(Video) The Reason You Attract Men Who Treat You Poorly

(Video) The Reason You Attract Men Who Treat You Poorly, ~Contact.FirstName~.
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At this point I hope you’ve had the chance to read the Love U Pyramid of Love.

Many of you wrote back to tell me how much those lessons resonated – and how painful it is to look back at all the crap you’ve put up with from men.

But there’s a big difference between realizing you’ve acted insecure in the past and understanding how to correct that behavior in the future.

That’s what I’m here for.

And what I love about my readers is that you are not shy about asking me to address what’s on your mind the most: how to identify good men and get rid of bad ones. Recent emails to me include:

  • How do you decipher the men that are looking for a real relationship vs. the ones looking for a one-night stand?
  • How can I be sure the man that comes on strong is a man is not a player and wants to build a relationship?
  • Why didn’t he felt connected with me since he showed signs of being in love?
  • What makes men commit to some women and not others?
  • How do you know when you’ve met the “right” guy?

Believe it or not, there are answers to all of these questions – and I’m going to share them shortly.

But I’ve gotta tell you: as a dating coach, I probably do the same thing that you do every day: observe common patterns and try to make sense of them.

Doctors do this. Lawyers do this. Finance people do this. Teachers do this. Dog trainers do this. We look for behavioral patterns and adjust to them.

Tell me if this pattern sounds familiar to you:

You fall for a guy based on chemistry and common interests.

He makes a great effort to charm you, seduce you, and win you over.

You get your hopes up.

You let down your guard.

You fall in love.

You later discover that he is selfish, abusive, critical, or unwilling to make a long-term commitment.

And while it seems obvious that you should let him go, you end up staying because it’s so rare for you to find such a unique and powerful connection with a man.

The longer you stay, the sadder you get, the more time you waste, and the more you convince yourself that it’s impossible to find true love.

The problem is that you don’t want to give up.

You don’t want to be alone for the rest of your life.

You want to live happily ever after.

You want to know the answer to one vital question that will determine your future:

“How can I attract better men and get the long-term relationship I deserve?”

As I said in the Love U Pyramid of Love, before we can talk about finding a husband, I think it’s valuable to walk through a few of the steps that come before marriage.

  •       Confidence
  •       Meeting Men
  •       Dating
  •       Understanding Men
  •       Relationships
  •       Commitment

That’s a lot of stuff – and you don’t have to figure it all out right away.

Today, in advance of my big Love U launch next week, I’m going to continue your free education with a video that answers 3 common dating questions centering on confidence:

How can I make a man feel needed without being “needy”?

Why don’t I ever meet any quality men?

Why do I always seem to attract unavailable guys who treat me poorly?

I’m especially excited to share the first tip about being needy. It points out what you’ve already observed in men:

If a guy is too aloof, it’s hard to feel emotionally connected to him.

If a guy is too needy, it makes you want to run away with him.

So the best way to create true intimacy – for both men and women – is by being VULNERABLE.

So the best way to create true intimacy – for both men and women – is by being VULNERABLE.

Click here to watch the video, and when you’re done, please share your biggest takeaways in the comments section below. Thanks a million.

By the way, you’ll notice there are 3 Relationship Tips that are visible but greyed out.

Patience, grasshopper.

Those will be revealed to you in a few days once you’ve had a chance to process these.

Warmest wishes and much love,

Your friend,

Evan

P.S. You want to know if this Love U stuff works? Ask Jules.

Evan, I want to thank you SO much for everything that you do. I really believe that it was a driving force behind me having the relationship that I’ve always wanted. I was divorced, never dated much before, and read your “Why He Disappeared” eBook in one sitting. It really changed things for me. I finally understood why that guy I went out with on 3 amazing dates never called me again, I finally understood why that guy I had been texting for over 1 month never asked me out. But here is my favorite part, I STOPPED GETTING UPSET ABOUT IT. Okay, I was a little hurt, but not like I was before, and I didn’t let it stop me or hold me back because I KNEW there was going to be another guy out there.

