Pity the Pretty: An Ode to Attractive Women Who Can’t Find Boyfriends

Pity the Pretty: An Ode to Attractive Women Who Can't Find BoyfriendsDear Evan,

I am 25 years old and have never been in a serious relationship.  I am a very attractive girl and I tend to meet guys easily and go on dates mostly every weekend. My problem is that it never leads to anything more than that. I don’t know what I’m doing wrong, but the date will go really well and things tend to either move really slow, I won’t hear from them after our date for a week or so, or not at all.  My friends all have boyfriends, and I’m really looking to settle down.  Can you help me?  By the way, it never gets farther than kissing with me.  I realize that if they don’t stick around because I won’t have sex with them, then at least I know. It just seems that’s all they are looking for. It seems that attractive girls only get guys that want to sleep with them.

Why can’t I meet a guy who sees me as more?

Ashley

Dear Ashley,

Today, I’m going to take a controversial stance. I’m going heap some sympathy on the pretty girl.

Does the pretty girl have the same issues as the fat girl? No. The pretty girl never lacks for attention. Heads turn when she walks into the room. Men leap to attention and whisper to each other before approaching. Yes, the pretty girl has more dates than she needs and probably has a waiting list a mile long. What could possibly be wrong with this scenario?

By being singled out for being attractive, you’re never, ever considered “normal.”

Well, if you’re a pretty girl or you know a pretty girl, you know exactly what’s wrong.

You’re an object to men.

You never know why someone likes you.

You can be intimidating without trying.

You can come across as aloof even if you’re just shy.

You’re instantly hated by a lot of other women.

You’re assumed to be dumb by many men.

You may be insecure, but people have trouble believing it.

You’re given things by men for no reason (Free dinners! Vacations! No speeding tickets!), which creates an odd power dynamic.

You’re catered to so frequently that you may lack some kindness, empathy or social grace. When you’re constantly put on a pedestal, it’s hard to be in sync with “normal” people. This is the same thing that afflicts celebrities, by the way. Except they get to claim “diva” status. You’re just known as a bitch.

That last one is just my observation about beautiful people and doesn’t necessarily apply to you. But the point is, by being singled out for being attractive, you’re never, ever considered “normal”…

As a result, you become a lifelong target—a trophy for men to bag. And make no mistake about it, most men want to bag you. For anyone to deny this is patently foolish. I’m as sensitive a guy as you’re going to find in terms of how I communicate with women, but I can still remember the rush of dating a Perfect 10. It was as if her magical glow rubbed off on me in some way when she walked into a room. And if I can be seduced by physical attraction, and the glory that comes with landing such a specimen, I would have to assume that 95% of the red-blooded, conscience-free men would feel the same way.

Put it this way—when I was single, if I had a chance to sleep with…I don’t know…who is the most distasteful female celebrity? Paris Hilton, maybe? Yeah, I’d do it. Just to be able to say I did. I wouldn’t want to have to make pillow talk, or cook her breakfast, or call her the following day. I just want to have the meaningless experience and cheap thrill that comes along with sex with a celebrity.

Men are to pretty girls what paparazzi are to celebrities. Their constant validation makes them feel important. Their ulterior motives make them feel used and disposable.

To me, that’s the perfect metaphor—very attractive women ARE celebrities. They get lavished with attention and praise. They get perks just for being pretty. Their mere presence makes people excited, nervous, fearful, giddy. And while it might seem like a great ride being a celebrity, tell that to poor Britney. Or Mariah. Or any of the people who crumble from the pressure and attention foisted upon them.

Men are to pretty girls what paparazzi are to celebrities. Their constant validation makes them feel important. Their ulterior motives make them feel used and disposable.

I know I’ve gone on a bit of a tangent here, Ashley, because it’s very rare that we hear that the root of someone’s problems stems from being too attractive, but I believe that is the case.

Some of the most attractive women I know in Los Angeles—tall blondes with thin waists and big boobs—are 40 and single, because nice guys don’t approach them and slimy guys are always on the make.

