that into you’ might be a nifty marketing concept, the sad depressing thought is that even if he were into her, would she be even capable of having a healthy relationship? Women like that seem to be attached to their own ideas of what a relationship is, rather than anything real or workable. Or to put it in another way, what can she possibly know of him as a person in his own right, when all she really knows is how he makes her feel? Yes, it’s friday, and I have an extra dose of depression and b*tch. Sorry.

54. Selena 54

    @Angela #53
    - “I do not care how smart, goodlooking or whatever the guy is. It is a real turn off if he doesn’t want you. That’s were I am at. And it feels good!!!!”

    I’m with you.

    But for some women it seems for them, the turn on is the challenge of a guy who doesn’t really want them. If he’s “hard to get” that makes him worth more somehow. I think that may factor into how some women get stuck in these situations repeatedly.

55. Steve 55

    @54

    LOL @ your closing line. It is funny that everyone is assumed to be grumpy on Monday and happy on Friday. I usually feel refreshed from the weekend, if only mentally, on Monday. A few years ago I was riding up a *HIGH* escalator from the metro. I was listening to a gay couple behind me talk. I almost lost it when on of them in a cliche “flamer” voice said:

    ” You can just tell its Friday. Everybody has that GO TO HELL! Look on their faces!.”

    About your other points. Like I wrote, it isn’t about blame, deficiency or default. Its about what a person wants. If the type of women you mentioned want to stop feeling crushed then they have to give up their addiction to drama, stop ignoring their common sense and apply HIJNTIY.

    Like many people with a substance abuse problem or a bad habit, they may not want to give up their habits. If that is the case and if they want to be happier then they need therapy versus dating advice.

56. Cilla 56

    @ Selena

    Most psychologists/psychiatrists seem to agree that women who are repeatedly attracted to “hard to get” men or emotionally unavailable men had unavailable men in leadership roles earlier in their lives–father, brother, coach, etc. Their theory is that most people (and these women are a prime example) are trying to fix something from their past by dating someone who allows them to repeat that situation, as if this time they’ll finally get it right, and the other person will undergo some type of transformation.

    I bet many women don’t change this pattern because they don’t recognize its roots. Once you finally say “OMG, my last four relationships were with guys who made me feel just like my dad did,” a light bulb goes off. It’s tough, because even when you understand the issue intellectually, you still have to deal with complicated emotions and habits that may have been around since childhood.

57. Shalini 57

    I would agree with what Evan says..

    I have experienced the disadvantages of ignoring my instinct and trying to find reasons to believe that the guy i am attracted to loves me. It never works.

    It does not mean that he is bad or does not like me.. But if he does not think that i am the girl he wants as his girl friend, its pointless to wait. No one said you should be rude to a person or ignore him if “he is just not that into you”. No one said that makes a guy a jerk. But waiting for a guy and hoping he would someday find you attractive is not very attractive to that guy.

    And to Ruby, I would like to say maybe the girl you were talking about didn’t expect him to be his boy friend while he was dating someone else.. For her it was natural. When they met again it might have just happened. I can be sure she wasn’t waiting for that guy to return to her!!!

    But if you are waiting to that guy to want to be your boy friend, its better not to contact each other!! It does not help anything. In fact if you like a guy and he does not feel the same. You would most probably go out of your way to be helpful to him, to please him. And that makes you act like a doormat. If you know you would do that its better to save your dignity by not being friends at all. (I agree there are girls who might actually do the opposite and become totally rude and angry at the guy but that’s rare, and even thats not healthy).

58. angela 58

    It is irrelevant why a person is not into you. That is the basis for it being so liberating! You have to feel that you are worthy of being treated well. Blame has no place in HJNTITY. I do not even try to figure out the why. Doing that is where excuses come from and women start to beat themselves up. Also, the person doesn’t have to be bad overall. They treat you poorly, because they do not really care about you and treat someone else great because they do care. WOMEN HAVE TO START REALIZING THAT PART OF DESIRING SOMEONE IS THAT THEY WANT AND ADORE YOU! That is a major part of the attraction equation. I do not care how smart, good looking or whatever the guy is. It is a real turn off if he doesn’t want you. That’s where I am at. And it feels good!!!!

59. Melissa 59

    MrRight wrote: “If she doesn’t want to kiss you goodnight after a few dates.”

    I don’t think guys should ever put to much emphasis on whether or not a girl kisses a guy on a first date.

    I kiss EVERY guy on a first date PURELY as a measure of whether or not I want to continue dating him. In fact, I’ll usually be more in a rush to kiss a guy I’m on the fence about because if I’m not 100% crazy about his personality, he can score a few points and be worth a 2nd date if he’s a really good kisser.

