Should I Spend My College Years Hooking Up Or Looking For Mr. Right?

Should I Spend My College Years Hooking Up Or Looking For Mr. Right?

There’s been a lot of talk – including talk on this blog – about hookup culture. Is it empowering for women to embrace their sexuality, have fun, and not worry about commitment? Is it hurtful to women because they’re denying their own feelings, wasting their time on dead-end relationships and turning into the very men that are so often decried in this space?

Yes and yes.

This New York Times article didn’t say anything that hasn’t been said before, but it did a very thorough job of presenting both sides of the argument.

The author took a look at students at the University of Pennsylvania, an Ivy League school, and reported what you already suspected: smart and ambitious college kids have a sense of drive and perspective that is somewhat uncanny.

I only wish more women in their 30′s, 40′s and 50′s understood the value in being patient and letting a man reveal his character over time, instead of jumping into marriage based on desire, passion and fear.

“Many privileged young people see college as a unique life stage in which they don’t — and shouldn’t — have obligations other than their own self-development.” The article continues, “Some women also want to wait to see how men turn out as they advance through their 20s. A., for example, said that she did not want to settle down until she could choose a partner knowing that his goals and values were fixed. “‘I’ve always heard this phrase, ‘Oh, marriage is great, or relationships are great — you get to go on this journey of change together,’ ” she said. “That sounds terrible. I don’t want to go through those changes with you. I want you to have changed and become enough of your own person so that when you meet me, we can have a stable life and be very happy.”

To say that this is wise is an understatement. I only wish more women in their 30′s, 40′s and 50′s understood the value in being patient and letting a man reveal his character over time, instead of jumping into marriage based on desire, passion and fear.

In fact, some of these 19-year-old Ivy League women sound very much like ambitious middle-aged men who want to have all the trappings of a relationship without all of the obligations of it. “Even if they did meet someone they were interested in, some women said the logistics of a relationship were just too hard. Some described extracurricular commitments — running debate tournaments for local high school students, or organizing Model United Nations conferences — that took up 30 to 40 hours a week, and came on top of going to class, doing homework and, in the case of less-wealthy students, work-study jobs. Some relationships ended, or never got off the ground, simply because schedules didn’t align.”

Personally, while I’ve always enjoyed hooking up, it was never the end goal. I would like to think that most people feel the same way, at most points in their life. Sex may be something that you have to scratch an itch when you’re too busy, but if you find the right person, you don’t let it slip away. By the same token, what are the odds of finding your soulmate when you’re 21 and you’ve never even tackled the real world? Pretty slim. Hmm…maybe these girls are onto something.

If you still haven’t prioritized your love life in your 30′s, and still favor random hookups because you’re too busy for love, you may be in for a rude awakening.

But the article doesn’t really want to concede that point. The last two pages of the piece focus on women with alternate points of view. One is a virgin who is inclined to save herself for marriage. The other is someone who has opted out of hookup culture after getting her heart broken. This, in and of itself, is perfectly fair. However, I’m not positive that the conclusion this young woman draws is entirely correct:

“In Catherine’s view, her classmates tried very hard to separate sex from emotion, because they believed that getting too attached to someone would interfere with their work. They saw a woman’s marrying young as either proof of a lack of ambition or a tragic mistake that would stunt her career. That might mean having to pass up certain career opportunities, for geographic reasons. But Catherine thought that her peers underestimated how hard it was to find the right person to be with — as hard, perhaps, as finding the right job.

‘People kind of discount how difficult it is to find someone that you even remotely like, let alone really fall for,’ she said. And losing that can be just as impractical and harmful to yourself, if not more so, than missing out on a job or something like that. What else do you really have at the end of your life?’ “

Catherine would be 100% correct if she were 30. But at age 20, with so much change ahead of her? I think that if she had the capacity to enjoy experimenting, falling in and out of love, and making mistakes without thinking it was the end of the world, she’d be a lot happier. You don’t have to figure it all out when you’re in college. But if you still haven’t prioritized your love life in your 30′s, and still favor random hookups because you’re too busy for love, you may be in for a rude awakening.

Your thoughts, as always, are appreciated.

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Comments:

  1. 1
    Jackie H.

