Why Wealthy Divorced Women Don’t Remarry And Men Do

Why Wealthy Divorced Women Don't Remarry And Men Do

According to a survey of 5000 members of MillionareMatch.com, 83% of divorced men would consider marriage in the next five years, while only 32% of divorced women would do the same.

That’s a huge disparity, and while the gap is a little surprising, the findings are not.

The article on MarketWatch does a pretty good job of explaining why. Here’s the paragraph that hit home for me:

“Why are wealthy divorced women more likely to decide to remain single? “It’s much harder for divorced males to be alone than females,” says Fran Walfish, a psychotherapist in Beverly Hills, Calif. Unlike men, she says, “a woman’s ego cannot bear to tolerate a man using her for her money. She needs to know she is loved—rich or poor—flaws and all.”

Women need to learn to respect lower-earning spouses the same exact way men do – for their character, kindness, warmth, attractiveness, and support, instead of looking down on them.

As a dating coach for smart, strong, successful women, I’ve seen this up close, and think that this is a genuine obstacle for women to overcome. I’ve written a lot about gender, money, and equality, and believe that the entire point of having money is that it gives you the freedom to marry for love rather than security. This is what wealthy men do. Male millionaires (smartly) don’t seek out female millionaires because, to them, it doesn’t matter what she makes. All that matters is how she makes him feel: appreciated, accepted, adored.

Female millionaires – despite being equal to their male counterparts – have a huge block against dating a man with less money. Where men take delight in picking up dinners and vacations for their lower-earning spouses, women become resentful that their spouses can’t carry their weight. Which is pretty silly when you are a millionaire with the means to do whatever you want. Women need to learn to respect lower-earning spouses the same exact way men do – for their character, kindness, warmth, attractiveness, and support, instead of looking down on them. Until they do, they’re going to remain single, surrounded by money, surrounded by friends, but without a significant other to share the ride.

Like many women – the risk is not worth the potential reward.

My 67-year-old mom – who I recently visited with my family – has absolutely no desire to date, despite the profession of her son. She likes her friends, her card games, her home improvement projects, her grandkids, her dinner parties, her travel, etc. Of course she does. But, in a rare moment of candor, she confesses to me that she’s lonely, and I continue to wonder why she chooses solitude over partnership. To her – like many women – the risk is not worth the potential reward.

Yet to 83% of divorced millionaire men, the risk IS worth it. Which is why those men don’t stay on the market very long. So while I really don’t judge anybody’s life choices – whatever makes you happy – I do find it curious that men are so much more willing to spend their money on partners and take the risk of getting hurt.

Your thoughts below are greatly appreciated.

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Comments:

  1. 1
    Claire

    Women give up a lot when they are married. I spent 18 years married to a man who struggled with my career and the time I needed to spend to achieve my goals and maintain our lifestyle. What was ironic is that he was in the same professional sector and had to work as hard as I did, yet I was expected to “understand” his commitments.

    Too many men move to fast and I am not talking necessarily physically, but emotionally also. They do not listen to queues from women and as a result end up trashing an otherwise good relationship. I am 46 and divorced, date 3-4x a week. My divorce was final April of this year, but I had been separated for about 2 years. There have been a number of men who I have barely known for not more than two or three weeks (have not been intimate with) and have asked me to go on a week long trip with them or made plans for us to move in together. Men, women need time also, we have lives before you, especially at this age. Can we just have fun at first without all this heavy talk about the rest of our lives?

    1. 1.1
      Mickey

      “Women give up a lot when they are married.”

      And guys DON’T?

      1. 1.1.1
        Claire

        Mickey– I am sure some guys do– everyone gives up stuff to be in a relationship, but we do that for everything. There is always a trade off. I was speaking more from my experience– where it was not a trade off– I got nothing in return. Probably why I am divorced.

      2. 1.1.2
        Bridgettweeter

        MEN give up the idea of random sex with random women and the freedom to hang out all the time. Women give up a whole lot more WEATHER men like it or not. 

        1. Alex

          Like what exactly? What more do you give up than men? Please enlighten me. I assume we’re talking about millionaire’s or at least upper middle class men and women, so the whole ‘women are expected to do more housework and childrearing’ argument doesn’t apply; since these income groups usually pay other people to do house work or look after the kids while working.

        2. JennNOLA

          *WHETHER*

    2. 1.2
      JennNOLA

      “Too many men move to fast … ” You got the “too” correct the first time, so I’ll say this was a true typo.

      “They do not listen to queues” In this usage, the spelling is “cues”. cue1

      kyo͞o/

      noun
       

      1.

      a thing said or done that serves as a signal to an actor or other performer to enter or to begin their speech or performance.

      So, you may be ‘wealthy’ but you appear uneducated.

    3. 1.3
      Chest Rockwell

      I would not be associated with any woman who dates 3-4 men per week. It doesn’t matter if you were married one day or one hundred years. This type of behavior is basically promiscuous and I would not be surprised if it was the number of partners you had prior to marriage that was a factor in your divorce.  A real man doesn’t accept this type of behavior. Unfortunately the American male has become a spineless caricature of what a self respecting man is.  If a woman has integrity and is respectful, she can have the long term relationship. 

      1. 1.3.1
        Evan Marc Katz

        Appreciate your username; disagree with your sentiment. Can men go out with multiple women at the same time in the process of looking for love? Or should you commit to every woman you meet or only see one woman at a time? If you believe that men and women should both only see one person at a time, I’d recommend you stay away from online dating. If you believe that men can date multiple women but women can’t date multiple men, you’re a hypocrite.

    4. 1.4
      R

      Listen to your queues?  Don’t you mean read your mind?  Women don’t know what they want but they are known for wanting what they can’t have?  What are us guys supposed to do if we can’t figure out women?  NOBODY understands women!  There is mob default do this with your woman and things will be good. Nope!  There is just try this and hope for the best. But after you have tried and failed many times, then what?  If we men ask the woman, what is it that you want, do we ever get an answer?  But you will leave and go out with your girlfriends and tell them exactly what you want or expect. Women have such unreasonably high expectations and your moody and so fn emotional that I am no longer surprised that relationships don’t work. I am thankful that I have no wife and no kids because the predictability of women is not good. Americanized women!  Think about that statement for a minute and ask yourself how many characteristics you have that would make you fit into the category of an Americanized woman. 

  2. 2
    JB

    I deal with this subject everyday online albeit not with “millionaire” women just with women(45-60) that after I do a little Google research on them I find out that they’re extremely well off. They themselves may or may not be in upper level management. Their ex hubby is a __________(doctor, lawyer, fill in the blank with any high status/earning title). Believe it or not there are a lot of these women on Match as we speak but when I search for their male counterpart they have very little if anything to choose from and wouldn’t even think of something so ridiculous as “dating down” to a guy (like me) making a paltry 100K. Even though in the looks department some of them may be a “4” and would have no value even to Joe Workboots let alone a man of equal status. Of course some are very attractive but then their ex is dating or married to someone 10-15 yrs younger than them who’s equally attractive. Wife/girlfriend 2.0 for well off men is rarely the same age as the first. Bottom line is, in the over 50 crowd because none of us really “needs” anyone for anything, unless someone “blows us away” with a connection(for men) or equal status, power, money (for women). We’ll all remain single…….and yes like Evan’s mom said “sometimes lonely”. :(

  3. 3
    Still-Looking

    My view is skewed because almost every well off woman I’ve known has money from family and/or ex-husband. Many of those who have been single for a while have invariably been screwed by gold-digging slackers so they are quite wary of being “taken” again. Others simply want to, at a minimum, maintain the standard of living they currently have. I went out with one lady who was receiving $8k/m in lifetime alimony and had a large nest egg from the divorce. She’s well aware that her alimony stops if she remarries and she told me that she would only remarry if the man signed a pre-nup to pay her at least that amount from the date of marriage and a considerably larger amount if the marriage ended in divorce. She’s certainly being fiscally prudent but her attitude, and the attitude of others, that what’s mine is mine and what’s yours is ours is quite a turn off to someone who has already been taken to the cleaners via the antiquated divorce laws.

    1. 3.1
      Claire

      Well some of us women get taken to the cleaners also. What really irks me is when some guy says you did well in your divorce, because I was able to buy a house. My money is not from my family nor my ex– I worked throughout my marriage and made the same and sometimes a little more than my ex. So half of the community property was rightly mine– unfortunately I got less.