What’s really difficult for pretty girls is trying to assess when a guy IS sincere. I mean, it’s tough enough for an average woman to tell when a guy is interested in a relationship or sex. Imagine what it’s like when you’re objectified wherever you go. You start to mistrust everybody. You make nice guys pay for the sins of bad guys. And you think that if you insist on not doing any more than kissing that you’re weeding out the “wrong” guys. You may also be weeding out some decent guys. Although it’s unpopular to say, sex is rightfully important to men. A reasonable man with looks and money and life experience might very well say to himself, after five dates with nothing more than a kiss, “Screw this. I’m going to find a woman who matches my passion, who makes me feel attractive and sexy, who is excited about me.”

It’s not that you’re wrong for attempting to protect yourself, Ashley. It’s that your layers of protection may be having an unintended side effect—putting off otherwise well-meaning men who don’t want to feel like they’re in seventh grade all over again.

So how do you decide if a man is interested in you or interested in sex? Well, there’s this previous blog post that discusses this phenomenon. And I’m delighted to report that I actually have a five minute VIDEO that takes on the same topic. Enjoy.

Despite your very accurate concerns that men want to sleep with the pretty girl, pretty girls get married ALL THE TIME. You want to know how? They let down their guard, they take a chance, and they TRUST. That would be my advice to you as well.

Good luck.

Are you also an attractive woman who can never tell if a man is interested in you as a trophy or as a human being? If so, I understand your predicament and can help you in your quest for true love.

Click below to learn more about what it’s like to have a male dating coach who can help you find the quality men in a sea of shallow and disappointing ones.

 

www.evanmarckatz.com/coaching/group-coaching/focus.php

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Comments:

  1. 211
    thetruth01

    Wow Evan you made me feel special and then cheap all in one article. (I’m not blaming you for my feelings I just didn’t know that was how men thought about attractive women). 

  2. 212
    catherine

    Iv`e never considered myself attractive, but all I was in my teens, twenties, & thirties, was how good looking, pretty, sexy etc. Iv`e spent most of my life surrounded by plain & ugly people, so I suppose I was attractive by comparison. The problem with this was that women endlessly bitched about me, & men only wanted me for sex. Iv`e seen plenty of very plain women find long term relationships, while I remained on my own. As for looks being an advantage in other areas of life, forget it! I always had trouble finding a steady job, & had few friends. From my point of view, looks can be a distinct disadvantage in life, being attractive can seriously hold you back, especially if your`e female.

  3. 213
    Lisha

    Catherine,
    I’m not dismissing any of your experiences,but a lot of men just want women for sex. It makes no difference how attractive you are in the scheme of things, that’s just how a lot of men operate. I don’t even date much because of this reason. Even on the plethora of dating sites I joined a lot of men are just looking for sex. There have to be men out there that aren’t just looking for sex,but I have yet to find any.
    BTW, I’m a bbw, curvy,voluptuous, healthy,  whatever label I’m assigned for being overweight. I’ve been called all of these. One things for sure I’m not skinny. I guess I’m one of those women that people say,  She has such a beautiful face it’s too bad she’s not skinny.
    I just wanted to chime in to say I know how you feel…lots of women go thru this no matter their looks or size…It seems so many men just want sex and nothing else.
     
     

  4. 214
    hunter

    @catherine#214,
    …men only wanted your for sex?…aaahhh..I am sorry…I think we only see average, plain women in long term relationships, on account of, most men in a relationship with tall, long necked, busty women, with a small waistline, will not let them out in public…

  5. 215
    judy

    Catherine 214 – to some extent, you are right.  I will never forget the man who engaged a very ugly woman as his secretary, when he had two candidates, (one of whom was devastatingly beautiful AND competent.) He explained to me that if he took the beautiful woman, his wife would wonder what he was doing when he worked late, but with the ugly woman, he would not have feared anything (which shows just how wrong a man can be, and a woman too).
    Yes – read some of Karl’s comments.  It IS annoying when ugly women find LTR’s and here for your enjoyment is an authentic comment from a man yet again “Hey, don’t go out with her (that’s me by the way), because men will always be wanting to take her from you”.  What can seriously get you down is that these (idiotic) men (not all of them, guys :o) think that YOU don’t have a choice in the matter. 
    Yes, being attractive has its plus and minus points.  Men have come on to me for sex (and very openly said that they are not into relationships just one-night stands) and they get shown the door.  Not always – some men have been so delightful to be around, that I have rather short relationships with them.  Apart from one, I have not really done one night stands.
    Of course, there are men who will court you and pretend that they want a LTR but to be truthful, some men don’t even know what they want in the beginning (same as us). 
    As far as the women are concerned, a VERY BEAUTIFUL WOMAN gave me some good advice.  So get up in the morning, shower, perfume, put on you make-up, make yourself look as fabulous as you can.  It’s a compliment to our femininity that we show it.
    If they feel bad about YOU being beautiful, well, stuff them! (And……it took me years to do this).
     