Also, I stopped trying to lead the relationship. I finally learned to let go, stop being SO invested in every single date and started to have fun with dating. I’m being honest when I say I had TONS of fun dating. I learned to focus on being playful, just having a great conversation with a man, and stopped appearing so desperate.

That’s when he found me. The love of my life. All it took was a few email exchanges on an online dating website, and before I met him I made a conscious choice to try to be myself; this meant I did not get super dolled up for our brunch date but went looking “cute” and friendly and open. He was not my type at all. He was the same culture and religion as me, which I told myself I would never do, and he was not my type physically at all. But this time was different. I decided to focus on how he made me feel and give it a chance. And let me tell you, he makes me feel like no other man has ever made me feel. Safe, wanted, loved, cared for, special, funny, desired. What I also realized is that when I am being completely and utterly myself (like the way I am with a best friend; nothing to hide, nothing to be ashamed of, nothing to be fake about), he is even more crazy about me.

He always told me when we were first dating that he thought I was a “cool girl” and let me tell you, it took a while for me to get there!! I was a nervous girl, a not so confident-don’t know-what I’m doing-girl, but you gave me confidence, Evan. I knew that I should focus on the way he makes me feel and I should focus on making him feel good too (quizzing him on our 3rd date on whether he wants to ever get married would NOT make him feel good, so I didn’t do that, asking him why he didn’t call me one or two days out of the week when he called every other day was NOT going to make him feel good, so I didn’t do that either).

I also learned that it is OKAY for a woman to say what she wants or is important to her in a matter of fact way, and the guy can either take it or leave it. If the man cannot or does not want to provide that, it is up to the woman to decide if she still wants to be with him. After 2 years of dating. I dropped a “hint” and sent him a picture of a ring and told him should he ever consider it in the future, that was my style. A few months later he proposed with that exact same style of ring I sent him. We are getting married on a beach in about 2 weeks now, and I wanted to thank you again for all the work you do. It truly, really, makes a difference. It helped me become the woman I wanted to be (and always knew I could be) in a relationship; confident, open, giving and receiving.

THANK YOU EVAN!!!

-Jules

P.P.S. You’ll notice one of the video tips echoes the same advice as my Pyramid of Love. That’s intentional. Repetition of core ideas is essential for your learning and I really want you to get clear on one key concept: you don’t actually attract bad men!

Click here to get three priceless dating tips that will bring out your best when you meet men.

 

Join our conversation (447 Comments).
Click Here To Leave Your Comment Below.

Comments:

  1. 61
    Yet Another Guy

    @Mike

    You should take time to read about the “cad” and “dad” mating strategies.  Jeremy brought it to my attention by referring to me as a “cad.”  I did not quite understand what he was driving at at that point in time, but he is a very well-read guy who has clearly spent a lot time studying social dynamics as they apply to relationships.  Online dating is a definitely a venue where cads dominate the show, well, at least, until women realize that cads will always be cads.  That is when they turn to guys like Evan who convince them to consider dads if they want a relationship with a guy who will commit.  The reality is that unmarried  guys who are over the age of 35, attractive enough to be in the top 20%, and have something going for them have probably enjoyed the life of a cad.   That is why they are still single.

  2. 62
    Mike

    @YAG:

     

    The big point of where I disagree with you is in your “Top 20%” concept. You seem to believe that being in the top 20% in looks/career/income [whatever *that* means] is about enough for the woman to feel attraction and chemistry with you–and that the reason why many more guys are successful meeting women off-line is that they can compensate for whatever was keeping them out of the “Top 20%”. And I can tell you that being “Top 20%” doesn’t matter much. It isn’t sufficient NOR is it necessary. If you do OLD it *does* give you an edge in getting her to write you back, but that is about it.

    I don’t know of how many examples you need to see of a woman happily dating her coworker or someone who was a friend of a friend who seems to be “nothing special”, this despite being able to go online and get the attention of plenty of men who are far more impressive on paper. Meanwhile from my own experience: On the one hand I was the guy she was attracted to despite her meeting others who, to the best of my knowledge anyway, made far more money than I did. AND on the other hand I was also the guy who couldn’t get a second date with a woman whose last partner had seemingly far less on paper going for him than I did. In the former case, we connected. In the latter case we did not.