      I think divorce is ugly and broad generalizations about either gender contribute to keeping us single and unhappy.

  4. 4
    Chance

    I believe that this is indicative of a pervasive problem in our society where many women only want the parts of equality that they like, while continuing to avoid the responsibilities that come with being truly equal. Women have demanded, and received, equal opportunity in the workplace. Further, women have demanded that they no longer be confined to the traditional roles that are tied to being a housewife. Men, by and large, have been accepting and accommodating to these expectations. However, many women have not changed their expectations of men, and they don’t want to accept the responsibility of bearing the majority (or even half) of the household and dating expenses.

    Women are free to do what they want, of course. However, it’s hard to really see them as equals until they are readily willing to marry men that make less, or pay for the majority of dates, in the same way that most men are readily willing to do so. Women’s refusal to be flexible when it comes to their potential partner’s financial capacity drastically reduces their chances of finding love, and it makes them appear to be inferior to men because it implies that they are dependent on men for financial support.

    Sadly, their own hardheadedness increases the likelihood that they will remain alone, and inferior.

    1. 4.1
      m

      Chance – 
      I don’t know what kind of women you’re running into, but as many complaints as you seem to have about “women who won’t date or marry men who make less” , I can’t help but wonder if you’ve asked around amongst your guy friends about how resistant they are to dating / marrying a woman who makes more than they do.
      All too frequently, men complain about women who “hold money over their heads” or “fling their money into men’s faces” — when all that’s really happening is that the women are going to work and working hard just like any other normal person … and it’s the men who are hypersensitive about how they feel their relative status is being perceived who are overreacting.
       
      (There’s another irony there, in view of those kinds of overreactions, about the societal perception of men being the “logical, rational” ones and women being “emotional”, but I don’t want to digress too far.)
       
      Especially when said “status” is something the woman couldn’t care less about (provided she’s taken reasonable precautions to safeguard her hard-earned money from the kind of man who only cares about how much of that he could get from her — and one could hope that she’d be able to see that before making a permanent commitment, but women can be vulnerable not only for safety-related reasons, but also because they get a lot of flack from society about being “unwanted” if they’re single — a little like this article’s subtext — and men can be crafty, deceptive manipulators) because she wants someone who loves her for her.
      I mean, the irony of this, as much as one whining and complaining as one hears from men about “gold-diggers” in the same breath, just really amazes me sometimes.

    2. 4.2
      DarthW

      You’re right Chance.  I’ve dated so many women who want to be “equals”, except when it comes to me spending all my money on dinner, movies, trips, and that would eventually lead to me spending all my cash on the bills while they have their earnings for frivolous shopping, etc.  Most women only want equality where it’s comfy for them.  Thankfully, I never married or they would have also fleeced me in a divorce.
      Single moms are the worst.  As the years go on it seems single moms feel entitled to all that men have.  I’ve had single moms deep in debt, who chose a deadbeat to have children with, who now have a couple kiddos and don’t get child support (course they act like best friends with the deadbeat).  Then, they get mad at me when I tell them if we would marry I won’t pay for their kids’ college because if I’d had my own kids I also wouldn’t pay for my own kids’ college since I worked for mine.  They think what’s mine is all for them and their kids, and think I should rescue them from the messes they created themselves.  So much for equality.

    3. 4.3
      dubbs

      BS. Women want a man who can at least match her financially because she knows she will be saddled with the majority of “unpaid work” which means a huge increase in her free hours spent doing housework, cleaning, cooking, laundry, and childcare while he kicks his feet up in front of the tv. Women still do the majority of “unpaid labor” while men enjoy the privilege of simply being men – exempt from the tedium and drudgery of “women’s work.” And don’t defend the once-a-week, five-minute tasks of taking out the trash or once-a-month mowing the lawn or once-a-year working on the car. The time spent doing unpaid household work is drastically disparate. Why would a woman who can afford to live independently go back to picking up and cleaning up after an ungrateful, entitled, lazy, selfish slob? For love? Please. Fool me once…
      sources: http://gas.sagepub.com/site/misc/Index/Classroom/Division_of_Household_Labor.xhtml

  5. 5
    Nissa

    Maybe Evan’s mom is just waiting for someone that stirs her heart. Maybe having lost one husband, perhaps she is not eager to experience that loss again. Statistically speaking men tend to die younger than women.

    Having seen both my parents (my parents divorced) as dating singles in their retirement years, I can say both of them feared greatly the loss of income that might result if they had a new partner without funds of his/her own; both felt unattractive due to medical issues and a no longer youthful body; both feared being used for money. From my vantage point, I felt they each had accumulated a host of fears in regard to life and relationships neither could overcome.

    Last, I live near a mobile home park for seniors and often see many men in their 60’s, who are either caregivers for their nearly disabled wives or living mostly separate, with their dogs as companions. I see them reaching out for friendship, companionship, etc from other men and strangers even. So while I see why Evan’s mother might hesitate, I see some lovely men out there that would be willing to accept a nice older woman just as she is, men who might be a bit scared about what a woman would expect from them.

    Perhaps a good talk about expectations and what Evan’s mom would like to have is in order? I had this talk with my Dad several times before he passed away, and know that he would have enjoyed just having someone to be a special person to him, to eat dinner with him, watch movies with him and to share days with him. Perhaps if Evan’s mom knew that not too much would be expected of her, she might be more willing to open to someone new.

    1. 5.1
      Joe

      FWIW, at birth life expectancy for American women is only 5 years greater than it is for men.  By the time people are 60, it’s only 3 years.

      1. 5.1.1
        Robyn

        Joe – Not sure what the source of your life expectancy stats are…
        The last time I looked into life expectancy stats for some one in my demographic (white, born in the mid-1960’s), average life expectancy for a male was 68, and for a female it was 75 = 7 years longer than the male.
        See the official CDC stats at: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr61/nvsr61_03.pdf.
        Interestingly enough, for those born in later decades (70’s, 80’s, 90’s) the gap between male & female life expectancy reduces. For people born in 2008, male life expectancy averages 76 and females average 81 – so the gap is down to 5 years (from 7).
        Given that most women are likely to marry a man close to them in age, or older, the average woman is highly likely to spend at least 10 or more years on her own after being widowed – and she will need to be able to finance those additional 10 or more years of life and health / medical / long-term care.
        I think this is a major factor in the decision by women “of some means” (significantly above average net worth, but not in the top 1%) to NOT re-marry – they have enough income & retirement savings to finance a comfortable life for one person but may not have enough to finance two people as well as those extra 10+ years they are likely to be alone and/or they can’t afford to lose any of their retirement savings in a future divorce (pre-nups are not infallible).

  6. 6
    starthrower68

    My 2-cents is that women are more adept at forming platonic relationships than men are, so while women get lonely, we can be fulfilled enough in our other relationships to get by. If a man wants to fill that need for relationship or companionship, he seeks out a woman because women tend to be the relationship builders. I don’t think guy friends share the same level of emotional intimacy and vulnerability that female friends do. Just a guess.

    1. 6.1
      JB

      You are 100% correct, we don’t at all. Even at my age of 53 men do not build or even maintain intimate friendship relationships with each other the way women do. We either have a relationship with a woman or family or distant acquaintances with men our own age that we see “out and about” in our social circles from time to time. What we don’t do is call other men to see “how they are” or “if they’re all right” etc…… It is what it is at least from my experiences.

    2. 6.2
      Chance

      Excellent point, starthrower68.

    3. 6.3
      Lia

      Yes that is a very interesting point!

  7. 7
    kelvin

    This only goes to show that women are more smarter than men.

    1. 7.1
      R

      Women being smarter then men is highly questionable. But what is not questionable is the fact that women are led by their emotions. So if the opportunity were to arise, and the woman might have a smarter answer then a male, her answer will be affected by which of her answers will cause her to cry! WTF! You know this is true so just say your sorry for not looking at everything.

  8. 8
    Kiki

    Evan,
    When I married, I did exactly what you advise women to do, even though this was way before the age of dating coaches :-). I did it intuitively, and it is not surprising, because what you advise is anyhow common sense. I chose my husband based on his looks and character, inspite of the fact he was making less money than me, and knowing that he clearly had a lower earning potential due to lower education and ambition. We dated for 5 years, 2 of which long-distance and 2 cohabitating, so we were both fully aware of what each of us had to offer.