    Hmmm….It’s almost a Catch-22 situation…College is the time where a women will have the most access to so-called “good catches” and that opportunity should not be squandered in random relationships aka hookups; however, I don’t necessarily advocate looking to get married right out of college…I think it’s a delicate balance. Be smart. If you want to get married someday, recognize that college is a good time to make those connections that could lead to a potential mate…on the other hand, don’t be so obsessed with that that you end up making immature decisions and not exploring a little bit…

  2. 2
    J

    As a Penn alum I was quite amused when this article came out; things haven’t changed :-) Of my college friends that got married right after school, one couple is still together ( admittedly the sample size was not very large). College was a mix of relationships and hookups for me, as were my 20′s. Now, in my thirties, I’ve found many more relationship oriented men than I did when I was younger. Im clear on who i am and what i offer and what i prefer and Ive no doubt I’ll find a guy i can build a happy family with. I’m pleased with the way my life has turned out so far. If I had stayed with any college boyfriend I’m fairly certain we would either not still be married or I’d be unhappily married and just slogging through. Hookup shouldn’t be a dirty word.

  3. 3
    Julia

    I feel like I am in a unique position as a woman in her early 30s who partook in hookup culture in my 20s-it didn’t kill me emotionally, I am still friends with many of the men I hooked up with and it gave me something when I didn’t have time for a relationship!
     
    I viewed my twenties as a time for me and my growth. I had lots of fun, went to tons of parties, moved around and took one in a lifetime opportunities. Most of my friends concerned themselves with marrying before they hit 29. They have children and husbands now but didn’t get much life experience. I am single now but have experiences they envy. I am 32 and have been very serious about dating since I was 29, I am attractive and still have options, especially among men who took their twenties and early 30s as a time for personal growth.

  4. 4
    Jenwon

    College is the best time to find your future mate. You will never have that many similar aged, educated men/woman in one place again. Im not advocating getting married right after college, but most (75%) of my friends met their future spouses in college.
    Have your learning experiences and bad relationships in college. Its much easier to recover and pick up the pieces at that time with no responsibilities and commitments. Once you are out in the world with your career and other things in the way, a relationship setback is much more damaging.

  5. 5
    Julia

    @Jenwon 
    How old are you?
    I know only a small handful of married friends who met their spouse in college, like 2-3 and I have an exceptionally large social network of well educated professional friends. Most who are married met their spouses in their late 20s and early 30s.
     
    As far as never being among that many similarly aged/educated people. Depends on where you live. I live in a large metropolitan area with 20 colleges in city proper, another 20 outside of it. Most young people graduate and stay in the city so I believe its a large network and higher quality than college.

  6. 6
    Paula

    I wonder how this would apply to mature students such as myself. I am in my 30s and went back to get my bachelors. I know of one woman who had a baby and is living with her boyfriend and going to school part time. Not sure how old she is but I am guessing she is in her 30s as well.
     
    I feel I have a lot to offer. I went back to school because I want to get into Statistics as I was an Administrator and kept getting laid off so I want a better paying job with hopefully more stability.
     
    Plenty of adults go back to school and considering how our economy has changed, being a life learner may very well be the norm where people are always going back to school to upgrade their skills.

  7. 7
    starthrower68

    It’s become painfully obvious to me I don’t understand the world anymore.  The big debate about women in college is, should they look for a husband or hook up, not what is a good field of study to get into, what are the up and coming careers, etc.  A series of no strings attached relationships and meaningless sex is personal growth.  I am completely out of my element in today’s world.

  8. 8
    SAL9000

    How is it folk ignore the catastrophic socio-economic consequences of a “hookup” culture – 1MM+ abortions a year, ~45% illegitimacy rates, 50%+ divorce rates, fewer and fewer marriages, and STD rates that make the eyes water. All of these things negatively affect women FAR more than men. Women are not men when it comes to sexuality. Try to make it so and you Very Bad Things (sadly for women). Oh, to answer the question, yes, women should choose looking for Mr. Right (or Mr. Right for the next year or two) over “hooking up,” when in college.

