Where Do I Meet Single Men If I’m In My 40s?

I am 44 years old and entering the dating scene again for the first time in 25 years. Where do you go to meet someone at my age? I am not doing the online singles sites…that is just scary to me. I don’t go to church. I am new in town, with a few happily married friends.I have four grown who are trying to set me up (I love them, but what a nightmare!!). What do single people do at 40 and over? So much of my time was taken up with caring for someone else that now I just don’t know how to fill that time. Any suggestions?


Thanks for highlighting an important principle for women over 40 seeking love:

You will not find it unless you do something differently.

You said it yourself. You’re new in town. Your friends are married. You don’t go to church. You won’t date online because it’s scary.

It’s about attracting men, understanding men, and making them want to stick around forever and ever. That’s what I do for my clients every single day.

What do you expect me to tell you? No, really. What?

Every day I get emails from women who want one-on-one dating coaching but don’t want to try online dating. I tell each one the same exact thing:

“If you’re dating a few men right now and can guarantee me that you’ll have at least one date a week for the duration of our time together, we can start coaching. If not, what exactly are we going to talk about for 12 weeks?”

They usually come back with a “Well, I thought, as a dating coach, you’d have some ideas on meeting men. Isn’t that what dating coaching is all about?”

No, that’s what articles in Marie Claire are all about:

“The Ten Top Spots to Meet Hot Guys!”

Here, I spared you the trouble of Googling it: The 14 Best Places to Meet Eligible Men

Without giving anything away, Loriann, here are the actual places that have been recommended by a site called AllWomensTalk: the bar, the market, online, church, the water cooler, newspapers, college, friends, the gym, restaurants, work, vacation, parks, airplanes.

Where does this leave you? Apparently, it means standing around a lot, hoping that a cute, age appropriate, interested single guy happens upon you at the bar, the market, college, the gym, restaurants, parks, and airplanes.

So if it’s not already abundantly clear, dating advice is not about WHERE to meet men. It’s about attracting men, understanding men, and making them want to stick around forever and ever. That’s what I do for my clients every single day.

As to where you meet men, yes, there’s one place that’s more effective in making introductions than 100 visits to Whole Foods and Art History class combined.

It’s called Match.com, it’s open 24 hours a day, and it costs a lot less than getting on a plane and hoping to sit next to a 45-year-old eligible bachelor.

…if you won’t go outside your comfort zone, I can pretty much assure you that nothing’s going to change.

I highly suggest you get over your fear of online dating, not because it’s perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but because it’s ubiquitous and effective in creating opportunity. Rather than dip your toe in the water and give up because you’re intimidated, I highly encourage you to check out Finding the One Online, in which I hold your hand through the entire online dating process, from getting over your fears, to choosing a website, to writing a profile, to flirting with men and so on.

You don’t have to be single if you don’t want to be, Loriann. But if you won’t go outside your comfort zone, I can pretty much assure you that nothing’s going to change.

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  1. 91

    I’m puzzled too that you don’t get to the actual dating stage very often. Have you put all your eggs in one basket by only subscribing to an online dating site like Match?
    Have you considered joining an evening college course where men in your age group have an interest, like photography,art and design, or languages.
    Two of my friends met their long term partners at one of these courses. Having a shared interest is a great ice breaker.

    1. 91.1

      Lol.   Men in a class?    men doing anything social at all would be amazing.    Never see them out anywhere, just tables full of women.    I swear they all sit home and binge watch TV.

    2. 91.2

      Men don’t attend these classes.  There’s another “love guru” that I follow that recommends taking on going classes(that means on going $) in men-oriented interests like cigar tasting (what guy is turned on by a woman reeking of cigar smoke?), finance, etc. I did take a couple of finance and home repair classes but it was all women. The only male was the teacher. I am in my late 30’s and everywhere I go it’s single women in packs.

  2. 92

    Hey there I suggest not bothering with online dating as its just full of weirdos lol just ask someone out in person lol I wish I could walk up and start talking to a girl but I am to shy and tried Internet dating omg waist of the last year I met two people wich I wished I never met lol so I am at the end of looking for good but if you find a good way to meet people please let me know thanks

  3. 94

    You think you have it bad?…Be a 40+ african-american woman. I’m educated, professional, living in the ‘burbs!’ I get offers for sex, but never a date! I’m 5’2 120lbs and I’m called gorgeous…yes I’m told…but you’re Black!!

    1. 94.1


      I feel your pain. I am 50, professional, black, living in the burbs too.
      I don’t have the figure of yesteryear..I am “big boned” ha ha.
      So its a little hard, but…I try to have fun. Tomorrow church and a meet up.
      Who knows

    2. 94.2

      I have no ethnicity preference. But I have no interest in women who stand on their credentials like they defied the world and are owed a gold star in the form of Ryan Gosling. Sex gets pretty boring, and so do accomplishments. Do you have a personality?

  4. 95

    Interesting conversation.
    1) Weight doesn’t have as much to do with attractiveness as some seem to think. Weight does narrow the field, though.
    What is MORE important is your attitude.  Your attitude about yourself.  How do you carry yourself? Do you hold your head up? Do you look like you have self-confidence?  Are you dressed/groomed appropriately?
    When you talk (and type) do you come across positive? (who wants negative attitude?) Do you have an appropriate vocabulary and sense of humor?  
    2) Online dating can be scary because it is anonymous and because someone we know might see it.  But, if someone sees it, it usually means they are looking to date.  I actually have dated a few people I already knew, but neither of us knew the other was single and looking until we found each other on a dating site. 
    3) Meeting guys at classes actually works.  I took a local “get to know your police” class.  Met a guy, dated very happily for awhile. Looking for your help on what classes single middle aged guys might be taking these days.


  5. 96

    Online dating…seriously? Where else can you run into a nigger group of lazy dysfunctional people. I tried online dating, almost every site there is, from those that turned out to be nothing more than hook up sites to the more “marriage minded” ones..and found alot of the same men on all sites…filled with ‘leftovers” and the socially illiterate. Self centered, wanting to get laid on the first date, herpes (turned out quite a few admitted to me of this affliction)…quite a few financially challenged..not just debt, we are talking the no-car-still-relying-on-mom types who are over 50. Creeps, liars (misrepresenting their ages) and lots of married men or those with one foot out the door but not separated.