     

  6. 216
    Sparkling Emerald

    A girl wanting to “take it slow”, often means she wants to know where she stands (IOW, she wants a bona-fide bf/gf relationship, exclusivity, etc) before the relationship progresses any further physically. 
    The guy takes her slower time line on the physical end of things to mean that SJNTIH & the gal takes his slower time line on the emotional progression of the relationship to mean that HJNTIH. 
    I wonder how many relationships that COULD have happened, DIDN’T happen because each person wrongly thought the other person wasn’t into them ?

  7. 217
    judy

    Hunter 216 – I’m not sure if you’re being ironic here.  Certainly, in some countries (want me to name a few???) women have to hide their small waistlines, long hair, pretty hair and other feminine charms behind…….veils/burkas, etc.
    Isn’t it great that in other countries, certain women are accompanied by normal men, whereas in others, there is more of a sense of possessiveness.  (both sexes by the way).

  8. 218
    judy

    Sparkling Emerald – 218 Great comment.  Yes, if the two sexes are not communicating properly, there must be some relationships that did not take off.
    An example if my own.  I had posted my profile on a dating site, and had put three men in my favourites.  I was pretty new to the dating site I was on.
    But one man in particular, I kind of liked.  But because he saw that I had three favourites, he hesitated to call me, because he thought I was the messing about type of woman.  (And I was just doing what people advised – keep your options open).

  9. 219
    miranda

    i gave up on love over two years ago right before the doctor told me i was pregnant. i have always gotten looks and compliments from men and women alike, and have had plenty of boyfriends (all of them rotten) and i see how the pattern will be in my life. i see people complain about their spouses and im so glad thats not me. im 26 and i still think every single day “what if i let my guard down one last time, what if i gave someone a chance again” and it occupies my thoughts ALL day long. im young and fun and nice and loyal, and theres no damn reason for me to be alone and miserable like i am, and everyone tells me that. but i know better than to think there’s any such thing as love because thats clearly a big fat LIE. i have been turned into trash and turned into a whore so much that i just stay away from men. i dont want to be trash anymore. my soul cant bear it.

  10. 220
    Sparkling Emerald

    Judy 220 – Yes, if the two sexes are not communicating properly . . .
    And that’s the rub.  What EXACTLY constitutes “proper” communication ?  Male leads the convo as far as the progression of the relationship ?  Or is there some way for the female to get this convo started w/o it looking like she is “leading” “over functioning”  “chasing”  “nudging”  “acting in her ‘boy’ energy as opposed to her ‘girl’ energy”  or whatever term some particular relationship expert can come up with ?
    And how is a guy supposed to figure out if a girl is playing “hard to get” or JNITH ? How is he supposed to know if holding doors and helping her into her coat is chivalrous or chauvinistic ? 
     Oh, and the sex thing ?  It’s practically a no-win situation.  Women fall into 4 categories, prude, b**ch, tease & jezebel.   (None are good)
    There is a female dating coach who charges thousands of dollars for word for word scripts.  She pushes her script as the EXACT word for word script a woman can use in EVERY relationship situation that  will unlock a man’s heart, and blah, blah, blah.  Gee, I do some acting, I have memorized oodles and oodles of lines in scripts, and sometimes even have to ad lib when an actor drops a line,  a sound queue fails, etc. etc.  But nothing seems to beat trying to figure out the EXACT and PRECISE way to verbally communicate with the opposite sex.  Not only do the WORDS have to be precisely correct and not veer off script or paraphrase, but you have to lean back and make sure your lips are never fully pressed together.  I suppose for another couple of thousand dollars there are step by step instructions on how to sit, stand, walk, lean, tilt your head, eat a banana,  sip your tea,  fold your hands,  and hold your shoulders.  I don’t mind having to follow word for word scripts, and have someone else dictate my body movements on stage when I’m playing a character on stage, but in my real life, I really would like to be myself, and be able to communicate a simple (non-threatening) message to a guy, without wondering if I just made one of the 10 ugly mistakes that women make that drive a man away.
    Or maybe I’ll just meet a guy who hasn’t read any of these relationship rule books, and we will take each other at face value. 

