I Think I’m Hot But My Boyfriend Doesn’t Seem to Think So

Evan Marc Katz

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Evan, I want an honest opinion on my predicament. I am in a year-long relationship and my boyfriend is a wonderful man. We have a strong connection and share a lot of values, views and interests. We’re getting pretty serious but there’s something that is eating me up inside. I think my boyfriend doesn’t think I am hot!

Being 5’5″ and 115lbs and measuring 34-26-35.5”, I always assumed that I was in the same league as a lot of celebrities who boast similar bodies. Granted, I am a little heavier towards my hips and have a bit wider frame but does 1″ really make a lot of difference here? Well, yes, according to my dear b/f. He basically told me that I can’t even compare myself to an actress or other celebrities (this ridiculous conversation started while watching TV and making comments about some actress). To him, I am “good looking” and “pretty” but, say, Angelina Jolie is “hot”, and “beautiful” and I am well… a regular person so I am not, how could I possibly be? He “likes me and finds me attractive”, but by no means am I nearly as good looking as a movie star, and I am crazy to be even comparing myself to them. That was the essence of the conversation. Of course, I felt hurt and I had a few “nice” things to say to him in response – as in “look who’s talking” kind of things and this conversation went downhill right away.

Now, am I crazy to be upset about this outlook of his? Men I dated in the past were (or at least acted the part) infatuated by me. I am used to hearing how beautiful I am. Men turn heads when I walk down the street. While I am totally OK with the idea that somebody doesn’t find me the most beautiful woman on the planet, which a lot of people probably don’t, I am somehow not OK with that person being my boyfriend! I mean, if he was truly into me, wouldn’t I be to him more beautiful than all Hollywood celebrities combined? Wouldn’t he be saying things like “honey, Angelina Jolie got nothing on you”? What happens if I gain weight with age – do I go from being “pretty” to “ugly, but I love you anyway because we have 2 kids and a mortgage and divorcing you is too damn expensive”? Am I being insecure and shallow for zooming in on this issue when everything else is fine, or have I got a legitimate concern? Is recognizing that your girlfriend is not ranking at the top of your scale in terms of looks but is the best “package” you can get in terms of looks-personality-values-etc. a sign of a mature man, or a sign of a man who’s not really in love? And most importantly, is this a deal breaker? –Diana.

Love. This. Question.

It’s a microcosm of every misinterpretation in every relationship ever.

And before I answer it, I want to share with you a story.

It was a tale from a linguistics professor in college who explained to the class that, in studies, men tend to be much more direct in their language. Women are subtle.

We can see this in many forms of personal interaction.

Because women are so kind and supportive, they don’t always speak their minds. They obscure the truth to be sensitive, but fail to communicate their true feelings.

Women are sensitive to each others’ needs. Men are blunt.

Women pick up on details. “What was he wearing? How did he kiss you? Where were you at the time?” Men just want to cut to the chase. “What’s the point?”

Women are supportive of their friends. “No, you don’t look fat in those jeans.”
Men cut their buddies down. “Dude, you gained, like twenty pounds!”

In fact, suffice to say, women are largely better and more sensitive communicators and men should really learn take a page out of women’s emotional playbooks.

Except for this one thing…

Because women are so kind and supportive, they don’t always speak their minds. They obscure the truth to be sensitive, but fail to communicate their true feelings.

My linguistics professor used an example of how a typical man and a typical woman would respond to being stuck in a hot classroom.

The man would say, “It’s hot in here! Open the window!”

The woman would turn to her friend and say, “Do you think it’s hot in here?”

The man issues a command. The woman tries to build consensus, but she doesn’t come out directly and say what she really wants: open the goddamn window!

I’m not going to get into some debate about whether this is 100% accurate, because it’s not. Not all men are direct. Not all women are subtle and nuanced.

But the reason I’m sharing this, in reference to your situation, Diana, is that the most interesting thing about women’s linguistics patterns can be summed up in one line:

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243 Comments »Filed Under Communication, Relationships, Understanding Men

243 Responses to “I Think I’m Hot But My Boyfriend Doesn’t Seem to Think So”

1. Amanda 1

   It’s in a woman’s DNA to want to be seen as the most beautiful woman in her man’s eyes. Her wanting to be that woman doesn’t mean she has low self esteem; it means she’s a woman. Like it or not, so much of a woman’s value is based on her beauty. A man telling his woman she doesn’t compare to another is basically telling her she’s second rate and that if given the choice between her and Angelina, he’d choose Angelina. She doesn’t want to feel like a consolation prize because he couldn’t get anyone better. This is basic female psychology. I’m sorry your wife isn’t the most beautiful woman to you, Evan. It sucks even more that your wife is okay knowing she’s a 7 in your eyes. It’s like you knowing that your penis doesn’t quite do it for her but she’ll still have sex with you anyway because…well…you pay the bills and she couldn’t find a man who satisfies her better. How sad.

2. sarahrahrah! 2

   Ouch, Evan. You really take the “direct communicator” model to heart. ;D

   To the OP I would say this: yes, it’s good to be honest with yourself about your looks. You’re not Angelina Jolie and that’s probably a lot more manageable anyway. What you really want to know is if your guy is crazy about you, right?

   Does he do all the things that Evan says guys do when they are in love? Is he able to praise and compliment you and be generous with his time? If so, I would drop your concern and never bring it up again. It will just annoy him. If this is a symptom of a guy who is aloof and not able to communicate his love for you, you should borrow a page from the guys and ask him directly to give verbal feedback more often. If your guy is uber-logical like I’m guessing he might be, he might respond very positively to your request.

3. Heather 3

   Evan,

   Now hold on a second here. Before we go jumping all over this woman and whatnot, here’s one thing. We weren’t there. We did not hear HOW he said it to her.

   I think what a lot of men fail to understand is that we women DO want an honest man, but we also want a little bit of sensitivity. There’s an old saying, that I repeat often to patients I work with, and my boyfriend, “It’s not WHAT you say. It’s HOW you say it.” And if he said something like, “Pffft, please, you’re NOTHING like them.” Well I can see why Ms. Diana would get hurt. I would be too, if I were spoken to like that.

   Do alot of women want a guy to lie to them? I guess so, I don’t know. I’m of the opinion that I’d prefer the truth any day over a lie. However, you don’t need to go bashing someone over the head with the truth, either.

   One thing alot of you guys need to learn, is tact, and to think before you speak. Just the other day at work, my department administrator came to me and said, “Heather, are you submitting your paperwork?” Excuse me?? Not, “Hey Heather, it’s the end of the month, is everything going OK? Need anything? Are there any problems?” Nope, just “Are you doing your paperwork?” And also let me add that I “reality checked” this with several men, who agreed that my admin was way out of line and insensitive for talking to me like that.

   I am not totally defending this woman since I don’t know what happened to her. But let’s not jump all over her and tell her she can’t handle an honest man, when we weren’t there, and we couldn’t hear how that conversation went down.

4. Kathleen 4

   I respect Evans response for its honestly and directness
   I find the question unusual because the majority of women seem to underestimate their attractiveness. This is true amongst my friends and I just read an article about it the other day on msn. I can’t imagine most women challenging their boyfriends with this question. It does seem extremely insecure and to fling an insult back at him definitely immature.

5. Ileana 5

   I don’t know what to say to this one, Evan…

   I think Diana is a bit childish by trying to compare herself to Hollywood celebrities because a) most of the Hollywood celebrities usually had some sort of plastic surgery and b) we usually see them on the red carpet or in some of the best photos (movies) there are out there, where they have the best make-up and lighthing available. So even though there are paparazzies everywhere, they usually put their best foot forward (lookwise)… heck, they earn their living by looking glamorous. They rarely have anything else to offer other than looks (and in some cases talent). Get over it!
   Plus, i really doubt that beauty is the indicator of a solid and happy relationship, considering the stuff that goes on between the ‘hot’ Hollywood couples.

   What actually bothered me in her letter was that her boyfriend said Angelina is beautiful and Diana is only ‘pretty’. Is he not aware that Angelina has a whole team of people taking care of this very aspect? I agree that he shouldn’t have lied to her, but still… ‘I think you are beautiful in your own way’ would have sounded way better. It’s like telling your guy that he is not handsome only because he isn’t Clooney.

6. david 6

   At first, I read this and thought the boyfriend was not doling out affection because she wasn’t measuring up to “celebrity-hotness”, or their sex life was being affected, but you’re right, this doesn’t seem to be the case — the OP wants some validation that she is as hot Kim Kardas. or Angelia Jolie…

   I had a friend like this (emphasis on ‘HAD’) — who at early 40′s looked 22 and had a great bosom and great lips and was sexy / cute (and got hit on constantly — notes on her windshield, etc., had a boyfriend) but was so insecure, would DEMAND reasons why she wasn’t as hot as the celebrities listed and wouldn’t let you off the phone until you presented your argument…and she cried. This was exhausting and felt like getting pulled into a black hole.

   Reading this, reminds me of that. And the boyfriend probably feels like that too.

7. Vicki 7

   If someone is the type of person who seeks validation outside of herself – as in the clothes she wears, the car she drives, and how high up the number scale her partner is in the looks department – then she probably suffers from low self-esteem, or she isn’t very educated or accomplished and has nothing besides her looks to feel good about. I think this woman is very fixated on her own looks, and worried also that she will lose them and her guy will lose interest as a result. It’s a valid concern, if you have a tendency to date men who are very fixated on your looks. The man she is dating could be (1) a person who doesn’t care as much about looks as she does ( in which case he is probably a better quality man than she’s used to, and probably he is attracted to her for other reasons than just her looks) or (2) he has a much higher and pickier standard of looks and doesn’t really feel that he’s lucky to be with her (red flag number 1! he will take off as soon as he meets someone slightly prettier) or (3) he’s the kind of guy who needs to put a girl “in her place” – he will find ways to constantly put you down or belittle you or make you feel like you’re not worthy somehow (red alert warning! run from this guy as fast as you can!). It’s very difficult to judge the situation from this one event or email. The fact that it bothers her this much, makes me think she’s picking up on something being not quite right about this guy. There have probably been other instances, slight remarks, that didn’t blow out into a fight as in this example she writes about. If her gut feeling is that this guy doesn’t like her much, or doesn’t seem pleased to be with her, he’s probably just “not that into her” and she should move on and find someone else who is crazy about her. Worst case scenario: his remarks about her looks are deliberately disrespectful, and he’s trying to undermine her self-esteem. Watch out for other signs of mental or emotional abuse. They won’t get better. They *will* get worse. Better still, stop comparing yourself to movie stars and inviting others to do so as well. Most movie stars aren’t that good-looking anyway. They just have access to professional makeup artists and stylists, and you don’t. Angelina Jolie probably looks like a dead trout when she rolls out of bed in the morning. Ditto for Brad Pitt.

8. amy 8

   I generally agree with you, Evan, but I’m not sure this time. I can’t tell if she is delusional. Like, no one is as hot as Angelina Jolie. But if she is semi-hot, her boyfriend should feel that way. He does have a job to make her feel he believes she is sexy and beautiful. (The word “attractive” should be banned from the dictionary, it’s so insulting.)
   Sounds like she needs more affirmation than he’s giving her.

9. david 9

   Also, flip the genders — what about I demanded of my (imaginary) girlfriend – how come you don’t find me in the same league as Brad pitt or George Clooney? If you loved me, you would think I was hotter than them combined!

   That sounds absurd.

   Just because one is the same porportions as the ‘Celebrity-of-the-month’ just make you an “unfamous peer of them” in the looks department.

   And isn’t it possible he sees MORE beauty in you ON THE INSIDE than he could of any celebrity (and the ability to look past your insecurity and ego?)

10. Selena 10

    Diana,

    With your boyfriend – please google Celebrities Without Makeup. Eye opening and perspective putting. Do it.

11. Aksauy 11

    Oh well. Like i always say, honesty is overrated. If you had a choice to tell the truth and hurt your g/f feelings, or tell a (harmless) lie and make her feel good, why would you chose to tell the truth? Who needs it anyway? In life, i noticed time and time again that “honesty” is mostly about thr ego of the person who is “being honest”, either their pride or their putting other people down with their truths.

12. Holly 12

    I think it’s important for the men and women in relationships to express their desire for one another. Let’s face it, the majority of us are no Clooneys or Jolies and we know it, but it would be nice to think that our partner desires us anyway. I’m currently dating a man who has been honest in letting me know that he has been with plenty of “hot” women in the past. However, he seems to assume that simply dating me should be assurance enough that I’m an acceptable partner. He does not drop little hints or comments to boost my self-confidence and I’m left wondering if I’m just a place-holder until the next hottie comes along. Being 20 pounds over my ideal weight and no looker, I’m finding myself very insecure in this particular relationship even though he’s a great catch in so many other ways. Folks, you don’t have to compare yourselves (or your partners) to the Hollywood elite, but it sure would be reassuring to hear the occasional “Damn, you look good in that! I’m a lucky guy/girl.” I don’t think that’s too much to ask for.

13. Happy Person 13

    1) I think A Jolie is kinda creepy looking. She might be a nice and interesting person–don’t know. So I’m not slamming her the person. Just the image.

    2) I don’t get the part of popular culture where these freaky looking people are considered better-looking than so-called normal people. Because of this I wouldn’t be with a guy who talks about celebrity pop culture as if this is anything we should admire or aspire to. We can all look like that if we spent the time and money to do so. I think it’s sane that most of us do not.

    3) Men don’t get the final word on how we look or feel in our bodies. We do. That he feels so entitled to judge female attractiveness is a problem. That she goes along with him in this role is also a problem. That pop culture supports this view of man as consumer of female packaging is also a problem. (No, I don’t buy the evo psych view of male sexuality, so won’t respond to those justifications of rude behavior.)

    4) If a guy is more into a woman’s “internal beauty” than her “external beauty” then that should be clear from his words and his behavior. Women don’t go all insecure or crazy around guys who treat all women as humans rather than as packaging. They get calm.

    5) The person who is in front of you and sharing all or a part of your life is more important than some image floating around in your head. Goes for both men and women.

14. Annette 14

    I usually agree with you Evan but I think you were a little harsh on the girl. Without being privy to the conversation, it’s hard to tell if the guy was being a bit tactless and needlessly hurtful. My boyfriend is always honest with me (which I love) but he is also blunt, so I do know better than to ask a question like, “Am I hotter than Angelina?”. (since we both know I’m not). But he also tells me I’m beautiful a lot, which is always nice to hear. She may be insecure, but maybe her b/f could have said the truth in a way that didn’t make her question his attraction to her.

15. Evan Marc Katz 15

    @Amanda – I posted your snarky remark instead of censoring it – even though it violates the rules of the blog – don’t insult the host (and especially his wife).

    In short, neither my wife or I find our marriage to be sad – and I would trust that anyone who knows us thinks that we’re about the happiest couple they know. So what do they see that you don’t?

    They see a couple who likes each other, respects each other, puts each other first, and communicates REALLY, REALLY, REALLY well.

    So if I don’t look like Colin Farrell (one of my wife’s crushes), I’m not remotely threatened or insulted. Why should I be? She hasn’t met Colin Farrell. She won’t meet Colin Farrell. She’s bright enough to know that there are other qualities besides looks. She doesn’t have him pegged for the best husband/father around. In short, because I’m really secure in my relationship, I could not care less about how she evaluates my looks in comparison to a super good-looking guy. I know this: she thinks I’m cute, we have a good sex life, and we’re both happy.

    To suggest that she’s my “consolation prize” or that either of us are “second rate” is to severely diminish what we have. You can say many things about us, but “sad” isn’t a label that would stick for even a half-second. In fact, my definition of sad would probably being in a relationship where my partner was expected to lie to me in order to keep the peace.

    @Amanda and Ileana – She’s his GIRLFRIEND. Year long relationship. Wonderful man. Strong connection. He thinks she’s pretty and good looking. That would seem to tell me everything I need to know about how he feels about her. She never said that her boyfriend insulted her or found her unattractive. She said that he didn’t think she was attractive as debatably the sexiest celebrity out there. To which I said, “So what?”

    I repeat: if this is something that you have in your DNA (hint: it’s not), then don’t ask questions where you don’t want the real answers. Sounds like that’s a better way of keeping the peace, instead of setting him up to hurt you with his honesty – or, your preferred method of treatment – the baldfaced lie.

    I can’t think of a single man who’s ever had this conversation and ask to be favorably compared to the most gorgeous guy out there.

    Honestly, why WOULD he?

    I know where I stand on the looks scale and as long as my wife still finds me attractive and compliments me from time to time, we’re good. Those compliments would mean a lot less if I asking for them and knew in the back of my mind that they were untrue.

16. Fawn 16

    Bravo, Evan! Great response!

17. Aksauy 17

    Not to make this about Jolie, but seriously have people not seen her pics without makeup? Hot, i think not, haha. I just generally dont get all the fascination with celebrities, most of them are very average looking and just glammed up and photoshoped to the extreme. I see girls no less beautiful everywhere i go. The beauty is in the eyes of the beholder and beauty is confidence.. To paraphrase Ford, whether you think you’re beautiful or you are not, you’re right.

18. JS 18

    The thing that always amuses me about these types of comparisons (does “normal person X” look as good as “famous person Y”) is that if Angelina Jolie decided to be a lawyer instead of an actress, her bf/friends would tell her “oh, no you’re not nearly as hot as Jessica Alba or whomever. She’s famous and you’re just a mere mortal.” We should really remember that all these famous people started out as normal people at one point. So a week before they get their big break, they’re normal and shouldnt try to compare to celebrities but the next week when their first movie kills at the box office, then all of sudden they are celebrity-level hot…? WTF. Either they were hot before & after fame or not at all.

    What someone does for a living doesn’t make them gorgeous. Kathy Bates is an extraordinarily talented actress but even in her youth, she wasn’t as hot as my next door neighbor who is a doctor.

    Beauty is beauty. Famous people can be hotter or uglier than non-famous people and vice versa. If the OP is not hot as hot as the celebrities she asked her bf about, then she’s simply not and would not be even if she were famous. And in my opinion, just based upon her measurements (not facial beauty, as we dont have a photo), she sounds like she’s got the body of a famous hot person.

    Plus…. for every guy who loves Angelina there are a ton of other guys who don’t think she’s all that but instead love Beyonce or Jessica Biel or whomever. Men debate “who is the hottest” even among the famous women of the world. It’s all so subjective.

19. Heather 19

    Evan,

    Why must you keep assuming that we women want men to lie to us? You don’t know me. You don’t know how I think. I really rather resent the broad brush generalization here. It would be like my going around and going, “Oh all of you guys are just mean and verbally abusive.” I know you’d be pissed off and rightly so.

    So why are you coming down on all of us women and saying we all want to be lied to? Not all of us women say these things to our boyfriends, or are insecure.

20. Evan Marc Katz 20

    Oh, this post is not about Angelina Jolie or celebrities without makeup.

    This is about the OP who thinks there’s something wrong with her relationship because while her boyfriend of one year finds her pretty, he doesn’t think she’s the prettiest person he’s ever seen.

21. Stacy 21

    I usually almost always agree with what you’ve written, Evan, and even in this case I do, to a point. Guys are definitely more direct and honest. I’ve learned not to ask if I don’t want an honest answer from my boyfriend, but in this case, I don’t necessarily agree with the boyfriend just being honest. I do think the OP is possibly insecure and was seeking validation from her boyfriend with her question, but I think that her boyfriend should find her “hot” because why wouldn’t you date someone that you found hot? I know I’m not the most beautiful person in the world and I know that there are women out there that I’m sure my boyfriend would find objectively “hotter” but he tells me all the time that he thinks I’m hot and beautiful and pretty and he shows me all the time that he feels that way as well. He wolf whistles at me or ogles me and winks. It’s the little things that go a long way in making a woman feel attractive and “hot” and while I would never ask for a direct comparison with a celebrity I know that my boyfriend would still tell me that I was hot if I did. (Well, probably only after he told me it was a stupid “trap question!)

22. Selena 22

    Re: # 19
    “This is about the OP who thinks there’s something wrong with her relationship because while her boyfriend of one year finds her pretty, he doesn’t think she’s the prettiest person he’s ever seen.”

    I think it may also have a bit to do with vanity since Diana wrote: “While I am totally OK with the idea that somebody doesn’t find me the most beautiful woman on the planet, which a lot of people probably don’t, I am somehow not OK with that person being my boyfriend!”

    Mirror, mirror on the wall – who’s the fairest of them all?
    You better say me, if you know what’s good for you!!!!

23. Karl R 23

    Amanda said: (#1)
    “A man telling his woman she doesn’t compare to another is basically telling her she’s second rate and that if given the choice between her and Angelina, he’d choose Angelina. She doesn’t want to feel like a consolation prize because he couldn’t get anyone better.”

    My fiancée has met the most attractive woman I ever dated. Part way through my first date with the more attractive woman, I realized that I had no interest in ever dating her again -and- I should have scheduled a shorter date. That woman was sweet and beautiful, but not intelligent enough to maintain my interest.

    I got someone better than that attractive woman. Physical attractiveness isn’t the most important quality.

    Aksauy asked: (#11)
    “Like i always say, honesty is overrated. If you had a choice to tell the truth and hurt your g/f feelings, or tell a (harmless) lie and make her feel good, why would you chose to tell the truth?”

    Why would I choose a girlfriend who needs a steady diet of lies to be happy?

    As david said (#9), flip the genders.

    Would you date a man who got upset because you thought George Clooney (or Russel Crowe, or Orlando Bloom) was better looking than him?

    Would you date a man who has to be reassured that you’ve never dated anyone who was stronger, more handsome, more successful or better endowed than he was?

    Diana asked:
    “if he was truly into me, wouldn’t I be to him more beautiful than all Hollywood celebrities combined?”

    Do you have to believe a man is more handsome than all Hollywood celebrities combined in order to be truly into him?

24. sg 24

    I agree men and women communicate differently but many women like to be told they are beautiful, and some of us who are a little insecure need a little reassurance. Frankly I think kindness should trump frankness when it doesn’t hurt anything – would it have killed her boyfriend to just tell her she’s hot?

25. Happy Person 25

    Wasn’t there a comment on here recently about AJolie being an upgrade from Jennifer? I don’t think it was a poster who made the comment, and the comment wasn’t about AJolie being a better communicator than Jennifer. So not sure why the descent into petty celebrity comparisons is all on the posters.

26. JP 26

    I think what’s ultimately sad is that Amanda echoes a sentiment that is now embedded in young women everywhere; that they’re only as good as their looks and need to be seen as beautiful first and foremost. Beauty is not just a word for looks. It’s a word for sentiments, feelings, and all sorts of other things that go along with marriage. My wife is a beautiful person, and her looks are simply a part of that. She’s so much more than good looking. She’s good feeling, good hearted, good natured, good-smarted (to keep the theme) and good to her family. Society and commercialism have demonized women who aren’t a certainly weight and height, and worse, has often made them look at only their defects…. Evan is absolutely right that men are direct and that honesty in a marriage is so much more important than someone who lies. Tact is a factor as Heather said and should not be forgotten, but I think what this person is really scared of is that he’ll leave her for someone better looking and she can’t come out and say that. He probably would totally re-assure her that he loves her if she did.

27. Jewel 27

    One thing is for sure, the boyfriend is tactless.I don’t buy this being blunt as a reason to hurt your partners feelings. On the other hand its best not to ask questions you arent prepared to hear the answer to.

    I remember years ago talking with my husband about Marilyn Monroe and I mentioned I thought she was the sexiest woman I had ever seen. He said he didnt agree, and when I asked him who was sexiest to him, thinking he would choose another celebrity, he said “You are”.

    He got a lot of “brownie” points with that response

28. Aksauy 28

    @Karl: everybody needs reassurance, men even more than women. What is so horrible in offering it? And again, “pretty”? Sorry, a dress is “pretty”, a little girl with a bow is “pretty”, but if a guy does not find his girfriend anything other than “pretty”, there absolutely is something wrong with it. My money is on him just being clueless thou

29. Katarina Phang 29

    It’s not about honesty, it’s about whether or not idle talk is conducive in relationship. To me talking about relative attractiveness of others compared to your partner is idle talk. What’s the point? What purpose does it serve? Now, you have an insecure partner or hurt feelings because of that.

    If you love someone you want to build them up not put them down. I will definitely bond closer to my partner who says, “Honey, you may not be the most beautiful woman in the world to others, but you are to me.”

    What he thinks about me matters the most, not what other people think.

30. Evan Marc Katz 30

    This is astonishing to me. The wonderful boyfriend didn’t come out of the blue and say, “You know what? I’m not attracted to you at all. In fact, if I had to do it all again, I’d hold out for someone who looks more like Angelina Jolie.” Not even close.

    The OP, Diana, came out and ASKED him, point-blank, to say something that, at the very least, stretches the bounds of credulity. It puts him in an unfair position – and everyone who’s getting on him for being tactless is not remotely sympathetic to him. Lying – to some of us – is an extremely uncomfortable act. It broaches our integrity and makes us feel uneasy with ourselves. To some of us, truth isn’t something that’s optional.

