Comments on: How Do I Avoid Clingy and Desperate Men? http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/ Thu, 09 Feb 2012 05:00:21 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: amy http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-252846 amy Sun, 29 Jan 2012 21:13:42 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-252846 Evan, I think you talked around the problem.   A guy who does that kind of thing isn't just a wonderful heart-on-sleeve romantic. Either he has real problems, or he thinks she's desperate and will fall for it.   Yes, there are a lot of desperate men out there -- with wildly unrealistic notions about what marriage will do for them -- and yes, there are a lot of men who actually pump themselves up by finding women they perceive to be even further down the totem pole than themselves: single mothers. It's super insulting, but they assume that single moms, esp over 35 or so, must be desperate for men to come save them. Any men. Even themselves.   Leah is smart not to want this, and also smart to protect her children from these men. What she needs to do is screen them better from go, not go out with them twice. How can she do that? Well, a guy who's not desperate usually has some kind of project or trajectory he's seriously interested in. He's not shining at her like she's his next true savior. He's friends with his ex. He doesn't talk pityingly at her, as if she wants to be comforted. He's warm, but somewhat reserved. He's not evasive about why he's single. If he has family nearby, he's got warm relationships with them.   The fact is that Leah's going to attract a lot of the desperate because they figure they can get her: single mom, two kids. She's also going to deflect a lot of more together, successful guys because they just don't want her baggage, and don't want someone else's kids. Her best bet, if she's actually interested in marriage, is a together, tired, single dad who knows who he is and whose first commitment is to his kids, and who isn't looking for a woman to come in and relieve him of parenting-time chores. Evan, I think you talked around the problem.
 
A guy who does that kind of thing isn’t just a wonderful heart-on-sleeve romantic. Either he has real problems, or he thinks she’s desperate and will fall for it.
 
Yes, there are a lot of desperate men out there — with wildly unrealistic notions about what marriage will do for them — and yes, there are a lot of men who actually pump themselves up by finding women they perceive to be even further down the totem pole than themselves: single mothers. It’s super insulting, but they assume that single moms, esp over 35 or so, must be desperate for men to come save them. Any men. Even themselves.
 
Leah is smart not to want this, and also smart to protect her children from these men. What she needs to do is screen them better from go, not go out with them twice. How can she do that? Well, a guy who’s not desperate usually has some kind of project or trajectory he’s seriously interested in. He’s not shining at her like she’s his next true savior. He’s friends with his ex. He doesn’t talk pityingly at her, as if she wants to be comforted. He’s warm, but somewhat reserved. He’s not evasive about why he’s single. If he has family nearby, he’s got warm relationships with them.
 
The fact is that Leah’s going to attract a lot of the desperate because they figure they can get her: single mom, two kids. She’s also going to deflect a lot of more together, successful guys because they just don’t want her baggage, and don’t want someone else’s kids. Her best bet, if she’s actually interested in marriage, is a together, tired, single dad who knows who he is and whose first commitment is to his kids, and who isn’t looking for a woman to come in and relieve him of parenting-time chores.

]]> By: Cindy http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-231149 Cindy Mon, 26 Dec 2011 19:11:27 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-231149 Evan, you must be kidding.  A guy who wants to talk marriage to a woman after one or two dates?  If a woman did that and then emailed you, you would caution her about being too needy and tell her she has issues with chasing men away with her desperation.  But if a woman is independent and is looking for someone who has a healthy sense of boundaries and self-confidence, you seem to accuse her of being a commitment-phobic egotist?  Men can be desperate and inappropriately clingy.  There is a huge difference between that and being emotionally available.   It is sickening that a man can be a needy bag of emotional baggage and insecurity and the woman who finds herself saddled with him should consider herself "lucky" but a man who finds himself saddled with a woman who is a needy mess is given sympathy and respect and the woman in that case is chastised for "holding on too tight."  Give me a break.  How about everyone - men and women alike - put their big girl and boy pants on and take responsibility for their own well-being, happiness and sense of self-esteem?  Evan, you must be kidding.  A guy who wants to talk marriage to a woman after one or two dates?  If a woman did that and then emailed you, you would caution her about being too needy and tell her she has issues with chasing men away with her desperation.  But if a woman is independent and is looking for someone who has a healthy sense of boundaries and self-confidence, you seem to accuse her of being a commitment-phobic egotist?  Men can be desperate and inappropriately clingy.  There is a huge difference between that and being emotionally available.   It is sickening that a man can be a needy bag of emotional baggage and insecurity and the woman who finds herself saddled with him should consider herself “lucky” but a man who finds himself saddled with a woman who is a needy mess is given sympathy and respect and the woman in that case is chastised for “holding on too tight.” 
Give me a break.  How about everyone – men and women alike – put their big girl and boy pants on and take responsibility for their own well-being, happiness and sense of self-esteem? 

