I Am a Nice Guy With Little Dating Experience. How Do I Get a Woman to Go Out With Me?

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Good Morning Evan,

I have a bit of a dilemma. I am almost 21 years old and I have only dated one woman in my life and I dated her for 4 years. She broke up with me in the summer of 2006. I’ve asked out several women since then, and they all rejected me. Just a few months ago I moved to Florida, and I’ve asked out two women and they both said no to me, too. I think I must be cursed. I feel scared to ask out any other women for fear of being rejected. The worst thing about this is that the last woman told me to never change who I am because I gave her a rose for New Year’s Eve. She said a man had not done that for her in a long time. But if she won’t go out with me, how can I be myself? In a way, I have an identity and a dating crisis.

I heard you were an expert, so how do I get a woman to go out with me?

Alex

Nice guys rarely do well with women, but it’s not BECAUSE they’re nice. It’s because they have no confidence.

Dear Alex,

Your crisis isn’t an identity crisis or dating crisis; it’s a confidence and perception crisis.

Your sample size of experience is so small that you’ve turned every tiny setback into a disproportionately large failure. This is impacting your perception of the world to view yourself through a prism in which you are “cursed”, “scared”, “rejected” and afraid all in one paragraph.

So let’s shake you out of this funk and set your record straight.

(This goes for any other reader – male or female – who has ever felt a lack of confidence in his/her ability to date. Dating failures are almost ALWAYS perception and confidence problems and not real problems.)

Okay, Alex. Your question says it all: “How do I get a woman to go out with me?”

The answer is: “You don’t. You become the man that she wants to go out with.”

It may sound like wordplay, but I assure you, it’s not. Our job as human beings is not to make anybody do anything. Every email I receive that says, “How do I make a man want to commit to me?” misses the point. You can’t make a man do anything. All you can do is be the kind of woman that makes a man never want to never leave. The focus is on who you are, not on how you want him to act.

Same for you, my rose-giving friend.

You’re a nice guy. Nice guys rarely do well with women, but it’s not BECAUSE they’re nice. It’s because they have no confidence. They don’t inspire, they ask permission. They don’t lead, they follow. They don’t trust their judgment, they want to see if their judgment is okay with their girlfriend. And they certainly don’t believe that they’re good enough to get any woman interested in them – they just feel fortunate to be in the conversation at all. In short, nice guys have to grow a set of balls.

This isn’t my opinion. This is me, as a dating coach, translating what I’ve heard from thousands of women. They don’t like bad boys BECAUSE they treat them poorly – they like them IN SPITE of it. Why? Because bad boys inspire, excite, lead and generally appear to have things all under control.

Seriously, bro, you’ve asked out TWO women in Florida who weren’t interested – and now you’re afraid you’re cursed?

Women want to be equals with men; they don’t want to be able to control us. The second they can control you, Alex, they’ve lost all respect for you.

I’m guessing that you’re sending out a pretty strong signal to women that they can control you. This is something that feeds on itself and has led you to this crisis of confidence. Seriously, bro, you’ve asked out TWO women in Florida who weren’t interested – and now you’re afraid you’re cursed?

By extension, a baseball player who hasn’t gotten a hit in his first two at-bats must fear he’ll never get a hit again. An oncologist who has lost two patients to cancer must consider hanging up his scrubs. And someone who is unemployed and sent out two resumes without a response should pretty much resign himself to a lifetime of unemployment.

This is what I mean by your lack of perspective.

I’m not making fun of you – not at all! I’m a guy who had to ask out three people before he got a prom date; a guy who didn’t lose his virginity until his sophomore year in college; a guy who didn’t have a relationship over a year until he got married. This stuff doesn’t come naturally to lots of folks, which is precisely why I still have a job. And I am living proof that you can learn – with considerable practice – how to understand the opposite sex. Your problem is that you are more focused on having the opposite sex understand you.

This is very common (especially for women, who should reread that last sentence.)

Instead of hoping that the opposite sex suddenly starts appreciating you, your focus should be on understanding what the opposite sex finds attractive and making small steps to becoming that person.