    So don’t invest too much in how long a girl waits to kiss you, and don’t think she’s really into you if she kissed you on the 1st date… she could have just been testing the waters like I do

60. Selena 60

    Guys, you are better off dating Melissa than me.

    I don’t kiss guys I’m not into on the first date; I give the “dreaded handshake of death”. LOL.

61. Steve 61

    Lulubell@41

    It sounds like you have your act together. You say that “I take the call, or return the call/text/email ASAP” after the guy’s first follow-up call and my question to you is at what point(e.g.after what date) do you initiate a call to the guy without waiting for him to call first? Also, what do you conclude if a woman is saying “let’s take it slow”, meaning nothing physical at the 4th date mark and still saying so at the 7th date? Anyone else who wants to respond to any of this is welcome.

62. downtowngal 62

    Curious #51, thx for explaining. With all of the advice out there, it seems women are presented w mixed messages. Repeatedly turned down for dates? Have a dating coach call and solicit feedback so you can work on that one thing that turns guys off. Been dumped for the 5th time? find out why you keep attracting/dating the same type of guy.

    Or those books that say, “why men marry certain TYPES of women but not others”, after you’ve just broken up w a guy who shares your values/goals/chemistry but jerked you around and the he ends up engaged 3 months later to someone who’s not of the same caliber (to put it nicely).

    Of course, sometimes you do everything right but you’re still single. But how do you know? The danger is that you can use HJNTIY as an excuse not to work on yourself.

63. downtowngal 63

    Steve #61, I never initiate a call to a guy after a date. I used to do that, thinking, ‘oh, he may be shy/busy/not sure how I feel’ and it’s never worked. Either the guy really wasn’t into me and I end up w an awkward, “sorry I didn’t feel a click” email or he feels like a loser because he realizes he should have been the one to call and it goes nowhere from there.

    It’s always been a better experience when the guy calls afterwards. Shows he’s truly interested in me and thinks I’m worth pursuing (women get turned on by this). And if I’m into him I’ll call him back as soon as I can.

    As for a woman saying, ‘i want to take it slow’ it depends on what she means. Kissing? Intercourse? I like to get to know someone before I become physical, but by the 2nd or 3rd date if I don’t at least feel as if I want to kiss him – or if we kiss but I don’t feel chemistry – it’s not happening.

64. Evan Marc Katz 64

    Well said, Downtown. At this moment, I’m finishing the first draft of my new eBook, “Why He Disappeared”, which gives the answer to the most popular question I get on this blog.

    For women who are not content with HJNITY and want to know WHY, I hope it will be a useful resource.

65. Steve 65

    FYI

    There are now two ‘Steve’s posting in the comments. I am the original.
    Probably more handsome too. I will go back to putting the chooseveg.com url into the comment form so you can tell us apart.

66. Adele 66

    @diana post #35:
    “It IS possible to be interested in seeing someone else again without calling them the very next day or even two days later. You don’t have to already be on cloud nine after the very first date to still be interested in someone. This is just another example of people’s expectations and how they sometimes get in the way.”

    I have to agree, I have to share my experience of what some might have read as a “HJNTIY” with my bf whom I met through an online dating website and we’ve now been together for nearly 2 years. After we first met up after 3 weeks of emailing each other, I felt the attraction and the “sparks” but didn’t hear from him a week later, but he would always ring within a week for follow up dates. He never rang “the next day or the second day after the date” as I was expecting if he was “into me”. This went on for almost 3 months and I was wondering what to do, until one day I cancelled a date with him as someone else (one that I met through a group of friends and not online) started to ask me out, and since we weren’t exclusive (though in my heart I wanted us to be) I decided to give other guys a go. This was the crunch factor cos he suddenly got really anxious, demanded that we meet up to have the ‘talk’, where he then expressed that he wanted to take it slowly and was building it up, and now that someone else was trying to work their way in he was pissed off. He then went on to say he really would like to be exclusive with me, and we started going out exclusively then. A month after that ‘talk’ he then told me he loved me, and we’ve been together from that time on till now.

    So, my conclusion is that each and every one’s dating experience is a little different, and we shouldn’t conform our expectations to just because our object of affection did not return our calls or reschedule straight away after the date, do not think HJNTIY. wait and see, if not, send a text, or a call. ONCE OR TWICE. BUT DO NOT BE THE DOORMAT. And obviously, if no response or action after the one or two calls or texts…face the obvious: HJNTIY.

67. downtowngal 67

    Adele#66, great story. Seems that what you did was kept youself open to meeting other guys, which woke this one up and made him realize what he could be potentially missing. And you weren’t playing games, you just went w your gut.