    I would like to explain to you what dating/being married to a man with lower income means from first hand experience for a woman, who is not a millionaire, but just has a high paying corporate job. When we have to decide where to go on vacation, what to buy for the house, for our children, clothes, eating out, etc., he thinks in terms of what he could afford, The fact that we have a double income, and I make more money than him is irrelevant, he still chooses within his own means. When I would like to get something more expensive (like a more fancy vacation) I have to argue and argue. His own income limitation puts a restriction on our spending habits, and I find it exremely annoying that even though I work hard, I am not allowed to fully enjoy the fruits of my labor, or to act generous.
    I have a friend, who, similarly to me, married someone with lesser income and ambition (her husband is also younger). She likes to travel, and her husband says this is too expensive for him to do, so she goes alone or with friends. I know she would love to be paying for them to travel together, but he refuses for this very reason.
    I am realistic, and I know there are things way worse than your husband not willing to go on expensive vacations. Both I and she consider oursleves lucky to have married our husbands. But dating him, and being married to him for 12 years now, I know for sure that he DOES NOT like it when I buy him expensive gifts, or pay for things which he would consider expensive/unreasonable. When a well-off man buys his girlfriend/wife expensive gifts, he would be, like Evan said, adored and admired. When a high earning woman buys her boyfriend/husband expensive gift, she does not feel adored and admired, but gets reminded, by his words and/or reaction about the income difference, and that he could not reciprocate, and that her generosity makes him uncomfortable. This really spoils the pleasure for both of them.
    So, to go back to Evan’s original topic of curiosity (why are men so much more willing to spend their money on partners) – I think the reason is that because men are rewarded for this with positive feedback, whereas women are not.

    1. 8.2
      Lau_ra

       That also pretty much sums up why women want someone who has achieved more than they did (or at least similar to what they did). 
       

    2. 8.3
      TJ

      I think you nailed it.  I have two female relatives in similar positions.  One has stuck it out with her husband, the other eventually divorced.  Men are raised with the same messages about money and gender roles as women.  They’re taught that they should be the primary provider and that image persists for many of them even when that is impossible and/or unnecessary.  I think it’s probably not uncommon for there to be tension in a marriage where the woman is the higher earner.  For many of the men I’ve known, it is a sore spot in spite of themselves and how much they may love the woman.  It messes with their self esteem and in some cases causes a degree of resentment that can be exhausting for a woman to have to combat.  It’s a catch-22 for women because as others have said, men of their age and financial standing are often seeking women who are younger, more attractive, whatever, and dating/marrying down is often a source of friction no matter how “cool” she is with it.  It’s not as simple and problem free as some like to pretend it is.    

    3. 8.4
      Chance

      Kiki,
      In a prior post, you mentioned that you would fantasize about being married to someone who made more money than you.  In another post, you stated that making money is part of what makes a man masculine.  Do you think that, after being with you for twelve years, your husband may have come to realize that you harbor these feelings?  If so, do you think these feelings could possibly be playing a role in your husband’s reluctance to allow you to spend money on him?  
       
      I only ask because many men suspect that the women they’re with have the same feelings as the ones that you’ve expressed on this very blog, which is why they refuse to allow their girlfriends/wives to pay for things even though these men would appreciate it.  Also, many men are very cognizant of the fact that they are perceived as moochers if their girlfriends/wives pick up the majority of the tab.  One needs to look no further than the comments made after various posts on this blog to see evidence of that.

  9. 9
    Clare

    Is it not possible for these women to conceal the fact that they are very wealthy until they know that a man is genuinely interested in them for who they are?

    I also see no reason why, just because a woman is wealthy, she should have to pick up the check all the time. Surely they can both pay their way and, sure, if it comes to something extravagant that she wants, she can pay?

    No one wants to be with someone who is a leech, or where them paying all the time becomes an *expectation*. My ex-boyfriend was well-off and I left it to his desire as to what he would pay for, I never expected it, even though he earned far more than me. I never took advantage. I imagine a wealthy woman could be happy the same way – if she was left to choose what she wanted to pay for and had a man who, though not as wealthy, was able look after himself.

    1. 9.1
      Locutus

      Clare #9 said “No one wants to be with someone who is a leech”. I agree fully with this statement, but perhaps Kiki in #8 would have been better off with a leech! She is married to a guy who respects money and expenses and sounds very responsible and logical and yet she is complaining about it!! Kiki, would you rather be married to a guy who wants to spend every dime of the money you earn??? Your complaints baffle me and also they have nothing to do with how much money a person has/makes. I have known people, e.g. who were millionaire entrepreneurs, but yet drove around in a beat up 10 year old minivan. I also know an average girl who married a rich guy and suddenly became all snobby and would only stay in the most expensive hotels and had to have the lavash lifestyle. So, to me it sounds like your values are just different. Your husband is conservative with money and doesn’t need flashy expensive things and you like the lavash lifestyle. Nothing to do with either person being rich or poor.

  10. 10
    Steelheart

    Oh please. I’m so tired of reading “women can’t handle dating down, women are greedy and can’t snap out of gender norms, lol feminism lololol” because guess what my experience as a high-earning woman is?

    Many men, when they get some idea of how much I make, immediately freak out and feel threatened. They assume I’m going to have all the power in the relationship (when relationships aren’t supposed to be about who has more power). Many, no matter how well I treat them, also resent me for not “needing” them — as much as some men love to bitch about women dating up, a lot of men also seem to resent it when they know a woman isn’t subordinate/dependent on them in at least some way.

    And, many men expect me to come home from my long, hard day and… still be a traditional housewife! Do all the cleaning, cook a meal from scratch every day, iron his shirt, and not breathe a word about whether my day was stressful or tiring. Doesn’t matter that I’m as worn out as he is, I’m a woman and he’s a man and we’re at home, time for me to do woman’s work!

    So don’t give me this s#!+ about how it’s just women who have a problem with unreasonable, intractable gender norms. Out of all the dating I’ve done, I’ve had TWO partners where one or both of the above issues wasn’t a long-term problem.

    One was uneducated and made about half of what I did working a similarly exhausting day — and it was never a problem once, because we respected each other and worked hard to make each other feel EMOTIONALLY cared for, and neither of our identities were wrapped up in our jobs or money. He was proud of me for being so accomplished and driven, and I was more than happy to spend my money on conveniences and little luxuries so that we could spend more time together and have a little less stress. We ended up breaking up over kids (I don’t want them, he decided he did) and he’s gone on to marry another lovely woman who happens to outearn him. (Cue the men in the background wisecracking about how he must have been whipped, a pussy, etc, and the women rolling their eyes at how I must have been taken advantage of…)

    The other was insecure at first (he makes good money but I make about 25% more). But once he learned that I wasn’t going to hold anything over his head or demand he serve me, he relaxed, and we were able to work things out. Once again, I’m happy to kick in more of the spending to help us BOTH lead happier, less stressful lives. And he’s been around for 7 years :)

    So the happy ending is possible, but these are only two… of MANY. I promise you, for every woman who supposedly expects a man to outearn or provide for her no matter what else he’s got going on, there’s a man who expects his wife to be a subordinate Donna Reed no matter what else she’s got going on. EVERYBODY needs to grow up about this s#!+, you can’t tell me it’s just women!

    1. 10.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      1. No one said it’s “just women”. Work on your reading comprehension. This simply shows that rich men are more willing to remarry than rich women.
      2. More importantly, it seems your personal feelings outweigh a study that would contradict what you believe. Ah, I got it now.

      You really have to understand that when something doesn’t apply to you, you ignore it. You don’t say that it’s not true or attack the messenger.

      1. 10.1.1
        Steelheart

        Where was I saying anything wasn’t true, or attacking anyone? If anything, my (admittedly anecdotal/unprovable) post corroborates the study. If I was attacking anything, it was the generalizations about women posted by commenters earlier in the thread. Perhaps my combative tone was over the top, but I’m not sure what I said that justifies condescending remarks about reading comprehension and taking things personally.

        1. m

          ” If anything, my (admittedly anecdotal/unprovable) post corroborates the study.”
          What you said.  Pretty much all of it, less the profanity.

    2. 10.2
      nae

      YOU ARE SO RIGHT.

