Ashley Madison: Not Just Immoral, But a Total Scam as Well

Ashley Madison- Not Just Immoral, But a Total Scam as Well

I know I’m late getting to this, but I did want to weigh in with a tiny bit of schadenfreude.

So, Ashley Madison, dating site for married people (slogan: “Life is short. Have an affair.”) has been hacked and their database was revealed. People who are far smarter than I am pored through it and determined a few things that are pretty mindblowing for a site that was supposed to connect married male cheaters with married female cheaters:

That is a scam, pure and simple.

It was pretty much just a bunch of men who were writing to fake accounts. Those fake accounts were created by Ashley Madison to convince those male cheaters to continue spending money, given that there were no actual women on the site.

There were supposedly 31 million accounts for men and 5 million for women, BUT:

  • Only 1,492 of the women in the database had ever opened their inbox to check their messages on the site. That’s compared with more than 20 million men.
  • Only 2,409 of the women had ever used the site’s chat function, versus more than 11 million men.
  • Only 9,700 of the women had ever responded to a message from another person on the site, versus almost 6 million men.

That is a scam, pure and simple. Ashley Madison created the illusion that there were lots of married women open to extramarital affairs via the Internet, and, in fact, there were not. I’m not sure which is more scary: that there are infinitely more male cheaters than female cheaters (so much for men and women are “the same”) or that Ashley Madison could make $150M/year on a business that didn’t deliver on its promise, since virtually no women were on the site to consummate these affairs.

I’m against hacking, in general – I believe people deserve to have their privacy – but I do think it’s a just comeuppance for Ashley Madison. They may not have created the market for cheating men, but they certainly monetized it.

Your thoughts, below, are appreciated.

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Comments:

  1. 1
    Stacy

    Evan,

    I could have told you that men tend to cheat or search out for extramarital affairs much more than women because of how men and women are biologically. Men are also driven by visual stimuli much more than women.  Healthily functioning women (in general, of course I know there are exceptions) tend to not be driven to cheat just on the physical alone and tend to be more emotionally centered (and wait till we have babies).  As a result, it gets more complicated for women.  Anyone who denies this is denying how we biologically function.

    1. 1.1
      BLINGBLANGGANG

      Touche. Men are growing less and less appealing these days lol

      1. 1.1.1
        ann

        i agree with you Blingglanggang!  So many grown men these days behave so sub-par that it is so disappointing!

        (the come hang-out instead of a real first date… the quick hook-up….asking for sexy pictures in bikini or lingerie right off the bat! …etc etc )

        so disappointing…

    2. 1.2
      Sam

      Stacy, this tidbit of pop-science has been repeatedly debunked. First off, Evolutionary Psychology as a study is strictly theoretical (it is the softest of the soft sciences). And secondly the idea that women are less sexual is a relatively recent idea.  For centuries men were lauded as the more conservative “civilized” sex (i.e. less horny, less carnal).  It is just as ingrained in female nature to mate with a multitude of partners (if not more so), only we as girls are taught to feel shame about our sexuality (unlike boys, who are equally shamed for being less sexual.)  All these myths are stupid and harmful to everyone.  I hope you educate yourself before perpetuating anymore of this obvious mind-numbing drivel.

    3. 1.3
      Sam

      You know nothing of biology, evidently.  Females are aroused more readily by a wider range of visual stimuli than men.

      Also women would sleep around more if A) they were fully cognizant and not so disbelieving of how disloyal/selfish men are and B) if there was less threat of violent retribution (from men) for it.

      Many women do cheat but never get caught because they are much more thorough and detail-oriented (for whatever reason).  Men on the other hand think women are stupid (not to mention, ultimately disposable), so don’t even bother covering their tracks, but those who do typically are incompetent or careless enough for even a stupid girl to catch eventually.

       

      Many women invest time and energy and loyalty in monogamous relationships, due to thinking that the behavior men exhibit during courting will last forever – she thinks she has a great mate who will meet all her needs.  Yet if more women recognized courting for what it is (a con) they would not continue giving men their “faith” (i.e. Faithfulness). They wouldn’t cheat, they would merely decline  to be monogamous from the get-go stay single and keep playing the field. Its not cheating if its up front.  Which is, in fact, female nature.

