I’m Pregnant and My Husband Is No Longer Interested in Sex With Me.

I’m Pregnant and My Husband Is No Longer Interested in Sex With Me.

My husband and I haven’t had intercourse lately because I am pregnant and he’s afraid it will hurt the baby. He didn’t have a problem with it from the beginning to the 6th month. I continuously give him hints and touch him playfully everyday, but he still refuses to have sex. I like to sleep alone so I make him sleep on the couch and he understands that, but he likes to sneak back in later when I am asleep and cuddle up with me. Okay, I admit, not having sex for a while is getting to me cause I am still young and virile. So last night I went to bed naked thinking he would cuddle up again and perhaps have sex, but no, he didn’t. Anyway, I caught him masturbating to Girls Gone Wild and it hurt me. I don’t know if I should be angry or forget about it. I know it hurts my feelings though that he chose to masturbate to other girls instead of having the real thing with me… Right now, I just don’t know how to get over it. Because of his actions, I feel that i am not attractive to him anymore. Any advice? -Hannah

Oh, Hannah. You sound very young.

And because you’re very young, it seems that there a number of things that you need to be taught about men that older women have already figured out themselves.

So let’s start from the beginning.

1. Your husband is afraid that having sex will hurt the baby.

The fear is normal, if a bit overstated. The reaction to this fear is ridiculous. Have you heard of Google? I just Googled “does sex hurt the baby?”

Here’s what the Mayo Clinic had to say:

“Your developing baby is protected by the amniotic fluid in your uterus, as well as the strong muscles of the uterus itself. Sexual activity won’t affect your baby.”

Until you start communicating like an adult couple, your sexual problems are likely to continue.

Now that we’ve quickly dispelled that myth, your husband doesn’t have any excuse.

Of course, it’s not as simple as that. Because your husband’s lack of desire to have sex is not really about hurting the baby. In fact, it may start with:

2. “I like to sleep alone so I make him sleep on the couch.”

Huh?

You expect your husband to feel warm, amorous and affectionate towards you when you treat him like a slacker houseguest in his own home?

You say “he understands that”, but I certainly don’t.

Tell your husband how you feel, ask him how he feels and get on the same page about your sex life.

And until you start communicating like an adult couple, your sexual problems are likely to continue. Ask him how he feels sleeping on the couch. Does it make him feel closer to you? Does it make him resentful? Does it impede the spontaneity of sex, given that he’s in a different room? I think the answers will be revealing.

3. “I caught him masturbating to Girls Gone Wild and it hurt me.”

More magic from Google: “how often do married men masturbate?”

Says one study, “Of the 647 who replied, 84% said they had masturbated in the three last months. While this may seem high, it is in line with other sources.”

So, given that the vast majority of married men still masturbate, given that you make him sleep on the couch, given that he’s worried he’s going to stab the baby in the head with his monster penis, and given that you’re six months pregnant, it doesn’t seem to be much of a surprise that he’s taking matters into his own hands.

The real surprise? “Girls Gone Wild”. Seriously? A cheesy, late-90’s VHS with college girls drunkenly flashing the camera? THIS turns him on? All I can conclude is that you guys don’t have a high-speed internet connection, otherwise this is the most disturbing development of all.

Finally, Hannah, a non-snarky paragraph from the aforementioned Mayo Clinic. I think it will lend some perspective to how normal your predicament is:

“You can have sex as often as you like — but you might not always want to. At first, hormonal fluctuations, fatigue and nausea might sap your sexual desire. As your pregnancy progresses, weight gain, back pain and other symptoms might further dampen your enthusiasm for sex. Your emotions might take a toll on your sex drive, too.

Concerns about how pregnancy or the baby will change your relationship with your partner might weigh heavily on your mind — even while you’re eagerly anticipating the addition to your family. Fears about sexual activity harming the baby or anxiety about childbirth might team up to sap your sex drive. Changes in your self-image might play a role as well, especially as your pregnancy progresses.”

In other words, this is normal, normal, normal.

Tell your husband how you feel, ask him how he feels and get on the same page about your sex life.

Once you know his thoughts on sleeping on the couch, pregnancy sex, and Girls Gone Wild, you’ll be able to move past them together.

And really, try using Google. It’s pretty incredible.