    Not to be a buzzkill but I wonder where you and your guy would be if the other guy didn’t come into the picture.

68. matt 68

    I think Evan has some great advice here on this topic. However there have been times when I have been really into somebody, and I do not make a move. chalk it up to really knowing on an unconscious, intuitive level that I can tell my efforts would not be successful because I’m already intuiting where the other is in relation to my interest, or also I’m just a little more cautious. calling and
    Texting everyday? “sure I’m into you babe, but I’m not going to act desperate,” I suppose some people would be this obvious and persistent about the person their into, but it’s not typical behavior for a man as species as a whole is it??, ( and some writers in this blog would say a shy man would be this outwardly obvious in concrete exhibited behaviors toward someone their really into??? wow what a turn around!) I’m not saying to keep thinking there is hope if there are no overtures coming your way from your love interest, becuz like Evan said, so much of that rationalization is wishful thinking. But just because I want someone so bad doesn’t mean I’m out there being black and white about it either.

69. Angela 69

    I do not necessarily have to be called daily in the beginning, but with some regularity. I can just tell if someone is really trying to connect with me and when they just are just seeing what they can get. There is an energy or vibe. And it has to be sustained over a period of time. Now if you are someone that gets intimate too early, you may have a problem. Some guys will pursue you hard initially just for sex.

70. downtowngal 70

    Adding to that, Adele, I was in a similar situation at first, I liked the guy, we connected but he didn’t seem to be making much effort, which I interpreted as mixed messages. And because I liked him I figured, oh, just take it slow. Friends advised me to ‘give him his space’ while being open to dating others, which I did. I ended up dating somene else but all guy#1 did was ‘wish me luck’. Turns out he’d been dating someone else on the side all along.

    In other words, HJW into me. Had I stuck more to that rule of thumb it would have ended sooner and saved me a coiuple months’ emotional roller coaster ride.

71. Shalini 71

    Steve,

    This the answer to ur 61st post.

    I think the time does not matter at all. After what number of dates i start calling him without waiting for him or even how long i wait for sex. If i feel he really wants to be my boyfriend it might happen at the second date. And if i don’t feel is that into me it might take 3 months and i still won’t feel like calling him first or let him touch me even!!!!

    My comfort level depends entirly on how much he likes me, and whether or not a guy wants me to be his girl friend. I can just feel it,

72. Shalini 72

    Steve
    oh.. by the way one more thing.. it also matter whther or not i feel the same about that guy.. But if i like him and he does not then i will not want to be more than friends.

73. Casey 73

    Bella @ #27

    “Also remember: Even if someone is genuinely into you, they might not be into having a relationship. Not everyone is focused on finding the one at the same time and place that you are. So if you feel like there is chemistry, you may be right! However, they just might not have any desire (or ability) to build off of that and develop more.”

    Sadly, this is what happened in my most recent relationship. He was doing everything on Evan’s checklist, and then a few months into the relationship, he suddenly decides he’s not ready for a relationship, his previous relationship having ended about 8 months before we started dating. To be honest, I wasn’t even sure I was ready for a serious relationship…that is until I met him.

    He told me he had dated quite a number of people in that time, but no one he was really interested in going out with again. That is, until he met me. But, having been in his previous relationship for 16 years, and even having as much chemistry as we do, he realized he’s just not ready to get serious with someone right now. I believe him and appreciate his honesty. But, still…for me this is the hardest type of situation to get over…I can accept HJNTITY because I don’t expect every man to be into me, but to have him be so into me but suddenly decide he’s not ready for a relationship is worse.

    Of course, it will only be made worse when, in a few weeks, I find out he met and moved in with some woman…’cause that is the way this type of situation always goes.

74. mic 74

    The replies seemed to have missed the mark. Pictures > words. If he hasn’t seen her for a while, her appearance probably isn’t on his mind much. If she looks about as good as she did then, which is no sure thing, his interest likely will go up once he sees her. Very likely, that is why he wants to know if they will be at the same event. If they both use Gmail, a sneaky tactic is for her to upload a picture that appears when he clicks on her name in the Contacts list.

75. hunter 75

    Many men, lack zeal/are not attracted to/don’t get erections, to help them select a woman. More commonly defined as timidness, shy, HJNTIY, etc…….

76. Adele 76

    downtowngal#70,

    to answer yr question about what would have happened if the other guy (let’s call him A) didn’t show up, at that time after 3 months of “weekly dating” I had contemplated sitting my bf (let’s call him B) down and asked where did he see us going, if anywhere. I would have discussed honestly with him that up till then I (on my part) had been seeing him exclusively, but if he didn’t see us going somewhere I would then start seeing other people. And I would’ve known from his response whether or not he was interested. (ie if HNTIY he would’ve responded like guy#1 in yr post) And if he was, he would’ve reacted like I hoped him to…(which he did, thank goodness!). My point is, either way from the talk I would know from his reply.

