The Fade Away

This song is fucking brilliant.

The lyrics are so smart, it makes my head hurt. And, of course, anyone who calls out hypocrisy is all right by me.

So, what do you think? Are women just as bad as men when it comes to breaking up?

Your thoughts, as always, are appreciated.

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Comments:

  1. 31
    Heather

    Erica,

    But see, you’ve just proved my earlier point.  It’s a cowardly move, not telling a person that you’re not interested.  Put it this way.  Would YOU like to be ignored after you find that you really like someone? 

    I’m not necessarily angry if I never hear back from someone I went out with once, I’m annoyed usually but not angry.  I do take issue with men who say, “Oh let’s go out again.” Or the ever popular….chime in with me here, ladies…..”I’ll call you tomorrow.”  To be honest if I never ever hear that damned phrase again, I’ll die a happy woman, LOL.

    Just because YOU do not want a possible confrontation, does not excuse you from being polite, mature, and an adult and letting someone down gently, because you don’t know how they feel, you are not them.  Granted, they might mutually feel no interest, but it’s always better to do the right thing, just let them know that you think it’s best to not go out again, and keep on going.

    I have never once regretted doing so, even during situations where it got ugly (one guy called me stupid, one guy said he agreed with my ex about hitting me and such, one guy email bombed me).  Doing the right thing is not always easy, but it is always better.  I’d rather have good karma on my side.

  2. 32
    Karl R

    Erica asked: (#28)
    “I don’t think that declining contact after only one date even qualifies as fading away.”
    “What are my alternatives, exactly?”

    When he contacts you after the date, you can tell him, “Thank you for the enjoyable date, but I’m not interested in pursuing things further.”

    Mia said: (#27)
    “I’ve simply never observed men having any deep emotions or capability of being hurt, so while I generally act courteous to men, I never operate from the assumption that they could be hurt, at least hurt by ME.”

    That’s the kind of misunderstanding that kills relationships.

    Based on studies using sensors to measure involuntary responses, men and women feel emotions equally intensely. Women are more likely to display their emotions in facial expressions and other responses.

    Men and women are equally capable of recognizing emotions in others. Women, however, are more likely to empathize (feel your pain).

    Mia said: (#27)
    “I guess deep down I don’t believe I have the ability to make a man feel very emotionally invested/attached to me enough to be upset over me.”

    That sounds like a self-esteem issue to me.

  3. 33
    Michael17

    Mia, yes we guys have feelings believe it or not!

    Erica: If a guy takes you out AND if he calls you for a second date–if you aren’t feeling it a text back is appropriate. Respect the effort he put into taking you out.

    I don’t see the point in preemptive rejections though. If you go on a date and you aren’t feeling it you don’t have to initiate communication just to let the other person know you aren’t feeling it. (Unless you told the other person you’d call or you already agreed to see each other again.)

    Example from my own life: Wrote a girl on Match. Didn’t hear back from her, so tried her a week later. A week goes by with no response and even though I’m disappointed, I forget about her. Finally I get an email from her saying that she met someone else. I appreciate that she was trying to be nice, but I’d prefer she hadn’t even bothered responding. I had already moved on, and her responding meant I got to feel disappointed one extra time.

  4. 34
    Heather

    Michael:

    EXACTLY.  That’s how I see it with a date, if I didn’t like him but he seems to like me.  I would offer to pay or split the tab, but no, and then he’d contact me to ask for another date.  At which point I’d think to myself, well, hey he DID take you out, he DID pay for you.  At the VERY least, you owe him that courtesy of saying that you don’t think seeing each other again would be a good idea.

    I’ve had a few first dates where I never heard from the guy again but we both could tell it was a pretty bad date, so I was fine with never hearing from them again. But like I said earlier, I’d be annoyed with guys who’d tell me that they’d call and then…..wait for it….crickets.  For me it’s the principle, treat others the way you want to be treated, that this world does not revolve around me, me, me.

    It got frustrating to meet so many men who just couldn’t be courteous and mature enough to just say something, but now I have my guy so the frustration was almost worth it, to finally meet a decent man who can behave properly.

  5. 35
    Chau

    Michael,

    Just curious, would you prefer that she let you know the day you contacted her on Match? Or simply never at all?

  6. 36
    Liz

    Really?  I even feel obligated to write back  when someone just contacts me to say: “Thank you so much for the contact, but I am _______,” then fill in the blank with something that doesn’t work for our situation ( looking for someone closer, under 50) if I am not interested. Followed by, I hope you meet someone great on here, I have had a lot of great experiences.

    If I have gone out with someone, and he took the time, effort and put himself out there, I would at least contact him to tell him I don’t see a romantic future for us. Golden Rule. Because I would like the same done for me.