    I would NEVER recommend online dating. It brings out the worst in people and the worst people. I’ve just never seen such laziness, the men want to be pursued and romanced like a woman, and so many of them are unemployed and misogynistic…truly demented.

    Demented? You just said the N-word. Pot, kettle. – EMK

    1. 96.1

      Obviously a typo – pretty clear to see that the poster meant ‘bigger’…

  6. 97
    SK Friend

    I know a bunch of serial killers. They are now active on most dating sirtes killing women in theri 20s through 60s. Beware! Go buy yourself a dildo instead!

  7. 98
    White European

    “You think you have it bad?…Be a 40+ african-american woman. I’m educated, professional, living in the ‘burbs!’ I get offers for sex, but never a date! I’m 5’2 120lbs and I’m called gorgeous…yes I’m told…but you’re Black!!”
    Leanna: you’re wrong. Personality matters, colour does not. At least toi NORMAL people, not the KKK or RR (reverse racists). I’m 48 and I spent 20 years in this difficult country. Women in USA doesn’t matter the colour seem so “independent” (fake?) and difficult and so demanding, but when they turn 40 things turn around. I was married to a Black woman. Got kicked out for lack of attention….but why? Because i got tired of her demands to cook, clean and be nice, while she was always angry and impossible to talk to. I’m not a door rag neither I’m an USAmerican, so I stopped talking to her. If you’re decent woman, no drugs, no anger, no too fat, contact me.

  8. 99

    Evan Marc Katz – 24. I would say that any woman in any circumstance would be wise to look after her physical safety. Unlike one of the posters on here who checks out HIS surname and office etc., I would NOT advise a woman to give her real date of birth or location and certainly not the office she works or too many details.

    But her fear is most certainly NOT in her mind.

    Because of my profession, I happen to know that women ARE aggressed and it is foolish to say otherwise. Some useful advice – listen to your gut, don’t get in his car if it doesn’t feel right, get your own taxi home and should you still decide to get in his car, make sure you have the number plate AND tell your friends where you are.

    It isn’t wise to be paranoid – and neither is it wise to be foolish about your own safety.

  9. 100

    I love how some dating “experts” push online dating. Our society is becoming too mechanized and computerized. Online dating should be a last resort, when all other options have failed.

    I tried online dating for almost 3 months and experienced massive burnout. Like Selena said, it is an endless round of blind dates. Most people lie about their appearances (men about height; women about weight). They post dated pictures. So you have to be honest: You don’t know what these men look like. The profiles all start to sound the same after a while. And you will turn down a lot of men who you might otherwise click with, based on stupid criteria. As a woman with a child, I was doubtlessly turned down by men who didn’t want to date a single mom – even though, had they met me in person, they wouldn’t have known I had a kid and wouldn’t have judged me like an item on a store shelf.

    I would not log on to a dating website every day unless you found someone you like to communicate with. And I would make a point to take things offline as soon as possible.

    Internet dates feel despicably awkward, forced and fake. The men I’ve met are sexually desperate and try to go in for a hug the first time you meet. They grope, grab, push you against things and press into you, press their faces against yours…. Always meet at a location away from alcohol for the first date.

    Also be aware of distance. Don’t waste time talking to men who are too far away. Over a half an hour is too much travel time, IMO.

    There is an article I read that online dating is conducive mainly to hookups.

    Internet daters tend to be socially awkward, or too afraid/lazy/thoughtless to break out of their routines and try to meet people in person. I fell into the latter category. I am now making an effort to get out there and see who I meet.

    Internet daters face the burden of becoming “professional daters,” i.e. people who keep going on date after date with different people, never settling down. It’s the “the next one will be better” mentality.

    Some people who start Internet dating never stop. Even when they find a relationship – once it ends, they’re right back on their computer. Rebound alert!

    Don’t throw all those lame Match and eHarmony commercials at me. Most married couples met offline, period. Do some research on Internet dating. It’s not recommendable, and not for everyone. It should definitely NOT be the only solution.

    (Hey, Fake Name. It’s your host, EMK. Yes, most married couples met offline but that’s solely because most people don’t date online. As it stands, 1/3 of all recent marriages started online. So I’m not sure you you can say that something that has helped millions of people is “not recommendable”. Leave the advice to me, and you can continue to meet men…um…however you meet men in real life…about twice a year if you’re lucky.)

    1. 100.1

      Wow.   Totally true post, far more accurate than what Evan claims.     match.com is a wasteland.

      I’ve tried online dating since 2010 – a total waste of time.    Sure Evan, lots of dates – a date a week – but a total bust over and over for five years.    Awkward and creepy.      Haha.

      I think a lot of this dating funk is just middle age – lots of depressed divorced people, or weird self involved never married people who will never be satisfied with anyone.    Get a dog … They are always happy to see you!

      How old are you Evan?   😀

        1. Jo

          Evan, try setting up a profile on match.com as a 52 yr old woman…I’m sure we can provide some pics and you can take it for a spin    I think it would be AWESOME!

          Seems to me part of the problem is middle age in general.   Most mid life men seem pretty miserable which is why online dating fails at this age      They are usually pissed off that the ex got the house, or they have to pay child support, or they got laid off, or they divorced their first wife and married the younger woman they had an affair with and are packing little kids around at middle age – but then wife number two divorces them…. I’m sure you get the picture on what the problem is   We are left with bitter unpleasant people – which is why a lot of women are simple done with men at this age      Go to a psychiatrist and find out why your problem is, don’t go online and start picking apart future partners

          Men seem to have few friend at midlife too, yet woman seem to go out and about in groups enjoying themselves     I suppose going to a baseball game might uncover a few bachelors if they haven’t drank themselves into a stupor.   I always seem to run into the inebriated ones at sporting events     Ah, that’s why I enjoy hiking and camping with….. My dog    🙂



        2. Evan Marc Katz

          What do you think my job is? That’s right: writing profiles for 52 year old women. Now go to the success stories page at the top. AWESOME!

        3. Jo

          Silly Evan – I can write my own profile .. It’s the men that seem to be a disaster at this age.

          I have a mailbox full of messages from 30 and 40 something men so I think I have been blessed with good DNA and am still relatively attractive.