    Turned out A popped up at the right time, so I decided to just go ahead (without the talk) and start giving other guys a chance (though my heart still wanted A). And if he cared, he would show…in his actions. If he didn’t, then at least I had my answer – to cut off my heartstrings.

77. Adele 77

    sorry i meant : (though my heart still wanted B)

78. Angela 78

    #48 and #57 – You are both so right!!!!!

79. Shalini 79

    Angela

    thanks.

80. Ruby 80

    Adele #76

    I’m assuming you told your BF that you were canceling plans with him to go out with someone else?

    #66 & #70. Interesting how two similar situations led to two different outcomes. I do think you often have to put a bit of time into a relationship to know if it’s going to move forward or not. Sounds like Adele had a reasonable time frame in mind (and Downtown Girl did too).

81. Ruby 81

    Shalini #57

    No, in none of the half dozen or so instances I can think of, did the woman (in one instance it was a guy) “wait” around for the other person. But they did stay in contact, and I would say each did continue to have a romantic interest in the other person. Timing certainly played a part, and sometimes years passed before they got back together.

82. Shalini 82

    Ruby..

    Yes, that’s what the whole thing is about. Its not very difficult to be just friends with a guy i like!! But this article is meant for a situation where the girl is still looking forward to something more. And its really difficult to handle such situation for a girl who is in the situation.

    Its better for such a person to end contact if she cannot stop hoping for more than friendship.

83. Karl R 83

    Ruby said: (#81)
    “I would say each [woman] did continue to have a romantic interest in the other person.”
    Shallini said: (#82)
    “this article is meant for a situation where the girl is still looking forward to something more.”

    I think you’ve spelled out the critical difference. It’s fine to want a romantic relationship with someone who isn’t that into you. But you start having problems if you expect something more will happen, and it starts affecting your decisions.

    I can think of a couple women whom I’d like a relationship with, but they’re not available. In one case I dated the lady for a month before she decided she wasn’t able to commit to an exclusive relationship. In the other case, I asked the lady out, but she was seeing someone else.

    I treated both those responses as “she’s just not that interested in me.” In both cases there’s obvious chemistry and compatability. But by taking the perspective that these ladies aren’t into me, I prevent myself from getting stuck in either the past or the future.

    Did the relationship with the first lady fail because I started dating her too soon after her breakup? It doesn’t matter. If I assume that she’s not that into me, I won’t waste time speculating about what I could have (or should have) done differently.

    Will the second lady break up with her boyfriend and be interested in dating me? It doesn’t matter. If I assume that she’s not that into me, I won’t waste time waiting for an opportunity that may never occur.

    I can want a relationship with both of them. I just can’t seek a relationship with someone who isn’t interested in a relationship with me right now.

84. Mikko Kemppe 84

    I agree with Evan. For us guys the signs are often pretty clear and easy to interpret when we are not into or ready to have a serious relationship with a particular women.

    What I think makes them often harder for women to interpret is that women often intuitively approach dating very differently. For women whether you are into a guy is not often so clear cut. You often go through a much more complicated process of determining whether you want to be with a particular guy or not, and even after you are in a committed relationships you understand very well how your feelings may often fluctuate.

    And since you intuitively approach dating differently then makes, no matter how much you would understand the concept of HJNTIY, knowing when a guy is into you or not much more difficult.
    .-= Mikko Kemppe´s last blog ..A BIG Mistake Many, Especially Honest, Women Unknowingly Make on a Date and How to Avoid It. =-.

85. Steve 85

    downtowngal@63

    If you never initiate a call to a guy who you know is interested in you, how is he to know your interested in him? Let’s say by the 6th or 7th date you don’t initiate an email or call to him, and also tell him “let’s take it slow” meaning no intercourse(you asked), why should he still date you?

86. Angela 86

    Women generally know very soon whether they are into a guy or not. There are times when you decide to give the guy or the situation a chance. Maybe because he is nice or treats you well or has a certain status. However, 8 times out of 10, you do not change your mind.

87. angela 87

    I rarely initiate calls to men in the beginning but when they call , if I like them I am excite to speak with them and it comes across on the phone. Also , in person the chemistry is obvious. If the guy is really into you they will continue to pursue you.

88. Shalini 88

    Karl R #83

    You really explained it. That’s what i wanted to to say!!! Its futile to give reasons about why someone might not feel for you. It does not matter what the reason is, you can’t change his decision unless he wants to.