    1. 62.1
      Yet Another Guy

      @Mike

      Once again, you proved my point about compensating attributes. I do not know about you, but I would not want to be with a woman who chose me because of compensating attributes. That is settling on her part.

      I completely disagree with your assertion that a woman can feel physical attraction for a guy who gained her attention via compensating attributes. She may be attracted him, but it is not the same visceral, gina tingling attraction that a woman feels when she is very physically attracted to a man. It is not remotely close. The rules get thrown out the window. A woman for whom a guy used compensating attributes to gain her attention will literally give herself away to a man who induces visceral, gina tingling physical attraction. I know because I have experienced it so many times in my lifetime that it no longer fazes me.

      I also disagree with your assertion that being in the top 20% is not enough for a woman to feel attraction or chemistry in person. Love is a conscious choice, but physical attraction and chemistry are primal in nature (you really need to read about cads and dads). What makes a guy be in the top 20% of men with respect to physical attraction is that he exhibits all of the markers of being superior breeding stock (signs of having high testosterone, taller than average, broad shoulders, narrow waist, a full head of hair, good facial symmetry …). Status has nothing to do with being in the top 20% of men on a dating site because status is a compensating attribute. A guy can be physically unattractive and have high status (i.e., status is a “dad” attribute). What makes men and women physically attractive are outward physical signs of good breeding fitness. It is the reason why older men are drawn to younger women, and why older women who are fit and look young for their age do better than older women who look their age or older. Physical attraction and physical chemistry are primal trigger driven.

  3. 63
    Lynx

    Aside: Fascinating reading, love being a fly on the wall listening to dudes debate relationships. Thanks, friends! 

  4. 64
    Tron Swanson

    “Tron, you are conflating so many things.  Women aren’t saying that men need them to be doing emotional labour, they’re saying they ARE doing it.”

    They’re actually saying both, depending on the situation. And I’m saying that, whether it’s women or men claiming to do it, it’s just taking melodramatic relationship drama and trying to dress it up as some mature and necessary activity. At best, you’re playing along with an idea, and at worst, you actually believe it. It’s kind of like the Empress’ new clothes…a whole bunch of women may be copying her style, and men may wear invisible outfits to show their solidarity and allyship, but if no one can see them, do they really matter? Personally, I try to ask for physical things from people, because then I can tell whether or not they’ve done them. “emotional labor” has to take place in the mind, so anyone can claim to be doing it…

    As for your wife’s hectic schedule and all the time and effort involved–well, I’ll say what would be said to any man who complained about child-support. If she didn’t want to deal with it, she shouldn’t have had sex. When you reproduce, consequences ensue. You don’t get credit for dealing with those consequences…that’s the minimum expectation.

    1. 64.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      Your lack of empathy is astounding, Tron.

  5. 65
    Noone45

    “While that situation occurs, it is very rare. There are more men with women who have nothing going for them vice versa. ”

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH….hold on gotta breathe…HAHAHAHAHAHA

    Do you know how many ain’t shit men are out there getting laid? Most of them. Men with no jobs, men on drugs, drunk men, abusive men, etc. Hell, you can just go look up the orgasm gap, many men aren’t even good in bed apparently – women still sleep with them. Ain’t shitness is not a barrier to getting laid cause trust me, I see so many women out in the world who are with worse-than-useless dolts. But I don’t live in Evan’s world, or yours for that matter. I live in a lower-middle-class army dominated exurb in the southeast US. I see so many women with jobless, fat, unattractive men who do little most than sit around playing video games. You’re lucky if these sloths will take out the trash. These women support these idiots. I wish I was joking.

    Evan’s advice is good for a certain kind of woman, but most of these women I see out here are settling for something awful. I wish these women were as picky as you claim they are.