          Men need coaching on how to communicate.    There is not a single website that audits the quality of its members … And the quality is extremely low.   Paying to have someone author a new profile won’t fix the quality issue one bit

          As my Grandma use to say, the odds are good that the goods are odd.    🙂

        4. Evan Marc Katz

          Silly Jo, if you were a client or regular reader, you’d know not to get upset about the 90% of men, but rather, to focus your energies on the 10%…and hope that men think you’re in their Top 10% as well (which is why your profile and email technique makes a bigger difference than you think).

        5. Jo

          I’m not upset in the least Evan.    I feel sorry for a lot of these miserable middle age guys, but have no interest in fixing them.    I tried to be supportive of one downsized gentleman I dated for two years, but he just got more miserable as time went on.    He switched jobs three times since being laid off in 2008 and each job is more unsatisfying than the last.     He was angry, bitter, sulking, etc.     yuck!!    Life is challenging enough without dating a scowling grumpy old man    🙂

          The 10% you speak of are playing the field from 20-50 yr old women because they can.     Again – I don’t believe I have a profile issue.   The quality just isn’t there.      It is a numbers game and the odds are not in favor of women.

          What we really need are professional matchmakers that screen out all the crap – matching serious relationship seekers.    Online dating is crap – and 90% of the messages in this seem to validate this.

        6. Evan Marc Katz

          Online dating is $30/month. Matchmakers cost over $1000/date. Have at it.

        7. Jo

          .50 cents worth of stuff for $30.   It’s not worth paying match.com because you get the same low quality people on POF and Tinder.

          Pointless discussion because you are selling a pipe dream that for the majority – online dating – is an epic failure.    1K is a scare tactic – there are services that offer more than that for 1K.   If you are a highly paid professional it might be worth the money simply to meet SERIOUS men who put their money down to find the right match vs wasting countless hours sifting through crappy dating sites.

          It depends how important it is to be coupled – and based on what I’ve seen in the middle aged man category – single is better than scowling old guys with low T.   Hehe

        8. Evan Marc Katz


          If you consider the fact that 1/3 of all marriages start online (half of those from online dating sites), I think we’ll have a very different view of what an “epic failure” is. Millions of people have found lasting love online – not just my clients, but my sister, my best friend, my wife’s two best friends, and so on. Online dating is flawed, but it works fine. If anything, it sounds to me like YOU were an epic failure. And because of that, you’re willing to pay $1K for a date with SERIOUS stranger. Go ahead. I’ll teach people to date online with a $197 course and $0/month on OkCupid. My clients will have the power to proactively pursue love for a half-hour a day online, flirt, screen and get a new first date every week until they find love. You will wait until a matchmaker who has met you for one hour hands you a husband (the same guy who also struck out online, by the way – just with a lot of cash.)

        9. Karmic Equation

          Here’s the elephant in the room, Evan.

          Not too many “rich” guys are on POF or OKC. If one of Jo’s requirements is high-income, then a matchmaking service may be better suited to her finding that rich guy because, by definition, you have to be either very desperate (if poor) or very rich to afford to pay $1000/date to a matchmaking service.


          Not sure what you’re looking for, but I’m 48 (did OLD for about 18 months after I turned 46).

          There were quite a few old men who wanted to date me, along with men young enough to be my son. It was really tough turning down a date with Channing Tatum’s doppelganger. lol Not so hard with Mr. Magoo’s.

          Anyway, as a woman who made just under 100k at that time, I had dates with an ironworker, a chef, a few poets; a paramedic, a personal trainer; a lawyer who owned a two-person practice (who also modeled and was a professional comedian); a power-lifter by night, a fed by day; a firefighter; a globetrotting sales director; a buyer for a pharmacy chain who managed a billion dollar budget; a man who owned his own HVAC company and had a yacht; a man with two graduate degrees who lived a “time rich, money poor” life as he put it.

          All were good looking. With a few exceptions, I’m pretty sure most of the guys made less than I did. Most were within +/- 5 years of my age. I would say that they were all well-balanced, non-bitter individuals. Most had been divorced.

          If you’re only dating losers (because that is what you’re making it sound like you’re doing) — then either only losers are asking you out or you’re choosing losers to date.

          If only losers are asking you out IRL, then you might need to consider hanging out in new places, so y0u can have access to a new (and hopefully higher-quality men) OR you have to stop choosing losers to date.

          Or it could be that you only look for the negative in the men you date and thus all of them are losers to you.

          All men are flawed. All women are flawed.

          The trick to finding a partner is to find one whose flaws you can easily tolerate. Not to find a partner with no flaws. S/he doesn’t exist.

        10. Evan Marc Katz

          Nice of you to help, however, Jo wrote me a nasty comment that was since deleted. She doesn’t want to admit that online dating works for millions of people. It’s too painful to face that; she instead tried to shoot holes in the statistics. In other words, Jo wanted to complain and have nobody call her on it. Thankfully, she will most certainly find a blog she likes better – there are no shortage of people on the internet who like nothing more than the sound of their own complaining.

        11. Jo

          @karmic equation

          how does one look for negative people online? How can you tell until you talk to them?   People post their pics, they write about themselves, their interests, etc.  and then you meet them.  You are either attracted to them or not.      I’m not necessarily looking for high income people, but I can tell you – if you are doing better than he is financially -then he will have issues with that too.

          Everyone has their problems for sure, especially as you get older but that doesn’t mean you have to complain about your ex or how you can’t get a break at work – love the complaining about the alimony payments because the lazy ex didn’t work and just raised their kids instead!

          As for this blog, if you don’t totally agree with Evan he will claim your posts are nasty – when in reality you might be hitting a nerve.   Truth be told he isn’t attacking the guys who say online dating is a waste of time and calling them failures.  🙂

        12. Evan Marc Katz

          I let your insulting comment through again but I would encourage you to go after this. There are THOUSANDS of posts where people disagree with me. The only time I push back hard is when your FACTS are wrong. When you say online dating is an epic fail, that’s not a matter of opinion. You are WRONG. I don’t care if a thousand women tell me how they got a thousand dick pics on their first day of online dating. When one medium accounts for 17% of all marriages (when it’s not used by 17% of all people), it’s a massive success. You insulting me doesn’t change the fact that you are only speaking for YOU. YOU fared poorly at online dating and, apparently, that experience is more valid than the millions of people who found love online.