      Most female “needs” like “protection” are manufactured anyway.  Women dont need protection by men from anything but other men. Elaborate shelter, fancy clothes, cosmetics, are marketed to women from birth in order to convince them these are needs.  Really it is men who benefit from these markets at the end of the day. If men were natural providers there wouldn’t be billions of women and children living in poverty and experiencing rape and violence at the hands of men. And in early human tribes,  (and those archaic communities still existing today in Africa and the Oceanic Islands, etc) hunting and all such labor was and is shared by males and females alike, and even children — the image of ladies picking berries and weaving grass baskets like princesses, children frolicking, while gruff dudes went out to spear boar (your modern nuclear family) is so historically incorrect I can’t even. On average (Yes, even in contemportray North America) Males consume more resources than they produce; that is the opposite of a provider.

      Think critically for ten seconds.   Better yet, do research. Dont just regurgitate some drivel that makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

  2. 2
    In Not Of

    Perhaps Ashley Madison was so successful for so long because users were lead by hormones and poor character rather than maturity, wisdom, and good judgement.

    1. 2.1
      BLINGBLANGGANG

      exactly.

  3. 3
    Morris

    Could it be women don’t need a website to get sex???

    1. 3.1
      Stacy

      There are tons of dating sites out there loaded with women.  The fact that there was such a disparity on Ashley Madison, a website geared toward affairs, reflects a bit on reality of what men (some) and women look for no matter how you slice it.

    2. 3.2
      pat

      Well, if those women are hooking up with men, then clearly men don’t need a website either….

  4. 4
    Dio

    I feel sorry for people who’s personal information was revealed by the hack. While I don’t approve of cheating, I also don’t approve of people playing the morality police. If they wanted to expose Ashley Madison as a fraud they could have done so without releasing people’s personal info.

    However, I’m not the least bit surprised that there were so many men on the site. I’ve been an active organizer in the kink scene and know people who frequent/own swingers’ clubs. Unfortunately, our lifestyle attracts quite a few cheaters and more often then not, they are men.

    In my experience, women are much less likely to justify their cheating. They know that they’re in the wrong and admit it whereas men tend to have all types of justifications why they cheat. And the justifications never fail to entertain.

    1. 4.1
      Jordan

      Respectfully, I have to disagree with your statement. I have found that women are more likely to justify their cheating and here is why. For a woman to cheat, she essentially has to be emotionally checked out of her relationship. Some are able to cheat without checking out, but for the most part they can’t do this without demonizing their partner.

      This process usually occurs when someone new comes along. Like I said in another post below, most women don’t go out looking to cheat. They receive attention from someone new, then they decide if they are going to cheat or not. When this happens, women go through the process of changing their marital history. They find faults in their partners that aren’t their or too small and exemplify them. This causes them to essentially demonize their partner in their own mind. From what I have seen, when men cheat, it usually is “in addition to.” Most men don’t try to replace their primary partners. They just want extra on the side. When women cheat, it usually is “instead of.” They transfer their emotional energy to a new partner, essentially replacing their primary relationship.

      When their affair bubble usually busts, the lying, blame shifting, and trickle truthing usually occurs because for so long they convinced themselves that their partners were the bad guys. It takes months, sometimes years for women to transfer their emotional energy back to their primary partners, which is why I think a lot of marriages end when a woman cheats. Now I’m not saying that there aren’t times when their partner wasn’t holding up their deal in the relationship, but from my experience, I have seen A LOT of cheating women finally admit that their relationships weren’t that bad. They just got caught up in the affair fog.

      Lastly, if you need proof, there are a ton of infidelity sites out there. The “Just Found Out” and “Wayward” sections on Surviving Infidelity can probably give you some insight.

      1. 4.1.1
        Dio

        Not really sure how you can disagree with an experience.

        Maybe in your experience you have had more encounters with deceptive female cheaters, but in my experience, like I stated before, it’s mostly been the men claiming negligence or coldness in their relationships. Now, it could be we’ve encountered different kinds of people.

        Also, based on your and several other comments, I’m starting to wonder if cheaters may be more honest when talking to peers of the same sex. Maybe women are more honest with me because I’m female and can possibly empathasize whereas a man may feel extra pressure to justify his behavior and vice versa.

  5. 5
    BLINGBLANGGANG

    Hahahaha! Thats exactly what these stanky, low moral, sleazebuckets deserve 😂😂😂

    1. 5.1
      Christine

      I think that will be the majority view!  The only real “winners” in this whole mess will be the divorce lawyers who cash in (well, assuming that these cheaters’ spouses leave them!)