]]> By: hash http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-202206 hash Tue, 15 Nov 2011 18:56:13 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-202206 We men are not perfect, if a man bothers you please be straight with him and tell him. Us men suffocate through the time when a woman tries to impose "hidden signs" to tell us something.My point is don't just shut me off if they go too aggressive for your liking, just inform him and give him a chance to change. We men are not perfect, if a man bothers you please be straight with him and tell him. Us men suffocate through the time when a woman tries to impose “hidden signs” to tell us something.My point is don’t just shut me off if they go too aggressive for your liking, just inform him and give him a chance to change.

]]> By: M http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-194558 M Sun, 30 Oct 2011 04:00:18 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-194558 Hmmm....I've recently experienced the same thing.  Here's the problem:  when a guy is too into you too soon - he's really not into you.  He doesn't even know you yet - how can he be into you?  The only thing that he's into is the idea of being with someone - anyone.   Guys, we don't want to be the object.  Moving too fast only shows us that you are after one thing - it shows us that the only qualifying factor you need is that we are female.  So, take your time, get to know us.  Show us that we are worth that and show us that you want us for the people that we are.  Show us that you can be a friend as well as a lover.    Hmmm….I’ve recently experienced the same thing.  Here’s the problem:  when a guy is too into you too soon – he’s really not into you.  He doesn’t even know you yet – how can he be into you?  The only thing that he’s into is the idea of being with someone – anyone.   Guys, we don’t want to be the object.  Moving too fast only shows us that you are after one thing – it shows us that the only qualifying factor you need is that we are female.  So, take your time, get to know us.  Show us that we are worth that and show us that you want us for the people that we are.  Show us that you can be a friend as well as a lover. 
 

]]> By: Veronicqua http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-194520 Veronicqua Sun, 30 Oct 2011 00:54:46 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-194520 Evan, I have to say that I agree with the woman who wrote to you. Telling someone you love them and want to marry them, calling/texting them a lot, and wanting to be with them all the time is understandable and appropriate IF YOU"VE BEEN SEEING EACH OTHER FOR A LONG TIME. But doing these things after you've only gone on one or two dates, or after you've only just met, is just too extreme, too demanding, and way too much for a lot of people to deal with. It scares them away, whether they're male or female. Many people prefer to get to know someone before they have a serious relationship with them. It's human nature. Also, I can understand wanting someone to call you, but do people still literally wait by the phone? What a drag. Don't they have better things to do? Don't they have a life? Talk about neediness and being too desperate. Evan, I have to say that I agree with the woman who wrote to you. Telling someone you love them and want to marry them, calling/texting them a lot, and wanting to be with them all the time is understandable and appropriate IF YOU”VE BEEN SEEING EACH OTHER FOR A LONG TIME. But doing these things after you’ve only gone on one or two dates, or after you’ve only just met, is just too extreme, too demanding, and way too much for a lot of people to deal with. It scares them away, whether they’re male or female.

Many people prefer to get to know someone before they have a serious relationship with them. It’s human nature.

Also, I can understand wanting someone to call you, but do people still literally wait by the phone? What a drag. Don’t they have better things to do? Don’t they have a life? Talk about neediness and being too desperate.