          Your next falsehood is that I don’t speak this way to guys. Here’s a favorite post of mine on that subject. And another. And another. And since I don’t expect facts to convince you, please keep in mind that I’m a coach for women. As such, I take questions from women and give advice to women. Thus, there won’t be many instances of me giving advice to men since that’s not actually my job. But I’m quite certainly an equal opportunity offender.

        13. Karmic Equation


          You probably don’t see the irony.

          Your complaining about all the “loser men” out there is not much different than men complaining about their loser exes.

          And TBH, at least those men actually had some sort of relationship with those women before complaining about them.

          You seem to be complaining about the men based on one date or only by reading their profiles.

          It’s clear you’re a fault-finder kind of woman, a criticizer. Good men will avoid dating you. And the only men who’ll want to date you more than once? Yeah, the losers who struck out with all the non-critical women.

          That’s the irony. I do believe you ARE indeed finding only losers to date. But that’s because the quality, well-adjusted guys don’t want to stick around, not because they don’t exist.

        14. Jo

          My original comment which you deleted was not nasty – I just gave you the same insult you started throwing at me – and my post is still missing.     You insulted me Evan, by claiming I am a failure because I have not found online dating very useful or enjoyable.

          In sales, making 17% of quota is considered an epic failure.   In school, a 17% score is an F.   Here it is considered success – good enough!   However, really boils down to luck – whether you meet someone via online dating.    Pictures are the most important part – more so than profile writing – and yes, that’s my personal opinion.


          Regardless of our spat, I read the blog mostly for entertainment and have found the topics interesting for the most part.   I’m not a complainer- my boss tells me that “no” doesn’t seem to be in my vocabulary when it comes to working on tough projects.   This is the toughest project ever, especially in Seattle where people are indoors for months and months out of the year.      I believe my cheery attitude is annoying to men on antidepressants- 🙂

        15. Evan Marc Katz

          You sound too bright to believe something so stupid.

          First of all, it’s 17% of all marriages come from online dating, not a 17% success rate for online daters.

          More importantly, you are viewing this through a fictional lens where online dating is only a success if 100% of people get married. You know how ridiculous that sounds, right? It would be like saying that all therapist, personal trainers and consultants are failures because people still need their services. Online dating isn’t responsible for awful men and women (who also exist in real life, by the way). It’s just a big aggregator like LinkedIn or Facebook that connects people and gives them a chance to meet. Nothing more or less. Your problem is not with online dating; it’s with people. That’s okay. But make sure your target is clear before you shoot. Online dating, like the gym, works fine. Some people will rock it. Some people will remain obese. Ultimately, it’s about you, not the venue.

        16. Jo

          I don’t think the article from psychology today is stupid at all.   It probably is the most accurate assessment of online dating I’ve read.

          I don’t believe that success is determined by marriage either – you seem to be the one zeroing in on how many marriages are a result of online dating.

          My problem is with the venue, and a large percentage of its users.

    2. 100.2

      If I had a dollar for every woman that got mad at me for not initiating sex after date 3…

      i don’t know your history…

      is that all women want on these sites, sex and money?

      sex does NOT equal love. It doesn’t even mean like sometimes.

  10. 101

    MeetUp.com is a GREAT site!!!  You can find lots of things to do from Dancing to meditation to groups just going out for a social time.  There’s groups specifically for singles to meet other singles.  There’s over 40, over 50 groups.  There’s no pressure, the only commitment you make is to be in the group and no you don’t have to attend every Meetup the group has, only what appeals to you.  No I don’t work for MeetUp.com  but I have created a Meetup group for social dancing.

    1. 101.1

      I agree, I LOVE MeetUp.com.  I am an organizer for a group, and belong to several, which means I never had to stay home bored.  There’s ALWAYS something I can be doing. 
      I have dated a few men from meetup.com, nothing that led to an LTR but it was fun anyway. 
      It’ great for singles, married couples looking for other couples to do activities with, married couples looking to go out and have fun and meet people together, people who are new in town, anyone with an unusual special interest looking for someone who shares that interest.
      It’s not just for singles, but it certainly is great for single people looking to have fun.

    2. 101.2

      In Seattle there is a meetup group called the Anti-Freezers.     They are trying to combat the “Seattle Freeze” – the city’s reputation for being cold and unfriendly.

  11. 102

    Don’t do Match.com as waste of time and money coming from a 49 yr old male who tried it.
    Try joining a club(don’t mean fitness) where you can talk to other people where a sports club or something like Toastmasters or library club or even a w walk club. Just get out in person and met people. 

  12. 103

    While I previously stated my bas experiences about online dating, I didn’t meet any serial killers or rapists.  Women need to use some common sense before going out with men they have only met online.  Get a full name.  Tell at least two people were you are going. Get a phone number and share it with those same two people. I also use to meet people at locations I was familiar with and I knew people at. My very first date was caddy corner from a police station. Women can have fun they just have to be smart about it.
    As for beauty, yes weight can be an important factor but so can grooming. I don’t know how many times I have seen a woman that could be attractive but she is poorly dressed and in desperate need of some make up tips and hair styling. The clothing a women selects can make that size 14 look like a day gardening or oh la la. Also don’t get dressed up for a man. Do it for yourself. It helps portray confidence even if you don’t feel like you have any at that time. The confidence is what shows off a persons attractiveness. As smile. Nothing is as inviting for a conversation as a smile.

    1. 103.1

      Not to sound catty, but I am surprised when I see women my age, who seem to still want to date and meet men, yet they dress and groom like grandmas.  Just because we are old enough to be grandmas doesn’t mean we have to dress like one.  I’m not talking about dressing like a teeny bopper either, but a little class and a little sass in the wardrobe, hairstyle and make up department can’t hurt. 
      Puleez, if I start wearing polyester lime green pants with the elastic waistband and the sensible shoes, just shoot me !

      1. 103.1.1

        Sparkling, that is great.  I am 57 and do not dress like a grandma (nor will I ever).  I still have plenty of life left and do not plan to slow down.  I am amazed at how many women (and men) my age have just given up on maintaining attractiveness.