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Comments:

  1. 31
    Karmic Equation

    In my last two relationships (recent one ended on Saturday. LOL. Now I can try the “circular dating” thing…But I digress) — I actually watched my men masturbate in bed. It’s a bonding experience imo. My ex bf of 6 years would ask occasionally if I would help him (and I would occasionally) and the new ex bf one would just hold me close while he did it. No asking, typical alpha. LOL

    My last two bfs regularly “manscaped”. Ladies, if you haven’t been with a manscaped man, you don’t know what you’re missing. In the future, I’m certain that if a bf doesn’t already manscape, we will have a flirty conversation about why he should. I can bet you he will without further prompting. So I can understand why men like hairless women. It’s just so much…neater…And this is an interesting article about that.

    I used to go with an ex bf to porn shops for toys and DVDs and we’d buy ones we could both enjoy. I also enjoy reading Forum letters. You can actually see how the world changed about what was risque back in the 80’s (sex outdoors, like on roller coasters, must have been a lie) to 90’s (I think bathroom activities, like golden showers; and S&M) to now, which is threesomes/multis.

    Just as you might fantasize about marrying Brad Pitt or Harrison Ford, men fantasize about having sex with other women. Equivalent, not equal, fantasies. Another correlation to the women want relationships and men want sex topic.

  2. 32
    Ellen

    John #29: your views are unfortunately widespread, but I’m not going to have ANY man dictate to me how the lower half of me should look like, ESPECIALLY as he has no idea the upkeep to “make him happy”.
    Screw it. Glad I’m a boomer. I feel sorry for younger women who feel they have to replicate what they see on porn sites cause certain men feel entitled. YOU pay for the bikini waxes weekly, etc. OR I’ll do all that friggin maintenance if YOU go completely hairless too. How about that?
    FTN (guess what that’s an acronym for)
    PS “grooming”, believe me, is a relative term buddy.
     

  3. 33
    Amelia2.0

    John, I believe you weren’t trying to be offensive, but I feel the same way Kathleen @ 30 does.  I think it is always reasonable to expect basic hygiene, but it’s rather annoying to be held to the standards of pornography, even the hairlessness.  These days you could just as well put the shoe on the other foot, as men in pornography aren’t exactly going by 70’s archetype anymore, either.  I often see hairlessness as a common standard for male actors as well, depending on the type of porn (and as you mentioned, you can narrow that down pretty easily).  Would you be understanding if women thought you ought to “groom” by completely waxing your face, chest, nutsack, etc based on what they see and prefer in porn?  Or hell, on romance novels?  I’d wager not.
     
    An analogy might be if someone dumped you because even though you cook good food, you don’t cook or present your dishes like an Iron Chef on TV.  If you found out that’s the standard you were in for on a date, then the only sensible thing would be to say “Well, bye.” a la Curly Bill in Tombstone.  If your date has yet to learn the difference between reality and fantasy, what chance is there to earn acceptance from them?

  4. 34
    Kathleen

    John 32 The topic of this post was not porn 
    Ellen Right on!!! Ive found men who dictate this most especially upfront, are focused on their fetish and this takes priority over knowing who the woman is.

  5. 35
    K

    @john you may not have presented it well, but the concept does not offend me.  I don’t love going bare, but if my bf loved it I may do it again.  I sometimes do things I don’t love, but bc I know they turn my partner on.  I’d obviously be more agreeable to this if he took my preferences into account whatever they may be, waxing chest/no beard etc.

  6. 36
    Androgynous

    Another point which women may not necessarily know about – sex and mastubation are really really great STRESS RELIEVERSs – particularly for men. Many women relieve stress by yakking, bitching and crying – should men try to stop women from doing these things because it annoys them ? I know the sound of wailing is particularly grating for some men – and can actually cause real physical pain in them.
    I like to say that when men and women are subject to great stress (at the workplace as an example) both rush off to the toilets – the women to cry, and the men to wank.

  7. 37
    John

    Ameila2.0 #36
    “Would you be understanding if women thought you ought to “groom” by completely waxing your face, chest, nutsack, etc based on what they see and prefer in porn? Or hell, on romance novels? I’d wager not.”
    I hope you dont make bets for a living since you would lose this one. I most certainly do manscape all the way. Been doing it for years. Strangely enough what convinced me to do that was a couple of my guys friends said they did that and the sex was so much better. My girl at the time didnt care either way so I tried it and voila I never looked back. Its awesome.
    Not sure why you think I demand women do this. I just stated in a comment how hairlessness is a turn on and one of the hottest parts about porn. And since it has its own category on porn sites, I am sure many others agree hence its own category.
    As far as Ellens #35 thoughts that men who dictate this upfront are turn offs, I agree. There is no place to just blurt that stuff out when initially dating. But if I am with a new partner and the topic comes up of turn ons, that one is surely near the top. If the guys you are with “demand” this, then maybe the choices in men you choose to go out with needs some work.
     