  9. 9
    Kiki

    Before the internet, people used to meet their spouse most often through study (college/university etc) or work.  It would be interesting how it is now.
    I have a 10 year old daughter, and I have been thinking what advice I would give her on boys.  She is already curious – sex is all around – in movies, advertisements etc, and – if we believe Freud – in little children’s heads from the day they’re born. She will hopefully go to university one day, and I honestly freak out from reading about the experiences some of the girls in the original article share. At the same time – she will be a young adult at the time, and young adults tend to look down on their mother’s advice…
    What I intend to tell her (honestly I wish I could delay this conversation) is that 1) sex is a natural and healthy experience, and it can be very pleasarable for both men and women 2) with the wrong person it can range from lousy to terrible to dangerous 3) she has to be very selective in her partners due to personal safety, danger for STDs but EQUALLY IMPORTANTLY in order to preserve the potential to really have a pleasarable experience which truly flourishes in conditions of emotional intimacy with the partner, and 4) there is a reputational cost a girl pays for being known to sleep around and it is in her favor to avoid this.
    Would this be valid for kids her generation? Will she even care to listen? She is a very smart and sweet kid, but I know for sure she will have to go through her own mistakes as a part of growing up. God help us.
     

  10. 10
    Rose

    Sal9000.
    I feel pleased I wasn’t brought up and educated  that healthy sex was part of lovemaking in a loving relationship with two consenting adults who cared and loved each other. And to have more respect for mysellf to not get invollved with  men who wanted to use my body for instant gratifacation and that would be putting myself in danger. And that men who wanted to hook up with women and use them for sex were not good men and avoid like the plague.
    I only had boyfriends whilst in my college years not hookups. And wasn’t wanting to get married when that young.
     
      

  11. 11
    Rose

    was not wasn’t

  12. 12
    LC

    None of the women that I know who were slutting around in college cared very much about themselves or their bodies.  They had low self esteem and were looking for attention–any kind of attention.  If a woman wastes her prime years hooking up, she must realize that when she gets to my age (37), there will be a lot less men available than in her 20s.  I have never slept around, and I still haven’t met the right guy.  Maybe I should have slutted it up while I had the chance?  Who knows?  I know that I would feel terrible about myself if I had been having one night stands throughout my younger years.  Sex either means something to you, or it doesn’t.  You get good at whatever you practice, and I don’t think there’s much of a point to practicing promiscuity if you’re long term relationship minded.

  13. 13
    starthrower68

    We call it being evolved when we can have sex with others but we gave no genuine feeling for them.  That’s a society at its cultural zenith. It worked pretty well for Rome.  Of course that was then and this now and we would not fall like Rome did because we are more evolved than they were.  One thing about the laws of sowing and reaping: they don’t care what era it is, they still work the same.

  14. 14
    J

    Hook up doesn’t always equal sex ( intercourse or oral). Sometimes it’s a good make out/ heavy petting session, particulary when talking about college kids. Surely we aren’t all going to hell in a hand basket for that :-)

  15. 15
    WhatsGoingOn

    I am not opposed to hookups as much as the article’s description of how young women nowadays go about it.  Did you guys click on the link and read the actual article?: “Women said universally that hookups could not exist without alcohol, because they were for the most part too uncomfortable to pair off with men they did not know well without being drunk. One girl, explaining why her encounters freshman and sophomore year often ended with fellatio, said that usually by the time she got back to a guy’s room, she was starting to sober up and didn’t want to be there anymore, and giving the guy oral sex was an easy way to wrap things up and leave.”  It goes on to describe several examples of unclear sexual assault and rape statistics. 
    I am not opposed to women exploring sex or delaying serious relationships until later in life.  But the actual culture described in this article smacks of uninformed women doing it cavalierly and insanely nowadays with alcohol and peer pressure.  They talk a big talk but it doesn’t sound like they are able to stand up for themselves when in the actual situation.  That is not empowerment that is asking to be taped.  If you are hogging to engage in potentially risky behavior you should do it sober and without peer pressure to fit in.
     
     

  16. 16
    Drew

    And what’s the 800lb gorilla in this room that no one is addressing?
    A woman’s declining fertility after a certain age.
    [OK, ducking for cover now.]

    1. 16.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      Sorry, Drew. You’re my friend, but I gotta give you the smackdown. First of all, 18-21 year old girls should absolutely NOT be on the prowl for a husband. No one should get married until their brains have matured (around 25-26) at the earliest. More likely, they shouldn’t get married until their 30′s, which is when most people have enough life experience to figure out what’s important in a partner. And, you’ll be surprised to know, Drew, that if a woman tried to get pregnant every month for a year at age 38, she’s got an 82% likelihood of doing so, which is virtually the identical percentage she would find if she were to try at age 30. Fertility drops significantly around 40. But that is a lifetime away for college girls who should not have to worry about finding husbands, but rather being independent, experimenting with alcohol and sex, and getting good grades.