  6. 6
    JB

    I was very skeptical when this site was first launched that there would be any women or very few women at all on it. So I did what I’ve been doing since the dawn of the internet and internet dating sites. I put up a fake reconnaissance profile just to peruse and see what I might find. From what I remember (and this was a few years back mind you) first off obviously there’s no photo’s so right there in order to even see what someone looks like you have to message them and get them to not only email you back but also “release” their photo’s to you. Which of course you have to PAY to do so that ended my “recon” mission right there. Many men, most not very intelligent or internet dating savvy like that goofball Josh Duggar who paid $947.00 were only too happy to pay some cash for what we now know was a scam. Unless you consider computer generated responses from “Fembots” exciting most were meeting nobody and getting very few responses from real women. The irony of my post is 2 or 3 years back I met a now divorced woman on Match and she told me (on our meet & greet mind you) that she had cheated on her husband with someone she met on……….. you guessed it………. Ashley Madison. So yep 1 guy got lucky…lol  And no, I didn’t end up dating her.

  7. 7
    Mike

    Women interested in having a fling really don’t need a site like Ashley Madison. All any reasonably attractive woman has to do is go out of town to any club or hotel lounge/pool/gym and she’ll be “Hit on”. I see this in action at my local upscale Pub all the time. Every Friday we have live music and it attracts a large crowd of regulars, and a lot of women from out of town staying in hotels a couple of blocks away, who often pair off by midnight with one of the locals.

  8. 8
    Jordan

    I agree with Mike. Women really don’t need a site like Ashely Madison in order to cheat. In addition, I find men are more proactive cheaters where as women are more reactive. The cheating man hunts down his prey and once the woman receives the extra attention, she decides if she wants to cheat or not. I’m not surprised a lot of women weren’t on Ashley Madison but they didn’t need it. If you want to examine how many women actually cheat, I think places like their jobs, schools, gyms, etc. need to be looked at.

    1. 8.1
      Christine

      As a woman, I can speak to this and verify that’s true.  The other day I got hit on while I was just taking my trash out to the dumpster (in my sweats and a hoodie, not exactly my most glamorous moment!  I wonder if he had some bizarre garbage fetish haha–or one for sweats and hoodies).  Just before that, I got hit on by the cashier at the drug store.  I could cheat on my boyfriend regularly if I really wanted to, even without signing up for a cheating website (but choose not to.  If anything, I was happy to take down my online dating profile after he asked to be exclusive and volunteered to take down his–to really give us a shot at a committed relationship).  I think I’m decently attractive but also don’t delude myself I’m a knockout either.  I can only imagine how many more offers “hot” women get.  It’s mind-boggling to me how easily those offers come, even without being a knockout and even without trying to get them!

       

      1. 8.1.1
        Dave

        Newsflash, Christine. Guys are horny. It doesn’t matter what you are wearing.

        1. Christine

          Well, now I’ve seen just how horny!  Sometimes I thought it was too bad I wasn’t just seeking casual sex, since it’s apparently much easier to get

  9. 9
    Kitty

    A woman, whether married or single, usually goes into an affair with a married man because she’s fallen for him and hope that he will leave his wife for her.  A woman very rarely seeks an affair with a married man as an end in itself.  There are a few married women who want to get a little satisfaction on the side and keep their marriages and families intact but such women can have their choice of men even if they aren’t very young or pretty.  So they have no need to pay for a dating site.  If most women were seeking only NSA sex almost no women would be on dating sites.

  10. 10
    Rebecca

    I agree with much of the above.  The hack was illegal and should be investigated and prosecuted, but in the meantime I’m kind of amused at the poetic justice of so many attempted cheaters just wasting their money.

    And I agree that women who want NSA sex have very little need for the internet.  I was amazed when I returned to dating post divorce that men’s willingness to have sex the night they met me was near unanimous, and I’m no knock-out either.

  11. 11
    jackson

    Women cheat all the time. As much as men. If you count emotional cheating I’d say 70% of women have cheated. For most men it really is pure sex and 90% of married men think of sex with some female they find attractive. But they really do love their wives most of them and no desire to leave . Women cheat to leave or try to and that is the truth. When a woman cheats, it’s rarely just horny sex release. It takes them a long time to get their it’s not a sudden decision.

    My last 3 relationships involved cheating. And women lied all the time and I did not cheat on them never even flirted while with them. I have never been in even casual dating mode with one woman and out with others. But I did participate as the 3rd person even though I was lied to at first. But I do raise my hand guilty because even after learning I was lied too I went ahead with things

    2 were women cheating even though they both had reached a phase of emotional separation and sexual with their spouses. Then I got cheated on. In all 3 cases I was trying to find an LTR and none of these ladies were party or wild types at all.