    You should keep it in mind that a relationship is not just about you. It’s about the other person as well. And his reasons to not feel attracted to you does not matter because you can’t change his feelings.

    So why worry about something you can’t change?

89. Steve 89

    angelina@87

    How soon do you know if “your into a guy” e.g.
    10 minutes, 15 minutes, 1day, more than that? You say the chemistry is obvious in person. Could you be more specific? Plus you say “I rarely initiate calls to men in the beginning” which says that sometimes you do but it’s rare, so under what rare circumstance do you initiate a call or even an email?

90. Jennifer 90

    @Steve #65- thanks for clearing that up. The tone of the comments was definitely different!

91. sunflower 91

    I think the reason it’s hard for women to accept the “HJNTIY” reality is because it relatively RARE to find a man who displays the behavior that indicates the willingness and desire to form a relationship. It’s often so rare that the behavior of men who don’t want to commit seems normal and almost expected, and after repeatedly experiencing variations on the same theme, women become frustrated. We hope against hope that just maybe there is some elusive maneuver that can empower us to get what we want from certain men. It’s hard to accept defeat, which is what a woman may be feeling when she is very much into a guy who doesn’t feel the same. Not to mention the fact that so many men are very skilled at creating the ILLUSION of being into you so that they can get what they really want, which leaves us disappointed, deflated and feeling foolish. It’s no wonder we choose the comfort of denial to help us avoid facing the unpleasant reality.

92. Steve 92

    @Jennifer #90
    The other ( less handsome) Steve has fewer typos than I usually do too .

93. Steve 93

    sunflower Jun 30th 2009 at 07:57 am 91
    I think the reason it’s hard for women to accept the HJNTIY reality is because it relatively RARE to find a man who displays the behavior that indicates the willingness and desire to form a relationship

    Exactly.

    Only a handful of people during your lifetime will be interested in having a relationship with you. It will be more common to come across people who are not.

    That is why the common sense acronym of HJNTIY works as a rule of thumb. You just have it backwards. You don’t look for behaviors consistent with wanting a relationship. You look for the more common behaviors of not being interested so you are free to move on without torturing yourself.

94. Steve1 94

    Since there is another Steve on this thread(I doubt he’s more handsome)I’ll use Steve1.

    Steve@93 said
    “You look for the more common behaviors of not being interested so you are free to move on without torturing yourself.”

    That’s good advice to follow to stay out of the “friend zone” and to determine that HJNTIY or SJNTIY.

95. sunflower 95

    Steve #93 said
    You don’t look for behaviors consistent with wanting a relationship. You look for the more common behaviors of not being interested so you are free to move on without torturing yourself.

    This runs counter to Evan’s checklist, doesn’t it? He’s saying look for those behaviors as the indicators that the guy IS into you. Which would mean the guy’s not into you if he’s not doing those things.

96. Chris K 96

    @Curly Girl #1:
    “Maybe there needs to be another checklist for more timid guys who don’t know how to show a woman they are into her.”

    Yes! I’ve struggled with this – partly with trusting that if I think a girl is into me, it’sFinally okay to express that I like her.

    The difficult thing for me has been in the early stages, when you like her, but it’s not even clear there’s a mutual interest (e.g. you’re thinking “maybe she’s this friendly with everyone”).

    I met a girl 4 years ago, and we flirted and teased like crazy. We held hands and hugged, but she held back, e.g. wouldn’t let me kiss her. (Mixed signals – but I now realize that I wasn’t communicating.) We were both traveling, and I had to move on, so I figured if she was into me she’d get in touch when she was in my city.

    Trouble is, she got a boyfriend before that. That didn’t last, but for most of the last 4 years we’ve been on different continents. To cut a long story short, with some advice from a wiser friend, I took her up on some positive things she said by email, and called her (from opposite sides of the Pacific), and we talked about getting together when we were closer. Fast forward a few weeks, we’re on the same continent, she flew to meet me and we spent a week traveling. This time I did tell her straight up I liked her. (Never stopped teasing her though.) I learnt that she was into me 4 years ago, but as she always has guys interested in her, my window of opportunity was narrow at that time. I was an idiot for much of the last 4 years, but I’ve learnt.

    Things have moved up a notch and in a few months I’m flying to where she is.

    That’s a long, long comment, but three messages:
    * Yes, we really need a SJNTIY
    * In the very early stages, a guy may not give all the “right” signals that Evan talks about, especially if he hardly knows you. Sometimes it would help a guy a lot if she asks a subtle question – or if he knew how he could gauge her interest somehow without feeling like an idiot. (This is more relevant if there’s that window of opportunity problem, e.g. you’re traveling; or if there’s a social risk, like you’re in the same circle of friends)
    * It depends what you’re looking for. This blog seems to be for people who want to find a spouse, whereas in my case, neither of us were that serious 4 years ago. (Less serious “young love” can turn into something more – but it doesn’t have to.)

