Can I Find Happiness With a Sex Addict?
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I just broke up with my boyfriend of almost three years. We had an amazing relationship. He was the first guy I fell in love with. He was my best friend and lover. We had talked about the future and had great relationships with each other’s families and friends.
Now, the problem. I recently found out that he had been responding to sex posts/ads online. When I confronted him about it, he immediately confessed and apologized profusely. He cried and said he’s so ashamed of himself. He explained that it’s a sexual issue/addiction that he’s had for years – even before he met me. He swore that he never actually met up and did anything physical with anybody; he had only exchanged messages. He said he’d go to counseling to get help. He asked me if I could find it in my heart to stay with him and give him a chance to fix himself and be a better man. He said he knows I deserve better.
I feel so betrayed, sad and angry. But a part of me also believes everything he told me, because it’s in line with his character. He had always been honest with me, even when we discussed difficult subjects.
I’m 25 years old and I’m attractive, intelligent, funny, etc., so I’m sure I can find another person in the future. The problem is, I don’t know if I want to. Is my ex-boyfriend “the one”? I’m not the type of person who magically “knows” or dreams about marriage, but being with him made me start thinking about the possibility of marriage. Does he have great character, make me happy and help me to be a better person? 100%. Did he hurt me? Yes. Do I think I can trust him again? I don’t know.
Like many people with addictions, he may be a good man with a pure heart, but if he can’t control his own actions, he fits the profile of a high-risk partner.
My rational side tells me that breaking up was the right thing to do and that I should never look back. My emotional side tells me that I should give him a second chance, but only once he’s made progress through counseling. What do I do? I don’t want to do anything stupid. I don’t want to fall into a bad case of clouded judgment due to loss of first love. Unfortunately I don’t have enough experience with love to know. I need your help. –Zoe
Dear Zoe,
A very thoughtful letter and a very tricky situation.
And, to echo your sentiments at the close of your email, unfortunately I don’t have enough experience with addiction (much less sex addiction) to be able to rightfully guide you.
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75 Comments »Filed Under Sex
Jenna 1
It seems really scary that you could be with someone for three years and just now find this out. Good for her that she’s only 25, but what if she was 37 and looking to start a family only to discover such a deal breaker? How could a problem like this be detected earlier? Were there red flags? I ask all this because at 28, and having been single for many years, the next guy I get in a relationship with I would hope we are on a path to marry, I don’t have time anymore for deadends. I don’t know what I’d do in this situation.
Grace Pamer 2
Wow, tough, tough decision to make here. Addiction is such a difficult issue. He no doubt totally loves you but, at the same time, struggles to control his urges. I’m sure he regrets it totally but how often will he have such regrets in future each time he err’s.
If he’s aware of the problem and willing to seek counselling that’s a start and one that should be applauded. If you truly love him then by all means be there for him as a friend through the process but keep it on a friendship basis until such time as you can judge how effective the treatment has been. If you truly love someone then sometimes you have to take the extreme good with the bad. Only you can decide whether that is something you wish to do, whether you wish to get hurt again in future or whether you believe there is enough good in him and determination to beat his addiction.
You will be taking on a heavy load if you do get back together, it will be the elephant in the room you try to ignore but which may always be at the back of your mind and there are no guarantees so you need to think it through. As Evan said you are young, good looking with a great deal going for you and young enough to know you will no doubt find someone else so there are plenty of opportunities ahead of you. Whether you find anyone you love as much as him is the great unknown but you can’t live in fear of that. I do not believe you will find others you will love. As to whether he is “the one”, well, there are many potential “the ones” in life but they come by only so very often so its important to think it through before letting go of one potential such person.
Good luck
Grace
Kathleen 3
Great advice Evan. I liked the comment “sounds like serious shit” …
mary 4
Break up with him, your too young to waste years of your life with someone with such a serious problem. He may change for a while but it unlikely he will change permanently. Consult a professional on the matter and get their advice.
helene 5
I have to say I’m in two minds about the recent fashion for classifying this sort of thing as “sex addiction.” Whilst its true that there are some people whose sexual behaviour is so frenetic and so high risk that it can be conceptualised within an “addictions” type framework, at the same time I do think there can be a bit of a cop-out in declaring yourself a “sex addict.” What is simply bad/immature behaviour and what is “sex addiction”?
By declaring oneself an addict, it is as though the person in some way abdicates resonsibility for their behaviour: “I can’t help it, I’m addicted.” “No officer, I’m not a reckless driver, you have to understand, I’m a velocity addict.”
In this particular case, the boyfriend gets a thrill out of sexy online chat. If as he says he never actually meets up with these women, then this is really only one step beyond oggling cute women in the street. Whilst I understand the OPs concern and hurt, I do think her boyfriend has taken the easy way out (yet at the same time scared her) by saying he’s “an addict” , which makes it sound as though he has some sort of medical condition… serious, (aren’t all addictions serious?) and possibly incurable… when the fact of the matter may be that he is simply a rather immature guy who has to learn to accept that you can be single – and act single – or you can be in a relationship, but you can’t be both at one time.
sarahrahrah! 6
Wow, Zoe.
This must have been so very hard for you. I’m sorry that you’ve went through this. I’m this has been really painful, confusing and hurtful time for you.
I think it is very loving on your part to consider continuing in a relationship with your boyfriend. Because your situation is so much like one I faced several years ago, I want to share my story with you.
I had a close group of friends in college and eventually started dating one of the guys in our circle. We had a lot in common, our friends all approved of the relationship, we got along with each others’ family and he wanted to marry me. We had so much fun together — talking, spending time alone and with friends. We loved going on “adventures” together and doing generally off-the-wall things just because we were young and carefree.
He wanted to marry me and we started going to counseling together to talk about it. At some point he came to me and told me that he was getting fired from his job at a high-rise condo community in the city. He had been going through people’s mail because he had found pornography once by accident and compulsively started a habit of opening mail that looked like pornography on his night shift.
This was before the internet boom and not many people knew about sex addiction. We broke up and I didn’t know if I had done the right thing because I missed him like crazy. Nobody really understood about sex addiction back then. I just knew that I couldn’t live through this man that I loved so much cheating on me. I hoped that he would get help and come back to me.
We both went our separate ways and didn’t talk after our breakup because it was too painful for both of us. We both married and then went through divorces and got back in touch with each other about ten years later. What I learned was that he ended up cheating on his wife. Not only that, he married a second time and also ended up cheating on that wife, too. He is still a kind and loving person and I still care about him as a friend, but he is an addict. He has tried to get help, but it didn’t prevent his adultery. (An aside: he seems to be holding steady now, but smokes a lot. I honestly believe the smoking is keeping him from acting on his sex addiction, but that is not such a great trade off.)