A nice guy can still be nice and do well with women.

A strong woman can still be strong and do well with men.

But something fundamentally has to change in your attitude, Alex, in order to make a breakthrough.

For the sake of brevity, I’d recommend three things:

1) Drop the idea that you’re a failure. Nobody wants to buy a car from a salesman who doesn’t believe in his own product. Your insecurity and negativity and fear is all over you.

2) Find a few guy friends who are good with women. Hang around them. Take mental notes. I remember the first time I did this and realized that my friend – the rush chair of his fraternity – was so great with girls simply because he didn’t hit on any of them. He was like the mayor of the party – getting everyone drinks, dancing with everyone, making everyone laugh. He was so NOT concerned with what anyone thought because it was HIS place; he could do no wrong. Make the world your place, Alex, and women are going to want to hang out there.

3) Get used to failure. Thomas Edison tried 10,000 different ways before inventing the light bulb. Maybe he should have just stopped at 2 because he was “cursed”. Every successful person has failed at something. Most of us have failed a lot more than that.

And if you’re reading this and saying to yourself, “This makes sense, but HOW do I make these changes to develop more confidence and perspective?”, click here to learn more about my coaching. You’re probably a lot closer to success than you even realize. You just need a little push.

Good luck.

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Comments:

  1. 41
    hopethishelps

    1. I don’t think this post is “demanding.” It is specific. But I think it’s what successful male daters do unconciously. The more experience a male has dating, the more likely he has internalized these behaviors, and doesn’t even realize he does it. That is, I think that most successful male daters (which I define as several new dates every couple of months) do all of these things and more, but they wouldn’t be able to point to each behavior because it’s so internalized they don’t even know they do it.

    2. I don’t think women, as a group, are “fearful.” What we are, is more cautious. That’s genetic, it’s a survival response, and I’m the first one to say that most women don’t even recognize it as being there. But, if an inexperienced dating male doesn’t adequately compensate for the natural response, he’ll have a lot less luck dating. I think most males learn this by the time they are twenty (mostly by accident) but if you are not having good dating luck, this could be the problem. I’m not saying he’s intentionally coming on too strong, I’m saying he could be giving out inappropriate signals due to inexperience (for example, many men do not realize that the space above a woman’s head is generally part of her personal space, because men don’t generally have to worry about people above their heads). It’s not that the woman is “afraid” per se, it’s that something he’s doing makes her uncomfortable, and women who are uncomfortable are going to say no.

    3. Concerning the dating venue (for a first date). The point of a first date (IMVHO) is to see if you like a person well enough to go out with them again (and vice versa). While a person may have a good time at a concert, how does having a good time at a concert improve your knowledge of the other person and whether you would like to go out with them again?

    4. Concerning dressing up–I’m saying that dressing up can be a pain, and sometimes a woman will turn you down because she doesn’t feel like committing that much time (for whatever reason, only one of which is she isn’t interested in you personally). My point was to reduce the number of obstacles to a “yes” answer. Casual dress can be just as “enticing” as dress-up clothes, should you so choose.

    5. And finally, if I give a guy my number, I expect that he will ask me out if he calls (and that’s my preference as well). I think that’s the preference of most women (else why did you ask, and why did I give it?). I may not have made that clear. However, it really sounds like this guy is either approaching women he already knows, or is asking for a date instead of a phone number. Perhaps I read too much into it.

    I do think that asking a woman out that you chat up in a bar or grocery store (even if she gave you her phone number) is much more advanced than asking out someone whom you know a little bit about and can tailor the experience to. People don’t think about the fact that most of their early dates are with people from their high school or other nearby high schools–you have things in common if only teachers and detention, and you usually know who they are or you can ask around about them. You practice on people who are also inexperienced (or forgiving) and who can ask around about you. Women can be very unforgiving of what they see as a “juvenile” mistake. This guy may be a little late out of the gate, and may not yet be up to the advanced moves that someone who’s been dating regularly since 9th grade can do.