    So to all the women who are somehow sympathetic with our insecure, manipulative, unrealistic OP…

    Are you more bothered by the fact that:

    1) He didn’t tell her a pretty little lie like, “Sweetie, I wouldn’t even look twice at Angelina if she were standing next to you.” (You know this is a lie. I know this is a lie. But we’re going to pretend it’s not.)

    OR

    2) He didn’t actually think she was as hot as a super-hot celebrity. (Because your boyfriend can’t simply be in love with you, treat you well, and make your life better in a thousand ways – every man has to be delusional enough to sincerely think his girlfriend is the HOTTEST woman in the WORLD)

    Remember, he IS her boyfriend. He DOES find her attractive, and for all we know, he compliments her when she gets dressed up for a night on the town or when they’re in the bedroom. (We have no evidence that he doesn’t). The ONLY reason this came up was because she was soliciting a completely unrealistic compliment.

    I wouldn’t WANT a girlfriend who says, “Oh, you’re the ‘biggest’ man I’ve ever been with.” It’s not true. It would make me feel uneasy. It would make me feel that she may be lying to me about other things. This seems so readily apparent to me.

    Are all you defenders REALLY saying that the “right” man is going to FEEL you’re more beautiful than the most beautiful woman or SAY that you’re more beautiful than the most beautiful woman, even though we all know that neither is true? Don’t all of his OTHER actions as a boyfriend add up to a lot more than this ridiculous unsolicited question by an insecure girlfriend? Would you REALLY turn this into a dealbreaker against your man?

    If so, you now have a much clearer explanation as to why men lie to you. You can’t handle the truth.

31. moe 31

    FIRST OFF, ladies….who asks men about how they look? WHO goes fishing for compliments? Just dress good, eat healthy, keep up with the hygienne, etc and there you go, he KNOWS you look good. Thats all he needs, to look at you without having to give a response all the time. I mean we like to hear it, but I certainly NEVER ask a man how I look, because my looks are measured by ME.

    I think its creepy when women go fishing for compliments verbally, why yall got to be so insecure? Ladies, its time to grow up. Evans right, the truth hurts. Dont ask if you dont want to get hurt.

32. Katarina Phang 32

    Yes I agree that asking stupid questions about who’s hotter is an idle talk too and it reeks insecurity. I will never do that because it’s like opening a can of worms. However, I do think the boyfriend can perhaps be more diplomatic about it instead of making it like a talk-show debate with factual precision.

    And I agree with others too many of these celebs will look normal without all the work/glam up they have.

33. Ruby 33

    Guess what? Angelina Jolie isn’t even Angelina Jolie. Movie stars have a team of stylists and makeup artists. They’ve been lipo-suctioned, botoxed, had plastic surgery, and even their long gorgeous hair is augmented with extensions. In order to maintain their super-skinny bods, they never eat. Their photos? Photoshopped.

    OTOH, what’s wrong with telling your girlfriend that to you, she is the most beautiful woman in the world? Hopefully, we mortals understand that beauty isn’t skin deep, and there are many factors that make a person “beautiful.” I’ve met some really handsome guys, but had no chemistry with them, or they turned out to be jerks. Their looks were, ultimately, unimportant.

34. Aksauy 34

    Evan, i am utterly confused by the question. If we assume that there exist THE HOTTEST woman to whom no one should compare themselves, than i woder who that woman is? Have all men on the planet agreed on that? Is that AJ? if not, and if beauty is, in fact, subjective, than logically what is the reason the OP can’t be THE HOTTEST woman – in the eyes of her b/f? Why not? And if that is a possibility, than why wouldnt she be upset that it didnt turn out to be true?

35. Evan Marc Katz 35

    Rationalizations. Excuses. Subterfuge. Avoiding the question. It doesn’t matter if Angelina has “help”. It doesn’t matter if beauty is somewhat subjective (and it’s not really THAT subjective). All that matters is whether a man should say something untrue to his wife because it would make her feel better. And if we play that slippery slope, how does it look in reverse? The 35K office drone asking his girlfriend if he’s as successful as Bill Gates? The 100 IQ, 1000 SAT guy asking his girlfriend if he’s smarter than Einstein? The short, fat, balding, back hair guy asking if he’s as hot as Chris Hemsworth?

    All of those “normal” men are worthy of love and should be praised by their girlfriends. I just don’t think they need to be lied to.

    I can praise my wife on her looks. There’s no reason for me to lie to her. And there’s no reason for her to ask me to lie to her.

    A woman on my Facebook page just said – based on this post – that I was a shallow LA guy who doesn’t love his own wife. Oh really?

    Is this the world we live in? Where a man who has an accurate assessment of his own limitations (and his wife’s) is accused of not loving his wife?

    Or does everyone here think that you’re a 10 in looks, intelligence, personality, humor, taste, athletic ability, career, etc. If so, on behalf of your future partner: that amount of lying becomes extremely tiresome extremely fast.

36. Ileana 36

    @Evan (15): Thanks for replying

    You really make some good points. What actually bothers me is the way the boyfriend said what he said (according to Diana).

    If it were the way you put it here – ‘She never said that her boyfriend insulted her or found her unattractive. She said that he didn’t think she was attractive as debatably the sexiest celebrity out there. To which I said, “So what?”’ – i would have said the exact same thing: so what.

    But how Diana puts it is somewhat different: ‘To him, I am “good looking” and “pretty” but, say, Angelina Jolie is “hot”, and “beautiful” and I am well… a regular person so I am not, how could I possibly be? He “likes me and finds me attractive”, but by no means am I nearly as good looking as a movie star, and I am crazy to be even comparing myself to them.’

    English is not my mother language, but from what i know, pretty and beautiful are somewhat in different leagues. Indeed, i accept the fact that i am a victim of what your linguistics prof explained, but i still think that Diana’s boyfriend was a bit blunt. Sure, the whole ‘problem’ is a bit childish, if you ask me. BUT: the way you said it, Evan, was elegant. The way he said it seemed – well, not so nice. It would have been totally fine if he said, you are beautiful too (not ‘pretty’ – i always think of little children when i hear that), but, well, not like Angelina. It also seems immature of him not to acknowledge the whole plastic surgery, make-up etc details. It is unfair to compare a regular person to a celebrity.

    Maybe it was a poor choice of words and i’m being picky, i dont know…

    Oh, and one more thing: I loved the way you brought the Colin Farrell story up. However, there is a slight difference. While i think that the DNA statement is was way off track, i do think that a really vast majority of women wants to look good and feel beautiful – heck, if it weren’t so, we wouldn’t be spending all that money on make-up and so on. What i am trying to say is that to men, this problem of not being Brad Pitt isnt that relevant to them.

    We have a saying in my country which goes like this: ‘Never tell a woman she’s ugly, nor a man that he’s incompetent’.
    Agreed, it is a bit out of date for our society right now, but it brings out something important, which i think has something to do with masculin/feminine energy. I assume that any aspiring businessman would feel a tad offended if his SO would tell him ‘Well, honey, you’re no Donald Trump, but you manage.’. I think this wouldn’t exactly tingle his ears. Please, correct me if I’m wrong.

    And one more thing: i know this might be a lot to ask, but what is your wife’s take on this issue

37. Heather 37

    Evan, you keep on missing the point. The point is this. We do not KNOW all the details in the conversation, we don’t know HOW he said that to her.

    I keep saying this and I will keep on saying it until I’m blue in the face. It is NOT what you SAY. It is HOW it is said. The way it came across to me was rather rude.

    I have not, nor will I say, that her question was a good one. But. Sometimes a little kindness goes a long way. And I ought to know, after all the verbal abuse I’ve gone through. I’ve had years of “You’re stupid. You’re lazy. There’s something wrong with you.” Now, anytime my boyfriend tells me I’m pretty or great (And no, I do not ask, because one good thing I learned from all the verbal abuse is to not give a damn what men think of me), I feel alot happier because of a small act of kindness. He told me I was pretty while in the hospital, high on morphine, limp greasy hair, no makeup, and glasses. Of COURSE I looked awful, but he performed an act of kindness.

    The guy didn’t have to lie to her but he didn’t have to be that rude, either. Goodness gracious.

38. Ileana 38

    Oh, just read your Post in 35. It somewhat answers my questions

    However i would like to add something. You say it is not THAT subjective. I think it is. Look, this year, Miranda Kerr was voted the best looking person of the year. Another magazine said Beyonce tops the list. There was an article claiming that a girl in Britain has the most symmetrical face and is, hence, the most beautiful women in the world. For years, Kate Moss was seen as the epitome of beauty (don’t ask me why). Not to mention, Cindy Crawford, Claudia Schiffer, Liz Hurley, Jessica Alba, Megan Fox etc. If we put all these women together , what will we get? Surely, a group of very good looking women.

    But what is the answer to ‘Who is the fairest of them all’? Now this is subjective.

39. Joe 39

    If Diana commented to her boyfriend that she thought he wasn’t as hot as [insert hot male celeb here], he wouldn’t give a f—, because he already knows he’s not as hot as [hot male celeb]. And he wouldn’t give the comment a second thought.

40. Selena 40

    The message in the tale of Snow White is that if one is the fairest in the land, they may not always remain so. And their vanity will prove to be their undoing.

    The undoing in this case could be a good relationship if the vanity isn’t held in check.

41. Rochelle 41

    I’m wondering how this convo started…was she asking to be compared to celebs and upset when he gave his honest opinion, or did he blurt out that AJ is hot, and beautiful while she is pretty and good looking? I mean it sounds like it’s more the former..I don’t understand asking for an opinion then getting mad because it’s not what you want to hear. anything like that or “do I look fat in these jeans” isn’t a good place to go with men lol.

    From a linguistic perspective, true “pretty” isn’t as strong as beautiful but I’ve seen men use it interchangeably. I don’t think they give much thought to the compliments as we women. I’ve had the same guys call me “cute” then also “beautfiul”. I already feel attractive so it’s nice to hear. I just take them as compliments on my looks and don’t feel less attractive just because he called me “cute” or “pretty” instead of “gorgeous” or “beautiful”. I just say thank you to it all. Besides physical attraction isn’t all that matters to guys …so if he finds a movie celeb more physically attractive big deal. I find a number of male movie celebs more physically attractive than guys i’ve dated..

42. Fiona 42

    Surely all a man (or woman for that matter) has to say in any situation like this is: “You may not be a movie star but you are beautiful/handsome to me” – no lies, end of discussion and everyone is happy.

43. Nadia 43

    I rely on the friends I have and the man I date to be honest with me. If not them, than who? If I asked my boyfriend if I was hotter than Angelina, I would expect him to laugh and say, “Sure,” with irony in his voice. But I also know he thinks I’m hot and that’s all that matters to me.

44. Nathan 44

    I have to agree with Heather. Truth without kindness isn’t helpful here. In fact, I don’t think that blunt, coldly stated facts are very useful in terms of maintaining the health of a relationship. Unless the situation is calling for tough love, which tends to be less often then we think. Above all though I want to be honest and also heard, and so considering how the other person might receive the truth is as import as not lying.

    At the same time Diana needs to take a good look at why she’s cares about this so much. Having dated a few women who were deeply insecure about their looks, I can say that sometimes, it doesn’t matter what or how you say something. You can be kind and say all the right things, and they’ll just want it reconfirmed again the next day, and the day after that. The idea that Diana is worried about being viewed like a movie star makes me think she’s got unrealistic standards, and that the boyfriend is likely being asked variations of this question regularly. Such a position is exhausting because you can never fill the other person’s well. They always need more to feel ok.

45. Helen 45

    Evan, it seems to me that you’re making a major assumption here that is not supported by the letter Diana wrote. You assume in several of your responses that SHE was the one asking the question of her boyfriend, and that his blunt words were a response to her. When I read Diana’s letter, I see no evidence of that. HE may have been the one to initiate the comments about how she’s not as hot as Angelina, in which case, her upset feelings would have been justified, in my opinion.

    It’s possible that you edited out that part of the letter. But if he was the initiator of such comments, then he is indeed the rude one. Some things don’t need to be said. No one likes comparisons of such a nature.

46. Aksauy 46

    #42 is by far the most sensible comment here so far. Honestly the original response strikes me as a bit aspi, no offense to anyone, and so does the OP’s bf. Response based on logic and unemotional comparison while clearly the problem is in the area of feelings and empathy.

47. soul 47

    When I look at myself, it seems obvious to me that we are no Angelina Jolies…. But who cares ?

    In my boyfriend’s eyes, I am definitely not the most beautiful woman of the world, not even the most beautiful woman he’s dated…and guess what ? IT IS TRUE! But who cares ?

    It seems totally paradoxal to me to state that beauty is not the most important thing in the world an to be offended when ur told that ur not THAT pretty…

48. Karl R 48

    Aksuay said: (#28)
    “everybody needs reassurance, men even more than women.”

    Really?

    I can’t remember how long it’s been since my fiancée complimented my appearance. It’s been a few months, if not longer.

    It’s nice when she does, but it’s not a big deal when she doesn’t.

    Aksuay said: (#28)
    “My money is on him just being clueless thou”

    I’ll agree with the boyfriend being clueless. Flattery is a great way to build brownie points.

    Years ago I read one of the “Men Are from Mars” books. One of the points the author made was that men and women keep score in a relationship differently. To give a simplistic example, if a man spends 8 hours at work earning money, and a woman spends 8 hours at home doing chores, the man thinks they’re equal (8 hours = 8 hours). The woman sees that she did 10 different chores, while the man did one thing (he went to work), so she did 10 things for him, while he only did one thing for her.

    This struck me as unfair, until the book pointed out that compliments count as something a man has done. Even if you have a situation where a man is full-time employed and the woman is a homemaker, he can “catch up” by giving enough compliments.

    It’s an easy solution. There’s very little effort involved.

    (I realize that I’ve given an oversimplified example, but it’s an easy way to describe this difference in perception.)

    Unsurprisingly, my fiancée has commented that I am “extremely generous” with my compliments.

    Heather said: (#37)
    “We do not KNOW all the details in the conversation, we don’t know HOW he said that to her.”
    “It is NOT what you SAY. It is HOW it is said.”

    Diane wasn’t asking Evan about how it was said. She was asking about what was said.

    Evan’s point is relevant to the question he was asked. Your point can only be addressed by speculating on events that none of us witnessed.

49. Evan Marc Katz 49

    @Helen – Even if he was rude – and we have no way of knowing – should this suggest that their relationship should be thrown away?

    Should this be a fight? In my world, this is a blip on the radar.

    I say something offensive, my wife is offended, it’s over. To me, the reader’s insecurity is a far bigger long-term problem than her boyfriend’s rudeness.

50. Fiona 50

    Men have insecurities too. My ex had moobs and mentioned a few times he hated them and couldn’t get rid of them no matter what he did. I picked up that he needed reassurance so I explained that I loved him, the moobs were part of him and therefore I loved the moobs. It never came up again and he was a lot less self-conscious than if I just agreed moobs were not his best feature. Just a thought.

51. Kathleen 51

    I still think thee woman’s original question was ridiculous and insecure. The boyfriend is set up unless he thinks on his feet and answers the diplomatic way Fiona suggested (42)

    My ex never asked if I thought he was hotter than Denzel.
    He just thought he was!!

    Insecurity is not hot but radiating confidence definitely is.

52. Desdenova 52

    Why do women ask men these stupid questions to begin with?

    Why do all of women here either takes the OP’s side or accept her as a valid source regarding her boyfriend’s rudeness? The OP does not strike me as an objective judge here in this regard.

    Why is “honesty” the most common trait women claim to desire in online dating profiles when the responses her would seem to indicate it is better for men to either be evasive or tell them what they want to here?

    And I’ll ask again, why do women ask men these stupid questions to begin with?

53. Androgynous 53

    I think there is a time and place for truth, and the brutal truth if it comes to that. The boyfriend’s response should vary according to the situation and would be very different in different circumstances. It all depends on whether the issue was raised in playful banter, or if Diana kept badgering him out of chronic insecurity, or if she was hell bent on spending her last penny on an aspiring modelling career.
    This is where I think poster Heather is being unrealistic and unreasonable in expecting nicely nicely softly softly attitudes from people at work. People at work have every right to speak to you bluntly and directly, as long as they are not being overly rude. I think most women understand this and can communicate as required in a work environment.

    The trap that men fall into is that they don’t or can’t read between the lines as to what a woman actually wants. A “typical” man would use logic and assume that a woman wants a direct answer to a direct question. A woman (in a relationship context) might ask a question for reassurance, confirmation, understanding or for a whole range of reasons, nothing which relates to wanting the truth. I think most women are perceptive enough to know the truth already, but either want reassurance, or an excuse to continue being in denial.
    Diana isn’t delusional enough to think she is in the same league as Angelina Jolie (though personally I don’t think AJ is at all attractive). She is wanting to feel totally absolutely and crazily desired by the man in her life. The issue is not that Diana’s boyfriend is blunt, but that is missed the fact that she wants to be worshiped.

54. JM 54

    From the letter, it sounds to me like the guy is probably exasperated/annoyed with the girlfriend. I can’t decide if she sounds shallow or insecure. Anyway, I imagine, again from the letter, that this woman spends a lot of time comparing herself to celebrities, asking him if he thinks she’s prettier than Megan Fox, a better figure than Hallie Berry, etc. And maybe he finally snapped. I know I would. I guess I could be wrong, but the woman sounds exhausting to me.

    If I was ridiculous enough to ask a boyfriend if he thought I was better looking to him than all of Hollywood combined, or if he asked me if I would choose Tom Brady over him, my comeback would be sweet and sexy, and equally as joking. We all (well, except for the woman who wrote this letter) know that we’re not as great looking as a celebrity and those of us with any sense know why, so this is immature and moronic.

55. Dawn 55

    I live by one rule…don’t ask if you don’t want the answer. Maybe I should say, if you can’t handle the answer.

    Only she knows if it’s a deal breaker. To compare one’s self to a model or actress is absurd…

    If you think you’re that hot…great. If you want him to think you’re that hot…pretend you know the answer.

    xoxo

56. Wow 56

    yes

57. Wow 57

    These girl is completely rediculous. Dont ask if you dont want the truth. I agree that men need to take lessons but you women are soooo needy.

58. Kathleen 58

    Wow and Desdenova
    Not all women are insecure and needy any more than all men can’t spell the most basic words

59. Laura S. 59

    If the OP needs validation from her boyfriend, then she needs to TELL him she needs validation when she goes fishing for compliments. If he can’t deliver after she requested it, then she needs to go shopping for a new boyfriend. It’s that easy.

    As a former hottie with measurements of 36-24-35, green eyes and long blonde hair thinking I was hot snot. A good look at some of the middle-aged former hotties gave me a peek at my potential future if I did not reform my attitude.

    At 54 years old, I’m still told I’m hot…..I say to myself, “Yeah,with my clothes on!” I hide the bags and circles under my eyes in the smile lines and I sure as heck won’t be seen in a string bikini ever again or even consider going braless in a sun dress.

    What’s important is charactor, personality and intellectual development, and an unshakable sense of self. Wearing a big smile and being comfortable in my own skin being who I am lets me pick and choose the men I date. I don’t choose men by their looks or their bank accounts.

    Standing naked before a mirror in the morning before coffee, make-up and smile, I’m a hideous 3. Thank God I know how to laugh at myself!

60. Stacey 60

    Jeeze this thread is making my eyes bleed. Why is this girl automatically assumed to be an average looking insecure person who torments her b/f with it? If they live in LA, where everybody is stunning, an equally probable scenario is that she’s a hottie and he’s a spoiled jaded typical LA guy who is taking it for granted and doesn’t even feel that he needs to tell his g/f she’s beautiful.

61. Brenda 61

    Amen, Laura S! I am a 55 year old woman who was formerly obsessed with her looks and thank goodness, I learned rather quickly that it was my character, personality and genuine compassion for others that was way more important in the scheme of things. It is a relief to be my age and to realize that living a good life is so much more than looks and being hotter than a celebrity.

62. Andrew 62

    The letter-writer is also indulging in “relationship fitness testing” where she asks a question out of insecurity and wants her man to stand up to that insecurity NOT with pretty and kind phrases that supplicate to her insecurities but actually prove that he has the backbone to stand up to her fitness testing.

63. sarahrahrah! 63

    @Happy Person #13:

    I’m pretty sure you’re as smart as Einstein.

    @Evan:

    “I wouldn’t WANT a girlfriend who says, “Oh, you’re the ‘biggest’ man I’ve ever been with.” It’s not true. It would make me feel uneasy. It would make me feel that she may be lying to me about other things. This seems so readily apparent to me. ”

    That statement is honest, awesome and hilarious all at the same time. That’s why I keep coming back!

    HOWEVER…

    There is a qualitative difference between someone calling you “pretty” vs. “hot” or “beautiful.” The latter terms connotate the generation of sexual desire. Just as men have a deep seated desired to feel useful to their partners, fertile women want to feel like they incite sexual desire in their partners. (Some women base most of their self-esteem on their ability to generate boners in guys, which is obviously unhealthy and unsustainable.) However, I have to think that there is some kind of biological imperative in women where they want their mate to show evidence of being extremely invested in their sexual coupling. I have no empirical proof for this yet, just an observation. It makes sense though since it is in a woman’s best interest if a man couples with her and remains sexual faithful to her.

64. Kathleen 64

    Laura and Brenda …Amen !Im in your club

    Come on Stacey … Dry your bleeding eyes …. Have you ever insisted that your guy tell you you’re hotter than his fav celebrity?? Do you have friends that do this ???
    If my ex ever said he was going to leave me for a certain actress Id laugh and tell him Im leaving him for her too!!!

    At 53 I attract more men than I ever did. This coincides with being the most confident and secure Ive ever been. It also helps that my vision and memory are declining LOL … but hey ,,, if you’re not always comparing yourself to other people you’re a happier person to be around

65. SnowdropExplodes 65

    To him, I am “good looking” and “pretty” but, say, Angelina Jolie is “hot”, and “beautiful”

    This makes the error of assuming that those are qualities that are measured on the same scale and that the first two ratings are lower than the second two. I think it’s a mistake to view them as quantitative terms rather than qualitative terms.

    If we say “Angelina is hot but Diana is pretty” the question to ask is not, “Is ‘hot’ higher than ‘pretty’?” but rather, “Does Diana’s boyfriend prefer the qualities of ‘hot’ or of ‘pretty’?” And the evidence is that boyfriend is with a woman whom he describes as “pretty”, not with a woman he describes as “hot”. Therefore, his preference is for “pretty” rather than “hot”. Therefore, he finds Diana more attractive overall than Angelina.

    I don’t know how much Diana has interpreted and extrapolated statements such as “by no means am I nearly as good looking as a movie star” and how much those statements were actually made by boyfriend (they certainly don’t seem to follow from the remarks given in quote marks).

    Then, of course, there’s the question of, “the best ‘package’ you can get in terms of looks-personality-values-etc” Think about it: Angelina Jolie is an object of admiration, a figure, a symbol. For the vast majority of people, including the ones who eagerly devour her every utterance in magazine and TV interviews, she is not a person with values or personality: she’s a marketed product with representations and symbols of certain character traits and values – that’s what it means to be a media figure. She doesn’t have a “package” at all, so it really is ridiculous and pointless to compare yourself with her: why not compare yourself to the Mona Lisa, the Venus de Milo, or any other incredibly beautiful but inanimate figure? I would hazard a guess that boyfriend probably didn’t mean “you are not as beautiful as her so don’t try to compare yourself”, but rather, “it is pointless and foolish to compare yourself to her, because she isn’t real”. Maybe I’m wrong about him saying that, but that’s what I would have been saying.

66. misha 66

    Here’s my opinion. This sounds like a gal who is used to get a certain amount of attention from the opposite sex. She’s not getting this type of validation from her current boyfriend and seems puzzled by it. I think the problem is not with the question, but being a year into the relationship. This guys is now used to her. He’s not going to fawn over her like men in her surrounding environment who probably have slightly to significantly less attractive significant others or who are single and looking.

    Most women want to be validated by the men they are with. We do want to fill cherished, special. Not every day but at least some of the time or enough to not feel like a potted plant as the years go by.

    Most of the women commentators are latching onto the seemingly blunt way he might have answered her. He, not realizing what she was really looking for, that you find me as attractive as all those other guys have in the recent past, answered her matter of factly and some would say bluntly.

    I’m not sure she wanted to be lied to per se but, like a lot of people have said sure angie is hot but i really love you, think you are just as sexy insert whatever here. Becuase that hopefully should be the truth. This girl is not auditioning for a modeling agency.

    And of course I’m no where near as empirically attractive as anglina jolie and never will be but that phrase can be turned into a backhanded stab if said with contempt and hostility. So how you say it does come into play and does matter.

    Have we solved hot pants problem yet? No and we probably won’t because in the dating game are still more valued for their appearance than any of the other things we can bring to the table, fun, companionship, helpmate, sex etc. It’s all how hot are you? So… yeah. women want to be complimented and not told, now way you are as hot as (insert celebrity chick du jour here)

    Not sure i’ve added value to this thread but i don’t disagree with Evan on this but nobody else has really answered her question.

