You Don’t Want Him Anyway

Evan Marc Katz

Let me tell you a true story about Alice, a member of my Inner Circle.

But before I tell you about it, I want to share a little bit about Alice.

In her mid 30’s, very attractive, intelligent but not intimidating. Alice is a good person and a good catch.

The two things that she doesn’t trust? Men, and herself when she’s around men.

Thus, Alice never has trouble attracting guys; her trouble is in keeping them.

Does this sound like anyone you know? Nah. Didn’t think so…

Anyway, Alice recently started dating Dylan.

Dylan is tall. Dylan is hot. Dylan is creative. Dylan is confident. Dylan is experienced.

Basically, Dylan is all of the characteristics that Alice finds so rarely in one man, that when she happens upon such a guy, she HAS to have him.

Oh, and one other thing: Dylan is on the rebound from a relationship. Alice is the first person he’s been with since his breakup.

Some random cute guy breaks your heart and all you can do is beat yourself up and attempt to plot how to win him over once again.

What follows is altogether too predictable.

Alice went out with Dylan and, barely able to contain her excitement, slept with him on the second date.

Dylan, still excited the next day, made overtures to follow up.

Alice, breathing a great sigh of relief, started treating Dylan as a boyfriend…

Which meant calls, emails, texts and demands to know where things were going…

Until, predictably, Dylan pulled the “slow fade”, where he didn’t fall completely out of touch, but became highly inaccessible.

A week had passed and now Alice was on the phone, during our one-on-one Inner Circle Private Coaching session, wondering how she could get Dylan back.

(sound of record scratching)

“You want him BACK?” I asked.

“Yes! I don’t have this feeling about guys very often. I want it to last.”

“You mean the feeling of elation that comes with sleeping with a hot guy? Or the feeling of despair you have because he’s a player, he hasn’t called you and you don’t have any chance of having a successful long-term relationship with him?”

The silence on the other end was deafening. Yet Alice couldn’t disagree with me.

Dylan WAS a player. Dylan DID sleep with her right away. Dylan WASN’T ready for a relationship.

In fact, when Alice looked at it objectively, Dylan was kind of a selfish jerk for coming on so strong and pulling away so abruptly.

And yet here she was, reeling from raw emotion, begging me, her trusted dating coach, to help her GET THE SELFISH JERK BACK.

This is like giving the alcoholic just one more drink.

BAD idea.

I’m guessing you’ve had this bad idea yourself.

Some random cute guy breaks your heart and all you can do is beat yourself up and attempt to plot how to win him over once again.

What a colossal waste of time.

Because even if I were a Miracle Worker – even if I could concoct some magic potion that erased Dylan’s memory of Alice’s needy texts and planted a chip in his head that forced him to call her every day… you know what Alice would get in return?

A selfish, immature, emotionally unavailable player who is in no position to be a good boyfriend to ANYBODY.

Thus, as far as I’m concerned, Dylan gave Alice a gift – the gift of freedom.

The freedom to cut the cord quickly because there is no potential of a future with a man who has shown no desire to commit.

Look back in your past and consider how much time you wasted on men like this.

Realize, at this moment, that you’ll NEVER have to do that again.

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Related Posts:

1. Should I Date A Player Even When I Know He’s Going to Be Trouble?
2. Believe The Negatives, Ignore The Positives
3. Do You Want to Have Your Cake and Eat It, Too?
4. How You Can Get Everything Wrong and Still Find The Man of Your Dreams
5. Is it Okay to Love Someone But Not Be “In Love”?

Why He Disappeared is the smart, strong, successful woman's guide to understanding men. If you want to learn how men think, and rediscover how to have meaningful relationships - all from a man's point of view - click here to learn Why He Disappeared.

102 Comments »Filed Under Chemistry, Communication, Dating, Letting Go

102 Responses to “You Don’t Want Him Anyway”

1. Abra 1

   Sometimes I feel like your blogs are pep rallys to go for the not-so-attractive, not as personable guys.  You know … something you have to talk yourself into going for, like diet food. Essentially, if a guy has a lot of desirable traits, he won’t commit, because he knows women desire him.  Sooo….go for the guys fewer women desire, and you’ll be complacently satisfied in the long run. 

   Honestly, couldn’t hooking up with a ho-hum guy who is on the rebound be a bad idea?  Why is Dylan’s desirability such a key factor in this story, like most of your blog entries?

2. Abra 2

   Also, you should change your mission statement: “I am a personal trainer for women who want to fall in love.”  Take the “in love” out of it and replace it with “women who want to find a satisfactory relationship.”

   “In love” denotes a chemical rush, a passion, an intense longing for that person.  What you promote is skipping the endorphins and going straight into bargaining and rationalization of a good relationship.  Not that it’s wrong, but you’re selling something you don’t deliver on.  You can be “in love” or you can be “comfortable” is what you essentially say in every blog.  Stop shouting that we can be in love and still get the man of our heart’s desire, and then whispering why that’s not possible.

3. Mona 3

   Amazing advice as usual. He actually did her a big Favor. She is now free to choose her perfect mate. Wish I had this advice years back. Thanks Evan.

4. AllenB 4

   So true.  This goes both ways across the sexes. It is hard not to run towards the slow fade. It looks like the normal push and pull then pull and push of a relationship, but is larger and fatal. There is nothing to be gained by responding harder and harder.

5. HappFace 5

   Instead of finger pointing that guy is a player the reality is she played her self. She is the one that continuously engaged in the kind of man that always leads her to disappointment. She can change herself to the kind of women a man would want to have a long term relationship which she has probably tried already. Or she can change her choice of men.

   At the end of the day; because I am a man I prefer her to go after the man she desires. If you do not desire him you will not put your best foot forward and energy. Thus it will lead to further disappointment. If your not genuinely interested in a man he will not be genuinely interested in you.  You create your own destiny. 

6. Tami 6

   Oh my goodness gracious!  This is EXACTLY, word for word, what I went through about a month ago.  The only difference is that I don’t know if and when his last relationship was and that 95% of the time I always waited for him to call and initiate.  The only time I made a blatant display of “neediness” was when he broke up with me, trying to “understand” what the hell he meant by I’m AMAZING but that he doesn’t have the “head-space” for me.  

   Anyway, all of your recent blogs have all been addressing every single thought that has crossed my mind about him and have put me at great ease.  I’ve been beating myself up over it trying to convince myself, “See, he’s got issues!  Nothing I could have done would have made a difference.”  But I don’t know how fair it is to say that.

   Although it kinda makes me feel good to hear you validate that it’s not me, but him, I don’t know how fair or true it is to say that.  I still can’t help but think, it is me because: (a) I didn’t have enough self-respect to say something when something was bothering me for fear of putting pressure on a new relationship,  (b) I slept with him too soon, (c) I gave him too much of my heart too fast, (d) I was too nice by always saying “yes”, being super supportive of all his efforts, (e) I should have held back a little and build more of an emotional relationship with him first, and (f) I should have put boundaries, in order to build the relationship slowly but surely.

   I can’t help but think that maybe if I had done all of that, he’d still be with me and wouldn’t turn out to be this emotionally unavailable (38 year old) jerk, that you paint someone exactly like him out to be.  In fact, I bet that he can be a great boyfriend…but it will be with the next girl who he’s going to be with because she knows how to keep her man (and doesn’t make the same mistakes I do).       

7. Ileana 7

   Evan, Alice is SO much the way i was before discovering your blog. (sidenote: I ran across your blog without even looking for dating advice. ALL the guys I ever wanted to ‘get’ were attracted to me as well. I thought I was doing just fine and that everything bad that happened was only bad luck. I coulnd’t possibly HAVE a problem. I simply clicked on a suggested video on Youtube, in which this funky Katz guy  was giving an interview. That click was literally life changing. Maybe you should consider posting some more videos, so that even more people become as lucky as I was. )
   Anyway, back to your post. I always used to want back all the jerks who pulled a dissapering act on me. I used to be simply blinded by them, and whenever they went ‘puff’, they never hesitated to make it all seem MY fault, so that I ended up tormented by guilt. Luckily, it only happened twice, and thanks to YOU, I will see to it, that it never happens again.
   My problem was however connected with something else as well, which determined me to want these guys back. Being rejected by someone you think is so amazing was such an ego blow for me. I used to think, what is WRONG with me, that makes such a sweetheart run off?. Why doesn’t he want to give me a second chance? I am sure that if I get one, everything will be bloody perfect! So, I think that by wanting them back, I needed reassurence that I was worthy enough of having a relationship with someone ‘SO’ great. I didnt’t look the truth in the eye. He was the jackass, making it seem as if he were a prince, when I was actually the catch all along. 
   Evan, you cannot imagine how much this information on your blog and in your book managed to change the whole ideaof ‘dating’ for me(funny as it may seem, I have a feeling that people in Europe view the dating process slightly different than you guys in the US…anyway, it was EXTREMELY worthy). Probably you hear it really often, but this does not change the fact that it had such an impact on me. The posts, the comment-wars, everything was such an eye-opener, especially since I am only 22 and have a lot of so called ‘dating’ ahead of me. Now I know what to expect, what (not) to do,  who to turn down, who to even bother considering and, basicly, how men ‘work.’
   So…THANKS
    

8. lld 8

   After several “Dylan”s, I recently started seeing a man that I connected to and who is obviously ready to make a commitment.  The attitude he projects is completely different when you’re both on the same page.

9. Ray 9

   Thank you Evan.  Very glad to observe the shared responsibility here…  And some coaching on how to avoid the knowingly or unknowingly confused.  

   I try not to label men as players unless they are actively trying to decieve women by claiming they are looking for a commitment when they are not… or they actively misrepresent their interest in a woman just to get sex.  