97. Seductress 97

    I would find if difficult to be excited about a man who exhibits ‘not into me’ behavior….

    I don’t understand the need to find exceptions and hopeful loopholes in order to hang on…

98. Jenn 98

    I just got done reading HJNTIY and it’s an amazing book, but came away with it still a bit confused about my situation. I guess I’m not sure if still he’s into me or not. In the book, Greg Behrendt writes, “If a guy truly likes you, but for personal reasons he needs to take things slow, he will let you know that immediately. He won’t keep you guessing, because he’ll want to make sure you don’t get frustrated and go away” (pg 13-14). Well, this is like what happened to me. The guy I was seeing told me that he’s extremely busy working on his dissertation for the PhD program he’s in and can’t pursue a relationship. In fact, he actually said “I like you and enjoy spending time with you and I was/am interested in being more than friends, but realistically now it’s not a prudent idea to pursue a more-than-friends relationship, not because I don’t like you, but because I am not sure that I can devote an adequate time, effort, and commitment to a relationship.” And another thing is, he still calls me. He remembers things I tell him, like if i’m going on a trip, when I have class, etc., you know, personal stuff and he keeps me informed on when and where he’s going for conferences, that have to do with his dissertation, etc. Now what I want to know is, did he tell me this to keep me around ’cause he really likes me (like the quote from Behrendt’s book above) or not. If not, why would he being doing this?

99. Ruby 99

    Pg. 159, question 8 of HJNTIY has the answer to your question. And did you know that PhD programs typically run anywhere from 4-10 years? I think that someone saying, “I am not sure that I can devote adequate time, effort, and commitment to a relationship”, is making a pretty clear statement.

100. Jenn 100

     I remember reading that part, which is why I’m confused as to what Greg is saying. That’s why I wrote a little novel on my situation above. I think he should make it more clearer for people like me. But then again, he does write, “Maybe there are men like that out there and maybe there aren’t.”

101. Karl R 101

     Jenn said: (#98)
     “Now what I want to know is, did he tell me this to keep me around cause he really likes me (like the quote from Behrendt’s book above) or not.”

     He likes you and he’s trying to keep you around.

     But I still think he’s not that into you … at least not right now.

     Jenn’s boyfriend said: (#98)
     “I like you and enjoy spending time with you and I was/am interested in being more than friends, but realistically now it’s not a prudent idea to pursue a more-than-friends relationship, not because I don’t like you, but because I am not sure that I can devote an adequate time, effort, and commitment to a relationship.”

     If you’re really into someone, you pursue the relationship even when it’s not prudent. You make the effort to scrape together enough time for the relationship.

     There are lots of graduate students who manage to make time for romance. How? They really want to. I dated a single mother who worked at least 60 hours per week. How did she find the time? She really wanted to. It was only one evening per week, but she managed to make that time every single week for 7 or 8 months.

     There’s not one “right” person in the world. There are lots of men you could have a wonderful life-long relationship with. He may be one of them. If so, this clearly is not the right time to pursue a relationship with him. But you don’t want to wait around for a few years for a “maybe”.

     So the obvious solution is to pursue other relationships and see if you can find another person who is right for you. If not, you can give it another shot after he’s done with graduate school.

102. starthrower68 102

     I have learned, thanks to Evan, that if there is no effort made, that is probably enough of a sign he’s not that into me and the rest of the stuff is a moot point. I don’t stress over it anymore and move on. It has brought me much peace.

103. kirsten 103

     I’m pondering the idea that we still need to make an effort. Knowing he just isn’t that into me is helpful and makes me feel better, but should I always give up?

     If, for instance, I applied for a job and they just didn’t feel I was the right choice, should I give up right then? Don’t send the thank you letter or follow up with a phone call? Do I withhold my portfolio no matter what? Or, do I up my game, be a better me and present myself honestly with prowess and intent? Remind them why I’m the right candidate.

     I get it. He’s not that into me. And I’m fine with that. But what about me? I don’t know the answer, and I’m hemming and hawing that it’s a lost cause and it’ll make it worse the harder you try… Or, can I make another attempt. Make my honest intensions clear? Make it happen.
     .-= kirsten´s last blog ..Shameless =-.