67. Margo 67

    Evan, Amanda@15 wasn’t insulting you or your wife. She asked you a simple question in response to your blog post. And it was a valid question at that. She asked you how would you feel if your wife didn’t like your penis size as well as some of the other men she’s been with, and how you would feel if she told you that outright instead of sugar coating it for you. There is no reason for you to even think about censoring such a post.

68. April G 68

    Oh. My. God. This had me laughing SO hard. Forgive me ladies, cause I have a strong opinion on this one.

    That woman, is what I’ll lovingly term “a beating”. My guess is that the whole “I look like a movie star, don’t I” is actually just one variation of the same argument they have a lot – or, more acurately, she has by herself. My guess is he’s not arguing – she is. He’s just answering her questions. And honestly. (How dare he!?!)

    Evan, I love that you tackled this from men’s point of view. It’s funny to me that we all want a “real man” as long as he’ll talk to us like our girlfriends when we’re feeling insecure. The truth is, you’re rarely, if ever, going to be the “most beautiful, youngest, funniest, sweetest – or whatever other superlative” in the room. So realize you’re the best you that you can be in a package and let it go. And let your man be.

    Lastly, a really great comedian had a joke I loved about how women should never be insecure about their man wanting or ever thinking they could be with some hot celebrity over them. He said “Ladies, rest assured, your man is with you because he knows, without a doubt, you are indeed the best he can swing. Or he wouldn’t be with you!” LOL.

69. Happy Person 69

    It doesn’t sound like the OP asked him for his opinion of her looks as compared with those of celebrities. Not sure how that assumption made it into the thread. Sounds like the conversation evolved out of who knows what and he said something rude. It also sounds like she countered with something rude and he didn’t take too well to that either.

    Have to say that I’ve known lots of guys who make these rude kind of comments about women’s looks just as a matter of course, and it doesn’t make any difference how nice-looking the woman is. I know far fewer women who comment on men’s looks as a matter of course.

    For me it’s a red flag when a man makes these kind of comments. I won’t even have lunch with a male coworker if he’s one of those guys who sits there and talks about how such and such a film star looks fat, had bad plastic surgery, isn’t all that, etc. Neither will I hang around and listen to guys talk about how great-looking some woman is (I’m assuming that they want to be alone with their hand at that point).

    This kind of objectification puts a tremendous amount of pressure not only on the everyday girlfriends, coworkers, wives, female friends who aren’t in the public eye but also on women who are, who then go to great lengths to appear perfect (and end up looking freaky, starving themselves or getting bizarro lip injections or bleaching their hair to straw or go running around with their hoo-hahs hanging out).

    Ashley Judd had a good response to this kind of crap. She called it misogynistic. Google her op-ed about the recent media assault on her for having a “puffy face.”

70. Evan Marc Katz 70

    I’m certainly not writing a blog post about my penis, Margo. But, to Amanda’s question: I would never ask her how my penis compared to other men, because the knowledge doesn’t help me. She could either lie to make me feel great or tell the truth to make me feel insecure. So I don’t ask a question where I don’t want to know the answer.

    If she VOLUNTEERED for some reason that she was dissatisfied with my penis size, I’d be shocked because she’s seemed content for the past 5 years and it hasn’t gotten any worse. Thankfully, this has absolutely nothing to do with the original post – because the boyfriend didn’t come out and say, “You’re no Angelina Jolie. I’m highly dissatisfied with your looks”. He probably said, “Wow, Angie looks hot at the Oscars!” And the OP said, “I look as hot as her, don’t I?” And then he said, “Um, no. But you’re my girlfriend and I love you and while I think you’re very attractive, you don’t look as hot as Esquire’s sexiest woman of the year 2007.” At least that’s the way I’m picturing it.

    Anyone who’s attributing bad qualities to the wonderful boyfriend is projecting what you want him to be – so he can be wrong. Sorry. At worst, he’s slightly insensitive because he didn’t know that the only proper answer was a lie.

71. Karl S 71

    I’m sorry, but a lot of you people seem to be ignoring the actual WORDS that she WROTE.

    “while I am totally OK with the idea that somebody doesn’t find me the most beautiful woman on the planet, which a lot of people probably don’t, I am somehow not OK with that person being my boyfriend!”

    She wants her boyfriend to think she’s the most beautiful person on the PLANET. Think I’m misconstruing her words?

    “if he was truly into me, wouldn’t I be to him more beautiful than all Hollywood celebrities combined? ”

    It doesn’t matter which way their conversation went down, this girl’s expectations are ridiculous.

72. Stacey 72

    Kathleen#64: I sincerely hope that my boyfriend knows that such comments are completely rude and if he ever said anything remotely resembling what is being discussed here, he would’ve never lived it down with me. I do think that the OP’s guy is at best clueless, and at worst manipulative and malicious. I have seen guys like that, who’s game is to make their g/f feel line crap about herself. Furthermore, I think if a guy can’t bring himself to call his girl “beautiful”, e tier has deep rooted issues or is not into her. And, if he is just clueless, him drooling over a fake image while denying a compliment to a woman he supposedly loves is hardly, hardly a sign of maturity. Bt that’s just my opinion.

73. Jadafisk 73

    No one should ask “trick” questions like this. But this is what happens when women are repeatedly told that nothing really matters to men except their beauty, a subjective commodity of which the only consistent consensus is that it depreciates rapidly. If your confidence with the opposite gender is based on one aspect alone, a bit of delusion will be necessary to get by, because we aren’t in Lake Wobegon, where everyone gets to be above average. Men don’t get hung up on not being the best looking man alive to their S.O. because their value isn’t defined by their appearance as heavily as women. He can easily contend that he’s more intelligent, mature or interesting than a Hollywood guy, more of a total package and better suited to her, where according to the valued traits stated previously here, an average woman can take solace in being… warmer than Charlize Theron or more supportive than Megan Fox…um, yay for that? Hopefully, the fond memories we inspire of our S.Os. mothers will last a lifetime.

74. Paul Mawdsley 74

    Three things:

    1. Truth without empathy and kindness is hurtful AND painting a person into a corner where they have to choose between their empathy and caring for you, on the one hand, and their integrity, on the other, is vicious and uncaring.

    2. I learned a long time ago to look less at myself in the physical mirror and more at myself through the psychological mirror of those people I respect, trust and care about. When we lose our capacity for empathy, we lose our connection to others and our ability to feel and see ourselves through another’s eyes. We seek to elevate our missing sense worth through comparing and competing. It sounds to me like Diana is struggling with her empathy. She can’t feel her worth in herself. She can’t feel her worth through the eyes of her lover. And she can’t feel for the position she put her lover into. But she still needs to feel good about herself so she compares herself to who she sees as the highest standard and demands her lover judge her higher to give her the self-esteem she lost.

    3. My standard answer to feeling painted into this corner by my lover: “Don’t go there and don’t ask me to go there with you. It’s not fair. Let’s take some time to talk and actually see each other.” Diana was saying, in not the healthiest way, she needs to connect, she needs to feel seen and she needs to feel appreciated. Guys can actually learn to read through the fog of her misleading communication. And she can actually learn to be less foggy.

75. Stacey 75

    Karl (#71) you are missing the point. She says “to him”, as a woman I concur with the #1 response, which is it’s natural to want to be the mst desirable person for your man. I don’t know how guys can do it in their heads, to love a woman and at the same time objectify her so that they can “objectively” say that she’s not as hot as celebrity X. To me it sounds rather impossible. If I love a guy, he’s the hottest guy on the planet, period.

76. Tash 76

    It was a dumb question to ask & the boyfriends response was real & truthful. She needs to ask herself why she asked it in the 1st place. Is she insecure in her looks or as she compared to other men she has dated, is she not getting her required quota of validation/affection/sentiments from said boyfriend. Every person & couple is different (read 5 love languages). I have watched good men lose good women to another man her better managed the female ego. Is it an issue with herself esteem or with her emotional/validation needs not being met. I don’t think there was anything wrong with the guys answer, it’s just how men are, they don’t fluff, fluff, they just tell it like it is. She would have had a better response if perhaps she had asked a girlfriend the same answer. But she needs to look at why she asked him that, what was the driving force to prompt her to ask that.

77. Evan Marc Katz 77

    @Stacey #75 – You nailed why you’re having so much trouble accepting my answer with this line, “If I love a guy, he’s the hottest guy on the planet, period.”

    I don’t know one man who doesn’t find hundreds of women equally or more attractive than his wife/girlfriend.

    Your refusal to understand that men can be attracted to you, love you, be faithful to you, and still want to fuck somebody else signifies a lifetime of either a) disappointment when your boyfriend tells you the truth, or b) lies, from the man who tells you that you’re the hottest woman on the planet, period.

78. Some other Steve 78

    Evan @77:

    > I don’t know one man who doesn’t find hundreds of women
    > equally or more attractive than his wife/girlfriend.

    Even Brad Pitt?

79. Suheil 79

    I completely agree with Evan, and… it made me realize that when I ask people questions like “am I pretty?”, “do I look good?” “do I look fat?”… there is no good answer for that… ever, cause it doesn’t matter how people answer that, the reasons for such questions lie in my own insecurity. Are they responsible for my insecurities? It really has nothing to do with the other person and even if they disagree, they are entitled to their opinion, right? It doesn’t mean they hate me just as it doesn’t mean I hate myself if I recognize that I’m human and can and will have some shortcomings from time to time.

    And seeing people here attacking somebody on things like their marriage or penis size, that’s just really really sad to me.

80. Margo 80

    Reality check for men: If you love/like the woman you’re with, you don’t EVER tell her that she isn’t “hot”, but just “pretty”. If she asks you to compare her to another woman, just tell her you think the other woman is beautiful/pretty, but so is she! Do not rate her on a scale of 1-10.

    Evan…Your wife must be a much better woman than me, because if you were my husband, and you told me to my face that you thought I was a 7, or posted it anywhere, you’d be hearing it, buddy! It’s ok to tell your wife the truth, but it must be done sensitively. The rating scale ain’t it. Now, if she asks you if she has gained weight, it’s ok to tell the truth. The same if she doesn’t look good in a certain dress, shoes, etc. However, there is a difference between latter and a rating scale!

    Reality check for women: Do not ask your significant other if you’re the most beautiful woman in the world because he may not think so. However, (men take note), if you ask him if you’re beautiful, he should say “Yes”. Why? The reason for this is that beauty can be subjective as well as objective. And honestly, if a man doesn’t think a woman is beautiful to HIM, he really shouldn’t be with her. A person can be beautiful and attractive in many ways other than having a beautiful face and/or body.

    Evan, and male readers, you do NOT tell a woman that you “want to fuck another woman”. In that context, the word “want” would be very problematic to any woman in a relationship with a man she likes/loves. C’mon men, please tell me you all see that.

81. AnnieC 81

    I am some-what astounded at the lengths that some posters are going to, to justify this womans’ behaviour.

    It’s just a long list of excuses. The OP is ridiculous in her expectations.

    And to the person who was offended because an administrator asked you if you’d done your paperwork, what on earth is offensive about that? My manager asks me if I’ve done my paperwork(because they want to know) and I say “yes”, or “no but I’m working on it”.

    The problem here isn’t male honesty, it’s female hypersensitivity and expecting men to read and manage your emotional state 24/7. As grown women we manage our own emotional state. If you expect a man to jump through mental/emotional hoops just to figure out the EXACT response to give you, because otherwise he might hurt your feeeeeeelings, then don’t date until you stop expecting men to wrap you up in cotton wool.

    Harden up.

82. Birdlife 82

    When my boyfriend (in an insecure moment – men have them too!) asked me how good looking my ex was (ex constituted a tres traumatic relationship) I told him that 1) he had nothing to worry about and 2) my ex’s looks were the best thing about him! He laughed and got the point.

83. Ileana 83

    @Evan (70): ‘At worst, he’s slightly insensitive because he didn’t know that the only proper answer was a lie.’

    You are ignoring one small problem here. The only proper answer wasn’t a LIE. It was the truth plus a bit of reassurence. Other people posted variations of what that would have sounded like!

    Telling her: ‘Well, Angie is really hot/beautiful, but you’re hot/beutiful too – not like her, but in your own way’ sounds BETTER than something in the lines of ‘Oh, come on now, you’re pretty attractive but you can’t hold a candle to Angelina’s beauty’.

    Oh, and one more thing. Related to the ‘size’ – issue. Size can be meausred. There are special units for size. A is larger than B leaves no room for interpretation.
    But how on Earth can beauty be measured???

84. Kathy 84

    @ Evan
    “Your refusal to understand that men can be attracted to you, love you, be faithful to you, and still want to fuck somebody else signifies a lifetime of either a) disappointment when your boyfriend tells you the truth, or b) lies, from the man who tells you that you’re the hottest woman on the planet, period.”

    If you were my husband/boyfriend and I saw this thought printed on your blog you would be history in a blink of the eye. I had a similar fight with my boyfriend and it nearly ended our relationship. We were having a conversation in the car and he brought up a story that happened to him in the past where a friend was going to fix him up with a woman who he knew to be a lesbian but didn’t let on and to do it as a joke. My BF described meeting the woman (far too young for him and obviously unavailable, unbeknownst to him) as “the most beautiful woman, unbelievably hot…” I stopped him and said that I didn’t want to hear the story, but he continued and repeated the beautiful/hot part again. This led to a discussion about him hurting my feelings, that I don’t want to hear him speak that way about another woman and he refused to get it. Now in this situation, his story was unsolicited. Does he tell me all the time that I’m pretty? Constantly. Is he in every other way wonderful to me? Yes. Did I recently divorce a man who was constantly cheating on me? Yes. Did I want to hear my current BF speak of another woman as being hot and beautiful ? No. Do I want to think that my future husband wants to, as you say-and I quote “fuck somebody else”? NO. And if that is the way all men are. I’ll remain single.

85. Heather 85

    Androgynous:

    No, my expectations are not “unrealistic.” My expectations are based upon: “Do unto others, as you would have done unto you.”

    So based upon your logic, then I would have every right to talk to you however I wish, no matter if it were abusive, mean spirited, hateful, etc.

    But guess what. I won’t. Because I know what that is like. And how that hurts. And how that can devastate a person. And THAT is what I expect out of people.

    If you think that kindness and empathy and compassion are unrealistic, then I feel kind of sorry for you.

86. AnnieC 86

    @80

    You said

    “Your wife must be a much better woman than me, because if you were my husband, and you told me to my face that you thought I was a 7, or posted it anywhere, you’d be hearing it, buddy!”

    Yes. She is a better woman than you.

    There is a reason Evan is in a happy marriage and you are not. His wife is not like you. She know’s she’s a 7, evan prolly thinks higher, but he knows he’s biased and does not care. They love each other.

    What is this “IF YOU TOLD ME I”M A Seven” nonsense? I doubt you are even that. Wtf?

    Evan’s wife, is a strong independant woman by default. She likely has no need to prove her worth , she just loves her guy, and he loves her.

    Your whole “You’d hear about it buddy”..its just a threat.

    Men don’t want to deal with emotionally hystrical women who threaten retribution if the man does not comply with the womans wishes to assuage her need to the most beautiful woman in the world. Only the most insecure and ridiculous women believe that is what a man MUST DO TO GET ACCESS TO THE GOLDEN UTEROUS.

    A man wants a partner, not a self-righteous hypersensitive dictator.

87. Helen 87

    Evan 49: “@Helen – Even if he was rude – and we have no way of knowing – should this suggest that their relationship should be thrown away? Should this be a fight?”

    My opinion is that it certainly warrants a discussion. We don’t know enough of the details; again, we don’t even know that Diana asked a question, although that assumption was a large part of your original response as well as the responses of commenters here.

    I think that she is well within her rights to say that certain types of comments from him, such as the hotness, etc. of certain actresses, makes her uncomfortable. She should say it in a nondefensive way: “When you say X, I feel Y.” If he loves her, he will work to accommodate her. Let’s face it – EVERY person is sensitive in some ways that may not make sense to their spouse or SO. If you love them, you accommodate them, even if you consider them oversensitive. You don’t say, “Well, I’m right and you’re oversensitive and should just get over yourself.” Bad recipe for an LTR.

    On a side note: I have to agree with the commenters in wondering what the hype about Angelina is. Her hair is nice, but her face is strange and not very comfortable to look at. Just to name a few, I think Kate Middleton, Halle Berry, and Winona Ryder are far prettier. They’re actually easy on the eyes, as the saying goes.

88. Selena 88

    Re: #81

    ” I am some-what astounded at the lengths that some posters are going to, to justify this womans’ behaviour.”

    Apparently many women need to believe their partners think them the most beautiful woman on the planet, more than all the *hottest* celebrities combined!

    Bemusing. And a little sad.

89. AnnieC 89

    NB. I know my spelling above was terrible. Sorry for that

90. Mini 90

    This whole discussion is a little surreal. I can’t even imagine asking my guy if I’m the hottest woman on the planet. I think I’d burst out laughing.

    It must be tough for women who’ve been taught to see their beauty as their most important attribute. It’s a transient thing and subjective to boot (to some degree).

    Here’s the view from the other end of the scale. My ex was in the “honesty above all” camp (well, on this particular issue, at least…). He never told me I was beautiful or pretty. Never. Eventually I pointed this out, saying look, I’m not so delusional that I think I’m a cover model–but surely on some level, at some moments, I’m beautiful *to you*? (In the same way my not-exactly-George-Clooney ex was “handsome-to-me” because I loved him.) Even thus prompted, he couldn’t manage it; at best he’d choke out some compliment about how nice that color blouse was with my eyes, or how well my outfit worked together. (And I would then point out to him that he had complimented *my fashion sense*, not me. Eventually I gave up.)

    In contrast, my BF now routinely tells me I’m cute–which I take to mean mostly “endearing,” but clearly he finds me attractive enough. He tells me I have a beautiful smile and laugh. The other day he told me I was pretty–a word I never heard from my ex. I still know I’m no beauty queen–and I don’t lose any sleep over that–but with him I feel cute and sometimes pretty, and that’s nice. I’m also happy deep down to know that he cares more about my other qualities, the ones that won’t fade in twenty years, like being intelligent and kind and good-humored. It probably helps too that he doesn’t sit around telling me how hot other women are. He has the sense to keep that to himself, if he’s thinking about it at all.

    Women: don’t fixate on being the hottest thing on the planet. Guys: say nice things to your girlfriend/wife, and mean them.

91. Zaq 91

    @Kathy

    Then you will remain single !!

    Men are biologically programmed to spread their seed with as many viable fertile females as possible. They choose not to for the sake of their partner.

92. Goldie 92

    As classics say, “this thread is useless without pix”. LOL Seriously, though, I’ve been shaking my head in disbelief as I was reading this. Did the OP actually ask whether it’s a deal-breaker if her BF does not consider her the most beautiful woman on earth? Not as a figure of speech (as in “aw honey, you know you’re the most beautiful woman in the world to me”, where we both know he doesn’t seriously mean that I could win Mrs. Universe or get a Hollywood contract — all it means is, he likes the way I look), but honestly, objectively the most beautiful out of the 3.5 billion women on this planet? My first thought upon reading this was, what is this world coming to? How shallow and high-strung have we become, to worry about something like this in a relationship? I assume the OP is fairly young, otherwise she would already be facing the fact that there are women in this world 10, 15, 20 years her junior, that she can never beat in the looks department because of age difference alone. So a good solution for the OP would be to take some time and work on maturing and personal growth, until she is in fact ready to be in a relationship with another mature person. Right now I have major doubts that she is. Sad thing is, I also think she’s completely capable of finding a guy who will tell her that she’s the most beautiful woman on earth, and tell her that in a perfectly convincing way… but this wouldn’t be the kind of man anyone wants to be with. Who wants a relationship with a player and a con artist?

    @Selena #40, I thought of Snow White too!

93. Heather 93

    AnnieC wrote:

    I am some-what astounded at the lengths that some posters are going to, to justify this womans’ behaviour.

    It’s just a long list of excuses. The OP is ridiculous in her expectations.

    And to the person who was offended because an administrator asked you if you’d done your paperwork, what on earth is offensive about that? My manager asks me if I’ve done my paperwork(because they want to know) and I say “yes”, or “no but I’m working on it”.

    The problem here isn’t male honesty, it’s female hypersensitivity and expecting men to read and manage your emotional state 24/7. As grown women we manage our own emotional state. If you expect a man to jump through mental/emotional hoops just to figure out the EXACT response to give you, because otherwise he might hurt your feeeeeeelings, then don’t date until you stop expecting men to wrap you up in cotton wool.

    Harden up.

    Yikes. I can feel the chill in your words way over here! My goodness!

    I have every right to be offended if my administrator makes an offensive comment. And let me add that I “reality checked” this with men and women. All agreed that he was out of line for questioning my doing my job.

    The boyfriend should have stopped and thought before speaking, which is a problem that a lot of men seem to have. The question was ridiculous and I never once said that it was a good question. Men need to take a minute, stop, think, and process before just running off at the mouth. If he’d stopped to think, he might have given a truthful yet KIND answer. There are times to be blunt, but if a guy’s going to be blunt and nasty to his girlfriend, then she needs to get a move on.

    I think it’s a shame that people consider kindness and empathy some kind of weakness. Says alot about our society, and that is a very sad thing. I am proud of the fact that I do my best to practice empathy, kindness, and compassion, and that I expect that out of others. If folks want to think I’m unrealistic, oh well. That’s on them.

94. Soul 94

    @Kathy

    I am a woman, so I understand where you are coming from, and I too feel hurt sometimes…. but still, you cannot twist reality because the truth does not appeal to you… yes most men want to fuck other women than their lover… and they are not only interested in hot women… I had a boyfriend who once told me he would be curious to have sex with a dwarf!!!! loooool. And when he was younger, my current boyfriend once paid a huge amount of money to the fattest prostitute on earth because he wanted to know what it felt like (I was like: “really ???”). ahahaahahahaah. Well get over it: men are different human beings looool. Actually I think they are extremely funny…you just need to find the guys who’s is mature enough not to ACT on his urges when he is in a relationship. Temptation is acceptable, ACTING on temptation is unacceptable though looool

95. Aksauy 95

    Uhm, this is fascinating. I wonder what is the level of self esteem of a woman who’s ok with her bf telling her that “he wants to fuck other women”, or that “she’s a 7″, or negatively compares her with some other woman, celebrity or a mere mortal, AND remains her b/f after that. Seriously? Seriously?? I dont even know what is the right word for it, sad or pathetic. You just dont say things like that to people you love. Every woman deserves better than that. And if my guy told me he wanted to fuck other women, i would grant him that wish in a heartbeat. I don’t need a b/f like that

96. Laya 96

    Suheil # 79 and AnneC #81- I agree with what your posted.

    I think this post and the ensuing debate goes at the heart of why men and women have trouble getting along. And now I’m joining in on this silly conversation. If the guy is overall a good man, respectful, committed and loving, so the frig what if he said (AJolie is beautiful and hot) it a little insensitively. Move on! It goes to show you that many woman are so insecure that they can’t let go of silly crap. So much so that if Kathy #84 knew that her boyfriend wanted to “fuck somebody else,” she would choose to remain single for the rest of her life. That is so ridiculous. Clearly some women can’t live in reality. A lot of you women are so hypersensitive and insecure but then make it the man’s problem. Take some responsibility for your own issues. Go get help. And stop torturing a good man (assuming based on her post)!

97. Goldie 97

    @ #93

    Re: the paperwork question, I can think of about a dozen ways to ask it – “have you done your paperwork?”, “what’s the status on your paperwork?”, “do you need help with your paperwork?” But what does the wording matter when we all know that the actual meaning is the same in all these cases – “where’s the fricking paperwork, it’s the last day of the month, I should have it by now and I don’t”?

    I guess I’m a rare woman who likes to be told things the way they are. I probably have mild Aspergers (my son has it, and I assume he got it from me) and I’m easily confused by sugar-coating. That was one of the most difficult things about dating for me — adjusting to the fact that “I had fun” means “this date sucked, never contact me again”, “let’s be friends” means “get the hell out of my life”, the list goes on. I get it that people want to be polite, but there’s polite and there’s misleading.

    Back to the poor unfortunate boyfriend, where was he “blunt and nasty”? He said that he likes the OP and finds her attractive. This doesn’t sound too rude to me. On the contrary, it’s nice, accurate, something I’d be happy to hear from my own BF, or something I’d be happy to tell him while being completely honest. If “I like you and find you attractive” is perceived as rude by the rest of the world, please warn me now before I actually say that to him!