   Labeling a confused man as a player is the same thing as labeling a woman as a ‘slut’ because she has slept with men while in the process of attempting a relationship.  That said, there is a whole lot people can do to avoid the perpetually confused and just plain users… of either gender.

10. Monique Gallagher 10

    Evan,

    You hit the nail right on the head when you referred to giving an alcoholic another drink.  Clearly there is addiction components when we are drawn to what isn’t good for us.  Self abuse is a hard pattern to break.

    Great article, thank you for sharing this!

    Monique 

11. lawyerette 11

    I think what is so hard about these situations is that it seems all about timing. And that if the timing were different, things could be different. I know it makes us feel better as women to say that the guy is a jerk and he sucks, but the reality is probably that the timing is just wrong. 

12. Heather 12

    Evan, thank you for that advice.  I wish I had read this about 9 months ago or so.  I’d met a guy who claimed he was ready for a serious relationship with me, and of course, after sleeping with me, he did the slow fade.  I mostly let him have his space but after awhile I confronted him and told him that disappearing was not acceptable behavior and that I deserved at the very least, “thank you but I don’t think this is going to work.”  Turns out he was cheating on me with another woman.  Surprise!!!
    Right now I am dating a very nice man but I am certainly not going to forget that valuable lesson, and if this guy does the slow fade, he may very well do so, and I will find someone who will not do that to me.  Not that I am looking for that to happen, but at least I will have the tools I need to take care of myself, if that happens again.

13. Ruby 13

    I recently met a guy who seemed great at first, but because I know (after years of getting involved with the wrong ones) that it takes time to get to know someone, and that, thanks to EMK, I should “believe the negatives and ignore the positives.”  So when the numerous red flags began to pop up, it didn’t take long to see that I wasn’t going to get what I wanted from him, and I got out. He moved on to dating someone else right away, and she completely fell for him in just a couple of weeks. But he dumped her, in a very nasty way, in the midst of the holidays.

    Getting involved with someone too quickly doesn’t give you a chance to objectively look at the warning signs that may arise. All too often, we women think we can change the guy despite his issues, and rebounding men are the most difficult!

14. Evan Marc Katz 14

    Thanks to everybody for your kind words. I’m glad this stuff is making a difference in your lives.

    But no series of comments would be complete without one hater, who has never posted before, and wants to explain what I’m doing better than I do.

    Welcome, Abra!

    If it’s not obvious, my responsibility here is to women, not lame guys. This is a classic way in which I’m consistently misinterpreted. Just because you don’t end up with George Clooney does not mean you end up with Danny DeVito. That seems very obvious to me; it looks like you need some clarity on the subject.

    Next point: Being “in love” is not a particularly good predictor of your future. You’ve just seen a bunch of women validate that statement above. Thus, telling women to actively pursue the chemical rush is, at best, useless – since everyone already does it, and, at worst, irresponsible, because most successful relationships are not based on the chemical rush.

    Next point: I’ve never said that you can’t have the chemical rush and be “in love”. I’ve simply stated what’s true: such feelings are evanescent and often blind us to a man’s poor character traits. People get married under the influence of chemistry all the time, which is about the best explanation for the 50% divorce rate that I can fathom. So go chase your chemistry all you want. I have no problems with it. Just don’t get so blinded by passion that you accept a subpar relationship. A very, very small percentage of people maintain those tingly, lustful feelings throughout a 40 year marriage. If it happens to be you, more power to you.

    Finally, to your last line: “Stop shouting that we can be in love and still get the man of our heart’s desire, and then whispering why that’s not possible.”

    All I would say is this: If the man of your heart’s desire has low character, does not want to commit to you, is selfish… if the man of your heart’s desire is not attracted to you and never wants you in return… if the man of your heart’s desire has never done anything but disappointed you and broken your heart… it would seem to me, an objective third party, that the man of your heart’s desire MIGHT NOT EXIST. And that you would be MUCH happier choosing a different man who has looks, wit, money, charm, kindness and consistency – even if you don’t get weak in the knees and obsessed when you think of him.

    That’s my whole philosophy in a nutshell – thousands of women have used it to great effect – and I will defend it ’til the very end.

15. Erinlee 15

    I have to agree with Tami and Ray here.  I don’t think we can just assume that this guy is a player or had ill intentions.  She messed up.  She should not have slept with him so soon, she should not have become needy and started treating him like her BF before they were even close to the relationship stage.  He didn’t like the pressure, and he backed off.  He might commit to the very next girl he dates, if she plays her cards right.  Yes, I do think it is HER responsibility to act in a way that will help a guy want to commit to her.   That’s not asking her to change her personality or anything drastic.  Just keep your pants on, be cool, and don’t push, move at his pace. 

16. Katarina Phang 16

    Having been married to a difficult, uptight guy whom I was so attracted to, so in love with, I can attest that the best guy in the long run is the one that you feel most comfortable and at ease with when you are together.  That’s my future partner, someone I can have fun with and share laughter for the rest of our lives.  I will still find him attractive -not necessarily breathlessly- but I’d rather that attraction develops over time over substance (compatibility) than just chemical rush of physical attraction.

    If I can have both, that’ll be great but I’ll be highly suspicious of a highly attractive guy with whom I’m feeling head over heels with.

    I won’t settle (no I won’t date guys I have no romantic feelings/physical attraction for) yet I’ll be self-aware of the trapping of hormonal rush in the beginning.  I won’t dismiss “less exciting” guys whom I potentially get along better in the long run because he’s so easy to be with.

    Both men and women want a partner who is easy to be with, who makes our life more enjoyable and joyful.  Seek that. 

17. Michael17 17

    Actually Danny DeVito does pretty well with the ladies. He wasn’t blessed with looks, but he has a winning personality.
     
    Had to stick up for one of my favorite actors.
     
    That said, great blog!

18. Jennifer 18

    Evan,

    Do you think that women like Abra are just totally dense ‘haters’, or can you allow for the possibility that something about the way you deliver your message is just not resonating with some people?

    You tend to ‘speak’ in very absolute terms, things are very black and white, there is ‘reality’ as you describe it or fantasy land. It can’t really be shocking to you then that when you say things like ‘you can have chemistry or you can be happy’ that people will be confused with that message. I’ve read you long enough to know what you mean, to get the nuance, and to know your heart is in the right place, but lately I’ve found you to be even more absolute than usual, so can you really blame some people for not getting it? Not suggesting you don’t clarify or defend yourself, but if it’s the same point over and over that people are getting stuck on, maybe it’s not just all their fault. Just something to consider.

    Regarding the post, I think you’re right about her not needing Dylan back, but I don’t see how he’s a player. She got needy and he bailed- were he a player he likely would’ve stayed to ‘play’ a bit.

19. Lance 19

    At abra#1: I think you get it, it is about considering the 90% of guys that are not immediately attractive to most every woman.

    At abra#2: No, you don’t get it.

20. Evan Marc Katz 20

    Jennifer,

    If anything, I’ve just lost patience for having the same conversation over and over again. I don’t preclude the possibility that I can do a better job of explaining myself – especially to first-timers.

    I guess my question to you is this: do you disagree with anything I said in my response to Abra?

    And, if not, then why wouldn’t I be exasperated to have to take up my time to clarify that by sacrificing butterflies you’re not sacrificing love?

21. Ray 21

    Just want to clarify… I do tend to avoid labels.  But I want to be very clear on this… Traditionally, it has been the woman’s ‘job’ to get clarity on a man’s intentions before having sex with him.  I do think it is wise to do that. 

    However, in no way shape or form does the timing of sex exempt a man from taking personal responsibility for his sexuality.   A responsible man will VOLUNTEER his relationship (or non-relationship) goals as accurately as he knows how at the time BEFORE having sex with a woman.  To fail to do so is irresponsible on his part too… especially considering what many would argue is rather thoughtless behavior after the fact.  Does that make him a ‘player’?  No.  It does make him irresponsible… and perhaps more irresponsible than the woman in question here… because I suspect she DID make it known she was interested in a relationship.

    Regarding the ‘neediness’.. Well, I find that is often 20/20 hindsight.  Others might construe that as ’interest’ or perhaps even justified anger/confusion.   

    I’m personally not a fan of attempting to get into any man’s head… and certainly not playing at anything… cool, not cool, or whatever, in order to ‘get’ a man. 

22. Angie 22

    I actually have a couple friends who are like Alice, who have had non-relationship  after non-relationship exactly like this, and I don’t think that women are the only ones who act like this.

    I think the most important factor in determining whether a person is a good partner is whether or not they are ready to be in a relationship.  People on the rebound are on the top of this list.  I had a friend who started dating a guy one month after his fiancee called off their wedding, and he would say “I know I like you, but I have all this other stuff going on” and she would seriously wonder what was wrong with her.

    I think people who consistently chase emotionally unavailable / unattainable people just aren’t ready for a serious relationship, but maybe don’t want to admit this to themselves, and I think there are quite a few people who enjoy the idea that through some actions of their own, they are able to get someone to like them.  I think that some people feel a sense of pride and achievement in dating, as opposed to wanting the satisfaction of a love relationship.

23. Katarina Phang 23

    Evan, write a disclaimer and attach it as your signature or post it at the very top of the blog.  I know how frustrating it gets when you get misconstrued at every corner.  And also write that people who have issues with generalizations shouldn’t seek advice from anyone for free (shouldn’t come to any opinion blog either since everywhere you go you will find generalizations).  They should go to a personal counselor who will tailor made their advice to their specific case.

24. Ileana 24

    @ EMK: I think a more dramatic analogy would be: Austin Powers to James Bond.
      