  8. 38
    Amelia2.0

    John,
     
    Fair enough about your own preferences, and I’m happy to be wrong since you walk the talk, which I respect.  Your comments came across to me as if porn star standards of hairlessness are the only way women as a whole can “measure up” in general, which is why I called them out.  If a lady’s goal is in fact to measure up to porn, then sure, I get what you’re saying.  But to measure up for dating in general?  Then no, a woman should not have to think that she needs to be at a porn star level in order to succeed.
     
    For the record, my boyfriend is one hairy bastard.  He’d be shaving all day to get the hair all off and by then it would look like the scene in Trouble with Tribbles.  But– and this is my preference – I love it.  I realize I made us sound like Mr. and Ms. Bigfoot but oh well.  There’s a porn for that I’m sure.

  9. 39
    Nadia

    Cat5, thank you for being the courageous one to take the bullet by raising the questions you have. I’m sure there are a lot of women out there–including myself–who appreciated the peek at the obvious other side. I agree that just because a behavior is common does not mean it doesn’t have a dark side. Which porn does. And if using porn is the benign sexual outlet that so many men claim it is, then why is it so hard to put their partner’s feelings first? Is it wrong to masturbate? Not in my opinion. Is it wrong that people get turned on by porn? Nope. It’s a human reaction.  But is it a corrupt industry that takes advantage of women, who, if healthier, might not choose the porn industry as a career path? I can’t imagine that it’s not. Nor is it reasonable to think that regular porn use isn’t detrimental to relationships, because it can be. And speaking personally, whether or not it is, depends on the man and the preoccupation level. I’m also confident that there are plenty of men who enjoy masturbating to the fantasies in their head over porn. I know several of these men. More power to them and their imaginations, if you ask me.

  10. 40
    Girl in the Midwest

    About the hairlessness in the ladyparts thing… I guess I’m very practical about it.  If I get the impression that I’m reducing my dating pool by a huge percentage by not shaving/waxing, then I probably would go hairless or at least groom.  If my experience says that I’m not really turning off guys by going au naturale, I’m probably more lax about it.
     
    I’m pretty sure guys do lots of things as well for the sole purpose of pleasing girls.  Like showering and not burping loudly and wearing deodorant…at least that’s what my bf tells me.  :)

  11. 41
    Karl R

    Cat5 said: (#25)
    “you should have no problem with your child, when they are an adult, going into the porn industry”
     
    Over the holidays, my father-in-law told a story about trying to convince my brother-in-law to quit working as a stocker in a grocery store and go to college instead.
     
    My father-in-law has nothing against the grocery industry. He appreciates the benefits he gains from its existence. He just didn’t want to see his son get stuck in a dead-end job.
     
    I would recommend against joining the porn industry because it’s a dead-end career with a lousy retirement plan.
     
    My parents didn’t brag about my minimum-wage temp jobs (and I doubt that my in-laws would either). However, they don’t see me as being a lousy spouse because I’m willing to call Prostaff, Manpower or Robert Half if I need some data-entry done.
     
    Cat5 said: (#25)
    “Tell me how you feel after you have had to help pull a loved one out of the porn industry…drug addicted, and diseased.”
     
    In the United States, an STD will get a porn star kicked out of the industry. Regular tests are mandatory (as are birth certificates proving age of consent).
     
    A friend of mine was in three gay pornos. He probably would have continued, but he tested HIV+.
     
    My friend is intelligent in his own way. (Our group of friends use him as our living example of intelligence without wisdom.) He has an Ivy League education. He has a well-paying job as a computer programmer. He did the gay porn because he got paid about $1,500 for doing something he happily would have done for free.
     
    And he will happily brag to you about how one of his sex scenes won an award at the gay porn movie awards. (I didn’t know they existed until he bragged to me about his nomination.) He is quite proud of how he was double-penetrated in that scene.
     
    My friend was popping party drugs (against my advice) before he ever did porn. He had lots of sex (a fair amount of it unsafe sex) before he ever did porn. He got HIV by having unsafe sex one last time. He even expected that his lifestyle would eventually cause him to become infected with HIV.
     
    My friend doesn’t blame the porn industry for what happened to him. He openly admits that he caught HIV due to his own choices. I don’t even think he would choose to go back and live his life differently if you gave him the opportunity.
     