    “meeting up” with someone (if you can’t or don’t want to ask for a phone number on first acquaintance) doesn’t have to be “stalker” behavior (“Oh, I’m going to be there to, maybe we’ll see each other” and then a *short* interlude), but does permit increased familiarity (which decreases his anxiety too, by the way). Then you ask for the phone number.

  2. 42
    Karl R

    hopethishelps said: (#41)
    “I think that most successful male daters (which I define as several new dates every couple of months) do all of these things and more, but they wouldn’t be able to point to each behavior because it’s so internalized they don’t even know they do it.”

    I would say that these behaviors may be internalized, but they’re also situational. And I also think through some of your points differently than you do.

    If I want to ask a woman on a date to do something fun and unusual, I’ll need to do some internet research. Therefore I want to ask her for a phone number or e-mail address, so I can do my research and have a plan before calling her.

    Like most rules, a lot of yours can be broken. A few examples:
    1) Hygiene is important, but I once met a woman when I stopped for coffee on my way home from 3 hours of yoga. I left with her business card, an excuse to contact her, and a request from her that we “get together for coffee sometime.”
    2) I meet most women through social dancing, where I can expect to break the “touch barrier” immediately.
    3) A woman my age has a complete wardrobe, and doesn’t need to buy new clothes just for a date. However, I will frequently comment on how dressy a venue will be (and what I planning to wear), just to make it easier for her to decide what to wear.
    4) You can circumvent most familiarity/safety issues if someone the lady knows and trusts feels safe with you.

    For an inexperienced dater, I would simply recommend that they read as much dating advice as possible, and do everything that makes sense.

    1. 42.1
      mjdavid

      Karl

      You’ve mentioned dancing as a way to meet women in several of your post. I like most men don’t dance well. Most of us men don’t want to look stupid. I’ve been thinking of taking dancing lessons. Do you think it’s a good idea? and if yes what kind of dance?

      1. 42.1.1
        Karl R

        mjdavid said:
        “I like most men don’t dance well.”

        I didn’t either. If you have a sense of rhythm (about 10% of people don’t), you can learn to dance well. The big difference between someone who is a “natural” (which fortunately I am) and someone who is not is only the time and effort that it takes to achieve the same results.

        One of my friends is not a natural. It takes him about 3 to 4 times as long to learn as I do. Five days ago he and another friend won a citywide swing dance competition.

        “Most of us men don’t want to look stupid.”

        Neither do I. But if you stop worrying about it, you’ll be able to learn to dance faster.

        “I’ve been thinking of taking dancing lessons. Do you think it’s a good idea?”

        If you’re interested in learning to dance, absolutely.

        If you’re solely interested in meeting women, you might pick a hobby that you’ll enjoy more.

        One of my instructors (who is a national/international dance champion) said there were five things you needed in order to learn to dance well:
        1) group lessons
        2) practice
        3) private lessons
        4) practice
        5) practice
        And you can skip either the group lessons or the private lessons. (I’ve never taken a private lesson.)

        “if yes what kind of dance?”

        Start with style that’s easy to learn.
        East coast swing, foxtrot, polka, salsa, Texas two-step, etc.

        What kind of dancing is popular in your area?
        i.e. Texas two-step is not popular in Australia. Find something where you can go out and practice/dance on a regular basis.

        What kind of music do you like?
        If you prefer fast, up-tempo music, then foxtrot might not be the best choice.

        Find a local source of information
        If you’re in Houston, I can provide specifics. Otherwise, you’ll want someone who knows your city much better.

        If you know someone who dances regularly (and takes lessons, etc.), they will be able to provide insight into the local dance scene.

        If you’re ever out and see someone doing any type of partner dancing (and doing it exceptionally well), just go up and ask them where they learned, where they go to dance, etc. That’s how I initially found the studio I’m at. And I’ve answered the same questions dozens of times when out dancing.

        Dance studios can also answer some of these questions (where to go practice, what’s easy to learn). If they can’t answer these questions, it’s a sign that they don’t know what they’re doing.