    @Michael17: That’s exactly what i wanted to say! )) 
    Personally, I would never have a problem chosing a guy like,say, Rob Schneider over the George Clooney type, when the qualities of the RS type point towards a happy, fun and exciting relationship … even if Clooney would be the one to give me the butterflies at the beginnig.
    ,
     
     
     

25. Ruby 25

    I think there are women who are very insecure and are looking for validation of their own worth from the those they date. If they think they can snag such a special guy, then they must be pretty okay themselves, right? But it’s not how impressive the man is that counts, it’s how he feels about you and how he treats you. Sounds pretty simple, but I see women NOT thinking this way all the time.

26. Honey 26

    This post made me laugh, because I am the exception that proves the rule.  My date with Jake was his VERY FIRST date after getting out of a four-year, live-in relationship.  We slept together on the first date, and he moved to another city a couple hundred miles away less than a week later.

    We have been together 5.5 years and married for about 7 months.

    I do agree with the main point you are making, though.  Which is that really, it is not the situation that causes the relationship to last or not last, it is the man.  So don’t let the situation blind you to the man.

    After all, Jake called me every single night the first 3 months when we lived in different cities.  In addition to calling every night, he texted throughout the day, sent me long emails, and we visited every other week for the entire summer.  He agreed that we should be exclusive at the end of the second date, asked me to be his girlfriend after 3 months (almost as soon as he moved back to town), told me he loved me after about 6 months and almost proposed to me before the end of the first year (and told me about it!).  So, even though a lot of the signs would say to run, it was clear he was as “in it” as I was.

27. Goldie 27

    @ Abra, it’s not just something Evan says on his blog to give the undesirable guys a chance. One of my favorite books on dating and relationship, “Is He Mr. Right?” by Mira Kirshenbaum (I know, cheesy title, but the book is awesome), has a whole chapter on how and why we should stay away from the “hot guys”.
     
    I’ve known a few Dylans personally. One in particular (who, BTW, looks exactly like the guy in the stock photo on top of this post) liked to say that he was afraid of “selling himself short”. As soon as they smell commitment, they’ll run, just on the off chance there’s a better deal around the corner. I wouldn’t mind having a Dylan for an FWB, if and when I needed one, but not for an LTR.

28. Carrie 28

    This unfortunately is my own story. Only I was successfully unsuccess and married it.  Why do I want that last drink? Why?  Why Evan why…is the unhealthy ungettable desirous…is it my ego (which I don’t really consider having, maybe?)..my pride losing and trying to get it back…all of the previously mentioned and then some?? LOL…oh boy what a tangled web we weave.  Why would I want someone who obviously doesn’t want me back?  Isn’t there a detox pill or program for this?  A support group? Something!!!!! 
    I am making fun of  MYSELF…there is alot more to my story of which I see the answers but still have such a yearn to do what I can to return to it….uh oh do I hear get a good shrink?  hahahhah
    XO Carrie  

29. Karl R 29

    Abra said: (#1)
    “Sometimes I feel like your blogs are pep rallys to go for the not-so-attractive, not as personable guys.  You know … something you have to talk yourself into going for, like diet food.”

    As a child, I prefered sugary, salty and fatty foods. My mother forced me to eat healthy foods, because a steady diet of those foods is unhealthy.

    As an adult, I still prefer those same foods, but I limit my intake … because I’m smart enough to know those foods are unhealthy.

    If you eat unhealthy food, you know what the consequences will be. Ice cream sundaes don’t become healthier just because I wish they would.

    If you pursue unhealthy relationships, guess what the consequence will be. Gorgeous, sexy, brilliant, funny, toxic women didn’t become less toxic just because I wished they would.

    If you want a long, healthy life, avoid unhealthy food. If you want a long, healthy relationship, avoid unhealthy relationships … no matter how attractive or personable he/she is.

    Abra said: (#1)
    “Honestly, couldn’t hooking up with a ho-hum guy who is on the rebound be a bad idea?”

    How many times have you gotten hung up on and desperately pursued a “ho-hum” guy who started pulling away from you?

    Why should Evan waste our time warning us about a problem that doesn’t exist?

    Abra said: (#2)
    “You can be ‘in love’ or you can be ‘comfortable’ is what you essentially say in every blog.”

    Those two aren’t mutually exclusive.

    However, if you’re head-over-heels in love, you’re likely to ignore the traits that make you uncomfortable. You’re likely to overlook the traits that make you unhappy. You’re likely to ignore the traits that are unhealthy.

    Abra said: (#2)
    “‘In love’ denotes a chemical rush, a passion, an intense longing for that person.”

    That’s infatuation. Most (mature) people are seeking unconditional love in their long-term relationships.

    I don’t think you realize how badly you’re cheating yourself in your pursuit of that chemical rush.

    That chemical rush wears off. It usually takes 1-2 years (maybe as long as 3 years). For me, the infatuation was fading after 9 months. It was gone several months before I proposed to my fiancée.

    If you’re choosing a partner who you want to be with for the next several decades, you might want to base your decision on traits that will last a bit longer.

    After the chemical rush and intense longing are gone, there are a few traits that matter for the rest of your marriage/life: someone who is trustworthy, someone who you’re comfortable with, someone who is pleasant to be around, someone who you respect, someone who respects you, someone who shares your values and goals….

    The list is longer, but you get my point. These aren’t exciting traits. They’re just the ones that matter in the long run.

30. Dan 30

    Let me offer that the same thing happens with men.
    In my case, I’m always attracted to the Bond girl: very attractive, sexy, dresses like a million bucks, has charisma, and has that attitude that can make me feel like it is a challenge to go after her. Meanwhile, her reaction to me is just enough to reel me in, but she’s not showing any clear interest, just the potential of interest, because she laughs and touches me and does the bare minimum to suggest she may be interested.
    I think that these women are like the Dylans and alpha males of the world. There are men and women that love the emotional rush, and we have the anticipation that this rush can last forever if we land the Bond or the Bond girl. But it never happens. We just get hurt, and we find that we wasted a lot of time and invested a lot that is now lost.
    Do we ever learn? Maybe not, or maybe for a few dates, before we forget. Then the next one comes along, and we are right into it again.
    It is the emotion that carries us away, and it is like an addiction. There are still women like that who I have dated recently, which I still think about. The ones from long ago, I no longer care about, and I have seen that they are all still single! The more recent ones, they still cast a shadow over my dating life, until time puts them into the distant past.

31. nathan 31

    The biggest issue here is the rebound situation. I disagree with instantly labeling this guy a “player” because of what happened here, but he was definitely much more of a risk. I’ve been on both sides of that fence. And frankly, what often happens is that the person who was recently out of a relationship thinks he/she is ready, starts dating someone and gets physically intimate, and then all hell breaks loose emotionally.
     
    Evan’s right that Alice should move on and not feel bad about herself. And furthermore, that trying to get him back is probably a waste of time. (Perhaps they meet again in the future under different circumstances, but that’s not worth waiting for because it may never happen.) However, in addition to that, I really think it’s vital that anyone dating learn to listen for how someone talks about past relationships. To get a sense of how long someone has been out of their last relationship, and how they speak about the past in general. Odds are that Dylan left enough clues to point to the fact that he wasn’t really ready for anything serious, but Alice probably missed them because she was too busy getting hooked. Which happens. I’ve been there. I had such an experience last year even, which just goes to show you that even people who write about dating and relationships, and who have made a lot of effort to learn about what works and is healthy, still can make mistakes.
     
     
     
     

32. Ron Diggity 32

    @ Evan – while I agree with your bottom line assessment (she should not date him), I totally disagree with how you arrived there.  Your attacking Dylan is uncalled for and only serves to comfort Alice – he is not a bad guy.  She offered sex early – he, on the rebound, accepted.  He didn’t lead her on – SHE jumped to conclusions.  Once she started pulling the “psycho smothering” job women do when they get attached, he seperated entirely.

    Just the other thread, you were saying women should be able to celebrate their sexuality without criticism.  Then this dude Dylan helps her do that under no false pretense other then what she deluded herself with and dude is “Dog of the Century?” Come on…..

    I agree she should not date him, but simply b/c he is not offering what she (thinks) she wants.  It would be no different than if a guy told her he wanted a concubine for a gf and she refused.

33. BC 33

    You hit the nail here, Evan, definitely.  Its like some other entitiy takes over all of our good sense in cases like this, and we lose total ability to step back and be rational…or thank our lucky stars for the *quick* escape from a non-relationship doomed to fail. 

    Hanging around just drags out the torment and serves no good whatsoever.  Its something the best of us have had to learn the hard way, but learning to not go that route again is the gift of having come through it once.  Once is more than enough in a lifetime to deal with that embarrassment and loss of sanity over the hot guy who got away.  There are plenty of great guys out there who will float our boats as much as we float theirs without chasing the unattainable ones who don’t want to be caught.  Good call.  I hope your client heeds what you’ve advised in this case.

34. Helen 34

    I agree with others who have stated that Dylan did not seem to do anything particularly wrong. When something awkward happens between two people, as it did here, it doesn’t mean that one should automatically start looking for someone to blame.  Does Alice feel hurt?  Of course, and there is nothing wrong with her for feeling that way.  But people should accept that if they choose to enter a relationship, they are very likely to become hurt or disappointed – this is true no matter what the nature of the relationship.  If someone cannot handle that without the need to accuse or blame, he or she is not mature enough to be in a relationship.

35. Abra 35

    It just seems like you’re always hung up on the fact that guys who are desirable are the only ones who can be low-lifes or emotionally stunted.  I’ve known plenty of ugly, fat, and GASP short guys who were also arrogant, self centered and cold.  And I’ve known women who loved them, oddly enough.  Focusing on the fact that all of the guys you run down are good looking, charming, funny and charismatic undermines the message that you should be with someone who treats you well.  It sometimes sounds like a subliminal message pushing women towards the guys who don’t get dates because they don’t chalk up.  In some ways, you’re selling both the guys and the women short.  I feel like the “cheers for the underdog” message is a bit cliched, when you go overboard with it.  Like I said above, the guy could have been an average dude on the rebound and did the exact same thing. You making a point to point out that he was a hottie and she was acting out of lust just undermines the real point.