    Now waiting on a call back after a glorious 8 days with someone, who was down here on vacation, and who just flew back. Completely intoxicating experience, that I wouldn’t give up for the world. Lets pray no sudden Fade Away because I will be on a flight to see him in two weeks. Good dates are just so damn awesome, no matter what happens :)

  7. 37
    Erica

    Heather,
    I am with Mia on this, that letting someone know that you are not interested after only one date with them is awfully presumptuous. It happened to me once (the guy e-mailed me saying that), and the situation was really beyond absurd, considering I found him very unattractive. I was thinking of e-mailing him back saying there is no way he is 5’10” :-D (he was 5’8″ at the most, and lied), but decided to take the high road.
     
    Michael17,
    I would do that if the guy was truly nice. In fact, I’d even probably go out on another date or two to see if he grows on me (if the attraction isn’t there from the start for me). However, a lot of the time the guy has no class or social graces (or whatever else it may be that contributed to my lack of desire to see him again to begin with), when I really don’t feel like wasting any more time or effort.

  8. 38
    Jewel

    I dont believe in preemptive rejections either. I always try to be kind, but believe if I havent met the person and we are just emailing I am not required to offer an explanation. Silence is the answer.

    If I meet a guy and he is asking for another date,and I am not interested in seeing him again I let him know with a simple ” It was great meeting you, but I cant see us as a match.” I think this is the right thing to do for me, but a few men have shown anger and sent me nasty communication in retort, so I can see why so many prefer to do the fade.

  9. 39
    David T

    @Heather 31 one guy called me stupid, one guy said he agreed with my ex about hitting me and such, one guy email bombed me
    I had a immediate visceral reaction when I read that part I bolded. I am impressed that you pretty much let go of how that must have made you feel. All three are a type of emotional violence meant to project power and control, but somehow that second got my adrenaline going. 
     
    @Erica 36. If you weren’t attracted or interested in the man, then why does it bother you that he took the time to say he was not interested in you? He made an effort to let you know not to wait for his call in case you were interested. No matter how undesirable you found him, he did not know that so his message was a gesture of compassion.  It might not have been necessary, but how is it presumptuous?
     

  10. 40
    Erica

    David T,
    I really cannot believe you are asking this. The presumption on his part, and a very big one, was that I was interested. That I would be waiting for that call. I really don’t understand how that is not clear.

  11. 41
    diamond1211

    I just wanted to say that I dated this man for 9 months. The first 6 months he pursued me soooo hard. I told him no, no, no and we were just friends. We talked on the phone and he would drop by my office to say hello. I finally gave in to a date after i felt so comfortable with him that I wouldn’t even consider it a date. I got used to him being around like a comfy sweater and We would just hang out and enjoy each other. One day we were out and we kissed; which led to more. We immediately became a couple. We dated and things were great. He did everything in the relationship and I never had to lift a finger. During Valentines, he made my day and I wanted to thank him by preparing a picnic. As soon as I showed and demonstrated my affection for him, he changed.

    Bottom line is, soon after that, he just walked away. I was lost. I didnt realized how much I cared for him. Two months went by and I wrote him a letter. He called me and we started seeing each other for 1 1/2 months. Then out of the blue, he did it again. This time, I let him leave. His excuse? He was going through some things he couldn’t tell me about? WTF? I kept him at arm’s distance for so long because i didn’t trust anyone. The moment I let him in, and showed some reciprocation, he left. How can a fading away happen like this.

    Anyone that can do that to someone else is just plain cruel. No explanation, no warning, nothing.

  12. 42
    Erica

    I have to apologize, I did not finish reading Heather’s post the last time in its entirety, and was not aware just how didactic it was. Thank you, but I will decide for myself what “the right thing to do” is. Nor do I believe that everyone is automatically entitled to my utmost consideration.

  13. 43
    diamond1211

    I forgot to mention that the 9 months of dating were in addition to the 6 months of us being friends first…..

    I understand the concept of “fading away” compared to just leaving.  However, the concept is still the same and hurts just as much if not more when there has been an established relationship.  

    I would rather someone tell me it’s over rather than leave me wondering.  Every fiber of my being wanted to find him and beat the living hell out of him but my pride wouldn’t let me.  It has been over 6 weeks and Im doing much better than I thought.   Rather it’s 9 months, years, weeks or days,  Fading away is really a coward’s way out.