    I don’t know which of your loved ones did porn, but maybe you ought to take a look at the role their own decisions played in their problems.

  12. 43
    Karl R

    Nadia asked: (#42)
    “But is it a corrupt industry that takes advantage of women, who, if healthier, might not choose the porn industry as a career path? I can’t imagine that it’s not.”
     
    Let’s assume for a moment that your two assumptions are correct. 1) The women choose to work in the porn industry because they’re unhealthy. 2) If the women were healthier, they would choose another career. (You’ve provided no evidence, besides your imagination, that your assumptions are correct … but I’m not about to disprove them this evening.)
     
    I could similarly argue that migrant farm workers end up being taken advantage of because they’re poor, uneducated and unable to speak English. If you put the fruit and vegetable growers of the United States out of business, the migrant farm workers would still be poor, uneducated and unable to speak English … and they’d be unemployed too. (And I don’t think “unemployed” solves any of their problems.)
     
    And if the ex-migrant farm workers found another job, it would be in another industry which would take advantage of the fact they were poor, uneducated and unable to speak English.
     
    The only way to help the ex-migrant farm workers would be to educate them and teach them the local language. Refusing to eat fruits and vegetables is unlikely to benefit them.
     
    If you want to find a way to make young women healthier (or migrant farm workers better educated), I’ll applaud your efforts … regardless of whether the industries that employ them are corrupt and taking advantage of them.
     
    Nadia asked: (#42)
    “And if using porn is the benign sexual outlet that so many men claim it is, then why is it so hard to put their partner’s feelings first?”
     
    I put my wife’s feelings first. I found a wife who doesn’t care if I watch porn.
     
    Evan put his wife’s feelings first. He found a wife who doesn’t care if he watches porn.
     
    If your partner didn’t feel like working for a living, would you put his feelings first by supporting the deadbeat? Or would you dump him and find a man who felt like earning a living like a normal adult?
     
    In some cases, the best way to put your partner’s feelings first is to find a different partner.
     
    Nadia said: (#42)
    “I’m also confident that there are plenty of men who enjoy masturbating to the fantasies in their head over porn. I know several of these men.”
     
    Are the men masturbating to fantasies or memories? I have a good imagination, but creating an imaginary woman down to the last detail takes a bit of work. Instead of reinventing the wheel, it’s much easier to envision the women I’ve already seen (and felt) naked.
     
    Do you feel that a man’s former sex partners are less threatening than girls on the internet whom he’ll never meet (and quite possibly has no interest in meeting)? Many women wouldn’t.
     
    The problem with Hannah and her husband boils down to their inability to meet each others’ needs … probably caused by their inability to openly communicate their needs.

  13. 44
    Nadia

    Karl, my question was a sincere one: Why, if porn doesn’t mean that much to men, is it so hard to put their partner’s feelings first, assuming the wife isn’t ok with it? Why should the woman suppress her feelings about it to be accommodating to her man, and not the other way around? I’m not trying to be challenging, I”m genuinely curious. There are plenty of women who are okay with porn use, and plenty who aren’t comfortable with it. Would you ditch your wife if suddenly she developed an insecurity around it, sneak it when she wasn’t around, or just tell her, too bad? As for the corruption of the porn industry, I didn’t think I needed to post links to books and articles to a topic that was already so well exposed in that regard. I agree with you that many women wouldn’t be comfortable with their man masturbating to images of previous encounters. I’m not one of them. In general, if I feel loved and secure and desired in a relationship, all these masturbatory distractions are just that: distractions. But you are really, really kidding yourself if you think there aren’t a lot of hurt women walking around as a result of over-preoccupations their men have with porn, and that’s ultimately damaging to relationships.

  14. 45
    Nadia

    Maggie #31, I would ask you the same question I have posed in general. Why, if you were uncomfortable with your husband always wanting to watch porn while he was having sex with you, did you feel the need to “get over it” instead of having your feelings be respected? Personally, I would hate sex like that. Where’s the connection and the intimacy with each other? There are a lot of men out there who not only don’t need to watch porn during sex, but who would find it as empty as most women.

  15. 46
    Anonymous Editor

    There are many reasons why I masturbate to porn, even though I’m happily married and have a kid coming along:

    1) Since young, I’ve always jerked off to porn when I’m bored, stressed, or horny, and I don’t think I’ll stop any time soon, unless my libido starts to slow down.  