  6. 66
    Marika

    YAG

    There are women who struggle with relationships and those who don’t. I have numerous friends who were always attracted to and married nice men who treated them well.

    Those women are not on your radar and not on this blog. But they exist.

    Of the women who struggle, there are those who (like you see), struggle because they are trying to get men with money and looks and charm to commit who don’t want to commit, or don’t want to commit to them.

    Some of us have different struggles. I can honestly say I’m not attracted to money. I’m also not that into classically good looking men. There’s a personality type which gets me going, a combination of cockiness, charm, humour and vulnerability. It’s not necessarily good for me, but it’s not that these guys fit into some objective ‘top 20%’.

    Even amongst those women going for the rich guys, not all of them will find the same type attractive appearance-wise. Some like darker complexions, some blondies. Some like ’em lanky, some not. etc etc etc etc

  7. 67
    Marika

    So what’s the deal, then, YAG? You want women who find you viscerally attractive; you meet women who find you viscerally attractive. You’re certainly not here to learn or listen as most of your comments are you arguing over and over again how right you are.

    You’ve got it all sorted, you know everything and you’re getting what you want. Congratulations, you don’t need this blog!

  8. 68
    Mrs Happy

    Tron,

    Your ideas above about make-believe work are interesting, a point of view worth considering.  It is hard to appreciate work we don’t observe being done, and work we don’t value.

    People who don’t value emotional connections or understand feeling states, such as people with autism or sociopathy, will find it hard to appreciate emotional labour, because emotional connections, emotional work, are of little worth to them.

    I don’t like the term “emotional labour” unless it describes actual emotional work, and I believe often it instead describes and becomes conflated with practical and mental tasks.  For example, I think planning meals, organising different childrens’ activities and social events, signing school notes, checking/helping with homework, picking up your husband’s shirts from the dry cleaner…. they’re not emotional tasks for the most part, they’re practical and mental jobs that have to be done by someone, and they are largely done by mothers and wives.

    Men on this site write that what they want from a girlfriend/wife isn’t her career progression, income, assets, success, or confident attitude, what they want, is what they cannot get from male colleagues, mates, and their workplace – tender care.  (Also, sex.)  They want their girlfriend to be sweet, to caringly comfort them at the end of a hard week, to make their needs and emotional state a priority.   That requires emotional work from the female partner.

    Not everyone experiences this as a child, but a lot of what a good, present mother does for a baby, infant, child, is emotional work.  Without this, the child grows into an emotionally disadvantaged adult, who can’t develop healthy relationships with others, who isn’t secure.  Check out how kids from orphanages fare, how foster children passed around different places grow up – it’s horrifying.  A lack of emotional labour done on your behalf during your first decade is catastrophic.  For people who don’t understand what emotional labour looks like, Naomi Stadlen’s books are educational re this (‘What mothers do – especially when it looks like nothing’, and ‘How mothers love – and how relationships are born’).

  9. 69
    jo

    Jeremy, I think the reason you and Tron think on different levels re: ’emotional labour’ is because you think of it in terms of taking care of kids (at least, that is the only context you wrote about it), while Tron is not even thinking about kids, but in terms of just the relationship between the man and the woman. Tron seems to be saying that he would rather not have the woman do emotional labour on him, which is fair. Mature adults should know how to take care of themselves emotionally, although most people do better with caring partners and some friends.

    To me, it seems that many of the disagreements that crop up in this particular thread have to do with conflating *relationships* with *families* that include children. The people who don’t have kids are arguing one set of things, while the people who do have kids are arguing something different. I’m guessing that must make Evan’s job pretty difficult, since it must be implicit what a woman asking him for advice wants – is it just the relationship, or does it include kids in the future. From everything I have seen and read, kids change the entire picture. But it’s not something every woman wants.

  10. 70
    Lynx

    @jo: “To me, it seems that many of the disagreements that crop up in this particular thread have to do with conflating *relationships* with *families* that include children. The people who don’t have kids are arguing one set of things, while the people who do have kids are arguing something different.”