  13. 104

    Gwynn 103, I agree with your first paragraph, except that a serial killer or rapists WOULD go on a dating site, wouldn’t he? The same way as a normal guy would.  The same way as these creeps are in daily life too.
    As for the second point, many men have said they prefer me without make-up (and my make-up is generally quite soft).  Poorly dressed? What exactly do you mean?
    Women don’t always know what a man likes anyway.  Show too much and you’re provocative, don’t show enough, and you’re a prude.  More positively, if a man doesn’t like the way I dress, he knows where he can go.

  14. 105

    You know what?  I’ve done the online dating thing – and I have met past relationships on places like match.com.  In general, I have to say the pool of men (at least in my area) online is lame.  I get emails/winks/compliments, but the guys are just not what I would be attracted to or interested in by any stretch of the imagination.  I wouldn’t touch them to scratch them, as cat woman would say.  Sorry, but I’m just saying a woman (no matter how old), has to have standards.  But in doing so, since in the 40+ age group the pool of available and GOOD to EXCELLENT men is so small, the pickins seem to be pretty darned slim.  
    oh – and older men have tons of issues.  younger guys are a lot more open and easier.

  15. 106

    As a woman who solidly fits the Marc Evan Katz client demographic, my hesitation with online dating isn’t personal security, but rather that it is easy bordering on lazy. I’m a very active person, and my foray into online dating seemed to produce a lot of men whose main extracurricular activity was watching TV or playing video games.  Obviously, that’s not true of every man on Match, but I’m wondering if I’d have an easier time identifying compatible men via more active channels, like Meetup hiking groups for singles or whatever. I’m curious if other online daters have felt similarly about the passivity and low energy of people they’ve met.

    1. 106.1

      Yes, I’m encountering a lot of passive lazy men, who try to get me to chase them.  Not going to happen.  What I personally hate, is during the phone calling process, the convo basically becomes pointless, so as I am trying to end the call THEN they ask, “Well do you want to meet sometime  ?”  Then they hem and haw and ask, “Well where would YOU like to meet ? ”  They bumble and fumble like that haven’t got a clue  how to set up a date.  To me, there is no excuse to not be prepared to ask a woman out.  You have a “cheat sheet” in the form of her profile, that most likely lists some of her fave places and/or activities.  I just screen out men, who try to get ME to plan the date, because I figure they aren’t really that interested. Men:  Better to be PREPARED to set up an initial meeting/date or whatever you want to call it, and if after talking to her on the phone you decide you DON’T want to meet her, then DON’T.  But if you decide you DO want to meet her, something along the lines of  “There’s a really great wine bar at such and such place,  they have a really great happy hour.  Let’s meet there after work next week, which night work for you ?”  Sounds so much more confident then “Uhhh, would you like to meet ?  Uh, OK, where would you like to meet ?  Uhhhh, my favorite hot-spots in mytown ?   I dunno, I don’t really know of any places, where do YOU like to go” ?   UCK !

      1. 106.1.1
        Evan Marc Katz

        “I just screen out men, who try to get ME to plan the date, because I figure they aren’t really that interested.”


        It’s not that your observation that women want men to plan the date is false. It’s that you constantly go back to your “men need to change” mantra, which, as you know, is a big waste of time. You ain’t changing men. The better question you can ask is “How can I understand him better? Accept him better? Encourage him better?” Right now, you’re screening out men who are asking how to PLEASE you. These are good men – they’re just on the beta side. And given your argumentative nature (like mine), I would think the best fit for you IS an easygoing beta man. You’re pretty much eliminating your ideal dating pool with your bias against these guys. Next time he asks “What do YOU want to do?” how about you TELL him?

        1. Jo

          Then when you TELL him, he still can’t figure it out – because it would require he actually GOES OUT instead of just messaging 20 women at the same time.

        2. Confused

          Um, Evan, haven’t you said before multiple times that you believe men should pay and plan the first date? How does it make Sparkling Emerald argumentative and wrong for saying the exact same thing?????



  16. 107

    Comments show up in my inbox, but I can’t get to them on this blog.
    I said “I just screen out men, who try to get ME to plan the date, because I figure they aren’t really that interested.”</em>
    EMK replied

    It’s not that your observation that women want men to plan the date is false.
    I don’t care what women want, it’s about what I want, and it’s true that I want a man who can do a simple task such as planning a date.  As for what other women want, I don’t care. 
    It’s that you constantly go back to your “men need to change” mantra, which, as you know, is a big waste of time. You ain’t changing men.
    I never said men need to change, I said I screen them out.  That’s what you advise.  If there is something you don’t like about a man, don’t change him, dump him (or in my case screen him out)  Plenty of women like being the social director of the relationship, so I screen them out,  and leave them free to find a woman who likes to be in charge.
    The better question you can ask is “How can I understand him better? Accept him better? Encourage him better?” Right now, you’re screening out men who are asking how to PLEASE you.
    They could please me, by planning the date.
    These are good men – they’re just on the beta side.
    I was married to a “laid back ” beta type, turned out he was really just passive aggressive.  Blew up in my face and it was UGLY. UCK, NEVER AGAIN !
    And given your argumentative nature (like mine), I would think the best fit for you IS an easygoing beta man. You’re pretty much eliminating your ideal dating pool with your bias against these guys. Next time he asks “What do YOU want to do?” how about you TELL him?
    So maybe I should tell him to call me back when he has a solid plan for date ? No, that would be trying to change him. So no, I’ll just screen him out.
    Sorry EMK, but passive men are a big TURN OFF to me.  No point dating a man that doesn’t turn me on.  Wouldn’t make for a very good relationship. 
    Milquetoast men are a turn off to me.  I don’t need a knuckle dragging Neanderthal clubbing me over the head and dragging me off to his man cave, but a man with a plan would be nice.  And I agree, about not changing men, so I don’t.  If they have wussy characteristics that I just don’t like, I just don’t go out with them.  I’d rather be alone than with a man I’m trying to change, so I don’t.
    I’m not arugmentative with someone who has a strong assertive personality.  (but I will stand up for myself if they try to treat me like a doormat)  I don’t like being argumentative, so I prefer a strong, take charge man with a plan. 