      And before you disagree with my fact (funny how people do that when it doesn’t suit their narratives/preconceived beliefs), here’s a quote from the article (which I will be linking to on this blog in a week): “It found that with sex at least twice a week, 82 percent of 35-to-39-year-old women conceive within a year, compared with 86 percent of 27-to-34-year-olds.”

  17. 17
    Joe

    @ J #14:
     
    That’s a semantic distinction, and it varies.  Some people consider hooking up to be sexual activity, some people think just making out is hooking up.

    As far as college being the best time to meet your spouse due to the similar aged, educated etc. reason, that’s not necessarily so.  College students often still don’t know what they want from life.  Getting married to your college sweetheart doesn’t mean you’re going to end up with the same life goals.

  18. 18
    Julia

    @LC well I guess you missed out on the “slutting around” and still are single, so your hypothesis seems a bit off no? Also hooking up doesn’t mean lots of one night stands that include intercourse. Hooking up can mean a wide variety of things but it does infer casualness. You can casually sleep with someone for an extended period, or fool around and not have sex, you can make out with random guys at parties. Maybe being chaste doesn’t equal women deserving a husband. Marriage isn’t something you merit from doing everything the way that society tells you to. Your sexual past has literally nothing to do with your relationship present.

  19. 19
    starthrower68

    @ Julia I disagree on two points:
    I consider this blog to be a pretty good bellwether of culture at least on a general level. Given that, I would submit that society cheers on the hook up, whether it stays on first base or steals home. Sex is all over our media and being sexually pure is considered prudish and outdated.
    With regard to your point about your sexual past not determining your future, that topic had been addressed more than once on this blog and we all seem to want it both ways. 

  20. 20
    amydk

    My Israeli husband says this country is really screwed up about sexual attitudes and the women he knew all had sex for pleasure’s sake and none of this “feeling used” that everyone talks about. I tell him that sex is different for women, that it makes us more attached, biologically speaking, and he says it’s just cultural mores. 
    It’s so hard to know if women are hooking up to feel empowered and take charge of their sex lives or for “low self-esteem” insecurities. I hope that it’s the former.
    And as one commenter said, I hope they go to college for education.

  21. 21
    Peter 61

    Back to the 1995 CDC survey of risky student behaviours.  About 25% of both sexes were promiscuous.  25% were changing partners and about 50% virgins or monogamous.  Does anyone really think that has changed? In the UK, alcohol consumption has risen dramatically over the last 20 years from amongst the lowest in Europe to amongst the highest (comparable with Ireland and Russia).  The largest rise was with young women.  The main driver was easier and cheaper access to alcohol at supermarkets (thus private parties at home/halls of residence) rather than the socially open pubs where bad behaviour can be seen in public.

  22. 22
    Peter 61

    @EVan @19.
    You are right about fertility.  I disagree with you about the onset of mature thinking.  The brain changes throughout life.  Due to the work of one researcher, who has claimed to discover a new stage of development to explain 20 something boomerangs (a quite modern phenomenon) there is an idea around that the 20′s are some kind of pre Adulthood.  I am not sure that would stand up to argument in the Kalahari desert.  I agree that you had to be 30 to enter the Roman Senate but most democracies give votes to 18 year olds, allow them to volunteer for the army and sentence them to adult terms in jail.  Really, some 5 year olds pass the cookie test.  Others don’t.  Some 12 year olds resist the pressure to smoke, others don’t. I have never seen the impulsive ones convert to people who exercise restraint.  Certainly by 12, people are pretty fixed.  I think you are as fit to make a decision about how marriage fits your life at 18 as at 40.
    I’m with Shakespeare on the stages of human life (for US readers – School was Grammar School and ended around 16 years old).  The lover is the next stage. Think Romeo and Juliet.  In easier times the soldier becomes the husbandman.
    “The Seven Ages of Man
    Poem by William Shakespeare.
    All the world’s a stage,
    And all the men and women merely players,
    They have their exits and entrances,
    And one man in his time plays many parts,
    His acts being seven ages. At first the infant,
    Mewling and puking in the nurse’s arms.
    Then, the whining schoolboy with his satchel
    And shining morning face, creeping like snail
    Unwillingly to school. And then the lover,
    Sighing like furnace, with a woeful ballad
    Made to his mistress’ eyebrow. Then a soldier,
    Full of strange oaths, and bearded like the pard,
    Jealous in honour, sudden, and quick in quarrel,
    Seeking the bubble reputation
    Even in the cannon’s mouth. And then the justice
    In fair round belly, with good capon lin’d,
    With eyes severe, and beard of formal cut,
    Full of wise saws, and modern instances,
    And so he plays his part. The sixth age shifts
    Into the lean and slipper’d pantaloon,
    With spectacles on nose, and pouch on side,
    His youthful hose well sav’d, a world too wide,
    For his shrunk shank, and his big manly voice,
    Turning again towards childish treble, pipes
    And whistles in his sound. Last scene of all,
    That ends this strange eventful history,
    Is second childishness and mere oblivion,
    Sans teeth, sans eyes, sans taste, sans everything.”