]]> By: Nirvana http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-169593 Nirvana Thu, 04 Aug 2011 14:46:28 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-169593 For guys I'm a guy late 20s... Most of my friends think i have had more of my fair share of dating and relationships, but i guess i enjoy the 'dating' ... However a guy who is overly eager, calls every day, txt every day or wants the girl too much ... It just doesn't work ...ask me how i know.  Just hint you enjoy her company and that's it, let her deal with. Unfortunately, sometimes it becomes a power struggle  of who's gonna cave in but that's no longer fun and you should just stop seeing the person. If someone is not willing to put in as much as  you do, dont waste your time. Don't beg, don't plead, don't desire her, just tease and subtly hint you like her ...it sucks but that's what works.  For guys

I’m a guy late 20s… Most of my friends think i have had more of my fair share of dating and relationships, but i guess i enjoy the ‘dating’ …

However a guy who is overly eager, calls every day, txt every day or wants the girl too much … It just doesn’t work …ask me how i know. 

Just hint you enjoy her company and that’s it, let her deal with. Unfortunately, sometimes it becomes a power struggle  of who’s gonna cave in but that’s no longer fun and you should just stop seeing the person.

If someone is not willing to put in as much as  you do, dont waste your time.

Don’t beg, don’t plead, don’t desire her, just tease and subtly hint you like her …it sucks but that’s what works. 

]]> By: Cat http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-83833 Cat Thu, 23 Sep 2010 22:34:21 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-83833 <p><strong>sasa said: (#29)</strong><em> “my desperate male friend, he actually admits he hates being single and alone… poor loser.”</em></p> <p>There's nothing wrong with someone hating "being single and alone!" Why do you think all of these online dating sites exist? Why do you think blogs like this exist?It's not because everyone just <em>loves</em> being alone... And what's wrong with your friend being <em>honest</em> to you, his <em>friend</em>, about his desire to be in a relationship? Isn't that what friends are for? Why does his admission that he's lonely spark such contempt in you?</p> <p>Now, if someone only complains and never does anything about it, that would be a problem and perhaps that's why you're so annoyed at your friend, and why you came here looking for some articles to help him.</p> <p>But have a little compassion for him. If dating were easy, we wouldn't be here on this blog!</p> sasa said: (#29) “my desperate male friend, he actually admits he hates being single and alone… poor loser.”

There’s nothing wrong with someone hating “being single and alone!” Why do you think all of these online dating sites exist? Why do you think blogs like this exist?It’s not because everyone just loves being alone… And what’s wrong with your friend being honest to you, his friend, about his desire to be in a relationship? Isn’t that what friends are for? Why does his admission that he’s lonely spark such contempt in you?

Now, if someone only complains and never does anything about it, that would be a problem and perhaps that’s why you’re so annoyed at your friend, and why you came here looking for some articles to help him.

But have a little compassion for him. If dating were easy, we wouldn’t be here on this blog!