    Agreed. Although, while not everyone reading this blog has/wants children, we all were once children ourselves and our parents’ attitudes have bearing on our relationship issues today. On another post, it came up that several of us had challenging parent/child relationships, and layering this discussion onto that one, I wonder if those challenges were in part due to parents fumbling with emotional labor (essentially, by pushing that labor onto their children).

    @Tron: “When you reproduce consequences ensue.” Yes, and there is a vast range of how well parents shoulder the load, from abysmal to stellar. Why shouldn’t parents who perform the job well get credit?

     

  11. 71
    Emily, to

    Mariks,
     There’s a personality type which gets me going, a combination of cockiness, charm, humour and vulnerability. It’s not necessarily good for me, but it’s not that these guys fit into some objective ‘top 20%’. …
    Even amongst those women going for the rich guys, not all of them will find the same type attractive appearance-wise. Some like darker complexions, some blondies. Some like ’em lanky, some not. etc etc 
    You’ve been doing too much break dancing  and are maybe a bit light-headed. You know women are wildly, uncontrollably attracted to ANY member of the top 20%. The bottom 80%? Blech. If that’s all we can get, we give up sex altogether and join the women’s movement.

  12. 72
    Tron Swanson

    Evan,

    You could very well be right, re: my lack of empathy, but what bugs me about this part of the issue is the lack of consistency. Let’s use children as an example: people should either get credit for taking care of their kids or not. Whether it’s a mother with an insane schedule or a father who arguably has to overpay in child-support, either they should both be told not to complain, or their complaining should result in both of them being praised by others for their hard work. None of this “One group is vilified, one group is lionized” stuff, because they’re both doing the same thing. Personally, I think that taking care of one’s children is the bare minimum, and neither gender should get too much credit for it.

    Mrs Happy,

    Thank you, that’s one of the best replies I’ve seen in this thread. You did a masterful job of throwing subtle shade my way–implying that I’m autistic or a sociopath, and that I had some sort of damaged childhood. You really should have thrown Asperger’s in, too, just to cover all the bases. (For the record, I’ve strategically avoided therapy all my life, so I’m safely undiagnosed.) But, no, I’m not being sarcastic, you bring up great points. Men do indeed tend to want comfort and other stereotypically-feminine things from their significant others, so it would seem to be hypocritical to turn around and criticize women for providing them. But are those basic parts of a relationship really “emotional labor”? To me, those things aren’t work, they’re passion. Or they should be. When I was in love, the emotional stuff never felt like work, it came extremely easily. (Being monogamous, on the other hand…!) Maybe I’m misinformed, but the definitions of “emotional labor” that I’ve seen have had more to do with the advanced, interpersonal stuff, and not basic human feelings. If someone thinks that caring for the person they love is work, they’re more of a sociopath than I’ll ever be.

    It could very well be that I’m wrong–that emotional labor is sometimes real–but that women commonly take drama and try to dress it up as emotional labor, to make their various freakouts seem more meaningful and intellectual than they actually are. “No, I’m not being unreasonable! This is something we need to talk about, it’s very important, and I’ve been working hard on it…” It kind of reminds me of that J-Law scene in American Hustle, where she blows up the microwave and then gives herself the credit for protecting her family from “unsafe food.” “Thank god for me!” Create a problem, swoop in and solve it, and then claim to be the hero. It’s the oldest trick in the book…

    1. 72.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      Tron, I hear your point of view. I would normally let other people explain why you’ve created a false equivalence here but I feel I have to do it myself.

      a. Fathers who financially support their children are doing their jobs. They are not heroes.
      b. Parents (not just mothers) who take care of their children are doing their jobs. They are not heroes.

      That much you’ve got right. Here’s where it goes off the rails:

      Both parents chose to have kids.
      Both parents work for a living.
      Both parents come home at 6 after a hard day making money.
      And, in general, women do 90% of the household/childrearing despite the fact that they are co-parents who both have day jobs.

