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Categories: Chemistry, Communication, Dating, Flirting Tags: calling after sex, chemistry, dating tips, sex, understanding men
A reader throws my words back at me to get clarity on my Top Online Dating Mistake: thinking your great date actually meant something…
Hi Evan,
To explain why a great date doesn’t necessarily mean anything to men, you wrote: “Instead of thinking in terms of black and white (He likes me/he doesn’t like me), think in terms of grey. Isn’t it possible that a guy can be out, enjoying your company, being thoughtful, telling you you’re beautiful, kissing you at the end of the night, and never call you again?”
I guess it’s possible, theoretically. I am not a man, so it’s difficult for me to understand. But why would a guy do that? For example, if I like a guy, and I had a good time on a date, I’d like to see him again. I think about it in 2nd grade terms, “I like a person, I would like to see them again. I don’t like a person, I don’t want to see them again” That applies to all people - men, women, romantic or platonic.
You also wrote: “All you can do as a woman is not make the date “mean” something, because 50% of the time, as you can probably see, it doesn’t mean a thing to him…”
Yeah, I think that’s an assumption. I, personally, cannot SEE that it doesn’t mean a thing to him, like I can’t differentiate. When do things start meaning to a man?
So what distinguishes when a guy goes on a date, has a good time, but is just “in the moment, and doesn’t call me back, versus a guy who had a good time with me and then calls me back? Is this “in the moment” feeling premeditated, i.e. the guy knows this date isn’t going to be serious, before the date occurs? Or does the “in the moment” feeling occur during the process of the date, which is dependent on the woman and on a date itself? So tell me about your experiences. How do you approach this dating, “in the moment” situtation? I am just trying to understand the psyche.
Maybe it’s just me, but all interactions with people mean something to me. I feel that’s the respect I should give to another person. And if they don’t mean anything to me, then it’s because I don’t want to interact with that person.
Any clarification of this idea would be very helpful.
Jean
Dear Jean,
I’m going to drop the dating coach bit for a second and just be a guy.
When I was dating prolifically, I’d be going out with two or three women at a time. And every single time I went out, I did two things:
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- I tried to be the best date I possibly could. I’d call, email, express interest, plan a good date, show up on time, etc.
- I tried to make her want me really badly. I’d listen, I’d lean in, I’d flirt, I’d compliment her.
In short, I wanted every single date to feel good about me, so I would have the option of going out with her again. Sometimes, we’d hug goodbye. Other times, we’d drunkenly go back to her place. But no matter what, I was looking to keep my options open, have fun, and sometimes get a little action. And yes, I was always in pursuit of a long-term relationship. I just didn’t want to deprive myself entirely of sexual activity until I fell in love.
By the way, whether you agree or not, I considered myself a NICE guy. I slept with very few people, I never said, “I love you” and I rarely kept a physical relationship going beyond a few weeks, if I felt it was headed nowhere.
To me, I felt like I was acting with integrity. To a woman who woke up next to me after a first date and thought that we were “in a relationship”, I can see how she felt differently….
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63 Responses
Evan, stop being so freaking reductive. The “you” in that situation could be the guy I just broke up with, who started seeing a future with me even though we had discussed that our relationship was what it was (friendship, sex, and yes, love, but not a future), and the “men” in that situation could be me. Actually, that’s being reductive. I don’t look for sex and find love or look for love and find sex. I look for whatever I can get, and get whatever end up with. I have sex just because I want to sometimes, and sometimes I’ll fall in love with that stranger. I become friends with people and lay in wait for years because I love them (or just want them). My longest relationship (2 years) was with a man who I was casually sleeping with, and we both accidentally fell in love with each other. This took 6 months for us to admit, because it shocked us so much. You need to start using some qualifiers in your columns: MOST women.
Yes, MOST women, Emma.
I agree with Evan about sex affecting men’s behaviour, but I think you should also consider how the expectancy of being the pursuer will cause some men to act keener then we might be in the early stages of a relationship.
On the whole we’re expected to initiate contact, ask women out and follow up after a good date. I don’t mind this, but it does mean there isn’t much space for contemplation if you’re sitting on the fence.
In my experience, women tend to ask themselves if a relationship has potential after one or two dates, whereas a man will probably wait for a few dates and possibly sex before being similarily far-sighted
This post comes at a very interesting time for me. I have been on about 6 dates with this guy over the past month. While we have hooked up, I have held back from sleeping with him. The big thing that is holding me back is that I don’t want to give it up only to have my guy pull a disappearing act.
We’ve talked about sleeping together and I told him that I wasn’t ready yet for a few reasons. One being what I just stated above. But another is that I don’t want to start having certain expectations once it does happen. I would want to see him more often that the twice a week dates we’ve been having. I would want him to do more than just text me almost every day. I would want to feel secure that this isn’t going to be just a casual thing.
I don’t want to want all of those things, so that’s why I’ve chosen to wait. I think he understands, but we shall see. Like Evan states, I am going to judge my guy on his actions and not by what he says. All of his “I miss you” texts mean nothing if he’s not actually making plans to see me.
The best way to get a guy to call you back after you have had sex with him is to leave a message on his machine that you would like to work on your blowjob technique and would he help.
Calling back is not the goal per se is it? The goal is to for the guy to call back because he is truly interested in you for an LTR.
For that I don’t have an answer. You can’t make it happen. If he is truly into you he will call. If not don’t force it.
Jean wrote: “Maybe its just me, but all interactions with people mean something to me. I feel thats the respect I should give to another person. And if they dont mean anything to me, then its because I dont want to interact with that person.”
I completely disagree. To me, a sign of respect is to not be so judgemental. A “you’re in or you’re out” decision made after a couple dates or sex seems harsh, not respectful.
My hunch is that Jean is hoping to avoid the unknowing anxiety of not knowing where she stands. So if you’re the type of person who is uncomfortable with “maybe” then you’ve got your answer. Unless it’s a clearcut yes, then take it as a no.