I also ended up marrying a sex addict whom I loved, had great conversations and sex with. He still ended up acting on his compulsions and even though he made certain promises and sounded completely sincere in his efforts to change, he still went back to his old ways. It look a lot for me to get away from him with my sanity. There was immense pain and my self-esteem and trust levels plummeted. It was easily the hardest thing I’ve ever gone through.
Moral of both stories: a person can be loving, kind, seemingly sincere and even bonded to you and continue to engage in sexually compulsive behaviors. Trying to figure him/her out will only result in frustration. The nature of addiction is that it doesn’t make sense and people only change when they are ready – you are completely powerless over it.
Some takeaways: I disagree slightly with Evan’s assessment that you will find someone who is just as good. You might not and that might make you want to go back to this guy. In my opinion, it is not worth the heartache. Another guy might be a little less exciting, but that will serve you better over time. Also, because the sex addict puts so much time and energy into sex, you might find that other guys aren’t as passionate and/or as skilled. However, if you feel basic attraction to them and they are good guys, don’t give up on them. Open-minded, loving people can and want to learn, so that aspect of a relationship can be improved upon over time. (This is something Evan really preaches and that I’ve learned to appreciate over time.)
I also look at my own need for excitement and realize that I’ve gotten it through unhealthy relationships. I now recognize and acknowledge this and try to get my needs met in healthy ways such as through outdoor activities, dance, etc. I also look at the guys I’m dating and try to assess if they are “adrenaline junkies” — if they are, do they have healthy outlets for these drives? Or do they live off monster drinks/coffee, cigarettes, etc? These are clues to me that they might have a higher need for excitement which is a yellow warning light to me for a possible addiction.
If you are really struggling, there are support groups for people who have or had partners who are sex addicts. I’ve found a lot of understanding from these people. The most common ones are S-Anon and COSA and some have online meetings. They won’t tell you what to do, but their platform will help you keep your sanity and maintain healthy boundaries in any relationship.
I wish you wisdom and strength as your navigate this dilemma, Zoe. :-)
DinaStrange 7
To be honest, I do not understand whether sexual addiction is high libido, or an actual disease. I mean, realistically speaking one man/one woman is a relatively new thing. In the past (and no, i do not approve, just state the fact) there was one man/many women. Something about men trying to propagate their genes to as many women as possible.
However since you love him, and naturally it bothers you that he has sexual addiction and will most probably end up cheating on you due to inability to control his sexual addiction, it’s better for you to look for someone else.
Erica 8
Well said Sarahrahrah, very well said and sound advice.
Great post Evan and well advised also.
Angie 9
Zoe,
You can always give him a shot if he is serious about counseling, but know your limit. Or you can take a break, date other guys, etc, with the consideration (I wouldn’t promise) you would give him a second chance. Or, you can go to therapy with him. Not addiction counseling, but you should probably also do relationship counseling on your own.
It’s pretty obvious you aren’t ok just throwing in the towel after three mostly happy years, and I actually think that’s a good thing. Addicts in general don’t make ideal partners, but I think for your sanity, regret-avoidance is the best path considering you have (mostly) happily hit the 3-year point. If this man is truly capable of over-coming his addiction, I feel you should see great improvement.
You do have to know your limits, though, and let him know that you are willing to walk away if he does not overcome this. 1 in 5 people meet diagnostic criteria for some mental health issue. I think people are coming down on you b/c sex addiction seems like a betrayal. It’s not. It’s an addiction and has nothing to do with you. I say give him a chance, let him discuss his addiction openly and honestly without shame and take your emotions out of it.
Leesa 10
this is kind of what happened to me. the point is that the guy that i experienced was so deceptive, that i didn’t know the extent of his deception until many months after our relationship ended. the point is that this guy deceived zoe for three years and only admitted to what seems to be half truths (he never met up with any of the women he was chasing) in order to appear honest to try to keep zoe. the guy i experienced did the same with me. admitted that he had a problem, wanted to get help, but, i found out afterwards, the reality was so much worse. he never got help. addicts are so mixed up in the head that they don’t know who they are, they don’t know what they want, and they don’t know how to love and respect themselves, so how can you expect them to be able to love and respect others. addicts try to keep hold of “hostages” because they struggle even more when they’re alone. if he’s a sex addict, women are objects of his addiction. how is zoe different from any of the others he focuses on? she’s just the poor women who is his emotional “crutch”. he is deceptive, a liar, a user and a cheat. if you love and respect yourself, you will walk away and not look back. if you don’t, and you give him a second chance, you will learn after you have suffered with him for far longer than you would wish on your worse enemy, that had you loved and respected yourself, you would have walked away from him at this point. that’s what i learnt from my experirence. life is far too value to waste on people who don’t have your best interest in mind.
Eleanor 11
@Angie 9
Sex addiction is an addiction, but would you marry an alcoholic, a drug addict, gambling addict or an adrenaline addict? When in the throes of addiction getting the fix becomes the number one priority at the expense everything else (family, job, money and even personal safety). Prioritising an addictive activity over the needs and emotional or physical safety of a partner and family is a more profound betrayal than cheating.
The partner of an addict will learn that she can’t count on him to follow through and be there in a pinch. The partner of an addict will never feel safe and supported and secure.
@Zoe,
After three years, it is understandable that you want to suspend things for a while and see if he cleans up. You are young, so you have time if two years from now you are back in the same position. If you decide to wait for him for a while, ask him to document his participation in 12 step programs or counseling, but most important of all make sure he wants to get well for his own sake, not for your sake or the sake of the relationship. Unless he chooses to do this for himself, he is likely to relapse. Your dilemma is you will not be certain why he is in counseling, and even if he wants to get better for himself, he still might relapse. He will always be a recovering addict. You must decide if you can have a happy life with that question hanging over you.
Leesa 12
i also wanted to add that even people who don’t have addictions per se, but have characteristics that cause problems in their lives …. have you seen how difficult it is for these people to actually change? even if they really, really want to change, often, as it is happening at a subconcious level, often they don’t change. again, they are wired like this, and the wiring often takes years and years to change. bruce lipton (scientist) talks alot about this in his talks. i’ve seen this in my own life. i’ve seen people who actively do 12 step programs take a long time to change. i’m talking years, not months. and often they really only change when they have lost virtually everything and everybody and have to face the shit within themselves that they have been so successful at running away from all their lives. of course there are exceptions, everybody is different. but i am speaking in generally.
melie 13
Zoe needs to run and run fast. No way would I knowingly take a partner back that confessed an addiction to anything. Life is hard enough as it is. On the flip side, if they were married and he became addicted during the marriage, totally different situation. Vows for better or worse have been taken, so you deal with it together. No vows, no deal.
Some other guy 14
How much would feelings change were the word “Sex” removed from the title?
Eleanor 15
@melie
Try if you are already married, but remember no marriage is unconditional. As soon as an addiction develops, the marriage vow is broken. The spouse has fallen on the priorities list, displaced by addiction.