98. tuudie 98

    Well, this seems to be a perfect example of ‘be careful what you ask for’. If she is that insecure after a year with this fella than there are bigger issues I’d say.
    I stumbled onto this blog, and I’ve been lurking around to gain some insight into the world of dating/ men in the 21 st century. I am appreciating the education on the male perspective for sure.
    I was married for almost 20 years to a guy who I don’t think ever said to me that he thought I was beautiful or ‘hot’.
    A little sad, sure. I never asked him out right. I know that I am very pretty. I’m in excellent physical shape. I didn’t need his vaidation on this. Although it would have felt good. But I certainly wouldn’t expect to be declared the MOST beautiful woman blah blah blah… by a guy.
    If a guy felt compelled to express that to me, then I would graciously accept it as the hyperbole that it was, but I would not be so deluded as to be expecting a call from People Magazine.
    Funnily enough, as I approached the very first guy I met for a date after my marriage ended, his eyes did that cartoon bug out thing and a big shiteatin grin burst across his face. He didn’t have to say it. I didn’t have to ask.
    Like I said, I come here to get the male perspective. It is what it is. I don’t always have to like it, but forwarned is forarmed.
    Wishing men would think like women in trying to relate to us ain’t gonna make it so. Acceptance of this is key I think.

99. JB 99

    Random thoughts……………

    1.) Being that we have no idea how old the OP is let alone what she actually looks like. I will assume she’s very young, extremely immature, and insecure.

    2.) The definition of the word “hot” in describing one’s physical appearance is an opinion that can’t be measured (even in a man’s mind)and we all know what opinions are like…lol

    3.) I personally don’t find Angelina Jolie that attractive. That doesn’t mean I think she’s hideous. It’s my personal opinion and Brad can have her.

    4.) Most(not all) men are attracted to and would love to have sex with many different types of women whether they’re married or in a relationship. They just don’t act on it. WE’RE MEN ! I myself love watching amatuer adult video’s with natural normal flawed women of all ages, shapes & sizes instead of fake porn queens but that’s my taste. Oh and ladies sorry to break it to you, no matter what you look like some men like watching porn. Yes, maybe even yours.

    5.) If you care about someone why would you say anything in a manor that would intentionally make them feel bad if you know their weakness? Who needs that drama? The guy handled it wrong!

100. Aksauy 100

     Goldie #97, this debate about proper words and expectations really cracks me up. I too used to think that i was a bit aspie as i am not always sensitive/aware/care about other people’s feelings, but this thread makes me realize that i am far more normal than i suspected LOL. Yes “attractive” is a watered down version of beautiful/handsome, and pretty is good looking but not beautiful, and beautiful/handsome is well… what you’re supposed to feel about your SO if you are into them. “cute” better be reserved for describing an object or behavior, or may be little kids and bunnies. Men or women, you do not say into your SO face that you find somebody esle more attractive or desirable even if you do (for all male readers, if you want to turn tables picture your g/f talking about how big a 6’5″football player’s penis is, or what a nice life Donald Trump must be providing to his g/f compared to your meager 75k/year). Also, i dont understand why so many people took the letter wording literally. The way i read it, “more beautiful than all celebrities combined” i think is simply a hyperbole, a figure of speech to illustrate that a b/f is supposed to really, really be into his g/f, and not just find her “doable”. Surely we can’t add beauty of several people and compare the results to another person’s, how is this can even be taken literally? Truly fascinating reading!

101. Margo 101

     Annie #86: “You said “Your wife must be a much better woman than me, because if you were my husband, and you told me to my face that you thought I was a 7, or posted it anywhere, you’d be hearing it, buddy!”

     Yes. She is a better woman than you.

     There is a reason Evan is in a happy marriage and you are not. His wife is not like you. She know’s she’s a 7, evan prolly thinks higher, but he knows he’s biased and does not care. They love each other.

     What is this “IF YOU TOLD ME I”M A Seven” nonsense? I doubt you are even that. Wtf?

     Evan’s wife, is a strong independant woman by default. She likely has no need to prove her worth , she just loves her guy, and he loves her.

     Your whole “You’d hear about it buddy”..its just a threat.”

     Um, Wow!…

     Anyway…Personally, I don’t ask any of the men I’ve dated or my ex-husband how I look. I already know, so I don’t need to ask. Nor, do I compare myself to other beautiful women such as Angelina Jolie because they’re beautiful in their own way, and I’m beautiful in my own way. It’s as simple as that.

     Still, for the men who are asked these questions by the women they like/love, you’d do well to interject a little sensitivity into your answers.

     Oh, and Annie, my statement about Evan’s wife being better than I was rhetorical, sweetie. Have a nice day.

102. Julia 102

     If your man tells you your hot or pretty, take it as a compliment and stop comparing yourself to impossible beauties. Who in their right mind thinks they are as hot or hotter than woman who are famous for being hot. Sounds like a very insecure woman. When my man tells me I’m hot, I smile and leave it at that.

103. maria 103

     I think Evan’s answer was PERFECT! I think that women need to aspire to something MORE than looking like a “celebrity.” I think it is PATHETIC that the insecure, shallow, manipulative OP bases her entire life and worth on her looks, despite the fact that she has a great boyfriend! And finally, I think that it is TERRIFYING and sad that so many women agree with her!

104. Aksauy 104

     Julia #102: not all hot women are famous (for it or otherwise). Those hot women who are not famous, in their right mind think that they are just as hot as celebs. What a ridiculous comment.

105. Kathy 105

     At Layla #96

     You said
     ” if Kathy #84 knew that her boyfriend wanted to “fuck somebody else,” she would choose to remain single for the rest of her life. That is so ridiculous. Clearly some women can’t live in reality. ”

     Oh really??? What is so ridiculous? Marriage is ridiculous! I AM being realistic! There is no point to remarry! If you think marriage is connected commitment it is YOU, Layla, that is living in fantasyland. I choose to remain single and have a relationship with my boyfriend (single means unmarried does it not?). Marriage serves no purpose for me. I had my kids, I am supported by my ex, and love having the freedom to do whatever I damn please. If one day my boyfriend or I decided to act upon “impulses” there is no paper to legally bind us.
     Very realistic!

106. Karl R 106

     Aksuay said: (#95)
     “I wonder what is the level of self esteem of a woman who’s ok with her bf telling her that ‘he wants to fuck other women’, or that ‘she’s a 7′, or negatively compares her with some other woman, celebrity or a mere mortal, AND remains her b/f after that.”

     If a man is stating that without being solicited for his opinion, I’d say he’s being tactless. If a woman puts up with someone who is tactless, I would say she’s either thick-skinned or extremely patient.

     My fiancée has a healthy self-esteem. If she believes another woman is beautiful (more beautiful than her), she’ll mention that herself. Her self-worth isn’t based on being the most attractive woman in the room. And if I agree with her opinion, I don’t have to keep it to myself.

     My fiancée doesn’t base her self-esteem on her appearance. She doesn’t care that I don’t believe that she’s more attractive than my favorite actresses (or even a couple ex-girlfriends).

     Aksuay said: (#100)
     “if you want to turn tables picture your g/f talking about how big a 6’5″football player’s penis is, or what a nice life Donald Trump must be providing to his g/f compared to your meager 75k/year).”

     I’d be curious how my fiancée knew how well-endowed the football player was. (She knows a ex-pro football player, but they’ve never dated.)

     My fiancée has dated men who were wealthier than me, better endowed than me, better looking than me, taller than me, smarter than me, better educated than me, funnier than me….

     … and if she thought they were better boyfriends, she’d still be dating them, not me.

     She broke up with them for a reason. As a package deal, I am better than those men. I have nothing to feel insecure about.

107. Aksauy 107

     Karl #106 : this isnt the point. The point is that (i hope) your fiance does not in fact make comments about her ex’s size, money or whatever in the context of negatively comparing it to you, because she does not want to hurt your feelings. So you say to yourself “whats the big deal”, but if you actually experienced it, you’d be wondering: why would she say such a thing? Does it mean i dont’t satisfy her? Omg has she been faking it? Is she still mad i didnt pick up that check 2 weeks ago? Did she not like her bday present? Am i even ENOUGH for her?

     God! I feel like i am doing sensitivity training in a kindergarden!! Are these things not obvious to grown people?

108. Evan Marc Katz 108

     @Aksauy – What you don’t seem to get is that there’s a big difference between a man coming out and insulting his girlfriend and that girlfriend soliciting a compliment and not receiving it. If my wife volunteers for some reason that I have a small penis, that would be mean and unnecessary. But if I ask her if I’m the largest man she’s ever been with and she’s like, “Come on. Really?” then I’m pretty much asking for it. It seems to me that the OP was soliciting a comparison between her and various celebrities and was shocked to find out that while he found her attractive, he still thought other women were more attractive. And it seems to me that pretty much every guy will also feel that way. So the thing to learn here – as always – is not how to change men and make them stop being attracted to other women – but rather to accept the fact that he finds other women more attractive and appreciate the fact that he STILL chose you!

109. Goldie 109

     How did we get from comparing a woman (at her request) to Angelina Jolie to comparing her to one’s ex? Unless the OP’s boyfriend used to date Angelina, this makes no sense.

     Actually, speaking of exes, I’d be worried if a man told me that I am better than every one of his exes in every way. I’d wonder why his judgement is so awful; why, with this awful judgement, he picked me; and why is it that no decent woman before me has ever wanted anything to do with him. Did they know something I don’t? Is he bad news?

110. Aksauy 110

     Oh Evan, should this even matter if those words were solicited or volunteered? Its not even clear from the letter and while the scenario you gave in #70 looks very realistic, its not really a solicitation of an opinion as much as idle talk, is it? For a boyfriend to turn a TV dinner into a beauty contest between his g/f and AJ is just dumb, and all he ever had to say is “you’re beautiful” without comparing. Comparing is toxic.

     And to appreciate the fact that he “still chose her”? Is it not the same as being the “consolation prize” that the #1 called it? I think any woman with healthy self esteem wants to be chosen for her beauty and character, not despite her “flaws”

111. Selena 111

     And how about appreciating the fact your boyfriend loves you dearly DESPITE not thinking you are the most beautiful woman on the planet? Sheesh.

112. Evan Marc Katz 112

     Aksauy – YOU called it a consolation prize.

     Here in reality, however, men don’t look at their wives as consolation prizes.

     We might be attracted to Kim Kardashian. We wouldn’t want to marry her. Do you still not get it? Do you still not realize that EVERYONE who gets married is doing it in spite of his/her partner’s flaws? Are you really that delusional to think that your future partner thinks you’re perfect? And if you don’t think he thinks you’re perfect, you’re admitting that he’s marrying you in spite of your flaws.

     Either way, you’re fighting a losing battle with logic, based on your raw emotion about how men are “supposed” to feel. It’s just not true. The OPs boyfriend could quite possibly have been more tactful, but he has nothing to apologize for if he believes that other women are more attractive than his girlfriend.

113. Aksauy 113

     Yeah, sorry i really dont get it. Or more like, i do get it that this is how things work for some people, but to me its just an incredibly cold, jaded, calculated and unloving way of going through life, and not something that would work for me personally. I married my husband and he married me because we were deeply in love and all we wanted to do is to be together, not because each of us decided that the other one was the best possible combination of desired traits that we could swindle, as if we werr buying a new car and looking for a perfect trade off between color, price and fuel efficiency. Doesnt mean we thought we were perfect, its more like we didnt give it much of a thought at all – if i am in love why would i be even thinking about somebody else? Call me a naive romantic but thats just how things work for me.

114. Happy Person 114

     I like what Kathy says!!! I agree with Kathy!!!!

115. Goldie 115

     @ Aksauy #113:

     “I married my husband and he married me because we were deeply in love and all we wanted to do is to be together, not because each of us decided that the other one was the best possible combination of desired traits that we could swindle, as if we werr buying a new car and looking for a perfect trade off between color, price and fuel efficiency. Doesnt mean we thought we were perfect, its more like we didnt give it much of a thought at all …”

     Exactly! I take it that you don’t go around bugging each other asking for confirmation that you’re more beautiful than AJ, wealthier than Bill Gates or any such silliness. Neither do any of the couples I know. It’s just irrelevant in a mature relationship.

116. Karl R 116

     Aksuay said: (#107)
     “The point is that (i hope) your fiance does not in fact make comments about her ex’s size, money or whatever in the context of negatively comparing it to you,”

     When my fiancée mentioned that one ex was incredibly intelligent and hilariously funny, the context was her pointing out that he did have redeeming features.

     A couple of her ex-boyfriends were doctors, so I can infer they were wealthier and better educated than I am. I forget the context, but she was probably mentioning how she met them. (She works in a medical center.)

     Similarly, Diana’s conversation with her boyfriend occurred while they were watching TV (and presumably actresses). He did not just announce it with no context.

     A few months ago I was watching “The Lord of the Rings” with my fiancée. I mentioned that I think Cate Blanchett is drop-dead gorgeous. That’s the way a conversation (like the one between Diana and her boyfriend) starts. It’s not a negative comparison. It’s just an observation about the woman we’re looking at.

     Aksuay said: (#107)
     “but if you actually experienced it, you’d be wondering: why would she say such a thing? Does it mean i dont’t satisfy her?” [long string of wild speculation]

     When something like that occurs, I look at the person and say, “I’m afraid that I’m missing the point that you’re trying to make.”

     Aksuay said: (#107)
     “God! I feel like i am doing sensitivity training in a kindergarden!! Are these things not obvious to grown people?”

     It sounds more like oversensitivity training to me.

     Let me point out something that ought to be obvious to you:
     If you are looking for reasons to take offense at what someone says, you will find them. Even if I stay silent, you can get offended that I’m “refusing” to talk to you.

117. Margo 117

     Helen # On a side note: “I have to agree with the commenters in wondering what the hype about Angelina is. Her hair is nice, but her face is strange and not very comfortable to look at. Just to name a few, I think Kate Middleton, Halle Berry, and Winona Ryder are far prettier. They’re actually easy on the eyes, as the saying goes.”

     C’mon, Helen…Now, YOU need a reality check on this one. I’m as into men as a woman can get, but I can appreciate that Angelina Jolie is seriously beautiful.

     I’m beautiful too, but I wouldn’t dare lie to myself and say that Angelina Jolie is just so-so. Is she the most beautiful woman in the world? Who can say? This is a big planet, lol, so I’m sure that there are women somewhere that are just as beautiful. However, Ryder, Berry & Middleton are NOT those women-especially Ryder.

     In summary, stop lying to yourself about Jolie. It makes you look very insecure and bad to a man.

118. Aksauy 118

     Goldie, #115: indeed we do not. That said, i do not remember my husband ever characterizing another woman as “drop dead gorgeous” in my presense, and even when i point out that some girl is very good lookig he would just say “she’s ok”, but he never fails to compliment me. If i heard him say, or read him write on the internet that i am no hottie and on fact is a 7, i would be deeply distirbed and it would prompt me to seriously re-evaluate everything wr had, because to me he’s just the best. Its not about thinking someone is “perfect”, no one is, no matter how successful or good looking. Its about being into each other and loving each other not knowing why you love them (as opposed to havig a shopping list of qualities in your head). I wouldnt want it for myself any other way. Delusional? Whatever. Rather be delusional and happy than realistic and miserable.

119. Evan Marc Katz 119

     So you and the OP are in the same boat, Aksauy. You both find it deeply disturbing that your partner doesn’t put you on a pedestal – to the point of reevaluating your relationship.

     That’s your business and I sincerely hope it works out for you. But on behalf of a lot of other men – dating women like you is exhausting and most men will opt out.

     Men tend to demonstrate their love through their actions, their dedication and their loyalty – not through a constant stream of puffery designed to protect you from reality.

     That said, if you found a man who tells you that you’re the most beautiful woman in the world, a man who never looks at other women or checks out porn, a man who genuinely thinks you’re a perfect 10 in all categories, hold onto him for dear life. He may be the only one left.

120. Aksauy 120

     The point is to not not look at porn (he does and i dont mind) or not looking at other women (he obviously does and i again dont mind), or other silly things, its about doing it, and still thinking your partner is just …well above that all, above competition, not even comparable, not putting your partner on a scale and objectifying them. What is so horrible about that?

121. Margo 121

     Karl @ 116: “I mentioned that I think Cate Blanchett is drop-dead gorgeous.”

     Cate Blanchett? Really?? What’s wrong with you, Karl? Lol.

122. Evan Marc Katz 122

     You nailed it, Aksauy. My wife doesn’t see Angelina Jolie as competition so there IS no competition. Seems the OP is threatened by fantasy. So what exactly was your point? Sounds like your relationship is just like mine. Except your partner has to be very careful about what he says around you and my partner doesn’t.

123. Fiona 123

     No woman no matter how well adjusted wants to hear a man wittering on about how attractive other women are – totally unnecessary and I would advise any man just to cut that sort of talk out and women not to ask to ask about it. Women are very well aware how much men value looks so making her feel that you don’t value her looks that much (and that is how she will feel if you feel the need to tell her how attractive other women are without being asked) will not make her feel great. Men may well show affection by actions but women need to be complimented in words too (alhough most do not need to be lied to). Suggest men reading this take note because if you are constantly making a woman feel insecure about how she looks, other men may not be!

124. Katarina Phang 124

     Why don’t we ask the OP herself how the conversation unfolded in the first place?

     My suspicion is perhaps she was saying something like “I think all these celebs are actually not much different to attractive regular people like myself. They have a throng of stylists that make them look the way they are. I can look like that too if I have the same privilege.”

     And then the bf responded the way he did. Way too harsh and unnecessary.

     Bottom line is, if you can’t say something good about your partner in this context, then don’t say anything! Again, it’s idle talk. Not every bit of honesty needs to be spoken. What about kindness? What is at stake here? Being brutally honest or your partner being happy and adored and in the process she loves you more and treats you with more kindness as well? Isn’t it what we want?

     We all lie every now and then and white lies are often important in relationship. It’s not that she’s going to abuse that lie and run away with George Clooney, for example.

     And it’s actually not just a woman thing. My ex was sensitive to being compared or me mentioning other guys were hot in his presence too! Once I mentioned that Jillian Barberie’s husband was hot. I said it twice and he cut me off, “alright…alright. I don’t need to hear that.”

     And I wasn’t even comparing him to the dude!

     Another time was when his sister was telling me about a hot guy who worked in a pizza restaurant and I was responding to it and he heard it. He did the same thing.

     Again, there is no need to tell your spouse that other people are attractive (let alone more attractive) except perhaps in some limited circumstances. Anyone over 20 knows that there are other very attractive or more attractive people than us. It’s not the point though.

     I told my date not to talk about other women (unwarranted) as well. I don’t want to hear it. And I will honor the same treatment upon him as well.

     Often it’s hard enough for a guy to be complimentary to his woman (like my ex) and it’s bad enough not being complimentary enough, don’t make it worse by actually wittingly or unwittingly demeaning her. Women thrive through compliments (we release oxytocin when we are being complimented especially by our men). Actually both men and women thrive on them, but especially women. That’s how we feel cherished and guys often don’t understand this.

     When we are happy and secure, we can give you what you need more readily (not nagging, not needy, not being a bitch, give you the space you need, etc).

     And it’s not an exaggeration that for most women, when we’re in love with you, you really are the best man in the world. You really *ARE* the most attractive man on earth, that’s why we often don’t understand why you don’t think the same way and we get hurt that you actually view others as more attractive (and for us attractive doesn’t mean only physical attraction but overall attractiveness).

     And of course we know that we really are not the most gorgeous woman on earth. But then again, why state the obvious? If we ever ask you that (again, I will never do that unless in jest), just respond lightly, “Of course, dear.”

     We will perhaps just give you a big grin and kiss you for being sweet and there is no silly argument ensue. Is it a lie? Hell yeah but who cares????

125. Katarina Phang 125

     And you know what, I actually loved it that my husband was jealous and feeling a bit insecure. That means he loved me and needed my love, admiration and adoration. He wanted me to think the world of him and women want that from their men too, without exception. It’s extremely important that we both feel that way.

     That was one of the few tender moments that actually was quite reassuring for me.

     So choose your word wisely, because they’re going to make or break your relationship in the long run.

126. Karl S 126

     It seems to me that she initiated the conversation due to a number of different things. For one, if the boyfriend had started it, you’d think she would have made a point of highlighting that fact in the letter as one of her grievances, with words to the effect of “and then out of the blue!” or “for no reason!”. In fact, I’d go so far as to say the entire focus of the letter would have been different.

     Secondly, she has offered her measurements to Evin, discussed differences over 1 inch and size distribution between hips and frame, and how she assumed she was in the same league as a celebrities. It just seems like she thinks about this issue a lot.

     In short, her entire letter asks “can he love me if I’m not the hottest?” rather than “why do men hurt my self esteem for no reason!”

127. Karl S 127

     And nowhere in the letter does she talk about tact or the BF just saying what she’d like to hear for her sake. She’s concerned with him *thinking* she’s the be-all-and-end-all beauty, not whether he’s an adroit diplomatist. Making white lies for your partner does not address the issue here.

128. Margo 128

     I had this sexual thing going with a man last year who, when I had first met him, had been an 8. He had been a bit of a player too. I had wanted to have sex with him because it was well known that he had been with a lot of women, and I wanted to know for myself if he was good in bed, and to experience that as well. I also wanted to have sex with a European.

     Well, he was ok in bed. It wasn’t as good as I thought it was going to be, and it was more than a one-time thing. He was a selfish lover: he didn’t like to take his time with oral sex, although he LOVED receiving it. In addition, he wanted a baby, and I wasn’t going to give him one. He was also losing in life, and had mental problems, so he became less and less attractive as a potential permanent prospect anyway.

     When we got together, he had gone down to a 7. He remarked one day to me that he needed to lose weight. I agreed with him, I wasn’t going to lie to him since he asked (he was starting to look like crap) but I did say it nicely. In any event, he became insecure. On another occasion, I saw a hot guy on tv, remarked on it, and he became insecure over that too. He didn’t say anything, but became visibly uncomfortable.

     Point is, some people are insecure anyway. In any event, it’s better to be sensitive concerning what you say to people that you care about on some level.

129. Aksauy 129

     ^^^ what Katarina Phang said. That.

130. Aksauy 130

     Evan, my relationship is different in that like you said my husband has me “on the pedestal”. ( That is actually an interesting choice of words and made me remember that he actually made a funny picture using photoshop of him putting me on a “pedestal” made of greek ruins from our vacation, as a joke). You dont seem to have your wife there. If she’s ok with it, it means that this is just not one of her needs. But it is a valid need in and of itself for some people and if the OP has it, it does not look like it will be fulfilled in her relationship. Which, if she decides to stay, is a ticking bomb, until a man comes along who will pick up on that and give her the admiration that she craves and is starved off. That will be the end of their relationahip. Again, hers is a valid need. I can relate to it as i have that need too. If an otherwise “wonderful” guy approached me with the message that even though i am not all that, he likes me “as a package”, i would thank him and move along. I dont need emotional charity.

131. Laya 131

     I have to disagree that when women are in love with their man that they think he is the most handsome, sexy etc.. man on earth. My girlfriends, sisters and I have had many of conversations about the men they have married. I am fortunate to say all of them are happily married. Some said that they weren’t attracted to them initially, the chemistry was lukewarm or they were attracted to their personality. My friends were smart to pick other qualities beside burning chemistry. My friends were able to evaluate their then boyfriends with a level of objectivity.

     My one friend just told me the other day that she married her husband not because she was so in love but because she knew he was a good man. She said that she knew she was taking a chance. She said that the love she has for him now is nothing compared to when they first married. It is much deeper.

     I am a woman with a high libido…my current boyfriend and boyfriends in the past have said I had the highest libido of any woman they have known. I sometimes identify more with men than women honestly. I have a boyfriend, whom I am in love with but don’t think objectively he is the most handsome or sexiest man alive. In fact he is not really my type with regards to looks. However, I am still deeply attracted to him and we have a fabulous sex life. That being said, I still admire attractive men, catch myself staring at them walking down the street, and will laugh with girlfriends about a man’s anatomy or pecs/biceps etc… It goes both ways. I wouldn’t doubt if I have accidentally glanced at an attractive man in front of my boyfriend. If he noticed, he has never said anything. He is not insecure. While I don’t think most women are like me, I do think it has something to do with my libido. Men are probably similar with theirs. It’s nothing personal, really.

132. Ruby 132

     My guy and I (both attractive, both movie buffs) have had some fun conversations about actors (both male and female), that we find hot, some of whom are long deceased. Do we actually compare each other to these people? Uh, no. We avoid that particular can of worms, thank you.

     I think the OP is worried that her BF isn’t sufficiently attracted to her. Is she insecure? Perhaps. Is he a clueless clod who doesn’t complement her appearance enough? Perhaps. But she’s worried that he’s not sufficiently attracted to her, and that he may lose interest over the long haul. That’s the gist of it, in a nutshell.

133. Katarina Phang 133

     Laya, I didn’t say most handsome/sexy but most attractive and that means overall, not just physical. I will feel slighted too if my man says there are other women who are far more attractive than me. Attractive is much more encompassing than physical beauty. You don’t say things like that to someone you love or in relationship with. It’s about respect too. If a man says that to me, hell, why would I want to be your second or third best? Move on then. Let me find someone who thinks I’m his best because I don’t want to think any less of him either.

