The College Try - Garfunkel and Oates | Evan Marc Katz Blog

What can I say? These two hyperliterate women make me laugh. Plus, they’re truth tellers. I like truth tellers.

Why He Disappeared is the smart, strong, successful woman's guide to understanding men. If you want to learn how men think, and rediscover how to have meaningful relationships - all from a man's point of view - click here to learn Why He Disappeared.

Do You Want to Attract the Partner of Your Dreams?

If so, sign up for my free dating and relationship newsletter and receive my free eBook, The 5 Massive Mistakes You're Making In Your Love Life - And How to Turn Them Around Instantly. Simple and effective advice to jumpstart your love life.

87 Comments »Filed Under Sex

87 Responses to “The College Try – Garfunkel and Oates”

starthrower68 1

That’s awesome!!!
Marcia 2

On occasion, Mr. Katz, you are truly crude. There is nothing funny about this, but totally depressing. This is the result of homosexualized media drivel contaminating male-female relationships; the death of masculinity and femininty (or, almost) and just plain cynicism–ugly, rude and crude.
And, uh, no, I am not a provincial “rube”…
in fact, I am the woman you say does not exist: the “supermodel” type in looks, History degree from an Ivy school, two foreign languages, and brilliant cooking skills. I came on this site as a young widow, looking to learn about dating.
I will not be staying any longer.
helene 3

I can only assume men see it differently??!!
Ellen 4

eeeeeewwwwwwwww. Really Evan, TMI ok? That said, porn stars earn their pay, that’s for sure.
Glad I had lunch over an hr. ago.
LD 5

My girlfriends and I are cracking up over this. Love it.
Karl R 6

helene asked: (#2)
“I can only assume men see it differently??!!”

Sort of.

I wish I had the email address of the (ex)girlfriend who claimed that female genitalia were aesthetically pleasing and men’s were silly-looking … just so I could send her the link to this YouTube video.

That said, I find female genitalia sexually arousing because it’s associated with sex, not because they look pretty. (I can’t fault their descriptions of how it looked.) On the other hand, I don’t have the visceral repulsion that they described. (My visceral reaction is the opposite of theirs.)

Discussing the distinct … aroma which Garfunkel and Oates mention: it’s my understanding that there are a substantial number of pheromones in vaginal secretions. It’s no rose bouquet, but it’s certainly arousing.
Amy 7

This is kinda funny, but I think it’s much funnier for you Evan, than for us girls.
Dawn 8

@helene I for one am extreamly grateful that they do!!
Helen 9

Ehhh… it’s not an offensive video, but it’s rather immature and melodramatic and not especially funny. It would be more interesting to know what men think. Karl, thanks for providing your discreet opinions.
Henriette 10

Meh. I know it’s meant in fun, but the fact that one of the fastest-growing forms of plastic surgery is women having their genitals hacked (“labiaplasty”)* makes me uneasy when I hear anyone talk about how ugly and gross females are “down there.”
Besides, I can’t say that I was struck by the smooth pulchritude of the first penis I ever saw. I liked it – because I was in love with the owner and attracted to him – but I sure didn’t think it was exquisitely beautiful or smelled like roses.

* http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18947106
* http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/nov/20/cosmetic-vulva-surgery
Frimmel 11

Couldn’t watch the vid but I’m pretty sure I get the gist and would echo Karl in #5. Some are prettier than others. It is very rare (ever?) in my experience to find one an unappetizing unarousing distance from a rose bouquet.
Kathleen 12

I also realize the video is meant in fun but behind it is a unpleasant tone of self loathing that is all to common in females.
I heard on a TED talk that 53% of 13 year olds are unhappy with their bodies and that goes up to 78% by the time they are 17. So now the self loathing goes from loathing your female fat to loathing your genitalia?
Thanks Karl for offering some redeeming comments so I don’t feel so “icky” about the video.
chivon 13

I thought the video was funny. Esp when the women cringe in horror =P
@ Marcia, Henriette and Kathleen: I thought you might be taking the video out of context. The song is about a woman who tried to sleep with another woman but was revolted by the idea of going down on her female. How would you say that it shows the woman loathing her own genitalia? She’s not trying to go down on herself….
And is the message really about self-loathing? I mean..the song describes the smells of the vagina and how it oozes (haha)..are you saying that this isn’t true in real life? How is telling the truth ‘crude’??? I don’t think the singers are saying that vaginas are ugly or gross in general, or that by extension women should hate their vaginas if they aren’t pink and perfect…I don’t think that’s the message. They’re celebrating the vagina actually by poking fun at how it looks. That’s all
chivon 14

*oops i meant ‘…going down on her female partner’ in the 4th line. Sorry for the confusion!
David T 15

I concur with Karl, Frimm and Kath’s points and add that some women are very self-conscious about that exquisite (:)) part of their anatomy. It is a little sad that in moments of vulnerability and caring affection (emotionally intimate sex) that they feel unsafe and fear being judged or rejected.
Nadia 16

Yeah, I’m kind of over hearing how gross the vulva is.
JB 17

As a guy I thought the video was cute and funny. I love everything about the vagina. I love the way they all look a little different, smell/taste a little different, have hair around them(hopefully), love the labia and the folds. “Labiaplasty”, waxing, or doing anything to ruin it’s natural beauty doesn’t do it for me. Sorry. I love it the way god made it.
Ruby 18

I’m not getting how poking fun at how the vagina looks is actually celebrating it. I understand that the video is about a woman wanting to be able to be bisexual, but when confronted with an actual vagina, she loses all interest. However, the video made its point repeatedly, literally ad nauseum. If you hate the way another vagina looks, are you going to hate the way yours looks?