@Some other guy
How about:
“Can I find happiness with a drug addict?”
“Can I find happiness with gambling addict?”
“Can I find happiness with someone morbidly depressed?”
The advise is yet to run.
starthrower68 16
Sexual addiction leads to behaviors that are both self-destructive and destructive to others. When the urges cannot be control, it then becomes a character issue. This is not how tall is he, how much money does he make, etc. This issue has the power to do some real damage. Lust is never satisfied. It will demand more and more. I submit Zoe is better off to cut her losses and find a healthy partner.
Michele McCauleu 17
Trust is the bottom line; without trust no relationship can be successful. It’s one thing to love but without trust, you heart will never be fulfilled. There will be someone else that you find love with and will not have these trust issues. Be good to yourself and listen to your heart.
John 18
Addict Shmaddict. The guy got caught and he is saying he is an addict so as to make it seem it was beyond his control and couldn’t help himself. Thats all. Everyone here is basing their commentary on a self proclaimed diagnosis by a boyfriend that got caught. If he had a mental health professional diagnose him as a sex addict then that would be one thing. But to have him self proclaim he is an addict as a way of mounting a defense is so obvious. Cant believe that so many people got taken in by that.
The bottom line is the same- she should dump him. But lets be real. He isnt an addict. Just a lousy boyfriend.
Nicole 19
I think people have a hard time believing that sex addiction is a real thing b/c so many public figures have been abusing the term when getting caught with their pants down.
But I think people can and are addicted to a variety of things and there is a difference between someone who can stop and someone who cannot.
Take the word sex out of the phrase and look at any addict. They cannot put down their addiction even when their entire life, family, job, etc. are on the line. They will hurt people that they really love. They will hurt themselves.
So a gambling addict will blow all of his money and keep digging into the hold, the alcoholic or drug addict will endanger themselves and others, and the sex addict is the person who will do the same.
I mean, I saw a show of some type where people were talking about it and you had people who talked about engaging in certain activities to the point where they were injured and bleeding, and people who lost job after job b/c they couldn’t leave the computer at home or b/c they couldn’t not look at porn at work. And this included men and women since I know that many people act like this is only something men deal with. One of the women said she would go out, meet strangers, and go places with them which she knew was totally dangerous in a lot of ways.
The fact that some people go to rehab to avoid the public eye/deny accountability doesn’t mean that others don’t have a very real problem.
Locutus 20
I agree with the advice to leave this guy. I too am baffled she just found this out after 3 years?? Did he hide it that well?
Just one comment for Eleanor #15:
Do you have your own version of marriage vows? Last I checked they included “In sickness and in health”. Guess that doesn’t mean anything to you since you said you would throw away a husband if they developed an addiction to anything!!! How many ‘other’ conditions do you put on a marriage?
marymary 21
Nicole
whether it,s real or not, he,s not figuring that out on my time. Sucks if you already married them though.
Karl R 22
Evan said: (original post)
“sex addiction is not listed in the 2013 Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders”
I’ve heard it classified as a form of impulse control disorder (312.30 Impulse-Control Disorder Not Otherwise Specified) which was listed in the DSM-IV.
helene said: (#5)
“I do think there can be a bit of a cop-out in declaring yourself a ‘sex addict.’”
I believe it’s often used as an excuse for bad behavior by people who get caught in some type of compromising situation.
helene asked: (#5)
“(aren’t all addictions serious?) and possibly incurable…”
I’m physically addicted to caffeine. If I don’t get at least 2 cups of coffee per day (or the equivalent), I go through physical withdrawal. If I don’t get my daily dose of caffeine, I’ll get a splitting headache for hours which can’t be managed by any form of over-the-counter painkiller (and the headache affects my mood, just like any other physical pain).
I can either give up caffeine completely, or I can manage a constant daily intake of caffeine at a safe level. That’s about as benign as addictions get, since caffeine is legal, cheap, readily available, and has health benefits which balance out the side-effects when used in moderation. But it’s still not curable. Even if I stop drinking caffeine for months at a time, I’m not cured. All it takes is a cup of coffee and the physical addiction is back at full strength.
Zoe said: (original post)
“Do I think I can trust him again? I don’t know.”
If you can’t trust him, you can’t have much of a relationship. Since you’re unsure about whether you can trust him, I think it would be a struggle, at best.
Goldie 23
Locutus #20, I would think twice before telling people that they have to stick it out till death if they’re married to an alcoholic or a drug addict, cuz the vows. I really hope people do not take anonymous comments on an Internet blog seriously, because the advice you’re giving here is pretty dangerous.
Cath 24
I agree with Goldie It is terrible advice to say that people have to stick it out in a marriage with a drug addict or alcoholic. Being married to someone does not give them a licence to treat u like shit
At the end of the day, if you stay with an alcoholic or drug addict who persists in their addiction, they will destroy you as well as themselves. It is even worse if you have had children with alcoholic or drug addict, and stay with your addicted partner. You may have chosen to knowingly go into a relationship with an addict but the children did not. The children are exposed to parental neglect, verbal abuse , physical abuse, emotional abuse etc etc The children end up damaged and it is just not fair to do that to them. Very often they end up partnering with an addict as that behaviour seems “”normal”" to them and the cycle repeats again
Locutus 25
Whoa,
Goldie
I never stated that at all and it is not my adivce. I just questioned Eleanor because she seemed to have a long list of conditional things about marriage. If the spouse does not want to address the addiction or if it takes over everything then yes, but according to Eleanor I just read that she runs away at the first sign of trouble. If someone developed a porn addiction and admitted it and wanted to seek help for it and did, would you right away divorce them? That’s what I read from Eleanor’s post.
John 26
Locutus @25
I agree with you that Goldie is waaaaay over reacting to your comment. I read Eleanor’s post the same way you did. Seems like Goldie and Eleanor both jump right to divorce court without even trying to fix the problem first. Not cool.
Nicole 27
@Marymary, at no point did I saw anything about the letter writer staying with the sex addict.
I was just commenting on people who said it wasn’t a real thing. It is a real thing and anyone thinking of staying in a relationship with an addict is in for a world of hurt I’m sure. I recall reading a blog (linked to my alumni list serv) from a woman who was married to a sex addict. She didn’t mention other women but there might as well have been b/c the whole story was a huge mess (she later took the blog down). His compulsions kept him from keeping a job despite having stellar academic credentials (and actually, professional ones except that his problem kept resulting in him losing his prestigious jobs). She married later in life and I think she stuck it out to avoid having to start over but yeah, I had never read anything like that blog in my LIFE.
I’ve never been in a relationship with an addict but being aware of the things people can be addicted to and not doubting reality are probably pretty important in avoiding it.