134. Margo 134

     I just reread the OP’s letter to Evan, and yes, this woman’s expectations are unrealistic. Her boyfriend doesn’t have to view her as the most beautiful woman in the world for them to have a good, loving relationship. My only problem with her boyfriend was that he was too blunt.

135. crau-crau 135

     god, this has got to be the most depressing post/thread on the planet. the subject matter is not even the reason why, it’s just that Evan expects that it is this woman’s job to understand where her boyfriend is coming from, and NOT vice versa. I understand that this site is about trying to understand the male perspective, but how come there’s no give in the other direction? The gist of this whole article is, “Women, suck it up, ’cause this is how men are.” What if we said the opposite? Well. Obviously Evan wouldn’t like that. Because Men Tell It How It is, Women, Get Used To It. Or something.
     Here’s the thing: part of being in a relationship is sometimes telling your sig. other what they need to hear at the time. Yeah. Gross, right? Lying. HOWEVER. We’re creatures, not machines, and sometimes we don’t need COLD HARD FACTS.
     We need the thing that’s going to get us through the night, and to not understand that is the opposite of empathy. You’re not always going to have a perfect girlfriend who RADIATES motherfucking confidence. Sometimes she needs to be built up, and if you tell her that TO YOU, IN YOUR EYES, she is hotter than A. Jolie, is a child dying somewhere because you fudged? No. Not so. But your girlfriend will snuggle up to you and understand that you think she’s gorgeous, and maybe next time Angelina Jolie comes onscren she won’t have to ask. Because she knows that you think she is beautiful.
     But, it seems like we’re supposed to applaud this dude for being Super Truth Machine and evaluating his girlfriend on a numbers system, when part of this whole girlfriend package he has is a girl who occasionally needs some reassurance. My boyfriend is in the creative arts, and sometimes he sends me a project he’s working on, wanting a critique. Do you know what I do? I tell him some glowing things about it (which are true) and then I say “Maybe this part could use some work.” Which is also true. I don’t say “This is a 5 out of 10,” and expect his feelings to MAGICALLY not be hurt. (And I know they would be, even though he’s A Guy.) What’s wrong with reassuring her? Like, seriously, is it not ok to be nice to each other? For the sake of niceness, because we love each other?

136. Evan Marc Katz 136

     Okay, Crau Crau, so when your boyfriend asks you if he’s smarter than Bill Gates, cuter than Matthew McConaghey, and more talented than DaVinci, you go and tell him that.

     Good relationships are built on sincere compliments, unconditional love and support, and frequent acts of kindness. I say this as a relationship coach and part of a very healthy marriage.

     If you’ve read closely, I’m not saying that the boyfriend couldn’t potentially be more sensitive. I’m saying that the OPs overreaction to this minor issue is far more concerning than anything the boyfriend “might” have said.

     Not quite sure why that’s so hard to concede. If you want to go to a blog where women talk about when men are supposed to do, there’s about a billion of them out there. Have at it. I’m only telling you that there are a LOT of good men who find conversations like the above one – “Am I as hot as Angelina?” – to be a nonsensical exhausting waste of time and energy.

     If you don’t believe me, look at the comments from men on here. This blog isn’t frequented by meatheads, but the kind of men you’d be lucky to marry. You’d be well-advised to see the nuance in my position, instead of blindly defending a clearly hypersensitive woman.

137. Cat5 137

     Evan,

     You have been getting beaten up a lot lately on your blog…and frankly, I don’t understand why. Your advice, as usual, has been sound and accurate. At times I also doubted some of the things you suggested and might have even said so in a comment or two…perhaps even in a confrontational manner.

     Despite my doubts, I am always willing to learn, so I went ahead and tried your suggestions. What did I have to lose? Nothing. What did I have to gain? A healthy, loving relationship. I’ve been with my boyfriend now for a year-and a-half.

     It’s simple: If a person is fishing for compliments, he/she shouldn’t be surprised if all he/she reels in…is an empty hook.

     If my boyfriend told me I was hotter than Angelina Jolie…no wait — she’s gotten hideously skinny…let’s say Angie Harmon…I’d laugh at him and tell him he was full of shit!

     I don’t know if I find this conversation more ridiculous or the one under “Why are women more negative about dating than men?” It had me feeling insulted for the many kind, loving and good men I know.

     Get out of your own way ladies. Evan is giving you good advice. Be open and give it a try. You don’t have anything to lose, and hopefully you will gain good man. I did.

138. Margo 138

     “…but the kind of men you’d be lucky to marry”.

     I agree with your latest post, but not this, Evan. Definitely not this…

139. Evan Marc Katz 139

     Thanks for the token kind word, Cat5. That’s what I find really amazing. I’ve devoted my entire life to helping women understand and connect with men… I am surrounded by women every day and talk on the phone with them each afternoon… I have over a thousand client testimonials from people whose lives have changed thanks to my writing… and yet I have to consistently defend against this inane talk that I’m a misogynist who wants women to suffer at the hands of the patriarchy. Give it a rest, y’all.

     Unlike all the women who blame men for all the ills in the world, I don’t come remotely close to blaming women for everything. I’ve consistently told women to dump men who don’t call, commit, treat them well, or have the same long-term goals and values. My book “Why He Disappeared” is all about how to get over bad men in an instant and find the good ones.

     What any of my detractors seem to have missed is that I’m only going to post questions where the person asking the question has something to learn.

     Can you imagine how incredibly boring this blog would be if every post was, “You’re right. He’s wrong!”

     I intentionally choose questions that provide a different perspective than the OP has on her own. I answer those questions thoughtfully, armed with more dating and coaching experience than anyone reading this. Now it doesn’t mean that you don’t have the right to disagree, to point out something I haven’t considered, or to conclude that you don’t like my POV and want to find a blog you’d rather frequent.

     But to continually have my integrity impugned when I am an ethical person, devoted husband and obvious friend to women? Yeah, that’s pretty annoying.

     Feel free to check out the rules of the blog and about the blog for more information about the code of conduct here.

     But there will be no more insulting me, my wife, my penis, my coaching skills, or anything else. Some readers have figured out how to have these kinds of discussions, they know who they are, and I value them tremendously. The rest of you? If you’re not gonna say anything nice, you’re not gonna buy anything from me, and you’re not gonna be my friend, just be gone.

     I sincerely hope that you eventually see that your anger at men like me is highly misplaced.

     It’s my job to teach you how (many) men think. It’s not your job to teach me how women think – after listening to women for 4 hours a day for the past 9 years, I have a pretty sound understanding. The real room for growth is from you – not from me, and not from “men” (whom you can’t change, no matter how loudly you protest).

     Want to be understood as a woman? Start with understanding good, solid, honest men like me instead of angrily invalidating our point of view.

     I think you’ll find that you enjoy men a lot more when you start appreciating our good qualities instead of throwing a fit when we treat you like human beings instead of mythically perfect creatures who need to be shielded from what we’re really thinking.

     When you allow a man to be himself with you, you get the best of him.

     When you tell him that everything he does, says, or thinks offends you, you get guys who pull away or guys who lie to keep the peace. You’ve seen it 100 times yourself.

     The choice is yours.

     Good night and good luck.

140. Lucy 140

     If my guy told me I was pretty, but that he didn’t think I was beautiful, I would dump that motherF-R pronto. PRONTO! Out the door! I am incensed by comments suggesting that the OP is being ridiculous.

     I know I make good money. I see it in my paycheck. I know I am really smart. It’s measured our whole lives. I know I don’t have an amazing body, but I am generally happy with it. I know I am really pretty! I see it in the mirror. I don’t KNOW that I am BEAUTIFUL.

     Being beautiful to my lover is really my main priority. And I suck at it?

     The letter-writer clearly thinks that she has an amazing body, but her boyfriend thinks it is just sort of OK.

     If I had a body with the letter-writer’s proportions, it wouldn’t be unreasonable to think that I could conceivably compare my figure to celebrity figures. It’s not even a ridiculous argument. I bet she didn’t even ask him. She was probably just like “I’m as hot as she is” and then was super surprised at the response.

     On the rest of it: I know other men look at me, and I like it, but it doesn’t really matter in terms of my self-perception because I do not know them. It matters what my BOYFRIEND thinks. If men on the street pay more attention to my general attractiveness than my lover, there’s a problem.

     I know that men think other women are hot. I kind of like it. It proves that they are really virile and have a lot of sexual desire – and choose me! I’m the winner! I am the most beautiful girl in the world! I’m the only one that they will ever love! I’m the only one who knows their heart. I love that Rihanna song.

     sarahrahrah! #13 is absolutely right. There is a huge difference between pretty and beautiful. –Good-looking, cute, and pretty? I know that about myself. Even platonic friends can see that stuff! I don’t need a boy to tell me I’m pretty. –Attractive and sexually desirable, hot and beautiful and sexy? I can’t judge that stuff for myself! Only my lover can do that. It is up to him.

     I absolutely think my lover is the most beautiful man in the world. ABSOLUTELY the hottest. Did I think that when I first met him? No way! I think I audibly snorted when a guy friend said he could see me falling for this guy. Is Brad Pitt cuter than him? I guess, but who cares? Brad is not more beautiful than him. He’s not sexier than him. My guy is the sexiest in the world. FACT!

     This girl’s douchebag boyfriend is a tool, and she can find someone who thinks she is beautiful.

141. AllenB 141

     Actually, until now I always thought pretty and beautiful were nearly synonymous yet 2-3 posters on the thread have said otherwise like “of course everyone knows they are different.” Any other guys believe this too? (Where does gorgeous fit into the spectrum?) It is a small thing to use beautiful instead of pretty so I will from now on, but don’t assume every man understands word choice nuances the same way many women seem to.

142. crau-crau 142

     Y’know what’s funny to me… that you can’t concede that you may have been slightly wrong on a point, or spoken too quickly. You counter with saying that you KNOW women. Because you’ve talked to them so much. For hours a day! You’re saying this… to women. It’s very interesting to me that say you’ll cut off comments if they’re not “your friends” who agree with you. How come you can’t extend that privilege, that power of cutting-off, to the chick whose boyfriend can’t seem to say something nice?

     I’ve read the OP’s post again and never once does she say she asked her boyfriend for praise. The details are iffy, but it could be that he simply offered up the helpful info that she’s not as beautiful as [insert name of movie star here]. You don’t think that’s, um, kinda cruel? Especially for someone who seems to need to be built up about her looks, a little?

     Is it terrible to need praise or reassurance? Maybe it would have been more constructive to advise the OP to let her boyfriend know what she needs? That she needs him to sometimes let her know that he thinks she’s beautiful? NOT objectively… subjectively. And if he can’t do that… then both their needs aren’t being met?

     Maybe the OP is insecure and needy. But a lot of us are. And it’s just as important for men to understand what we need – and I need a man who can understand that. “That’s just how dudes are” isn’t good enough anymore. That’s not really relationship coaching – it’s man-psyche coaching, and being in a relationship is a two-way street.

143. Evan Marc Katz 143

     Crau – I edited out your insults and kept the meat of your comment. And you’re right. It might have been more constructive to tell the OP a more effective way to communicate with her boyfriend, instead of insulting him and threatening to dump him over an inane celebrity comparison. But that’s not what I did. I told her something that was equally valid which is something you probably wouldn’t have considered: there’s absolutely nothing wrong with a man who finds other women more attractive. Most happily married men can find other women physically attractive and have absolutely no illusions that he’d be happier if he were with them. This is a point worth understanding, but it seems to be one that you want to sweep under the rug to justify how insensitive the OP’s boyfriend MAY have been.

     And since this is a blog teaching women to understand men, I feel that it’s my responsibility to do just that. A one page blog post is not a comprehensive answer to solving all communication issues, needless to say. So to expect me to uncover every possible nuance of what happened is simply unrealistic. I chose to do what I do best – educating women on the one thing that they can EASILY change – how to understand and accept men… as opposed to doing what YOU want me to do, which is teaching MEN to become better boyfriends.

     If HE came to me with HIS version of the dilemma, I might have told him how he could have been more sensitive to his girlfriend. That’s what HE could have learned. Alas, SHE wrote to me, so I told her how she could choose to be LESS sensitive to minor perceived slights like this. My fix is much easier and more effective, for what it’s worth. And since relationships are a two-way street, as you kindly pointed out, the easiest thing for her to do is start with the woman in the mirror, instead of flying off the handle as she seems to have done.

144. Paul Mawdsley 144

     I find this thread very interesting, not the battling but the dynamics that underlies it.

     Evan and Aksauy, have you considered you both may be right on this? I’m not being wishy-washy here. Rather than contradictory, your views may be paradoxical perspectives of one truth. You are both becoming the symbols of two very entrenched and seemingly contradictory perspectives, largely divided along gender lines: Evan taking the part of objectively detached realist and Aksauy taking the part of empathically connected idealist. These are each view points we all can have inside us at any given moment.

     Maybe entrenched battling is not the answer. Maybe a dialectical approach, where each takes time to consider stepping into the other’s perspective for a moment, can raise awareness and understanding, and see through the fog.

     Evan, have you ever looked at your wife with eyes that see her as being so completely right for you in so many ways, filling so many of your needs and touching you so deeply that you can’t imagine feeling that way with anyone else? And then can you not shift back to seeing her from a frame of reference that sees only her outsides, where she can be measured by an outside standard as not being as attractive as other women you have known.

     Aksauy, have you ever looked at your husband with a sober mind, not intoxicated by the intimate spaces you create together, and reflected on how he is not perfect by any outside standard; that he is outwardly less attractive than some other men you have known? And then can you not shift back to the perspective where you see all he means to you and you can’t imagine feeling this way about anyone else?

     We have the ability to shift perspectives. This makes them paradoxical not contradictory. The same reality seen through different lenses in different contexts will produce different conclusions. There is no point battling between such paradoxes. There will be no winner. There will only be a power game where truth is the loser. The wiser strategy is to find the underlying truth that connects the different perspectives and different conclusions. This is what I tried to do in my earlier post…but the battle has waged on.

     I think the mistake you are both making is in entrenching your positions and excluding the other’s perspective. It leaves no room to find common ground and a shared perspective.

     You can see your lover as both a 7 and the best thing the universe has ever given you…which I think was Evan’s earlier point. It seems clear that Diana didn’t get this. She had a messed up frame of reference and skewed emotional space when she painted her bf into a shitty corner. Not understanding the emotional space she was coming from, not exploring what her frame of reference was and shifting to a defensive ultra objective space to respond was his mistake. It should be easy to sympathize. This whole thread has been all about people making the same mistakes they did.

145. Evan Marc Katz 145

     A wonderful and perfectly valid point, Paul. Thank you for bringing a useful and measured maturity to the proceedings. However, if you’ve read this ridiculously long stream of comments, I’ve frequently validated that the boyfriend could have acted with more tact and sensitivity if he had to do it all over again. It still doesn’t make him a bad person or boyfriend, however. The OP can search far and wide for a man who always says the right thing and never offends her, but that’s gonna be a really, really long search. Better to let stuff like this roll off your back if the rest of the relationship is solid (which the OP says it is). So while I’ve conceded that the boyfriend could have done a better job, I haven’t quite heard the Aksauys, Lucys and Craus admit that just MAYBE this woman was being a bit insecure in her desire to be hotter than every celebrity combined, a bit melodramatic in her reaction to the realization that she’s not, and a bit hypersensitive in her rush to insult her boyfriend’s looks and consider dumping him over this frivolous fight.

     Your point is well taken – and it can be made about almost any argument with two valid points of view. Too bad some of our readers have yet to concede any of the points I made above.

     Your last line really resonates: this whole thread has been about people who refuse to recognize the validity of the other side. As I said in my post itself: this is a microcosm of all misunderstandings in all relationships. The best thing I ever did was find a woman who doesn’t police me or threaten me for my thoughts or occasional lapses in judgment. She sees the big picture instead of reacting to every verbal misstep. We have a very peaceful relationship because of it.

     It’s a lot easier – and more productive – to let tiny things roll off your back (if you love him and he loves you) than it is to get him to stop thinking thoughts or speaking his mind.

146. Ruby 146

     We live in a culture in which women and their looks are continually scrutinized, much more so than men’s looks are. Advertisers and the media make billions off of telling us that we’re not attractive enough, and that we need to look younger, thinner, have different hair color, larger breasts, ad nauseum. So it’s not that surprising to me that many women on this thread have come across sounding insecure, when we’re constantly encouraged to feel that the way we look isn’t good enough. If you’re a woman who feels secure and confident about her looks, consider yourself lucky. If you’re a man who thinks these women are ridiculous, then realize that you are not bombarded with magazine articles and shows on plastic surgery, advertising for the multi-billion dollar cosmetics industry, and images of models and actresses who are the beneficiaries of all that, and create an impossible-to-live-up-to standard of beauty, the same way that we women are.

147. Katarina Phang 147

     Evan has a point that women also need to learn that fishing for compliments is very annoying for most guys. It reeks insecurity and dampens their attraction. Men are generally not sensitive to our emotional needs for reassurance. Unlike us, we are happy to give it to them ’cause we are a natural when it comes to relating and empathizing. The more we demand it, the less generous they become. I have learnt the hard way.

     The younger guy I’m dating is very blunt too so I have learnt not to ask him questions the answer of which I don’t want to hear or may not make me feel good. He even has the tendency to joke in a way that comes across as negging (the PUA’s common technique of putting a woman down before raising her up again). I’m still observing all of this in him.

     One example was he told me that he didn’t usually date Asian women because his type was usually white women. At first I was kinda bummed hearing that but then I did take a positive interpretation thanks to my own sense of security that the fact that I’m his first Asian woman shows that I’m really that special that he can’t resist.

     You see, you can take an empowering perspective to their bluntness or lament it as insensitivity. Or better still just believe in yourself that you are all that…and so you become one. Confident women are very attractive even when they are not the most gorgeous on the block.

     I have unwavering belief in that so there is no need for me to ever ask a man again about how attractive I am to them. The fact that they keep coming back to me tells me everything I need to know. Sure, I still want compliments and verbal kindness because that’s my love language. But I won’t beat myself if guys these days don’t praise me left and right because when they do, I know they really mean it (like my cub told me last week: “I’m the best.”) Their compliments have more impact then.

148. AnnieC 148

     @97

     If some-one asks you if you’ve done your paperwork, they are asking for a reason. If you want to invent meaning, put words into their mouth and create drama for no reason, then you only really have yourself to blame. I take people at their word. It is much much easier. Lol

149. AnnieC 149

     Btw: That was a general “you” not a personal “you”.

     @146

     Women are not victims of a world that tells them they must be beautiful. If we are that easily influenced , are we not what some men suggested in the past, that we are weak, irrational creatures? Are we women really that weak? If we are we should be wrapped up in cotton wool, and not allowed to make decisions for ourselves.

     We have to stop blaming everything outside of ourselves. You can’t change the media anymore than you can change men. You can change yourself, and that is the only action that is productive.

150. Margo 150

     @Paul#144, of course there are two different perspectives on what transpired between the OP and her boyfriend in this article. DUH! But, thank you for pointing that out. What really doesn’t surprise me is the reaction of those on here who are so rigid in their thinking that they can’t see that each side has valid points.
     For example, the women on here who are saying things like, “Well, he better think I’m as beautiful as Angelina Jolie or else!” and “my boyfriend looks as hot as Brad Pitt!

     Well, actually, your boyfriend does NOT look as hot as Brad Pitt, but your feelings and love for him have come into play, and that reality is now dictating your feelings. But, there is an objective reality…

151. Samantha 151

     @146 Women ARE victims of a world that tells them they must be beautiful. I think it’s sad that people like you probably know there are millions of females suffering from eating disorders and still think they’re just being weak. If you have self-esteem, great! But educate yourself… you should see Demi Lovato’s Stay Strong documentary or maybe think about Jessica Simpson and Kim Kardashian, how they had to struggle with their weight and curves and understand before you criticize. No wonder so many women are like the OP and feel the need tocompare themselves to celebs like AJ.

     ”We have to stop blaming everything outside of ourselves. You can’t change the media anymore than you can change men. You can change yourself, and that is the only action that is productive.” Albert Einstein once said: ”The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don’t do anything about it.” There you go.

152. nathan 152

     AnnieC @149 – You are over emphasizing the role of personal responsibility and individual agency. None of us is totally free from being influenced by the media, and the rest of our culture, no matter how strong and independent we are. I have never met a woman who didn’t have some challenges around her looks (either in her past, or in the present). We are surrounded by messages that women must look a certain way, or else they are aren’t good enough. I’ve seen the effects of this even in small children. Girls under six years old talking about not being pretty, or that they are comparing themselves with child stars on TV and in the movies. Telling women to grow up and stop being victims really isn’t enough. In fact, I can imagine it’s insulting to any woman who has done her damnedest to let go of such concerns, only to find them creeping in during weak moments.

     As I said earlier, I think Diana’s fixation on celebrities and being “the hottest girl on earth” to her boyfriend is immature and irritating. If it’s a regular pattern, it’s something that makes being her boyfriend a difficult task at best. On the other hand, if her boyfriend regularly makes subtle or not so subtle comments about how she looks, then a whole different dynamic is at play. Given the lack of information in the letter about their overall relationship, it could be that she’s partly reacting to his undercutting.

     A lot of men fail to give any credence to the ways in which American pop culture fixates on certain beauty standards, and renders everything else inferior. Playing the blunt, “objective” truth teller role all the time is a failure to meet your partner somewhere in the middle. Compromise. Evan loves that word. Guys gotta get a clue and do that more around issues like this.

     To be honest, though, I get the sense that both Diana and her b/f are either young and/or immature. Making comments about how hot celebrity X is, and then making “serious” comparisons between celebrities and yourselves is high schoolish. Granted, with the way so many people are obsessed with celebrities these days, perhaps the whole “extended adolescence” theory is worth considering for them, and for our society as a whole.

153. Samantha 153

     Oh, and my opinion about the actual question… I wasn’t there to know exactly how this conversation happened, so I would advice Diana to ask herself: is it a deal-breaker for her boyfriend because being hot is important to him? Is he really that attracted to Angelina and sad that he has to be with Diana instead of a much hotter woman? Or is it irrelevant to him and he loves Diana more than anybody else, despite her not being the most physically beautiful female he knows? I think if he still loves her despite her physical flaws and not-so-perfect looks she should give him a chance and ignore this instead of making it a big deal, but there are a few men that are with their partners ”just because”. If he’s not into her and is just too comfortable to leave or work in the relationship, then she should dump him.

154. Diana 154

     Ok, I am the letter writer. I want to thank everybody for their comments, it was very helpful to see other points of view. To clarify how the conversation went: I never asked my (now ex) b/f if I was hotter than AJ. I stated it, saying something like “yeah I am just as hot as she is” – to which he responded “what are you crazy?” and I said “excuse me?” and then the whole conversation how I am not that hot but pretty enough ensued. I broke off this relationship for two reasons. First, I realized that no matter what I did he would never see me as beautiful or hot, while there’s plenty of men who would. I should’ve taken a note when we first started dating and he told me I wasn’t “his usual type”. Everybody is entitled to “their type”, and he’s not a bad guy for having it, but being “good enough” is not good enough for me. I decided that I didn’t need to spend my life trying to morph into “his type” or accepting being “second best” and see him longing for women that he considers hot, when I can be “the best” as is to someone else. And second, and the main reason, I just saw my future together with this man. A “good woman, the whole package” shoved into a suburban house with 2 kids while her husband is partying in the city with a “hot woman” and his friends. Relationships where a man can so clearly separate “hot” from “good” in his head are ripe for serial infidelities, I see way too much of it every day, thanks but no thanks. I am really upset with myself that I did not pick up on those signals earlier in this relationship and let it progress that far (as it turned out he went shopping for a ring…) Like Evan said earlier on this blog, men always tell us exactly how they feel and we choose not to listen. I chose not to listen, while he was not simply dropping hints but telling me outright how he felt about me all along. I am also upset with myself for letting his snarky remarks even temporarily undermine my self-esteem and confidence, and for snapping at him – I should be a better person than that.

155. Helen 155

     nathan 151, all your points are very valid. However, I’d be curious to how the media affect not just women, but also men, in this example. Ruby 146 described how the media enforce aspects of women’s perceptions and behavior. How about for men? Do you find yourself bombarded by the media into believing that a particular female look is the most attractive (tall, skinny, long hair, etc.), or do men look less at all these examples because they’re not specifically tailored to men? Do men actually have a much wider definition of women’s beauty than portrayed by the popular media?

156. Ruby 156

     AnnieC

     I never used the words “victim”, although, as Samantha (150) said, an argument could be made for the use of that term. I never said that women were “weak”, either. I am talking about very deep-rooted and over-arching standards of beauty that women are expected to conform to. We are all influenced to conform to cultural and societal expectations, and most people simply follow, rather than question. That is not most WOMEN, that is most PEOPLE.

