Comments on: Do You Want Advice or Do You Want Validation?

By: Nissa

Nissa — Tue, 16 Apr 2013 19:23:33 +0000

Great article, Evan. I am not in a relationship, but I do have this issue with my Dad. When I tell him about my day, issue etc he will say things like “what you should do is….” or “you need to…”. Please note: this occurs even when I am merely giving facts about what someone has done (my lawyer filed this document and it will be 6 weeks before my court date,etc). This makes my eyes bug out as I bite hard on my tongue to keep from commenting.
Now, since this is my Dad, it seems to me that perhaps he has not yet realized that I’ve grown up and am a competent person. For me, there are four issues here. One, his ideas about how to solve things are radically different than mine. Two, when I provide information, I almost always have already decided what I need to do or am willing to do, but am expressing my discomfort with the situation. I genuinely do not want feedback. Three, his suggestions almost always stress me out and make me feel worse. Four, when I am providing facts, I am not always in the right place to help him process his emotional response to those events.
Now, my Dad has expressed that he is just trying to help, that it always makes him feel better when someone gives him suggestions. He didn’t know how to know when I needed feedback. My response was “Please don’t provide suggestions unless you get a direct request for it, such as: what is your opinion, what do you think, what would you do?”. I tried to make it clear when I would welcome input and when I would not. To be fair, when he discusses his life, I also ask him “Do you want input on that?” or “Are you looking for a suggestion?” before offering my thoughts. My first assumption is that he knows best what is right for him.
I also gave him specific feedback that he could offer that I would receive as helpful, such as saying “gosh, un-huh, wow, that’s big, what are you going to do?” This helps me receive his commentary without feeling judged or that he believes I am not competent to handle the situation.
When I do share my emotions about a situation with my Dad I try to specify ”I’m just venting, I don’t need you to fix this”, or even “I already have a solution, Dad, I’m just not ready to do it yet, I’m still too angry/sad/riled up”. Part of this is a belief I have that if I have an emotion, I don’t have to do anything about it. Just saying “I’m angry!” often is enough to move me past that emotion.
However, I almost always end with a comment of “Thanks for listening; that really helped” or “when you listen it really makes me feel supported, and I appreciate that”. I try hard to be clear about what I’m looking for and to provide the same to him.
What is good about this is that (in spite of the irritation factor) it is a process where we both try to respect what the other needs and wants. We both listen to what the other says and try to accomodate that person’s preferred mode of conversation. This has genuinely helped us communicate better and made the relationship more enjoyable.

By: Greg

Greg — Wed, 07 Dec 2011 14:44:57 +0000

The whole point of the post is that men and women tend to communicate differently. Understanding that men and women have different communication styles helps relationships. He’s not saying one way is better than the other.
Leaving the seat up is not a character flaw. Many men have gone their entire lives without having to even think about such a thing. Its a minor thing. Women do annoying things that men have to deal with. I can’t make my wife stop liking trash reality TV programs and she can’t make me stop liking football. Acceptance is about being able to overlook minor things that don’t matter, and understand that men and women are different.

By: Ron

Ron — Wed, 07 Dec 2011 02:46:52 +0000

A funny little history story although you don’t have to post it.

Cato (of Roman times) said that we men rule the world and then we come home and women rule us.

Great blog and comments.

By: Kat Wilder

Kat Wilder — Wed, 24 Mar 2010 18:22:10 +0000

Let's face it, men and women are different doh and we react differently. Women do need to understand that men are fixers, and men do need to understand that women want to be heard, and not always get advice (or, be "fixed.") I wish both sexes could appreciate those differences and learn how to work with them. And that means each couple should at some point have a conversation about what he/she wants his/her partner to do when venting, crying, etc. Then, we should respect that (and be forgiven if we sometimes slip into old patterns). This is not rocket science; it's communication (uh, which is often like rocket science!) And, honestly, we women have trouble advising each other, too.

By: anette

anette — Tue, 23 Mar 2010 11:49:38 +0000

@70 I don’t know how you got all that from Evan’s comments.