For the record, I don’t see how any addict who isn’t in recovery (since apparently people can’t ever say they are cured) would be a good partner for anyone. No matter what their other positive traits are.
Nicole 28
@Locutus, you are reading something different from what was written b/c this letter came from a 25 year old who left her BF. Not a married person. And she isn’t breaking anything by leaving him and even if she was married, this is a pretty serious problem that anyone dating OR married would be hard pressed to tolerate.
Eleanor 29
@Locutus and John
Was what I wrote in 15 what you misinterpreted or was it something else?
Try if you are already married, but remember no marriage is unconditional. As soon as an addiction develops, the marriage vow is broken. The spouse has fallen on the priorities list, displaced by addiction.
You presume broken vow with the end of marriage. I do not. I said “try if you are already married.” That is not throwing away. I said only the vow has been broken. The addict is not able to protect, and loves and cherishes his fixes over his spouse. The vow is broken. I did not say abandon the marriage because of that, only recognise that your partner has broken his (or her) vows, and take the situation that seriously.
Should an addiction endanger me, I would have very firm conditions whether I stay. If my children are endangered by being left alone while looking for the next fix or by being intoxicated while in charge, or their future through depletion of savings spent on fixes, they must be protected immediately. Even in that case, I would be separate and still work on the marriage. . .for a while.
Gina 30
Zoe! You in danger girl! DO NOT! I repeat, DO NOT marry that man. If you do, you will be setting yourself up for a world of hurt. I know that this is a painful time for you right now, but be thankful that you found out BEFORE you married him.
nb 31
Staying could put her at risk of sexually transmitted diseases.
Locutus 32
Nicole, Nicole, Nicole…..go back and reread. I am aware of what the letter says. My statement about married couples was in response to Eleanor’s hypothetical statement about married people. You obviously didn’t read all the posts.
Locutus 33
I don’t know, Eleanor, when someone writes “the marriage vow is broken”" to me that means “All bets are off” and your free to do what you want, i.e. get a divorce, at anytime. That’s how it looked to me.
Goldie 34
@ John #26, seems that you know more about my personal life than I do. Good for you.
I read Eleanor’s post as stating that, once a spouse has developed an addiction, there is a possibility that this marriage cannot be saved, depending on the nature and severity of the addiction. I read the response (“my vow said in sickness and in health”) as meaning that we have an obligation to stay married regardless of our spouse’s addiction, because addiction is a sickness and we promised to stay through that. Was there any other way to read it?
Fusee 35
Unfortunately, as unfair as it is, having any kind of serious mental health disorder is not compatible with being a partner in a long-term solid, happy, and healthy relationship. The affected partner has to get better and gain control of their disorder first, and casual dating might be a better option until improvement.
If the disorder develops within a marriage, it will have to be dealt by the couple the best they can, maybe through a temporary separation to allow treatment and recovery. However it is foolish to choose to enter marriage willingly with someone having a serious mental health challenge that has not yet been treated and successfully kept under control for several years.
Marriage is not simply a matter of being a good person, and it’s not simply a matter of love. It takes more than a good and loving person to make a good spouse. If your mind is not fully under your (wise and virtuous) control, it’s pointless to make life-long vows to someone else. And it’s foolish to accept those, no matter how much we love or how loud the clock is ticking.
If she cares that much, Zoe can offer this man her loving support from a distance. That’s what friendship is for.
Locutus 36
Goldie,
Her comment didn’t elaborate on whether she would first try to get her partner help nor did she say that if the addiction could not be overcome or worsened or he refused to get help then it might end up in a divorce. She simply stated that once an addiction forms then all bets are off. You added words in your head trying to defend her. She DID NOT say “Once an addiction forms then the marriage vow COULD BE BROKEN or IS IN JEOPARDY or MAY BE BROKEN or IS IN DANGER OF BEING BROKEN. She said the marriage vow IS broken implying that if an addiction forms the contract is immediately nullified in her eyes which means she can walk away at any given time- whether it be immediately or at a later time!!! You added your own words- “a possibility the marriage cannot be saved”. She did NOT say “a possibility”. When I read things I don’t add words to them or speculate unknowns.
Goldie 37
@ Locutus, “As soon as an addiction develops, the marriage vow is broken” means it is broken by the addict spouse.As indicated by Eleanor’s next sentence: “The spouse has fallen on the priorities list, displaced by addiction.”
Would take a lot of dedication for one person to stay true to their vows when the other person is not honoring theirs. Here you go. Words not added, unknowns not speculated.
As an aside, this whole vows talk always rubs me the wrong way. If the only reason why two people are staying married is because they gave a vow many years ago, then there’s something seriously wrong with their marriage and maybe it’s better for everyone involved that they part ways. If they have other reasons to stay together besides the vow, then they have a healthy functional marriage that the vow has very little to do with.
Locutus 38
“As soon as an addiction develops, the marriage vow is broken.” Those are her exact words Goldie. Not sure how you interpret “As soon as”, but I interpret that as immediately after an addiction forms. No kidding it is caused by the addicted spouse. Not sure how you can twist that to mean any other thing without adding your own words or speculations. It’s cut and dry. Let me give you an example. “As soon as the clock strikes midnight I am leaving”. It does not mean 5 minutes after midnight or 20 minutes after or 1am it means immediately after midnight. An infinitessimal amount of time after the clock strikes 12. Are you seriously still trying to contest her statement??
JustMe 39
Justbecause the vow is broken doesn’t mean the marriage is over. It means that the promise one party made has not been kept. That is the vow.
Katie 40
Hi
I’ve never posted on here before, but I’m gonna throw out a really off the wall suggestion… If this guy is so amazing that he makes you so happy, if he has never actually DONE anything with these women except flirt and talk sexy, and if he has owned up to it and says it is a genuine problem, can you not find a way to just let him continue, or maybe even somehow join in with him? On the basis that if he ever does go behind your back and get physical with any other woman, he is out and that is it? It sounds harsh, but it also sounds as if you love him a lot and as if he’s been able to make your pretty happy up to now in spite of this. So is it totally out of the question that you either turn a blind eye, or actually try to have some fun by helping him write the messages, or seeing if you have a bi side you could explore here?
Please don’t think I’m not sympathetic because I am and I can totally understand how hurt you must feel and how upsetting this has been for you. And obviously what would be really great would be if you found someone just as good, or if you stayed together and he got help and didn’t need to do this anymore. But if it really is an addiction type thing he has (and I have a partner with addictions, though admittedly not this kind) then maybe there are other shades you could explore besides black and white here if you don’t want to imagine life without him. After all, pretty much all guys watch porn and maybe he just gets off on the reading and writing aspect rather than the watching (kind of like sexting?). If he has been physically loyal to you and has no emotional connection with these girls, does it have to spell the end?
xxx
K 41
I had a friend in the same boat whose bf claimed he only messaged and did nothing else. She was smart enough to ask for cell phone records and credit card statements. Yep there were calls and hotel bills. Maybe this guy only messaged, but somehow I feel like that wouldn’t be enough…
Ruby 42
Katie #40
“…can you not find a way to just let him continue, or maybe even somehow join in with him?”