    First woman I met made it seem she was single. She was pretty and a scientist. Most women hiding stuff make an emotional connection with another man for awhile before it goes physical. We chatted a lot and met several times. Emotional connection established. I couldn’t figure out why she wasn’t breaking the touch barrier. Hugs good night. What? We had obvious chemistry. Then 2 months after knowing her and starting to fall for her a lot, she dropped a bomb. The old “there is something I have to tell you”. I was stunned when she said she was separated but living in same house but different bedrooms. And she had 12 year old son. She was a very smart impressive person. I was just shocked she kept that from me. But then told of her marriage honestly. No sex for years. No romance. And was on her way out (she did leave him eventually). It was hard fom me I’d never knowingly been with someone legally married. But our chemistry was undeniable. I decided to date her when I realized their marriage was over in every way but legal documentation. Our sex was for her a deeply passionate thing and much needed. Not just because it felt good but she felt wanted and attractive. It wasn’t at all she was just horny.  We had a healthy relationship that had the weird element of her living like a roommate with her husband. It’s cheating technically. She became sexual while still legally married. It’s cheating   I know that. But they did get a divorce and both wanted it. He turned out to have a girlfriend too just before. We always met at my place for sex and I never met her son. We ended friends once she got single she decided to move far back to her parents area.

    Next woman was foreign woman studying English. I helped her out and we had fun friendship. Tons of laughter. Emotional connection established. That’s what women need first well most as there are some who are just horny like guys can be. Starting dating. First sex was amazing. Breathtaking best sexual experience of my life she was so awesome during sex. She was trembling uncontrollably after sex I had to hold her. It was amazing at first then scary when she wouldn’t stop shaking. And I mean shaking like people who are freezing dangerously only she had good shaking lol.  I asked if she were ok. I thought maybe something bad happened in her past and it got triggered. I asked if she could tell me. She just said the sex was so emotional wonderful and connecting because it was her first time in 8 years. This was someone wanting to feel loved and desire for a LONG time. At first she told me her ex was terrible to her and made her feel ugly (she was very attractive in and out) and was planning a route to divorce. Then confessed weeks later she was too afraid to leave him and start out on her own so she was still very much married. I stopped seeing her but retained a warm friendship. She went back to her husband and still unhappy.

    Then I became victim (karma? lol). A great relationship just the best ever. Engagement talk came up at 7 months. We both were on same page totally wanting it. I planned to ask her to marry me on our 1 year dating anniversary. But 5 weeks after our first talk of a ring, I found she left her iPad at my place. I used it to sign on to my gmail but she was auto signed in. I couldn’t help it. Something told me to have a look around. And there it was. Message from a guy. They’d been meeting for lunches then dinners. Old friends. Stunned only because she was so affectionate still and initiated intimacy as much as me. Then I took her phone when she slept. She confided to close friend I did not challenge her enough. She is ridiculously ambitious whereas I’m “just” ambitious. She loved me and highly attracted to me but thought marriage with me would not be good life match. She emotionally cheated on me for over a month and left for the other guy (a lawyer)

    And to put a cherry on top of all this cheating dessert, the guy she left me for turned up on Ashley Madison site! A real user not “oh I was just looking” or “someone else signed me up”.

    I beleive cheating is common and especially the stats for women MUCH higher than told if emotional cheating is included (that’s how most women cheat admit is not about sex initially for them). Women are better at hiding it they rarely even tell there most trusted friend and wouldn’t even admit in an anonymous poll. They do not have to go looking. Men constantly initiate with any women regardless of status. If you include emotional cheating as cheating, and I do, women I believe cheat a relationship even more than men. After all, they are typically more social and emotional. Social media now too women can connect with a guy emotionally and unless really stupid they can keep it a secret very easily. Women have high emotional IQ and many wind up with guys just clueless or macho/controlling.  They get stuck with a mate they find over time becomes just a buddy or clueless. And sexually most women need deep connection. Very few just want to bang cause they are horny though more and more I see that happening with younger females.

    I also have turned down married women when a social connection started getting borderline. I was the one who politely would say this has gone over to uncomfortable and we should stop even though it is innocent seemingly.

    Men rarely cheat to leave. Women cheat to leave. If she’s cheating, a lot had to happen a long time for that to come. And unless guy can catch it before it happens and change what is chasing her away, she’s gone. And some women are gone but physically stay. But once a woman loses that respect she initially had of a man…forget it. It’s VERY hard for her to see him the same again. Bozo is out of the picture. lol

    1. 11.1
      Mike

      Your experince pretty matches mine, but the claims they make for wanting to leave are often fabrications to paint the X in the worst possible light. I can count on two fingers of one hand the number of divorced women I’ve met that claim any responsibility for the ending of their marriage…It’s almost like they have to villify their husband/boyfriend and break the bond in order to justify cheating in their own mind.