    2) Sometimes my wife isn’t in the mood or she’s tired from work. Not to mention she has a low sex drive. Instead of asking her to put out for me, I just rub one out in the morning when she has gone to work. I find it more convenient and considerate than asking her to have sex. 

    3) Previously when my wife was having her period, her breasts would become sensitive and sore, so she would not be in the mood for sex. 

    4) Porn is the quickest way for me to get aroused. When I’m short on time and I just need a quick release, reading/watching porn is faster than fantasizing about my wife.  

    5) I have some kinks/fetishes that I cannot do in real life or that my wife will never agree to participate in, so porn helps me achieve my sexual release without cheating on her. 

    My wife is aware of my kinks/fetishes, and I don’t make any attempt to hide them. However, when I masturbate, I try to keep it discreet or do it when she’s not around. 

  16. 47
    sarahrahrah!

    @ John #29
     
    Are you freaking kidding me?  This reminds me of the post from a week or two ago about the “war on men” because men can’t be men like they could be 50 years ago.
     
    Guess what?  Grandpa didn’t require Grams to shave her legs, let alone torture herself by ripping out the hairs from the most sensitive part of her body.  He stayed with her through sickness and in health.  He managed to have enough cajones to find *something* to be attracted to (and sex-worthy) even as she turned gray and got wrinkles that she didn’t fill in with Restylane.  He fathered many children with her — and, presumably, got boners — without the help of a high-speed internet connection.
     
    I want a man like Gramps, even if he’s not a spiffy dresser.
     
    Sorry, but I just don’t get men like you, John.  I don’t think you truly want a living, breathing, *real* woman.  You see, we have other things to do besides color, buff, wax, pluck, work out, tone, soak and otherwise spend inordinate amounts of time trying to alter our natural state.  There is nothing wrong with grooming and exercise — and Grandma would agree — but needing to painfully alter the body in a way that ends up putting someone at a higher risk for STDs and that takes away a natural buffer for active sex just doesn’t make any sense to me.  I’ll take you in your mostly natural state; why can’t you accept women in the same way?
     
    This attitude of entitlement — of men thinking that they are entitled to having their female partners undergo painful and dangerous procedures in order to look like porn stars — is just one of the many fallouts from the porn boom in the past 15 years.  
     
    I am an attractive and sensual woman, but if a man doesn’t want me simply because I don’t conform to typical porn images, he can go fuck himself.  I ultimately wouldn’t respect him in the long run because he has compromised his innate aesthetics for some mass-produced, cookie cutter, stereotypical imagery.  It would be like me wanting my man to dress, groom and act like Brad Pitt. 
     
    @ Karl R #44, cat5 #25
     
    I also think that it is wise for people to question the porn industry.  The average length of the career of a pornographic actor is only three months.  This is because people’s (predominantly women) bodies get spent from the abuse they receive regularly in the sex acts they engage in for their work.  Prolapsed uterus, bladders and intestines are commonplace.  Source:  Robert Jensen in “Getting Off.”  These statistics can be found other places.  However, long-term health care is not available for these people after they are no longer actively working in the industry.  How fair is that?
     
    You know, if there was someone on the street poking needles in his cheeks so people would  give him money, I wouldn’t want to support that.  I would be horrified and walk away, not wanting to support him hurting himself for show and profit.  I see the situation with actors in the porn industry to be no different.  
     
     
    In the past couple of years there have been HIV infections transmitted between porn actors who were supposedly getting tested.  However, there are false negatives and many people ended up getting HIV through this business that doesn’t protect it’s workers and is currently even fighting to keep condoms out of pornography all together.
     
    I cannot respect or support an industry that wholesale treats human beings like disposable gloves — to be used and then discarded — and I don’t understand how any self-proclaimed liberal can continue to uncritically support this industry without at least recognizing the huge human rights abuses inherent in it.
     
    (PLEASE NOTICE:  I’ve never said one thing about sex or free expression.  I’m wholeheartedly for both of those!  :-)

  17. 48
    Jennifer

    John#29-just for the record, I don’t think you deserve the beating you’ve taken here. I understood your point and didn’t find you offensive or entitled.

  18. 49
    John

    Sarah #50
     
    You must be doing something wrong. Every woman I have dated in the past few years did the hairless thing. Most did it on their own without me even bringing up the topic. It is so mainstream to the 40s women I date. If it was as painful and torturous as you say, then maybe you are doing it wrong.
     
    I guess besides not knowing how to groom yourself in a painfree way the way many women have already figured out, you also dont know how to read. It was something I said was a turn on, not a demand at all.