Have you ever watched a woman give birth? It looks pretty gross, yet from that comes a new life. Is there a point to going on and on about how disgusting it is?
PK 19

Haha, so then what’s behind girls saying they like doing that?
Karen 20

I understand this was intended as lighthearted fun. It struck a nerve of sadness instead, and even more so because it was made by two women.
I immediately felt sad for all the girls and women who will continue to miss the pleasure, orgasms and deep intimacy that come when they can truly relax and enjoy their bodies being pleasured so intimately by another. Instead many or most will continue to feel too uncomfortable to really let go, since their fear and insecurities that their pussy is revolting in some way is perpetuated or confirmed (inaccurately in my opinion of course.)
A video about the sexiness, tastiness, and hotness of a pussy– up close would have gifted your readers with a greater freedom to embrace and enjoy their pussies with complete abandon.
Instead, more women will keep their legs closed and feel inhibited, ashamed, afraid and not wanting to revolt their partner.
So much pleasure, fun and intimacy that could have been. So, so sad.
Locutus 21

OMG…what very uptight women visit this site? The movie was hilarious. Of course the girls rambled on with half a million different rhyming descriptions about the vagina- that was the point and that’s what made it funny, the fact that they drew it out to the extreme and made everything rhyme, as well. I know a girl who thought she might be bi and when faced with it found out very quickly she wasn’t. LOL. This video reminds me of her. She laughed it off.
If they made a video of a straight guy saying how gross a penis is I would laugh my ass off.
Ruby, Karen, if you’re that insecure with your own bodies then don’t blame a funny video. That is your issue. Others who aren’t insecure with themselves want some laughter. I think most of my straight female friends would laugh at the video because they are not into vagina either and would find it gross to put their mouth on one!!! It’s not about saying yours is gross, it’s about saying vagina to a straight female is gross. To a guy it’s totally different. Geez, lighten up!!! Twisting everything out of proportion!!
Karen you find the video sad? Seriously? What’s with all the extreme sensitivity? Geez nobody can even make a joke anymore. You women must be a bore! This was funny. You want sad, turn on the news and see people getting killed around the world for stupid reasons. That is what is sad. Do you ever watch comedy because they make fun of people all the time- both men and women. Do you take it personally and get all offended at that too?
Lia 22

Seriously??? @ Karen “… more women will keep their legs closed and feel inhibited, ashamed, afraid and not wanting to revolt their partner.” PLEEEASE! Showing that video is going to cause women to feel shamed??? Really?? My self esteem isn’t so fragile that I would be introverted by a silly video. Bit over the top in your dramatic conclusion of the demise of women’s pleasure and self confidence.
Jennifer 23

If the video has any ‘message’, it’s that lesbians should stay away from fake bi-curious women. Cause the night won’t end well.
K 24

Amen @21 and 22!
Birdlife 25

A friendly word of advice Evan – before posting ask yourself ”How does this help smart, strong, successful women understand men?”
I’m glad that I already have gained so much from this site – if this had been the first thing that I had seen on my first visit to the site I wouldn’t be a-coming back!
henriette 26

Amen @16 & 20!
Chance 27

@Birdlife: I think the video can provide insight on how many men may view close-up encounters with vaginas, even though the song is from the standpoint of a bi-curious woman. I’ve met many a-woman over the years that thought penises were unsanitary and funny-looking, while vaginas were beautiful, delicate flowers that were to be celebrated.
Truth is, human genitalia (male or female) are pretty funny looking, when you think about it, and they can be flat-out gross when proper sanitary measures are not taken. At any rate, it was a funny video. I was entertained.
Karmic Equation 28

@Women who found this offensive/disheartening etc

This just goes to show you you have no sense of humor and/or take yourself and/or sex TOO SERIOUSLY.

If you’re having trouble finding men or keeping relationships going, your lacking a sense of humor about women could be a culprit…or taking things too seriously could be a culprit…or having too thin a skin could be the culprit.

This video wasn’t cruel. Just telling it like it is from a straight female perspective.

The only take away ANY woman should have from this is that the MEN who have commented here are saying, “Hey, we LIKE/LOVE how your genitalia look and smell. It turns us on.” That is the message whether or not you enjoyed the video. Internalize that positive message and don’t be self-conscious. It’s all good.
JB 29

Karmic Equation is correct.
@Birdlife #25 - THAT’S how it helps smart, strong, successful women understand men.
Teresa 30

This is laugh out loud funny, just don’t watch the clip whilst drinking a glass of wine. Totally worth it, but I just snorted it out of my nose. Struck a chord with me, lots of women think they might kiss a girl, and like it, but getting up close and personal downstairs is an entirely different matter!
henriette 31

Most people who enjoy the video have been civil in the their comments. But I’m interested that a significant minority have chosen to insult ~ in a personal, rude manner ~ the women who’ve stated that they don’t enjoy it or who have expressed some discomfort with certain elements.
“This just goes to show you you have no sense of humor and/or take yourself and/or sex TOO SERIOUSLY.”
“What very uptight women visit this site!”
“Bit over the top with your dramatic conclusion…”
Goldie 32

I dunno, I chuckled. Pretty sure straight men (and gay women) do not have the same reaction, so to me the song had nothing to do with self-loathing or any of that stuff. A penis does not exactly look and smell like the lily of the valley, either, but with the help of my hormones, I am able to, um, enjoy my interactions with it.
Rebecca 33

I thought it was hilarious, and for me, kinda accurate (though my response wasn’t quite so visceral, I did come to the same conclusion these ladies did). LOL
Locutus 34

I find that hypersensitive women, i.e. Henriette, love to throw around words when it suits them. Somebody can make an statement to one extremity that agrees with her opinion and it’s just fine. Then someone who is against that opinion is suddenly rude or insulting or hostile in their eyes. Henriette, grow a backbone. I find Karen’s extreme comments about being ‘sad’ over the video totally ridiculous and insulting. If she wants to blow something way out of proportion, well then be prepared to hear extreme comments back. You obviously have chosen your side and I will stand my ground. Secondly, why are you sticking your nose into comments that were not even directed at you? Are you trying to police the site or something? Evan is the moderator and if he feels a comment does not belong then it is up to him solely to disallow it. Nothing worse than people who can dish things out, but not take anything back.