  3. 43
    PHILLIP ROBBINS

    IT ‘S A WONDER NO ONE EVER TELLS ANYONE ABOUT THIS LITTLE TIDBIT I’M ABOUT TO SHARE. IF YOU THINK THERE’S NOT GIRLS OUT THERE NOT INTERESTED IN YOU THEN THINK AGAIN. THEY ARE BUT PROBABLY JUST AS SHY OR NOT WANTING TO BE TO FORWARD.
    WHATS THIS GUY TALKING ABOUT??????
    DO A GOOGLE SEARCH FOR WOMEN/GIRLS BODY LANGUAGE
    THERE ARE GIRLS OUT THERE BROADCASTING THEY LIKE YOU AND WONDERING WHY YOUR NOT PICKING UP ON THEIR SIGNALS THEIR SENDING YOU. HEY AND TO YOU GIRLS YES WE GUYS HAVE OUR ON BODY LANGUAGE ALSO THAT WE BROADCAST.
    YOU MAY BE SURPRISED AT HOW MANY ARE OUT THEIR SUBCONSCIECELY SAY THEIR INTERESTED IN YOU

  4. 44
    Rahim

    Damn guy, you launched on this poor dude like Mussolini from the mezzanine. The guy is young with limited experience… that pretty much sums up his problem. He doesn’t have an inferiority complex or a gonadal deficiency or a subconscious attachment to his mother. The man just needs to get out more. Brevity and simplicity are the hallmarks to all the best things in life, blog posts included.

    1. 44.1
      PHIL ROBBINS

      YEH, BUT SOMETIMES KNOWLEDGE IS POWER ,AND WITHOUT THAT KNOWLEDGE ONE IS CLUELESS,DAZZED,AND CONFUSED. I AGREE HE SHOULD GET OUT THERE BUT WHEN YOUR UNSURE OF EVERYTHING YOU DO IT HINDERS YOU GREATLY. BELIEVE ME I KNOW BECAUSE I WAS MUCH LIKE HIM WHEN I WAS A TEEN MANY MANY MOONS AGO LOL LOL .
      STOP AND THINK ABOUT IT IF YOU SAW BODY LANGUAGE OF A GIRL (THAT IS AFTER FINDING OUT WHAT THEY ARE ) THAT EITHER SAYS I’M INTERESTED OR (AND THERE ARE THOSE SIGNALS THAT SAYS STAY AWAY DON’T CARE TO KNOW YOU ALSO .
      WOULD THAT GUY OR GIRL BE ALITTLE MORE OPTOMISTIC ABOUT APPROACHING THAT PERSON TO BREAK THE ICE SO TO SPEAK?
      JUST A THOUGHT

  5. 45
    stephen mosher

    my name is stephen mosher, and I have asked lots of women out and   and am sort of a bad boy at times but over all a nice guy the thing is that I have asked women out for years and all have said no I dont understand,   I tryed every thing you can think of and sadly enough Im afraid   that as good as a coach as you are, their are some of us that will be doomed to walk the earth alone forever. and never know what it is like too know love.

  6. 46
    Mickey

    Stephen #48: Well stated; I know the feeling.

  7. 47
    Mickey

    Evan said:
    “In short, nice guys have to grow a set of balls.”
    That’s all well and good. But when the next man-hating feminazi kicks the guy right into those newly grown balls, then what???

    1. 47.1
      Nathalie

      There are man loving anti-feminazis out there. Just don’t date a feminazi. 😉

  8. 48
    Adam

    One thing you have to keep in mind, something that not surprisingly, nobody else has mentioned because it is SO politically incorrect, is most women are disgusted and turned off by older male virgins. It isn’t something they can always verbalize, but nearly all of them feel this way deep down inside. So be sure to hide this fact from them. If you are asked directly, lie. Don’t argue with me, you need to lie to them. Once you have slept with several girls, you can then tell the truth. But don’t tell the truth before then. More often than not, if a girl hears this, she will leave immediately. It is almost like telling her you have an incurable STD but FAR worse.

