I’m Dating A Passive Beta Male. Is His Behavior Normal?

I’m Dating A Passive Beta Male. Is His Behavior Normal?

Hi Evan,

I love your blog and Why He Disappeared. It can be a tough pill to swallow at times, but I appreciate your no-nonsense advice. I’ve had to learn the hard way, that my “go-getter” attitude does not translate well in the dating world. Not doing anything in the beginning stages of dating tends to drive me crazy.

I’ve been dating a beta-male for about a month and a half. He’s a total sweetheart and for the first time in a long time, I feel very safe. He’s kind, attentive and affectionate- when we’re together. He communicates with me daily, mostly through text message, to which I always respond warmly.

Here’s where I’m struggling: I find myself wanting to take over and take control with him sometimes (planning things mostly). I am resisting this urge as I’m trying out your mirroring concept.

My question: We’re texting everyday, but he’ll wait FOREVER, (in actuality, 5-7 days) before asking to see me again. What gives? Is this a downside of dating a typical beta (i.e., no initiative) or is he just not that interested in me? Do I continue to utilize patience or should I move on?

Thanks, Evan!
-Michelle 

Dear Michelle,

Thanks for reading “Why He Disappeared – The Smart, Strong, Successful Woman’s Guide to Understanding Men and Keeping the Right One Hooked Forever”. Glad it turned on a few light bulbs in helping you realize how a few of your behaviors have been ineffective in forging a relationship with a man.

But I have to say that if I had to write the whole thing again, I would have taken a few pages to put in a caveat:

This advice doesn’t work for every single woman in every single situation with every single guy. Basically, WHD was written for alpha females who want to date alpha males. It was a way to open your eyes about how the men you’re the MOST attracted to don’t necessarily want to date you in return.

While you’ve adjusted your take-charge attitude, you haven’t adjusted for the fact that you’re NOT dating a take-charge guy.

And in the absence of giving yourself an entire personality-ectomy, the smartest thing you can do is a) be aware of some of your tendencies to dominate and b) find a partner who is cool with them.

You, apparently, have done both of those things, Michelle.  But while you’ve adjusted your take-charge attitude, you haven’t adjusted for the fact that you’re NOT dating a take-charge guy.

Take charge guys are the ones who will always follow up quickly, make plans, make the first move, and claim you as their girlfriends.

Beta guys are the ones who have more kindness than confidence. They’re not nearly as assertive. They’re so passive as to be, well, almost feminine in nature. They are not going to put themselves on the line for rejection until it’s 100% clear that you like them. They would sooner wait to get a written notice in the mail that you’re really, truly interested in them than to follow up too much and potentially make you uncomfortable.

Is any of this hitting home, my friend?

So you’re not wrong to curb a little bit of that domineering side. Where you’ve gone astray is that when you’re with a beta male, you’re ALLOWED to be more alpha. “Doing nothing” as I describe in WHD works with take-charge guys because those guys don’t need you to take charge. Your new guy DOES.

The good news is that, if he’s a true beta, he’ll be THRILLED that you’re taking control.

So instead of extrapolating my advice to apply to every man, make an adjustment based on the man you’re actually dating. The good news is that, if he’s a true beta, he’ll be THRILLED that you’re taking control.

When you’re done reading this, give him a call to find out if he’s around this weekend. You’d like to cook him dinner. I suspect that’s all you’ll need to seduce him into becoming your boyfriend. And if, in fact, he’s just not that into you, you’ll figure that out quickly, too.

For all of the women who are reading this who would not be able to tolerate such behavior from your guy and prefer a take-charge man, do yourself a favor and pick up a copy of “Why He Disappeared”. You’ll be very glad you did.

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Comments:

  1. 1
    Beta Female

    I wish I read this 6 months ago when I was dating a beta male cause I thought he just wasnt into me and we had many conversations about that.  He accepted me planning everything and anything but I am a beta female and there was 18 years age difference so I think that was what bothered me too.  He was not bothered by the age difference but could easily go 2-3 weeks without seeing me….but would call me every day and text every day.  I just couldn’t keep it up after 9 months that he would never make a plan or cancel due to work.  I got the vibe he just wasn’t that interested in me and broke up with him.  He was a great guy too but figured he would eventually want to get married and have kids with someone. I’m typically attracted to alpha males so I was very confused by his behavior.  After 6 months I asked him what we were and he said “you want me to be your boyfriend” then we are boyfriend/girlfriend!  Never took initiative to plan anything fun and when he did something would always come up and we had to go to Plan B.  Interested to hear from other ladies on here….