I think it’s possible to be absolutely respectful, genuine, and enjoy dating (including sex) without it having to be an LTR. It’s not fair to say than anything less is manipulation/deceit/disrespect. Lighten up! That, or don’t sleep with people who aren’t already committed to you.
What do you make of men who make the second date before you part after the first, and then make all kinds of excuses to not keep that second date? I can’t tell you how long that happened to me before I started disallowing second date requests until he went home, thought about it, and decided he really wanted to go out wiht me. Doesn’t that blow the theory of how quickly he follows up for another date out the window? Or is is just me?
Shari. I used to try and arrange dates at the end of the evening. I stopped because the answer was ALWAYS yes, even though many backed out before the agreed date. I appreciate this. People need time to mull over a date in private. People don’t like rejecting a stranger face to face. People like to keep their options open.
Far from contradicting Evan’s theory, so experience actually supports it. You can’t follow up on a date, whilst your still on the date. Its nice if someone wants to arrange plans at the end of a date, but i’d take any promises with a hefty grain of salt until their confirmed at least 24 hours later.
I agree with most of what you wrote here…but there are exceptions. I’m a man and I definitely do not sleep with someone I’m not interested in. I don’t ever sleep around and I’m generally looking for love first, not sex. I know it’s rare to find a guy who feels that way but nonetheless…here I am…so we are out here…but I would agree that I’m probably in the 1 percentile on that one.
JimmyE – I think I could agree with what you said about rejection in context to those things that happened to me, but I wasn’t the one asking them, and they weren’t the ones saying “yes” then backing out one me. They were the ones asking me. My conclusion is that, at that time, I was their best option for next Saturday night – or whenever the date may have been. But then a better option came to them and they traded up. Quite a few of these guys who broke second dates before they happened would contact me a few weeks later and ask for that second date again. I didn’t say yes, just agreed with whatever their reason had been for breaking the second date – you’re right, there is no chemistry, there is no spark, I didn’t think about you constantly while we were apart – or whatever.
In my deduction I blame the Internet for this and not a gender, or even personality type. There are too many options and some people – not going to qualify this to guys or girls – don’t want to tie themselves to this person who seems okay, when someone else comes around who might be better.
Hey Adam-
Where do you live?
I went on a “great date” after some marathon phone conversations with this guy. We hit it off great on the phone, so we were excited to meet each other, and we seemed to hit it off great in person, too. We did not sleep together that night, though we certainly fooled around quite a bit, and knew we both wanted each other. He called the next day, and 2 days after that. On that 2nd phone call, we didn’t make plans for the weekend (it was only Monday) but I just (wrongly, apparently) assumed it was understood we would be together that next weekend. When we got off the phone he said we’d speak during that week. I never heard from him again! I would have been much more prepared if I hadn’t heard from him after the night we went out, but c’mon, guys, why 2 more phone calls and then the vaporizing act? He still goes online, I have seen him. I did take that one personally at first, but over the course of the last 2 weeks came to realize it has nothing to do with me at all and everything to do with his issues. Still, it is frustrating.
If I just want sex, I have sex. If I want a LTR , I hold off on the sex until I feel confident we are going somewhere. At least that’s the new leaf I’m turning over! This is after being dumped with no warning 8 weeks into a relationship with someone I met online— and who I saw every weekend- and talked to a lot …I realized that I’m just sick of making myself that vulnerable before I even know the person properly.. This means less sex , but less annoyance and heartbreak, and, lets face it, less random squalor too! I’m 12 weeks or so into the new regime, lets see how it goes!
I think some of you are underestimating most men. Sure there will always be the odd sleaze bag who is only after sex, but the majority of decent guys view sex as a bonus to a relationship, not the be all and end all.
I have to appreciate the brutal honesty of Evans response. Evan, I recognize that youve changed and I think by publishing the truth youre doing a great service.
Apparently there are a few girls capable of what Evan says guys do, but my guess is only a very very few, and half of those girls are lying to themselves. Thats what makes the whole idea so successful. There may actually only be a smallish portion of men who act this way, but they are quite active and are a real factor in the prolific dating scene of the 21st century. I happen to think there are plenty of guys who dont think that just dating for the sake of sexual activity is okay if its going to hurt someones feelings they just dont need to date as often because they actually want to get to know that first awesome girl they take out. This is really important to point out, because otherwise a girl could come away from this post feeling pretty bleak about the goodness of most men.
What Evan is saying is that on one hand you have girls, and sometimes guys too, who are having a fabulous time on a date because they are so excited that theyve finally met someone whos smart, funny, polite, sexy, a good listener, and who would be a great person to have around in life; while on the other hand you have some guys (and a very very few girls) who are having just as much of a fabulous time, and seem to be just as giddy, for the simple reason that they see a decent likelihood of having sex, maybe even that night. Apparently the likelihood of having sex is so intoxicating that the mere thought makes everything that happens that evening just delightful. These guys tell themselves that they are not being shallow because if the girl puts out for a few months without expecting to hear from him very often, he is reserving the right eventually to have feelings for her this is called the grey area. This is also called just being a guy.
Part of me cant decide if I a single girl looking for a real connection really want to know this. The next time Im out with an attractive guy who is just effortlessly beaming at every word I say, Ill have the insiders knowledge not to take this necessarily as a special moment in my life. Sure, it could be that he feels hes found his new best friend. It could also be that hes just sublimely psyched to get laid. If the prospect is that all-consuming, then I guess I can see why it would take no pretending at all to display such excitement.