  12. 12
    ScottH

    I was a paying “member” on Ashley Madison.

    As far as I can tell, there are 2 categories that most members fall into:

    1.  those who are stuck in loveless sexless marriages and are starving for a human connection and touch.  There is an epidemic of these people.  Please do not say that those people should “just get a divorce.”  Situations can be far more complicated than you apparently understand.  If you are/were in that situation and didn’t “cheat,” then good for you.  You cheated yourself.  Getting your needs met when the person with whom you share a marriage certificate nonchalantly neglects your needs is not cheating (IMO).   They are cheating you and if you feel like you owe them kind of allegiance, go look up Stockholm Syndrome.

    2.  those who have a human connection but need more.   These people are cheaters, IMO, and deserve to spend eternity in the hottest places in hell.

    And yes, there are a lot of women in category 1 and they do resort to websites.  And they are good decent people.  I’ve met some.

    I was in category 1.  Who’s going to cast the first stone?  (spare me any sympathy too, if you are so inclined.)

    1. 12.1
      Kyra

      Few points here….

      I think you’re forgetting the third category of individual: sex addicts. Sexual addiction is far deeper than just “liking sex” and most men and women who are sex addicts resort to reckless/dangerous sexual past-times to act out deeper emotional issues.

      I’m concerned about your first category, especially if you feel you belong in that category. it screams of entitlement. “I married you. You owe me sex within that marriage  If you’re not giving it to me I’m going to get it from someone else.”

      But, don’t you also owe your marriage partner honest and monogamy?

      It just seems what you’re saying is a case of an eye or an eye or two wrongs not making anything right.
      I’m a single woman and, for the most part, am proud I have remained single and not entered into a relationship that led to marriage/monogamy because I can take as many lovers as I feel to meet my sexual needs which, honestly,  I sometimes feel no one person can do (like monogamy has us believe). As a single woman I have been approached by MANY married men both online and in person. A couple I engaged in extra-marital affairs with. I was once signed up to Ashley Madison, but never met anyone because I determined affairs with married men were too complicated for me.  But, I’ve gotten to the point — when hit on by married men — that I discuss their sexual needs with them rather than judge or admonish them. Most of the time they want more than sex: talking, touching, laughing. They’re not only feeling as if their wives have neglected them physically, but emotionally since sex and touching is, primarily, how men show or feel desire/attraction/love. To men, sex is very important; it boosts their feelings of being desired and wanted, and if the woman they are with is not giving them sex their self confidence and emotional state take a big hit.

      But, I feel it’s completely entitled, selfish and over the top for you to equate your partner not having sex with you to Stockholm Syndrome and that cheating on your partner is somehow owed to you. You owe her honesty and monogamy, but you’re not giving her that. See how hypocritical that is?

      I do believe partners should discuss their sex lives, even if their sex life is non-existent. I believe women should be attentive to their partner’s sexual needs. Most women I know, whose husbands cheated, weren’t having sex with them (or offering any sort of sexual touch) to their men for months/years.

      But, I believe, as married/committed people, talking about how you feel neglected and how it is disrupting your commitment to your marriage and the thoughts you are having about seeing to your sexual needs outside of that marriage is important. That sort of respect is what marriage is about and should be based on.

      I see nothing wrong with saying to a spouse who hasn’t had sex with you in months/years: “I very much would like to have sex. I desire the physical intimacy. If you are unwilling or uninterested in having sex with me, we should discuss my ability to seek sex outside of our marriage.”
      But, to say you’re some sort of victim because your spouse won’t give you sex you feel you’re owed (which, I’m sorry, that’s not the world we live in. No one owes you anything. No one owes anyone anything.) and that taking it outside of the vows you took isn’t cheating just wreaks of a selfish entitlement that is quite extreme.

      I’m not saying get a divorce. That’s a complicated choice and action. I’m not saying don’t cheat. If you feel you want to do it, can keep your wife healthy and safe from sexually transmitted diseases you could catch from partners, have as many affairs as you wish to get your sexual needs met. But, don’t delude yourself and think you’re some sort of victim.

      You’re married. It’s what you signed up for. The good and the bad. Enjoy the good and learn to talk through the bad. Having those difficult conversations with your wife just may make her see you through new eyes and desire you more sexually than she has in years. I’ve had quite a few married men I’ve known take my advice — after hitting on me and hoping I’d enter into an affair with them – – and seen their sexual lives with their wives greatly improve after such a talk. They, first, had to realize they weren’t some victim of sexual neglect, but a married who had to put work and time and emotional intimacy into their marriage to get desire and attraction and sex out of it they seek.