I did get the impression from Evans comments, that he was saying a little “too much” that women should curb their need for validation.

The Post title, say’s it all. Yes, we need validation.

Find the validation you are able to handle as a man, and find a woman that only requires that much.

Women will alway’s need it, just like men will in their stuff too And it won’t alway’s make sense.

By: anette

anette — Tue, 23 Mar 2010 11:42:58 +0000

@ 65

You make a great point.

Do you put the seat down?

By: anette

anette — Tue, 23 Mar 2010 11:28:30 +0000

Okay before I read everything else, TY for those that did read my wall of text. God that was aweful!! hahaha. I appreciate you listening.

Toilet thing. He can leave it up if he wants. I’m just going to ask him to put it down. It’s a thing. It’s like saying I hate putting gas in the car. It’s a thing. I HATE PUTTING GAS IN THE CAR!! hahaha.

Not a big thing, he doesn’t have to do it, but…it’s really nice when he does, and I notice it. I’m a bit forgetful by nature and am worrying about other complicated stuff. Hitting the poop water(no seat), or hitting the “ding ding ding” no gas meter(my constant issue) sucks.

But in terms of equality, yes it should be “up” as much as “down”.

No reason either way. Weird huh? What is a sheila/bloke thing? It something you recognize, don’t understand and do, because it’s kinda sweet It’s a rule we know

By: Evan Marc Katz

Evan Marc Katz — Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:15:03 +0000

To wrap up this thread:

NOWHERE do I say to put up with bad behavior. Everywhere on this site, I tell women to leave men who don’t call, don’t commit, only want sex, don’t follow through on dates, don’t treat you well, etc.

EVERYWHERE I tell you to accept OTHER things that are NORMAL among GOOD men. That may include him being a flirt, it may include him being a workaholic, it may include him working on a different relationship timetable, it may even include him forgetting the way you like your toilet seat.

Choose your battles, Betty. But let’s get it straight: I’m an advocate for women who want to know how to handle men. Good men. Like me. Like my male readers. So for you to conflate clueless and inconsiderate bathroom behavior with a man who only calls you once a week…or doesn’t propose after 4 years… well, those are two entirely different stories.

I hope you can agree – and agree with everything else I’ve offered today. I am FOR you, not against you. And, as you can tell, it pains me that you can’t see this.

Off to coach more women like you…

Evan

By: Betty

Betty — Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:08:18 +0000

@69: I'm not making men the enemy. I'm acknowledging that some men are the enemy, as are some women. You keep telling women that they have to accept specific things about men. They do not. Then you follow it up with a threat that if they don't they won't find a man to love them. Again, false. There are so many men who do not partake of what many of consider "typical male" behavior. These are the men I know and love. They also happen to be men who consider leaving a toilet seat up after peeing to be very crude behavior and would be embarrassed if they did it, even by mistake. Just as a counter-example.

By: Betty

Betty — Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:00:57 +0000

@67: The problem with your argument is that you are suggesting that women accept traditional roles that we have fought long and hard to break free of and that most of us are happy to see go. (In your example, the traditional female strictures would to be pleasing physically on his terms, take on household chores that might just as easily be shared, put the relationship with him above her other sustaining relationships, those that predate her relationship with him and might outlast it.) In other words, you're making a case for female dependence on men without showing at all how it goes the other way. In the example you give you're asking her to become subservient to him and give up her claims in the world--claims she might need were the relationship to go south. And you're adding a threat--if she doesn't do these subservient things, the relationship will definitely go south because she isn't being accepting (read "compliant") enough. To add insult to injury, she doesn't even have a say in how the household is to be run (he still gets the seat up!). This is not a compelling scenario for coupledom. Love is also about knowing what you won't accept and having the guts to soldier on, being true to yourself, and finding the people of your tribe--men and women both. Maybe you weren't compliant enough and had to learn that "acceptance" lesson, and that's why this message keeps cropping up here, but for a lot of us gals we've accepted way too much bad male behavior. We did change in response to that. But it wasn't to become more tolerant of b.s.