Evan mentions that guys and girls seem to be having a lot more sex with strangers. Call me crazy, but that doesnt seem like such a good thing. I think there are a lot of fair reasons for it girls are more liberated and theres less stigma for a woman to be sexually active (and amen to that). Also, people are waiting much longer to get married, which means a lot more time to figure out what theyre looking for in and out of bed. It also means a lot more time and a lot more women with which men can practice the art of the delightfully meaningless date. I just dont think many women have caught up with that idea yet after all, the pill has only been around for about 50 years. Before then, we couldnt afford to take the risk of falling for meaningless delight. Thats nice that now we can control the physical risks of sex with someone whos on the way out the door but we still need to account for the emotional risks, which are much more real for women than men (read up on oxytocin, girls). Maybe men would have to be more grounded in what they expect out of a date if the likelihood of sex with no strings wasnt so high, and if women would wise up and get back to the practice of not hooking up with guys they might fall for unless theyve gotten some commitment (in other words, Evans readership needs to skyrocket). This doesnt mean undoing the feminist movement and saying no to sex, it just means taking 30 seconds to clarify that neither of the two involved will be seeing other people.
Meanwhile, I think it would be an impressive next step in the evolutionary process if these sex-addicted guys would leave their caves and join modern men who see women as fellow modern human beings and not just heartless pairs of boobs. And to the nice guys who get this already: stop high-fiving your buddy who just bagged the nice cute girl who adores him. Hes a prick. You know you dont want to be him. Maybe you should tell him so.
Look sometimes women can have sex with no feeling involved to the person they are having sex with, and a woman can have sex with someone because of feelings of love and emotion. I was one of those women who wanted to wait until I was married to have sex – I had two serious boyfriends without ever doubting that and we never went that far. In the 3rd relationship, we were serious and neither of us had had sex before and talked about it beforehand. I always think that if you can’t talk about it, you aren’t ready to do it. I felt ready and did it – only to find out from him months later that he only began dating me for that reason. It didnt matter to me at that point, that his feelings had evolved and he did love me and want to be with me, his initial intention in dating me was simply to get laid. He knew how important it was to me, how big of a step it was for me, and yet he still told me this fact. What was the point of that? We ended up still having a long term and fulfilling relationship emotionally, but after i found that out, our sex life was never the same and mostly functional. To keep this rambling story shorter, I did eventually break it off and it took me a year to get over it – but sex became a thing connectes soley with those feelings and him and I need to end that in my head. So I met a incredibly hot guy in town on vacation and had instant chemistry with him, and ended up having sex with him, making him my second. I don’t regret it the least and never saw him after that night – and I dont have negative feelings attached to it – only happiness that sex could finally be a positive experience for me. Sometimes a one night stand is what the doctor ordered.
posts #15 & 16#
..good posts, my applause!…
I always say if you want a realtionship cool and if you don’t move on… I will do the same if I’m interested in a guy and he acts like he is not ready for a relationship. We can’t wait for a men to decide what they want…
Collete #15 writes: ” if women would wise up and get back to the practice of not hooking up with guys they might fall for unless theyve gotten some commitment. . . This doesnt mean undoing the feminist movement and saying no to sex, it just means taking 30 seconds to clarify that neither of the two involved will be seeing other people. ”
While this information may be wise to obtain for women seeking an LTR & an efficient way to get there, my suspicion is that this “30 second clarification” raised on a first date would lead in to a significant percentages of first dates also being the last date; Or if “clarified” prior to acceptance of a first date, would lead to a cancellation of the first date in a significant percentage of cases. I suspect that in this modern dating environment where women go out with men who picked them up; or have casually met, that women will just have to put the time in to find out what that man is truly like and run those risks (or go back to introductions from trusted friends, relatives and associates).
I don’t think relationships are better after premarital sex… Premarital sex is adultry…because adultry affects your relationship in the future… You should try not to concentrate The relationship on sex much at all…in the end relationships hold on to what you’ve built from the relationship…you don’t need permarital sex to assure your relationship just as it seems that you need to be reassured by a stupid phone call after sex…tell your stupid boyfriend to begin to start waiting for sex until after marriage, because first you have to build a different type of relationship like trust (which will help women give themselves to their boyfriends wholly, especially after marriage) and compatibility….then sex will be great and trust will keep you from getting worried … There is more to this but I can’t think much more because I have other things in mind peach out
on post #20
Adultery is defined as, the sex act of, either one or both partners married(not to each other), engaging in sexual intercourse.
If you want to hang with the crowd, you have to know the lingo!…..LOL!….They’ll see you coming!…
This is an easy one: don’t sleep with someone you aren’t already in relationship with. I haven’t had this problem for decades…actually, maybe not ever.
moon
Why is is the girls always seem to be waiting for the guy to call after sex. Girls- if you want to talk to the guy you just laid, call him. Whats the big deal?
I really dont know what is wrong with my dates but it doesnt metter if I sleep with a guy or not they usually lose their interest pretty quick! I consider myself somewhat attractive woman with a distinguished taste for style and fashion.I meet most men online due to the nature of my job and because Im not very socialy active! I am starting to believe that online dating is a huge deception because a person,or at least me start to like the other person I talk to for week or two , we share interesting conversation and it seem that we would “click” in person as well and then when I finaly meet that person even if he shows affection and interest on the first date its gonna turn out disastrous in the near future and unfortunately it always does for me.I become the abandoned one..for what reason I never know! I am starting to believe that this just might be my destiny but I dont want to be the only passenger on the boat that is slowly sinking down because I know there should be a great guy out there that is genuine and real!!
Jane D, I’d prefer not to date co-workers, (because of messy experiences) but, according to census, I believe it is, almost 60% of “shipping while relating,”(relationships), happen at work.
Adam-
Call me.
JaneD said: (#25)
“I am starting to believe that online dating is a huge deception”
“its gonna turn out disastrous in the near future and unfortunately it always does for me.”
“I become the abandoned one..for what reason I never know!”
“I am starting to believe that this just might be my destiny”
I have several questions. How does your dating turn out to be “disastrous”? I’ve had a number of dates through online dating. The “worst” outcomes were, “I don’t think you’re the type of person I’m looking for.” That doesn’t even qualify as a bad outcome. These women probably weren’t the type I was looking for either, and they were perceptive enough to figure it out before I was. That’s just the normal odds at work.