    1. 107.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      You just ignored everything I wrote and engaged in pure black and white thinking to justify your original stance. Great. Keep on screening out guys who ask you what you’d like to do on a date.

      1. 107.1.1

        I didn’t ignore everything you said, I responded point by point, I’m not surprised you disagree with me, but I didn’t ignore what you said, I just don’t agree.
        I’m already open to many varieties of men, men that other women overlook.  I’m fine with short, bald, slightly over weight. (not morbidly obese)  I don’t demand George Clooney good looks, but I do have to feel SOME degree of attraction. (I have been falsely accused on this blog of holding out for a tall dark and handsome rock star, but that was just flat out false)  I just want to wear the skirt in this relationship.  Passive men just don’t do it for me.  I’d rather be alone, than cringing in a relationship with a man I “settled” for,  just for the sake of being in a relationship.  The letters from women who are head over heels for a guy who doesn’t treat them right are heartbreaking.  So are the ones from women who are with a man who doesn’t turn them on.  I don’t want to be that woman.  The woman who “settles” and then finds herself sharing a bed with a man she’s just not into.  No one should have to be “convinced” to be with someone.  I’m not going to try and “convince” myself that  I could be happy with a passive Milquetoast.  I can’t.  You might as well try to convince the average man to pursue a chubby woman if he likes his women slender.

        1. Evan Marc Katz

          You’re making up more stories. A guy asks what you want to do and you leap to the conclusion that he’s a passive milquetoast. That’s my entire point. Black and white thinking, extrapolated from one question.

        2. SparklingEmerald

          EMK – I did not give you the ENTIRE convo, but the “milquetoasts” I am describing behave that way the entire convo, and the few I went out with anyway, continue on in that vein, right through “may I kiss you ?” at the end of the evening.  After and evening of “and what would you like to do next” after a phone call of “where would you like to go” and answering my questions of “What are your favorite places in your town” and they reply with “I don’t really have any” etc., etc., etc.
          I would just like a man to have ONE damn opinion of his own about something !

        3. Chance

          I get it.  You want what you want.  Attraction isn’t a choice, but have you considered that you might be jumping to the conclusion that these men are “wussies” because they didn’t ask you out in the way you prefer?  That might not be the case with some of them, and the only way to find out is to spend a little more time to assess them.  Unless you are finding that you have much better options available to you, try giving some of them a chance – not for their sake, but for yours.
          I also agree with Evan in that you come across as quite assertive and argumentative based on your comments here.  Not judging, but this does present a problem:  most alphas aren’t really attracted to assertive/argumentative/bossy women.  However, if an alpha was reading your comments on this blog (let’s pretend this is a dating site where he’s assessing potential matches), would he be doing himself a favor by jumping to the conclusion that you’re assertive or argumentative, or would he be missing out on something?

      2. 107.1.2

        Hi Chance
        I know I come off to you as argumentative on the blog, but I don’t have these types of convo’s with guys I meet IRL.  Blog talk is different than real life.
        Also, I don’t have enough bandwidth to describe the TOTALITY of the wussy passive men who seem to be attracted to online dating.  Believe me, I have given them chances, I have held their hand, I’m talking about 2 years on and off with the OLD, I really can’t give a line for line re-cap of every phone convo, every e-mail exchange, every date.  Believe me, there are some men who don’t even qualify as Betas, more like Omegas. 
        I don’t think a simple task as planning a date takes a super macho alpha male.  I don’t think asking for a date should take several e-mails, phone calls and texts, of hemming and hawing.  My profile tells a man how to “please me”. 
        Since I’ve been doing OLD, I’ve tried going out with guys who aren’t normally “my type”.  I’ve been open, I’ve settled, etc., etc.  Then I just don’t feel it for the guy.  So what’s the point ?
        Some of the OLD “success” stories seem like women settling to me.  I hear an undercurrent of women convincing themselves to like a guy they really aren’t that attracted to.  I think on the other side of a women pining for a man who doesn’t want them, is women settling for a man they really don’t want.  (I’ve actually been down both roads very briefly) 
        I feel like I have 2 choices, I can have a man I don’t want, or I can want a man I can’t have.  Neither is satisfying.

        1. SpanklingEmerald

          Now I remember another reason why I like men who just say what THEY want instead of asking me.

          I have experienced this MANY times, where a guy will give me a choice of “This or That”. If I say, “Let’s do “This”, then he’ll say “nah, I rather do that”. (So why did he ask me in the first place?)

          I just finished up a correspondence with an online dater. After a few e-mails, he asked if we could meet or chat on the phone soon. So I chose chatting on the phone, and we set up a phone call. So after we talked a while he asked me, “Anyway, why do you INSIST on meeting someone by phone ?” Well, I was really puzzled by the question, because I didn’t recall the EXACT e-mail exchange, but I really didn’t think I INSISTED on anything. Well I did explain to him that I like to exchange a few e-mails and at least one phone call prior to a face to face, as a way to try and get to know the person a little better before meeting. Then we arranged to meet the next day. After we did that, he said, “Wait, do you mind if I check my calendar and get back to you ? I just want to make sure “, I said OK. Then he e-mailed me later and he asked if we could meet Wednesday instead and I said yes. Then on Tuesday he e-mailed me and said things “got busy” with his schedule. (I had a feeling that was going to happen) Maybe we could meet next week ? OK, he’s a self employed author and he put in his profile that his schedule is “flexible”.

          At that point, my gut was telling me he was flaking out, and would continue to do so, so I wrote him an e-mail wishing him well on his search.

          He wrote back that he would have met me face to face the day we first talked except that I “INSISTED” on a phone call.

          I read through the e-mails. He gave me a choice of phone or meet in person, and I picked one of the choices HE gave me. So he give me a choice of two things, and gets pissed that I pick the “wrong” one.

          I’ve been through this before, guy asks what I want to do, or if I want to do A or B, and then they get mad at my choice.

          Anyway, more proof that phone screening WORKS.