      THAT is emotional labor. The disproportional costs borne by women to run a household – cooking dinner, kids’ doctor’s appointments, lunches, homework, putting away toys, managing the schedules, the social plans, the plumber – while the guy pretty much puts his feet up after work and feels like a hero if he does the dishes and takes out the garbage.

      To deny this – as you’ve repeatedly attempted to do – is pretty much the equivalent of gaslighting. You’re denying a common reality that may not apply to EVERY couple but sure applies to a LOT of them. Thus, the term “emotional labor”. She has her day job as an ad exec or nutritionist and then comes home for her second job caring for her two kids and husband.

      I should know: I’m one of those husbands and I’m always trying to figure out how to lighten my stay at home wife’s load. Most men never even consider this because they feel like you: it’s her JOB. No, it’s not. It’s a combined job and yet most of the weight falls on women – whether you acknowledge this or not.

  13. 73
    Mike

    Lynx # 63: Yeah I do feel a little strange having a debate here with all you present..it feels like having a conversation about ‘what someone wants’ when that person is standing right there in front of us! Anyway I am only talking from my experience has someone who has experienced both success and frustration dating. Of course you and everyone here are certainly free to say from your experience if one or both of us is right or off-base.

    YAG #62.1 and #61:

    They–the things I mentioned–are not “compensating attributes” though, they are instead the main things.

    Meanwhile if anything I think you have the “cads” and “dads” thing somewhat backwards. [For those who aren’t familiar, the manosphere likes to divide men who have at least some success with dating women into two categories–“cads” and “dads”. A “cad” is the type of guy a woman longs for, except he is hard to pin down. A “dad” is the type of guy a woman may end up marrying because he is a safe choice–devoted to her, decent career, nice guy, and he seems like he’d make a good husband and father.  The idea is that a woman may marry the “dad” but she will always long for the “cad”, and so of course men are encouraged to be “cads” and not “dads”. ] In fact, most “cads” you speak of are not anything close to “top 20%” men as you described. At least not the ones that I know of. It is instead these “top 20%” men you speak of are more likely to be the type of guy women will settle down with because he makes good “husband” material–can finance a good lifestyle and she looks good on his arm.

    As a man, I would MUCH rather be with a woman who is drawn to me because of my personality and because we have great chemistry together, as opposed to a woman who wants to settle down with me because she sees me as a “top 20%” man your definition. I could NOT do the latter–too much self-respect and I would rather stay single my whole life instead.

     

  14. 74
    Mariks

    Haha Emily-The-Only-Forever. You got me! I’ll come clean to YAG – the entire female population did meet to divide the entire male population into hot (20%) or not (80%). It was hard with time differences, language barriers, abject poverty and more-important-things-to-worry-about in the mix, but once we got together it only took 5 mins, as everyone knows women all think the same….

    I wrote a funny, heartwarming comment on the other thread about Easter, break dancing, not being able to compete with Adrian’s dirty birdness, and my mother always doing her best to make me feel loved. It didn’t come through for some reason. I’ll bring it up in person at the next big meeting. I’m pretty sure the next big agenda item is Men Who’ve Never Had a Relationship are Clearly Experts on whether there’s Any Such Thing As Emotional Labour.

  15. 75
    Mike

    And @YAG….if you *really* want to go down the rabbit hole, when some women *do* cheat,  the “cad” that they cheat with–as in the guy they get with even though they (both) know it is wrong but they can’t stop because the chemistry and connection is so strong, is often someone who is actually a dad  in that he has his own family too. And he is a very often “dad” in your sense of the word in that he isn’t all that impressive on paper–he is very often a coworker of hers who doesn’t earn more money e.g., a fellow teacher at the school they both work at. And the genesis of the affair was very often because they opened up to each other about their struggles with their marriages and families, NOT because he serenaded her with stories of all his adventures.

    Wait, so does this mean that the “cad” was really the “dad” all along? Who can possibly tell! It’s all a big bowl of spaghetti!

  16. 76
    Marika

    Mike said: “Wait, so does this mean that the “cad” was really the “dad” all along? Who can possibly tell! It’s all a big bowl of spaghetti!”