Next time stick to discussing the topic and not policing others comments that were not directed at you or else mind your own business.
Jennifer 35

Locutus, I’m on your ‘side’ on this issue but telling someone to ‘mind their own business’ on a public website/message board where anyone is free to comment on the article or comments following the article just doesn’t make much sense.
Signed,
CommentPolice
marymary 36

Locutus
the irony of your comment is slaying me.
henriette 37

“Locutus, the irony of your comment is slaying me.” + 1
Locutus 38

Jennifer,
No problem if she wants to butt into the conversation, but if so then she better not complain about the comments. You don’t have it both ways.
Support one extreme view and then cry foul when someone makes comments that are directly opposite. I see people like Lia and Rebecca thought Karen’s comments were silly too. “Over the top” as Lia put it is 100% correct and not an overstatement. If Henriette feels that a comment like that is insulting then she is clueless.
Ruby 39

“Locutus, the irony of your comment is slaying me.” + 2

“…if you’re that insecure with your own bodies then don’t blame a funny video. That is your issue.”

Hey, I’m not the one who described the vagina as “a half-eaten beef and cheddar in the garbage can at Arby’s”, or said,” I can’t believe I have one of those, eeew.” But if you find it a laugh riot, good for you.
Karen 40

We all want women to feel at ease with their bodies, their vaginas, their sexuality, and their capacity to orgasm.
As women who are fortunate to feel such ease, it’s easy to forget that HUGE numbers of women are not so fortunate. Lots of women don’t feel ease in at least one of those aspect, let alone more than one.
Those of us that enjoy our sexuality and orgasms can easily forget that a large percentage of sexually active women have never had an orgasm and will never in their lifetime. Of course being sexual and intimate is not all about the orgasm. Having multiple women friends reluctantly confess their lack of pleasure or ability to orgasm has made it that truth much more real for me.
Two beautiful women 38 and 42, with husbands who wanted and tried to please them beyond but couldn’t. The women couldn’t really enjoy themselves alone either. Their sex lives were strained as the women did not feel at ease sexually. What came forward in conversation was their mixed feeling about their bodies and their especially their vaginas. Once they were able to come to acceptance and embrace all of themselves, their sex lives changed dramatically. Non-orgasmic women became multi-orgasmic sex hungry and happy women. They were grateful to finally connect to their sexuality with full freedom and all the benefits. They felt released from the silent shame and all the judgement about their bodies and their inability to orgasm as well.
My 77 year old mother shared recently that she’d had fewer orgasms in her life than fingers on one hand. That means I have had more orgasms in one night than she’s had in her whole life. It’s not an orgasm contest, please don’t misunderstand me. It’s sad. How many women or men can even imagine a life with no orgasms or less than five? Seriously. I digress but for a reason.
In my experience, the greater ease I feel with my vagina (and my body, my sexuality, and my being) and sharing it up close in all it’s glory, with myself or another, directly correlates (for me) with the ease with which I orgasm and enjoy myself and my partner and the experience.
I suspect that to be true for other women as well. It was also true for my women friends and fortunately once the connection was made, a whole new world opened for them.
The sadness I felt seeing the video was for the younger and mature women who do not feel at ease with their bodies, their sexuality, their capacity to orgasm.
The numbers of women and girls who feel physically insecure or inadequate with clothes on is tremendous. Ask women to get naked and that number only goes up. Invite women to spread their legs and reveal their vaginas and the number of girls and women truly at ease with how they look, feel and taste I imagine is lower than low. Do I find that sad. I do. That’s me.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Can you see the beauty in 100 different women of all shapes and sizes? I hope so. Does our society? Not generally. Someday I hope it does.
Do 100 different women have 100 different looking pussies in all their glory. They do. Can one appreciate the beauty in their 100 different shaped and colored pussies? I hope so. Does our society? Not yet. Someday I hope it does.
Do I wish all women to feel at ease in their bodies, as to enjoy themselves and their sexuality with the greatest possible liberation. I do.
I believe HUGE numbers of young girls are growing up insecure about how their bodies compare to the everyday highly sexualized images they see in the media. Porn is the predominant sex education for young people these days creating all new (and often false) expectations as well.
My response was much more than to Evan’s choice to repost the video on his blog. I wish I would have clarified that. His audience is more specific.
Beyond that, inside myself, I was caught up feeling for all the impressionable young women NOT yet comfortable with the look, feel, smell or taste of their vaginas or sexuality, that will see the video on you tube directly or somewhere else and will feel less comfortable with their bodies and their sexuality as result. That I found sad.
In seeing the video:
A woman not comfortable with her vagina may or may not laugh on the surface, but I imagined she would feel numbness or pain below as her fears are confirmed.
A woman comfortable with her vagina may laugh on the surface, in recognition of insecurities she perhaps once felt when she was less secure.
A woman comfortable with her vagina may also find the video a sad and an unnecessary creation. For her the price of a momentary laugh for some is just not worth the possibility or cost of accidentally or inadvertently leading younger girls and other women to continue to feel a lack of acceptance and lack of ease with their vaginas and thus to me, their ability to enjoy themselves and their sexuality as fully as possible.
I would hate for some already insecure young woman to watch the video and as a result be swayed by the strong ugly imagery (no matter how in jest) and vagina disgust (no matter how lighthearted), that it tipped her away from a life of enjoying her body, her vagina and her capacity to orgasm. That I imagined and felt as sad.
Oversensitive. I am a woman. That does happen. That’s how I experienced it in the moment.
No matter what, I’d just rather see more vagina loving women at ease with their bodies and fully enjoying their sexuality, and able to orgasm. That’s me.
Locutus 41

Hey Karen,
Go live in a sheltered world then. Are women so weak that they need to be insulated from jokes or anything that might dare be hurtful towards them even if meant as a joke? Should the world stop working because insecure people can’t handle it??? Good Lord.
To all those posting about irony. There is no irony. Cite me whatever example you are referring to and I will clear it up for you.
Karl R 42

Karen said: (#40)
“I would hate for some already insecure young woman to watch the video and as a result be swayed by the strong ugly imagery (no matter how in jest) and vagina disgust (no matter how lighthearted), that it tipped her away from a life of enjoying her body, her vagina and her capacity to orgasm.”