  11. 221
    judy

    Sparkling Emerald 222 – what proper communication is?
    I’m a woman – I know how to communicate to a woman.
    As far as communicating with men is concerned, I know how it doesn’t work. 
    For me, if a man holds my coat, opens the door for me, it strikes me that this is normal male behaviour.
    We women can often miscommunicate – try reading Rachel Greenwald’s  “Have him at hello” – confessions from men and the reasons they didn’t call back.
    See if you identify the stereotype you communicate to men without even knowing it. 
     

  12. 222
    Sparkling Emerald

    Judy 223 – No disrespect intended,but that is the problem, she is just ONE of MANY voices all to eager to nag and scold every woman on the planet who is over 20 and not currently married, that SHE is ALL wrong and somehow defective
     
    And the blog-o-sphere is full of that attitude:  (I don’t find THIS site to really be that way from EMK, some of his bloggers, but not EMK)
     
    If a man doesn’t ask a woman out for a second date, it is because SHE is defective.
     
    If a woman declines a second date with a man, it is because SHE is too picky.
     
    If a woman cheats on a man, SHE’s a b****.
     
    If a man cheats on a woman, it’s because SHE’s a b****.
     
    If a woman wants more together time with her man than he does she is “clingy”.
     
    If a woman wants more space than her man she an ice queen.
     
    If a woman has sex on a first date she’s a slut.
     
    If a woman doesn’t have sex by date 3 she’s a prude.
     
    If a woman does some heavy petting but declines sex she’s a tease.
     
    It a woman has gone out with a guy 1 or 2 times and stops seeing him and they never had sex she’s a b**ch.
     
    If a woman offers to pay on a date, she’s a ball buster, or she’s a liar and isn’t being sincere in her offer.
     
    If a woman let’s the man pay for the first date, she’s a gold digger.
     
    If a woman goes on 2 – 3 dates with a man, and then stops returning his calls she “led him on” and she’s a b**ch.
     
    If a man disappears after 2 – 3 dates then women are ridiculous if they feel even the slightest amount of hurt because he never promised her anything.
     
    If a woman has a high paying career, she’s a ball buster, unfeminine, etc.
     
    If a woman is a low wage earner, in a low status job, she is obviously just looking for a man to mooch off of.
     
    If a woman asserts herself in a relationship, she’s a B**ch who deserves to die lonely.
     
    If a woman smiles sweetly and goes along with everything the man suggests, she’s a doormat and the guy will eventually lose respect and ditch her.
     
    If a husband pees in the kitchen sink, the wife is to blame because she didn’t keep the bathroom clean enough.
     
    Bottom line, I am going to be MYSELF.  The BEST version of myself  I can be.  If some guy thinks I’m too bossy because he suggests goat cheese appetizers and I politely decline because I don’t care for goat cheese, then so be it.  I’m not perfect, and I’m not expecting perfection in a mate.  Just someone who is a good fit for ME.

  13. 223
    judy

    Sparkling Emerald 224 – thank you for your reply.  Yes, one could assume that a woman can never get it right.
    What I find interesting is HOW a woman (and indeed a man) can be perceived. 
    Why doesn’t she get that second date? Why indeed? Over my very interesting dating “career”, I have learned one or two things.
    1. It ain’t because you’re pretty/slim/tiny waisted/long haired/fabulous skin and a great conversationalist that he’ll want you.
    2. If he asks you about your past, it belongs to you, not him, at least in the beginning.
    3. It isn’t just the men who deselect.  Some of my dates have been really cringe-making and I have had to find a noble and kind way of getting out of them as fast as possible.
    4. Some guys (Men – I said “some”) are dying to find out why you’re single if you are whatever.  Some of their questions are indiscreet or interested, it depends on how you look at it.
    5. But based on the information you give them (or not!) they will have sussed out already quite a lot. 
    6. I was totally unaware of how I came over and in hindsight, have had rather a laugh about one of the descriptions which could have been attached to me quite easily, based on one or two questions fired at me.  (And some rather unfortunate and spontaneous answers).  I could easily fit the “Park Lane Princess” description.
    This is not me.  What is interesting is in what manner the man draws that conclusion.
    Sure, I’m gonna stay me too when I’m dating.  But a rather more self-aware “me”. 
    My choices of men have already changed since being on this site.  Thank you Evan and team.
     