      1. 12.1.1
        ScottH

        @Kyra

        I had the conversation with my ex that you suggested, several times, at home and in the office of a professional.  It did not go well.

        “No one owes you anything. No one owes anyone anything”   “selfish entitlement that is quite extreme.”  Really???  Nobody has the right to condemn a person to a life of celibacy, certainly not the person who vowed to love, honor, and cherish me.  To unilaterally decide to withdraw from sex is an egregious violation of the wedding vows.  It is a hostile and mean act.  I’m selfish and entitled?  YOU BET I AM.  I am absolutely entitled to expect that my partner will hold up her end of a great relationship, or at least try to.  Mine shirked her responsibilities in the worst way.

        “I’m married, it’s what I signed up for, the good and the bad.”  Really?  Do you mean that if my spouse beat me for recreation that I should stay because I signed up “for better or worse”?  There is a line that can be crossed.  If my partner beat me, that is crossing the line.  Unilaterally deciding that our marriage will be sexless against my wishes is crossing the line.  It is emotional abuse and I have every right to take care of myself.  If you call it “cheating,” you are just clueless.

        Kyra- I am a 50-something man who married and raised children with a person who has borderline personality disorder and divorced her after 17 years.  You have never been married.  You have no idea what kind of hell my situation or anybody else’s was.  One of the things I’ve learned is to withhold judgment of other people.  You just have no idea what their situation is.  I suggest you consider that the next time you give married (or divorced) people your “advice.”

        1. Kyra

          “You have never been married.  You have no idea what kind of hell my situation or anybody else’s was. ”

          My father had multiple affairs on my mother. They had a healthy sex life (trust me, I heard it) up until they were in their late 50s, which I’m aware is something that happens.

          When my mother found out about one of his most intense affairs she was devastated, angry and stressed out. She lost the ability to walk, talk and understand language.

          So, yea. I have absolutely every idea what I’m talking about.

          If someone abuses you leave.

          If you feel your wife is abusing you by not having sex with you (something you and I will never agree upon), leave. Find a lover and have as much sex as you feel you are entitled to.

        2. Kyra

          I should have been clearer that my mother suffered a stroke (cerebral hemorrhage) after learning about the affair and dealing with the intense emotional affects of it all.

          A person doesn’t have to be married to understand the devastation an affair can cause.

          By all means, have sex with women outside of your marriage, but you can also man up, get a divorce and find as much sex as you want.

          The choice is yours.

        3. TJ

          I could not have represented my feelings any better than this post Scott.  Withholding sex, without agreement from the other party, is textbook selfish, and is a hostile, controlling act. Why then should the withholdee not be selfish and look out for his/her best interests then too?  The withholding is the much more egregious and damaging behavior.

          I’m not saying cheat here (though clearly the hostile withholding act puts that at serious risk), on Ashley Madison or anywhere else.  But one does have the right to fund his/her own happiness., especially when neglected.

      2. 12.1.2
        Peter 51

        Sex is part of marriage. “With my body I thee worship” is a commitment made in the Anglican marriage service. Something similar applies in most religions. Breaking that commitment is a serious rejection of the marriage. Demanding monogamy from a partner after decades of sexual refusal is not appropriate. With hindsight, I think 6 months is enough for a rejected spouse to demand a meaningful explanation and attempts to redress problems. That said, I went decades and not until I gave attention (not sex) to other women was there reform. A total transformation that I thought impossible took place. Too late. What would happen if I relented? Power dynamics do change. Children grow up and can no longer be made hostages (in UK women invariably get custody). So what? Once power is abused …

        Now I have a much younger woman with very attractive unmarried friends who do not interest me a bit. Even men, if their relationship needs are met, including some sex, can be happily monogamous.

  13. 13
    Lucy

    I don’t think anything justifies cheating on someone so don’t me wrong with what I’m about to say. I know a married man who’s a friend of mine but much older than me. He usually has girlfriends outside of his marriage which his wife is probably aware of but doesn’t say anything about it. He told me it’s because he has a high sex drive but she doesn’t want to have any sex at all so he has had casual flings from time to time. He says he didn’t know until they were married that their sex drives were incompatible because she wanted to wait until marriage to have it in the first place. I feel sorry for his wife though. It is sad that people stay in marriages which they don’t want to split up due to kids, financial reasons etc but decide to get their bit on the side at the same time.

  14. 14
    Joe

    Only 1,492 of the women in the database had ever opened their inbox to check their messages on the site. That’s compared with more than 20 million men.

    Only 2,409 of the women had ever used the site’s chat function, versus more than 11 million men.