  23. 23
    Rose

    The theory is pre frontal cortex doesn’t fully develop which contolls impulse contol and mature reasoning doesn’t occur until 25-30.
    Later in boys.
    And not at all in some people.
    Also re fertility what we are told are the older one gets the higher the chances of abnormalities.
    Another problem appears to be if a woman is on the pill that she will not choose the best match to have healthy babies with.
    http://www.livescience.com/2781-pill-women-pick-bad-mates.html.
    All that along with girls Daddy issues, boys with Mummy issues adding alchol into the mix and it is a wonder any of us get it right.
    Maybe a different type of sex education including all the above information would be a start in the right direction.
     

  24. 24
    Peter 61

    In most of Europe, for most of the last 1500 years, certainly since the rise of Christianity, young people have needed parental permission to marry before 21 years of age  After that they were free to make their own choices, unless aristocrats who needed the Sovereign’s permission.  That’s a long time to be consistently wrong about adulthood.  Suggests to me that college is a time for flirting not long term commitments.  30 seems to me to be the minimum requirement for the onset of full maturity.  The Brother’s Grimm have a take on this which is different from Shakespeare’s (essentially that life after 30 is no fun).  Give me a request and I’ll post it.

  25. 25
    Francesca

    I am a little surprised that the view of my broader group of friends didn’t make an appearance tbh. 
    A lot of us found hooking up with randoms to be emotionally draining and really distracting from studies. I remember one time after hook up not being able to properly study for a couple of days because I was so distracted. I went through a succession for about a year or so of short term relationships – 5 weeks or so, really quick and fast. When it ended I was relieved, and my friends were too. I found the whole experience to be damaging for my self confidence tbh. In comparison I found being in a steady relationship enhanced my study – I could schedule sex, and if I was having a bad day I could call someone, who would answer, who would come over and give me a cuddle. 
     
    It was also really sad to hear about the involvement of rape/reluctance on the part of the women. When we went out to parties if our friends needed to go home because they had drunk too much – we took them. Even if we were really annoyed she’d gotten to such a state. No girl went home with a guy unless we as her friends were convinced that it was what she would have wanted to do when she was sober (or at least semi sober). 

  26. 27
    Karmic Equation

    Rose @ 10

    “…And to have more respect for mysellf to not get invollved with  men who wanted to use my body for instant gratifacation and that would be putting myself in danger…”

    I object to this categorization of casual sex because your phrasing implies that women who have casual sex don’t have self-respect and are stupid.

    Casual sex is not right or wrong in and of itself. The REASONS why one might have it can make it so. An insecure woman having casual sex is not a good idea. A secure woman having casual sex, no problem. A man having casual sex, no problem. A woman looking to start a relationship with casual sex, big problem.

    In my opinion, a woman who constantly denigrates other people for having casual sex shows her own insecurity…because she needs to push others down in order to push herself up. Please stop with the moralizing. It doesn’t make you a better woman than those who can have casual sex.

    LC 12
    “None of the women that I know who were slutting around in college cared very much about themselves or their bodies. They had low self esteem and were looking for attention–any kind of attention.”

    How do you know this? Did you take a survey? Or is this just your opinion?

    When I was in college, I *didn’t* slut around and had low self-esteem (as it related to men) and would have loved to have gotten any kind of attention.

    Slutting around, low self-esteem, and wanting attention are not mutually inclusive.