  2. 2
    Henriette

    Yeah, I think this is pretty awesome advice, Evan.  I used to date Alpha males but have moved on to sweeter, more gentle Omegas (I prefer to think of them as not Betas, which to me implies one step Lower than Alphas, but rather just miles away in terms of personality, behaviours and goals).   I’d wait for them to take action and would feel confused and unsure of their intentions when they seemed passive.  
     
    I think you ought to write another book, Evan, on how to attract, keep and be happy with wonderful Beta/Omega men.   Even how to figure out if a guy is an Alpha or not; it can be hard to tell with some of these successful, nerdy, techie-types.  

  3. 3
    Sunflower

    A mixture of both would be ideal :)   

  4. 4
    Jackie H.

    Hooray for beta males…Alpha males can be annoying anyway…

  5. 5
    m

    “When you’re done reading this, give him a call to find out if he’s around this weekend. You’d like to cook him dinner.”
    So … dude gets dinner and the company of his lovely gf.  She has to call him up & invite him, make the plans, buy the groceries, plan the meal, make the whole thing (three courses at least, I’m sure), find the time to decorate both the house and herself, and charm him all evening …?
    I hope dude brings at minimum his best behavior, some thanks for the excellent meal, and two bottles of her favorite wine.  Oh – and an oxygen mask. 
    It wouldn’t hurt if he threw something into the $$ pot for the groceries either.  It’s not just working men who are feeling the effects of the recession.  Working women feel it too.
    Anybody else feel like emotional, not to mention concrete, reciprocity in relationships is not just slipping, but being actively shoved, through the cracks of what we continue to call modern society …?
     
    P.S.  EMK – nice, nice job on Marni’s panel the other evening.  It’s good to know that sometimes it’s not so much some of your concepts I take issue with as it is said concepts’ written delivery (which — as speech and written language come from two different brain centers — I at times suspected, but couldn’t actually verify without having had the privilege of listening to that silky baritone :-) ).
    Further, on the blog, there are a lot of topics where men are actively encouraged to use their relationship-relevant leverage, and women are exhorted to just work around it (I know “men won’t change, so women have to” is a pretty fundamental tenet to the work so it’s never going away, but at least the fundamental inequity & imbalance therein is at least apparent when it’s set up like that – and of course women “get” to choose whether or not to work with it) … whereas the talk seemed much more focused on finding, and communicating around, the Venn diagrammed points in relationship where men’s and women’s interests do in fact intersect.  (See, I paid really close attention. :-) )
    So, in short, thank you so much for doing that.  You were great.

    1. 5.1
      Evan Marc Katz

      Any compliment coming from you, m, is a meaningful one. You’re a tough audience. Thanks for the shout-out.

  6. 6
    Jenna

    Ugh, I can’t stand people like this, whether it’s a romantic, professional, or platonic situation. I have a lot of courage and confidence and reciprocity is very important to me — I want someone who can engage on an equal level. Somebody this slow would be a poor match for me. 

  7. 7
    Julia

    So I guess this makes everything a bit more vague for me. If he’s not asking you out is it because he’s not interested or because he’s beta? My default stance is to believe its because he’s not interested and move on. The only truly beta men I’ve gone out with have followed up right away, were very interested but put me on a pedestal and made me feel uncomfortable with the enthusiasm they have towards me that I didn’t really earn.

    1. 7.1
      Andre

      That’s because you and other self entitled alpha wannabes think respect should be earned.respect should be automatically given until you find out the person doesn’t deserve it.backwards alpha  wannabes while your think ing your the greatest I’ll be working  to self improve on things that will make  me an all around better person.

      1. 7.1.1
        Julia

        Did I turn you down for a second date Andre?

        As a follow up, my partner now is a bit more beta, he’s quiet, shy, very romantic. He never has held back in stepping up the relationship. He was never so beta that he didn’t ask for everything he wanted, from second dates, to exclusivity, to moving in. So I still believe my original statement that men not asking you out again means they are disinterested. 

  8. 8
    Goldie

    Hmmm. I’ve dated a good number of betas, and I’m skeptical. All my betas have been pretty prompt and consistent about making plans to meet next time. I can only think of one occasion when one of them left me hanging for the weekend, and that was because he’d run into a tough family situation that he didn’t want to tell me about.
     
    Then again, my betas have all been grown men with children and one or two marriages, and a few relationships, under their belt. Maybe OP’s beta is a very young guy who really is too shy to ask her out. I still wouldn’t go as far as cooking him dinner. First of all, there’s a 90% chance that even a beta will get the wrong message that he is being invited to spend the night. But I do like the idea of inviting him out. Second, that’s way too much work for a guy who might not even be interested. I don’t know, to me cooking the guy a dinner this early in the game just screams “trying too hard”. Who wants to send this message, right? My advice is, find an activity that you both like to do, something happening in your area this weekend – a concert, a show etc. – and invite him to attend together.