157. Evan Marc Katz 157

     Thanks for following up, Diana. I’m sorry that your relationship didn’t work out. If your ex really thought that his future was “partying” with “hot women” in the city, then you definitely made the right decision. Please don’t get distracted by all the noise in the comments section. You do deserve a man who is attracted to you and loyal to you above all; I implore you to disabuse yourself of the notion that he has to think you’re hotter than every other woman on the planet. It’s an impossibly high bar to jump and you’re setting yourself – and your boyfriend – up for failure. I trust that with the right guy, you won’t even feel compelled to ask for validation.

158. nathan 158

     Helen @154 Those are good questions.

     “Do you find yourself bombarded by the media into believing that a particular female look is the most attractive (tall, skinny, long hair, etc.)” I’d be interested to hear from men who pay more attention to pop culture, because I mostly opted out of television, American movies, and reading pop magazines years ago.

     “do men look less at all these examples because they’re not specifically tailored to men?” I think they often are tailored towards heterosexual men. In terms of a celebrity or model’s final image. While at the same time, they are tailored towards women in as far as getting women to buy beauty products, “in fashion” clothing, as well as believing that the final image is desirable.

     “Do men actually have a much wider definition of women’s beauty than portrayed by the popular media?” Even though there’s a lot of cultural pressure to maintain narrow definitions of beauty, I do think that men as a group still display a diversity of definitions of beauty. And I’d say that with experience and more maturity comes a much more nuanced understanding of what is beautiful and what isn’t. But some guys never really grow out of that narrow view. I don’t know what the percentages are, but enough that it makes me think that media and pop culture are still a pretty strong influence on people, regardless of gender.

159. Helen 159

     Thanks, nathan. I’d assumed that Cosmo, Redbook, etc., were tailored toward women, but it makes sense that men give the covers a long glance as well, even if they don’t look inside.

     Diana – wow. I feel for you, but at the same time would encourage you not to keep comparing yourself to others, supermodels or not. Be happy with yourself the way you are. Even if I met a guy who really was as hot as Matthew McConaughey, I’d be turned off if he actually stated it outright. It would imply vanity combined with a bit of insecurity, that he needed to compare himself at all.

     Looks are not the most important thing in a relationship. Don’t let this be the basis for how you perceive your worth to other men.

160. Helen 160

     Diana – also, I wonder if you’re hurting yourself by reading way too much into your ex’s statements. For example: “Relationships where a man can so clearly separate “hot” from “good” in his head are ripe for serial infidelities”… Many people, male and female, can clearly separate hot from good, myself included. But I have no desire or intention whatsoever to commit infidelity, and would guess that most people don’t.

     It may already be a moot point, but from your description, your ex doesn’t sound bad at all. If he was shopping for a ring, he loved you despite whatever he may have said about looks. What would be so wrong with his falling in love with your humor, kindness, courage, or something else that really mattered? The only real problem here, from what it sounds like, is that you didn’t trust him. A relationship can’t thrive if one party doesn’t trust the other. But in the future, I hope you don’t base trust on how hot your man thinks you are.

161. Karl R 161

     Diana said: (#154)
     “Relationships where a man can so clearly separate “hot” from “good” in his head are ripe for serial infidelities,”

     Really?

     If a woman is “hot,” then I think of her as “eye candy;” nice to look at, but I don’t particularly want to converse with her or be in a relationship with her (unless she demonstrates that she’s intelligent, fun, easy to get along with, etc).

     I’m certainly not about to ruin my relationship (with a “good” woman) for some temporary fling. I’ve never cheated in my previous relationships. That’s not because I think my fiancée is the hottest woman on the planet (nor were my ex-girlfriends). It’s because she’s more important to me than all the hot women put together. And my integrity is more important, also.

     Diana,
     Do you have some basis for believing that your ex-boyfriend is destined to be a serial-adulterer, or is this a “fact” that you invented?

     Diana said: (#154)
     “I just saw my future together with this man. A ‘good woman, the whole package’ shoved into a suburban house with 2 kids while her husband is partying in the city with a ‘hot woman’ and his friends.”

     Did he say that was what he expected? Has he demonstrated a tendency to run off and party with hot women while leaving you at home? Or is this something you imagined?

     If this was what your ex-boyfriend expected for your (collective) future, then you dodged a bullet. If you broke up with him because this is what you imagined he’d be like in the future, then he dodged a bullet.

     Diana said: (#154)
     “I never asked my (now ex) b/f if I was hotter than AJ. I stated it, saying something like ‘yeah I am just as hot as she is’”

     Even if you are as hot as Angelina Joliie, I would consider that to be an incredibly immodest statement.

     If you’re as hot a Hollywood actresses, you don’t need to tell people that you’re hot. They will have already noticed.

     It seems to me that you’re creating problems for yourself, primarily with an overactive imagination, but also with what you say. And if you’re creating your problems, you’ll find those problems in all of your future relationships as well.

162. Happy Person 162

     Nathan–you are great!!!! Love all of your comments. My BF and I have pretty much opted out of TV and movies, though I watch stuff on Netflix (hate commercials). It is amazing how much easier it is to see people as people and accept them as they are when your head isn’t full of these manipulative, manipulated images.

     I feel very bad for people who aren’t able to love others or themselves because their heads are so full of this media nonsense.

     Maybe in response to this thread, not sure–but I was just thinking yesterday of all of the once “hottest” celebrities from the last few decades and how they ended up not so “hot”–sometimes because of their own doings, often just because of fate: Elizabeth Taylor, Montgomery Clift, Farrah Fawcett, Kirsty Alley, Michael J Fox, OJ Simpson, Whitney Houston, Christopher Reeve, Margot Kidder, Michael Jackson, John Travolta, Marilyn Monroe, JFK, JFK Jr., just about every rock star—the list just goes on and on.

     Name one “hot” person who stayed that way for very long. Really, if men are into this “hot” nonsense they are not mature enough to be in a relationship. We all have to grow up. That growing up usually requires that we leave behind the things that we found so all-consuming in high school. It also means that boys can’t get away with bullying us gals unless we let them.

     Glad Diana dumped him.

163. Diana 163

     Karl R, nobody has a crystal ball so of course I can’t tell for sure how this relationship may have turn out, but i was basing it on the fact that that’s what pretty much all of his friends are like (again – should’ve known earlier, right?). That, and the fact he was not too crazy about my looks to begin with, and I didn’t need to torture my imagination to come up with this scenario. It is quite possible that I am wrong, but my gut told me to walk away. I did not feel truly loved in that relationship, and the idea that I was picked out for his life plans almost like a qualified candidate gets selected for a job, with minimal emotional investment, just did not sit well with me. I am not that desperate for a white picket fence…

164. Heather 164

     @ Diana,

     Wow, I’m sorry that your relationship ended. When I read what was actually said, I thought good god, she sounds like she was dating my ex boyfriend, who made all kinds of snarky comments to and about me, including calling me a “whore” in front of his friend, when introducing me. It sounds like you made the right choice and I’m glad you stood up for yourself.

     Like I said in earlier posts, alot of men need to learn to think before they speak, and it sounds like this one needs some serious remedial training in that department!!!

     I am actually reading a book that you might find interesting, it’s called “The Verbally Abusive Man” but the author’s name escapes me at the moment. It’s very insightful and as someone who’s lived through a couple of verbally abusive relationships, it’s teaching me the warning signs so I steer clear of these men for good.

     Good luck to you and EMK is right, the right man won’t cause you to feel like you need validation. I haven’t needed to feel validated one bit by my current guy. Hes a nice person and also, I love me and myself and were he to ever start making me feel bad, he’d end up getting punted like a football through the endzone, LOL!!!!

165. Goldie 165

     @ AnnieC #148, WTH was that post about? My point was, if my manager asks me whether I’ve done X,Y, or Z, it’s because I should’ve done it by now (and reported to them that I have) and they don’t know if I have or not. How they word their question is irrelevant. That’s my point, what’s yours? I don’t get it. If you want to pick a fight with me, ask for my email address and we’ll take it offline, this blog is not the right place.

     @Diana, thanks for the update. IMO, regardless of the “hot or not” discussion, your ex BF was out of line. “What are you, crazy?” is never the right thing to say in a relationship. Having a verbally abusive husband is not fun, so good for you for getting out.

166. Karl R 166

     Helen asked: (#155)
     “I’d be curious to how the media affect not just women, but also men, in this example.”
     “Do you find yourself bombarded by the media into believing that a particular female look is the most attractive (tall, skinny, long hair, etc.), or do men look less at all these examples because they’re not specifically tailored to men?”

     I would say men’s preferences are probably influenced by popular media, but men’s tastes aren’t controlled by those images.

     For example, I’ve noticed my tastes shift over the years towards the appearance of women I’ve dated before. I find that “type” more attractive once I became seriously involved with the woman, and that preference continues years after the relationship ends.

     Helen asked: (#155)
     “Do men actually have a much wider definition of women’s beauty than portrayed by the popular media?”

     Absolutely. If you want to observe this, browse porn on the internet. While some of it is clearly portraying women who look similar to what you would see on popular media, a lot of porn goes directly against those images. There is BBW and GILF porn because there are men who are willing to pay money for it.

167. Katarina Phang 167

     Diana’s bf’s response to her statement (whether or not said in jest) was totally uncalled for. You don’t speak like that to someone you love period. What he said and how he said it was contemptuous. That was horrendous. You can only imagine what else he’s capable of down the road.

     If my man quipped that he’s just as hot as Brad Pitt, I would just say while kissing his cheek and rub his head “You bet, darling. You know I’m crazy about you.”

     You see which response will lead to stronger bonding in relationship? Who cares if I lied through my teeth? I love the guy and his emotional well-being is much more important than factual truth.

     Why the need to put him down even if for the sake of objectivity he’s not as hot? To me a guy needs to be hot to be in relationship with me anyway because I need a physical relationship as much as it is emotional, so yeah my guy is usually as hot as any celebrity TO ME (hence, it’s not really a lie either).

     There are other guys who will think the world of you, Diana. If it’s important to you to feel admired and adored even physically, then go for a man who will give that to you.

168. Margo 168

     Karl #161: “Diana said: (#154)
     “I never asked my (now ex) b/f if I was hotter than AJ. I stated it, saying something like ‘yeah I am just as hot as she is’”

     Even if you are as hot as Angelina Joliie, I would consider that to be an incredibly immodest statement.

     If you’re as hot a Hollywood actresses, you don’t need to tell people that you’re hot. They will have already noticed.

     It seems to me that you’re creating problems for yourself, primarily with an overactive imagination, but also with what you say. And if you’re creating your problems, you’ll find those problems in all of your future relationships as well.”

     I agree with Karl on all of the above.

     Diana…you may go through 20+ men before any of them truly find you as attractive as Angelina Jolie. Do you have that long to wait? And, yes, if you’re hot, there is no need to go around announcing it. This whole conversation with your fiancee about it just sounds really immature. But, your need to bring it up with him is a sympton of your insecurity and anger in the relationship.

     From what you have written, it appears he is the cause. Appears being the operative word here. Going forward, I would suggest, as Evan and Karl has, that you be cognizant of your expectations and ensure that they are realistic. If you have difficulty doing that, then that is evidence of a deeper problem that is worth investigating.

169. Happy Person 169

     Edie Sedgwick, Lady Di, Grace Kelley, Blondie, Demi Moore, Michael Douglas, Alec Baldwin, Valerie Bertinelli, Tim Conway, Marlon Brando.

     All once upon a time the hottest thing around. They all lost “it.” So will Brad, Angelina, and anyone else who has “it.”

     Really, is “it” what we want to base our love relationships on?

170. Still-Looking 170

     Diana –
     Happy Person @169 made a great point.
     Do you want your partner to love you because he is in love with how “hot” you are?
     You are, in essence, basing your worth on your perception of how physically attractive you appear to your partner.
     1. What happens when you get pregnant? When you gain a few pounds? When you develop some wrinkles? When a pimple sprouts on your forehead? Are you then going to feel less loved because you “know” you are not as attractive as you once were? Are you going to fret that your partner will now be searching for a “hotter” woman? I have dated quite a few extremely attractive women. As Evan, Karl, and a number of others have noted physical attraction is just one of many attributes that will attract and keep a man. I’ve cut dates short with beautiful women because they were boring, vain, or not intelligent. I’ve never lost interest in a woman who had a great personality because she wasn’t the hottest woman in town.
     2. Was your BF the hottest man you’ve ever seen in your life? Can you honestly say he had the hottest body in the country? Was he the epitome of male masculinity or whatever your preference is for men?
     3. Assuming you are truly in the 99th percentile for physical attractiveness, what about all the “lesser” women who just pretty, cute, average, or heaven forbid, homely? Are they destined to a life of loveless misery merely because their partners would admit to themselves that their GF/spouse was not the “hottest” woman in the world?

     I wish you luck in finding happiness and a great relationship but please realize that physical attractiveness becomes less and less importance in a relationship (for most people) as the years go by. Read some of Evan’s articles on the importance of compatibility versus chemistry… lust based on physical attraction only gets you so far….

171. Soph 171

     “yeah I am just as hot as she [AJ] is” — Seriously? OMG just how delusional, insecure and conceited can a person be? This woman’s bf is so much better off WITHOUT her. That guy probably just snapped because he got annoyed at her conceitedness. I know that cos I used to be THAT woman. Not to that extent of course but I can say Diana’s need to tell this to her bf comes from her own insecurity, and conceitedness also. I have grown up since then and I strongly urge you, Diana, to do the same.

172. SalsaQ 172

     @170 Still-Looking

     Diana wrote
     [i]I can’t tell for sure how this relationship may have turned out, but i was basing it on the fact that that’s what pretty much all of his friends are like that and the fact he was not too crazy about my looks to begin with, and I didn’t need to torture my imagination to come up with this scenario. my gut told me to walk away. I did not feel truly loved in that relationship. I was picked out for his life plans almost like a qualified candidate gets selected for a job, with minimal emotional investment[/i]

     OP may have written about that one conversation on looks but there were deeper problems than just that! I would guess that conversation became a big deal to the OP because all of the other concerns were mounting and she was already troubled.

173. Soph 173

     BTW, I have a friend who likes to constantly slip into conversations or writing on FB how “pretty” she thinks she is. I probably would have found her a lot prettier if she didn’t feel the urge to say it out loud. The more she does that, the more I find that she really isn’t all that. It’s probably the rebellious nature in man, I don’t know. But the fact that she feels the need to constantly remind the people around her how pretty she is reeks insecurity to me. And it’s just downright pathetic/annoying.

174. AnnieC 174

     @Nathan.

     I do understand that Nathan. However, all adults are ultimately responsible for their issues. No matter what happens to us or how we are influenced, if we don’t have that fundamental belief that everything we feel or believe is our responsibility then we cannot fix our own problems, let alone social problems. The victim mentality in society is so powerful that it is becoming ridiculous. You aren’t a victim, when you have a choice.

     If a woman is struggling with self-esteem, to such a degree she expects her partner to find her the most beautiful woman in the world(or lie) as some women here seem to be saying, then she has a problem needs to own it instead of blaming men.

     Should people be kind in a relationship? Of course. But what IS kind? Is it kind to put your partner on the spot asking them silly questions about looking like a movie star? Is the OP considering how her partner feels, or is kindness only a one way street? It is not kind to put unrealistic expectations on your partner, or expect them to deal with hypersensitivity and the need for constant validation.

     That understanding seems to be missing in so many comments here.

     @Goldie, I’m not Picking on you, I’m challenging your comments.

     And it is quite relevant to a lot of blog entries, due to unrealistic expectations that people have due to their own emotional reactions to situations.

     If some-one asks you if you are done, yes or no can suffice. You reading some kind of nefarious meaning into it IE he’s really saying I SHOULD be done, is not your co-workers problem, your assumptions are a choice you are making. Why do that? Why put words in some-ones mouth? And how many times has Evan suggested that women stop putting ulterior motives onto men, and take them at their word?

     My point is, if you take offense at something so simple as someone asking you at work, if you have completed a task then what else in life are you going to take offense to?

     This hypersensitivity that people feel is actually really disturbing.

175. Androgynous 175

     Heather :
     “So based upon your logic, then I would have every right to talk to you however I wish, no matter if it were abusive, mean spirited, hateful, etc.”

     Heather, I never said it was acceptable to use abusive, mean spirited and hateful language to your co-workers. My exact words were blunt and direct. There’s a difference. Just as there is a difference between “Why didn’t you do what I requested you to?” and “Why didn’t you do what I requested you to, you idiot”.

     My point is that there is a time and place for blunt and direct language. Blunt and direct language used in a relationship context depends on the circumstances. In a working context, blunt and direct language is perfectly acceptable.
     If anything, I have found that being empathic and compassionate gets me absolutely nowhere as far as managing some people go. I have found that as a female team leader responsible for 25 staff, being empathic and compassionate can result in some staff taking advantage and walking all over you, eventually becoming insubordinate.

     Don’t feel sorry for me because I am doing pretty well, thank you – by behaving as a situation requires, which means being blunt and direct where I have to. And no, I have never been abusive or I, or my company would have had our pants sued off our behinds.

176. Stacey 176

     Soph, Margo, and all: so here’s one woman who doesn’t have body image issues (or may be she does NOW). She doesn’t look at AJ and says “oh i wish i had her legs “, but rather shrugs and says “meh, I am just as good”. And SHE is the one who gets labeled insecure, delusional, immodest, etc.? Is this for real, so sad that this is a society we live in, where a woman is expected to think of herself as inadequate in comparison to images forced fed to us by tabloids, and if she doesn’t – there must be something wrong with her, and she needs to be put in her place.

177. Soul 177

     #Stacey:

     Fishing for compliments = having body image and/or self-esteem issues….

     If you feel insulted for not being perceived as as “hot” as another woman…what do you call this?

178. Stacey 178

     Soul: so women can’t win! You think you’re beautiful you are insecure and possibly delusional, you don’t think you are beautiful you are definitely insecure and have body image issues, what is, in your opinion, the healthy way of perceiving yourself? “ugly but ok with it”?

179. Soul 179

     @Stacey:

     There is nothing to win…. and it’s not a female or male thing…

     What would you say if a man repeatedly said to you or asked you if he was rich enough/richer than brad pitt?

     You would tell him to relax, try his best, and just be confident in who he is…. and also, this doesn’t seem very attractive, huh?

     That’s my opinion: do your best (and I mean really DO your best in terms of food, clothes, hygiene, gym…),

     and relax…

     oh! and smile !!!! you’re good enough

180. Harmony 180

     I suddenly had an image of Angelina sitting on the porch in her rocker at 80 asking Brad “Do you still think I am the hottest woman around?” What would he say??

     It’s all subjective and loving someone can make them the most beautiful person in the world. Men should express that….

     Sad how many of the beautiful celebrities have not found their true love and/or have been betrayed. Better have a strong sense of self that withstands time!

181. Soph 181

     Well said, Soul@179. A person (male or female) who is truly comfortable in their own skin will not feel the need to seek validation outside of them. IMO there is a fine line between confidence and conceitedness. To me confidence is “I’m perfectly happy with what I’ve got, but at the same time I still acknowledge the fact I don’t look ‘perfect’ so to speak (or as ‘hot’ as AJ in this case). But hey, so what?” As Soul said, just slap on a big smile, do your very best in taking care of your appearance, and know that you are special in your own way!

182. Soul Sister 182

     When I was married, after 3 kids and a husband who never made me feel good about myself (I was very thin and very sexy when he first met me) I gained about 40 lbs. I no longer felt sexy, beautiful, or even worth noticing. After 20 years we got a divorce and I went on the “divorce” diet. I lost the 40 lbs, exercised, and got a breast augmentation (breast feeding 3 kids does NOT do wonders to your boobs!). Anyway, I must admit I looked fantastic and felt fantastic…sexy, hot, whatever. We were at a local race together and a man said to my ex-husband “how could you let a woman who looks like this go?”. My ex said “maybe if she would have looked like this I wouldn’t have” (ha ha, since I asked for the divorce). My response back to him was “maybe if you would have made me feel hot and sexy to you all those years, I would have still looked like this”. Not saying I blame him for gaining the weight, but when your partner stops believing you are beautiful…sometimes you stop believing it to. It took other men noticing me to make me notice myself again, and once I did, there was no stopping me. So yes, it is very important to me for a man to make me feel beautiful, because then I believe it too and work hard to stay that way…..chicken or the egg….

183. Heather 183

     @ Androgynous:

     No, I’m sorry, you do not have the right to come into my office, ask me if I’m doing my job, when you have no proof that I am not doing my work, and you can clearly see that I am doing my work. It is unprofessional. It is rude. And unacceptable. Put the shoe on the other foot, dear. Would you like it? I’m sure you wouldn’t.

     Treat others like you’d like to be treated. And yes, I do feel sorry for you that you feel that compassion and empathy have no place in the workplace. That’s a shame. And like a therapist once told my ex husband who screamed at me in the middle of a therapy session and I tearfully asked him to please stop screaming at me: “If she feels abused and cornered, then you need to honor that, and stop what you’re doing, because clearly, you are hurting her.” So if I feel insulted by some administrator who has no clue, coming into my office and asking me if I’m doing my job when he has no proof of wrongdoing or lack of work on my part? I have every right to feel insulted, and men and women both, with management experience mind you, have agreed that he was rude, unprofessional and way out of line.

     Again. It is not WHAT was said, so much as HOW it was said. And I wish more of you folks would learn that. This world would be a nicer, kinder place if people would use the brain cells in their head and THINK instead of being so damn rude all the time.

184. pj 184

     I understand how diana feels in the sense that this insecurity of whether her boyfriend finds her attractive or not may have manifested itself into an obsession.
     However I personally HATE the terminology ‘hot’ because I think it only goes with the physical appearance of a person (i.e don’t know them personally/couldn’t possible comment on their personality). Whereas to me, comments such as beautiful/pretty say that they like everything about you (this is only my opinion btw other people may see this differently!), such as men, I would never describe a boyfriend as ‘hot/fit’ (although I may describe a guy i met in the street as this) I would describe a boyfriend as handsome/beautiful.

     An example of this is when I was seeing this guy a couple of months ago, I was pretty sure the relationship was going nowhere especially when he said to me ‘You have an amazing body’ so the first thought that went through my mind was ‘he just wants me for sex’ not ‘OMG HE THINKS I’M HOT’

     Whereas a few weeks later when he decided he actually wanted to be in a relationship with me (i wasn’t interested at this point because I had thought he wasn’t interested due to the aforementioned comment) he described me as ‘a beautiful, intelligent girl who is pretty awesome.’

     I know which I’d rather be described as.
     Also, I don’t understand this whole ‘comparing to celebrities’ culture we seem to have, if a boyfriend who i’d been with for a year made a comment about a celebrity i’d probably respond with something along the lines of ‘Yeah well angelina jolie would definitely not be picking your dirty socks up off the floor, so think yourself lucky!’

185. Eljem 185

     Bit off-topic (sorry Evan!) but…

     Heather @183

     Speaking as someone who both manages and is managed, of course a manager has the right to ask a team member how they are getting on with a task. They don’t have the right to ask in an abusive manner, but the fact of asking is not, in itself, abusive. So, in response to your question to Androgynous, I don’t feel insulted when my manager asks how I’m getting on with a task.

     I suspect that, although it was obvious to you that you were going to meet your deadline, it wasn’t similarly obvious to your manager. In that scenario, the simplest approach is to ask the staff member directly.

186. Joe 186

     @ AllenB #141:

     IMO in general ugly<unattractive<plain<cute<pretty<beautiful<gorgeous

     Notice "hot" doesn't really fit into that spectrum, which is more about the way a woman looks to your brain. "Hot" is more about the way she looks to your pecker.

     That spectrum is more like
     double-bagger<doable<hot

187. Senior Lady Vibe 187

     “The real question is whether it’s a dealbreaker for HIM to stay with a woman who has such a hard time hearing the truth.”

     What was said and heard was not the truth about her, it was her guy’s opinion of her. The only truth here is that she has a guy who thinks she’s not so hot… and wants her to know he thinks of her that way. His opinion. I think I’d want a second opinion, maybe a second guy too…

188. Katarina Phang 188

     SLV, exactly. It is one thing to think your partner is not that hot, it’s quite another to viciously let her know the cold hard fact.

     A woman can do better than with a man like that. It’s hard enough to be in relationship with a decent guy who appreciates you, forget about with the one who talks down to you.

189. AnnieC 189

     @185

     Exactly.

     Feeling offended over some-one simply doing their job, is oversensitivity imo.

190. Senior Lady Vibe 190

     @Katarina Phang 188:
     “SLV, exactly. It is one thing to think your partner is not that hot, it’s quite another to viciously let her know the cold hard fact.”

     The lack-of-hotness verdict was a bit cold and hard but, I repeat, still only his opinion, not a fact about OP. The real fact hanging in the air is he has that opinion of her. IMHO, that would turn me off to hear that from a guy. I’d much rather have a guy who thought I was hot, regardless of what he thought about other women. I like a guy who appreciates women.

     Other thoughts are: “hotness” is usually in the eye of the beholder. For example: some guys still consider Jennifer Anniston “hot” even though Brad Pitt might have told her his “truth” that she wasn’t. Brad’s opinion didn’t suddenly become “THE TRUTH” about Jennifer… it was only the truth about Brad…

     1)Find a guy who thinks you’re hot.