]]> By: Karl R http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-83790 Karl R Thu, 23 Sep 2010 15:05:06 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-83790 <strong>sasa said:</strong> (#29) <em>"I simply don’t date, any more. [...] I believe I’ll meet someone purely by chance one day, and we’ll strike up a friendship [...] we’ll be able to develop a real relationship."</em> Do you use that strategy for job hunting too? Instead of sending out resumes, filling out applications and going to interviews, you <em>can</em> network until you meet someone who offers you a job. I know dozens of people who got their jobs that way. But if you rely on that as your <em>sole</em> method of job hunting, you may spend a <em>long</em> time between jobs. In the past, I've done as you're doing now: not dating and having friendships evolve into relationships. In <strong>11</strong> years I had <strong>2</strong> relationships. Then I switched to actively dating. That resulted in <strong>3</strong> relationships in <strong>4</strong> years, including my current relationship which is likely to last until death do us part. Instead of spending years between relationships where nothing romantic occurred, I only spent months between relationships ... months filled with dates of other potential girlfriends. Feel free to limit yourself to <em>less</em> efficient strategies. <strong>sasa said:</strong> (#29) <em>"my desperate male friend, he actually admits he hates being single and alone… poor loser."</em> I've confided my feelings to friends numerous times, and I've <em>never</em> had one call me a <em>"loser,"</em> or show me <em>any</em> other kind of disrespect. Your male friend will be <em>more</em> successful at dating if he's happy being single. I generally recommend it as a first step in the dating process. And as a first step toward being happily single, I'd recommend that he get rid of any toxic, disrespectful "friends." <strong>sasa said:</strong> (#29) <em>"A guy who says he loves me after two weeks, is lying. There is no 'genuine' anything, after just a few dates, MR EVAN. You’re damn wrong if you think otherwise."</em> Who said anything about <em>"love"</em> at two weeks? (Besides <strong>you</strong>.) My first few dates with my current girlfriend were on consecutive days, but <em>neither</em> of us mentioned the word "love" until we <em>were</em> in love (around the three month mark, if I recall correctly). <strong>sasa said:</strong> (#29) <em>"It’s up to us what we choose to believe. I, for one, am choosing to make things happen by believing in them."</em> Does that strategy work for housework too? Instead of vaccuuming and dusting, you just sit there and <em>believe</em> that the house will become clean? Things happen because of our <em>actions</em> (or the actions of others). Action/reaction; cause and effect. The <em>only</em> things that are changed by our beliefs are our perspective and attitude. <strong>sasa said:</strong> (#29) <em>"without the ignonimity of dating and all its obligations and expectations"</em> This is a perfect illustration of what I was just saying. The <em>only</em> thing that makes dating ignominious is <em>your</em> belief that it is. And all of the obligations and expectations also arise from <em>your</em> beliefs (and your date's beliefs). So far, it sounds like your beliefs have quite the track record of <em>sabotaging</em> your relationships. Now you're intending to rely on them <em>exclusively</em> to make a relationship happen. Wow! Talk about <em>expectations</em>. sasa said: (#29)
“I simply don’t date, any more. [...] I believe I’ll meet someone purely by chance one day, and we’ll strike up a friendship [...] we’ll be able to develop a real relationship.”

Do you use that strategy for job hunting too?

Instead of sending out resumes, filling out applications and going to interviews, you can network until you meet someone who offers you a job. I know dozens of people who got their jobs that way. But if you rely on that as your sole method of job hunting, you may spend a long time between jobs.

In the past, I’ve done as you’re doing now: not dating and having friendships evolve into relationships. In 11 years I had 2 relationships. Then I switched to actively dating. That resulted in 3 relationships in 4 years, including my current relationship which is likely to last until death do us part.

Instead of spending years between relationships where nothing romantic occurred, I only spent months between relationships … months filled with dates of other potential girlfriends.

Feel free to limit yourself to less efficient strategies.

sasa said: (#29)
“my desperate male friend, he actually admits he hates being single and alone… poor loser.”

I’ve confided my feelings to friends numerous times, and I’ve never had one call me a “loser,” or show me any other kind of disrespect.

Your male friend will be more successful at dating if he’s happy being single. I generally recommend it as a first step in the dating process.

And as a first step toward being happily single, I’d recommend that he get rid of any toxic, disrespectful ”friends.”

sasa said: (#29)
“A guy who says he loves me after two weeks, is lying. There is no ‘genuine’ anything, after just a few dates, MR EVAN. You’re damn wrong if you think otherwise.”

Who said anything about “love” at two weeks? (Besides you.) My first few dates with my current girlfriend were on consecutive days, but neither of us mentioned the word “love” until we were in love (around the three month mark, if I recall correctly).

sasa said: (#29)
“It’s up to us what we choose to believe. I, for one, am choosing to make things happen by believing in them.”

Does that strategy work for housework too? Instead of vaccuuming and dusting, you just sit there and believe that the house will become clean?