    3. 10.3
      Androgynous

      That’s right Steelheart. Just because of your personal experience, EVERY SINGLE wealthy, high earning women have exactly the same experience as yourself. Solipsism much ?

    4. 10.4
      Goldberry

      You are right, Steelheart. Men usually resent women who have more education or money than they do. This happens over and over. So I would also say to Evan that it is not because of the “same old problem” of women overlooking certain men; it’s because they’ve tried it and saw the weird interpersonal dynamics that resulted. And Evan, there’s no need to be rude to someone because their experience doesn’t line up with your system…!

      The *article* said that women don’t have as much trouble being alone and want to be truly loved; *you* claimed that it’s because they are overlooking men with less money. I know it’s a big part of your plan for improved dating that women should be more open; but the personal experiences of your commenters is showing that when it’s a huge financial difference with the woman having/earning more — even when they *are* open, results are usually not good.

      1. 10.4.1
        m

        “So I would also say to Evan that it is not because of the “same old problem” of women overlooking certain men; it’s because they’ve tried it and saw the weird interpersonal dynamics that resulted.”

        QFT.

        I don’t think this point gets brought into the discussion enough ever.
        And it happens frequently enough that it really should.

      2. 10.4.2
        GMarie

        I couldn’t agree more with you and Steelheart. I am a middle income earner who owns her own home and doesn’t look to a man for money, and I’ve run into the “You’re too independent,” “I don’t feel like you need me” thing. It doesn’t matter how attentive I am or that my response to that type of remark is, “I might not need financial support from you, but I need other things from you like emotional support and companionship.” It is very frustrating.
        On the flip side, a guy I’d been attracted to for some time happened to stop by when I lived in an apartment. At one point he asked why I wasn’t seeing anyone so I asked him why hadn’t he asked me out. His response was, “I have to get myself together before I date someone like you.” I’d like to add we worked together so I know we made about the same amount of money. 
        I’m not flashy, I drive an economy car so it’s not like I am materialistic which I don’t have anything against. I’m a nice woman who carries herself well like so many out there. I say all of that to say, it’s not as cut and dry as the article and commentary says.

        1. Nissa

          GMarie – I am a middle income earner who owns her own home and doesn’t look to a man for money, and I’ve run into the “You’re too independent,” “I don’t feel like you need me” thing. It doesn’t matter how attentive I am or that my response to that type of remark is, “I might not need financial support from you, but I need other things from you like emotional support and companionship.” It is very frustrating.
          GMarie,
          I have gotten that also. Isn’t it EMK who asks women, “what do you need protection from, falling anvils?” EMK, do you have an article that discusses the man’s point of view, in why they like to be needed? For the record, I think a person’s needs should be respected even when I don’t understand them, but I think it would help me to offer more if I understood why (apparently) men get warm fuzzies when they are needed. I grew up with needy people (not in the appropriate emotional spectrum)  and they give me the willies.

  11. 11
    Ruby

    Another aspect that the original article mentioned that wasn’t mentioned here is, “Divorced women are more likely to have had an unfaithful husband, says attorney Jeff Landers, author of “ Divorce: Think Financially, Not Emotionally .” Landers—who has an exclusively female clientele—says many women are divorcing because of a cheating husband.

    I do agree that men don’t necessarily care if a hot woman uses them for a sugar-daddy, but I don’t think many women want to be used as sugar-mamas, as the article states, “Only 60% of divorced millionaire males surveyed said falling in love would be the most important factor in their decision to remarry, while the remainder said they’d go into a marriage to “share their wealth” or to “spoil a beautiful woman.”. Women, OTOH, don’t want to feel as if they are “buying” love.

    I do agree with Steelheart (#10), though, that some men are still threatened by a woman who out-earns them. That could also be a factor in a wealthy woman’s reluctance to remarry. Too bad the article didn’t touch on that.

    1. 11.1
      Chance

      I think the issue of men being threatened by women who earn more is more common in my parents’ generation. You won’t find many Gen-Y guys that would be uncomfortable with this. Also, one has to consider that a big reason men feel threatened is because they know most women don’t respect men who make less than they do.

      1. 11.1.1
        Julia

        I think you’re right Gen-Y isn’t as encumbered by these feelings, especially since most of them have very little money. So I guess the point is kind of moot.

      2. 11.1.2
        Ruby

        So Gen-Y men don’t care if a woman makes more money then they do, but Gen-Y women don’t respect a man who makes less?

        1. Chance

          You’d be surprised at how common that is.

        2. Julia

          Well, if a man made less then me he’s basically be in poverty. If he made the same as me I would be fine with it.

      3. 11.1.3
        m

        “You won’t find many Gen-Y guys that would be uncomfortable with this.”

        If you really believe this, I’m thinking you need to get out more.

        (I’m also wondering if you’re limiting your observable pool of Gen Ys to “the guys I know”. In which, case, actually, my first suggestion still stands.)

        1. Chance

          m,

          Yeah, your point is completely hollow. I could say the same thing about you if you believe that most women don’t have a problem with men who earn less, or that most men have a problem with women who earn more: “You need to get out more” and “you’ve formed your belief from the women and men that you know”. Of course our view on things is formed by what we observe and what we experience, which is largely influenced by the people we know.

          You haven’t even started to provide a meaningful argument, but I suppose I shouldn’t expect any more from someone who, in a prior post, tried to use the fictitious pay gap as the reasoning for why men should pay for dates.

    2. 11.2
      Chance

      Oh, and to your point about divorced women being more likely to have an unfaithful husband. This makes sense because women who cheat are more likely to do so for emotional reasons. Therefore, when a woman strays, she will be the one who will likely initiate divorce and then get married to the person who she was cheating on her original husband with. As a result, she would not be included in the pool of divorced women.

      Food for thought.

  12. 12
    Julia

    I don’t have any money so I don’t really need to worry about this. I’d probably be more willing to spend money if I had some. Where do I get one of these millionaire divorcees?

  13. 13
    Dina Strange

    It’s not fair to compare men and women in this regard. Perhaps women have problems lying to themselves, the way men do. Perhaps women look in the mirror and see that they look old, and perhaps a bit fat..and that there is no way attractive, young, hot guy will date them IF they didn’t have the money.

    Men are much easier with that. As long as she pretends that she loves him, he will believe her or his ego will believe her. Way harder for women to believe. I mean examples abound. Also women do have emotional network so they don’t feel as lonely…men rely on women to create emotional networks and connections around them. That could be another reason but personally i do still think women have harder time lying to themselves the way men do.

    1. 13.1
      Androgynous

      Unattractive men with money KNOW that attractive women stay with them for the money and they are fine with that. These men are NOT kidding themselves – if they were that delusional they would not be making any money in the first place (exception is if it is inherited money). Men are OK with it because as hard as it may sound, they know they are “paying” for sex, arm candy and attention. It has always been that way with them.
      Women cannot accept someone stays with them for their money. It hurts their sense of worth and self, which resides not in their ability to make money, but in their inherent ability to attract people and men to them.

      Men are transactional and pragmatic in this way. Women are not.

  14. 14
    Sunflower

    Of course wealthy men would marry again. Men like to be taken care of and as indicated in the article, their egos play a role. A woman who has a lot of money already has security. Money means that to a lot of women. It certainly does to me. As a women in her 50’s and who’s been down the road of marriage, raising kids, working, yadda, yadda, yadda, I don’t feel compelled to partner up (been divorced for a while). And, I’m not wealthy. Just enjoying my time to do what I want!

  15. 15
    Soul Sister

    I am not wealthy by any means, but I am a corporate executive who makes a significant salary, and I am in my 50s. I have been divorced for several years, and I do see issues with men knowing I make more money AND I have a high level job. These are just a few of my experiences as a woman who works for her money (not inherited or given):

    1). I have been told I don’t “need” him as much as other women do (true, I do not HAVE to stay with anyone, so more likely to only stay because I want to, which does require some men to keep their behavior at a high level consistently and not start slacking off the romance and attention). Feeling needed seems to be very important to men. Feeling wanted is more important to me.

    2). It takes a certain personality for a woman to be able to stand in a board room full of men and hold her own. Not saying it is right or wrong, but it is different. As that is part of my personality to be able to do so, I am not very soft and nurturing. I am not a bitch, I am very feminine, but I also admit I do not have that big “let me take care of my man” gene. I am more likely to pick up take out on my nights to cook than worry about making a home cooked meal. But I do want to feed him well so take out is never fast food!