    Only 9,700 of the women had ever responded to a message from another person on the site, versus almost 6 million men.

    Something doesn’t jibe here.  How can only 1,492 women have opened their inbox, but 9,700 women respond to a message?

  15. 15
    It's you

    Think of it this way — if you get 1 million people to sign up and only charge their card $25 once before they either delete their account or lose interest in the site, you’ve still grossed $25M. What’s their overhead? Very little. You could have run that sham business from your own house (which is probably what they did).

    They also had the benefit of word of mouth and customer experience having no effect on their “business” model. If you signed up and never met any women or thought “I think this is just a rip off,” it’s not like your going to ask your friends about it or try and get your money back and risk being exposed.

    It’s unlikely that most men who opened accounts ever invested that much time on the site and surely almost none actually had affairs as a result of it.

  16. 16
    TJ

    People should get married with the intention of being monogamous.  I think that is or should be a universal agreement.  Problem is, far too many (men generally) marry into virtual celibacy.  I believe withholding without agreement is abusive and a smart man/woman that is the victim of that  must leave the relationship.

    Unfortunately, I am not a smart man.  Kids are my trap – I love them so dearly even though I’m depressed at the complete lack of physical touch, caring and acceptance beyond spending the paycheck I provide from my wife.

    The fact that men are far more often on the receiving end of this neglect and what seem to me punitive laws toward men in divorce, my only advice yo EVERY man would be to never marry, unless you strongly desire to have kids AND you can accept you will have a high probability of being in a joyless/sexless relationship or you will likely get divorced and be destroyed and not see your kids anyway.

    1. 16.1
      Marrisa

      No way, I think wives are rejected sexually far more often. Or at least in equal measure.  There’s many forums and billions of comments of women desperate for sex but deprived of it while their husbands visit prostitutes or indulge in excessive masturbation and porn use  (porn is latin for prostitute, btw).

       

      When men are rejected sexually at least the women generally aren’t cheating.  Give your wife some no-strings-attached pleasure  (lick her pussy to orgasm and don’t let her return the favor). Do this enough and she’ll start feeling hot for you again.  It’s pretty damned simple.

      Porn-jacking or browsing dating sites, on the other hand, will exacerbate the no-sex (with your wife) problem. Are men really this dense and selfish? I’m impressed.

      Excessive interest in porn/adult chat sites is cited in a whopping 50% of divorce cases in North America. Obviously, these acts (porn-jacking, extramarital dating, seeking prostitutes) are not pro-marriage behavior. Would you be happy if your wife engaged in such activities with male prostitutes?  Probably not.  It’d probably turn you off and cause you to indefinitely lose respect.

       

  17. 17
    Hannah

    I agree with these men. Sex is part of marriage. Why if my husband just stopped sex, has no interest at all. The only physical affection is a kiss on top of my head when he leaves. I’m not a dog. I don’t even get a hug. I have asked him to go to counseling. They won’t take him , he’s an alcoholic. I have been to stores for things to maybe spice it up, Nothing works. Its been almost 13 years since he has touched me. He stops, so I am suppose to not have sex for the rest of my life? He is making the decision for me. He is asking me to stop being a woman, I am only 57. I’m not done. I want someone to be affectionate, and caring. I want to fall in love again. I want the fairytale. Contemplating divorce . that is a big step at my age,

  18. 18
    Kate

    I came across this post because I have a friend who is so wrapped up in finding a man but constantly unhappy and I’m trying to find words of encouragement for her (I probably didn’t pick the best article for that!). Whatever the case, she thinks it’s odd that I have no interest in a serious relationship.. I am a tall brunette who was a professional model at one point and because of a love of school, geeked out and got a few degrees, started my own business. I am not a lonely, unattractive person. I am simply busy and happy with all my friends, family and activities which include fitness and keeping myself in the best shape possible. On occasion, I meet a very interesting man who I am willing to go out with. My goal on a date is to have an enjoyable time with another person who I have determined has an personality that melds nicely with mine and we can both take time from our busy professional lives and have fun. I am in the moment, taking it in, listening to his stories, enjoying the interaction and appreciating his finer qualities. In many cases, they want more and I tell them very quickly that I don’t feel any relationship desires but I am certainly open to getting to know them better at a slow and easy pace. If something evolves that surprises me, great. If not, I’m okay with that too.