          And to think this guy writes “self help books” (and I googled him and he doe

        2. sophie

          SE, your sentences about the two choices sum it up for me perfectly. I don’t have many men who are interested in me but the ones who were, I had no attraction to whatsoever. And most recently two men I did like, one of them I feel would actually be interested back if he didn’t have a girlfriend who I know he has some serious issues with but can’t seem to walk away from even though he knows the relationship is downright unhealthy for various reasons. And another guy who I do think is single and who seemed to really enjoy talking to me through work interactions seems to have lost some or all interest after he learned I am nine years older although I happen to look at least 7 years younger than I am. And I actually liked him back which makes it disappointing for me since it’s so difficult to find mutual attraction. I’m not opposed to men my age or slightly older or younger but it obviously has to be mutual but I’m not having much luck ticking off those boxes. I wonder if I will have to convince myself that I really like the ones who like me who I have no attraction to whatsoever if I don’t want to die alone. I tried to convince myself with my last boyfriend that I was happy and that I should feel lucky but I knew I was fooling myself when it became difficult to pretend to be happy to spend time together. He was a nice man but not compatible in the ways I needed in my daily and long term life. But at least he was a good person which you can’t say about many men these days. So yeah , I echo your sentiment infinitely.

        3. SparklingEmerald

          Sophie – “I tried to convince myself with my last boyfriend that I was happy“Hi Sophie – Please don’t try to convince yourself of anything, or try to convince a guy of anything.In the time that has elapsed in the above convo (yes, the one that said I should accept an indecisive man to counter my aggressive bossy personality . . .)  I have met and married a WONDERFUL man.  I wouldn’t class him as an alpha or a beta (as if those black and white classifications are actually helpful) but he did know EXACTLY what he wanted and what he wanted was ME.  We actually skipped the phone call, and went from meeting online, to e-mailing back and forth and arranging a “coffee date” at his suggestion.  That “coffee date” turned into a walk around the neighborhood, then a walk to a bar for appetizers and wine, then to a movie date . . . and then a little over 2 years later, getting married.  I felt very attracted and connected to him from the moment I laid eyes on him, he felt the same way, and that feeling has been growing ever since.I was 61 when we got married (he is 8 years older than I am).  I never had to convince myself of my feelings for him, I never doubted his feelings for me.Please don’t settle.  It’s never too late.

  17. 108

    I have done about 20 dating sites.. I get one of two types of responses 1) None at all, whether i start it or not and 2)  men who want me to work and they laze around the house while i support them, they do nothing.  I also get a lot of idiots who think they can scam me Match.com was one of the very first sites i tried and it was the worst.  I have to disagree that  dating sites are good.. I have had no luck in finding anything decent there.  BTW I can pin point a scammer so quick (usually in about the first 20 minutes of a conversation, or first email). 

  18. 109

    Evan: Let me know if you have any success. I’ve been widowed for over five years, fixed up by friends, and tried the majority of dating websites.  I receive thousands of replies, but the majority consensus is that “if I look that good, have a good profession, then I’m too good to be true.”  Hey!  I’m just a real person trying to meet someone!  I strike up conversations wherever I go, but no luck!

  19. 110

    Match.com for people over 40 is a joke.  Men are cheesy, unintelligent, trashy and needy on Match.  I went through 6 grueling weeks of searches and receiving emails and winks and was not interested in ONE. I could write an entire blog about this. It just baffles me that dating coaches or any professional recommends online dating. I’ll give some props to eHarmony, but as far as online dating goes…it’s a joke. I’d rather be single and go to Whole Foods 100 times and stand just to have an intelligent conversation with someone, than meet some desperate loser on the internet.

  20. 111

    I don’t find online dating “scary” i am just sick of the “players” and flakey people i meet on there.  I guess there are so many choices, that there is always the “grass is greener” attitude..

  21. 112

    When I first dabbled with online dating it was in early 2002. Back then, like 12 years ago, internet dating was seen as a scary place for sure – it almost had a thing that you were hanging a big sign around your neck saying desperate – I’ve run out of options. I remember really vividly all my friends laughing and say that was for people who couldnt find anyone else. I guess a lot has moved on in 12 years and some things have’nt changed a lot.

    What’s definitely moved on is that its considerably more mainstream now. Back then, 9 out of 10 people would tell I was nuts. Nowadays that its more acceptable, its more like 1 or 2 people out of 10 tell me I’m nuts.

    The same underlying fears exist though for many people which I see coming through in this thread – fear of what is out there, insecurity, will I just meet guys who only want sex and so on.

    If you are over 40 and looking for romance, there are tried and tested formulas that you can follow – Evan has plenty of these and these work. Period.

    Sometimes, you just need to put it out there, dance with your fears and have a go anyway. What’s the worst that can happen.

    Source: http://www.strictlydating.com/dating-at-40-the-10-step-guaranteed-success-plan/

  22. 113

    Agree with everything said here.  I tried internet dating after becoming widowed.  In my experience these sights contain 1% genuine daters and 99% non genuine daters ie just looking for sex or so damaged by their previous relationships they’re not respectful.  I dated one man for 7 months only for him to do the disappearing act on me without a word.  After doing some research I found him on every dating website out there, more fool me for not doing more research before I got involved but as he was a police officer I thought he’d be genuine. Lesson learned.  Prior to him I met three or four guys, two of those turned out to be married the other one had trouble putting sentences together and was at least 10 years older than he said he was!  I had abusive messages if I didn’t respond to a wink, requests for naked pictures, got sent naked pictures.
    IMHO the best way to meet someone is through friends.  Go to as many functions as you can, if your friend has a party go whether you feel like it to nor, if your work colleagues ask you to go out with them go. They all have friends you’ve not met yet.  If they are friends with a person you trust and are friends with then they can’t be a bad person can they?

  23. 114

    i embraced my singleness long time ago. i am 40 too but pets keep me company… i do not go out, and watch tv but when i had friends i used to hang out with them, and party but now i am left alone, friends eventually find their significant other and leave few stay, in my situation all found and left. getting to know new friends is not easy at first especially when you rarely go out, since going out alone is not my thing. but again i say it’s better being single than being in a sad relationship, i know people who do not go out try online dating but i do not like it. wow what’s wrong with being single? most people around me also keep questioning me, i am looking for a penpal a girl preferably, but it seems that 40 + single girls are more absorbed into dating than a penpal.