    1. 48.1
      Nathalie

      That is not true at all. As a woman, I actually prefer someone with little baggage. If a woman has a problem with that, then that person is just not for you. I’ve dated in and out for a couple of years, and something that is REALLY important to me is to wait a while before I actually sleep with someone. Why? Because the first person I did it with, I didn’t get to know him well enough before doing it, and after a year, we broke up. it left me devastated and hurt. Lesson learned for me. You know what? A lot of men didn’t call back after that first date, because I wouldn’t sleep with them. Or they would insult me and belittle me for trying to do such a thing. People have told me I’m crazy. But it’s what I want. I want to get to know someone well before I go to bed with them. And now, I’ve met someone who respects my idea, he supports it, because he also wants something special. So, in a nutshell, there’s someone out there who will embrace who you are, even if you’re a 40 year old virgin or whatever.

      1. 48.1.1
        Adam

        Look Nathalie, I am sure you are a nice person and mean well. You are right to feel the way you do and to not jump into bed on the first date. Nobody should ridicule you for this. It is good that you found a man that respects and treasures you. That is great.

        Now having said that, when I was an older male virgin, years ago, I just never ran into a woman that accepted this or was willing to deal with this. I am not saying that there was no woman nowhere who would be OK with this. I am simply saying that the overwhelming number of women didn’t. I personally never found a woman that did. That is my own experience and the experience of countless men who were in the same position. Please don’t misunderstand the tone of my comment, I am not anger or bitter at all. It is just a fact of life. Like men have total turn off deal breakers with women, women have total turn off dealbreakers when it comes to men. And whatever deal breakers a person has are OK. And having said that, women overwhelmingly consider men with relatively little dating experience / virgins a total and utter turn off. Perhaps you don’t, but out of all my female friends and all their friends, perhaps one or two don’t and they are already in relationships.

  9. 49
    mikesommers14

    I’m always amused by the suggestion to “not take it personally” when somebody rejects you. How could you NOT take it personally? A person rejecting you is basically saying you’re not good enough for them to spend their time with. That hurts and I don’t see how anybody could not take it personally.

    1. 49.1
      Nathalie

      Because at the end of the day, that person doesn’t realize what they’re passing on. Just move on. Do not let rejection get to you. Everyone suffers through rejection. But part of having confidence is knowing who you are, loving yourself so that if you are rejected, you can brush it off and say “NEXT”. Don’t let rejection hurt you. It’s not you.

  10. 50
    judy

    Mikesommers 14 – 49

    That was fascinating reading.   Maybe   in answer to “A person rejecting you is basically saying you’re not good enough for them to spend their time with” you could try this  .

    You are maybe a really good guy and will make someone happy.   For this or that reason (nothing PERSONAL) I know that we will not make a good couple.

    Two men in my life whom I dated.   Both of them were extremely successful in their professional and social lives.   Both of them suffered from, wait for it, shyness, despite being in the public arena on a massive scale.

    They were both incredibly attractive, intellectual, well groomed, etc.   True Super Alpha males.   High achievers – high salaries.

    Why I did not wish to continue the relationship with either of them? They had an extremely high profile lifestyle (as in cameras flashing, constant television exposure, interviews etc.) and I would have been part of this.   I would not have coped and told them this.

    One of them did take my remark very personally and sulked for ages.   The other remained polite and distinguished.

    Out of the two of them, the one whom I regretted the most was the one who remained polite and distinguished and if life threw me in his pathway again, I would still be able to go up to him and say, “hey.   You’re still a great guy”.

  11. 51
    Nathalie

    As a woman, your advice is SPOT ON. Guys think that being nice is the reason they’re being dumped. No, it’s not. And actually, most guys that say they’re nice really aren’t, and that’s also why they get dumped. Women do actually want a nice guy. I will always go for the guy who treats me well and forgo the hot bad boy, because I do not care for the baggage. But the guys I’ve dated have usually been guys that aside from being nice have confidence, they know what they want, and they take the lead. I’ll make decisions with you, I’m cool with that, but I do not like guys that cannot take that lead and be the hero that I’d like them to be. Also, having vision for your life is so important. Women dig men who have vision.

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