36. SnowdropExplodes 36

    Sort of picking up on what Nathan #31 sad, here – and my own thoughts were going this way anyway:
     
    Is it always the case that a guy who is recently out of a relationship is a “rebound” guy or “player”?   Is it not likely that at least some of them (though I’d hesitate to guess at what percentage that might be – fairly low but perhaps not negligible is my thought) are decent folks and at least working on being emotionally available?   How long does a guy have to be out of a relationship before you think he’s NOT a rebound case (that is, how long has he waited before seeking someone new)?   After all, someone has to be, “the first person he’s been with since his breakup.”   Must it always be the case that that person has to be a fall-girl for the rest of womankind?
     
    I guess another way of putting it is, at what stage do you think Alice should have walked away from it – when was the writing on the wall that she didn’t heed until you talked her through what had really happened?
     
    One other point, out of pure curiosity: does it make a difference whether his last partner dumped him, or he dumped her?

37. DMC 37

    Having read this article I think there are two major problems:

    1) Blaming the guy at all.  He didn’t do anything wrong
    2) Not assigning full blame on the girl Alice.  

    The second is a double standard.  If it had been a guy who jumped the gun like that, he would be getting picked apart for being needy, or smothering her, or being too available and not enough of a challange.  Some would even say he was a whiny “nice guy who’s actually not a nice guy”.  All in all, it would have been pointing blame where he screwed up.  But with Alice, there is coddling and basically she is being told she deserves better than a guy who would be turned off by her mistakes.

    She should move on, but not lose the lesson.

38. Evan Marc Katz 38

    I think it’s pretty obvious by now that women get angry when I blame women for anything and men get angry when I blame men for anything.

    I’ll say something men do ineffectively, and you’ll come back with “But WOMEN…”

    I’ll say something women do ineffectively, and you’ll come back with “But MEN…”

     

     

    You’d think that having someone experienced who has no horse in the race would be useful, but apparently, if I don’t agree with you, I’m “wrong”.

    I think that both men and women would be well-served to attempt to understand a thread of truth in this dialogue. Everything in moderation, my friends.

    Good night and thanks for your contributions.

     

     

39. DMC 39

    How exactly does having a website to promote your business constitute “having no horse in this race”?  Am I wrong to assume your business does not cater to the needs of women, as compared to men?  If I misunderstood something, I apologize

    Let me be clear, that if the roles were reversed, the man would be fully to blame.  I just think with social standards what they are, the criticism wouldn’t have been leveled out so evenly.

    Have a good night.

40. Ruby 40

    SnowdropExplodes #36

    People who are just out of a relationship generally need time to heal, but they are more likely to be ready if it was their decision to leave, rather than being the one who was left. The latter are the ones who are most likely to be on the rebound because they are still hurting, and not truly ready to move on. They really want to move forward, though, and sometimes believe that they are ready, but when push comes to shove, they realize they’re not in a position to get emotionally involved again. 

    Every scenario is different, though, and you can learn alot by asking a man how he feels about his breakup and his ex. The length of the relationship matters too. Especially when someone is just out of a long-term relationship, it makes sense to take things slowly, and ask questions.

    IMO, both parties are at fault here. Both rushed in too quickly, and Dylan’s slow-fade behavior, rather than a direct and honest admission that he really isn’t ready, was cowardly. 

41. Evan Marc Katz 41

    You’re new here, DMC, so you’re forgiven for thinking that I give advice based on monetary considerations. This is a site that, if you look around, tells women what they NEED to hear, not what they want to hear. My entire business model is predicated on telling women the truth (or at least my perception of the truth) about how good, smart, relationship-oriented men think.

    In other words, I’ve discovered that I’m an equal opportunity offender. And if I say something that indicts you personally, you’re more likely to take offense. Since most of my questions are from women, I’m generally in the business of telling them how THEY should change and adjust to reality. I believe you can’t change men, and that men don’t want to change. And, of course, there are many men whom I don’t think are evolved or self-aware enough to make any woman happy. They’re usually the ones who yell at me the most. I try to help women avoid those guys.

42. DMC 42

    Thanks for the reply Evan.  I must say though, your last comment is a little bit of a swipe at men who don’t agree with you.  Why would a man have to be unevolved or lack self-awareness if he doesn’t live to make a woman happy, but instead himself?  This almost sounds like a “single people are flawed” perception.  I can understand that men who are not relationship oriented are not the right guys for relationship oriented women, but to paint them in a broad bad light is quite biased and unecessary I think…..

43. Evan Marc Katz 43

    You hit the mark, DMC. I help women who want relationships. You can’t have a relationship unless your partner wants to make you happy. If you’re a single person who has no desire to make the necessary compromises to be in a relationship, that’s great. But why read my blog and why get upset about it? Believe me, bud, I have a lot more women taking me on than I have men. I just don’t understand those who yell at the TV instead of changing the channel if they don’t like the programming.

44. Lou 44

    @Abra,

    This is not about dating fat ugly disgusting men, it is about being self-conscious, aware of who you are in front of you.Not being fooled by the gift paper around the object that looks very nice.

    I made a lot of mistakes, especially this one with a guy who was not ready to commit and especially to me. Did suffer a lot, and did try to win him over.

    Today i am in relationship with a guy who is hot, i find him very sexy, i am physically attracted to him. But actually what matters to my eyes and as Evan mentioned it before in other posts, it’s his attitude towards me: saying “i would like to see you again” at the end of a date, bringing me flowers because i was sad and he knows i love them, making me coffee and breakfast on sunday mornings, wanting me to stay over 6 nights a week, listening to me and helping me finding solutions to my problems, sharing the same values, laughing together. 

    He does not look like my man ideal (love them with brown hair, very tall and he is blond normal man size). But of course I am also attracted to him, and i find him handsome, and attractive, etc. but maybe that’s not what i looked first when i met him. And to be honest what i looked first because it matters to me a lot, was if he was genuinely a kind person. I wanted a 9 in kindness. Not a 9 in beauty, because i wanted something else than bed moments

45. Sherel 45

    I cosign Abra and Jennifer!!! 

46. Sacha 46

    I do not see how Dylan can be blamed for anything in this situation, much less being called names like player, selfish jerk, immature, etc. What has he done wrong?? She consensually had sex with him on the second date, i.e. before she knew whether he was interested in a relationship or in a quick fling, then she assumed he was her boyfriend and smothered him….and he pulled back! Why is he wrong to pull back or walk away from a situation if it becomes uncomfortable? Maybe he did not even want to fully walk away, after all he did not fall completely out of touch….maybe he wanted to give her some space and a chance to calm down her emotions. Sometimes that is exactly what is needed at the start of a relationship when one of the parties is moving too fast for the other one. Gives people a chance to get on the same page.
     
    I do not agree that he is necessariliy a selfish jerk, nor a player. At least based on the information given here, there is no reason to assume that. Seems like just because he is tall, hot, creative, confident, etc,  we should just assume that it was his fault that she fell overboard and put all the blame is on him!
     
    If the situation was reversed…..if a man had fallen head over heels over a hot woman, treated her to an expensive dinner hoping (yes, just hoping! not expecting!) to win her affections (just like sometimes women hope they will win over a man if they give him sex! ha!), smothered her with attention, calls, emails etc, and she felt uncomfortable and decided to pull back….whose fault is it then?? Hers for being “hawt” or his for going too fast? Would you blame anyone, regardless of gender, for pulling back if they feel uncomfortable after two dates??
     
    Evan, I think in this case you have not told your client what she needed to hear. Rather, given that she had already lost him, you told her what she wanted to hear. I know that “You don’t want HIM back” is a central premise in your dating coaching, and I bet it made her feel better being told that she only lost a “selfish, immature, emotionally unavailable player who is in no position to be a good boyfriend to ANYBODY”, but it is not what should have been her takeaway from the situation. She clearly made so many obvious mistakes, that I simply cannot understand how someone who was being coached by you, in your Inner Circle, privately, one-on-one, could possibly have acted like she did!
     
    Did you, Evan, in your capacity as her dating coach, tell her not to have sex with him too early, especially before she knew his intentions and/or was ready for the consequences? Did you tell her not to assume, after 2 dates (!), that he was her boyfriend? Did you tell her to mirror him and/or just “stand in the sand with her arms open” and do nothing and wait for him to come to her, instead of smothering him with calls, texts, emails and premature relationship conversations? You were her dating coach. Where were you when this was unfolding in her dating life? What exactly did you coach her to do?

47. Gem 47

    I don’t think Dylan is all to blame. I don’t think Alice is all to blame.
     
    The bottom line is two people to were not on the same page. She pursued a man not ready/interested in a relationship while he was taking comfort in a warm body.
     
    Grown adults must take the potential negative consequences with their chosen actions.
     
    The only problem I see is when Alice noticed the big pull-back from Dylan, her response was “how to conquer this challenge?!” as opposed to cutting her loses.
     
    THAT is the major flaw I see in some women: continuing to want/pursue a man and hope to *change* him/his actions instead of accepting the reality of the situation and moving on……

48. Zaq 48

    I am a man and been around this blog for a while, and I do see where Abra is coming from.
    Evan has time, and time again said that he is not talking about women compromising or settling. That choosing someone who is less handsome, is still choosing someone who is never the less handsome, if not extremely so.