  19. 50
    Suzanne

    A very lively debate here. I dont understand why the wife makes the hubby sleep on the couch. I have 2 kids and I craved that cuddling even more so when pregnant.  So I dont know why she would want to lose that intimacy.
     
    As for the discussion regarding porn and shaving, personally, I dont see this to be a big deal.  If I shave a couple of times a week, especially on the weekends or prior to going on vacation then thats pretty easy to do. SOme women are making this out to be a big deal and I find that doing it when taking a bath is the easiest way. If something that simple makes my hubbby happy then it becomes part of my routine. He doesnt complain if I go a few days it but since I know he enjoys it and its a simple thing to do, then its worth it. Besides, I have more leverage when I want him to open the checkbook for something I want for the house!

  20. 51
    Karl R

    Nadia said: (#47)
    “you are really, really kidding yourself if you think there aren’t a lot of hurt women walking around as a result of over-preoccupations their men have with porn, and that’s ultimately damaging to relationships.”
     
    If a man prefers porn to sex with his partner, I’ll recommend that she dump him unless he’s willing to change and meet her needs for physical intimacy. That’s a dysfunctional relationship.
     
    I find Hannah’s situation (having her husband sleep on the couch when he’d clearly prefer to cuddle in bed with her) to be equally dysfunctional. She hasn’t been meeting his physical intimacy needs. Now their situation has hit the point where he isn’t meeting hers either … and neither one has the guts to initiate a discussion which could lead to some solutions.
     
    Nadia said: (#47)
    “Why should the woman suppress her feelings about it to be accommodating to her man, and not the other way around?”
     
    Typically the underlying feeling is insecurity. Regardless of whether it’s the man or woman feeling the insecurity, I’m going to say that the insecure person should be the one to change.
     
    sarahrahrah! said: (#50)
    “long-term health care is not available for these people after they are no longer actively working in the industry.  How fair is that?”
     
    For years I worked as a temp through a couple temp agencies. My employers didn’t pay for any health care. They didn’t pay for sick time off. If I became sick during an assignment, I typically went to work sick. If I was too sick to show up and work, I could generally expect that another temp would replace me and complete that assignment. When I recovered, I would be “between assignments” (which means I was not working and not getting paid).
     
    For every $1.00 that a client paid for my services, I received 40 to 55 cents (depending on the assignment) before taxes. The agency kept the rest.
     
    While clients typically provided ergonomic work spaces for their own employees, temps routinely have to work in non-ergonomic spaces doing repetitive-motion tasks. (One assignment had me working 10 hour days in the same non-ergonomic chair doing the same repetitive-motion task for 5 months straight.) Not only would I have received no long-term care for any repetitive-motion injuries I suffered, I wouldn’t have received any short term care during the assignment either.
     
    How fair is that?
     
    sarahrahrah! said: (#50)
    “if there was someone on the street poking needles in his cheeks so people would  give him money, I wouldn’t want to support that.  I would be horrified and walk away, not wanting to support him hurting himself for show and profit.  I see the situation with actors in the porn industry to be no different.”
     
    I wasn’t doing temp work for show. I was just doing it so I could pay the rent and buy food. Do you consider exploitation to be more tolerable when it happens in back offices where nobody sees it?
     
    When I did that 5 month task, I was working for ExxonMobil. I have also worked as a temp for most of the other major oil companies (and numerous supporting companies which the major oil firms use). All of those companies still use temps (except for the ones which have gone out of business).
     
    Given your strongly-stated principles, are you intending to stop using gasoline and other petroleum products in order to avoid supporting temps hurting themselves for below-average wages?
     
    It’s easy to self-righteously state that you’d never support an industry when you have no interest in using their products. But unless you’re equally willing to stop supporting an industry whose products you already use, you’re just another hypocrite.
     
    Nadia said: (#47)
    “Why, if porn doesn’t mean that much to men, is it so hard to put their partner’s feelings first, assuming the wife isn’t ok with it?”
     
    Why, if porn does bother these women that much, is it so hard for the women to simply have sex with their boyfriends/husbands enough so the men don’t bother with it?
     
    If my wife is having sex with me 3+ times per week, I’m not bothering with porn. (This was also true with previous partners.) If Anonymous Editor’s wife (#49) was having sex with him daily and participating in his fetishes, I doubt he’d bother with porn.
     
    Most of the men watching porn are like us. We’d rather be having sex with our partner.
     
    Why are the woman’s feelings the only ones that matter in this situation? Is it because you’re a woman?
     