    You raise an excellent point. And YAG knows it better than anyone, as he was a “dad” to his own kids, going without sex for years to give them a stable home. The groups can’t be as discrete and clear cut as he claims.

  17. 77
    Jeremy

    The cad/dad thing was never intended for use this way.  It is a descriptor of evolutionary reproductive strategies.  In the complex tapestry of modern life, in the warp and weft of psychology and culture, it’s like describing a single thread as representative of the total.  Erroneous, over-simplified.  It’s much like the concept of hypergamy – sure, it exists.  Sure, for some women it makes up a large part of why they do what they do…but for others it does not.  Because for those others, that one thread in the tapestry might be of insignificant value compared to all the other threads that make up the overall picture.  The point of it is to understand where some of our modern algorithms come from, not to extrapolate all motivations from one algorithm.

     

    BTW, the cad/dad descriptors were not based on any particular trait of the male, but rather on whether he intended to stick around after the sex to help raise the offspring.  This is why I referred to you as “cad,” YAG, because you make public your disinterest in commitment.  And that is why I referred to myself as a “dad,” because I have always been drawn to commit and become emotionally attached, never been interested in hit-and-runs.

  18. 78
    Noone45

    “People who don’t value emotional connections or understand feeling states, such as people with autism or sociopathy,”

    Yuck, what ablist trash. All you had to do was google “Autism empathy” and look at the top article to find out how wrong you were and you couldn’t even do that.

  19. 79
    Tom10

    @ Evan #72.1
    “Both parents chose to have kids.
    Both parents work for a living.
    Both parents come home at 6 after a hard day making money.
    And, in general, women do 90% of the household/childrearing despite the fact that they are co-parents who both have day jobs.
    THAT is emotional labor. The disproportional costs borne by women to run a household – cooking dinner, kids’ doctor’s appointments, lunches, homework, putting away toys, managing the schedules, the social plans, the plumber – while the guy pretty much puts his feet up after work and feels like a hero if he does the dishes and takes out the garbage”

    It is indeed true that women make unique emotional contributions to relationships which you’ve eloquently outlined Evan, and men would do well to recognize; however, I think you’ve omitted the unique emotional labor, or “the disproportional costs” borne by men to run a household:

    – Avoiding drugs/alcohol/playing video games/porn/cocaine/womanizing/prostitution/__________fill in the blank addiction is more difficult, in my opinion, on average, for men than women: living a clean healthy life is real male emotional labor.
    – Monogamy, as Tron pointed out, is more difficult, in my opinion, on average, for men than women: giving up sex with randos/not cheating, ever, is real male emotional labor.
    – Establishing a career, buying a house etc, with the goal of marriage comes, in my opinion, less naturally to men than women; therefore, making oneself marriage-material is real male emotional labor.
    – Commitment, real commitment, as in life commitment/marriage: now THAT’s the ultimate in male emotional labor. Indeed, it’s the existential purpose of why this blog exists and why we’re all here: learning how to inspire men to do the heavy lifting and do the real male emotional labor.

    For some guys, like Jeremy, all of the above comes naturally. However, in my opinion, for most of us it doesn’t; we have to work at it. Really work at it. And some guys, like Tron, just don’t want to do it. Which is fine. But we should recognize the efforts of those, like you, who do.

    It’s much easier for men to simply opt out of relationships and just indulge in our vices: it takes heavy-lifting to do the work to stay involved. And we should recognize that work. Unfortunately, as a society, for whatever reason, we don’t really. Which is why, I guess, some choose to opt out. Why work so hard for no thanks?

    In reality, both parties bring something to the table in all relationships: otherwise, well, there wouldn’t be a relationship. There’s always an equal reciprocal benefit, somewhere, that each party receives that they just can’t, or won’t, recognize.