    1. 43.1
      PrincessJ

      Dear Diamond,  I am soooo sorry that this happened to you.  He should have had the courtesy to tell you and you were within your right to press him, about what SPECIFICALLY he was going through… that he just could not tell you about.  That is total B.S.!  Yes, some men, perhaps many, enjoy the pursuit…but the really good ones, will work just as hard at keeping you, at cherishing you, because these are the men that actually want a commitment!  Even though it hurts now, hold out for something better–hold your head high my dear, treat yourself with love and respect!  REALIZE THAT WHAT A PERSON DOES IS ALL ABOUT THEM AND NOT ABOUT YOU!!!  DO NOT PERSONALIZE IT!  HE REALLY DID LIKE YOU AND HIS BEING A JERK AND ACTING SO INSENSITIVELY IS ABOUT HIM!  Set your intention towards finding a better man.   Best of luck

  14. 44
    David T

    @Erica 40
     
    If assuming someone might be interested is a “big presumption,”  then they are being presumptuous any time you are asked for a second date, unless you directly tell your first date you want to see them again.
     
     
    Unless you made it clear to him with words (or less clearly with overtly rude behavior during the date) that you were not interested, his only presumption was that he can’t read you mind, so it is better to err on the side of courtesy rather than assume you were not interested. 
     
    Suppose on another first date, you are attracted to the man you are out with. You want to hear from him again. Unfortunately, he didn’t feel it so he assumes you didn’t either and decides not to contact you again.  Will you be annoyed about how you had a fabulous first date, but this man never followed up and left you wondering for a week or so until you figured it out? Isn’t his silence based on his belief you were not interested also presumptuous?

  15. 45
    Daria (Ria)

    I seem to write comments that are totally offtopic in here, but …l think the left girl is pretty hot. And l´m a woman….:)

  16. 46
    Mia

    Diamond – that’s awful, but it goes back to my belief that a number of men DO enjoy the challenge of getting a girl interested, then leaving her. It’s a game to them and makes them feel important  and powerful. These arent innocent, nice, confused men at all. That’s why I’m so against anything that starts with the girl being hard to get and the guy winning her over through furious pursual. You never know if it’s only a game to them to like a chase. The best relationships start when both people like each other equally.

  17. 47
    kira

    First, i laughed so hard it make this pass week of multiple “fade aways” FADE AWAY from my focus thoughts…needed that laughter…

    Second, I think both men and women are equally guilty of the fade away.  But really it doesnt matter who did what to whom…the fade away let’s you know what type of person they are with you when things are in conflict or difficult…the fader is doing you a favor…

    Glad to learn early that communication is a weakness for them with you and move on.

    I can’t say that I recall ever just fading out on a guy but if I did I apologize for not having the balls to just speak up.

  18. 48
    Karl R

    Erica said: (#40)
    “I really cannot believe you are asking this. The presumption on his part, and a very big one, was that I was interested.”

    Erica,
    Your statement sounds presumptious. The man’s email doesn’t seem like it was (though I’d know better if I saw an exact quote of what he said.)

    If I tell you, “I am not interested in continuing to date you,” (or some similar message), I am telling you what I want, or what I believe, or what I think, or what I feel. 

    That doesn’t require me to presume anything. And my thoughts, beliefs, feelings or desires are not dependent upon yours. My statement is true regardless of whether or not you want a second date.

    However, you’re presuming that the man has made a presumption that you are interested in a second date. He’s sending the email because he hasn’t made the presumption that you’re not interested.

    You’re getting offended at your own presumption.

  19. 49
    Erica

    David T:
    What I am disputing here is that the person who does this is actually erring on the side of courtesy, as this behavior seems rather discourteous to me. Honestly, it’s like one step away from telling them why.
     
    Suppose on another first date, you are attracted to the man you are out with. You want to hear from him again. Unfortunately, he didn’t feel it so he assumes you didn’t either and decides not to contact you again.  Will you be annoyed about how you had a fabulous first date, but this man never followed up and left you wondering for a week or so until you figured it out? Isn’t his silence based on his belief you were not interested also presumptuous?
     
    Hard for me to say, as I don’t think this ever happened to me. No, I wouldn’t be annoyed, I’d be disappointed, maybe a little hurt. But after one date my investment can be only so big.

  20. 50
    Daria (Ria)

    @Mia 46 and diamond. I would be intriqued wether being with a woman for 9 months + 6 months is really the aim for a player to just mess up a girl for fun. For some reason, l wont buy it, call me naive, but l just wont buy it.

    Maybe there was something darker going on in your bf-s life noone knows about, and l dont mean other woman, but something way more *godfatherish*

  21. 51
    DavidT

    @Diamond211
    Cowardly indeed.  Even if his “other stuff” was another woman, I think he owed you something of that story after you two spent so much time together.  Vanishing after all that time is very much Not Cool.  It is like he completely tossed out the friendship part of your relationship too. You have my sympathy. If you date again, I hope the next has a little more integrity.