Your ability to blow this out of proportion is truly amazing.

I’ve never been under the impression that my scrotum is a visually attractive part of my body. My legs, buttocks and abs get compliments. The scrotum, never.

Somehow, I’ve been able to accept that my scrotum (just like every other man’s) is acceptable to women … unless the women want to forgo sex with men completely. I’m comfortable being seen naked. I’m comfortable having my legs spread. I’m comfortable having my scrotum played with (provided the handling isn’t too rough).

Having made the transformation from someone who was uncomfortable with my looks into someone who is completely at ease with my looks and body, the essential transformation comes from within. It didn’t require people telling me that I was beautiful in every possible way. (If it had required that, I’d still be uncomfortable with my looks.)

On the contrary, I’m able to be comfortable with my looks even though I catch a fair amount of unflattering teasing (usually about the glare off my skin when I take off my shirt).

Karen said: (#40)
“No matter what, I’d just rather see more vagina loving women at ease with their bodies and fully enjoying their sexuality, and able to orgasm.”

Teach them that masturbating to orgasm is normal and healthy.

I don’t have to think my scrotum is gorgeous in order to be comfortable with it. If I truly internalize being at ease with myself, I can be comfortable with the fact that it looks like a purplish, wrinkly, hairy little bag.

Karen said: (#40)
“I was caught up feeling for all the impressionable young women NOT yet comfortable with the look, feel, smell or taste of their vaginas or sexuality,”

TASTE ??

Most heterosexual men are sufficiently comfortable with their sexuality and able to orgasm regularly -without- ever tasting their own sperm (or anyone else’s).

If women are equal to men (which I fully believe), then it should be equally possible for you to be comfortable with your own damn bodies.

Even the wrinkly parts.
Karen 43

“It’s a messy visible secreting organ
Real woman genitals are kinda gross
I thought it’d be smooth and non-threatening
Or nonexistent like Barbie’s
Instead it looks like a half eaten Beef and Cheddar
In the garbage can at Arby’s
It’s wrinkly and flappy and uneven and messy
And kind of pink but also kind of brown
With a super aggressive tongue-like hole
And a hoody triangle protruding skin mound
It’s like a weather beaten deflated football
Or a decomposing, bloody pear
Or a toothless mouth with gum rot and yeast
That’s salivating and covered in hair
I knew it smelled weird but this is extreme
Like old French dressing at a salad bar
Or expired banana Activia
Or a dead, rotting turtle you left in your car
It reminds me of the smell of my grandma’s house
Or a guinea pig with bacterial disease
Wafting from a jar of formaldahyde”

I contend if this same routine was done by two men on you tube instead of two attractive women, other women would not dismiss the lyrics so easily and be so quick to defend it as funny. I don’t think it’s the sex of the presenters that make it “funny” or not. It just allows them to get away with degrading women’s bodies in a way that men wouldn’t likely attempt in public.
I can appreciate the humor in it. I get it. i really do. in my heart, I just feel the price of the laugh isn’t worth the potential insecurity it may perpetuate.
Karen 44

Karl #40
When a person goes down a woman, for most, if not all women, there can be a moment of vulnerability and concern that the taste of her vagina is somewhere between enjoyable and tolerable enough for the person pleasing her. So yes, I believe this too is a common insecurity girls and women overcome in learning to enjoy themselves.
i believe their perception directly relates to their ability to relax and enjoy the pleasure being given vs avoiding the act or not being able to truly enjoy it.
Locutus 45

Karl R,
Blown out of proportion. Incredibly correct!
Karl R 46

Karen said: (#43)
“I can appreciate the humor in it. I get it. i really do. in my heart, I just feel the price of the laugh isn’t worth the potential insecurity it may perpetuate.”

Following your line of reasoning, Jeff Foxworthy should stop telling jokes, because his redneck jokes could perpetuate potential insecurity in lower-class southerners.

Following the same line of reasoning, Gabriel Iglesias, John Pinette and Bruce Bruce shouldn’t tell jokes about their own weight, because they might perpetuate potential insecurity among fat guys.

Oh my God! Christopher Titus should avoid making jokes about his dysfunctional family, because those jokes could perpetuate insecurity among people who grew up in messy family situations.

And we should stop watching Mel Brooks entire body of work, because it might perpetuate potential insecurity among Jews. Evan, I’m so sorry if I’ve been thoughtlessly enjoying myself watching material which could damage your fragile little ego.

Almost every comedian makes fun of white guys. How on earth has my delicate mind managed to withstand the assault ?!?

Karen,
You believe that women need to be protected from “potential insecurity” caused by humor. I believe that women are tough enough to shrug off the same kind of jokes which are told about white guys all the time.

I think your attitude is far more damaging to women than mine. It perpetuates the ignorant belief that women need to be sheltered, protected and coddled “for their own good.” My attitude perpetuates the idea that women are strong and equal to men.

Karen said: (#43)
“I can appreciate the humor in it. I get it.”

No. You can’t appreciate it. And you don’t get it.
Karmic Equation 47

@Karen

I fail to see how you can link this video to non-orgasmic women. You are really stretching it. Pun intended.

If women aren’t comfortable with their bodies *within themselves* nothing outside of them will ever be able to make them feel comfortable. Therefore, nothing outside of themselves should be able to make them uncomfortable either. As Karl R wrote “the essential transformation comes from within.” If this is not the case, the women have MUCH bigger problems than how their vaginas look, feel, or taste. That is actually the LEAST of their problems.

You are really over-dramatizing this and making a mountain out of a mole-hill. It’s wonderful how you love your vagina and are multi-orgasmic. I really feel hurt that you have this capability because while I only get along with my vagina, I’m not even singularly-orgasmic during sex, nevermind multi-orgasmic…so I should I feel inadequate because you have this ability and I do not? How inadequate you have just made me feel. It’s shameful what that you were so insensitive as to point out my inadequacies like that.