How does an online date “abandon” you? Do they take you on a date, then strand you with no way to get home? If not, what are they doing that you feel qualifies as abandonment? Is it just that they’re breaking up with you or failing to call you again?
I can see two possibilities for what might be happening with your dating.
#1 You’re managing to date a lot of abusive and horrible men, and your dates turn out to be disasters. If this is the case, you might want to examine what it is that draws you to this type of man. Once you start dating nice, considerate men, your dates will be much better … even if your dating still doesn’t lead to a long-term relationship.
#2 You have adopted an attitude where you see yourself as the perpetual victim. If a man isn’t interested enough to want to pursue a relationship, you view it as “abandonment” or “disastrous”. You believe the universe has somehow singled you out to have a lonely, loveless life. If this is your attitude toward dating, you’re going to drive any high-quality men away. The only men who will be attracted to this attitude are victimizers who are drawn to victims.
I have two pieces of advice that might help you:
Change your expectations:
Let’s say only 1 in 5 of the women that I contact end up going on a first date with me. Let’s say that only 1 in 5 of my first dates ends up becoming a long term relationship. If that’s the case, 96% of the women I contact don’t become long-term girlfriends. That sounds like lousy odds, doesn’t it?
But I only need one long-term girlfriend. So if I contact one new woman per week, it will take me around 6 months to get into a long-term relationship. I just have to put in the time and effort, and it will become a reality. That’s rather encouraging.
Change your attitude:
I go on a date with the intention of enjoying myself and getting to know the lady better. If I succeed in doing both of those, it’s a good date. Even if I decide that I don’t want to date the lady again (or she decides that she never wants to date me again), it was still a good first date.
It’s still possible that I could have a disastrous date (the lady steals my wallet, or she’s unspeakably rude to me and everyone around), but it hasn’t happened yet.
As a final suggestion, you might want to become more socially active. Socially active people have interesting things going on in their lives. That makes them more interesting people. Interesting people get more dates.
its gonna turn out disastrous in the near future and unfortunately it always does for me.
Actually, I have a small anecdote about this- I met a guy online a while ago- he e-mailed me to say ‘u free tonight’ just like that. Now, I like it when a guy gives me a little notice, so I said, maybe sometime next week instead. He did the ‘u free tonite’ thing twice and then got the hint and we planned for something the following weekend.
We met at a bar- the guy had a scowl on his face for some reason (he was friendly over the phone). I couldn’t imagine why, but I just tried easing into friendly conversation. oh my god, for an hour (I can’t believe I stayed that long, but I’d ordered food, which he didn’t offer to pay for either) all he did was complain about every single thing that’s wrong with life, not in a whiny way, but an angry way, like he wanted to punch someone. Every time I tried to say something pleasant, he tried to pick a fight with me! Then a neighbor of his happened to show up at the bar- this is a college town- and the guy turned away and acted like he didn’t know me until the neighbor had left. Yes, this was a female neighbor, but she was with her boyfriend. They kept looking at me, surprised probably, that I was putting up with this guy.
Anyway, I left five minutes after that. The guy actually looked surprised that I was leaving!
The reason I bring this up is because it turned me off of online dating for months. Only because the guy had been pleasant on the phone. So I thought, if I’m going to get a nasty surprise like this every time I go out, forget this whole business. Yech.
“This is an easy one: dont sleep with someone you arent already in relationship with.”
lol- well, I totally agree with you there, as you’ve prob’y figured out from my other posts. But the thing is, the guys aren’t going want relationships unless we sleep with them first.
“Socially active people have interesting things going on in their lives. That makes them more interesting people. Interesting people get more dates.”
I would MUCH prefer to meet men through a venue other than online dating- but unfortunately, the kind of interests I have- art gallery tours, museums, plays, etc. only attract other women.
At least I have a ton of female friends to hang out with though.
I appreciate this post as I have had a similar experience and wanted to share. I have probably met over 30 men from online dating sites over the past year, and that is after e-mail and phone screenings and trying to be “particular.” Of the thirty or so in person meet-ups (which I do not classify as a date), i have only gone out on multiple dates with one man that I felt there was enough chemistry and potential. Sure enough by the third actual date, the guy brought me a gift, and our marathon date ended at 2am following swapping a massage and what I considered great sex. He said and did all the right things to get it to that point, and yet following our third date I received a text message from him the following day to say he had a great time and hope I was having a great day. Just as Evan suggested, no call and no making plans to see me again. I knew darn well I could phone him and initiate more nights of passion (secretely I wanted to because the sex was good, and I do have needs.) However, I did not and am not going to pursue it because it is obvious he’s just not that into me, and my goal is a long term relationship. It’s a little heartbreaking because its hard enough to meet someone you like enough to go there with, and when its not mutual (or mutual enough) it stings. But, that is dating for you. I must accept and move on. Thanks everyone for this thread, it helps to know I’m not alone.
Maria, you met 30 men from online dating sites. Good for you!…
I have! I unfortuantely havent met the right one yet, but not for lack of putting in the time and effort. I go through phases where I meet two or three and then meet no one for a couple weeks. I am getting more discerning and particular as it still requires alot of effort/time to prepare for and attend a date. Initially I was getting my feet wet after a 10 year marriage, now they have to be date worthy.
To Adam, you sound wonderful! That said, I actually find it kind of exciting that men are so sex driven. It’s just that I wish more of them could have sex while also being excited about the woman, about the possibility of falling in love with her. We need more men like you, in any case!
Sayanta #30- This isn’t true! There are some guys who won’t continue to date if you don’t put out on the first date, but guess what? Those guys usually wind up being one night stands anyways. (And I know this-I was in the greek system at a university, and here were a lot of my friends dating the same guys I had gone out with- a lot of them had their hearts broken by the guys who didn’t see me again after I didn’t put out on the first night. Trust me, you will weed out some guys by not putting out early on, but theyre the same ones who would eliminate THEMSELVES early on AFTER sleeping with you. All you lose is the feeling of emptiness after giving your body to someone who could give a s— less.