    However, as a man, I don’t see this. For many reading this blog, the choice is not between very attractive and attractive, it’s between mildly attractive and not attractive. In this situation compromise leaves you with someone who you find unattractive. Not surprising some get angry about the suggestion.
    It may be that Evan’s experience is that women are only interested in the extremely hot guys so there should be plenty of room for compromise. There is certainly enough evidence that may be true. Men’s attractiveness to women depends on a number of variables, physical attractiveness only being one of them, so there may be room for manoeuvre there.
    But men generally set the bar low anyway so there is less room to compromise.     

49. Sacha 49

    @ Ray #21
     
    “A responsible man will VOLUNTEER his relationship (or non-relationship) goals as accurately as he knows how at the time BEFORE having sex with a woman.  To fail to do so is irresponsible on his part too… especially considering what many would argue is rather thoughtless behavior after the fact.”
     
    I have to disagree that anybody should have to volunteer any such information, especially if they themselves do not exactly know yet what they are looking for. (I personally am in this situation.) There should be no expectations so early in a relationship. Evan often says that in dating “don’t ask, don’t tell” applies, and I agree with that.
     
    I was just reading another blog thread about when should a woman have sex with a man, and it turns out there are many women who are happy to have non-committed sex, because they have a physical need or just for the pleasure or to celebrate their sexuality, or whatever their personal reasons. (No judgement, each to their own.) It stands to reason that there are men who would be justified in thinking that sometimes women just want sex, nothing more.  It is not irresponsible to accept something that a man believes is offered in good faith. It would be completely different if one of the parties does not want to be sexually intimate without commitment and makes that clear to the other party. I believe it is the responsibility of the party that has the requirement for commitment or exclusivity to make that clear to the other party and to make it a condition before having sex.

50. Kelly 50

    Is it also possible that men do the slow fade because the sex wasn’t good? I’m just asking…not to insult anyone..myself included. 
     

51. Joe 51

    Oh look, Karl R. is back!

    I agree with those who are refraining from calling Dylan a dog.

    To follow what Ron Diggity #32 said, we don’t know whether he was offering what she wants, or not.  We simply know that she moved too fast for him, and got too clingy, too fast.  Alice simply forgot that to most men, having sex does not equal having a relationship.

52. Suheil 52

    Abra, you sound bitter. It doesn’t matter what Evan or anybody writes, you’re still going to take it as you wish. If this blog doesn’t work for you, then why are you reading? Take the positive and get out

53. Evan Marc Katz 53

    Sacha, the limitations of being a dating coach is that I work with women around the world, by phone, once a week. I don’t go on dates with them. I don’t whisper in their ear, via a Bluetooth connection while they’re at the restaurant. I certainly don’t follow them back to the man’s house and hide in the closet, reminding her not to have sex until she’s got a commitment.

    In short, I give advice. And given that you just quoted a whole bunch of my advice back to me, it’s pretty clear what advice I give. If someone doesn’t follow what I have to say, it’s not my responsibility, no more than the personal trainer is responsible if her client doesn’t follow her training regimen between sessions.

    And part of the reason I don’t get too emotional in the face of failure is that failure is part of the process. You learn your lesson; it never happens again. We move on. I have hundreds of happy client testimonials, so while you can feel free to try to call me out as an ineffective coach, it’s not gonna have any impact.

    I’m good at my job. I give sound advice. I care about my clients. What they do when I’m not with them is beyond my control.

54. Heather 54

    While I agree that Dylan may not have necesarily been a “dog” or a “player”, I take issue with the disappearing act.  It is childish, it is immature, and rude.  OK, Alice moved too soon.  But my god, how hard would it be for Dylan to have OPENED HIS MOUTH, pulled up his big boy pants, and said, “Listen, I think this may not work out.”  I do this (well, did before I met my current boyfriend) with men I dated and realized it wasn’t going to work out.  Why?  Because I knew how it felt to have men just disappear on me and hurt my feelings, and I promised I’d be the bigger person and always tell my dates “thank you but no thank you” if it wasn’t working.
    I just take real issue with people who can’t have the bloody courtesy and maturity to speak up.  No, it’s not fun.  But guess what, being an adult is not always going to be easy.  Notice I said, PEOPLE, not “men.”  I am not here to man bash but to point out a real problem I see in dating.  I have had friends complain about this problem as well, men and women both.

55. Sacha 55

    @Evan #53
     
    Thanks for replying to my comment #46. You do give sound advice, no doubt about that. As you noted yourself, I quoted a whole bunch of your advice that I have found extremely helpful. I am reading, absorbing and trying to apply your advice in real life.
     
    What I was trying to say was that if I were in your client’s situation, it would have been more helpful to tell her what she did wrong herself, not call the guy names that he does not deserve in my opinion. How is telling her that he is a selfish jerk and a player going to help her learn her lesson?? It will sure make her feel better and think that it was his fault, not hers….but it will not help her change her behaviour so that in future she does not come on too strong and push men away. In short, I think not only have you been blaming the wrong person, but you have been too soft on her and she would have been better served if you had pointed out to her her mistakes. If I were her dating coach I would have given her two pieces of homework: to write an essay analysing what she did wrong and the second one to compile and learn by heart a list of Dating Rules (based on your advice of course!), i.e. what she must and mustn’t do when she starts a new relationship and how to behave on a date! Ha!

56. Heather 56

    @ Sacha #55.
     
    I agree and I disagree.  While Alice does need to hear where she went wrong, calling a spade a spade, and calling his behavior wrong, isn’t wrong either.  The guy acted like a child.  I totally agree that Alice needs to learn some things here and not move too quickly.  That is hard to learn and it took me forever before I caught on.  But.  His behavior is really rather pathetic and worthy of a high school kid, not someone in their 30s.
     
    Again, I totally agree that Alice needs to learn to keep her mouth shut and legs crossed if she’s interested in a relationship with a guy.  I finally learned that after a few times of being badly burned.  And she should definitely develop some pride and never chase after a man who’s rejected her.  Heck, if a guy rejects me and then comes back, all he gets outta me now is, “Sorry, you had your chance, you blew me off.  Why would I ever let you hurt me again?  Buzz off!”
     
    If we’re going to point out mistakes, let’s make sure we point out Dylan’s as well.  Just sayin…..

57. nathan 57

    “I believe you can’t change men, and that men don’t want to change.” Do you really believe the second part of this statement, Evan, because it actually doesn’t make sense, given the experiences you’ve shared about your own dating life here.
     
    I totally agree with the first half of the statement. And I also believe it’s a good idea for men to approach women the same way. Wanting to change someone you’re dating isn’t a good way to develop a healthy relationship.

58. BC 58

    Heather@54, I totally agree with you on this!  God, it is the absolute worst to *think* that things are going really well, only to have a guy just do that cowardly fade out thing.  It has only (thank goodness!) happened to me once, but I was left totally baffled and really blind sided by it.  It was years ago, and we were both in our early twenties, perhaps not the most mature age, but yikes!  Even at 20, I had the good sense and decency to be forthright and honest…and considerate with people.  If you have spent a good portion of several months of your life with someone, you shouldn’t just fade out, ya know?  Its hurtful to treat someone that way.  A teensy bit of honesty would at least put some closure to something that was seemingly important to both of you, at least for a period of time in your life.

59. Sacha 59

    @ Heather #56
     
    I don’t understand what makes you think Dylan acted like a child. He did not go ‘puff’, he did not disappear without a trace. Evan said “he did not fall completely out of touch, but became highly inaccessible” (whatever that means….probably not answering all her emails, texts and calls). But it had only been A WEEK!! 
     
    How do you know he was not trying to slow her down a bit, give both of them a chance to take stock of their emotions, give them a chance to miss each other? Again….Evan says it had only been a week before she started freaking out and asking how to get him back!? And they had only had a couple of dates!
     
    Right now I am in a similar situation with a man who is coming on too strong too quickly. I feel if he does not slow down it will seriously put me off him, while at the same time I am interested in him. But he is constantly texting and emailing and that is coming across a bit desperate. That is definitely not a turn on. It is for his benefit that I am trying to slow him down! Is he thinking I am acting like a child, or pulling a slow fade if I do not reply to every single one of his texts. Because I am not!!

60. still looking 60

    Is Dylan a jerk?  A player?  Emotionally unready?  A user of women?

    Would we be making the same assessment if Dylan was just a nice guy with average features?

    This scenario has probably happened to every person reading this blog.  Boy meets girl, there’s a mutual attraction, they go on a second date (or 5 or 10 or 25), and at some point “he/she is just not that into you” enters the equation.  Whether they slept together is probably irrelevant – Dylan lost interest and Dylan pulled a “slow fade”.

    I’ve had women fade away, others have gone “poof”, and others have tried to explain.  It’s all a part of dating.  Until you meet Mr/Ms Right and live happily ever after, you are going to risk being hurt when the attraction turns out to be one-sided.

    The only red flag I see with Dylan is he was on the rebound.  The real question is why can’t Alice hang onto a guy? (“Alice never has trouble attracting guys; her trouble is in keeping them.”)

    Perhaps Alice is aiming too high and Dylan’s only intention was a pump and dump.  Then again, maybe Alice has a flaw that makes every guy head for the door after a couple of dates.    

61. Diana 61

    To Erinlee #15, bingo! Both Dylan and Alice played their equal part in what happened. He can’t sleep with you on the second date unless you let him. It sounds to me like she rushed things along far too quickly, and tried to put the cart before the horse, and most men are turned off by this.

62. Ruby 62

    Would Alice have been that hot for a nice, average guy? Don’t think so. I think the fact that they slept together so quickly is very relevant. It put too much pressure on the relationship too soon, made Alice feel too needy and Dylan, who was not over his past relationship, too scared.

    She could have slept with a guy who was ready for a relationship on the second date and things could have been fine. But if you can’t handle the possibility that casual sex won’t lead to a relationship, then you should wait a lot longer before having sex.