    3). Same issue with the man wanting me to do things that are within his financial means, even if I am paying. One man told me I was taking his “manhood” because I liked going out for more expensive dinners than he could easily afford, even though I was fine paying or contributing. But then I wonder why I am drinking a $5 happy hour wine, when I really would enjoy a $15 wine that is more worth the calories to me and I can afford it and what I would already buy for myself.

    4). Men typically do not have the type of relationships that also can provide emotional intimacy. I become my boyfriend’s best friend, when in my world I have several female best friends already. So I am never lonely.

    5). The men I know who are wealthy are typically married to younger, unprofessional, very attractive women. Even if they are overweight, unattractive, or much older. They are much more willing to pay for arm candy than a woman is. And they are also much more likely to be fine with a woman who does not match them intellectually, as long as she looks good. She spends her time working out and taking care of the house. I would rather spend my time working or discussing last nights episode of Shark Tank and who he would have picked and why. I do work out, but it is not my life mission, I just have too many other things going on. What is interesting about this, is in a social situation, I am way, way more likely to be talking to him than his wife. The wife usually has nothing in common with me. He does. And I can tell he is really enjoying talking to me as well.

    Last, I agree with one of the posters: After a long, stressful day at work, I am still expected to come home and start taking care of him too. Sometimes I am just too tired, and maybe I would like someone to take care of me. So it can be easier to not be married, just date, and know when I am tired I can go home and just take care of me.

    The pool of men who really enjoy being around a professional, educated, self sufficient woman is much smaller than the pool of men who enjoy being around a young, hot, maybe not so self sufficient woman. Even if looks are equal. But yes, I do occasionally find men who really want and enjoy being with a woman who is their equal in every way. Unfortunately, not that often in my generation though. I just don’t have a lot of incentive to marry again.

    1. 15.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      @Soul Sister: “Maybe I would like someone to take care of me.”

      That. That’s it. You need a man to take care of you at the end of a long, hard, day. Who is that gonna be? The guy working 60 hours a week and traveling 12 week a year? Or the high school English teacher who is home at 4 and has his summers off? Obviously, it’s the latter. But the point of this article, blog post, and my entire business is that until you’re willing to CHOOSE and VALUE him, you’ll have no one to take care of you. Men get the value of having someone to care for them. Women still insist that the man who takes care of you at home should also outearn you in the office. It’s a broken paradigm.

      You need a wife, Soul Sister. Just like I do. So why wouldn’t you choose one?

      1. 15.1.1
        Soul Sister

        Hi Evan, thanks for your reply. Because women know how to be wives, men do not. I have no problem paying, they have the problem with it and get resentful. I would be thrilled if I came home to a nice dinner and a clean house…but unless I do it (or hire it), most likely it is not going to happen. Even the teacher wants to the “the man”….I did find one that would have been perfect…had he not been 20 years younger than me. The few women I know who do have house husbands, about the best they do is help with the kids. They do not take care of the home, and they do not have dinner on the table when my friends get home. So she works 60 hours, comes home to a messy house, and then cooks the dinner. And he gets a very, very easy life…..although I am sure there might be an exception out there, I just haven’t met him.

        1. MsB.

          Hi Soul Sister, we are not on the same boat at all, but just a thought, I am wondering if you are a “dominant woman” and would be interested in dating “submissive men”. I am dominant myself what you describe is easily available by seeking “submissive men”. Many of whom are very successful but seek the submissive role at home. Just a thought. This type of man does all the housework, It leans slightly towards the “fetish” but I recommend you look into it. It’s called the Female Led Relationship. Google it:)

      2. 15.1.2
        Lau_ra

        Evan,
        I don’t agree SoulSister needs a wife – what she actually needs is a man who is all about the relationship itself, not about holding the power in it (usually by the financial means), which, unfortunately, is mostly the case. 
         
         

      3. 15.1.3
        m

        ” Or the high school English teacher who is home at 4 and has his summers off? Obviously, it’s the latter. ”
        Not so “obvious” if that teacher dude has a chip on his shoulder about her money, or about being willing to take care of her emotionally on a reciprocal level, EMK.
        This kind of thing – that more than one woman is talking about the further I scroll down, and goodness knows this blog or this year is far from the first time I personally have seen this stuff – goes on far more frequently than you seem willing to acknowledge.

      4. 15.1.4
        Kris

        Evan, I think it is you who are not seeing the true problem here. Most men simply are not interested in dating or having a relationship with a woman who makes more money. I saw this firsthand when my mother inherited. My father had a very tough time with it. It isn’t the women who are the problem, it is the ingrained attitude of the men. I would certainly date a man who made less money, but none are interested in dating me. Even though I am in my fifties, I look about 15 years younger, am attractive, educated, and yes, sexy. I think a poster above hit the nail on the head…men want to be needed, and women want to wanted. And by need, men mean their money. I just don’t get why men can’t see that to be needed and wanted for something other than their money is the ultimate ego boost? Or are they afraid they just can’t cut it without money? I realize I am generalizing, and there are always exceptions to the rule. Please, I’d like to meet an exception.

  16. 16
    Androgynous

    Generally speaking, women DO want to be taken care of – even if they are fully capable, high earning and wealthy in their own right. Tandem to this is that women DO NOT generally like to take care of men because it suggests that their men are “weak” and not “masculine”.
    Please ladies, there is nothing wrong about wanting to be taken care of, and not wanting to take care of others. Please don’t try to rationalise it or justify it by saying men are cheaters so they have to pay, or men are old fashioned in their take on gender roles so they have to pay. Or better still, women are still abused in places such as Afghanistan and therefore a marketing executive living in New York should not have to pay !!

  17. 17
    starthrower68

    I get so confused. If women want to attract a man, we’re supposed to be soft, feminine, sentimental, sexy, flirty, fun, etc. And then turn around be the breadwinner. I can’t keep up. It’s exhausting trying to get everything right.

    1. 17.1
      m

      Glad this is finally coming out as a concern more regularly (even though some of us have been articulating this problem for … some time).

      A concrete example is how, if we’re going out for a date, women are constantly badgered by the dating & relationship experts to “remove the suit jacket; bring something different to work to wear on the date” — even go all the way home and change clothes before the date (which, in a city like NYC or LA or DC or Boston, with all the traffic, is just … *sigh*).

      It may sound like an insignificant example, but it’s just one contrast demonstrating the principle you speak of, which is that women are expected to jump through twice as many hoops to be considered “desirable partners” — earn your own money, because men hate ‘golddiggers’, but make sure you demonstrate how much you need him, because men need to be needed (even though concrete steps WRT how to do this, other than just flat-out underearning him, are never included in this “advice) — while men don’t have to do any of it.

      I’m not even going to get into the “good men are everywhere” rhetoric v. the actual disparity of numbers of available men who appreciate successful women, as opposed to deliberately & actively seeking out women less “successful” than themselves. Or the professional women who *do* try dating non-professional men, only to be sabotaged and undermined by those men at home and/or out at her professional events. And nobody says a word to these men about their behavior … they just keep chiding and scolding the women.

      1. 17.1.1
        Dina Strange

        Agree with what you said.

      2. 17.1.2
        starthrower68

        M, I suppose in all fairness, I should say that because this is a blog for women trying to have a better dating experience, that is why women are the ones advised to jump through the hoops; we’re the one asking the questions. That having been said, I guess it depends on what stage of life you’re at as to whether or not it’s worth all you have to go through. I’m raising children, accomplishing some financial goals, and of course dealing with all the other cares of life. I find that, as much as I’d like to meet a great guy, I simply don’t have the emotional/mental energy it takes to jump through all of those hoops at this time in life. And maybe by the time I would, I will simply be too undesirable. It is what it is. What can ya do?

      3. 17.1.3
        Henriette

        @m: I heartily agree with much of what you’ve written and would love some of these issues to be explored, further.

        However, I don’t think that Evan chides/ scolds us women, even though he does tell us how we can change to have more success with men. As he’s pointed out again and again, he thinks that men have plenty of room for growth, too, but the vast majority of his clientele is female so we’re the ones to whom most of his advice is directed. If 50% of his business came from men, I’m sure 50% of his advice would be telling dudes how they could “up their game.”