Obviously, the above is tongue-in-cheek. I don’t feel in the least inadequate. Most women aren’t orgasmic during intercourse. So count yourself lucky. But that doesn’t mean I count myself as unlucky or inadequate. If I did feel inadequate, then the problem isn’t in what you communicated but rather what I felt about myself before any communication ever took place. It has nothing to do with you. Non-orgasmic women or insecure women will continue to feel that way even if this video never existed.
Goldie 48

@Karen,

“I contend if this same routine was done by two men on you tube instead of two attractive women, other women would not dismiss the lyrics so easily and be so quick to defend it as funny.”

I disagree. If this kind of routine, as in “I tried same-sex oral because I thought it was cool, then realized at the last moment I couldn’t do it” was done by two men, it’d be infinitely more offensive and boundary-stretching.

This same routine done by two straight men wouldn’t make any sense.

This video isn’t about what you think it’s about.
K 49

Another thing to note is that these women aren’t talking about how they feel about their OWN vagina. I look at mine, touch it, cleanse it and groom it. It’s not my favorite body part in the looks department, but I’m fine with it. I do not want to do any of the above activities with another women’s vagina. I don’t think they are portraying self-hate.
Karen 50

I simply felt sad in response to the video.
I felt surprised Evan chose to repost it on his site. I felt moved to share my experience.
I did not post to oppose someone else’s experience. I was simply sharing my own. There is a difference.
I am all for freedom of speech. Freedom of experience. There is no right or wrong here. There is no fight. There are just different ways of experiencing the world.
Laugh, enjoy the video…so what. Have your experience. There is no need to be disturbed and reply with criticism because I shared that I didn’t enjoy it the same way some of you did.
I felt sad and concerned about women who may be inhibited because of how they might experience the video. So what. It is just my experience. I never intended to suggest my experience needed to be someone else’s experience. If I came across that way, my sincerest apologies.
Truly, to each their own. Variety is the spice of life.
Locutus 51

It is not your personal view of the video that is so shocking Karen. It is your belief that so many women are fragile and insecure and need to be sheltered from even jokes and comedy. That is what is appalling! I don’t feel the majority of women are fragile nor need to be sheltered or would be bothered by this video. How can you cast such a dismal view of women? It is inaccurate and not representative of most. It is when people want to cast their wild beliefs on others that causes an uproar.
Jennifer 52

Karen#50
While I don’t share your views or experience regarding this video or vaginas in general, I respect the manner in which you’ve defended your point of view.
Ruby 53

Locutus #51

Hyperbole much? What’s the irony here? Simply that you are so harsh with people who don’t agree with you, and your language is even harsher than the opinions you claim to disagree with. How would you know what is “inaccurate” or “not representative of most”? Several women commented that they were not pleased with the video for various reasons. You don’t have to agree with us, but don’t turn around and insult us, or judge us. If you are “so shocked” and “appalled” that not everyone agrees with you, maybe that is your issue.
henriette 54

@Goldie – “If this kind of routine, as in “I tried same-sex oral because I thought it was cool, then realized at the last moment I couldn’t do it” was done by two men, it’d be infinitely more offensive and boundary-stretching.” Just curious as to why? Not ribbing you: genuinely curious.
Lia 55

@ Karen #43

Thanks for taking the time to write out the lyrics!!! Now all those poor women you wrote about and felt so “sad” for, all those women who have been traumatized watching the video can now clearly see any of the lyrics they might have missed. Well done!! They will now be suicidal. :)
Cat5 56

Karl R said: (#46)
Karen said: (#43)
    “I can appreciate the humor in it. I get it.”

    No. You can’t appreciate it. And you don’t get it.

Respectfully Karl R., you can do both, i.e., appreciate the humor and get it, while not being happy with the content and the message it sends.

Here is an example, using a comment I read on another site today:

   “Women always complain that it’s stupid how men can sleep with multiple women and be considered a Stud.

   I say to women it’s called the lock scenario. They say “What?”

Then the clincher —- “If a key opens lots of locks, it’s a Master Key. But, if a lock is opened by lots of keys, then it’s a shitty lock.”
I snorted/laughed out loud when I read it. But, after I laughed, I thought…”Yikes. That is really clever and really f’ed up, and sad that there are still people that think that statement is true.”

See I appreciated and I got it (snorted/laughed out loud and acknowledged it’s cleverness), although I am not happy with it’s content and message.
Locutus 57

Ruby,
It’s not agreeing with me. It is agreeing with most women. Do you think women should be sheltered like Karen suggests? If you don’t then you agree with me and not Karen. It’s funny how someone can come in and cast extreme views and you don’t say squat to it, but then you jump all over me. Your bias is showing Ruby. Is it because you are gentle with women and love to criticize men? Seems that way to me. And after reading many of your comments in many topics, it appears you argue and disagree with Evan maybe 75% of the time. Maybe you ought to listen more often because you don’t know much about men at all. It totally baffles me why you are not chastizing Karen for portraying women as being weak. I am a man and it bothers me because most women I know would think she is a quack for saying that and they would be insulted by her comments too. Why? Because most women I know are smart, confident and strong. And yeah women I know aren’t afraid to use strong words when it’s necessary. They are not all cuddly and gentle and citing people as hostile when someone uses a strong word. If a guy came in and portrayed his strange beliefs on all men I would blast him with both barrels. Did you see how Lia and Karmic and Karl R think Karen is absolutely ridiculous? These are the types of women I am used to (sans Karl R, sorry Karl LOL). They speak right up and are not afraid to use strong words when called for. They seem to see things with an unbiased point-of-view. Learn from them.
Eleanor 58

@Locutus, Karl R, Karmic
Nowhere did Karen say the video should be censored or women should be sheltered from it. The closest she came was that she would hate it if an insecure woman was negatively affected and that thought makes Karen sad. You presume that means she believes the video is”wrong” or should be censored. She only said it made her sad and explained why.
Locutus, this is the second time you have read between the lines and inserted your interpretation as what the writer really meant. Others attribute your interpretations as literal from the writer. They run with the mistake making for circular pointless discussions.