63. Kellie 63

    Gotta love it!!  Evan, I have been a huge fan of your work for some time now and your emails are the highlight of my morning when they arrive.  It humours me when I read some comments.  Being in a number of the situations you write about (including this one verbatim) I know that what you talk is just pure, simple and uncomplicated truth.  My personal mantra is “Tis wot tis, don’t make it wot it ain’t…”  You either get it or you don’t…for all of us (and we are many) that do – thanks – love your work!!

64. Sara 64

    Evan: you speak a lot of sense. It’s pretty clear to me that you are not telling people to sacrifice chemistry and passion for something comfortable and boring. You are simply telling people not to get blinded by chemistry to the point where they ignore character, as character is the most important thing. I can’t for the life of me see how anyone could take issue with such good, common sense advice. Thankyou!

65. Nicole 65

    @Ruby, I agree…they hardly slept together so fast b/c he told her she was the one.  They clearly had some powerful chemistry and jumped in bed but that doesn’t make him a jerk.  How could either of them know what they wanted after 2 dates?  

    I’d chalk this one up to him probably not knowing what he wanted until he was confronted so quickly with the idea that this was another intense relationship.  He could have very well gone to bed with her thinking this could go further and then gotten freaked out when she cranked things up.

    I think I’ve read that on other threads.  And 2 dates is hardly enough time for EITHER person to know what they wanted or to have real feelings about each other and the roles here could have very well been reversed with him wanting to make things official after 2 dates and sex.   And no one would ever call a woman who wanted to pull away a liar or a player.   It’s like the men who complain about buying women dinner a few times who then blow them off.  

    He showed her that he wasn’t the one, not because he’s a jerk but because he’s not ready and she needs to move on to someone else who is there.  Since sex makes her feel like someone is her boyfriend, she needs to wait for more info next time.  In this case, maybe he was called a player in the response to make her feel better about the end of things, or because it is behavior that a player would have willingly engaged in.  I don’t think that’s this guy though.

66. Ray 66

    sacha@49

    Glad you brought up Evan’s ‘don’t ask don’t tell’ policy.  I disagree with it.  
    Doesn’t sound like a basis for creating intimacy or any shared responsibility. 

    Plus it doesn’t teach you communication skills, nor does it do anything to show you how the man of interest communicates either.  Just avoids communication.. till when exactly?  This post is a perfect example… Don’t ask don’t tell leads to alot of misunderstandings and hurt feelings that could easily be avoided if someone had the courage to speak up… and that is both people’s responsibility.

    I didn’t call the man in the post a player, but I do consider him irresponsible.  If the doesn’t know what he wants, he should say so before having sex. 

    I’m rather tired of people expecting women to be either celibate or mind readers when it comes to men.   Women shouldn’t be ashamed of themselves if they’ve stated their goals and act on them accordingly. 

    There is also this myth out there that women need to avoid stating what their relationship goals are early in dating.  IMO, there is no quicker way to get rid of the losers than by at least attempting it.  Sure, you’ll get the occasional guy who will lie… those aren’t that hard to weed out either, to be honest.  Failing to state one’s goals in advance leads to alot of misunderstandings, drama, and even worse in some cases.

    If the OP didn’t tell this guy she was looking for a relationship before having sex with him, then yea, they both share in the responsibility.   

         

67. Ruby 67

    Ray #66

    I agree about asking a man’s intentions. Maybe not on the first date, but early on, and before sex. I know that usually I have a pretty good idea if a man is more serious-minded by his actions, and little “hints” he drops. Generally, if I do have to ask, it’s because I’m getting the sense that he wants to keep things casual. But I’d rather be sure.

68. starthrower68 68

    While it would have been NICE for this guy to be up front with the OP (assuming he knew he wasn’t ready), we can’t always depend on the other person to be nice which means we are at least somewhat responsible to mitigating the emotional risk to ourselves.  Evan has said more than once that a woman is wise not to put too much stock into what a guy says, i.e. if he thinks you’re beautiful, smart, etc. as it doesn’t necessarily mean he is interested.  I just had a similar scenario play out, and fortunately I didn’t put any stock into what the dude said so when he turned on me after having sex with him, I wasn’t hurt.  I knew what I was doing, chose to do it, and moved on.  I would not advise instasex with anyone, nor am I particularly proud of myself for having done it, but I did take away the lesson that I needed to from it.  

    There was another guy with whom I experienced what I believe is real love but he could not reciprocate.  He is unavailable, irresponsible, and cold.  I don’t think he’s necessarily a bad guy but he’s misguided and unwise.  As much as it hurt, I made the quality decision to move on and I may have just met the kind of guy Evan says we should be looking for.   And I’ve experienced some breakthrough in the process.  Keeping in mind all of EMK’s advice, I was able to go on date one and enjoy myself with no expectations.  When he texted me last night after the date to find out what I thought of him, I was pleasantly surprised.  Now I’m giving him the space to process things and let him “be the man”.  This was after I initially contacted him.  I think one date is too soon to tell, but if nothing else, I can actually see how far I’ve come and how much I’ve grown and for me, that is huge.

69. Saint Stephen 69

    Ray Said; (#66)
    I didn’t call the man in the post a player, but I do consider him irresponsible.  If the doesn’t know what he wants, he should say so before having sex.  
    Why should he be the one to say so? What about her, didn’t she have any role to play in this? You always seem to be putting women in the victim’s position and make men the assailant. Both of them were matured adults who knows what’s good for them.  

    Ray Said; (#66)
    If the OP didn’t tell this guy she was looking for a relationship before having sex with him, then yea, they both share in the responsibility.
    Ray – According to the letter, she didn’t tell him (Except Evan edited that part out).   

70. starthrower68 70

    @ St. Stephen #69,

    I think you make a couple of good points.  If we are going to engage in adult games then we have to behave like adults and that means accepting responsibility for what we can.  Both parties were neither completely wrong or completely right.  To co-opt Evan’s phrase, there isn’t right or wrong (in most cases; sometimes people just engage in plain bad behavior) but effective and ineffective.  However, whether the guy was completely at fault or the OP was is purely academic.  This guy didn’t give the OP what she wants/needs and it’s time for her to move on.  I don’t mean to lack compassion by saying that as we’ve all been where she is and it never feels good to be rejected.  My point is, if someone is not on the same page as you are, there is nothing to be done.  It’s futile to try to change it or wait it out.  

71. starthrower68 71

    My apologies Evan, for the double post, but I saw a quote that really speaks to me and really goes along with this thread:

    “It hurts to let go. Sometimes it seems the harder you try to hold on to something or someone the more it wants to get away. You feel like some kind of criminal for having felt, for having wanted. For having wanted to be wanted. It confuses you, because you think that your feelings were wrong and it makes you feel so small because it’s so hard to keep it inside when you let it out and it doesn’t come back. You’re left so alone that you can’t explain. Damn, there’s nothing like that, is there? I’ve been there and you have too. You’re nodding your head.” ― Henry Rollins, The Portable Henry Rollins

72. Sacha 72

    @ Ray #66
     
    I understand your point, but if I may quote you from another thread:
     
    “I’ve argued in past posts that women should lie about their sexual history, and my opinion on that hasn’t changed.   On the other hand, sometimes being honest about one’s life is the only way to find out if he does hold double standards.  However, there are many other ways to figure this out that don’t involve radical honesty on the woman’s part.  Women can figure this out by observing how he treats and talks about other women…. NOT by sharing her past…   
    yes, I realize that could be construed as a double standard for honesty.  Shrug.  At the end of the day, I suppose all we have is what we can observe in the here and now.  So perhaps that is the real message.  Observe someone’s behavior now and how they conduct themselves.  Sometimes letting the past stay in the past is the best thing for everyone.”
     
    I happen to agree with part of what you say there, namely that women should observe. Words do not mean much. What is the point of asking direct questions? In the best of cases, the other person will tell you what they feel/think in that moment, as best as they can. In the worst of cases they will deliberately deceive you or tell you what they think you want to hear. I am a believer in the indirect approach of observing and “testing” men over a period of time in different situations.
     
    To illustrate the point in the case of Alice and Dylan. What did Alice observe? Sex was on the table and Dylan was ready and willing to take what was offered. Did he demonstrate that he wanted anything more than that?? Nothing in what Evan has said points to that. The rest was all in her head. That is not his fault. How was he supposed to know that she was developing this boyfriend-girlfriend fantasy?? Maybe even designing the wedding dress and naming their children?? And it happened on their 2nd date! Alice only had data to conclude that he wanted or was not going to turn down sex. He is not a villain for doing that, it is all consensual. After all, sometimes women want just sex. If she wanted more and would not have wanted to go ahead with sex otherwise, then it is her responsibility to tell him. He is not a mind-reader. 
     
    I agree with you on this as well: “Failing to state one’s goals in advance leads to alot of misunderstandings, drama, and even worse in some cases.”  If nothing is stated, nothing can or should be assumed. If someone has requirements and conditions that are critical and non-negotiable to them, then they should state them. 
     
    There is also the possibility that Alice was actually hoping to win him over by having sex with him, using sex to make him bond physically and emotionally. If that was the case with her, (and note that Evan said that “she HAD to have him!”, presumably quoting her so it is not such an outrageous supposition to make)  then her hidden agenda had a fundamental flaw and backfired. Again….that is on her, not his fault.
     
     

73. Ray 73

    stephen@69

    I believe I’ve held both people accountable here.  If she didn’t state what her goals were and assumed, then she shares in the responsibility. 

    I don’t share the opinion that he holds none… and I certainly don’t hold the opinion that if a woman offers sex that a man should just accept it without some responsibility on his end… as convenient as that is for alot of guys.  