104. starthrower68 104

     Kristen,

     I understand your question, but I guess what I think of, is, should I have to “make it happen”? Yes, relationships require time, effort, and commitment but those things come naturally to both people as a result of a mutual desire, goal, or whatever you call it. But you can’t ever “make” someone want to be with you. And why would you want to? Wouldn’t you want to know that’s what, in his heart of hearts, he wants?

105. hunter 105

     Kirsten lusts this man so bad, that I can almost smell him. There is nothing wrong with seducing your partner.

106. Selena 106

     Kirsten,
     You can certainly make your intentions clear if you want to. Just be prepared it likely won’t change anything.

     My pride would prevent me from trying to make some guy want me, but I’m not you. Perhaps for you, “trying to make it happen” would be what you needed so you could tell yourself you did all you could. ??

107. Chris K 107

     Kirsten,

     A few years ago a woman I met seemed to be into me, and she was great, but I wasn’t feeling any chemistry. Then one day she turned up at a party looking really nice (not especially revealing, just nice) and bam, I felt the chemistry. Might seem shallow (and I’m not a guy that puts looks at the top of my list) but there you are.

     Some small thing (not necessarily appearance) may tip the balance – you can’t know if it will work, but it might. Flirt, have fun, and good luck!

108. Cassie1972 108

     Amen!! Just got out of a situation like that. I agree with you 100%

109. Chris K 109

     Sounds like he doesn’t want to make big promises, but his actions (and words) show he *is* interested.

     There’s a few possibilities about this guy. Sometimes we don’t realize how fleeting an opportunity is, and we can lose it (in this case, he could lose you). Sometimes we really like someone, but are not so wrapped in them that we drop everything and pursue them – that’s a small dose of the HJNTIY thing.

     I also agree with Karl R’s response below.

     My thought is – stay in touch, see how things develop, but if there’s no commitment from his side, definitely see other people (and be honest with him about that). Good luck!

     (For commenting on legal issues people use the footnote “IANAL” – I am not a lawyer. So… IANAEIL – I am not an expert in love!)

110. Chris K 110

     Sounds like it’s in the grey zone.

     Maybe he really likes you, but hasn’t been knocked off his feet – maybe he’s not the sort of person who tends to get knock off his feet or follow his heart.

     Keep in touch, appreciate his thoughtfulness, but see other people. And be honest with him, of course. Good luck.

     Just my thoughts – I don’t claim to be an expert, but I’ve learnt from my many mistakes!

111. dPain 111

     Is there such a checklist for men to use on women, to tell if SJNTIY.  By nature, its got to be different than the HJNTIY list, no?

112. Karl R 112

     dPain, (#111)
     Start with Mr._Right’s list (#33).

     One I would add is that she isn’t into you if she declines two consecutive date invites (provided you’re not asking at the last minute), even if it’s beacuse she has a previous commitment.

     A woman who IS into you will suggest a date/time when she’s available, or she will ask you out at a date/time when she’s available, or she will make some other serious effort to get a date with you that she can attend.

113. Denise 113

     #13

     Here, here!  I agree…it is VERY freeing to get this concept.  That doesn’t mean it’s not disappointing, but I can go about my business with my dignity and boundaries intact. Also keeps me from getting ‘bitchy’ of something I have no control over.

     Who knows what the future holds…but I bet a guy is more likely to want to try with a woman who had strong boundaries and knew what she wanted than one that called and tried to convince him they would be good together.

     Took me awhile to get here, but a much better place to be…LOVE Evan’s answers to questions, he’s right on.

114. Denise 114

     #93 Steve

     Right on in regard to there only being a handful of people that are willing and AVAILABLE to enter a relationship.  Timing is everything as they say…that’s why it’s good to keep our boundaries about us and deal in reality.  He’s just not into you, checklist or whatever, is a good way to do that.

115. Sarahrahrah! 115

     Ah, gee, Evan, you wrote an entire column on this after I misquoted your original list.  Thank you! 

     I wanted to alert you and your readers about an excellent article that was published in the NYTimes weekender edition, entitled, “He’s Just Not That Into Anyone”:

     It chronicles the effects of porn on men’s romantic relationships —- and it isn’t good, but it IS informative.  What I took away from the article was that there may be otherwise really good dating prospects out there, but if they’d rather sit home and whack off in front of the computer (pardon my crudeness, but I think we need a dose of reality), we can’t fix them AND we’re better off without them.

     Cheers and happy dating to all in 2011!

     (Evan, I’m praying for your family and your upcoming bundle of joy!  Thanks for freely giving in the form of this blog.)

116. jacinta 116

     what would be your postition on a guy who has a lot of other issues going on (like a family member with terminal illness) for example. Would that affect whether they are going to be in touch or not? I am struggling with this situation right now, and I think that if you really like someone, you want to see them regardless of what´s going on in your life, and it´s sometihng postiive.