      4. 17.1.4
        faded jade

        M – EMK would chide & scold more men, if more men came to him for advice. He actually did tell one petulant male that he was being a bad boyfriend, because said “boyfriend” was complaining that his girlfriend wanted him to call her on a daily basis.

        Most of the “scolding” he does toward his females are for sticking with men who are ABUSIVE, or EU. Other than that, he does advise us to be non-critical of men (while advising us to dump men who are hyper critical of us), to be “cool”, accept a man as he is, find a man who accepts us as we are, and tells us how to be a good girlfriend. What he DOESN’T do is tell us how to reform a guy who is a jerk. Or tell us that it is OUR fault that the jerk in question is a jerk. (like so many relationship experts do) He tells us CONSTANTLY, dump him, dump him, dump him !!!

        I really wish more men would try and figure out how to be better relationship partners, rather than better pick up artists, but men are the way they are. All I, or any woman can do is to keep dumping the bad ones, and when we find a good one, treat him well.

      5. 17.1.5
        Clare

        In defence of men, I think some of them actually try pretty hard, but I don’t think their efforts always look the same as ours. I am with a really sweet guy at the moment who, by my standards, can sometimes seem a bit distracted or neglectful, but he always checks that I got home safely, jumps to fix something that’s not working properly (he’s technologically good), pays attention to my moods, keeps his word and his cool, being available to me… stuff I’d probably miss if I wasn’t paying attention, because it’s not how I show love.
         
        It’s not always easy, and I have a long way to go, but I try to appreciate men for what they *do* do rather than what they don’t do. I’m not talking about tolerating abuse or neglect, but I’ve realised I could make myself very unhappy focusing on the things he doesn’t do, when I could be appreciating who he is. Men are not women – they’re very different. In some ways it’s like learning another language :p

        1. Joe

          That’s actually a good point.  If you’ve ever heard of the 5 Love Languages, it’s like two people with incompatible love languages, or who don’t understand their partner’s love language.

  18. 18
    Dina Strange

    I wish more men understand that by taking care of their women they take care of themselves and vice versa.

  19. 19
    SparklingEmerald

    Androgynous – While married both times and in my long term relationships, I enjoyed taking care of my men. There are more ways to “take care” of a partner other than financially. I guess I am old fashioned but I love to cook for people. I love to learn his favorite dishes, exactly how he likes his eggs, etc. If there is a pot luck at his work, I gladly make a dish for him to take. I enjoy giving my man massages. (I used to be a licensed massage therapist) I like to “take care” of my man in the bedroom. When my guy is sick, I turn into Florence Nightingale. My 2nd ex husband was color blind. I would help him shop for clothes, co-ordinate the colors. Sometimes I would go out and buy clothes for him, bring them home, he would decide what he wanted and what he wanted to return, and I would return whatever he decided he didn’t like. If he asked me to repair his torn clothing, out comes my sewing machine and I’ll fix them for him. With my first husband, he owned his own business, I answered phones for him, took some computer programming classes and did some minor programing. I was a stay at home step-mom to his step son in the summer, (at his request) and loved having his son be an important person in my life. Oh, and when I did work outside the home for pay (which was MOST of the time during my second marriage) I made substantial financial contribution to our household, which is pretty typical with women who work outside of the the home.

    You said “Please ladies, there is nothing wrong about wanting to be taken care of, and not wanting to take care of others” Well first off there IS something wrong with expecting to be taken care of giving nothing in return. It’s called BEING SELFISH. Taking care of each other doesn’t mean you have to take care of each other in THE EXACT SAME WAY. You each can make different, but valuable contributions to the relationship.

    And while you are on this nonsense about women not wanting to take care of anyone, which gender to you think contributes the most labor when it comes to caring for offspring ?

    Among my circle of girlfriends, this is pretty standard. None of us sat back like spoiled entitled princesses while our men took care of us, and gave nothing in return.

    1. 19.1
      GK

      @SparklingEmerald . You argue the statement “there is nothing wrong about wanting to be taken care of, and not wanting to take care of others” is wrong, and go on to describe what is sentially a “material exchange” as well as reach a definition for “SELFISH”. I am 100% certain you are unfortunately wrong.
      The quality of love is that the giver gives with no expectation of return, and the receiver has sanction to receive without feelings of being subordinated. That is, under the premise of love it is okay to be on receiving end, it takes one to swallow ones pride to sometimes be in the receiving end of a relationship. The lesser earning man is advised to let his ego, and not let ideas of traditional roles leading to an evaluation of himself to hurt his relationship. Likewise women in higher earning situations should give without asking for return. The reason is because a higher commodity called “intimacy” to which value cannot be ascribed is exchanged. To choose to cohabit with someone, to feel and say loving words, to care like one’s own body, by woman or by man are not automatic gestures. The interaction has a price infinitely more that the worth of a waiter who waits at a table. Pretend love is easily uncovered. The lesser earning male/female is also advised that once a relationship is monetised (by higher earner woman or higher earner man) it is better to leave the relationship, so that they can at least live with self respect even if single, alone and poorer. If there is love in the relationship all monetary and status benefits must be shared equally by the intimate partners. There is only one income, the sum income of both woman and man. The giver does not give and the receiver does not receive, because all belongs to both. This does not mean the intimate partner will slack-off. If a true loving relationship has been nurtured then, lesser able partner will do what they can even if its materialistic value to the higher earner is less, the higher earner will see love in the smaller gestures.
      Historically, not all men have subscribed to the view of family income. when men did, they hired domestic help so that their intimate partners did not have to do house work. Those who had an individualist sense of income did cause cruelty to dependent wives be expecting returns for their provisioning. This does not mean it was right. The provider saw provisioning as the form of love and the receiver was supposed to take cognisance of the love through receipt of provisioning. Today we know provisioning is no where near true nature of love. Now neither women nor men will accept cruelty. Both higher earner men and higher earner women need to subscribe to the family view of income. The earner gets to decide how his/her earned money gets spent, but the dependent has a right to fairness. The total amount spent on the intimate partner must not be less than how much one on spends on one-self. The my money mine, your money yours, is very ugly pattern in a relationship. It is through Intimacy a dependent partner can be made to understand and make him/her to try to be more accommodating and not get unreasonable or uncooperative. It is through security and being needed they will want to contribute more. The intimate partners do what they can. Marriage gives no right to either to treat it like an material exchange.

      1. 19.1.1
        marymary

        GK
        I really like your points. I found it difficult to stop “keeping tabs” on who was spending what or doing whatever in my relationship, not because I’m wary of being used but because my boyfriend is so generous with his time, money and affection, I felt like I had to pay him back. It’s not love to be exchanging favours, it’s an arrangement. An arrangement which, seemingly, many people are not satisfied with. It’s just not enough,
        I’m not sure that sparkling is 100% wrong though. Fairness is still important.

        1. faded jade

          I’m not advocating “score keeping”, so that’s a strawman argument. However, if one is going to argue that score keeping is wrong, I am going to counter that it is wrong to falsely the report the score as MEN – 100% care takers WOMEN – 0%.
          I responded to a post that did just that. Marymary, I really don’t believe that you give your boyfriend zero. Give and take comes naturally to most people in a relationship. It’s not SCORE KEEPING to point that out.

      2. 19.1.2
        SparklingEmerald

        You obviously missed the ENTIRE point of my reply to someone who stated that women want to be taken care of without giving anything in return. I was merely showing that there ARE non monetary ways of caring for, and used myself as an example of ways I cared in non monetary ways. (Of course when I worked I contributed in monetary ways as well)

        I am not “wrong” to give to a relationship. I am also not “wrong” to accept what a man wants to give back in a relationship. I do think it is very ineffective to ONLY consider hard dollars and cents and to tell a woman that what she gives doesn’t count if she’s not whipping out the check book or credit card and BUYING something with money.

        I NEVER suggested score keeping, just pointing out that really, very few women are 100% takers and 0% givers as the post I responded to suggested.

        And yes, someone who takes and takes and takes without giving back EVER is going to have a harder time finding love. It’ not really a matter of any “expecting” it, as in the form of a DEMAND, but “expecting” it, because that how most people operate. Also, I would not stay with a man who accused me of being a taker because my monetary contribution was less than his (which will be likely because I only make a modest income) if he did not recognize and appreciate my non monetary contributions. I take care to appreciate and say “thank you” to the people in my life for ALL that they give, not just what they BUY with money. Such a man would probably be TOO focused on money in my opinon and emotionally bankrupt.