    If men want to be treated like ’men’, then they need to act like one… not a little boy.  Little boys ‘take’.  Men share.    

74. K 74

    @Sacha 72.  I’m totally on board with your comment.  I don’t blame Dylan at all.  I have had girlfriends sleep with guys just because they want to.  Sometimes those guys want more and they don’t.  I wouldn’t blame them for not stating their non-intentions prior to sex.  If those men needed to have a commitment to have sex it would be up to them to say so.  I don’t think it should change here because they guy distanced himself.  I actually did have the talk with a guy once who I was dating, turned out he wasn’t that serious about dating me and was sleeping with other women so we ended it.  I got a lot of grief from my girlfriends for having the talk.  They thought I should have just had sex with him and that it would have been more fun/casual and make him like me.  I obviously disagree with that (for me).  But I think some women think that strategy would work.  I think if you have requirements then state them, otherwise enjoy sex and tomorrow is no guarantee (frankly even if you did have the talk it wouldn’t be even though at least then you can label him a jerk if he takes off immediately).

75. Saint Stephen 75

    Sacha @72
    I completely agree with everything you said. 

    Ray @73
    She didn’t offer sex. They both offered and had sex. 

76. Ruby 76

    Yes, they both made the decision to have sex. But Dylan should be mature enough to tell Alice honestly that he’s not ready for a relationship. The fact that he’s pulling away seems cowardly. Perhaps she thought sleeping with him would bring them closer, but it’s just as likely that he gave her expectations of a relationship, especially since he is avoiding facing her now.

77. Selena 77

    “Both men and women want a partner who is easy to be with, who makes our life more enjoyable and joyful.  Seek that. ”   -  Katarina Phang # 16

    Yes. That Is It.

78. Still Looking 78

    Ruby@76

    Ruby – Maybe Dylan is ready for a relationship, just not with Alice.  

    “ Alice went out with Dylan and, barely able to contain her excitement, slept with him on the second date.  Dylan, still excited the next day, made overtures to follow up.  Alice, breathing a great sigh of relief, started treating Dylan as a boyfriend…Which meant calls, emails, texts and demands to know where things were going…Until, predictably, Dylan pulled the “slow fade”, where he didn’t fall completely out of touch, but became highly inaccessible.”

    Looks to me like Dylan was interested until the “calls, emails, texts and demands” began.  Then he pulled a slow fade.

    I would agree that after a long relationship that a slow fade is inappropriate, but a slow fade after two dates is fairly common.

    After losing interest in a man you’ve had a couple of dates with, have you given an explanation as to why you were no longer interested or did you poof/fade away?

79. Saint Stephen 79

    There wasn’t anyway Dylan would have known if Alice was seeking a relationship if she never mentioned it to him. He could as well thought that she just wanted sex for the sake of sex and nothing more, which might lead him to assume they were riding on the same boat. Perhaps he might have been really interested in a relationship and suddenly got cold feet when her smothering and clingy attitude surfaced. 

    Going by the letter: Evan stated that she had problems in “keeping guys” which indicates some deep seated negative issues plaguing her dating life – and seriously needs to addressed. That Evan’s comment got Dylan off the hook.  

80. DMC 80

    Do you guys think there is a double standard when it comes to personal accountability with men and women?  Sort of like physical strength? What constitues a “strong” woman might only equate to a man of average strength ability?

    Honestly, I don’t see how Dylan is too blame at all – unless you feel men have a moral responsibilty to “be his woman’s keeper” and protect her from her own flaws (in this case, jumping the gun, overactive imagination)

81. Goldie 81

    I agree with Sacha #72 as well.
     
    If Dylan slept with Alice and then she never heard from him again, then yeah I’d say he’s a dog and a player. But he followed up the next day. Even after he pulled a slow fade, he didn’t fall completely out of touch. I’d say he did the best he could under the circumstances, given his personality. A well-rounded man who’s in touch with his feelings would’ve probably had a talk with Alice on what their expectations are — heck, he would’ve probably had the talk before the sex. But Dylan is not that man. Most guys aren’t.
     
    I still stand by my earlier comment that Dylan is FWB material. Nothing wrong with that, BTW. A good FWB is hard to find

82. Ruby 82

    Still Looking #78

    <<Looks to me like Dylan was interested until the “calls, emails, texts and demands” began.  Then he pulled a slow fade.>>

    It sounds like the calls, email, & texts began after Alice sensed that Dylan was pulling away. But I agree, she jumped the gun (so to speak).
    <<I would agree that after a long relationship that a slow fade is inappropriate, but a slow fade after two dates is fairly common.>>

    The slow fade might be common, but since they did have sex, letting her know he’s not interested would be the courteous thing to do.
    <<After losing interest in a man you’ve had a couple of dates with, have you given an explanation as to why you were no longer interested or did you poof/fade away?>>

    I’ve never had sex with anyone who faded away after two dates, or with whom I actually had that little interest in. Fading away after two dates with someone I had a little physical contact with is another story.
    I think there is plenty of reason to ask direct questions, or to state your own expectations. Yes, the person may lie, but I think you usually can tell when someone is being cagey. And if they do lie, all the more reason to walk away without having to wonder any longer about their intentions.
     

83. Ruby 83

    St Stephen #79
     
    <<Evan stated that she had problems in “keeping guys” which indicates some deep seated negative issues plaguing her dating life – and seriously needs to addressed. That Evan’s comment got Dylan off the hook. >> 

    What EMK said was, “Thus, Alice never has trouble attracting guys; her trouble is in keeping them.
    Does this sound like anyone you know? Nah. Didn’t think so…  ”
     
    I think EMK’s saying that lots of his female readers can relate to Alice’s “trouble”, not that she has deep-seated issues (although she may).

84. Heather 84

    @Sacha:
    I think thou doth protest too much.  If the guy you are seeing is putting you off, then you owe him the courtesy of opening your mouth, pulling up your big girl panties, and SAYING SOMETHING.  Men hate the disappearing act just as much as we women do.  Trust me, my current boyfriend has told me how much he hated that.
    Just because you are a woman does not give you the right to behave just as you choose.  You need to let him know that.  He may not know that you feel this way.
    Sorry but a week of no contact or communication equals disappearing in my book, especially if sex is involved.  Not that I am saying that Alice should have slept with him so soon.  However, in my book, once sex is involved, then it is imperative, not nice, not a suggestion, but IMPERATIVE, that the person who feels freaked out, tell that other party.  It is hurtful, rude, and inconsiderate to just disappear.  And I have called a few men out on that.  I tell them “Look.  Fine, if this is not what you want or you don’t feel ready, that’s fine.  But your disappearing act is very rude.  Please don’t contact me again since you have already shown me your character and I’m not going to put up with it.”
    We are all supposed to treat others as we would want to be treated. Like another poster said, we can’t always depend upon people playing nice.  But that doesn’t mean that we have license to just start mistreating others.  I take other people’s feelings extremely seriously.

85. Betsey 85

    And I cosign Sherel #45, who cosigns Abra and Jennifer!!! 

86. Linda 86

    Hey Abra, it’s not about settling for guys who are less than what’s desired, but learning to respect yourself enough to bypass those who think they can treat you poorly because you let them.  There are plenty of great, good-looking, charming and smart men who aren’t players and jerks and don’t trade on their sex appeal.  and it works both ways.  Women too.

87. Abra 87

    I’m not even so much complaining about the advice itself that is given, just by constantly making the attractive, confident, funny, intelligent, enjoyable guy into being the bad guy because no guy could have great traits and be dateable seems to undermine Evan’s actual point.  I think I was irked because rebound Dyaln did what many people (men and women) would have done in his situation and somehow it turned into another diatribe about why you should go for someone who you feel less sizzle for because desirable people are manipulative jerks, not that you shouldn’t bed down with people if you’re looking for a relationship, or look for a relationship with someone on a rebound, etc.

88. Androgynous 88

    Evan, Dylan may or may not have been a jerk but he certainly does have poor relationship skills. What struck me about Alice’s situation is that she assumed full girlfriend/relationship status after the second date (when she slept with him) without first checking with him what his position was. Sounds like he was scared off but too poor at communication and relationships to explain this to Alice.
    Then again, a LOT of men don’t know how to handle this situation, especially when they do not know what the reaction of the woman would be. They can’t stand the thought of the woman crying, begging, threatening, scolding, sulking or generally throwing a tantrum. They hate it because they don’t like to feel manipulated or forced into doing or saying something they don’t agree with, just to placate a woman. Sure Alice is probably too mature for this sort of behavior, but how was Dylan supposed to know this, especially after the second date and especially when her reaction after a second date was to go full steam ahead ? The best and easiest reaction in this scenario, as far as men are concerned, is to simply ignore the “problem” and hope it will all fade away. Poor choice, but the only one for many men.
    The best way for Alice to go ahead in the future is not to assume anything with men – even when a man pledges his undying love for her and flagellates himself for it. Take things nice and slow until a man shows his growing love and affection mainly through deeds over a period of time.

89. Maria E 89

    @ JOE 51
    “Alice simply forgot that to most men, having sex does not equal having a relationship.”

    So when do men consider it is relationshop worthy??

90. Joe 90

    It’s different for every man.  I was just pointing out that for men, jumping into bed doesn’t mean they want to jump into a relationship.

91. Jess 91

    First time writing a comment. Your friend Alice and I use the same size shoe. I spent years working on me, being happy..blah blah blah, then dated here and there. I feel men are just not worth the monk life I lived while I made myself complete. Then came the ONE guy you speak of. Except, I don’t he, or Alice’s man were the playing losers. I think like Alice I was starving for that connection. I slept with him like two weeks after our first date, but I did have those faults of wanting more so soon. I switched from the cool gal he saw himself dating to the clinger. Any man would run away whether on the rebound or not. I treat dating like a good diet now though. I date multiple men whether I like them physically or not. I balance things out, get to know men. My only advantage is my sexual self-control. I treat that like the piece of cake I will regret the next day on the scale. So far it’s been great. The pressure is off. Guys keep calling.