Also, I should probably mention that this approach doesn’t leave me “dateless”. In fact, I really don’t have to date much at all, I tend to just go from one LTR to another. Yeah,. there are no guarantees, and none of those have resulted in marriage (there’s just no way to tell until youve put in the time), but they’ve all given me the unique and wonderful experiene of being COURTED by them, as opposed to the generally homogenous experience of just having a one-night stand.
So yeah, wait until you’re in a relationship. I made this one wait until 30 days AFTER we got into a relationship, and so far things are going great!
#36-
You’ve given me hope, sister…
Ive always been the one to tell my friends not to put out on the first date if they expect to see the guy again. I have one friend in particular who has gone from heartbreak to heartbreak because she kept on sleeping with men as soon as they made it clear thats what they want. She ends up being the one leaving unanswered messages, drunk calling wondering why it went wrong. Well, it happened to me. Ive always been in a relationship. My last lasted two years. I think its mainly because I only used to hook up with men who pursed me enough to get me interested. Otherwise I always kept away from men who seemed too eager as it was always a put off for me. I like men to work for my attention. I broke up with my ex because I was moved to another country in a company transfer. We both didnt want a long distance relationship so we ended just ended it. After two months, I havent met anyone because all I do was work, work so I havent made any new friends. So on Christmas day I went for a party that had more men than the ladies. Soon I was getting a lot of attention and I was really enjoying it. The guys who were there were friends of my cousin and he warned me not to get close to any of them because they didnt have the best habits. But I hadnt had sex in a while so I ignored him and gave out my number to a lot of them. I only really liked one of them but he made it clear that he just wanted to take me to bed immediately so I avoided him. Sadly, the really good looking one had a girlfriend who was there with him. My cousin took me home when I started to get a bit tipsy. The next day most of them called but I wasnt quite sure who was who because I hadnt saved any of their numbers and am very bad with names. Especially foreign sounding ones. One guy sounded really good and insisted on coming over to my place to check on me. I was bored and wanted company so I invited him over. I kinda thought I was sure I knew who it was. It ended up being the guy with the girlfriend. We got to talking and he kept denying that she was his woman although I knew it was. One thing for sure, we had this mad sexual chemistry and the next thing I know we had sex. Immediately after he said he had to leave. I knew that was the only reason he had come and I was pretty much ok with it because hey! I got laid and thats what I really wanted. He called me a few hours later we talked a bit and he said hed call me the next day. He hasnt called since. Thing is I fell for him and havent stopped thinking about him. I didnt think I would fall for him because I really dislike men who cheat on their girlfriends especially in a very open manner. Its probably the loneliness or the lust but I know one thing for sure I might never even see him again. Its pretty simple if you like a guy dont put out on the first date. Am pretty sure even if I didnt he would probably have tried again a couple of times and maybe just given up along the way. If a man really likes you then sex is not the only thing on his mind. My mother told me if a man likes you he will cross the oceans and seas to be with you no excuses will ever be made. If he is just not that into you, he just aint. I know from speaking to my male friends that men like to imagine the woman he is with is a virgin in some sense. And if she comes off as easy in any way that is a sure turn off! Women are always the losers.
What if I only want to have sex with him again?
I met this guy who is 10 years older than me ( I am 25) and asked me out.I knew already he was not interested in a LTR, butwe both felt really attracted to each other and had sex. After doing it,hedescribedin detail how satisfied he was, and so was I.
We were both out of town for the Holidays, buthe sent a couple of messages without saying he wanted to meet again.
My question is, should I interpret that he would be willing to have sex with me again?If so, should I wait for him to call or does the waiting applies also for sex buddies? I just don’t want him to think thatI am super enthusiastic for initiating a relation and ruin my possibilities of having sex with him again just because I am making the first move.
Anna,
If all you truly want to be is sex buddies, then waiting does not apply. He is not trying to win you over and vice versa. You both already know that you only want sex. So, you are well with in your “rights” to give him a booty call. Just make certain that a sex buddy is all you want him to be. If you are thinking about him and worrying about his feelings and what he might think about you, he is not good booty call material. The primary reason men like to have booty calls is because they are basically no maintenance encounters. They don’t care about the woman or think about her until they want sex. That’s how you have to approach it as well. If you can’t in general or with this man in particular, you really aren’t a good candidate for casual hook ups. I don’t think there needs to be any shame either way. But just understand what you are getting into.
bottom line why dont guys call/talk to you after the fact.
I am for one of those who have been to the mountain. I have had the sex, and I spoke to the man that same day when he left. But after that, I have tried twice to reach him via phone two weeks apart, and it went to voicemail. RED FLAG! I was born at night, but it wasn’t last night. You don’t want to talk to me?! Two can play at that game. “Out of sight, out of mind”. He verbalily said I was his girlfriend, but he treats me this way? I don’t think so… (Lesson) You have to kiss a lot of frogs before you find your prince. In this case you have to look at it from a perspective that it NOT YOURS. It was just sex. that is it, MOVE ON. Don’t get use to he/she until they make an appearance the next day, and the day after that. PLEASE on your toes for the stalkers….