        1. faded jade

          That last reply was meant to go to GK, not marymary.

    2. 19.2
      Chance

      It depends on your definition of “labor” as it relates to caring for offspring. If you don’t count working 45-65 hours per week under stressful conditions to ensure that your children have a roof to live under and have food on the table, then you can say that women contribute more.

      1. 19.2.1
        SparklingEmerald

        Chance, not sure if you were responding to my comments about a woman’s care taking or not. OF COURSE I recognize a man’s contribution in the work force. However I was responding to a poster who claimed that men take care of women who contribute NOTHING in return. (he said they like to be taken care of but don’t do any care taking themselves) I was just pointing out the non-monetary ways women take care of the people in their lives. Unfortunately, the non-monetary contributions are usually dismissed as being non-existant or un-important.

        And I don’t know where these hordes of leeching women are. I don’t know ANY women who work, and keep every penny they earn and not share a dime with their families. I don’t know any women who work, keep every dime for themselves and never lift a finger to contribute their labor to a relationship.

        To all these men who think they typical woman is a leech who keeps ALL of her money and sits back and NEVER contributes her labor, you really need to get out and meet MORE women and BETTER QUALITY women. We’re out here. We want to give to you, if you are willing to accept what we have to give.

  20. 20
    JB

    Ironically I stumbled upon this brand new book at the library this week that pertains to this thread. “Dollars and Sex: How Economics Influences Sex and Love” by Dr. Marina Adshade. I’m only half way through it but she touches on many of things we’re discussing here.

  21. 21
    Selena

    I can think of a number of reasons women over 50 might be content being single- with or without having a lot of money.

    1. Finding someone attractive enough to be intimate with. Not expecting a Clooney, just attractive enough can be difficult.
    2. Men in our age range (that we find attractive) want women 10-20 yrs younger.
    3. Men 10-20 years older may want us, but again that attractiveness issue, plus the possibility of spending our retirement serving as nurse. We may end up looking after our parents as it is.
    4. After menopause we may not feel the same kind of hormonal pull to get into a sexual relationship. We still like sex but it doesn’t have the same influence over us as it did pre-menopause.
    5. We’ve already had our children if we were going to, so we don’t feel the pull to create a family either. We already have one.
    6. Many of us had the long relationship/marriage and understand that along with the satisfactions can come dissatisfactions. (See housework and cheating references in prior comments.)
    7. After having been on our own for awhile, we see being solo and independent has some perks. We can have tea and toast for dinner if we feel like it, and watch whatever we want on tv instead of basing choices on what a partner wants to eat, watch.
    8. We might open to meeting a special someone, but we realize our happiness doesn’t depend on it.
    9. Like Evan’s mom, we might feel a little lonely sometimes, but most of the time we don’t. :)

    1. 21.1
      faded jade

      Very excellent analysis Selena ! I agree with everything you said, and can’t think of one thing to add.

      1. 21.1.1
        Selena

        Thanks SE/jade. 
        I can think of something else I’ve observed in some women to add.  They’ve had the marriage. They’ve raised a family. They’ve spent much of – in some cases most of- their adulthood taking care of a man. When the find themselves single in middle age they are reluctant to spend the rest of their life taking care of another man. Sort of a “been there done that” outlook.
         
        They might like a special friend, but not another husband.
         
         

        1. Clare

          I think that’s a good point, Selena. The older unmarried/divorced women I know who are financially comfortably off are not champing at the bit to take care of a man. Either they like their independence, or they have already spent many years taking care of others.  Generally for them what seems to be ideal is “someone to do things with” – go to the movies, go out for dinner, attend social events with, participate in hobbies and activities with – rather than something as committed as a husband.

        2. NIGHTRIDER

          Thank you Selena and Clare for your very insightful statements.  You are both on track.  As a “young at heart” retiree, I want to enjoy dining out, attending special events, attending the theatre and sharing lovely moments with that special someone.   Definitely not a husband!  I have raised a beautiful family and am now divorced and immensely enjoying my new lifestyle.  I do as I please! Currently seeing a great guy with the same expectations!!  I have to thank Evan for this fantastic guy!!   

      2. 21.1.2
        Kris

        I agree as well. Maybe women in their fifties want what men in their twenties want…a friend with benefits, so to speak, a guy to do things with and have uncomplicated sex with, not necessarily marriage.

  22. 22
    Ruby

    The survey this article is based on studied millionaires, who are less than 4% of the population., mostly older, and not representative of the majority of people. Most of the men I’ve dated are more in the average range financially, and most of these older men are not in any hurry to marry again, if at all.

    1. 22.1
      Julia

      Agreed Ruby, I think worrying myself with what people who lives entirely different lives than me is sort of silly. I will never be a millionaire, I will never marry a millionaire.

    2. 22.2
      Belinda

      Good point. Most divorced men are very damaged financially and  don’t want more burdens.

  23. 23
    Belinda

    The demographic you speak of is mine so I speak from personal experience. I will never get married because there is no upside for me. I will lose my alimony, which would be very hard for any man to match. Why would I give up a great thing? I am very comfortable and if I were to marry I would need a prenup but those things are never ironclad. I have my kids and will not be having more. I am engaged and have a commitment so why do I need a piece of paper? Besides, marriage is for people who are building a family with kids. As far as I’m concerned it is better to be permanently engaged so that if either party wants to leave, it is easier than having legal entanglements. Wealthy older men who marry younger women are doing so because often  they want to start new families and that, I believe is a selfish idea. Having a baby who one day will be graduating college while his father is in his seventies is a bad plan. Usually, these men cheated on their first wives and you know what they say…

  24. 24
    CeeCee

    I agree with many of the people posting; older, wealthy men remarry because they want to (be taken care of, sex, etc.) and they can.  I’m in that camp of ‘wealthy divorcee who would LIKE to remarry'; I have 4 children, and I’d like to have a husband and father figure for them to look up to (since their own father is a workaholic who has little time for them; he remarried within a month of our divorce being final to the much younger woman he had a lengthy affair with.  She’s selfish, immature, manipulative and awful to my children– but she’s young and cute, so he let’s that slide.  And of course, she wants to have children of her own, so he’ll be nearly 80 years old by the time any potential child of their gets out of college).  
    My problem?  Nobody out there.  I’m 50 years-old, I’m fit (I surf, row, run triathlons, etc.), blonde, fairly attractive (so I’m told), intelligent, open-minded (Ivy league grad), spiritual, funny, sweet, kind, giving, sexually adventurous, etc., etc.   According to all the dating advice that I’ve read since my separation and divorce, I should have eligible, relationship-ready men falling at my feet (or at least my Match.com profile).   Nope.  I move through the world, and I feel like the invisible woman.   Men in my age/income bracket want– no, “deserve” (and that was an actual quote from one of them) a younger woman (15-20 years) because they ‘feel so young’ (i.e., have mid-life issues and want to be reassured about their virility).  Hey, I ‘feel young’ on the inside too, but I’m OK with how I look on the outside and would like to date someone in my own age group.  And yes, I’ve ‘dated down’– I’m originally from a working-class background, so dating a middle class or blue collar guy isn’t an issue for me: I take people as they are.   When I’ve done this, they’ve all bailed on me for not ‘being needed’ (financially), although I very much want a man who will be a life partner and lover on a physical, emotional and spiritual level, as well as to be head of a family and a teacher and guide for my children.  
    So who do I attract?  I get the mid-life crisis guy in his 50’s who just wants to have a woman available to cook for him and sleep with , with absolutely ‘no commitment’, emotional or otherwise, and younger guys (I get hit on by 19-25 year-olds) who want to check off that ‘cougar/MILF’ box on their personal sexual rotisserie.   None of these men are ever interested in me as a person, appreciate my character or reciprocate my feelings.   In fact, when anything as messy as a genuine feeling arises, they head for the hills, because that would mean losing their precious “freedom”.  I think this is a sorry state, since it’s just the freedom to live on the superficial, shallow level of mere sensation and comfortable routine, when the real juicy intense stuff only happens when you have the guts to get real with someone, and risk falling in love.  None of these guys want to go there– at least not with me.
    I’d love to meet your mythical nice divorced or widowed H.S. teacher in his 50’s, (with or without kids) who’s smart, funny and has a sense of adventure.  I don’t care about what he looks like or how much money he makes– if he has a good heart, is loyal, treats me and my kids well and isn’t going to lie and cheat on me , I’d be in heaven.   So until that guy shows up, I’m going to live my life, pour my passion into my work, take care of my kids, pursue my interests and volunteer in my community.    And if I have to do it alone, then so be it.  