     
     
     

  14. 224
    J

    Sparkling Emerald- I read that book some time ago and didn’t get that impression from Rachel Greenwald at all. I just found it an interesting take on the conclusions some men draw.

  15. 225
    judy

    And thank you Sparkling Emerald for your answer again.
    By the way, you go and eat the Goat’s Cheese.
    When the man asked me if I wanted white wine or red, I said white and he wanted red.  When I said fine, let’s go with the red, he said, are you sure?
    Ye Gods but some men drive you bloody bananas!

  16. 226
    hunter

    @227,
     
    ……true……some men don’t know when to keep their mouth shut…

  17. 227
    Sparkling Emerald

    Judy – LOL, :0  The goat cheese thing is a “no win” for me.  I really HATE it, and it is so trendy these days.  I have accidently eaten it, thinking it was a different kind of cheese.  The look on my face when I discover I have goat cheese in my mouth would definitely be a deal breaker out on a date !  Out with my GF’s, being myself, if offered goat cheese I would probably be a smart alek and say, “Ugh, I’d rather have something from the kitty litter box”, but on a date, I would just say “No thank you”.  So I guess I’m already “not being me on dates” :)  And if I have to die alone over my refusal to eat goat cheese, then so be it.  Goat cheese is like one of five foods I don’t eat.  Every other food in the world is my favorite !
    I know what you mean about self awareness, but there is also a wide variety of how men will perceive different things, and we can’t be aware of how every man will percieve things. So constantly trying to adjust every breath you take to please a man is a losing proposition.  They are not a monolithic group.  Just look at the heated debate about who pays for the first few dates.  Many of the man responded as if THEY represented EVERY MAN.  They don’t.  I don’t believe that “men are all alike” but some men on this blog sure do think they represent their entire gender.  They will SWEAR that EVERYMAN absolutely HATES paying, but I have had men outright tell me in is INSULTING when a woman tries to pay.  (maybe it’s a generational thing)
    So I’ll stick with being my best version of me.
     
    J @ 226 – I didn’t read the entire book, just what was allowed online.  The 2 examples in the online excerpt just seemed like men being petty to me.  I don’t expect perfect behavior from a man, and I cut them some slack.  I am not really sure the men were really being petty, I think they may have honestly just not felt it for the girl, but the author pushed for an answer, and they have felt badgered into picking the date apart to find fault with the woman.  Too bad, I read an online article from the author about how to give “good phone” and it really had some helpful, practical advice, and again, didn’t clobber anyone with a long list of how horrible women are.
    I de-select men “with cause” and “without cause” and I’m sure I’ve been de-selected on the same causes or non-causes.  It’s called DATING !  I’ve also had some LTR’s so I can be one big man repelling ugly mistake either.
    I enjoyed the VERY PRACTICAL advise in FTOO.  I re-did my profile and in a few hours I am having my photos re-done by a professional photographer.  After I re-vamped my profile per EMK’s FTOO advise, I got better quality men e-mailing me.  The advice was practical and effective and I didn’t feel like I was being hammered that every thought, word and deed of mine was one big ugly man repulsing mistake. How ever, my still being legally married was still an issue, so I bit the bullet and we signed papers, and soon I’ll be legally single.
     
    I am looking forward to seeing what my new photo shoot, re-vamped profile and new status as a LEGALLY DIVORCED woman will bring. (2014 will be the year I make a fresh start)
     

  18. 228
    miranda

    SPARKLING EMERALD – YOU GO GIRL THAT WAS  A LONG COMMENT BUT DAMN YOU NAILED IT

  19. 229
    Sparkling Emerald

    It’s called DATING !  I’ve also had some LTR’s so I can be one big man repelling ugly mistake either.
     
    OOOPS, the should be “It’s called DATING !  I’ve also had some LTR’s so I can’t be one big man repelling ugly mistake either.