Addictions don’t really work that way. If Zoe turned a blind eye, and let him continue, what’s to stop her boyfriend from actually meeting these women? I also have to wonder if he hasn’t done more than he’s already admitted to, even though he has denied it. And if he is using the sex addiction as an excuse, then turning a blind eye wouldn’t help matters at all. Not only that, but he has betrayed her trust, and I doubt that this approach would remedy that. Watching porn on occasion, and feeling a compulsion to respond to sex posts and ads online are two different things.
“…or seeing if you have a bi side you could explore here?”
In that case, Zoe should avoid watching the video by Garfunkel & Oates on another thread.
Eleanor 43
@JustMe That is how I believe.
@Locutus You chose one sentence I said and what you believe it means as my belief. You believe “vow broken, marriage ends.” I never said that. Would your marriage certainly end if a vow were broken by your partner cheating on you once and confessing? If I were cheated on, I might try to save the marriage. You and I are different.
I said “Try if you are already married” contradicting what you believe a broken vow means. Why do you ignore those words? They provide context of what a broken marriage vow means to me. of what they mean to you that I did not say.
Staying in a marriage or a relationship is a decision made every day. I believe being married is a commitment between two people that includes a promise to try work through bad times but it is never an unconditional promise to stay together forever no matter what the other person does or becomes.
marymary 44
Katie @ 40
It’s a slippery slope. According to divorce-online (uk), facebook is mentioned in one third of divorce cases. And that’s just facebook, not primarily designed for hookups.
I had an ex, married, contact me on facebook. This “progressed” to texts, including pornographic images. He sent these to me while his wife and child were sleeping. I’m sure if she’d caught him (I cut him off before then ), he’d be swearing that it didn’t matter as we were never phyiscal (true). it does matter.
As for the girlfriend enabling this behaviour by joining in, that’s a step too far. Women feel pressure to be “cool” and not “oversensitive”. I get it but don’t take it too far. It doesn’t mean we have to put up with every cockamamie thing. I don’t mind that my boyfriend gets free food from canteen ladies, I think it’s funy. But I certainly wouldn’t help him hit on other women.
It applies to women too. We may not be porn addicted so much, but there are many who are indulging in online fantasy relationships . It’s “harmless” as they don’t meet such men, it’s all online. Sometimes not even phone calls. Well, that has brought down marriages. It certainly didn’t help mine. I’m embarrassed by it now. If soemone is ashamed of something, like the OP,s boyfriend, like I am, maybe we should be.
Friend of mine married someone who turned out to have issues she could no longer endure. They divorced. One of her children has still not forgiven her and they no longer speak. She can’t tell the child why she divorced, because she doesn’t want to alienate him from the father. Another friend married an alcoholic who drank herself to death, leaving their teenage daughter motherless. Once you let this stuff into your life, it can get to the stage where there is no right thing left to do.
regarding ”the recovering” I knew someone who was a recovering alcoholic and had quit drinking for decades. Instead, of drinking he married and divorced three times, ran off with his best friend’s wife when said best friend had a brain tumour, and started hitting on his students. One addiction replaced by another.
I’m not saying no-one deserves a second chance. They deserve the same chance as anyone else. ie if they start mucking it up, don’t just say “oh, he/she can’t help it. they’re an addict/recovering”. That helps no-one, not even them. Where’s the motivation to change when a devoted partner is at their side? If they change, it’s usually when everyone has left them and they feel the consequences.
Zoe, you’re not married, you’re not even in a relationhips (broken up), let this one go.
Goldie 45
@ marymary, I have a facebook story too, luckily I nipped mine in the bud before anything at all happened. I belonged to the same church for 12 years (left it in 2009), and every summer, like everybody else, I’d help out during their annual festival — setup, cleanup, selling baked goods, etc. One year during setup, I met a guy I hadn’t seen in church before (there was usually a good crowd so I’d probably never noticed him), who was setting up the bar. Apparently he was there for every festival selling wine and beer. We seemed to have hit it off and friended each other on Facebook. Almost right away, he start popping up almost every day in my FB chat, being very friendly. About the same time, I start getting these silly game requests from him on Facebook. One was, “Bob wants you to suck on his lollipop”. I couldn’t think of a way to tell Bob off, when one evening in a chat, he mentioned that he had two daughters, same age as my sons. I quickly remembered the two girls that were in same Sunday school classes as my kids, with his last name, and messaged back: “Oh is ‘Karen’ your wife? I know her well. She is so nice, gorgeous looking too, you Bob are so lucky!” Funny thing, Bob ended the chat almost right away, and never messaged me again. This was a wealthy, religious, conservative guy, active in his church, whose Facebook page was mostly reposts of all and any religious right things he could find on the Internet. As irresistible as I am, I’m pretty sure I wasn’t the first woman in church he’d approached, or the last for that matter! I feel so bad for “Karen”, who by the way is indeed very sweet and great-looking.
To Katie’s question, first of all there’s no proof that the amazing guy hasn’t ever DONE anything. Secondly, if he hasn’t yet, he will. It is only so long you can message and flirt and dwell upon those thoughts before you suddenly find yourself checking into a motel room for an hour or two. Happened to someone I know, the man flirted with everyone around him for years, and then one day, shit got real, he got himself a mistress. IMO, it’s not the same as watching porn if you’re interacting with real people and getting responses.
nathan 46
I really don’t know whether this guy is an actual addict, or using that as an excuse to cover his behavior. What I always find interesting about these conversations is that they never fail to bring up a lot of stories about the nature of “good” partnership, fidelity, healthy sexuality and a whole lot of related issues. The reality is that each couple has their own balance point. What’s “good” for one couple is a disaster for another. Trends and statistics can only be guides, as much as many of us would rather have black and white blueprints to follow.
Seems to me that the OP has an opportunity to reflect upon what she really needs in terms of commitment, and then to decide whether or not the guy she’s with is compatible with that or not. I’m guessing the divide between what she needs and how he is currently is too much. For the right person, Katie’s suggestions could turn a hidden, shame-ridden behavior into something more relationship supportive. It’s never a partner’s job to do that. We are not each others’ therapists per se. However, it’s also the case that many folks have a lot of shame when it comes to sexuality and sexual expression in general, and that it’s only through finding acceptance and exploring with a partner (or many across a lifetime) that the shame is transformed.
The thing is that this tends to happen only when the two people involved are at a similar enough place to make the risks. What I see in the OP is someone who wouldn’t be able to make that big of leap with her boyfriend without forcing it. And that’s not worth it. She may never want to make such a leap anyway, and so it’s probably best to move on and find someone else.