    1. 24.1
      JB

      You’re right CeeCee, they are “mythical” and at least on Match in my area(Chicago/suburbs) they don’t exist or are extremely rare. Even though at 53 I am in theory one of them. I’m not going to lie, I see many of you on Match. When I research women like yourself and see they live in a $750,000 home on the North Shore (with or without 3 or 4 kids etc….) I get intimidated and think….. first off this woman is most likely very high maintenance, second off she probably wouldn’t give me a chance because of where I live and my occupation despite my 100K a year salary.(We call that zip code discrimination around here…lol) So for the most part but not always I just email attractive women that are middle class like myself. I applaud you for giving “regular” guys a chance though. You’re smart to stay away from those “Milf hunting cubs” ignore them when they email you. They just want a “Cougar experience” to tell their friends.

    2. 24.2
      Goldie

      “Men in my age/income bracket want– no, “deserve” (and that was an actual quote from one of them) a younger woman (15-20 years) because they ‘feel so young’”
      This was probably the biggest problem I had when I was on Match two years ago. Men that were a horrible match, specifically men old enough to be my father, felt entitled to a date with me. Men in their 60s emailed me about how they were getting multiple dates with 40-year-old women and I should get with the program. I could be wrong, but to me it sounded a lot like these guys thought that their $20/month was supposed to buy them dates with the kind of women they couldn’t get if they approached those women in real life.
       
      ” I get the mid-life crisis guy in his 50′s who just wants to have a woman available to cook for him and sleep with , with absolutely ‘no commitment’, emotional or otherwise… I’d love to meet your mythical nice divorced or widowed H.S. teacher in his 50′s, (with or without kids) who’s smart, funny and has a sense of adventure.”
       
      Ha, I get the same kind of guys. My close male friends are confessing to me that they are the same kind of guy. Sometimes I wonder if there are any other single guys in the late 40s/50s age group, or if everyone is like that? Because if the latter’s the case, then, just like you, I’d rather remain single and live my life as best I can on my own.
       
      Since some of these guys are, like I said, my close friends, I know their stories – I know that they’ve been burned in their previous relationships – that they worked hard at being good partners and got nothing but misery and heartbreak in return. Or they feel they have spent all their lives just giving and giving, being the man their partners, kids, families etc. needed them to be, so now they want to finally relax, take instead of give, be themselves, and live for themselves. Women like you and I just happen to come into their lives at the wrong time. They used to be commitment-oriented, but they no longer are.
       
      Lastly, I had a guy with a sense of adventure. He left, among other things, because he felt being in a committed partnership with me didn’t give him enough room for adventure. He is now happily adventuring on his own; in his own words “doing things he couldn’t do when he was in a relationship”. So I’m conflicted on that one. I don’t want a man who’s stuck in a rut and bores me to death, I was already married to one. But the adventurous one just isn’t likely to stick around.
       
      I am in my mid-40s still, but my kids are grown, and are just a few years away to living on their own and not needing my help. I know I make a good partner; I have a lot to offer, and am good at taking care of a man I’m close with – I enjoy doing that for someone close. I would love to meet a like-minded man, so together he and I could experience life and all it has to offer, while supporting and taking care of each other. I’m starting to run out of faith, though, that such men exist. Being on my own is starting to look more attractive every day, though I’m keeping my eyes open in case a good match comes along.

    3. 24.3
      TTCM

      You wrote: “I’d love to meet your mythical nice divorced or widowed H.S. teacher in his 50′s, (with or without kids) who’s smart, funny and has a sense of adventure. I don’t care about what he looks like or how much money he makes– if he has a good heart, is loyal, treats me and my kids well and isn’t going to lie and cheat on me , I’d be in heaven.”

      Thank you for making me feel better about my own dating situation. I’m in my early 40s and met a man 8 years old than I am 3 years ago on Match.com. He’s everything that you described above but he’s not a teacher. He’s an entrepreneur. Sometimes, I feel unhappiness because he has child support payments, alimony payments, and other debt, and as a consequence, and he makes less than I do financially. However, I have stayed with him because he’s the best man I have ever dated in terms of emotional compatibility, looks, sexual compatibility, and trustworthiness and dependability. He says that he envisions spending the rest of his life with me. I guess I should just consider myself lucky and stop complaining.

  25. 25
    judy

    Selena 21 – I tend to agree with your viewpoints. 
    However, I would like to meet someone.  But as someone who has her own money, I’d be really cautious with some things like saying I own my own place and my income.  My experience in dating has been that the first questions men asked me were “do you have a place in ……..”, “do you have your own place” and “how much do you earn” and “where do you work”.  This tells me a LOT about their intentions.
    So, in my own sweet time, I make sure that when I meet a man, the clothes are not expensive, and the jewellery is left at home, and he does not come up to test ride me.  Nope.
    It sounds maybe mercenary, but if he wants to commit to me, I will be wanting a clean bill of health (no AIDS, or STD’s and proof of it) and to know that, before I “fall in love”, clear proof that he has no debts, etc.
    Love is great, but at a later stage in life, we do tend to attract users.

  26. 26
    Chuck Loch

    All was fine when I married my wife.  I made three times her salary and supported her both financially and emotionally, encouraging her to “go for broke” in her job..  The trouble started as she began to rise among the ranks in her industry.  At the end, she was making twice my salary, and resented it.  That’s when she decided to divorce me.   Nough said.

  27. 27
    Henriette

    @ Chuck Loch  – I’m truly sorry that you had such an unfair, hurtful experience with your ex-wife.  However, there are plenty of women (a few of whom have even posted in this thread) who would happily be with a good man who earned less than she… as long as HE didn’t resent HER. 
    At this stage in life, we’ve all been burned.  If we can learn to avoid dating people who embody character faults that truly lead to long-term problems within couples ~ such as selfishness; financial irresponsibility; substance abuse; unwillingness to compromise; etc. ~ we have a better chance of finding happiness in the future. 
    If things transpired exactly as you said they did (not that I’m doubting your veracity, but most marriages fall apart for a wide variety of reasons) then it sounds like the problem was not at all that your wife earned more money but rather than she had poor character: for example, she lacked gratitude (as shown by her unwillingness to support you after you had generously supported her) and she valued too narrow a scope of your traits (your ability to earn as much/ more money than she vs. all the work you did around the house/ your kindness/  your exemplary cheerleading abilities, etc.)
    A woman having more or less money does not tell you anything about the quality of her character.  It’s kind of like being a redhead; Jewish; short; volleyball player; community college graduate; Martha Stewart fan… none of these are traits that help you determine whether or not this person will be a loving, devoted, suitable partner.   
    Best of luck to you.
     

  28. 28
    judy

    Chuck Loch 26 – yes it works both ways.  Thank you for making that comment.
    A happy New Year to you and I hope you meet someone worthy of you.
     
    Happy New Year to Evan and everyone on here too.

  29. 29
    Aisling

    Selena #21, Ceecee, and some of the others:  Excellent points!  Exactly the way I feel.  At 52, I, too, attract the “boys” in search of a MILF, and the men old enough to be my father, or close to it.  What always amused me is the older men insisting that their age is not “an issue” for them.  Of course not.  They are getting the better end of the bargain:  someone younger, more attractive, still working and making a good income. I am not inclined to want to be a nurse to a man unless I have at least shared some of the good years with him.  Not something I will sign up for.
    And all of the other reasons to stay single on Selena’s list echo my sentiments.  In the final analysis, some of us will end up alone and will be ok with it.  Particularly given some of the alternatives. Now, if that elusive 50-something teacher showed up……..

  30. 30
    Trenia

    This sounds a lot like listing reasons why women should be more like men. Just as it’s often said men don’t change, well neither do women in a lot of respects. If women need to release the block they have against marrying men with less money, why don’t men have to release the block they have against youth and level of attraction? What I didn’t see mentioned is that a lot of women prefer to stay single after divorce and often feel more fulfilled by other relationships.

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