117. Kate Candy 117

     Evan,
     Is there any way that guys don’t have the checklist?  I dated a guy for over a year who swore he was into me, who made future plans with me, who wanted to see me every Friday and Saturday, but did not have regular sex with me, who did not tell me he loved me regularly, who did not immediately call every night, asked me if I wanted to be referred to as a girlfriend and when I said yes, still introduced me as his friend.  I ended up cutting things off because he felt that there were more important things in a relationship than sex and communication (that’s a quote).  

     Guys seem to break down in two categories: guys who will commit and guys who will not.  But I don’t know any guys who would pass the checklist.  If we meet a guy who does want a committed relationship, can we show them the checklist and say, “You want to know what women want?  Here it is.”   

118. Miranda 118

     Evan, I really enjoy your blog, it is extremely entertaining (and you know it;).
     But I constantly think you miss an important thing about dating: there are decent people and non decent people. The latter will mess with you at some point no matter if they want a relationship, don’t want one, marry you, etc…
     So in situations like these, instead of asking “is he into me, is he not?” this girl should rather find out if this guy respects her and if they share the same values. If that’s the case, it is impossible for him to hurt her that much, because he will make sure not to take advantage of anyone.
     I have been twice in casual relationships in which I developed more feelings and wanted a relationship. The first guy ended up committing to me after a few months, saying “as there is so much attraction between us, I think we need to give this a try”. He was a sweet, caring person.
     The other one did not really committ, but kept coming back and I think I could have made him at some point (after a few months of no contact), because his interest level was still soooo high. But at that point I realized I didn’t want him to leave his then gf, because he tried to cheat on her with me… and I realized he is UNABLE to have a deep, meaningful relationship.
     Sorry I just wanted to get this off my chest… girls and guys, if you deal with a good person, they will either date you at some point or leave you alone – and not treat you like shit, because it’s not in them and they will back off or do they right thing once they realize they hurt you. So look at their personalities. If they disrespect you, even marriage with them will never ever be fulfilling!!!

119. Miranda 119

     I wanted to add something to my previous post: that means for the girl from the posting to make sure he is a respectful person. If he is, he won’t lead her on. “I am not able to have a relationship at the moment but I like you and want to see where things go” will mean exactly that. I have said that to guys and meant it. I have felt nothing for a guy I fell head over heels for at a later point, because I was so numb inside from previous hurts. Sometimes it can be worth waiting, sometimes not, but I think it depends more on the person than on HJNTIY.

120. JS1613 120

     Does this apply to long term relationships as well?

121. Lily 121

     EVAN YOU RULE!!!
     Absolutely fabulous response and such a breath of fresh air. I SO WISH I had access to you when I spent 8 years with a man I was head-over-heels in love with, who abruptly broke up with me out of the blue one evening after dinner. No discussion, no explanation. And no commitment, either. For such a smart woman, I was very, very stupid to have wasted so many years wishing, hoping, yearning, fantasizing. It really is simple. If a man is into you, he commits. Period.

122. A. 122

     It’s funny, I’ve had:  actually several situations where signs of “he’s just not that into you”, actually did mean, “he’s incredibly into you, but there’s a real reason why the relationship wouldn’t work, so he’s trying to be nonchalant.”  

     One was sharing an apartment with his sister, a very close friend of mine, and was working 60 hours a week:  she became jealous and angry at the thought of us dating, and he couldn’t afford, financially or emotionally, to shake things up.  Another was a close friend and business partner of an ex: again, he couldn’t afford to mess up the relationship with my ex.  ETC.  

     Just for maturity’s sake, there are times when “HJNTIY” is actually not the case.  Both of these men, and a few others, would call me constantly, flirt, offer me gifts, etc. and then randomly bail, act weird, or be distant.  

     Either way, if he’s displaying mixed messages, it generally means get outta there!  

123. Clare 123

     I’ve read He’s Just Not That Into You, and I’m not wild about it, or the phrase. I think for women it can feel a little like getting hit on the head with a two by four. I agree the message is an important one.
     But I prefer, instead of the somewhat harsh-sounding “He’s Just Not That Into You”, consulting what’s going on inside me. How do I really feel about someone who is so flakey/inconsistent/unavailable/openly tells me he doesn’t want a relationship/is pursuing other people? I must say, usually my enquiry stops there. I don’t usually even have to ask if he’s that into me or not. Do *you* really want someone who expresses no clear interest in you?
     It’s a subtle shift perhaps, but I think it’s every bit as important, if not more so, for women to focus on how they feel, rather than just trying to work out how he feels.

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