Goldie 47
Wanted to add. There are people (I know a few) who prefer open relationships. As in, both partners support open relationships, both meet other people on their own and/or bring them in and the three of them have their fun together. Not my cup of tea, but they enjoy the lifestyle. Maybe the OP’s boyfriend should seek out that kind of people. They won’t mind the things he’s been doing and his behavior won’t disrupt the relationship.
Karmic Equation 48
@Goldie
There was an episode on Investigate Discover (ID) that showed nothing good can come of the open relationship. Admittedly it was an N of 1.
But the couple had an open marriage. The husband was ok with until he got jealous that the wife liked a man too much. The man ended up dead. I think the wife too.
Sometimes I’ve thought an open relationship sounds interesting, maybe something to try. But then I think, “Nah, I’d get jealous or he’d get jealous, and someone would end up dead.”
“An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure.”
Frank Lavario 49
Sex addiction is not just about open relationships. Apart from that: what women (understandably) usually don’t understand is that a sex addiction of their partners have nothing to do with them. Usually it’s about traumatic experiences and unresolved problems from childhood or adolescence. Instead of a sex addiction, it could also have become a gambling addiction, alcohol addiction or other type of compulsive behavior.
Cat 50
I’m with Helene (#5) 100% – too many people use the “i’m a sex addict” cop out when in reality they are immature, selfish, compulsive personalities with no self control. This day & age of instant gratification for men = using online porn to get off immediately. They can’t wait a few hours until their S.O. gets home etc. It’s absolute insanity. What did our poor fathers & grand fathers do when they got horny? They either had to wait for their wife/g.f. or, use their imagination or maybe a girly magazine to jerk off – GASP! Nowadays men don’t even wait 1 min if they feel the urge they get online. To me it is the most selfish act, especially if they have a willing & ready partner that wants intimacy. If their partner is not interested in sex, than that is another story. If the writer is willing, able & ready to have sex with her partner & he is not attending to her needs, she needs to dump him. This isn’t about sex addiction, it’s about being selfish & not considering your partners wants/needs. A great website about porn is ….yourbrainonporn.com – maybe she & her b.f should start there.
“Evolution has not prepared your brain for today’s Internet porn”
Locutus 51
Cat5,
Nowhere did the writer say her BF was not “attending to her needs”. Not sure where you made that one up from? The writer said she felt betrayed which I agree with. Looking at online porn….no problem. Interacting with real people via the internet in sexual ways now that is intolerable, which this guy did. I agree with Evan for the OP to dump this guy, but I don’t agree with your little generalized rant about men watching porn and not being able to wait 1 minute. You turned your response from talking about a guy who actually has a problem or is at least untrustworty to lambasting all men with your made up beliefs. As a man I’m insulted to hear such utter made up nonsense. I bet you are the first to go screaming if a guy made up such generalized nonsense about women….
Locutus 52
My response #51 was to Cat #50. I incorrectly wrote Cat5.
Cat 53
My comment wasn’t about ALL men, it was about those men that abuse/over use porn & use a cop out like “I’m a sex addict” – I believe Tiger Woods tried that too. I don’t think using porn once in a while is a bad thing, although the website I mentioned may contradict that. My point was, there are men (& probably a few women), not ALL men, that use porn too much & it affects their relationships. I also said “IF, the OP was not getting her needs met, she should dump him”….no where did I say “the OP isn’t getting her needs met so she should dump him”. I don’t understand why you are “so insulted”. Never did I say “ALL men do this or ALL men do that”. Lighten up, I have noticed in this blog you arguing with many women about what they posted. I think you’re the one that has the hang up with “ALL woman do this or ALL women do that”.
Locutus 54
Cat#53,
Absolutely wrong. I call things straight down the middle and get all riled up when people are biased to either side. Reading your post again, to me I don’t get the specification where you were only talking about a specific group of men. It did not and still doesn’t sound that way to me. “This day & age of instant gratification for men = using online porn to get off immediately.”…sounds like you are talking and generalizing about all men. What angered me is that yes I watch porn and watch it even a moderate amount of time. Doesn’t make me a bad person and most women I know wouldn’t have an issue with it. Your statement really sounded like you were chastizing men for watching porn. Tough luck, I bet 80% do and there is nothing wrong with it most of the time. There is no harm in it unless it takes over your life or relationship. Most women I know jump right to instant gratification when they are horny and many are horny just as many times or more times than men. Doesn’t bother me one bit. And FYI when you just say the word “men” it implies ALL men!!!
Cat 55
@Locutus – Well, I guess that was your mistake in misinterpreting my post or what I meant. I agree with you, and like I mentioned before, occasional use of porn is not a bad thing. We agree on that & no I am not anti-porn nor do I think you or any other man/woman is a “bad person” for using it, including my husband & myself. My whole post was how it can affect a relationship when it is misused/overused/used as replacement etc etc. What I meant by “in this day & age of instant gratification….for men – it means the use of online porn at the click of a button. ‘In this day & age of instant gratification…for women – it means getting cosmetic surgery at the drop of a hat, before even trying other options or working out etc”…”In this day & age of instant gratification” – applies to both sexes in a lot of different ways. I could give numerous examples for both men & women…We live in a world of instant gratification nowadays so hence my analogy to our fathers/grandfathers not having porn. Just like our mothers/grandmothers didn’t get breast implants or tummy tucks or botox like it’s going out of style like nowadays. Everyone wants instant gratification! My example had to do with porn or using the internet for sex because that is what the post was about, her b.f soliciting women online etc. In no way did I say “ALL men use porn too much & ALL men are bad for using porn, blah blah blah”….not even close. So you read my post in a way that you felt was directed toward you? – for what ever reason? – and got angry? Really? It sounds like you have a hang up about porn & using porn & thinking you’re a “bad person” for using porn. Hence, you’re interpretation of my post. I don’t care that you use porn, really.
Locutus 56
Well your post was not stated clearly. Once again, when you make a statement and simply use the word ‘men’ it IMPLIES all men. You need to say ‘a lot of men’ or ‘some men’ or ‘most men’. Realize that. It’s not misinterpretaion, it’s mistating what you mean. If I made the statement “Women are insecure” that would cover ALL women. I would need to specify if talking only about a certain group or type or individual.
Finally, I don’t agree with your statement about men, albeit some men, having to instantly gratify themselves with porn and you make the statement about men watching porn instead of waiting for their wives to get home. I don’t have a problem with that. If I am at work and my girlfriend is home let her masturbate all day if that pleases her. All the power to her! I totally don’t understand why that upsets you. It baffles me. If she is that horny of a woman, but loyal and honorable enough to never cheat then that is awesome.
And as for grandfathers/grandmothers…their grandparents probably thought the same thing of them.