  22. 52
    Erica

    I forgot to add (in relation to the courtesy argument): I myself prefer not to respond in those cases not out of cowardice, but because my silence would be much more polite and less hurtful than anything I could possibly say. There is no good way of rejecting somebody.

  23. 53
    diamond1211

    @DavidT  & MIA

    Thank you for you nice comments.  I agree during this last dissappearing act i too felt like “wow. maybe he planned on making me look stupid” He did after all say no woman has ever told him no before.  So maybe it was all just a game to him.  But live and learn right? 

      I always had doubts in my head like”its too good to be true” and other things.  But I took a risk and that’s what relationships are all about.  The hardest part was not that he left but how he left.  And yes David, i thought too about our friendship.  What about that?  So now it makes the whole experience a darn lie.
    I thought i was doing all the right things so It’s hard for me to say next time i’ll do this and that. 

    Im patching myself up and feel like maybe in the Fall or before the new year I may be able to put myself back “out there”     I wont go on anymore.   I just wanted to chime in with my experience.  stay positive everyone and thanks.

  24. 54
    diamond1211

    @ Daria

    Yeah possibly.  I hate to play myself as the victim. I hate to give him so much power.   So anything is possible.  I will take my part in the acountability of it all as well.  It had to have been something I did or said that made him leave or not feel comfortable enough to tell me. I just wish I knew.  If it was not something I did or said then yeah something is definitely wrong wether it was internal or external conditions on his part…… which is why I wanted to share my experience as an example.

  25. 55
    Renee

    This is hysterical but not totally true. (Am I in denial? Probably.) Actually, I’m not the type to fade away. I think, ironically, it takes too much energy to do so. You have to ignore calls, avoid certain places, and basically be an ass while knowing that you’re being an ass; I don’t know about you, but that makes me feel guilty, which eventually weighs me down. It’s so much easier just to say goodbye and be done with it.

  26. 56
    Daria (Ria)

    Diamond, youre not a victim. And you did nothing wrong. And for some reson l still find it hard to belive, that he “planned it” because like l said,  l dont think any guy would waiste a time of 9 + 6 months just for fun.

  27. 57
    Soul

    I am guilty. I did fade away on a guy after 4-5 dates (and even a kiss), and I knew it was totally immature and rude…. 

    I just felt that the guy was too sensitive…. he was wearing his heart on his sleeve and it made it even more difficult for me to actually break things off directly. So i took the easy way out…shame on me! 

    But it is true that it is one of my biggest flaws….I have a tendency to avoid conflicts and just disappear when things are too tough for me to handle. I hate to make people suffer (or, more honestly, I do not want to see/experience their suffering). I am working on it but it has been and will always be a challenge for me.

    Ironically, I find it easier to be straightforward with people who do not seem to be too easily shaken; although the sensitive/nice people are the ones who really need your honesty….

  28. 58
    Karl R

    Erica said: (#52)
    “I myself prefer not to respond in those cases not out of cowardice, but because my silence would be much more polite and less hurtful than anything I could possibly say. “

    The two singers said: (in the video)
    “We pretend to ourselves it’s the nice thing to do, to let you down gently just by not fucking telling you.

    I’m seeing a parallel here.

    I agree with Evan. This song is brilliant.

  29. 59
    Erica

    Karl R,
    allow me to reiterate that in my posts above I was only talking about what happens after one date. If it were any more than that, I wouldn’t just disappear.
     
    As for your post on presumption: considering that you don’t know how the guy’s message was actually worded, your whole comment is one big presumption. :) From what I recall, it was really quite precious, something about sparing me considerable emotional pain down the line. I was most bemused.

  30. 60
    JB

    There seems to a lot of confusion in this thread as to what an actual “Fade away” is.

    If someone doesn’t return your call after 2 or 5 dates for whatever reason that’s not a “fade away”.

    If someone goes on an internet meet & greet with you and emails you 2 more times and stops that’s not a “fade away”.

    In other words you have to have something established for someone to “fade away” from. OVER TIME

    “Fade away’s” have to happen over time or it’s not a “Fade”

    Here’s what a definite “Fade away” is ie:

    I was dating a woman exclusively for 6 months. Around the 4.5 month mark she started to cancel dates, returned phone calls less frequently etc…. At the 6 month mark I was barely seeing her once a week and phone chatting maybe twice a week. About a month later she stopped “accepting” dates saying she was “busy” and waited a day or 2 to return any phone call all with out ever saying “I don’t want to see you anymore” or this is O V A. I had to make my own ending/closure by stopping contacting her.

    What SHE did my friends……… is a ….F  A  D  E     A    W    A    Y………………. :-(

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