     And why, oh, why is the OP obsessing over her five measurements? Five measurements do not “hotness” make. Five measurements don’t even equate to automatic glamour, beauty, or attractiveness. She could use some “fixing” in this area and perhaps the fixing is mostly in her head.

     I amend step one to:

     1) Think you’re hot.
     2) Find a guy who thinks you’re hot.

191. Joya 191

     What ? Please. Angelina Jolie isn’t even as hot as Angelina Jolie! The public image of AJ is a symbol, a constructed projection, of an ideal of absolute perfection. Celluloid heroes.

     I could address the eternal building up and knocking down practice involved in the cult of celebrity worship, but I won’t.

     For purposes of this discussion, I will say this:

     I rue the day I would ever ask my man if he thinks I’m as hot as the celebrity du jour. But let’s say, in a moment of weakness, I did ask, like Diana did. He wouldn’t be apt to answer the way her boyfriend did or if he did I would be very surprised.

     Mine would reassure me, knowing that this level of rampant societal pressure can serve to make even the most confident woman question her appearance. He would again lovingly acknowledge my own brand of specialness, having nothing to do with the relationship between my value and my body.

     Does he love me because I’m beautiful or “hot” according to some ideal, or am I beautiful and hot because he loves me ?

     Diana seems to be one more poor, misguided sucker buying into the trap of determining a significant percentage of her worth and value based on her level of “hotness” (whatever that means) compared to an impossible and very narrow ideal.

192. Paragon 192

     I admit, I get a kick out of all these women clearly overestimating their options.

     While it may be trivial for a typical woman to, indeed, find a man who thinks she’s all that.

     The question is, will she necessarily *want* such a man?

     My observations tell me that it is the rare woman who can command the same level of interest from the kinds of men who *she* is into – that is why women frequently end up in abusive/disrespectful relationships(ie. they cannot
     reconcile the fact that, for many of them, warranting the kind of respect/sentiment they think they deserve, may entail
     considering men who aren’t their ‘type’).

193. sthrnphoenix 193

     I’m the girl next door. Regularly described as “cute” and “pretty”. That really used to bother me, but as I’ve grown older, I’ve come to realize it really doesn’t mean much. I’m a reasonably pretty woman, and have never been described as “hot” by any boyfriends, friends, or family members. I think I would be thrown if I was. My family frequently tells me I’m beautiful and my family tells me I’m beautiful. They all believe it’s true, and I love them too. But to be honest, I’m cute. I came to terms with that a few years ago, and I’m okay with it. I still feel warm and fuzzy when my bf tells me that out of the blue. I can’t even conceive of telling my boyfriend I’m as hot as Angelina Jolie in any context other than making a joke.

     My first thought upon reading this letter, which has not been changed by the OP’s subsequent comments at all, was to wonder just how old this girl is. I was also struck by the feeling that she was exaggerating his response in order to make him look worse than the situation warranted. Again, that has not changed. And it really doesn’t matter, because beauty is so much more than whether you are as hot or hotter than AJ or wear a beauty queen’s crown, or got voted prom queen. It’s a whole lot about how you comport yourself, whether you can look in the mirror and see what’s really there, and whether you treat other people with respect and a recognition of who and what they are instead of only how they reflect back on your own image of yourself. Before I even met my guy, I worked out what I was looking for. None of my lists included a great looking guy. Because one of my criteria is that I want someone to sit with me on the porch in rocking chairs as wrinkled old people watching the grandkids play and still enjoying each other’s company after all these years. And as a previous poster stated, when we’re old and wrinkled, we just aren’t going to be “hot” anymore. However, we can still be happy.

     Oh, and Heather: Do you really think people who know you and know how sensitive you are will argue with you over whether you are overreacting? Your “reality check” is useless. Your admin has a right and responsibility to follow up with you when a deadline is looming. Guess what? If you have a month end deadline, so does your admin, and he (or she) cannot meet their deadline until you meet yours. If I had to preface every conversation I had with a subordinate with “how are you”, “how’s the kids”, and “what about them Saints” before I could ask where they are in getting their task done, I would spend half my time wasting my time and theirs, not to mention preventing them from actually *doing* their jobs. Your admin is not your friend and shouldn’t have to pretend to be your friend just to get an update on your work. That would be a very tiring way to do business.

194. sthrnphoenix 194

     Oops, I meant my family and my boyfriend tell me I’m beautiful. Perhaps a little proof-reading might help me just a bit.

195. Speed 195

     As a break from this debate over who’s hot/not deluded, etc., I thought this would be inspiring, and basically complements EMK’ s whole approach:
     http://www.huffingtonpost.com/sheryl-paul/what-is-love_2_b_1446105.html

196. mara 196

     Evan, please answer me. Your words are echoing in my brain and maybe I don’t understand men but it seems quite horrifying.

     “Your refusal to understand that men can be attracted to you, love you, be faithful to you, and still want to fuck somebody else signifies a lifetime of either a) disappointment when your boyfriend tells you the truth, or b) lies, from the man who tells you that you’re the hottest woman on the planet, period”

     When I am in love I only desire the man I am in love with. I don’t want to fuck anyone else, celebrity or real person. I only have desire for the man I am with.
     Is it possible for men too? Am I normal?
     ?!?
     

197. Joy 197

     Diana,
     Only you know whether your (now ex) boyfriend’s response was a legitimate deal breaker or not. Everyone’s comments on this list are valid and worth considering but the bottom line is how did you feel in that relationship? Yeah, it seems a little shallow or egotistical or insecure that you’d make a comment about being as hot as a celebrity to your boyfriend in an attempt to get some validation from him. In your defense, I know a woman can start feeling pretty darned insecure when they aren’t being treated as hot and desired by their man. You said he was a wonderful man and that you had a lot of good things going on in your relationship but clearly you weren’t happy with the level of attention you got from him. Was he a clueless cad? Was he just not that into you? Did he have issues of perfectionism that you could never meet? Were you demanding too much validation? Too insecure and high maintenance? I have no idea.

     While a man can be a wonderful person and you have a lot in common that takes care of the friend part of a relationship. A woman can get all of her needs met in many different ways and places. She can feel sexy about herself. She can be validated at work for her competence and smarts. She can feel good about being a good person by the way she conducts her life. She can feel love and loved by friends and family. I’m not in the camp that we are islands of security and that we don’t need other people in our lives. We are human and we have needs for connection, love and affection. As women we can only get the level and type of affection we crave and enjoy with a man from our man. That is why we are with him, why we want a man in our life, why we love men and not something else. We love their honesty, we love their muscles, we love their decisiveness and the way they get things done and take care of their family. We love their logic and emotional strength. We love their manliness. We want them to love and adore our womanliness. More than just at a friend level or you are ok, you’ll do. I’m here, aren’t I, isn’t that enough, level. We want them to notice our curves, want to touch our soft skin and smell our hair. We want them to love us when we cry and are a little emotionally vulnerable, or when we nurture them and others. We want them to appreciate when we spend hours getting ready so that we can look our best for them. We put all that effort into it for Him. Because he is important to us, because we want him and we want him to want us. A woman doesn’t want the same kind of compliment from her man that she gets from her girlfriends. She wants to know that she pleases him, makes him happy and that he desires her, picks her. Which means he is happy with her. I wish more men realized that. We want to know we are wanted and appreciated as his woman, loved and desired by that one man we are entrusting our heart to. It really isn’t that difficult for a man to make a woman happy. We aren’t a bunch of insecure ninnies who aren’t capable of having rich fulfilling lives in all other areas just because we want the quality of what we really desire from a man to feel good.

     Too much of these posts have focused on the logistics and hard cold facts of appearance. The real issue here is much bigger. Do we feel loved and appreciated by our significant partner? Do we feel good when in relationship with them in a way that is special or unique to them which is why we are with each other and not any other person out there – including some stupid over idolized celebrity. Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that save about 1% of the population, we all end up looking like funny looking old people. I hope we all find the magic that can sustain a loving relationship through all the phases of life including losing our looks.

     I’m guessing Diana didn’t feel good with her bf. Is it right or wrong? I bet she learned from it too and the next time she feels compelled to make a comment about being as hot as a celebrity it will trigger the memory of all these helpful comments and she won’t need to ask anyone about it. I bet she’ll know why she got that urge and will know what is and isn’t a deal breaker. I’d love to know Diana, if you are still reading this blog, how you feel about the whole thing now? What did you learn that helped you the most?

198. Nathan 198

     Mara, I can’t speak for other men, but when I am in a relationship, I rarely feel attraction for other women. My focus is on being with my girlfriend.

199. mara 199

     @Nathan

     thank you Nathan;
     I felt so saddened at the idea I might never find a man like me – someone who only has eyes for his lover.
     It’s funny, sometimes I feel like I was born in the wrong era…
     I am so romantic !
     I hope will find a man that thinks like you do.

200. Androgynous 200

     As to the question whether a man can love a woman, and yet desire someone else, I think both Evan and Mara are correct, depending on the context and the intensity of the desire. While it is normal for a man to love his girlfriend/partner and feel attraction for other women, this attraction is based on momentary appreciation of their beauty, wit, charm, whatever and NOT a deep, profound yearning and longing for that other person. If it is the latter, then I suggest the man is not truly in love with his partner/girlfriend in the first place.

201. Tina 201

     Mara, of course there are men who are romantic and they will have ‘eyes’ and ‘heart’ only for you…just don’t lose your faith in love and men.

     Believe me, I’ve been disappointed (even recently) but as for me I know that men are different and definitely there are romantic and good men out there.

     You will find the One some day. Just continue to be a romantic person and he will find you

202. SalsaQ 202

     @201 I agree with your first point. I also believe if you don’t keep trying you won’t find a partner. I disagree with the certainty of your last line.

     There is no guarantee we will find The One some day, even if we do everything right. I dislike the term. The One reeks inevitable fate and destiny. Believing that certainty is counting on something that is not entirely under your control and feels like something you need to be whole.

     Live a balanced and full life leaving room for love to come into it and *chances* are good someone good will come into it, but if he doesn’t you will still be happy.

203. Senior Lady Vibe 203

     @sthrnphoenix 193
     “And as a previous poster stated, when we’re old and wrinkled, we just aren’t going to be “hot” anymore. However, we can still be happy.”

     Gee, I didn’t notice who wrote that. Pity that he/she thinks he/she is old, wrinkled and no longer hot. OTOH, I’m old –and last week saw a couple wrinkles emerge across my un-botoxed brow — and I’m still hot!

     One of the secrets to remaining hot is a lack of dependence on the votes of others about whether or not I’m… hot. I might have my work cut out finding guys who think I’m hot but that’s another story.

     Still living the hot life in Hotsville.

204. Kathleen 204

     Senior Lady Vibe in Hotsville
     U go girl !!!!! I like your attitude and your secret to remaining hot Im with you on that one!!

205. sthrnphoenix 205

     @ Senior Lady # 203: You keep living in Hotsville! I was actually paraphrasing another poster speculating about AJ asking if she’s still hot when they’re old. Your idea of old and mine may not be the same. I really don’t consider anyone old until they hit their 70′s at least, and that is all in their point of view. My vision was of me being in my mid 70′s with my honey. Then again, being hot outside of the bedroom just isn’t high on my list for myself or my boyfriend.

206. Paragon 206

     @ Mara

     “When I am in love I only desire the man I am in love with. I don’t want to fuck anyone else, celebrity or real person. I

     only have desire for the man I am with.
     Is it possible for men too?”

     Yes.

     When I fall in love, physical appearance truly becomes a secondary consideration(even while being a determinate
     factor in emotional bonding).

     She becomes more beautiful to me with every passing moment, and every beat of my heart – a perfect beauty which
     is no longer dependent on my physiological senses.

     She becomes the burning star, the focus, in the center of my perceptual universe(to the exclusion of all other women,
     regardless of their relative merits, in an objective world).

     @ Senior Lady Vibe

     “One of the secrets to remaining hot is a lack of dependence on the votes of others about whether or not I’m… hot.”

     Only in an a priori world(ie. not the same one the rest of us undeluded individuals are living in).

     “I might have my work cut out finding guys who think I’m hot but that’s another story.”

     Not really – such indications speak reliably to the matter, on whether or not you can justifiably be considered ‘hot’, or
     ‘not’.

207. mara 207

     @ Paragon

     Thank you so much.
     Your answer made my day !
     =)

208. cat 208

     I have to totally agree with Evan on this one. I read on another website a man constantly professing that his wife is the most beautiful woman in the world to him, but his whole blog was all about how natural it was for all men to stare at beautiful women even in the presence of their wife/girlfriend. I tried to argue that although most men tell their wife/girlfriend she is the most beautiful woman in the world to him, I think it is a romantic gesture alone & isn’t truth. No man is totally satisfied with how their wife looks, no matter how “HOT” or averagely attractive she might be. The truth is men want to look at other beautiful women. Period. And even if the lady that asked the question was as beautiful as Angelina Jolie, it wouldn’t matter, he would still want to look at Angelina Jolie. Point is, men like variety, when they are in love or not – it doesn’t make a difference. Men want to see beautiful, naked women. All the time. Doesn’t matter if you’re George Clooney with a g.f. like Stacey Kiebler or Brad Pitt with a g.f. like Angelina Jolie, those 2 men are STILL looking/ogling other beautiful & probably younger women. Just nature, men are never satisfied & can never be. With looks that is. Other aspects maybe but I’m not so sure? And just for the record, Angelina Jolie isn’t that “HOT” in my opinion…Stacey Kiebler blows her out of the water on the hot scale as do amny many other women. Just sayin! So who cares if her b.f. thinks Angelina is “hotter”…lol

209. Charlotte 209

     I agree that we do not know the tone with which this man spoke these words to his girlfriend. My concern is that tearing your girlfriend down is the first sign of abusive behavior. Abusive men often entice women by being charming and once they have them, begin to tell them no other man would want them. I would be taking note if he makes other derogatory comments.

     If my wonderful boyfriend made a comment comparing his looks to those of Brad Pitt or George Clooney, I would *not* tell him to stop being absurd and delusional. I would tell him that those men have nothing on him. I would tell him that, to me, he is the most beautiful man in the world. And it’s true. And we’ve been dating a year.

     Of course I see other men who have pretty eyes or are buff or have a strong jaw, but they are not attractive and sexy to me the way he is. I understand that it is typical of women to find most attractive the men who have the characteristics they are looking for. Beautiful men who open their mouths and say ugly things are ugly. Celebrities hire people to make them physically beautiful and since I’ve never met them, they are not real, so they are not all that attractive. This is how women view men. I think it is wrong, and frankly mean-spirited, for you to call this woman insecure.

210. Gina 210

     To him, I am “good looking” and “pretty” but, say, Angelina Jolie is “hot”, and “beautiful” and I am well… a regular person so I am not, how could I possibly be? He “likes me and finds me attractive”, but by no means am I nearly as good looking as a movie star, and I am crazy to be even comparing myself to them.

     Okay, I at first looked at the Boyfriends comment as insensitive. Of course a woman wants to feel cherished by her man. The way that I perceived her describing herself, it sounds like she doesn’t see much value in herself other than her looks – who cares that you have almost a perfect body? Granted, one of my needs in a relationship is for my Boyfriend to perceive me as pretty, beautiful, attractive, cute – whatever, I do like compliments but the way I perceived it was that the Boyfriend was trying to knock some sense into her by saying “You are crazy to be even comparing yourself to them” … I suppose she feels she does look like those stars and needs someone who feels that way about her. Its one thing if the boyfriend started out of the blue when watching t.v. that Angelina J was so hot and didn’t even compare to her but I don’t think it went down like that, she was probably probing about it and probably making him feel uncomfortable. Although, it’s not too far fetched for her to be beautiful, so I sense there was some friction in the conversation. I wouldn’t even play that game by asking my boyfriend if I was as beautiful as celebrities…

211. Happy Person 211

     Not saying the guy in the original letter was doing this, but just asking in a philosophical way. What does a guy get out of looking at other women he doesn’t “have” and comparing his GF to them? Sounds like unhappy loser behavior to me. And if your BF is doing this and is so unhappy and sees himself as such a loser for being with you, he would be a very unappealing, unattractive partner himself. Quite an ugly partner, in fact.

212. Kakay 212

     Evan, you are so right. I am different than most women in that I am as direct as most men because I ended up hanging out with nothing but guys for several years. I one friend in particular who is obsessed with the celebrities, walks around like she is the hottest thing, and acts like it, and then comes to me and asks me every single time we hang out if I think she is fat, ugly, looks old, or if those pants make her ass look fat. She tries to show me muscle definition on her legs that doesn’t even exist. She is not as hot as she acts like she thinks she is. She is probably a 7.5, but acts like she is a 10. She is really so insecure. And my goodness, I am a female friend, and I get tired of hearing her shallow antics and I am trying to help her become less shallow so that she will find some sort of genuine happiness one day…because she is hitting the wall of misery as we speak. A lot of times, I leave from us hanging out feeling worse than when I did before, and must keep a healthy distance.

     If I were this guy’s girlfriend, I would be so annoyed too. If I was dating some guy and he constantly said hunny, don’t I look like Keanu Reeves, I am so hot! My god I would dump him so fast…well he wouldn’t even make it past the first date if I already saw that side of him. And from her describing her measurements, she is just average. Sorry hunny, you are just average! I am 7 inches taller than you with the same measurements, and I don’t go around boasting that I am america’s next top model, or do I even think in terms like that! I would never ask a man to tell me that I looked like one either. In fact, it would annoy me and I would say “ya know what hun, I would hope that you value my other qualities as much as how you think I look”.

     This girl is way to obsessed with celebrities. Those pictures are all photo shopped anyways. All she values is the way she looks. Yes he boyfriend is mature and not as superficial and wanted the perfect package of looks, intelligence, and personality, and my goodness be flattered that he likes all of you and doesn’t care whether you look like a celebrity or not, and thank the Lord for that! You want some guy who only wants you if you look a certain way, and would dump you if you put on few lbs? Screw that where did you end up with these twisted priorities? Wouldn’t you rather a man love you than see you as just arm candy?!?!

     He probably started retaliating after she constantly begged him to tell her she looked like everyone on tv. You can’t force a man to constantly tell you how hot you are. If you force them it’s just a drain on them, and it’s annoying so he probably finally snapped and said dude give it up you don’t look like them, you are pretty, but you are never going to be Angelina Jolie! And I don’t blame her bf one bit, that shit is so annoying, and and people like that are such a drag to be around. If they are that superficial, like that one girl mentioned above, they need to go find people who are just as vapid as they are, and leave the people with substance and more grounded interests alone because the two types have no long term compatibility in friendships or romantic relationships.
     I can promise you that when a girl like that hangs out with my friends, when she is gone, they start laughing at her. And when that girl finds a meathead guy who tells her she needs to lose weight or work out more, or get boobs to be hotter she takes what he says seriously, thinks he is wonderful and that he such a good influence on her and loves that he told her that. If some guy told me that he would probably get slapped.

     Shallow people need to find each other and go be shallow together. End of story.

213. Elizabeth 213

     In my opinion, men who come across aloof, or indifferent, or “not into you” usually do this as a form of emotional abuse. Quick and easy solution…leave. Leave that situation. A great woman doesn’t deserve a man that doesn’t have the sensitivity to perhaps say “sweetie, I think you are beautiful”. What’s so difficult about being sensitive to your partner, and perhaps occasionally–realizing she has an insecurity–since we all have insecurities at one point or another. It’s not about reading her mind. I don’t believe a man should have to constantly validate her–and remind her that he finds her attractive. But if his actions say it all, and he is attentive, that should be enough. Not sure why any woman would compare themselves to celebrities? or to any other woman for that matter. Makes absolutely no sense. However, it is nice to know your boyfriend finds you beautiful, nothing wrong with that. And especially after a few years of dating. It’s natural to want to be attractive to your partner.

214. Parfait_One 214

     I was originally going to say this guy sounds like a game-player, wanting to keep his hot gf interested & never telling her outright he thinks she’s hot. But after seeing Diana’s second post I realise he was just an insincere sleazebag who was settling for whatever he could get. And she picked up on this, as women often do, and it made her feel insecure. That’s what probably made her say what she said, about being hotter than Angelina Jolie (not ‘the hottest woman in the world’ as some here have been saying). I think ultimately what she said took guts.

     I was once living in a very small community where I suspected racism. It was never blatant so I always doubted my thoughts. Until one day when I was in a car with a woman talking about sunscreen and I happened to mention that my family was always telling me to watch out for sunburn “because of my milky-white skin”. I don’t know why, but that last part was very hard to say. The woman I was saying it to was white, Anglo-Saxon. I am so white I was once asked to play a vampire bride in the school play even with tons of foundation on. But I’m not Anglo. And this woman goes to me, “No, YOU don’t have milky-white skin; you’re olive. MY skin is milky-white.” And she stretched out a pale, freckly arm for me to judge for myself. It was then that I realised I had been right all along about the racism and I was glad I’d had the guts to put myself out there figuratively and subconsciously DEMAND a response to my suspicions. Sometimes you need to make comments like Diana’s in order to find out the truth once and for all. Because the truth is that if her guy was really into her (and I do believe she is a very beautiful girl), he would not only not have had eyes for anyone else, he would have thought Angelina Jolie ugly, as so many men I’ve spoken to whose gfs look completely different to Angelina usually do.

215. cat 215

     I don’t agree with a lot of posters that say Diana is insecure & has low self esteem. I think quite the opposite, she TOLD her bf she was as hot as AJ & she probably is! I think he is the insecure one & that is why he disagreed, to try & knock her down a notch. Sounds like he was dating “up” & she was dating “down”…good for you Diana for leaving him!

216. Clare 216

     I laughed when I read this letter which was written in by Diana. It made me think of myself when I was 18 or so.

     Thankfully I grew up and blessed my good fortune that I was born good looking, but by no means the best looking person on the planet. I know this, and I don’t expect my boyfriend to say that I am. I am quite aware that there are women more beautiful than me. I am in touch enough with reality to know this, why can’t he be?

     The point is, he does find me beautiful, and he makes me feel beautiful. He does love and doesn’t intend to cheat on me or leave me. If the day comes when our relationship becomes dependent on me being the hottest woman in the world, I’ll know that’s a relationship I no longer want to be in.

217. Lynn 217

     There are quite a few things to point out regarding how biased you’re being in your answer Evan.
     - First off I’ve read it over and over again and NEVER does she say that she said “hey honey aren’t I as hot as Angelina Jolie?” So how you assumed that is still beyond me.
     - Second of off you saw nothing wrong with a guy saying that his girlfriend is pretty but AJ is beautiful and she’s crazy to even compare herself. There is something seriously wrong with that. Its something a man should never say period!
     - You automatically ascribed to some pathetic teenaged boy, LA belief that if a woman is on tv she is leagues hotter than everyone else. No I don’t think I’m hotter than AJ, but if a guy told me I couldn’t compare myself to Jennifer Aniston-there would be a problem. Because I am more attractive than JA! Flat out- and the fact that she’s on tv doesn’t make that statement an impossibility. Frankly I work in a place where celebrities come in almost daily and I am almost always more attractive than these women in real life-get compliments from them regularly as a matter of fact. Not saying that would be the case with AJ but please don’t say it’s absurd for “normal” women to compare themselves to celebs. That’s your definition of mature? My definition of mature is knowing celebs are smoke and mirrors and aren’t so perfect you can’t compare. I disagree that a man who doesn’t realize that a celeb is a normal woman (within reason some are actually gorgeous) is somehow mature.
     - You have no idea what this girl looks like so how are you deciding that it was ridiculous for her to get mad that she was given such an answer?
     - You suggested that the supposedly male way of doing things bluntly was correct rather than tactless. Amazing! You also forgot that along with being less blunt women lie to their significant others. ALL THE TIME! And there are idiot men on here making comments about not caring about their looks. Well there are other things men care about that we lie about just to make our men feel good and yes we’re entitled to the same sometimes. Most of the time the fact is: no you were not as good in bed as I claimed, yes I would like it if you made more money, yes I faked an orgasm last night, yes your penis could be a bit bigger, I DO miss that guy I dated in college that could last for hours, yes you gained weight and its turning me off.
     A few years ago I started being as “honest” to my boyfriends as they were to me and let me tell you it did not go over well! So don’t even try that crap about men being more honest. They’re honest, they’re also used to us stroking their ego so again if they have to do it sometimes that’s just part of a relationship.

     If this girl said “hey honey do you think I’m hotter than AJ” and he tactfully said something like Fiona suggested or even got annoyed and flat out said he didn’t, you would be spot on with your response. But there is no evidence that that happened and so this is complete crap.

218. Evan Marc Katz 218

     @Lynn #217 “If this girl said “hey honey do you think I’m hotter than AJ” and he tactfully said something like Fiona suggested or even got annoyed and flat out said he didn’t, you would be spot on with your response. But there is no evidence that that happened and so this is complete crap.”

