There is certainly a lot of dialogue occurring here, with both men and women attempting to share perspectives and bridge the gap that exists — and likely always will due to the different ways in which we’re biologically wired. As a student/researcher in Child Development, I think it’s inherent in our makeups, both physically and socio-emotionally, for men and women to take different approaches to communication, perception, etc. Some of this also has to do with societal expectations (“nurture”).

What we can all strive for — in the vein of Evan’s entreaty — to build a more collaborative environment is to be accepting and appreciative of the differences between men and women. I think of it in terms of viewing art. I’m an aficionado of culture, particularly art — and I have my favorites (as well as my least favorites); however, at best, I can say I appreciate all art — I don’t always reach an understanding of what the artist is trying to convey with an abstraction on canvas, but I can appreciate the emotion, skill, and intent with which they are trying to communicate their artistic vision of the world. So it can be in bridging the divide between the genders — when the edges of communication and interaction don’t line up perfectly, aim for appreciation and acceptance, a realization of the other’s intent — as Evan put it, the other’s truth. Understanding may follow at some point.

I think there is some truth in that, but the way I see it, non-sarcastically, is that part of being a real man is not needing or letting other people tell you what being a man is about. Including men’s groups. I’ll pass on the promise keeper clones, Iron Johns etc.

Hey, Steve –

That tends to be because they’re suffering from the delusion that whatever they’re going through, EVERYONE ELSE in their gender MUST be going through as well.

Lack of perspective.

Plus, they’re generally unable to see things from another person’s point of view.

Lack of empathy.

And Paul — speaking of appointing yourself as “Supreme Representative of Your Gender” — here’s something I’ve wanted to ask you “Wimmins Shuld Alwwaaays SUBMITTTT!!!!1! types for a looooooong time.

Say the woman does submit to your “guidance” of the household/relationship in every way that you desire, forever and ever, amen.

What happens when you screw it up???

Why should your entire family suffer just because, according to your logic, your wife/SO should give into your ego and whims and “gentle leadership” just ’cause — what? We’re “wired” that way?

A gentle (hee!) suggestion: Read some history that’s NOT American, NOT European, and goes back before 1950.

By your own admission:
“Men simply don’t know how to be MEN anymore. Not real men anyway. Not the kind of men that takes care of things and does what he is supposed to.”

And maybe THAT’S WHY women have suggested that perhaps an equal voice in household and corporate and relationship decision making might be appropriate. Maybe that’s what drove us to want it in the first place.

Not.

Rocket.

Science.