Cat5 57
Locutus @ 56 said:
“If I am at work and my girlfriend is home let her masturbate all day if that pleases her. All the power to her! I totally don’t understand why that upsets you.”
Perhaps if your girlfriend was mastubating to pornography of males, and you lived in a historically matriarchal society where men had been treated as property (including legally in the not so distant past, as there are those of you who remember when a man could not even get his wife arrested for assaulting him or that there are still laws on the books in some states that make your rape a crime against your wife, but not a crime against you), exploited sexually, and construed as the weaker sex, and often still are regarded and treated this way by some women, and you had been treated in this fashion by women at times, then you might have some understanding why this issues upsets some people.
Disclaimer: Every scenario/option available to humankind has not been covered in this example. It is an example for thoughtful and respectful discussion purposes only. Hopefully, individuals will understand the spirit of the point being made and not nit-pick every single idea, word, and sentence to death. No representation or warranties for fitness for a particular purposes are made.
Karl R 58
Cat5 said: (#57)
“Perhaps if [...] you lived in a historically matriarchal society where men had been treated as property”
That’s a truly immature excuse.
I could use similar reasoning to excuse almost anyone’s horrible behavior against anyone else.
Do you think my brother is justified in being a bigot toward an entire race of people who just happen to be of the same race as the men who murdered our grandparents? In my opinion, he’s trying to justify his hatred of tens of millions of people who did nothing wrong.
Would Evan be justified in treating me horribly? He’s Jewish. I’m primarily of German descent. We both have relatives who are old enough to remember the holocaust.
If someone has treated you like property, take it up with them. For the rest of us who haven’t, we’re not interested in hearing childish excuses.
Several of us have questioned whether Zoe’s boyfriend is just using “sex addiction” as an excuse for bad behavior. We’re not any more tolerant of using other excuses for bad behavior.
Cat5 59
Karl R @58
Thanks for taking a portion of the sentence and using it. I should have known that you would not be able to look at the overall idea of what I was saying instead of just pulling out what you needed to make your point.
Also, thanks for proving Godwin’s Theory correct.
Finally, prior to WWII would have told a Jewish person who was a victim of anti-semitism to take it up with the individual treating them so badly. I don’t think so because that was a systemic and societal issue.
Well…here’s some news…so is women and children being treated as property and sexually exploited around the globe, including the United States of America. If you don’t think this problem exists today, come visit me and I’ll be happy to introduce you to some of the women and children I represent and they will tell you their story. Then, if you still believe what you said above, you are free to tell them right to their face to take it up with the individual who treated them like property.
Cat 60
Locutus56…I never stated that anything “upsets me”, about men using porn for instant gratification or delayed gratification or otherwise. My point was about when it affects a relationship badly. Where do you see that I said I “was upset”. I am stating an opinion, totally just MY opinion. And you are reading my posts & inferring things you think I feel which “baffle you”. I’m really not following you at all. I’m not a woman that is mad at the world about porn use, but it seems you want so badly for me to be that woman. By telling me how I feel & that I’m upset & I’m wrong & blah blah blah… Sorry. And as far as you stating “women are insecure” I would not infer that you meant ALL women, I would read that & think to myself, he’s right, some women are insecure & some are not. It’s not rocket science to know that all women are not the same nor are all men. You seem over sensitive. And I certainly wouldn’t be “baffled” by your opinion about something. We all have opinions & certainly no need to get upset about any of them.
You can come visit the women and children that I represent for free in my free time.
Locutus 61
Cat5,
You obviously have a personal grudge against some people. As Karl R suggested, take it up with them. You’re going to place blame on everyone for some bad things taht happen in the world, really? People die of starvation in some countries, probably some in this country too, so you better not be going out to any fancy restaurants to enjoy yourself. Your argument is whacked. Take your bitterness out somewhere else.
Just because some women were taken and forced into sexual slavery, doesn’t mean I am never going to watch porn or go to a strip club again.
Cat5 62
Locutus,
I fail to understand how my saying that the sexual exploitation and treating as property of women and children are systemic and societal issues on a global scale and offering to introduce Karl R. to some of the women and children I represent (for free on my own time – somehow my comment got added to Cat’s comment), so that he can hear their stories personally and tell them to their face to contact the individual who sexually exploited them and treated them like property…makes me the holder of a grudge and bitter?
I’m pretty sure it means I’m educated and experienced on the subject, and that I consider the freedom from exploitation of women and children a vital social issue, so much so I spend my own time and money to help individuals and hopefully make some changes in the system.
And, for the record, I have also represented males who have been the victims of violence and sexual exploitation. Only one of them was an adult male who was the victim of domestic violence. I would represent more men, but they are not victimized at as high a rate as women and children, and when they are, very few of them come forward.
Most of the males I have represented have been children (including babies through teens), who have been physically and/or sexually assaulted by their caregivers.
So, as you can see, I hold no grudges nor I am bitter against anyone. I do, however, have a problem with societies and systems that do not recognize the extent of and their own role in the perpetuation of violence and sexual exploitation of women and children, and I am not afraid to stand up and say so…and to donate my own time and money to try and make that come about. I, put my money and time, where my mouth is.
I also do the same with Veterans organizations, and with a scholarship fund set up in memory of my sister.
With respect to your comment about eating at fancy dinners, the last time I ate out was last week. It was at the Country Buffet where I took the boy I represent (as a volunteer) who was repeatedly sexually assaulted by his father from the age of 8-12 before being removed from his home. Does that count as a fancy dinner I should be ashamed to have eaten?
Karl R 63
Cat5, (#59 & #62)
Of all the exploited women and children that you’ve met, how many involuntarily appeared in legal, commercially produced porn?
It doesn’t matter whether I quote half a sentence or your three posts in their entirety. You still haven’t showed a link between the two.
I know a couple people who have “acted” in porn. I know several others who were strippers. None of them claim to have been exploited or abused … and that includes the one who hated the job and only did it for the money.
Locutus 64
That’s just it Cat5. There is no correlation with most porn stars/srippers and the people you talk about. If there is on rare occasion it is beyond the realm of my knowledge or control. I am not going to quit something just because there is a small chance someone in the porn I am watching is there against their will. If you think I should then I also think you should stop buying clothes because they could be made by forced child labor and you should not have any 401K investments because some of that money might be invested in places like China or countries that are not friendly towards ours. Your logic fails.