    1. 79.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      Tom, I think you’re a valued commenter but I think that your answer is pretty weak sauce. If two of your big selling points for men are NOT A CHEATER and NOT AN ALCOHOLIC, you’ve lowered the bar pretty far for “decent” men. The fact is that men get a LOT out of marriage. That’s why they volunteer to do it. I GLADLY forgo being free to sleep around for the ULTIMATE in freedom – the freedom to be myself, to be loved, to be supported emotionally, to have a best friend and companion, and yes, good sex as well. Ask a HAPPILY married person if they’d rather be single and you’ll never find one person to say yes. Ask a happily single person if they’d be happier if they were in love, and most people would get married in a snap. So stop with this thing like marriage is SUCH a sacrifice for men. Men are really disconnected, really lonely, really bad at maintaining friendships, and think they have to go through the world alone. It’s not true. A good marriage solves that. But most men STILL don’t get that and remain terrible husbands and communicators. Which is why women initiate 2/3 of divorces. And yet men want to get remarried 65% of the time, while women want to get remarried less than half the time. Marriage is VERY good for men.

      Every relationship requires some massaging. Most people – men and women – are not great partners. That’s why I encourage you to choose wisely – find someone cool, happy, accepting and giving – and realize that it’s so much better to have a loved one than to fly solo. That’s why people keep coming back to it – no matter what MGTOWs continue to suggest.

    2. 79.2
      S.

      @Tom

      I had to respond because this made me smile somehow. So men just showing up for a relationship and being a relationship partner is their contribution to emotional labor? Because men are less inclined this is hard work for them.

      LOL.

      That assumes it’s easier for all women or even most women. If it was that easy for women, Evan wouldn’t be as successful. Unless the main problem for women with relationships is that men are less likely to want a relationship. I wouldn’t paint all men with such a broad stroke, though.

      Establishing a career, buying a house etc, with the goal of marriage comes, in my opinion, less naturally to men than women; therefore, making oneself marriage-material is real male emotional labor.

      Women have to do this too. And it’s not “less natural”. We all want homes and fulfilling work. AND women do the other work. Women do both. That’s the point.

      There is this weird thing where it starts to sound like, all single women want a relationship and we’re just lucky if a man does the bare minimum of emotional work (which women are also doing) to be in one.

      Nah.

  20. 80
    Adrian

    Hi Evan,

    You said, “Men are really disconnected, really lonely, really bad at maintaining friendships, and think they have to go through the world alone. It’s not true. A good marriage solves that.”

    This seems so wrong to me! It’s like these type of guys are dumping so much on a woman. Shouldn’t we consider a person (male or female) like this a BIG red flag?

    Would it be wrong for me (or anyone of either gender) to require a potential new partner to have some level of a social life (real not online), some level of activity or hobbies that require them to get out of their home and interact with people, and have at least 3 or more real friends that they meetup with or call at least a few times a month? It sounds extreme but a lonely, friendless person seems like such an emotional, mental, and physical drain on any partner-a.k.a needy.

    I mean if one of your clients said she just met a great guy who does everything you preach a good guy does, and they have the 7 chemistry 10 compatibility BUT he has no friends, no activities/hobbies, or anything that gives him something to connect to beside his job; would you advise her to next him or would you tell her to continue seeing him?

    …   …   …

    I know a lot of times many of us hold on to “potential” and turn a blind eye to the negatives because of a scarcity mentality when we think we found someone with mutual attraction and compatibility. Since you’re the professional and you are wiser than me I’m trying to understand the “why” of what you advise.

    1. 80.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      Not sure what you’re talking about here, Adrian. Maybe it’s a function of your age, but the world isn’t THAT black and white. Nowhere did I advocate that men or women date someone who doesn’t have a life. What I am pointing out – which you may not be privy to in your late 20’s/early 30’s – is that if you’re a 50 year old divorced man, your world is usually working, paying alimony and child support, and trying to find someone (male or female) to spend time with. Your married friends don’t have much bandwidth for a single guy so it’s a lot of trying to fill up time. The percentage of middle aged men with robust hobbies and a bunch of actively close friends has to hover below 25%. These are not losers. They are just normal men.

      You may not understand, you may not empathize, but that doesn’t mean that what I’m saying isn’t true.

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