  24. 115

    Online dating sucks and is extremely overrated. I’ve been contacted by scammers three times in three months. Yes it’s an international crime ring who’s profiles are fake and their only goal is to lie and try to get you to wire them $2500 at some point right before you are suppose to meet. Very creepy stuff. 98% of the real men don’t really bother being a gentleman once you make the step to meet or communicate off the website.Why? Because there are utterly 10s of thousands of other women on line at their finger tips. It’s dreadful. I can’t wait until “OFF-LINE DATING” becomes a thing again.

    1. 115.1

      I’ve had a few cat fishers contact me.

      I have found them out through google image search. You can upload a picture through google image search, and it will search the internet for that picture.

      I have found out that 4 men who have contacted me through various means (OLD, meet up & just e-mailing me directly) were fake by using google image search.

  25. 116

    What I am hearing from the comments and the replies is that good girls cant find good guys because all guys who use dating sites are creeps. Also from this and other blogs the girls who use these sight are needy or sluts or some other degrading insults and the poor guys are good and looking for a decent relationship. Something is wrong here. I am good and they are bad syndrome. From the above there are a lot of intelligent people here’Can some one come up with a solution to solve Loriann’s dilemma and that of other including myself

  26. 117

    Mic… Thanks for letting me know that I will never be lusted over again! lol

  27. 118

    I can tell you what is scary about online dating. You meet a total stranger who has no references or shared contacts who can vouch for him. This stranger lures you into a relationship after two or three months of dating with a lot of charm and sweetness. He doesn’t have a lot of family or friends, but that’s because when the economy went down his so called friends abandoned him. He has a few cousins you meet who te you he’s a good guy. Fast forward a few and you move in with him. Only now, he seems to get angry a lot. And he starts to badger you to divulge your number of sec partners, and when you do, he calls you a slut and whore in arguments. He pressures you for sex all of the time and subtly hints if u don’t give it, he’ll get it elsewhere. These things lead up to fights and then he apologizes profusely and promises to change. You see improvement…for awhile. Then he guilt trips you for spending time with friends and family. He screams in your face and lunges at you when you do something as simple as drop a utensil in the kitchen. He tries to get u to participate in a threesome and pressures you to marry quickly. You finally leave and find out that the background check you ran on him in the beginning of the relationship was inaccurate. He has a record of battery against women and armed robbery. Funny, no mention of that on the background check you ran. He stalks you after you leave. You consider getting a gun, mace, pit bull, etc. the thought of dating again makes you want to vomit. You become a hermit, except visiting your friends who stood by you. nightmares ptsd. Etc. Thats what you have to be afraid of.

    1. 118.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      Um, you realize that story could just as easily be told about a guy you met at the supermarket, right?

      1. 118.1.1

        Spot on, Evan!  Of course it could be, and sometimes is. There are bad people in real life, and there are bad people online, and so far as I know, neither comes with a warning label affixed, or a sign that says”abuser”, “creep”, or “convicted felon”.

        That aside, what I see here is a lot of people (both genders) who don’t seem to realize that while OLD gives you access to a lot of people you’d never meet IRL, it also gives a lot of people (including those you’d probably avoid meeting in real life) the same ability to try to meet you…and they will try. You’ve mentioned this before, but it bears repeating. Guess what the implications of that are? Put a profile out there, pics and all, and the more attractive it is to the quality man/woman you want to attract, the more it will also attract the ones you don’t want to attract. It’s akin to putting a brightly colored flower covered in sugar out there; it will attract both hummingbirds… and botflies.  The botflies are a lot more numerous.

        This is exactly why women with attractive profiles have mailboxes overflowing with everything from cut and paste emails, to messages from scammers,  messages from men so low quality and/or dysfunctional they couldn’t pick up a drunken slut in a low-grade honky-tonk, and messages from guys old enough to be their father, mixed in with a smaller number of messages from men they might actually want to date. It’s also why successful men with reasonably attractive profiles find the most of the unsolicited messages they get come from the most desperately unattractive, dysfunctional women, the obvious gold diggers, female scammers (yep, they’re out there), and women old enough to be their mothers, while they struggle to get a 20% response rate to messages they send to women they’d actually date. Demoralizing? Frustrating? You bet. It’s the price of opportunity; if you date online, the (to you, anyway) “undesirables” are going to take their shot at you, even if they’d never approach you in the real world…because they can, and in the anonymity of cyberspace, they have nothing to lose. This fact of life can be painful to absorb ( I didn’t like it much when I was online);  it’s hard to take that kind of attention as a compliment (I suppose it is one, of a sort), and pretty easy to feel discouraged  by it when you’re not getting as much, (if any) of the kind of attention you actually want. Best to just accept it as something virtually everyone online has to deal with to one extent or another, and just hit “delete” without taking it personally. There ARE good men and women online; it’s just hard for most of us to find and connect with them amongst all the clutter.

    2. 118.2

      Well this is awfully specific.

      1. 118.2.1

        This last response was for Ana

  28. 119
    Jo B

    I did online dating for about several years. Nothing bad happened to me but I wasted a lot of time sitting in bars with boring, dull guys I had nothing in common with. I tried to be open minded and non judgemental so I dated a wide variety of guys. I liked one a lot – he wasn’t interested in a committed relationship. As numerous people have said I also found guys who wanted a sexual relationship but no commitment. I just don’t have the time to waste anymore.

  29. 120
    Kelly Ann

    I have done a lot of online dating. I’ve had minimal negative experiences and some very positive ones. I’ve had two short term relationships from them. One with a doctor, one with an accountant. Both men were kind and good. I had a great time. I am 45 years old. When a man who is 55 to 65 writes me I just delete the profile. I wish them well. I have never felt threatened. I meet in a public place, like a restaurant, and get a sense of who these guys are. There are many divorced men looking for a kind, thoughtful woman in my age range. I like OK Cupid the best. If someone writes me something that creeps me out, I delete, block or report, depending on how crude. But I also respect the different variations of sexuality and if someone reaches out in a thoughtful way, I just delete. Some people write crude things and I usually block or report. But I’ve met so many good guys and I find the majority of the men on these sites are good men looking for everything from casual sex to marriage. It doesn’t take long to figure out what they are looking for. OK Cupid allows you to state what you are looking for. I’m looking for long term to marriage. So far, I’m very pleased. I’m shy and would never date if it weren’t for O.K. Cupid.

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