I was divorced several years ago and I have recentlty entered the dating scene. I have experienced some ya-hoos cross my path over the course of the past six months and one thing I have discovered is that they all have their own angle on how to “draw” a woman in. After several months of dating, and lacking sex for three years, I finally met a nice man. I refused all the other men in the past to sleep with because their dating tactics were cheesy and tacky. In other words, it was obvious they would be the ones to play you. So, I meet this nice man, we go out a few times and my goodness, the sparks and the chemistry, I had so been longing to feel a man, so I decide HE is the one I will sleep with. I tucked the notion in the back of my mind that I could potentially not have a relationship with this guy. The sex was great. It was several hours after he left my place that I contacted him as we had spoke the previous night about going on a double date, which he accepted. So after I contacted him about getting together that nite for the double date, he kept changing the subject. Finally I told him I needed to go and wished him a good nite. We have not spoken since. He has made no attempt to contact me or try to set up a date. Yet, prior to the sex, we spoke very nite and meeting up and going out. Explain that one? I then realized I may have just been played…and Iam ok with it and then again I am not. Simply because I feel as though I was deceived. I have learned something from all of this. There is a little bit of player in all of us. And I am learning the game. You will win some and you will lose some; but each new man affords me a greater insight to what I WANT. And let’s face it ladies, it should be about us. If he were to call me, I would go out with him again, because I want to, regardless of what he thinks or even if there was a motive on his part. In turn, I set my boundaries as well, by not contacting him again either. So, I’ve sent my own message, not because Iam hurt he blew me off after having off, but because he assumed I couldn’t handle not being in a relationship with him. It;s his arrogance that turned me off, not his tactics. I own my own life and I control MY life, not him. I have learned not to have expectations and that means AFTER sex as well. Now, there is a certain level of respect that should be shown, but in the grand scheme of things, he owes me nothing, I made a decision based on what I wanted not what I was hoping would come out of it just because I slept with him. In short, nothing should have changed. But with him it did.I enjoyed his company. By him not contacting me, I believe is his way of letting me know his boundaries. Which he has a right to set, whether he played me or not. You know why? Because once again he owed me nothing when I made the decision to sleep with him. Just as I owe him nothing. Him not calling me is his way of letting me know “hey, just because we had sex, doesn’t mean I have to spend every moment with you trying to make you feel better about a mutual decision we both made to have sex.” Period. Now if he is a mature and decent guy he can balance that and we can go back to the PRE-SEX relation we were having. It’s a hard pill to swallow because I liked him and I feel as though it could have gone somewhere; but we all need to accept the fact that as much as we would like the other person to be into us ( I mean after all they were jumping through hoops pre-sex) the behavior should not change post-sex. But with men, it does. Either they feel pressured or spooked, or they needed a ego lift. Either way it’s no reflection on us as woman or our ability or inability to land a good man. This guy may stay gone, but that is a decision he feels is best for him. Now he is missing out on a wonderful woman, and if he can’t see it after sleeping with me, then Iam sure he would be missing alot more of what I can offer in the course of any kind of relationship. Iam sad in a sense because I would have liked to seen where this would have went…and by deciding to sleep with thim, would be the sure fire way to find out, because a man won’t tell you. And if he calls or our paths meet ,then I will tell him this, because one thing a man doesnt expect from a woman (other then for her to be needy and clingy or expecting a relationship), is to be honest with where things could have went or not. By letting a man know you are ok with it BEFORE the sex, and that a disappearing act isn’t necessary, he can stay if he wants or he can go if he wants. Then YOU decide what you want from him, noone— male or female should give up the power and control of the direction of any said relationship because of sex. Too many games and not enough raw honesty I say. Sex or no sex, right or wrong, sleazy or genuine…the bottom line is noone likes rejection, but through it..it can become a huge part of accepting YOURSELF.
It seems to me that men are the ones who can not emotionally handle a “friends with benefits” type of relationship? I recently enjoyed an evening with a man. It was a blast. We connected well. Had some awesome random sex. Now I met this man through a friend of mine who I happen to be friends with since we were kids. He “hooked me up” and I “hooked him up” with a friend of mine type of thing. I am a grown woman and know quite well how it works. I am not looking for nor want any type of commitment at this time in my life and it happens to be that that I am purposly choosing unavailable men. I am souly on a mission to have meaningless sex. However, I would like a continious “botty call”. I have been through a few and even though very good times were had they dont call. I think men think we want more than it is. Why is it so hard for them to just be “friends with benefits”. If it was a good time for them than why wouldnt the want to do it again? I could totally be this guys friend and have sex with him on a regular basis with out attachment. If he would call!
hehe, wildcat – I have “almost” the same problem – they think they’re invited back, but end up upset because I just wanted to “see” what was up – nothing else
Reading the article and many of the comments – and having been one of the “loved, lost and in the game again” crowd, I have a hard time swallowing the the rules of “holding out for commitment” thrust upon women any more than I can the “sex-hound-ism” of men.
For the women who find themselves never getting the call back, perhaps you’re really just selecting unavailable guys, or maybe sending off that aroma of “please, please, please call me tomorrow and what are you doing for the rest of your life.”
And for the male half of the equation, I’ve seen plenty of you trying to hard to get laid, then being suprised when you do AND she flips the script and doesn’t want anything further from you!
I’ve watched several of my girlfriends approach each and every date as if “he” was going to be their next chance at “forever love” only to be bitterly disappointed each and everytime. Those same gal pals clicking their tongue and shaking their heads at me for having a much more cavalier attitude about dating. ”How can you just ‘give it up’ like that?” they ask. Give up what – sex? my time? a chance at a LTR? A second date?
Hmmph, if the date is great and he’s hot, he may get some, he may not, I may not feel like it, his breath may stink or I’m really thinking about someone else – I get to chose! And if it’s looking like something more serious, sex usually doesn’t rear it’s head for awhile anyway! And trying to have a single booty call boy is a sure way to catching some unwanted feelings, no wonder boys run from regular free lays - it’s better to have a couple of boys to help keep ones mind clear, if you’re going to play that game!