     Diana #154 “To clarify how the conversation went: I never asked my (now ex) b/f if I was hotter than AJ. I stated it, saying something like “yeah I am just as hot as she is” – to which he responded “what are you crazy?” and I said “excuse me?” and then the whole conversation how I am not that hot but pretty enough ensued.”
     
     

219. JSYA 219

     I have been lucky enough to have been really in love twice in my life and I can honestly say that, although society may not have chose those men as being #1 most physically attractive, I most certainly would have, and it’s not just because I am viewing them as “the whole package”, personality included, it is because to me they are most attractive. My first love once told me unsolicited that I was the most beautiful woman he had ever seen, met, or imagined, and I know in my heart that he felt it. I love the way I look and have been told many times that I am beautiful, but am I the most beautiful in the world? I don’t know- I would expect ,however, the man I love to believe that I am the most beautiful because beauty is subjective and because if I loved him, I would find him most handsome. For example, I believe Angelina Jolie is very beautiful, however many men I know think Jennifer Aniston is better looking…to me, Jennifer Aniston is plain and nowhere near as beautiful as Angelina-but what do I know? everyone has a different perception of what is beautiful, and every woman deserves to be “most beautiful” to the man she loves.

220. chnlove 220

     If this girl said “hey honey do you think I’m hotter than AJ” and he tactfully said something like Fiona suggested or even got annoyed and flat out said he didn’t, you would be spot on with your response. But there is no evidence that that happened and so this is complete crap.

221. ulrike 221

     I’ve read a lot on your page and in most cases you give very good advise, but in this case I believe you got it completely wrong. By telling Diana she is not as hot as Angelina, Diana would naturally understand that she is worth less then the actress and that her boyfriend would leave her if Angelina ever gave him a chance. I doubt her boyfriend meant it that way. He was probably simply comparing body form in inches or whatever. If a man told me that some famous person is better looking than me (unless he mentions in the same sentence that he prefers me nevertheless)  I’d kick up a fuss and make sure he understands that this really hurts my feelings. I am not the most beautiful person on the planet, and yet….I want my boyfriend to think that I am. Because in this society beauty in a woman represents value, sad but simple. No woman wants to feel second best!

222. Tory 222

     It’s interesting how each gender projects their own ideas into this argument, including Evan. I don’t know how the conversation went down, but it’s sounds stupid and definitely not worth a break-up the type of thing you fake pout about and laugh to let the guy know you didn’t really care that much. When a guy tells me “You’re so pretty, I don’t know why you’re with me.” I’m not going to say, “It’s not your looks I can tell you that.” (although that is really fun to say) I’m going to say, “Are you kidding? You’re just as hot as I am.” I don’t care if it’s the truth, and I don’t really give a damn about their feelings, but if they’re going to continue the whole relationship thinking in the back of their head that I’m more attracted to everyone else then the relationship is not going to work, trust me on that. BTW Angelina Jolie looks like a scarecrow and has pancake boobs, and that doesn’t make me pathetic. It’s the truth. Ask any guy who actually has a brain.

223. Kim 223

     I think that this is a touchy subject for most people. IMO, there really is no such thing as THE most beautiful/ smart woman or man because people are too varied and unique to always compare. That said, I think her boyfriend took this response too literally. I think if a woman is asking this type of question she is looking more for validation of being beautiful. She in all honesty knows she has competition, but you want to know that your partner places you in mind, body and spirit high on his totem pole. Men don’t really ask this beauty type of question about themselves to their partners but if say, your man asked if he were the best lover in bed you have had, would you flat out say ” Honestly no Ive had better but your not bad,” or would you try to reword your statement to say ” sex isn’t everything its the whole package that makes me love you.”

224. Olivia K. 224

     I don’t know anything about the background of your relationship, Diana, but I’m wondering if your boyfriend is the jealous/insecure type. It’s not uncommon for insecure men to deliberately withhold compliments from their girlfriends in fear that it will go to  their lady’s head and cause their gf to seek a “better” man. If you’re pretty secure with your looks but still felt the need to ask your man something like that, than obviously you’re wondering how he feels about your looks or if he’s attracted to you. Does he tell you you’re beautiful or otherwise let you know how attracted he is to you consistently? I can’t say for sure of course, but if not, there’s a chance he’s just being an insecure little prick and trying to make you question your own attractiveness. This same thing is happening to me. Pretty much my whole life, people have made kind of a big deal about my looks and I’m used to turning heads and being called “beautiful”. By realistic standards, my boyfriend isn’t what most people would consider Brad Pitt or whatever. But to me, he looks as good as anyone could ever look and I’m very, very attracted to him and he looks perfect to me no matter what. Literally. So that’s where my confusion comes in.  I always look my best for him, but when I meet up with him, he never says a thing about the way I look. I’ve noticed that it actually seems like he’s deliberately holding back from commenting. And when he does compliment me, which is seldom, it’s very bland and dispassionate, as if he’s forcing himself to. On my birthday, I wore a beautiful dress and got all dolled up and the only thing he said, was halfway through dinner when he said “Your dress is pretty.” Really?! Just the dress?? I totally feel your pain and frustration. When you’re in love with someone, you’re in love with every aspect of them, and the love you feel for them shines through their looks and you get those rose-colored glasses that make you think that they’re the most beautiful thing you’ve ever seen, even if on a conscious level you know it’s not exactly the truth. But you really believe it. That’s why it’s so frustrating because you think this about your man, and you also know how attractive you are, and when your boyfriend makes you feel like you’re not good enough for him, than it makes you fell that you’re not good enough, which spawns resentment. I don’t care if other people call me shallow for this either, but I’ve decided this is a big enough deal for me to consider whether I really want to be with my man or not. I’ve realized he’s not all that I’ve cracked him up to be. Why? I want him to feel loved and attractive and for him to know that no one compares to him in my eyes, because I love him. If he doesn’t want me to know, or care that I feel the same way I make him feel, than he probably doesn’t love me as much as I love him. It’s very selfish and hurtful and I’d never do that to him. I’ve had guys that really seem to think I’m the most beautiful girl on the planet and I know that I can have that again, and for everything I’m willing to do for my men, I deserve it. 
      
     ps. in the future, never compare yourself  to other women privately, or out loud, but especially not to your boyfriend. Don’t set yourself up to feel badly, and don’t let him know how insecure you are about your looks. If he sees you comparing yourself, it just makes it okay for him to compare you to other women as well.

225. Lucy 225

     It doesn’t have to mean that the woman is insecure but every woman needs some kind of verbal reinforcement from her partner. So people should so sensitivity without being false. At the same time, I don’t think you should ask a question when you don’t want to hear the honest answer. I don’t believe women should play emotional games with men and try to make them act in a certain way as opposed to being more direct.

     I want not feel upset if a boyfriend told me Angelina Jolie is hot. I might say “Hey I think she’s pretty hot too” but it depends on when it’s said. 

226. Vanna 226

     So, my boyfriend apparently doesn’t think I’m the most beautiful thing ever either…  lol.  In fact, he says his ex-wife could do porn because she’s so attractive, but since she cheated on him etc… he’s learned that there’s more to love than looks.  While I applaud that attitude that he shared with me when we first started our relationship – OUCH for me!!!  And what is weird is that I’ve seen his ex-wife in person and she’s got a huge honker, a really bad crater face and a body like a teen boy…. LOL…  Anyways, I could care less.  I’ve never asked him to tell me how beautiful I am or asked him if he thinks I’m beautiful.  I KNOW I’m beautiful to myself and that’s all that matters.  Would it be great if I had a boyfriend who told me how beautiful I am? – probably couldn’t hurt but I don’t need that validation.  He isn’t Brad Pitt either…  The thing that is most important to both of us is that we love each other deeply, we are sexually attracted to each other, we appreciate it others’ attributes and qualities, we have a great sex life, we are 1000% compatible and committed to each other forever and that we are HAPPY TOGETHER.  We haven’t been together a year yet, but we live together and are old enough to have chosen each other with clear headed experienced adult minds.  Our love for each other is still deepening and growing.  No one forced this relationship on the other, we have let it take its own course naturally.  There’s nothing like having a relationship where both people are secure in themselves and where both people are able to choose a significant other with good character traits and the right “mix” of characteristics…  Beauty grows out of a secure love.  I can objectively say that neither my boyfriend nor I are the most beautiful people in the world – but my love of him makes him the most beautiful man to me and I know he feels the same way about me.

227. Ben 227

     After reading the first couple comments, I have to say:

     Woman do want to be lied too. In fact I’m willing to bet it even extends to the male spectrum a bit as well. If everyone were blunt and truth tellers, we’d be at WW20 and everyone would probably lean towards a gay stature as it’s a common belief that women understand women and men understand men.

     A woman like amanda who says she does not want to be lied too, only affirms the fact that women, are always insecure in some shape or form. And women like amanda state statements such as those only to affirm thier own belief that they are not. Because she is insecure in that thought process that she is somehow not as “high and mighty” (in a more passive sense) to believe herself to be any other way. 

     Because if you think you are this person, that is always who your are going to be, and you cannot believe input from anyone else but yourself. And that my friends is insecurity.

     As I said it can descend into the male spectrum as well so all of this can apply to men. 

     what people really need is the ability to handle intense outside stimuli to their core inner being to truly understand themselves as a whole.

228. Melody 228

     Well, I’m guessing this girl is pretty hot and that’s where she gets her personal validation. Because only pretty girls go around asking people to confirm their beauty (the rest of us feel the risk of being told “no”!).
     On the other hand – I dated a guy who wouldn’t tell me I was beautiful, in the name of honesty, and it was a big fat bummer.  I know I’m not the prettiest girl in the room, probably ever. But I want the guy I date to be able to tell me I’m beautiful.
      
      
      

229. Same Problem 229

     I have a very similar problem as the OP.

     I know I’m good-looking.  My whole life I’ve had random people walk up to me to let me know how beautiful they think I am.  Several times a year I am randomly given business cards from photographers who want me to model for them.  I used to model.  I’m an actress who’s been in some independent films.  Guys’ heads turn when I walk by, they sometimes stare with that transfixed-mouth-agape look until they realize what they’re doing or their buddy nudges them in the shoulder.  When I ask how I compare to different celebrities it’s because I’m working towards being amongst them and I want feedback.  

     I just discovered that my boyfriend of two years only thinks I’m “alright” looking.  He thinks I’m the least attractive girl in our friend group.  When I said I thought I was beautiful and even elegant, he looked at me like I was crazy and said I had a very high opinion of myself.  He’s also indicated that I’m crazy to compare myself to celebrities, “we’re just average people, of course they’re super hot and you’re not.”  He genuinely thinks I’m not that great looking.  He sees it as a good thing that he loves me despite the fact that he only thinks I’m average-looking at best.  In general it’s a good thing because who I am is more important than I look and looks only fade with time, but it’s still very upsetting because I am very good looking.
     I’m glad that he’s stopped lying to me and was finally honest about what he thinks.  This whole time he’s just been skirting the issue whenever my looks came up by giving me a white lie and then offering me little tips and advise to make myself look good (like – maybe you should ask Friend X for advise on how to put your best foot forward…).  I’ve noticed my confidence in my looks slowly deteriorating over the course of our relationship as a result of his well-placed and subtle comments.  I’m not the best at picking up on subtlety so I was unaware of what it was that was having this deleterious effect.  

     If he had let me know from the beginning how he actually viewed me it would have saved me a lot of turmoil that has resulted from his decision to tell me the truth after two years of “white” lies.  (As an aside, white lies should always just be called “lies.”)

     I’m not sure now if I can trust him.  I think if I had a history of being unattractive I would have recognized his lies sooner.

     I’m also not sure if I want to be with someone who thinks he’s settling on someone less attractive.  I feel like my looks are being wasted. I love him but I can’t stop thinking about how unattractive he thinks I am and how much more attracted he is to other girls in our group than he is to me.  This leads me down the road of dangerous logic: if he’s just settling on me then he clearly just doesn’t think he could get anyone better, he wasn’t able to get the other girls he thinks are more attractive.  I realize I sound a little crazy.  I don’t know why this hurts me so much and makes me so angry.  I’m at a loss.  

     I don’t want the guy I’m with to lie to me, I just want him to find me more attractive than most other people – when I’m in love, I become less attracted to everyone except the person I’m in love with.  I’ve done research and this phenomena is supposed to occur in males as well.  Everything except this suggests that he’s truly in love with me.

     I don’t think this is a reflection of “insecurity” about my looks, as Evan suggests.  I also don’t think the solution would be for my boyfriend to continue lying to me – as has also been suggested.  I think some of the other responders might be right, maybe it does come down to a female psychological need.  But knowing this doesn’t provide me with any idea how I should proceed.  I don’t know if I can spend the rest of my life with him knowing that 1) he thinks I’m uglier than all the other people we’re around on a regular basis, and 2) he thinks I’m uglier than the majority of other people on the planet do.

230. marymary 230

     Same 
     Heres an idea. you could dump him and find someone who isn’t a jerk?
      

231. Sara 231

     I don’t know how old this post is, but I’d like to add a couple things in. Men keep saying they don’t understand why women want men to lie to them, he was honest, respect his honesty, etc. Logically, yes, that’s true. But emotion is not logical. I don’t want a man to lie to me, but , I am about to turn 40, so, no matter what younger women will say I have to admit it: When I have PMS I am the most insecure woman on the planet…or at least in the room. There are times when a woman needs a bit of reassurance. The OP asked for it in a kind of immature way. I would like a man to understand that for about 3 days out of the month, a little extra affection or attention goes a long way. The rest of the month, I feel great, sexy, wonderful, but for those few days, I feel fat, ugly, unloveable. Also, I’d like to point out to Evan that I, too, have been in love with a guy who was by no means the most attractive I’ve ever seen, but when I was in love with him, he was to me. I can’t explain it, but his giant ears were adorable. Once we split up, of course, I thought WTF??And I’d also like to point out that not all women find Brad Pitt attractive (me, for one), and not all men find Angelina Jolie attractive.
     To #229, your letter doesn’t sound like it’s about needing reassurance, this guy is chipping away at your self-esteem. Dump him, fast, because he is toxic. Having a good opinion of yourself is great and healthy, having a man give you tips to improve your looks? No. I was with a guy who constantly reminded me that he could do so much better. I felt so awful and ugly by the time I left him that I needed years of counseling. (It escalated from the emotional abuse, but that’s where you are right now.)

232. Pat 232

     I think some people are just better at seeing “beauty” than others. There are some people who can only see beauty in terms of superficial looks, and these are the people who tend to use the 1-10 scale. And there are people for whom beauty is more subjective – the person who cares about them, cheers them up when they are feeling down, listens to them talk about their concerns and worries – and, at the end of the day, is there for them – is the person who they find much more “beautiful” than Angelina Jolie. I think my partner is the most beautiful person in the world, much more beautiful than any celebrity.

233. Mary 233

     Hi Evan,

     I agree with you.

     Although its a hard reality to accept, we are not perfect.  Not even people who are incredibly beautiful, smart and have everything else in life. There will always be someone who is better (or worst) than you in some way, thats reality.

     I think its human nature to compare ourselves and want to be the best girl in the world, but its also childish.  As adults we must realize that comparing ourselves to others isn’t always useful.  It’ll only make you feel bad about yourself because if you are an average person there are a lot of people who will score higher in looks, money, and intelligence.  Even for the people who are above average, there are still plenty of people who beat them.  

     Most people know they aren’t perfect but they expect their boyfriends to make them feel perfect by thinking they are. That way we can feel a bit better about ourselves.  And then when they don’t, the girl freaks out.  Which is silly.  But i think this all stems from insecurity and the desire to be one of the ‘best’.  Or in the top percentile for every good quality one can possess, which is highly unlikely for most of us.

     So my suggestion is that we stop comparing ourselves and that we stop bringing our boyfriends into it.  There is no rule that says: you must be the most beautiful, smartest women around to have happy relationships and a fulfilled life.  And there is no rule that says your boyfriend only really loves you if he thinks you are the most beautiful, smartest around.  If that was the case, the wide majority of us wouldn’t have boyfriends.  Flawless beauty is just like a fancy car or tons of extra money, its nice to have but its not necessary for a happy relationship or a happy life.

     I hope this perspective helps you understand more fully what Evan was trying to say (if i understood it correctly).  Try to accept that you are a flawed human being, there are people who are better in some ways than you and there are people who are worst in some ways than you, and thats absolutely ok you can still find happiness, just stop comparing.  And for christ sakes don’t get your boyfriend to compare you either and force him to lie, thats even worst.  I think it’s much better to be honest.

234. Mary 234

     I’d like to add one more thing.  It’s one thing, asking your boyfriend an unfair question like “you think i’m hotter than Angelina Jolie right?” and expecting him to say yes just so you feel a little better about yourself. And its a whole other story with “same problem” who essentially stated that she is confident with the way she looks and then her boyfriend puts her down and gives her reasons why she shouldnt be. a) you are the least hottest of your friends b) I dont really find you that attractive. Okay he is being honest but his honesty is only causing pain in this instance and was totally uncalled for.  And then he states that he’s so proud of himself to go out with someone who looks like her and only care about he personality.  I think its important to be comfortable wherever your fall on the looks scale (whether you are 1 or a 10) but the guy you are with shouldn’t be trying to make you feel LESS comfortable, thats messed up.  In Diana’s example her boyfriend at least still says “i like you and find you good looking and attractive” so its not like he’s trying to make her feel bad about herself, he’s just being honest. This other guy is like “I dont know why you have such a high opinion of yourself”  now thats messed up, why shouldn’t she feel happy with where she is on the looks scale?  I just wanted to point this out because in my opinion thats the difference between when its a deal breaker and when its not.

235. Caroline 235

     Just had to say, definitely agreeing with Amanda and Heather on this one. Nobody wants to feel second choice, and if a person is going say his woman is beneath somebody else, then he ought to be coy. Women are practically programmed by society to value their own beauty and that men do, too. It’s this oh-so huge and important thing and it IS very threatening to have it degraded (as in, down from grade A to grade B, which is “good” but still a downgrade) by the man who should value it the most.

236. Desirae 236

     Okay, honestly, I think this is all bs. I kind of think Evan is wrong in a way by automatically assuming that a guy can’t think that the girl he loves isn’t perfect and more beautiful than any other woman  without it being a lie. My husband always tells me that I’m beautiful and that he feels that I’m a perfect 10 without me even asking him. He honestly does feel that I’m more beautiful than any celebrity in his eyes, and I don’t even bring it up. Sure, he finds other women to be attractive as well, but in his eyes, I still top all of them.

     Hell, even his friends, family, and coworkers tell me that he always talks about how perfect he thinks I am and that he gushes about me often. He even shows off pictures from our wedding day and from dates to people a whole lot whenever given the chance. Are you saying that he’s not only lying to me, but all of those people as well? I don’t think you can speak for every guy out there.

     I can kind of see how the OP would feel hurt if her boyfriend only called her pretty and not beautiful, too. Beautiful is a much more meaningful compliment in my opinion, because beautiful doesn’t just describe physical appearance, but everything about a person as a whole, including their personality, mind, and heart. Pretty is just restricted to appearance, and nothing more. It doesn’t have much substance to it, if that makes any sense. 

     Is it really wrong for her to want to be seen that way by someone she loves or has feelings for? I don’t think it is. 

     Then again, what do I know? My husband and I have very romantic personalities, and to some people, maybe we overly romanticize one another, but it’s not like the things we do for one another and say to each other are not an expression of our true feelings. We mean every bit of it, and we each put the other’s happiness above our own.

     To me, the OPs boyfriend isn’t really considerate of how his girlfriend would feel by answering the way he did. He really could have at least been more gentle about the way he answered. And really, I hate the “just being honest” excuse. You can be honest without sounding like a complete jackass. Just saying.

237. Karl R 237

     Desirae said: (#236)
     “Hell, even his friends, family, and coworkers tell me that he always talks about how perfect he thinks I am and that he gushes about me often.”

     It sounds like he’s affected by limerance (a state of perpetual infatuation). It’s uncommon. It can be an asset when it occurs inside of a marriage. It can be horrible if it happens when the other person is not interested in the person with limerance.

     Your husband is not representative of the population in general. He’s an exception to the rule.

     Desirae said: (#236)
     “Beautiful is a much more meaningful compliment in my opinion, because beautiful doesn’t just describe physical appearance, but everything about a person as a whole, including their personality, mind, and heart.”

     Thank you for sharing your definition of beautiful.

     When my wife describes something as “beautiful”, she’s frequently refering to things which don’t have personalities, minds or hearts (a sunset, a dress, a bird…)

     If you decide to change the connotation behind a word, it’s unwise to assume that everyone else has decided to spontaneously adopt the same connotation.

     Desirae said: (#236)
     “Is it really wrong for her to want to be seen that way by someone she loves or has feelings for? I don’t think it is.”

     Frustration occurs when your expectations exceed realtiy. If Diana’s expectations can only be met by rare individuals (like your husband) who have limerance, then she’s going to face disappointment after disappointment in her relationships.

238. Amelia 238

     Thumbs up Vanna @ 226.
     I’m fully aware that my boyfriend has the hots for certain celebrities.  I might even sincerely congratulate him if he had the chance to score with, say, Christina Applegate or Scarlett Johansson- because that would be a serious accomplishment, and my bet is that he’d get struck by lightning or win the lottery first.

     Thing is?  I have my “would-do” list, too, and he knows it.  And we joke about it.  I understand where others may not agree, but I simply don’t consider this subject to be a shady, oblique criticism of the other person or relationship.

     As far as the author of the letter– nevermind if he does or doesn’t think you’re the hottest thing on two legs.  Will he still want you even after seeing you when you’ve just rolled out of bed, gained a couple of pounds, or otherwise look like frazzled shit?  Yes?  Then what’s the worry?   Is Angelina Jolie your sister? (kidding)

239. Danielle 239

     Okay, first of all Diana never mentions anything about her ASKING her boyfriend for his opinion. Second of all, I think you’re all forgetting beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Therefore Angelina being the hottest woman is an OPINION and NOT a FACT, so it is very possible for him to have told her she was the most beautiful woman in his eyes without it being a lie. Afterall, usually when a person really truly loves a someone, they are the most attractive person inside and out in his or her eyes so I don’t know why everyone is bashing on her. There’s nothing wrong with her feeling the way she does, wanting to be the most desireable one to a man I’m assuming she loves. Personally I would be beyond upset if my man was comparing me to other woman, celebrities or not. Lovers are supposed to make you feel wonderful and good about yourself, not create insecurities like he has clearly done to her. If your man doesn’t see you as the most desireable woman in the world, then you should probably find a new one who will. :)

240. Elaine 240

     I agree with those who said beauty is in the eye of the beholder. When I am in love with someone that person is the most beautiful person in the whole world to me and I don’t care what everyone else thinks. If he is not, why would I be with him? Similarly, I don’t care if everyone thinks I am ugly but I want to be with a man who feels that I am the most beautiful woman to him. I don’t need others to validate me, nor do I care what they think. All I want is to feel that the person I love has chosen me, NOT settled for me.
     I know most guys don’t place much importance on their own looks especially if they are “average” looking but how would an average size man feel if his girlfriend said “you know, you are ok, but don’t even compare your unit to porn stars”? or “I have been with better lovers than you”…
     Seriously…
     I have a habit of thinking Is it true? Is it kind? Is it necessary? before I say anything… In this case, I feel that telling his girlfriend “the truth” was NOT kind nor necessary… There are so many ways to be diplomatic without insulting anyone and without verbal abuse. She was insulted, and thus it was verbal abuse IMHO

241. Sylvie 241

     I may be coming in late on this, but it sure was a lively discussion! In my case, I used to be hot stuff – when I was skinny and insecure. Now I’m fatter, gravity is starting to take its inevitable toll, and I know that my enthusiasm and appreciation for men goes a lot further than my previous bids for assurance.
     The joke’s on me, though – my lover really IS the sexiest man I’ve ever seen, and is frequently mistaken for Mr. Clooney. I wouldn’t bother asking him a question like that – its irrelevant. He thinks I’m very pretty, and I have moments (when the lighting is right) that I’m drop-dead gorgeous. Better than that? I know what turns him on, on all cylinders, not just sexually. And, we talk, and are unfailingly polite to each other.
     I never thought George Clooney was all that, anyway.

242. Joe 242

     Jessica Alba is way hotter than Angelina Jolie, she is starting to look old to me.
     Back to the main point.  
     What is this chick’s poor bf supposed to do?  Does she really want a relationship built on lies?  It seems many women do.  Why can’t he just say I’m the most beautiful woman in the world?  Why can’t he just say he loves me?  Why can’t he just pretend he wants something permanent?  So accustomed to having everything to her liking that  anything which is not, is completely unacceptable, even if it only exists in someone else’s mind.
     And if he continually concedes to her “crisis du jour” she will decide he is weak and uninteresting.

243. Elaine 243

     “I asked Blake, ‘Dude, why didn’t you tell me I got fat?’ He said, ‘It’s not my job to tell you you’re fat. It’s my job to tell you you’re beautiful.” -Miranda Lambert (re: Blake Shelton)

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