Cat 65
@Locutus…with every subsequent post you make, I cannot help but think you have a hang up with porn yourself. If any woman makes a comment about it not being good, you jump on them. Remember, every one that posts has their own opinion, that doesn’t mean you have to some how convince them that they are wrong. I know personally some women that have been deeply hurt & their relationships ruined because their S.O. was abusing porn. With that said, I still don’t think porn use, in moderation, is a bad thing. But another friend of mine does think that porn is the “devil” because of the effects it had on our other friend. You can debate with Cat5 for the next 100 years & my bet is her opinions will not change. So why labor over & over trying to argue? It seems that you are trying to make yourself feel better about your porn use by arguing all it’s great qualities etc. with the women that post contrary to that. What my or Cat5′s opinions of porn are have absolutely no bearing on your life/use; how much you use it, how it affects or doesn’t affect your own relationships etc. So why work yourself up so much about it? My personal experience has been that the less my husband uses it, the better he is in bed, honestly. When he was single & we first started dating, he used it probably twice a week with us having sex another 3 or so times a week. And I had no problem with his use. In the last year, he’s probably “used” it maybe 3 times & the sex is so much better. Markedly. Just an FYI if you’re an “avid user”. It probably affects your performance more than you know/think. There is no vagina on earth that can match the tightness of your own grip & there is no way your body can match the rhythm of your hand thru intercourse – i.e. the “jack hammer” effect, which for women is no good! Now….with ALL that being said, I still think there is a time & place for porn, solo & couples. And again, this is just MY experience & opinions. No need to argue with me now, I’m all for porn!!
Locutus 66
This is bizarre. I was originally arguing with Cat and then Cat5 jumps in and unloads a load of BS on me. Then I respond to Cat5′s attack on me and now Cat comes back to scream at the way I responded to Cat5.
Cat, now you are diagnosing me? I am not hungup on porn. I can watch it for 3 hours or 3 minutes, doesn’t make much difference to me. It doesn’t rule my life by any means. Sometimes I watch it 3 days in a row, sometimes I don’t watch if for over a week. Your responses are highly assumptional and downright crazy as you even take a stab at describing how I might get off to porn. My own grip??? Is that the way I do it? You have no clue. Porn is mental stimulation for me. And no I do not masturbate by ‘simulating’ intercourse. Wow, amazing how you could possibly actually think you know what is in my mind. How arrogant. I already tried to explain to you how your remarks were generalizing, but yet you insist I have some hang up. You couldn’t be more wrong. Seems you think you know everything- even what is inside a person’s mind.
You are arguing for Cat5′s case? You agree with her that porn should not be watched because of the plight of a few who are forced into sexual slavery? That is what you are defending if you are backing Cat5.
marymary 67
locutus
it,s a blog with a comments section. People are gonna butt in, that,s how it goes. It,s not just you who gets random responses.
Locutus 68
Really MaryMary?
No kidding. My statement had to do also with both members having almost the same username- Cat and Cat5. That is what contributed to the confusion. Also, Cat5 attacked my original response to Cat as if my rebuttal had been directed at her. Almost leads me to believe they are the same person. I dislike when other members attack you about what you said to somebody else. That is silly. They should address my actual stance on the issue because they do not know the full story about my original comments to a different poster nor do they know the real intentions/feelings of that particular poster. But sometimes they thow in suppositions about how that poster might feel- that is just dumb to do. That is why it is ridiculous.
marymary 69
Sorry about the double post
Cat
Saw this today:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/sex/9828589/Children-and-the-culture-of-pornography-Boys-will-ask-you-every-day-until-you-say-yes.html
This is my concern with porn, especially on the internet. It’s not just girlie magazines anymore or the bra section of mum’s catalogue.
cat 70
@marymary..thanks for sharing the article. I do have great concern about our youth & their access to porn as well. I have children of my own at that age, one being a son. It’s one thing for grown people to have access to it so easily, but for young kids to have such easy access is scary. I agree with the article that it’s affecting our young boys & girls negatively. Something needs to change on how porn is delivered & accessed, but that is another blog. I still think there is a time & place for porn use (for adults), however, I believe it needs to be off the internet…..that is the only way we will ever be able to protect our kids from it, until they are of age. Either that, or charge for anything to be viewed online – making it very difficult for kids to access. I monitor my kids’ use of the internet, however, there is so much they see just at school that I cannot stop. Kids with Iphones etc. I have read several articles also discussing the rising cases of porn induced ED, even in young men! It can be a true problem for SOME men (that was for you Locutus)! Thanks again for sharing the article.
Cat5 71
Locutus,
I have a few things to say to you. The first being that Cat and I are not the same person. Why on earth would she or I use two different users names? Evan (or his website administrator) would be able to determine we were the same person because we have to provide e-mail addresses, which can be validated, to make posts. Even if we gave a different user name and valid e-mail address, the IP address of the computer or computers posted from can be traced and the individuals IDed to determine if we were in fact one and the same person. I have seen Evan comment on it before when he has banned someone who tries to post again (and on other websites also.)
Secondly, I have not “attacked” you, unless you consider the time I called one of your responses childish. For me, calling an individual’s response childish is not the same as calling an individual childish. There is a difference, and I understand the difference. I hope you do also.
Thirdly, you appear to perceive many of the statements made, questions asked or scenarios presented that you don’t like or disagree with as a direct personal attack. It is not. You are posting on a public website where people have different opinions and would like to discuss various issues, and the right to express them and respond to various statements regardless of who made the statement or where they originated. If you would like to have a conversation with one individual, then you should take it to personal e-mail or IM, and not post it on a public website.
Cat5
Cat5 72
marymary @ #69
Thank you for posting that article. It is very interesting, and part of the larger point I’ve been trying to make but seem to have been doing so very poorly. The issues arising from and surrounding the use of pornography are just one factor in the much larger systemic and societal problems of women and children being treated as property, and subjected to violence and sexual exploitation. When people focus on one thing, in this case pornography, and say that as an adult it’s my choice, it’s harmless and tell others they are just being prudish, the big picture is missed.
Karl R 73
Locutus, (#68)
If I disagree with what you say (even if it’s directed toward another person), I’m going to feel free to voice my disagreement. You may feel that it’s silly, but it’s not against the rules of the forum.
Cat5 74
Karl R. @ #63, you asked: Of all the exploited women and children that you’ve met, how many involuntarily appeared in legal, commercially produced porn?
I think that is a bit of a pointless question because obviously child porn is illegal, and I wouldn’t be representing the women or children if legal action was not involved.
But I will say the following in answer to your question: Approximately 30 years ago, I did some modeling, and I was offered, on more than one occasion, significant sums of money to do porn – both pictorial and video. I chose to pass on those offers because IMHO, whether a person will voluntarily appear naked in pictures and video for any amount of money…is a matter of character.
stacey 75
Go to an open meeting of SAA, Sex Addicts Anonymous and if your ex wants you back, maybe he would be willing to work a program of recovery in SAA. If he doesn’t get help, he will likely continue his addiction, or it will morph into another addiction. I was married to an alcoholic and sex addict and did not know for years. SAA AA and Al Anon gave me the info and tools I needed to make good decisions. I wish you the best.