.
Locutus 59

Eleanor,
Perhaps you have a habit of saying what you don’t mean. What you said in the other discussion was interpreted the same way by others not just me. My posts in this discussion are clear. It seems Karl R has no trouble seeing the exact same thing of Karen as I did. So does Karmic. Why don’t you go ask Karl if his comments are pointless.
Eleanor you seem to have only come in here to instigate an argument with me because your statement was totally wrong in the other discussion and you can’t admit it. Funny how you immediately singled me out and insulted me saying I start pointless discussions. Your wrong here again just like you were wrong there. You’re clueless. People claim I am harsh, but you just walk right in here and hurl a major insult to me wrapped in softly written words. No different from being harsh. You’re a real winner Eleanor let me tell ya. Go back and reread Karen’s comments. Nobody talked about censoring the video. Mistating words again?? You have a habit for doing that. Funny how these people all thought Karen’s comments were ridiculous- #22, #24, #28, #29, #30, #33, #35, #42, #46, #47, #49, #55
Ruby 60

Locutus #57

I’m glad you’ve taken the trouble to read so many of my comments. Maybe you ought to go back and re-read them, so that you can interpret them properly. In this thread, I’m not referring just to Karen, but to the other women here who were not fans of the video, and there are several. The more that I read your posts, the more I see that they make little sense, and that you simply enjoy antagonizing others, so it’s hard to take what you write seriously.
marymary 61

The vagina is self-cleansing. Trying to soap it to sterile standards will cause bad bacteria to proliferate. That is not going to smell good. The healthy smell varies but some say it’s like Serge Lutens Ambre Sultan (a perfume). I say maybe. A courtesan famously (well, famous to those who care about these things) would dab her juices about her ears. Apparently it drove men wild. Jeanette Winterson (a writer) described her girlfriend’s thus, “she keeps a starfish in there” (not a dead one, parentheses my own).
If it really does smell like a dead animal, get it checed out.
In the interests of equality, Serge Lutens Les Muscs Kubhla Khan smells exactly like male scrotum, on first whiff anyway.
The scents that come from animals (musk, ambergris, civet) are close to the scents we produce as human animals. We’re not supposed to smell like roses. We’re animals. Woof.
Birdlife 62

Evan – as moderator here – maybe you should moderate?
Locutus 63

Well Ruby,

My posts here about the topic say pretty much the same thing as Lia, Karl R, and several others. In fact, Karl R even used some of the same words as me- saying Karen “Blew things out of proportion”. So I guess you are insulting them as well when you say my posts make little sense. Lia and Karl R, congratulations my posts and yours make little sense according to Ruby. Apparently, Ruby you are just another hypocrite crying people are harsh while hurling your own insults about their intellect. Yeah, your brilliant Ruby, real brilliant!! LOL
Goldie 64

@ henriette #54, I’ve worked in a mostly male environment all my adult life. I also have two sons, age 20 and 17. Both like comedy and I’ve gone to see the 17yo’s favorite comedians with him a few times. (One actually made a vagina joke during his act that made even me mildly uncomfortable — “I love big vaginas. Ladies, if you’ve ever been stopped at at airport for trying to sneak an elephant ear through security, I’m your man”. The audience apparently loved it.) It’s just that, in my experience, to most men, there’s no such thing as too offensive (or too soon, for that matter) when it comes to jokes. If it’s funny, they don’t care if it’s offensive or not. Granted, there are sensitive guys who are not like that (I’m dating one), but they are pretty rare in my experience. I have to admit, after spending years around my coworkers and my sons, I sometimes have to watch what I say around my BF — not everything that is funny to them, is equally funny to him.

Locutus, I’m confused. Are you trying to teach Karen something she doesn’t know about women, or are you trying to make it look like the majority of this thread is ganging up on Karen, and Karen is therefore wrong? I don’t agree with what she’s saying here, either, but she’s entitled to her opinion. Your post with the long list of comment ##s made me scratch my head, if truth be told.

@marymary #61 – I like this! Woof! I’ve got to say, if my dog suddenly started smelling like floral perfume, I’d freak out!
Goldie 65

Apologize for double comment, have to add that what I said about most men in my reply to Henriette in the comment above, IMO, goes double for male comedians. It’s like nothing is off-limits to those guys. And, since it’s the video we’re talking about falls under comedy, if it had been made by two guys instead of two women, ouch! I’m afraid to imagine what they could’ve come up with.
Cat5 66

Locutus @ #59 said:

“Funny how these people all thought Karen’s comments were ridiculous- #22, #24, #28, #29, #30, #33, #35, #42, #46, #47, #49, #55.”

That is not even a discussion of the issue. That is the response of a child, “Weeeeeeell everyone else is doing it.”

Rather than dogpiling on Karen (and thinking that is a legitimate method of debating an issue), perhaps you should go back, review the posts and make a list of those who didn’t think Karen’s comment were ridiculous. Here, I’ll get you started – #56.
Evan Marc Katz 67

Nah, @Birdlife #62. Not worth my time.
amy 68

HAHA evan, hysterical video!!
I wonder the correlation between women complain about this video being in bad taste and women who are single?
marymary 69

Evan is busy so I will moderate if I may:
“you don’t have to turn up for every argument you’re invited to.”
yes, I get the irony. I just turned up for this fight and I wasn,t even invited.
*shuffles off*
Ruby 70

amy #68

For what it’s worth, the women who actually wrote the song are single.
Locutus 71

Why do so many people not read each post thoroughly before they make a remark about it??
Cat5 #66, did you even read my post you are criticizing? It was not about ganging up on Karen. In fact that particular post was not even directed at Karen!!! Go back and reread. It was directed at Eleanor because she just waltzed in here and threw out an immediate insult to me which actually stemmed over from posts in a different topic. If anybody is ‘childish’ it is Eleanor for doing something like that. I recommend you go back and reread every single post here as clearly the inaccuracy of your comments shows you haven’t read them thoroughly enough.
Goldie,
My point was to point out how foolish Karen sounded with her statement and how ridiculous it was. I have no problem respecting a person’s personal opinion no matter how off the wall I think it is. But she made a blanket statement about many other women about how this video is hurtful to them, as if they were so fragile and needed to be sheltered. You said you disagree with her too. How come you didn’t blast her for doing something like that. Lia did and rightfully so.
All of my comments after my words to Karen were rebuttals to people that hurled insults at me- Ruby and Eleanor. It’s funny how I am criticized for being harsh, but these 2 women can quietly tip toe around and hurl insults at me, but use soft wording and that is ok? Criticize me for insulting people, but don’t say a word when they do. Many hypocrites in here. I can proudly say I am not one.
Karen 72