    “Sex either means something to you, or it doesn’t. You get good at whatever you practice, and I don’t think there’s much of a point to practicing promiscuity if you’re long term relationship minded.”

    It’s interesting you used the judgmental word “promiscuity” in place of the word “sex” because logically your sentence SHOULD have read:

    “Sex either means something to you, or it doesn’t. You get good at whatever you practice, and I don’t think there’s much of a point to practicing sex if you’re long term relationship minded.”

    And had you written that, you would have been WRONG. That’s why you changed the word sex to “promiscuity”. Good men like good sex just like bad men like good sex. There is nothing wrong with “practicing sex” so that you can be good at it. Stop moralizing and judging others for having the capacity to handle casual sex when you cannot. Casual sex is not bad. The reasons people have it can have bad consequences for those people, but the act of sex is not bad (unless the partner is bad at it). Just like relationship sex can be terrible, even though you’re in a relationship. I’ve had both. I would say casual sex has been better than relationship sex…because nothing beats that hot, first-time-sex, sex.

    I write like I slut around. I don’t. Only one lover last year; only one lover the 6 years before that. Have to admit, I’ve had 3 lovers and counting this year, but only because I’ve consciously decided to try circular dating rather than serial dating. I’m having a blast.

    Which leads me to…

    @Cat5 27

    That’s an interesting article. Maybe I’m just not good with numbers, but how can there be more hookups but less partners? For some reason I couldn’t get my head around that. I’m guessing the women are lying about their number of partners.

    That said, I understand exactly the point they’re making in the article.

    I’ve had more sex when I was in relationships than I’ve had having casual sex. I may have more partners this year than in years past, but I’m not having sex with them 2-3x a week like I was doing when I was in my relationships.

    So is promiscuity having “more sex” or “more partners”? Because having more partners doesn’t necessarily mean one is having more sex.

  27. 28
    David T

    Karmic28, you seem to be rather defensive when no one called you out in particular, but then I have not been following this blog terribly closely in recent months so maybe this is part of an ongoing spat?

    

I disagree with Rose in many ways, and from the tone of her post I do agree she was making a judgement about women and sex in general and not just herself in particular. Nevertheless, what do you care what she thinks? What works for you, works for you, and what Rose and people like her think about other folks does not matter.
    



    I am going to re-restate what LC12 probably meant (if you can pretend to be a mind reader, then so can I).

    Karmic, you believe she meant to say:

    “Sex either means something to you, or it doesn’t. You get good at whatever you practice, and I don’t think there’s much of a point to practicing sex if you’re long term relationship minded.”
     
    


I believe she meant to say:



    “Sex either means something to you, or it doesn’t. You get good at whatever you practice, and I don’t think there’s much of a point to practicing sex without attachment if you’re long term relationship minded.”




    

I believe that if a person wants sex to be an act of attachment and rarely uses it that way, it will lose some of its ability to do that, and they will have to build their attachment (if that is something they even want) in other ways. 




    I believe all of us are wired such that sexual intimacy inherently builds an attachment to a lesser or greater degree depending on the individual.  If this was not true we would not bother seeking out other people to share sex with and would stick to the convenience of self pleasure with the person who knows best what feels good to us. For some reason we WANT  (need?) to share it with another person.  I also believe this inherent attachment is stronger for the typical woman than the typical man, yet  the level of attachment the “typical” male builds from sex is larger than most men care to admit (from observations of male friends; I think I am tend towards more the attachment direction more than most men.)

    What is inherent  can be altered through repeated practice because we are big brained critters.  I am curious, did you find this to be true? Do you get hooked on someone less from sex now, than say in your early 20′s?





  28. 29
    Rose

    Karmic you are free to object all you like and tell others what to do.
    I personally haven’t found that works well for me or anyone else though.
    It feels odd to me that someone who felt good about themselves and was confident in themselves and their life choices would then feel the need to defend those life choices, to someone who didn’t want to make those same life choices because they felt it was disrespecting themselves.
    I personally wouldn’t want to disrespect myself by sharing my body in an incredible intimate act sharing my genitals in a casual way.
    If you do not think it is disrespecting yourself that I can respect your difference of opinion just do not agree with it.

  29. 30
    J

    Rose- don’t you get it? It’s your tone that ruffles feathers.  In almost every post, it’s your tone.

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