    I find it equally suspicious that your concern for the health and welfare of other humans covers female porn stars, but doesn’t cover male and female migrant farm workers, or male and female temp employees, or male and female minimum-wage employees in any other industry. It makes me wonder whether your concern for health and welfare is sincere … or whether it’s just a convenient facade to further your argument in opposition to porn.
     
    Nadia said: (#47)
    “Would you ditch your wife if suddenly she developed an insecurity around it, sneak it when she wasn’t around, or just tell her, too bad?”
     
    If my wife suddenly develops an insecurity (about anything) my primary interest is in discovering the reason behind it. Unless we address the underlying issue, it’s going to manifest in other ways in the future.
     
    But more to your point, my wife and I would reach a compromise. One of the reasons I married her is because she’s always willing to compromise. Would you be willing to give up a few hours of TV per week (even if it includes your favorite TV shows) in order to make the time to have more sex with your partner? If so, a compromise can easily be reached. If not, then why do you find it so hard to put your partner’s feelings first?

  21. 52
    Kathleen

    Sarahrahrah 50 
    Great post !!! You had me dying laughing 

  22. 53
    David T

    To the moderator: Crud.  Paragrpah breaks often don’t work right when I am on a mac.  Looks fine in the WSYWIG editor then they vanish upon post. Here is a more readable version of the prior post if you care to substitute:

    @John Most guys like [hairless women]

    Have you any statistics to back that up?  It ain’t true for me.  Hairless is just weird. As for manscaping, years ago one female friend suggested that grooming was a good idea, but the one girlfriend I talked about that with specifically said it was a turn OFF for her. 
    Different strokes fur different folks.

    @Sarahrahrah
    if a man doesn’t want me simply because I don’t conform to typical porn images, he can go fuck himself
    That is exactly what he will end up doing! I literally LOL’d when I read that. ( Milk came out my nose, and I wasn’t even DRINKING milk. Maybe I should see a doctor.)
    There have not been any male perspectives on one side of the porn question, so here is my 2¢. I used to think as long as an activity is consensual it was OK which I think reflects the sentiment behind Karl’s underpaid migrant worker analogy. In my world an industry that exploits or takes advantage of people because they have no other options, is wrong. This is why sweat shop garments lead to boycotts.  A industry that exploits and does harm to its workers is really reprehensible.

    If you choose to dismiss the very real disease and body harm aspects, porn takes a very fundamental core part of who we are and turns it into a transaction with no nurturing or feeling behind it. That is going to change how the adult industry worker experiences sex. The job is an assault on a fundamental part of the workers’ humanity,  less than being a hitman or combat soldier, but certainly of that nature.

    Many porn workers wish they had other options.  Many of them are aware that they are wrecking their own personal sexuality. A lot of them end up with STDs. Their psychological distress sometimes drives them to consume harmful drugs to hide from their discomfort. Perhaps a few “adult models” are unharmed in mind and spirit and body, but there are plenty who are harmed.

    Maybe you justify your own consumption, because clicking pirated, old or free material online makes a very indirect contribution to this industry, but even that click does create an incentive to produce more.  My own personal decision to turn away from this widely accepted entertainment came a few years ago after doing some reading and thinking about what is right for me. To calibrate who I am, I avoid shopping at store chains that use what I consider unfair labor practices (yes, I often end up paying more someplace else) and when I see a headline on Google news that points to a news outlet with questionable editorial practices or biases, I search for the same story by another outlet to avoid giving them any benefit that might accrue to them from my click.

    @Karl The only way to help the ex-migrant farm workers would be to educate them and teach them the local language. Refusing to eat fruits and vegetables is unlikely to [improve their situation]
    I remember a grape boycott that helped improve working conditions for migrant workers once. I fundamentally disagree with you that my boycott of products that harm workers does not make a difference.
    If a person making the choice to use porn is aware that many of the people behind the images are hurting themselves because they are psychologically damaged from early life experiences (a lot of porn workers were molested) or feel they have few or no other options, then it is also a window into that person’s ethics.

    Am I  100% Mr. Perfect?  No. Sometimes I shop at Walmart when I can’t find what I need someplace else and I am in a hurry. Sometimes I eat chocolate made from cocoa harvested by slave labor, but usually I will pay more for fair trade,  and yeah, sometimes, usually when I am upset with myself for some reason and want to feel worse (we all have our dark moments), I have looked at porn. It doesn’t mean its not wrong.  
     