  20. 230
    judy

    Hi Sparkling Emerald, 229 who knows? You may just find the man of your dreams? I certainly hope so.  New photos, new profile, a divorce finalised. 
    At the very least, you’ve opened another chapter in your life which is great.
    May I be the first to wish you a happy New Year in 2014 (I’m spontaneous, remember, as well as being a Park Lane Princess???:o)
    Perhaps the whole point of books/knowledge is that you find out what could help you. 
    My New Year’s resolution based on the paragraph below: 
    They will SWEAR that EVERYMAN absolutely HATES paying, but I have had men outright tell me in is INSULTING when a woman tries to pay.  (maybe it’s a generational thing)
    So now Park Lane Princess is gonna go the whole hog, and let them pay.  Come to think of it, every time I suggested paying or reciprocating, it blew up in my face! Oh well.
     

  21. 231
    Sparkling Emerald

    Judy 229 – Thanks for your response.
    I went & had my photo shoot yesterday, and afterwards I went to visit a friend of mine and she is stuck in a horrible marriage. After hearing her tale of woe (which was almost identical to MY tale of woe)   I am still on the fence about if I even want to go back to the dating game jungle.  Of course, the worst that could happen is that a good relationship goes bad, and since I don’t plan on ever making a legally binding commitment ala marriage, I can always bail if the relationship sours.    Then again, I could meet someone who is a good match for me and have a few good years.  Or maybe I’ll never meet anyone that’s a suitable match,  but that really leaves me in the same spot I am now, so big deal.
     
     
    You also said:  “So now Park Lane Princess is gonna go the whole hog, and let them pay.  Come to think of it, every time I suggested paying or reciprocating, it blew up in my face!”
     
       The whole “who pays for what thing” would be SO MUCH easier, if guys who contact me throught OLD, would just take the GREAT BIG HINTS laced throughout my profile that one doesn’t have to spend a whole lot of money (or any at all) to show me a good time.  I list lots of free activities that I enjoy in my profile. (the cost to hike in the desert preserves ?  ZERO !  Beautiful views, bring the camera & we can have a fun time photographing the desert beauty, and also, MILES away from any eating or drinking establishments, so no pressure to spend a dime)
     
      I think my profile clearly indicates that I care more about what’s in his heart and mind than what is in his wallet.  I also say that I enjoy cooking, so after treating me, a time or two,  he could always ask me too cook, and if I was comfortable being at his place or vice versa, I would. 
    Good lord, guys who suggest pricey dates, then complain that they are “expected” to pay, think a woman is only offering to “be polite” or is disinterested and pay anyway and then feel resentful . . . . Well that just reminds me of women who INSIST on cooking the ENTIRE Thanksgiving meal, refuse any offers of help, then play the martyr that they cooked the entire meal, provided the space etc. There was an ALTERNATIVE, they refused it,  and then complain. 
    Men, if you hate paying so much, show a girl a good time for zero dollars.  It’s a good test of HER character. A good hearted woman who wants to make a genuine connection won’t balk at a first date consisting of drinking free wine at the artist’s opening reception at the art gallery. 
     
     

  22. 232
    Lisha

    Sparkling Emerald,
     
    Free wine and munchies at an art gallery sounds like the perfect date to me, haha, I’d love it if a man wanted to do that with me, There are tons of free or nearly free activities for dates.  ;-)

  23. 233
    Sparkling Emerald

    Lisha 234 – Yes, there is so much fun stuff to do that doesn’t cost a dime, and is a MUCH better way to get to know some one than dinner in a stuffy five star restaurant.  But I think some would rather complain about how they are expected to pay for everything, rather than take control of the situation and come up with a fun, free, first date.  (Of course, if that first date or two is taking your cameras and going for a walk in the historic district and taking photos,  how is the guy supposed to make you feel obligated to put out ;) 

  24. 234
    Lisha

    Sparkling Emerald,
    Too funny!  I never feel obligated to put out I don’t care where a man takes me on a date, haha. The last date I went on the guy took me out to dinner, we had a nice time, then as we walked around waiting for the move to start he goes, We should go to a hotel instead. That should have been my exit but it wasn’t…We sit down to the movie and he goes, I still think the hotel would have been better and I know you think so too. That was my last date with him. I guess it just goes to show that you can  have a nice time on  a date but that doesn’t mean she or he is THAT into you. Even if he hadn’t given me the hotel invitation I still wasn’t interested in him,but I’ve never been one to just say OK see ya…I usually try to make the best of the date and I can laugh and have a good time with just about anyone. The exceptions are the men that have absolutely nothing to say, I had a date like that not long ago too. He just wasn’t into me I guess, oh well, haha
     