I’ve found the best medicine is to not take sex sooo seriously (aside from STD and unwanted pregnancy prevention), date, have sex, meet people – do your thing. Keep your weekends booked up with new men, different ones, girlfriends, family, etc…then you’re not pondering the one who ain’t calling. And if you find yourself stranded on that Isle of Rumination, immediately head to your “lil black book” and call the next boy. It’s just like Chris Rock says, “new p*ssy always clears you mind.” It works the same way for us gals – and we don’t have to get naked to appreciate the value in that sentiment ;)
Lots of great information here and it sure sounds like lots of similarities in the dating scene. What has me confused is after multiple dates and this guy seemingly being really interested in me, he said there was chemistry, was looking for LTR, introduced me to his children and even referenced that being a big deal. We discussed ‘sex’ and he mentioned that he didn’t engage in sex lightly and in fact it was ‘serious’ for him to engage that way. Sex was great, and he asked me to stay the night, we discussed ‘future’ plans such as going on a trip together, plans for the summer, and him wanting to meet my kids. We made plans for a date that next weekend before I left. All great signs..so I thought. I didn’t hear back from him for a few days, so I contacted him and just politely left a ” hi, hope your having a great week ” still nothing.. So I let it go, and decided to move on. Then I get a message from him stating he would marry me in a heartbeat.. ?? Huh? You won’t/don’t communicate yet you would Marry me in a heartbeat? Sounds like games to me.. Thinking he is keeping me as an option perhaps as he pursues others? Or working out some ‘issues’ or who knows what.. Women share what they feel, and are willing to talk, I see and hear Men complaining women just want sex, or play games. .doesn’t everyone realize were teaching one another to behave this way and it’s not working for anyone!!
It’s very interesting to read all of the above, but just enjoy live not all encounters end up in a relationship. Despite I think that every person want to know the reason and understand why, it’s impossible. Maybe instead if reading all negative things find a happy blog, go for a walk, just try to enjoy it might be not the last time you get hurt but that only will make you appreciate something real when you find it.
I also met a guy online to whom I use to speak and Skype every day before we met; I came to visit him we spent 4 days together and I never heard from him again. I am not going to lie and say I feel completely indifferent but it’s just what happened, there is a never guarantee that someone will call you back, marry you or it will turn into something special. But the beauty of all things if you willingly to love and make someone else happy because you are happy it will eventually comeJ)))))))))))))))))))))
Well there is no guarantee that after having sex, the guy would be calling you..Unless he likes you a lot and have this little feelings with you.
Adam, You sound wonderful
I personaly don’t think sex has anything to do with the guy calling you or not. If he likes you he will call wether you sleeping with him on the first date or not.
Think about it sex nowadays is easy anyone can get laid, so if it’s not you it will be someone else. So why not enjoy the experiance, as long as you have fun. What is the harm?
Anna, yes. We’ve been talking back and forth about this on the other thread.
I’m with you in regards of sex. Lighten up, it’s just sex…it won’t kill you just because you have sex because you want it (even if he disappears after that), a huge part of why we are here in the first place.
I think if he is looking for sex, he will try to press his luck when he first meets you and/or talks to you. I met one man who is a player, who has enticed by one woman who made him go out of his way to find her.
I’ve made myself too available to some men and have felt hurt/used and disappointed because once they get sex, most likely they will never think of you/keep in touch with you after.
Sapphire: Thank you soooooooooooooo much for telling the Truth. It’s so true that sex b/f marriage is adultery, fornication. There is a reason why God provided these peramiters-to keep us safe. I can’t tell you how painful and long-lasting (whether you want to admit it or not women) the feelings can be after you slept with a guy and he them becomes part of your history and just a memory-negative ones.
Anyhow, it’s not easy at all to find a guy who will wait, Christian or not, but obviously it’s worth it. Yes, a relationship cannot survive on Sex. Sex does not pay the bills, it does not provide answers to problems…
@ no 25 I have the same problem, I have dated many guys from online as I don’t seem to meet any potential dates in real life, some of them I slept with too early and some I waited or didn’t sleep with them at all but all had the same outcome.
They all tell me how great I am and seem really into me then get scared once they feel I like them back, it’s like game over for them.
The latest guy I dated was really into me and we clicked, we eventually slept together and he went all cold on me, he said he didn’t feel we clicked in the bedroom yet he still really fancied me. To be honest I would have rather slept with him earlier to find this out, this is not the first time I have waited only for the guy to say the sex wasnt for him. Yet when I sleep with a date early on they seem to want more, but not a relationship.
I have learned that as a woman I really can’t win whatever I do.
I have given up on dating. It has not made me feel good about myself.
The dating thing is sooo hard! Just a lot of work, get your hopes up only to have them dashed. The things that have worked for me are… 1) letting a guy know that I am interested in going out with him, someone I choose, not the men who ask me out as I find those dates go nowhere as I am usually not interested in them. I choose the guys, let them know I’m interested and then go out with them, 9 times out of 10 we hit it off in some way and I enjoy the dates much more and most have ended in short relationships. 2) knowing my boundaries and not ever letting a guy cross them, if a guy is not contacting me entusiastically by telephone and consistantly about going out or getting to know me then I don’t go out with him. 3) the whole sex thing, most men will chase you for it if they like you enough and if you make them chase by not calling them (like NEVER!), don’t be available all the time, insist on dates (not just hanging out), make them work for it, don’t be all nice to them, make them work hard for at least 3 months, they want to work this hard and want to chase. and really I don’t even believe it if they say its an LTR or an exclusive thing before they have sex with you, i’ve been dumped or cheated on after sex after having all those agreements in place … never a sure a thing. best thing to do is watch his actions, don’t put up with any crap, call him on all of it, do not persue him, and if he’s making you a part of his life, meeting friends, family etc etc the more entrenched you are in his life, the better chance you have of not getting dumped after you do the deed
you can fool around with him though, just keep control, no actual intercourse… if he walks before that, oh well. And discreetly date other guys on the side so you do get your needs met, we all have needs 
I’m a 24 year old, single professional mother. I came across this article at just the right time. I have been seeing a man for about 3 months. At first everything was WONDERFUL. He was SOOO into me – or so it seemed. He said he wanted to be “exclusive” (only see each other) but not “official.” Within the first month, I didn’t think anything of it. Because we were just getting to know each other. After the 2 month mark, it became clear he was drifting away. I knew what it meant. I freaks out, panicked and acted extremely needy. FURTHER pushing him away.
Finally I decided I didn’t want to be used to for sex anymore. At first I thought cut him off completely. I came across this article about words vs actions. So true! Thank you, Evan!!!