    When I start to go there, I look at those people as *people*, imagine the distress they might be under, and how they used to be someone’s young child and wow,  the images aren’t a turn on anymore. I have no doubt that 500 years ago people still sought and found release on their own. I  get my turn on from memories and from just focusing on sensation. It is amazing how the latter puts you in tune with your body and the kind of control you develop without thinking about baseball.
     
    Evan will correctly say that with 90% of men using porn regularly, a woman will tremendously shrink her dating pool if she makes this a deal breaker.  Agreed. I beleive Evan will also agree she is free to make that choice and there are still sexually healthy, horny men remaining in her pool. In the end a relationship is always a compromise of our internal wish lists, and each individual has to choose when the summation of checklist misses adds up to dealbreaker.This is one that will cost a lot for some here to compromise on.

  23. 54
    hespeler

    “I am an attractive and sensual woman, but if a man doesn’t want me simply because I don’t conform to typical porn images, he can go fuck himself.  I ultimately wouldn’t respect him in the long run because he has compromised his innate aesthetics for some mass-produced, cookie cutter, stereotypical imagery.  It would be like me wanting my man to dress, groom and act like Brad Pitt.”
     
    He can go F himself but he’ll probably go find someone else to go F who grooms themselves and worksout in a manner that is more consistent with what he’s looking for.  The word Comensurate is a good one to keep in mind.  You get a comensurate salary for your experience and you get a comensurate partner for what you’re looking for and what you can offer. 
     
    If you don’t want to go the extra mile to conform to standards of beauty that are more in line with the standards of today then please don’t have any demands about the physical charactersitics or lack thereof of your partners.

  24. 55
    Karmic Equation

    @John
     
    I’m with Jennifer. I didn’t take it that you were demanding anything. Just stating a preference.

  25. 56
    Kathleen

    Hespeler 56
    Who’s standard of beauty are you referring to? Hey if you and John love the porn star look I hope you both get with the porn star looking woman of your dreams. To each their own!
    But there are other women out there who can look great and be in great shape that don’t like being told that we should conform to looking like a porn star. 
    Ive had online guys tell me before Ive even met them to wear a very short dress, heels and a specific perfume for the first date.  This is the same mindset as the guys who dictate I be completely shaved before Ive even decided if Im attracted to them. Are you saying we are supposed to be insecure that these freaks might want someone else? 
     
     
     

  26. 57
    Some other guy

    For a man to have a preference regarding shaving down below is understandable, and it’s nice if a woman doesn’t mind accommodating her beau, but any man who puts this in even the top ten of important things in a partner shows himself to be very, very shallow.
     
     

  27. 58
    Ruby

    John wrote, “BUT there is no reason why any woman cant be hairless. I understand that maybe a perfect body of a 25 year old porn star cant be replicated by the average woman. But the hairless part can certainly be…. you certainly can measure up in the grooming department. And that goes a long way.”
     
    Sounds like John is assuming that because he prefers women with no body hair, that other men naturally feel the same, and that not being hairless means that you don’t “measure up”. Couldn’t be further from the truth.

  28. 59
    JustMe

    @ David T
     
    “Crud”.  laugh of the week.

  29. 60
    Locutus

    Clearly the attitudes of some women in here are anti-men.  You seem to have a take anything said to yo uwith defiance.  If a woman asked me to shave down there because she found it sexier I would do it without hesitation.  Why not?  If i can do something that she thinks makes me even sexier then I’m all for it. 
    sarahrahrah! ….”he can go fuck himself”- obviously you have underlying anger issues with men.  Do you keep a mop down there?  If so, gross.  Every male AND female friend I have would say that is disgusting!! LOL. Go see how many guys would be turned on by that.  There are some, but I guarantee you they are in the overwhelming minority.  Do you let your under arm hair grow too???  Do you think it would be “demanding” if a guy wanted you to trim that?  To me keeping a hairy vagina is the same thing as not showering.  If a woman doesn’t want to groom herself- I shave my beard neat and keep groomed everywhere else so I expect the same in return.  If I let my finger nails grow and refused to cut them I would expect a woman to be turned off. 
    Ruby,
    I don’t have statistics, but by word of mouth to the many friends I have- even both male and female…MOST women shave clean or at least keep a tiny trimmed strip- either is sexy to me!  I would wager a guess that probably more than 80% of guys feel this way- at least in the Northeast US.  I can’t speak of other places.  So, I would wager a bet that John is mostly correct.
    Kathleen,
    And I have had plenty of women ask about penis size before ever meeting too…yup it works both ways…..

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