    BTW, the historic district date with cameras is a fun date too  ;-)
     
     

  25. 235
    Joe

    @ judy # 219:
     
    Fat, ugly women in those countries have to hide themselves too…

  26. 236
    judy

    Joe 237 – thank you.  I never thought about that.  Maybe we should all wear veils and burkas on our bad hair days, fat days, etc. (Just kidding folks).
    Sparkling Emerald 233
    I am still on the fence about if I even want to go back to the dating game jungle.  Of course, the worst that could happen is that a good relationship goes bad, and since I don’t plan on ever making a legally binding commitment ala marriage, I can always bail if the relationship sours.    Then again, I could meet someone who is a good match for me and have a few good years.  Or maybe I’ll never meet anyone that’s a suitable match,  but that really leaves me in the same spot I am now, so big deal
     
    Yes, I’ve felt like that too.  Many times, including twice when a man asked me to marry him (two men, twice, right :o).  I just could not do it.
    You can be a happy single, or a happy married woman or a happy woman in a committed relationship (or, for that matter, a happy woman who is as free as a bird with some relationships here and there – everyone’s different).
     
     
     

  27. 237
    judy

    Lisha 236 – some of my most romantic moments have been walking hand in hand at midnight under the stars, (free, free!) and eating a sandwich (nearly free) on the beach.
    Yes, money comes into useful when dating but it certainly gets in the way sometimes.
    If people were upfront about it, it makes life so much easier.
    But consider this one.  It makes me laugh just to think about it.  I go on a blind date and suggest coffee.  When we get to the cash desk, he buys his coffee and then turns round, and asks me to pay mine.  The guy behind the desk laughs out loud and says “Oh God.  You have GOT to be kidding!” My date went scarlet and then starts counting out his money.  (If that isn’t cringe-making……….)
     

  28. 238
    Lisha

    Judy  238
    Haha I liked your comment to Joe about all of us wearing veils and burkas…
    Poor date, geez….he didn’t even want to pay for a cup of coffee. That’s funny that the guy at the counter didn’t let it slide.
    I had a guy take me out and he paid for the movie, he goes you can pay for dinner later. We get there he places his order then moves  out of the way and goes, I wasn’t kidding you can pay…
    I didn’t go out with him again,but the reason I didn’t was because during our dinner he spoke badly about another woman he had met, he mentioned her by her full name and called her a B****. Not exactly the kind of man I want to get mixed up with. When he wanted to see me again I texted him back and said no and I’m glad I didn’t give you my last name but I’m sure you’ll still tell other women I was a B**** too.
    I’m with you,  a person should be upfront in the beginning. I had no clue we were going dutch. But I’ve read that some men think a woman should at least offer to pay sometimes.
    I know we’re living in different times,but I’d like to think chivalry isn’t completely dead. It’s always been customary for the man to pay for the date,but as times change I could see them discussing going dutch or the woman paying sometimes IF the relationship becomes ongoing.
     
    There are so many free or nearly free activities so it’s not like the men have to spend a small fortune to take a woman out on a nice date.
     
     

  29. 239
    hunter

    @235,
     
    …there is a lot of free fun stuff to do, yes, there is..it has been my experience, most women want a dinner…..on the first date…

  30. 240
    judy

    Lisha 240 – I think I would also react the same.  If a man calls another woman a whatever (insert insulting comment here xxxx), I would assume he has anger issues.  Don’t think I’d go there either.
    Sparkling Emerald 235 – you eaten that Goat’s cheese yet? (The things a woman has to do to get love, yeah, and that includes goat’s cheese? How about a nice free visit to see the goats?????:o)
    Hunter 241 – I don’t really know what to make of your comment.  I suppose in the past men usually DID ask a woman out to dinner on a first date.   Your comment could be taken both ways, i.e. is he too cheap to buy me dinner OR who does she think she is, asking for me to buy her dinner on a first date?
    Any thoughts?
     

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