  9. 9
    Lady Z

    I married a guy like this and I am miserable. But hey, you know the Alphas aren’t marriage material for women who are 4-5 on the SMV scale like myself. It’s settling for Mr.Good enough, when you’re not hot enough. But I would give ANYTHING to be with a take-change man. I’m just not on thier radar. Its a fact that Alpha female and ugly female share.

  10. 10
    Rose

    I don’t buy this Alpha/Beta theory which I believe in based on research on wolves is captivity.
    I do believe that you have more masculine energy and he is being passive. So yes you need to reverse the energy. However this only works if you when you start to be the passive one that you express how you feel and what you want and then give him chance to step up into the masculine role. For eg, this would be next time he texted to say, ” I am starting to feel disconnected from you with only seeng you x amount of times a week and  I feel more connected to people when I see them in the flesh and blood on a regular basis and want to feel closer and more connected, what do you think we can do about this?” And see what he suggests and does. If he doesn’ want to step up, resolve the issue you will get bored and not want him. As he can’t meet your needs. As long as you do not revert to stepping up into the masculine role. Unless you are happy with role reversal.This can work for some. What do you want? Or ignore your needs.
     
     
     

  11. 11
    Frimmel

    Because I just can’t resist. 
     
    M in #5 with the genders reversed:
     
    So …  gal gets dinner and the company of her lovely bf.  He has to call her up & invite her, make the plans, buy the groceries, plan the meal, make the whole thing (three courses at least, I’m sure), find the time to decorate both the house and himself, and charm her all evening …?
    I hope gal brings at minimum her best behavior, some thanks for the excellent meal, and two bottles of his favorite wine.  Oh – and an oxygen mask. 
     

    It wouldn’t hurt if she threw something into the $$ pot for the groceries either.  It’s not just working women who are feeling the effects of the recession.  Working men feel it too.
    Anybody else feel like emotional, not to mention concrete, reciprocity in relationships is not just slipping, but being actively shoved, through the cracks of what we continue to call modern society …?
     
    I certainly don’t get the idea that reciprocity is being actively shoved through the cracks. /sarcasm

  12. 12
    Ruby

    I just posted on another thread that I don’t believe the whole alpha/beta male thing anyway. Most people are too complex for that and are a mix of various traits. I’ve dated men who had what could be considered “beta” qualities, and they were still very proactive in the dating realm if they were truly interested.
     
    After a month and a half, I feel that waiting 5-7 days to make plans might be a sign of lukewarm interest or passivity. And I agree with Goldie, better to find an activity that you both would enjoy, and invite him.

  13. 13
    Braind Ed

    I am a guy. I cannot be categorized like this. I am a little confused because, though I know about these categorizations of alpha beta omega etc., I see now how society simply categorizes men like a meat market. Thats all well and good because I’d rather not be categorized. and as a wise man said “Once you label me, you negate me” Perfect! The thing is that I am an alpha when it comes to many other things. Being an alpha male can be learned btw. What most women call beta is simply ignorance as far as inter-personal skills are concerned and the place society wants you to be categorized. And what we were taught since we were little boys. And how Alpha traits are bad, that’s what I learned. I really don’t care if I’ve lost the best years of my love life because of ignorance.

  14. 14
    David T

    He’s not interested in going out much; whether that means he is not interested in you as his dating partner is a different question entirely. 
    You get together a bunch, you always respond to his communication, so if he is interested in doing something with you he will ask because he knows what the answer will be.  Maybe he just doesn’t plan things in any part of his life, or he is content and happy to be on his own most of the time.  Ask him directly during the nice dinner you are going to make for him, perhaps along the lines of “I enjoy hanging out with you but we only see each other once a week and I would enjoy more time together.  Would you like to do more activities together on the weekends?  It’s OK if you want that alone time. I can do things with my friends on my own.”
     
    Depending the answer you decide if this is a relationship that works for you.  It could be a daily friendly text message and once a week companionship is his relationship ideal.
     
    I have been described by some women as more beta, but dang, I  never hesitated to ask a woman out and give a kiss or start affectionate touching on the first date or two (when it feels right) because I want that.  Is that an alpha-beta thing or just a making your own wants happen thing? I think the OP’s dating partner is doing something else with his time.
     