So after this I realized being “used” for sex is sometimes a state of mind. I decided to use him back. We went out last Saturday, hooked up and immediately afterward, I left. He asked me to text him when I got home (I live an hour away.) … But I never did. I detached myself from the strong feelings I had and was the guy for once. And he reacted in a way he hasn’t in over a month. Texting, calling, pursuing ME. WELL… Buddy, lost his chance. But I think I’m learning about the difference between men and women. And next time, I’ll be a LOT smarter.
Adam don’t tell Mary where you live, tell me
Evan makes this see SO SIMPLE. BLACK AND WHITE. Women, behave a certain way and you will always come out on top. NOT TRUE. Yes, there are absolutely behaviors that many men share. Also, that many women share. HOWEVER, human beings are NOT an exact science so we can not treat it this way. I do agree with Evan on many issues, however, I also disagree. For example, it is possible that a man’s ACTIONS can be great – and then the moment you get comfortable he freaks out…once he feels “he has you”. This happens ALL THE TIME. This is a guy who is afraid of commitment. But there is no way of knowing, because he doesnt even know! If you date a guy for a month, you hangout several times a week. Meet his friends, talk on the phone becuse he CALLS and wnats to see how you are. Then, goes on vaca, but doesnt contact you the entire time. CONFUSING RIGHT? Because he is confused, or different than you… The woman can not decipher one way or the other what this means…because we are always being told we are too sensitive or needy. It could mean he doesnt care, or it could mean his phone is off out of the country and thinks there is nothing disrespectful about it. TWO DIFFERENT MEN, TWO DIFFERENT REASONS. It is NOT an exact science – human beings never are… yes it can be VERY CLEAR one way or the other, but it can also be very gray. So do you walk away from gray (mostly good) because its not exactly right? AS women today there is so much pressure on us to either make or break the relationship. It is mostly OUR behavior while initially dating that guides the relationship…unless the guy is literally an asshole. So let us say, you date this guy a month or so. He is unbelivable attentive, sweet, but occasionally inconsiderate (or are you just over analyzing??) – you hang ou ALOT considering your schedules, he always does what he says he will, he does not pressurre you for sex.. he wants to know your last name, bday, and family names…and then… as you start to become less cautious and more comfortable he slowly becomes aloof. Is this my fault? NOOO. It is his issues. Now we have sex, 10 dates later… (and also being acquaintances for years) and h DOES NOT call you the next day. He sleeps i with you, cuddles you, and takes you to breakfast…but leaves (doesnt have plans or anywhere to be) talks about your plans for the following weekend – but doesnt call…or text… So Evan, is this a clear cut thing ? NO- the guy is confused , scared, hs his own issues taht have NOTHING TO do with howi have behaved… There was no way to forsee this or guarantee anything.
Also depends on the two people, what you need. Personally, I need daily contact. NOT all day long morning noon and night, but every day. Some people need more or less, and they can care the same amount.
#47 i love your attitude..BUT, the problem is… BIOLOGY. Women ar made to want a comittment. Our bodies literally have hormones that produce after sex which make us want to bond. men, on the other hand – biologically want to spread their seed. OF COURSE, men dont want to be lonely. But the more options they FEEL that they have, the LESS likely it will work out long term. In NYC, there are 5 women to 2 men (about). With the biology of men and women, is it so ODD that its the toughest city to date in? Also, the men who live in NYC are mostly all successful. Combine these factores, and why WOULD THEY want to settle down? Even the “losers” who maybe are goodlooking, there are so many deperate girls they don’t even want to settle or feel that they have to. Why in small towns,, is everyone married? Because there are NOT so many options. When you find someone you like, you HOLD ONTO IT. In NYC, they freak out even if tey do love you and arent bad guys because — they have all these options walking around in their face everyday…
LADIES -stop saying you can have “casual” sex. Or booty calls…it is total denial. Even if you barely like a guy, the minute you get intimate you will catch feelings…end of story. You will feel badly if you know he is with other women, you will feel used if he only wants your body, and you will resent his treatment of you soon after… THERE IS NO exact rule (wait 90 days, wait 30, wait til marriage…) Wait til you feel like the guy is good enough a person to have you. But know, people can be actors (or confused) and even if you wait, and do all the right things…it STILL may not work out. But KNOW 100% if you sleep with him before you get to know one another — you will NEVER have anything. (Except for rare occcasions, I mean never say never right) But wait tooooo long, like the guy, have bad sex— whats worse than that? Right. So i am not waiting three months to fall for someone and then find out our sexual chemistry is horrible. I will also never sleep with a guy on the first few dates (I mean AT LEAST 6… 7, 8-10 best) This SHOULD occur within 4-6 weeks. 8 at the MOST… but he could flip a switch. Happens all the time. But its better to feel like it is all his fault it did not work out, than yours right?
There will never be any hard core guarantee. After all, if men (and women) can disappear on their spouse after 20+ years of marriage, they an disappear after a few dates. He can change his mind, he can lose your number, hey he can even die at the wrong time…
The closest you can get from a guarantee is being so special, so interesting, so loving, and having the man like you so much, that there will pretty much be no chance that he will not want to see you again ASAP. If before you become sexually intimate, he knows how amazing you are, he desires to get to know you better, he feels great around you, and he finds himself emtionally connected to you, why – oh why – would he disappear after sharing a sexual connection, or after a few dates for that matter?
Therefore, make sure to be that special, interesting, and loving woman. Make sure he feels emotionally connected. Make sure these feelings develop QUICKLY – over the first few dates – so that sex does not need to be postponed for too long. This is YOUR responsability as a woman.
@Sayanta31 – I’m not sure if you’re still following this thread, and I’m not sure either if you’re still looking or where you live, but I was at a gallery exhibition last night, the place was packed, and I left having given my info to not one but four charming single men. Gallery things have changed (especially when it’s a group show and the presenting artists are there) — you may want to try again.