Things happen because of our actions (or the actions of others). Action/reaction; cause and effect. The only things that are changed by our beliefs are our perspective and attitude.

sasa said: (#29)
“without the ignonimity of dating and all its obligations and expectations”

This is a perfect illustration of what I was just saying. The only thing that makes dating ignominious is your belief that it is.

And all of the obligations and expectations also arise from your beliefs (and your date’s beliefs).

So far, it sounds like your beliefs have quite the track record of sabotaging your relationships. Now you’re intending to rely on them exclusively to make a relationship happen. Wow! Talk about expectations.

]]> By: sasa http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-83756 sasa Thu, 23 Sep 2010 04:24:46 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-83756 I stumbled on this while looking for an article to send my desperate male friend, he actually admits he hates being single and alone... poor loser. He's even turning me off being friends. But seriously, in my experience, any guy who wants things to move quickly is bad news. A guy who says he loves me after two weeks, is lying. There is no "genuine" anything, after just a few dates, MR EVAN. You're damn wrong if you think otherwise. It takes time for genuine feelings to develop. Any man who starts to talk marriage too soon, is obviously just hung up on the idea - he is desperate. Would you marry a desperate woman? No. Why not? Because she is marrying out of desperation, not from genuine feelings of love.. get it? Coincidentally, I simply don't date, any more. Do I feel scared? Nope. I believe I'll meet someone purely by chance one day, and we'll strike up a friendship... without the ignonimity of dating and all its obligations and expectations, we'll be able to develop a real relationship. And if it doesn't happen? After all, no one says it will happen, right? Well, no one says it won't happen, either. It's up to us what we choose to believe. I, for one, am choosing to make things happen by believing in them. I stumbled on this while looking for an article to send my desperate male friend, he actually admits he hates being single and alone… poor loser. He’s even turning me off being friends.
But seriously, in my experience, any guy who wants things to move quickly is bad news. A guy who says he loves me after two weeks, is lying. There is no “genuine” anything, after just a few dates, MR EVAN. You’re damn wrong if you think otherwise. It takes time for genuine feelings to develop. Any man who starts to talk marriage too soon, is obviously just hung up on the idea – he is desperate. Would you marry a desperate woman? No. Why not? Because she is marrying out of desperation, not from genuine feelings of love.. get it?
Coincidentally, I simply don’t date, any more. Do I feel scared? Nope. I believe I’ll meet someone purely by chance one day, and we’ll strike up a friendship… without the ignonimity of dating and all its obligations and expectations, we’ll be able to develop a real relationship. And if it doesn’t happen? After all, no one says it will happen, right? Well, no one says it won’t happen, either. It’s up to us what we choose to believe. I, for one, am choosing to make things happen by believing in them.

]]> By: Diana http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/comment-page-1/#comment-80245 Diana Wed, 25 Aug 2010 12:54:38 +0000 http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/how-do-i-avoid-desperate-and-clingy-men/#comment-80245 For the men that Leah is meeting to talk about how they want a commitment with her and a future together after only two dates, something is wrong with this picture. Whether it's an obsession, a ploy to move to home plate, desperation, controlling, etc., their behavior is inappropriate. I completely understand her feelings.   It's fine if they're making a confident, consistent, normal effort to go out with her again, letting her know that they find her fun, attractive, or whatever, but as with Patricia's post [#27], I think they're after the fantasy at this very early stage.   The men are coming on too strong and her feelings may have nothing to do with timing. If she were to do the same thing, the men would likely think similarly and back way up [perhaps after having some fun].     For the men that Leah is meeting to talk about how they want a commitment with her and a future together after only two dates, something is wrong with this picture. Whether it’s an obsession, a ploy to move to home plate, desperation, controlling, etc., their behavior is inappropriate. I completely understand her feelings.
 
It’s fine if they’re making a confident, consistent, normal effort to go out with her again, letting her know that they find her fun, attractive, or whatever, but as with Patricia’s post [#27], I think they’re after the fantasy at this very early stage.
 
The men are coming on too strong and her feelings may have nothing to do with timing. If she were to do the same thing, the men would likely think similarly and back way up [perhaps after having some fun].
 
 

]]>