Locutus 71
You wrote:
“Why do so many people not read each post thoroughly before they make a remark about it??”
‘I recommend you go back and reread every single post here as clearly the inaccuracy of your comments shows you haven’t read them thoroughly enough.”
Please consider following your own advice.
Evan Marc Katz 73

@Locutus, I agree with you, for what it’s worth.
Goldie 74

@ Locutus: “You said you disagree with her too. How come you didn’t blast her for doing something like that.”

Excuse me, who died and made you king of comments? I blast whom I want to blast when I want to blast. I left a post for Karen, #48, in which I actually say “I disagree” verbatim. If that’s not harsh enough for you, tough shit, that’s how I chose to reply to Karen and you’ll have to live with it.

“It’s funny how I am criticized for being harsh, but these 2 women can quietly tip toe around and hurl insults at me, but use soft wording and that is ok? Criticize me for insulting people, but don’t say a word when they do. ”

Are you fucking serious? What is this, kindergarten? Why does any commenter on here have to reprimand any other commenter for supposedly insulting you or anyone else? Geez. That’s it, I’m done.
Locutus 75

Evan,
Thank you , I appreciate it. I don’t envy you the amounts of stubborness and biasness you have to deal with. It’s a wonder you haven’t torn all of the hairs out of your head already.
Goldie,
One last time. I am not TELLING you to do anything. I am asking you why you chastize me when I am insulting and not others of the opposite opinion when they are equally insulting, but in a subtle way. You have the gall to use vulgar language with me and you are all sweet talk to others. You’re a massively biased person. Please don’t even begin to deny that.
Karen,
I read every single post here with scrutiny before ever commenting. I believe it was Cat5 I told to reread posts and not you. Why are you replying to my remarks to her?? Better yet, turn off the internet, radio, and television. There might be something hurtful towards women broadcasting that I wouldn’t want you to be all shaken up by….
Karen 76

Eleanor 58
Thank you for “hearing” what I actually said!!!
I wish more were capable of responding to a post without mistaking their own filters, projections, and interpretations, as if they were part of an actual post.
Cat5 77

@ Locutus
Goldie @64 said:

“Locutus, I’m confused. Are you trying to teach Karen something she doesn’t know about women, or are you trying to make it look like the majority of this thread is ganging up on Karen, and Karen is therefore wrong? I don’t agree with what she’s saying here, either, but she’s entitled to her opinion. Your post with the long list of comment ##s made me scratch my head, if truth be told.”

I could have worded my post @66 better as I agree with Goldie, and I would have just agreed with her post but it was not yet showing up when I posted my comment.

Even give that, I’m not sure slinging around statements like, ”I recommend you go back and reread every single post here as clearly the inaccuracy of your comments shows you haven’t read them thoroughly enough,” or “Many hypocrites in here. I can proudly say I am not one,” help your case in anyway. Making bald factual statements based on internet postings…well I, for one, can state unequivocally, that you have no idea what I did or did not read, how thoroughly I read it, or whether I am a hypocrite or not.

For the record, it does not now, nor did it at the time I read your entire post, make any difference to me at whom your comment (for clarity I mean your comment “Funny how these people all thought Karen’s comments were ridiculous- #22, #24, #28, #29, #30, #33, #35, #42, #46, #47, #49, #55″) was directed. It was a specious comment and did not advance your argument in anyway. In fact, it made you sound childish, and I said so. Retaliating by saying that I didn’t read it thoroughly enough, or saying why do you get criticized for being harsh when no one else does and they are just throwing insults at you…well, that is another specious and childish argument.

For the record, the reason I chose your post to comment on, you took the time to list out all the other posts. It made it quicker and easier for me. I may be lazy, but I’m not childish. :-7
Locutus 78

Cat#77,
Your post is so tangled and interwoven that I can’t even accurately follow what you are saying. One needs a flow chart to follow it. From what I can make of it I’ll say that no you didn’t read the posts that well at all unless you have a comprehension defficiency. I’ll say it again, my post you cited #59 was a response to Eleanor as she came in and insulted me off the bat which stemmed from another discussion- not even this one. You haven’t mentioned Eleanor’s post #58 AT ALL and that’s what my post #59 was ALL ABOUT! Do you now see what I’m talking about? That is why I said go back and read it. Do you now comprehend? Your mind seems to be devoid of structure. Try taking a course in linear algebra. It will help your mind to learn structure and order.
It’s funny how you have called me childish about 4 or 5 times between both of your posts just because you didn’t like what I posted. What’s wrong, do you get all flustered when things don’t go your way that you have to pout and call someone names? You sound really immature with the name calling- remininiscent of a 2nd grade student. Hmmm, who is the childish one now? I recall some people posting once about irony. Well, if this is not ironic I don’t know what is….
Evan Marc Katz 79

Enough, kids.
Karmic Equation 80

I think the women here gave Karen too much of a free pass, because she said “It’s been my experience” as if that validates the truth of her statements.

Suppose I had dated only two men in my life, and both men raped me. Then I say to everyone, “All men are rapists, that has been my experience.” What would all of you who are in happy relationships and/or dated good men have to say? I think you would say, “I’m sorry that happened to you, but you need to have a better pecker picker. Not all men are rapists. You need to adjust how you choose men.”

I’d say the same thing about the women that Karen alludes to. Ask them to change their mindset and look for the positives and don’t take things personally that shouldn’t be. Get some perspective and therapy if necessary.