92. Jess 92

    Missed a word (Except, I don’t think he, or Alice’s man were the playng losers. )

93. Ray 93

    DMC@80

    Ok, have it your way.  All of us women will assume men are irresponsible a-holes out for nothing more than a piece of ass.   (sarcasm intended).

    You want to be treated like an adult?  You want women to show their vulnerable side when they decide to sleep with you.. then ‘man up’ and take your share of responsibility for communicating your relationship goals (or lack of them) before having sex.  It isn’t that hard.

    Unless you like playing the game where you pretend you have better intentions on the off-chance that will get you laid more often.  Like most cowardly men.  

94. Ria 94

    Abra – l can tell you this. I completely completely understand you and l applaud for being so brave, but as l usually like to say – the key lies in you, not in everyone else and you have to take each person as individual. If one hot guy is a jerk, another is not and the key is to recognize (red flags),and how do YOU feel (with him and around him).  And this is what Evan talks about. You can fall in love with a hot guy, if YOU are his one and he treats you well.

    So taking each piece separately, As for this Dylan character. He might not be player, opportunist, but he was irresponsibly taking a bite of a *good time* he was smelling was coming towards him. And Alice was hot girl, yes? So there you go. He, after a rebound relationship, wanted just some distraction from the pain and *lets-see-how-things-are-going-kind of thing,* when Alice probably was already thinking wehter to write wedding invitations to pink or white paper… Which comes to Alice. It was not her fault either, but probably she was a bit naive, hoping that maybe This time…and not to recognizing her own patterns which has lead her to bad consequences in past. 

    Not sure wether both of them adressed at first about what they are looking for, but l find that funny if they did (and jump into bed straight after to celebrate that desicion), because you cannot decide over few dates wether that IS your future partner, and expecting that maybe, maybe this time, because the chemistry is so high, its an exception of the rule. (Ladies, be more wize and men, if you dont want problems, make sure she knows you dont mean relationship:))
      

      

95. Saint Stephen 95

    Ria Said;
    Ladies, be more wize and men, if you dont want problems, make sure she knows you dont mean relationship.  
    What sort of problems are u talking about? I’m lost.

96. Ria 96

    Saint – Chill. All l said is that ideally it would be nice if guys make it clear before sleeping with woman, that they just want it casual. If she wants the same, fair do, but if she thinks relationship and he thinks rebound/casual/fun, you name it, quaranteed, problems arrive later.
    In a real world it usually never happens, because should a guy say that hey, l just want to have a casual fling with you, but nothing more serious, then he just probably have to *sit alone in the bar:)*
      

97. Ray 97

    …and to add to my thoughts in another thread… if the guy presses for sex early, by default, he is NOT relationship material.  At worst, he’s just seeing what he can get away with and doesn’t give a crap about you.  At best, he’s one of those double standard kind of guys who will have sex with you and consider you a slut after the fact, but not himself. 

    Neither type is worth your time.  Sticking to that rule (making a man exhibit some personal discipline and take the time to communicate his relationship goals in advance) would save women alot of headaches.  

    Notice how resistent the men are here to stating their goals up front and taking personal responsibility.  It isn’t ’natural’ to them.  They are used to the woman doing all the heavy lifting there.   

    Like, if she has sex ‘too soon’, she’s a slut.

    If she waits, she’s a tease.

    If she wants a relationship after sex, she’s needy and grasping.

    All of this, ladies, is designed to put you off YOUR game… which is sizing up HIS character.  Doncha see?  Nice distraction, isn’t it?   

    If the guy does his part and takes responsibility for communication of his relationship goals and pace of sex (cause his d*ck is attached to his body, not yours… never forget that), you can imagine how much less drama there is, can’t you? 
         
    Stephen@95

    I have a close male friend I’ve known for over 5 years who was stalked by a woman he dated exactly two weeks.   She made up false police charges and created some pretense for a restraining order (women can do that)… that were later dropped of course when she didn’t show up to court.  I guess that was her revenge for him deciding he didn’t want a relationship with her after they had sex.  Oh, and he met her on Eharmony.  I guess they don’t screen for crazy there.   We found out later (after she moved out of the state) that she had done the same to a past boyfriend.  Psycho.

       

98. jbv 98

    @96 Ria

    -

    I think that is because a lot of girls think that they can’t be “okay” with casual sex even if they want it and feel better about having sex as a step towards finding “the one” whether or not they think the partner is actually the one.

    If they tell their female friends that they slept with this guy and he never called me back than at least the guy looks like the “bad” one.  If they tell their friends “yeah, we had mutual casual sex and it was awesome” the  ”friends” may think badly of her. 

99. Ria 99

    JBV, l agree with you. In this context, however, Alice was not that kind of girl, she was looking for relationship. But also – a lot of girls think they *can handle* casual sex in hopes to make it something more. And the disapointment comes, when its not happening.  Girls who master the *casual sex game* hardly ever moan, but enjoy life:)

100. priya 100

     Dylan was jerk, player?What if he just lost his feelings for this lady and thus stop dating?
     Just the way this lady want to pursue this man because she has feelings he want to pursue women who makes him feel  crazy.
      
      

101. hespeler 101

     I’m picking up the pieces after being the rebound to a girl I met 6 weeks ago.  This situation did not involve sex yet I feel just as hurt.  She told me before our first date not to have expectations because her ex made out with a girl in a bar and she decided to break it off.   She said she thought she was ready to date but she wasn’t sure.  She told me she’s went on a lot of dates with men she wasn’t interested in but told me I would be someone that she was interested in. 

     I had a lot of doubts but knew I had a high level of interest too.  The first date went great and we had one of those first great kisses.  On the second date she told me her ex was trying to see her but she was still very angry at him.  She asked if I was dating other people and wanted me to be a “player.”  No matter how much I told her I wasn’t, she kept thinking I was a “player.”  This idea I was a player made me seem more disposable to her.

     After the third date, we became much more physically intimate.  No sex because she said she doesn’t have casual sex and that she wasn’t ready for a relationship.  Yet after the date she began to tell me how excited she was about me, how much she missed me and how much she wished I was there with her.  I kept remembering what she said about her ex but hearing these other things made me feel special and I thought that if I just take it slow with her, things may work out.

     A few more dates went by with constant contact in between.  It felt as though she was my girlfriend.  The dates always had a lot of passionate kissing.  We would find secluded areas and just stare at each other for hours.  I’m human so I really thought we were connecting and began to get very excited about this whole thing but I accepted the fact and was cool with her only wanting to see me once a week.  I told her not to worry about sex and that I just enjoyed being with her.

     It began to become apparent that she was keeping me at arm’s length but still treating me like a boyfriend…constant texts and phone calls, sending me pictures, etc.

     When we would get together it would get very passionate but when we were apart she seemed to be able to turn her emotions off like a faucet.  I was very hurt and confused.  I told her halfway into it after she broke a date, that she had to understand 3 things: 1) I was not a player, 2) I was beginning to have strong feelings for her, and 3) not to contact me unless she was genuinely interested in me.  She called me that night and we went on a few more dates and it seemed to really heat up.  She said that she couldn’t wait to have sex with me.  I thought to myself that I just had to give it a little more time because in her state she needs to take it slow.

     After becoming very aloof towards me for a few days, I started to feel like a second-class citizen.  I told her that I seemed like and afterthought to her and wished her luck.  She responded, “Ok, you too.”  I couldn’t believe how she could be so passionate with me and then just dismiss me so easily. 

     Th next day she reached out to me and we met that night.  In an immature manner, she went on the offensive telling me how she didn’t believe a lot of the things I was saying and how I never wanted her to come to my neighborhood (I asked her to my house many times which she always refused).  I can’t believe I didn’t end it there but somehow I found myself in a store with her afterwards and we were holding hands, hugging and kissing.  On the car ride back she dropped the bomb on me that she was going back to her ex.  I was devestated.  She admitted to me that she had feelings for me but had to keep me at arms length because she was torn.  She admitted that we did have a connection and apologized as I got out of the car.

     It was time to cut my losses and heal but she kept reaching out to me and I was so into her I could not ignore her.  We began to flirt again and found ourselves right back where we started.  We went out again last week and she told me that she’s pretty sure that she’s going back to her ex but you never know.  Again I should have cut it off there but after wards we drove to a secluded area and became intimate for a good 4 hours.  She told me how crazy she was about me and I told her how bad I wanted her.

     But again, I had to pull teeth to see her again.  She refused the last time I asked her out and she sent me some pictures this past weekend.  I tried contacting her to ask about her weekend.  She gave me a short response and I’ve tried to reach out to her once more with no response.  I haven’t heard from her in 3 days.  She is disappearing and it hurts.

     I’ve never been caught in a rebound before.  I feel so used.  Funny thing is, all the signs were there and she never really treated me well except for the first couple of dates.  I can’t believe I let someone treat me like that.  I kept giving her the benefit of the doubt becasue she seemed so confused.  It’s not often you find someone who really excites you.  It can be really frustrating to find that person when the timing isn’t right.

102. Anna 102

      
     I would never have had the long-term relationship that I have had without chemistry.  And my beau is very good looking and brilliant.  He is emotionally open and a man of character and self reflection, too.
     I, meanwhile, have fashion model looks and a degree in Philosophy from an Ivy school.  
     Looks, Character, Chemistry, and long-term relationships (or marriage, if you desire) can certain all happen together.  There are such people and such couples.
      

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