Comments on: Are Stereotypes About Men and Women True?

By: Michael17

Michael17 — Thu, 23 Aug 2012 15:58:00 +0000

When I made my comments, I wasn’t talking about how “independent” a woman is per se. I know some very independent women who come across as both strong AND feminine.

Just as Nice Guys have trouble creating attraction, so do Women Who Are Too Logical. I don’t think I’d want to date a girl where I’d be the emotional one in the relationship.

The book “Way Of The Superior Man” by David Deida illustrates what I am getting at here. Some of his writing is a tad woo-woo, but he explains masculinity, femininity, and the polarity between the two quite well.

By: Clare

Clare — Thu, 23 Aug 2012 06:30:14 +0000

Hey Fusee

I agree very much with your approach. I do the same thing myself. I know I’m *able* to take care of myself, but I listen out for the things he likes to do as a team and I do those. And I accept (and appreciate!) the support that I get, enjoying that it makes my life a bit easier.

I do think as an independent woman it’s important to be with the right person. A man who respects and likes that independent quality. It has been for me anyway. It’s never going to completely gel with some men, and I’ve no doubt there are some men who might find me a little aloof or cool or independent for their taste. That’s ok.

I do think as an independent woman, even with an independent man, it’s important to make a conscious effort to make the guy feel valued and as though you are interested, and to show affection, warmth and vulnerability.

By: Mia

Mia — Wed, 22 Aug 2012 19:07:57 +0000

I agree that independence is not a problem for women in attracting relationships, but it depends how you come off. There are certain women who come off as materialistic, too busy to see a guy more than once a week, who come off as boasting of their accomplishments and intelligence, and seem a little cold. Showing vulnerability is really important, and so is being soft and welcoming and appreciative. None of that means you have to play dumb and dependent.

By: Fusee

Fusee — Wed, 22 Aug 2012 18:22:36 +0000

@ Clare #40/47 and Heather #41:

Interesting developement of this thread! As an independant woman myself and yet relatively easily attracting LTR-minded men, I can confirm that finding a balance between independance and interdependence is crucial when interested in growing a harmonious, solid, and happy long-term relationship.

Re: independence: I’m 33 and I’ve lived by myself for ten years (through graduate school and a few non-cohabiting LTRs), purchased a condo at 26 on my own, spent the last ten years in two different foreign countries, traveled the world alone including stints in Australia, Guatemala, and a long one in India, trained myself in various skills from martial arts to social dancing, from foreign languages to Asian massage techniques, have been volunteering in the health care field for the last four years, and I could go on and on. When I really want to do it, I go for it and do not wait for a man to make it happen for me, or for a female friend to give me company. My emotional support system is made of family members and female friends who are dependable, truthful, and loyal.

And yet I can yield. When single I support myself 100%. When starting a relationship, I allow the new partner to fullfil a progressively increasing % of my ongoing needs + a part of the new needs that the relationship creates. I show my vulnerabilities. I talk about my regrets and dreams. I express my gratitude for help and support I do not receive when single. And I start all of this early. On date #1. A relationship requires sharing vulnerabilities. And we are all vulnerable about something.

However the % of needs that I let my partner progressively cover will never exceed 20-33% depending on the needs. Intellectually I am still independent and the guy “knows” it, but emotionally and logistically as I become part of a team and start to actively cultivate an interdependent relationship, the guy “feels” the reality – and the pleasure – of fulfilling some of my needs without experiencing pressure of facing unresonnable expectations. He is needed and appreciated, but he has not become the rescuer of a lost soul and knows that I’ll be fine if he chooses to walk away. I’ll just take my 20-33% back and take care of those myself again.

And this balance works great!

By: Kurt

Kurt — Tue, 21 Aug 2012 23:34:08 +0000

Clare (#40), I have heard that “too independent” argument mentioned as to why certain women get passed over for relationships. However, I suspect that the women who claim to be very independent go on dates and behave aloof or somewhat disinterested and the men who date them simply give up because they think that the woman either isn’t putting forth enough effort or they assume that the woman isn’t interested in them.
From a man’s perspective I can tell you that sometimes women will go out on dates with men whom they either don’t like or don’t like that much and no man wants to waste his time and money on a woman who isn’t that into him. So for me personally if I get the feeling that a woman isn’t putting forth enough effort or doesn’t seem interested enough, I will stop asking the woman out.

By: Clare

Clare — Tue, 21 Aug 2012 06:44:26 +0000

@ Heather and Julia

Yeah, I know. I happen to be a particularly independent woman myself. I’ve looked after myself for the majority of my life and it’s comfortable for me to be that way. Guys who want to coddle me and make all my decisions for me tend to have me cringeing in horror!

Some guys are not comfortable with that, and that’s ok. Rather than trying to change myself I found a guy who let me have all the independence I desired, but was still there for me.

Because I’m an independent person in a relationship though, I still find I have to consciously give myself reminders to “be part of the team” – make decisions as a couple, allow him to do things for me, show vulnerability. It’s something I have to consciously remind myself of.

By: miskwa

miskwa — Mon, 20 Aug 2012 21:05:30 +0000

Evan
You forgot a couple; men cannot multitask to save their lives, women cannot stick to doing one thing at a time. Men tend to be sloppy, women, anal retentively neat, men are visual and spatial, women verbal. A lot of steroetyping is just that but some is because male/female brains are wired differently. Together, we complement each other but we must understand how the other works. In addition to that, all of these traits are on a continuum (well maybe not the multitasking part). I know lots of men who are great empathizers (my ex was one), and some women who don’t wanna hear about it. The “rebound” thing has always been a BIG problem. Yep, men are designed to “get over it, forget her” and move on fast. Women aren’t, period. we tend to grieve, process the loss, figure out what went wrong, maybe move on which, in the case of a really bad breakup, years. The problem w/ rebounding is that the guy often hasn’t dealt with or processed his loss and being used as a rebound aint fun.

By: Mia

Mia — Mon, 20 Aug 2012 18:18:26 +0000

Michael – given how many people I see all the time who are fat, ugly, eccentric, awkward, or whatever who have found love, I doubt there is anything really wrong with the people you describe. The problem is that they may be on the wrong track. There are several mating tracks – on one, people who are simple, average looking, and look for nice mates who share their values often get married by their 20s and never played the field much. The other track is filled with picky people who like games, strategies, drama, looks, and wealth. Sometimes the simple, normal people do not want to get married right away after college, though, and they unwittingly wind up on the second track filled with people who crave dysfunction and can never be happy.

By: Erinlee

Erinlee — Mon, 20 Aug 2012 17:52:22 +0000

Someone commented that insecure men suppress their feminine qualities, I’m going to have to disagree with that. Men suppress their feminine qualities, because that’s what society has raised us to believe is proper. Even as children boys are tought to be tough, not cry, etc., while girls are are treated more tenderly and encouraged to share their feelings. The lists overall are pretty accurate as far as how many and women are perceived but every person is going to be different, more of this less of that. I view it with humor, there is not a list in the world that could accurately describe every man, and every woman.

By: Julia

Julia — Mon, 20 Aug 2012 16:38:48 +0000

@Clare and @Michael The thing about someone who supports themselves is that, by a certain point in your life, you kinda have to be able to support yourself. I am 31 and I’ve never even lived with a partner, I have to support myself, there really isn’t another option. Would a man rather be with a 31 year old woman who still lives at home and allows her parents to support her? I should hope not. Just because I don’t need a man to pay my rent or call a mechanic when my car needs repairs doesn’t mean I don’t want and need men for other things, like companionship, to father my children, etc.