——-

It was really interesting how the flames got fanned higher and higher due to the Mars & Venus communications. Locutus was trying to be rational and support his arguments with listing supportive posts, but Goldie felt that he was childish because he was listing the posts. She tried to counter a rational argument with an emotional one. Hence both sides flared up even higher because neither was trying to understand the other, but was more interested in being “right” or “winning”.

If both sides were interested in the goal of “mutual understanding” instead of winning, then this thread would have been less dramatic and more productive.

Just my observation.

——–

@marymary

Hmmm…Interesting. Since I like my neck and ears nuzzled…I’m gonna have to try that instead of perfume!

——–

Funny story (at least funny to me, YMMV) — It’s pretty apparent that many women here don’t watch too much porn. I don’t watch a lot, but enough. One time, an ex-bf commented, “Wow that chick is so roast beefy.” I said, “Huh, what does that mean?” He explained, my eyes widened. “You guys have a name for THAT??!!?” If you still don’t know, obviously porn women have been well used and get flappy down there. Need I say more? So “roast beef” is actually not a derogative, but rather a descriptive.

Other words in the male lexicon that women may not know about:
“Queef” (not sure if it’s spelled that way) – the farty sounds from the vagina after vigorous sex
“Winter bush” – I laughed so hard when I heard Howard stern used this term, no explanation required.
“Raw dogging” – unprotected sex
“Red wings” – Something a guy ears by performing oral sex on a woman when she is menstruating. Some men are pround of this. (ew!)
“Camel toe” – well, let’s just say men notice this if you go commando in spandex.
Goldie 81

“It was really interesting how the flames got fanned higher and higher due to the Mars & Venus communications. Locutus was trying to be rational and support his arguments with listing supportive posts, but Goldie felt that he was childish because he was listing the posts. She tried to counter a rational argument with an emotional one. Hence both sides flared up even higher because neither was trying to understand the other, but was more interested in being “right” or “winning”.
If both sides were interested in the goal of “mutual understanding” instead of winning, then this thread would have been less dramatic and more productive.
Just my observation.”

Wow, what an interesting observation. My opinion of the video itself is probably closer to Locutus’ than to Karen’s. What I disagree with is telling someone “you are wrong because everyone else thinks you are”, followed by list of names, followed by list of posts. Which in turn is followed by asking other posts “why didn’t you blast Karen” and “why didn’t anyone blast two other posters (names) for attacking me”.

I am not interested in being right or winning, geez. I am already winning at life as far as I understand it, and have no need to be winning on an online forum. I have however been posting here for about three years. I like reading the comment section on this blog as it is usually very informative. And you’re right, it did upset me a bit to see one person try to turn it into a middle-school drama-fest. His last half-dozen or so posts are not even about the video at all. They are instead about some weird Karen-shaming and calling people out for not disagreeing with her harshly enough.

I honestly think this horse has been beaten to death. Unless I see anything constructive and related to the video, I promise I won’t be replying anymore. I’ve added more than I should’ve to this cluster as it is.

“She tried to counter a rational argument with an emotional one.”

That made me laugh. Thanks.
Locutus 82

I will just say that I am not “interested in winning”. However, I am interested in what is right and what is the truth. And like I said most of my later remarks were because people cited my name and insulted me. I would have been done posting in this discussion long before that if I had not been singled out and personally insulted.
Oh Goldie,
You continue to bash don’t ya. You’re NOT innocent at all. I see in your followup comment you still have to refer to my posts as “middle school drama”. I think you’re a stuck up snob as you seem to always write posts as if you are looking down on me. And again, you are the one who resorted to vulgar language. You’re a total hypocrite because you acted like a middle school kid with your vulgar remarks and you accuse me of acting childish?? I may be harsh at times yes, but I admit my actions and stand by them and am no hypocrite.
Karmic,
Thank you for echoing my thoughts on why women gave Karen a “free pass”. Gee when I made that remark I got chewed to pieces.
Karmic Equation 83

@Goldie

I found your “Are you fucking serious” comment serious misuse of feminine outrage…And I felt that if you were trying to sound cool, you failed. Instead it made you sound like an out of control, emotional woman, making a mountain out of yet another mole hill.
Save the feminine outrage for something deserving of that. Like when your man comes home at 4am in the morning. Not for disagreement over how a stranger argues about commentary on a video. Seriously?
Goldie 84

Uhhh, sorry, I have to answer this.

“And I felt that if you were trying to sound cool, you failed.”

Um, nope. That’s how I talk. Like I said, I’ve worked in mostly male environments all my life and have two teenage sons. I have to make an effort not to talk like that. I have to watch what I say to make sure nothing like that slips through. Obviously, when I lost my… ummm… poop, something slipped through. Just setting things straight. I am honestly surprised that this word made it past the mods, my posts have been edited here before once or twice.

I’m going to ignore the rest of your guys’ posts if you don’t mind, but I had to come back to this.
Selena 85

Interesting the different takes on this video.
Mine is that understanding of the sexuality spectrum is more accepted now than it was in previous generations…BUT… not everyone wants to explore the whole spectrum. The message? Don’t bow to peer pressure when it comes to same gender sex? Lyrics were crude to me, but might be helpful to someone in that age bracket who’s feeling pressured get ‘experience’ just because it’s in fashion.
Paula 86

What’s the big deal here? Not everyone is going to like this video. I didn’t. I thought it was cheesy. I normally find their videos funny, this one… not so much.
It’s not the end of the world if people don’t agree. I respect the feelings of those who liked the video. That respect should be mutual.
Locutus 87

Paula,
Go back and reread the comments. The debate was not over whether you thought it was a humuorous video or not, it was over Karen calling the video hurtful. If you just didn’t find the video humorous that is just fine. I don’t find all comedy funny, some of it is stupid and doesn’t make me laugh. However, it was not a question of humor. Karen called the video hurtful and many disagreed with Karen’s belief that it was hurtful and found that response to be ludicrous and a total overreaction. I do not respect when something simply made to be funny is blown out of proportion and made into a huge deal. It’s making a mountain out of a mole hill. The argument was about something that went a lot deeper than just the simple video and whether you were amused by it or not. Next time read a little deeper into the comments.