    This willful singleness puts me in a situation to be regularly hit on or complimented by men. They are very commonly married or attached. Because I’m curious and a good conversationalist, I have begun asking them outright why they are flirting with me when they have a ring on their finger. Or I’ll ask them how long they’ve been in a relationship if they aren’t wearing a finger (I can sense attached a mile away). I’ve received mixed answers but the most common reason is they are looking for “attraction validation” – they don’t want me – they just want to be told or get some kind of response that validates they are smart, sexy, beautiful, etc. Another reason is they enjoy the chase. Turns out, sex is actually on the periphery – it’s a perk if the other person shows interest but it’s not the #1 goal.  And in many cases, it’s a group of guys traveling (I live in a place where there are a lot of tourists) and they are drinking and having fun and suspending the reality of their lives back home for a while. It’s easy for them to get caught up in the flirting (as it would be for married women traveling and drinking together too).

    My friend needs a lot of validation. I’ve observed her behaviors for many years now. When she pursues a man, she isn’t paying attention to his character and personality or even the superficial things like looks or the way he dresses. She’s just looking for someone to mirror back to her that she’s amazing. When I give her a compliment, she beams like she’s just won an Oscar. It makes me so sad cause she has so many wonderful qualities. She seems strong on the outside but is profoundly insecure underneath. She sells herself short and the men she meets who are looking for something meaningful. I doubt she would even notice a man who isn’t that attractive but has some incredibly wonderful qualities. In a relationship, she complains about the petty things and misses all the great things about the guy. And then she wonders what goes wrong when he leaves or things fall apart.

    I have been married and divorced and had a few long-term, meaningful relationships. Each ended very painfully for me because when I love someone, it’s for life. I still love them all and can see how much I grew and learned from them being in my life even if we didn’t end up together forever. Life is ever-changing and everyone crosses our path for a reason – even just for a while to learn a little lesson or help them on their path. For a few years since my last serious boyfriend, I had a small desire for a relationship. I would feel it at night for a few minutes when I would go to bed and wish someone was there. But I knew I had some emotional issues to work on and so I decided not to date and work on my business, being healthy, building healthy non-romantic relationships with others, and working on a long list of my imperfections. I thought this would help me attract a good quality relationship but what it did instead is teach me to love myself in a way I only read about in self-help books. It made me secure, confident and empathetic. I have made incredible friendships with so many people – many men that I dated who are still friends who I encouraged to pursue dreams outside of dating. I just got a wedding invitation from one of those guys. I met him 7 years ago and he was an insecure wreck. He took all this time off dating seriously, built his career, traveled, did some very cool things. And one day, when he wasn’t expecting it, she came along and swept him off his feet.

    I think, like my friend, there are so many good people out there who are unhappy and lonely and perhaps what they need is to love themselves more and stop looking for others to fill in the missing pieces that only they can fill in? I don’t know; I’m not an expert. But it seems like a good place to start.

    To all of you with infinite courage – putting yourself out there and looking for the diamond in the  rough, I wish you the best of luck and hope you are nurturing and taking care of yourself in a way that ensures you are bringing the best “you” to a relationship. Even if you don’t find that amazing connection, it’s okay, you will likely find that you are happy just being you and well, the world needs more healthy, happy people anyway.

  19. 19
    Bill

    I think you have it wrong.  No doubt there are fake profiles and men out number women but no all are fake.  I created a fake female profile to see what I was competing with.  I was frankly shocked at what men use as their approach – I’m not surprised that the majority of men on this site strike out 100% of the time.  If you are reasonably attractive and don’t treat women like whores, this site is a gold mine.

    1. 19.1
      Liz

      Bill’s got a point..there’s a HIGH demand for men who dont view women as or treat women like 2-dimensional whores..

       

      Have that trait and you’re in, for the most part. Seriously. Lol.

  20. 20
    Karen Black

    I was one of the few married women hooking up with married men from AM.  Now single, and comparing to other dating sites, AM men are 1) great in bed and 2) better looking and in better physical shape and 3) rich! Many men from regular dating sites are also just looking for sex.  They lie to get it saying anything you want to hear to get it.  Then, they split.  Married men give loyalty to their wives or girlfriends especially when it comes to feelings.  Mrn from both sites do not see woman as anything but a vagina or lips to suck cock.  Its really all just free sex.  That is the only difference between you and s prostitute.

  21. 21
    Susan Taylor

    I was one of the few married women hooking up with married men from AM.  Now single, and comparing to other dating sites, AM men are 1) great in bed and 2) better looking and in better physical shape and 3) rich! Many men from regular dating sites are also just looking for sex.  They lie to get it saying anything you want to hear to get it.  Then, they split.  Married men give loyalty to their wives or girlfriends especially when it comes to feelings.  Mrn from both sites do not see woman as anything but a vagina or lips to suck cock.  Its really all just free sex.  That is the only difference between you and s prostitute.

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