    I also don’t mind when a woman make a plan to do something they want us to do together or they ask me out.  It usually exposes me to something I wouldn’t have thought of on my own and adventures are fun. :)

  15. 15
    Flgal

    This could not have come at a more perfect time. I am dating a “beta,” I guess, for the past 2 months, and I have been making myself nuts trying to sit back and let him lead – but this weekend, where I took the initiative a bit more in terms of future plans, he definitely responded in a positive way – which made me feel way more at ease about the situation.
    Anyways, I actually think cooking dinner is a great idea for a few reasons 1) If you can cook together, its a fun activity that allows you to get to know the person in a casual and less formal setting and 2) I notice a lot of guys really appreciate it when a girl goes a little out of her way for them – since many men tire of having to go through all the early and potentially expensive stages of courting without much of a guarantee that the girl is even interested ( I don’t mean sex – but who wants to shell out $100 for dinner that might not even lead to a second date?). I have cooked a few meals with (notice I said with and not for) the guy I am seeing and so far it has allowed us to get to know each other, because it’s a team effort and is more private than eating at a restaurant – which can get mundane. Also, both of us actually enjoy cooking, and since I am a neat-freak, I have no problem cleaning up after, which he definitely appreciated.

  16. 16
    Robyn

    I’m with Goldie on this one.
    If a man has been dating you for close to 2 months, and you’ve been very receptive to his asking you out and you’ve given him plenty of other signals that you’re interested in him and enjoy his company, then he should know by now that you’re not going to randomly turn him down if he asks you out again. Even if he is a so-called beta male.
    I would not offer to make him dinner (or dinner-bed-and-breakfast). That’s doing way, way, way too much of the heavy lifting at this stage of the game. I would suggest that you find some activity or event that you want to attend (and would attend solo in the absence of a date) and call & ask him if he’d like to join you. If he says yes, that’s great. If he says no, then you can attend solo & still have a good time.
    If he attends & enjoys your company, then he should be savvy enough to return the favor & ask you out for a future date – without too many heavy hints or overt prompting from you.
    When push comes to shove, even if a guy is a beta male, he can’t expect you to do all the asking. If he really wants to see you more than once every 7 days – especially if you’ve expressed interest in seeing him more than once every 7 days – then he will find a way to make it happen.
    And if he doesn’t, then you have your answer – and need to cut him loose and find some one who does want to spend time with you more than once a week, and who’s not scared to show it.
     

  17. 17
    Robyn

    P.S. “Getting To I Do” by Dr Pat Allen has some very good info on the masculine-feminine dynamic in a relationship, and how to go about things when you (as a woman) are the more “masculine energy” partner in the relationship.

  18. 18
    marymary

    When I suggest we go out, my boyfriend always asks where I would like to go. AGH! Some peeps are like that and as “faults” go it’s quite minor.  He’s loyal, kind and funny, but he won’t be surprising me with tickets to Paris. Just as well, I don’t like Paris.
    If it makes you feel better, think of it as co piloting rather than taking the lead.
     

  19. 19
    Kathleen

    I got Evans  “Why he Disappeared” book and loved it!!
    Another book I love is by Ali Binazir who wrote the Tao of Dating  He might describe this guy as a guy with a heart and no spine. 
    I think a guy who has a lot of feminine energy,( who is more passive indecisive and lacks initiative) is probably ideally paired with a woman with a lot of masculine energy.
    For a woman though who is more in her feminine, this sort of guy may bring a flatness of passion and lack of sexual polarity.   
    I like Binazirs description of heart and spine in men. Ive met jerks with no compassion who are very masculine (No heart but spine). Also have met a kind loving guy who has a great heart but lacks a life purpose and direction(spine) Im on the lookout for someone with both!
    This guy sounds so passive that I would definitely want some sort of confirmation that hes actually interested 

  20. 20
    Rose

    Seems nuts to me and overfuctioning to invite him anywhere and cook him dinner if you want to motivate and inspire him to step up. All that will do is reinforce his passive feminine behavior and not motiavte hmi to want to step up and become a man. Sounds crazy bf can’t be bothered to invite to do anything so I will chase him and reward him treating me like that by offferig to cook him dinner. Where’s the natural consequense for not making plans if you do this? Be less availablle and take yourself where you want you go. Unless you want to be the one doing the invuting, being the social director, over fucntioning and taking the lead always as that is what you will set yourself up for and being the man. Do you really want a a realtionship like that?

  21. 21
    Karl R

    Michelle asked: (original letter)
    “he’ll wait FOREVER, (in actuality, 5-7 days) before asking to see me again. What gives?”
     
    During my first serious relationship, I was rather shy. This caused me to be reluctant to take the initiative. I was comfortable maintaining the relationship at it’s current level, because that was low risk. Even though I wanted a more serious relationship, escalating the relationship to a more serious level felt risky … except when I already knew that my girlfriend wanted to get more serious.
     
    Best case scenario: he’s not sure how you’ll react if he asks you out more frequently, which makes him reluctant to escalate things.
     
    Robyn said: (#17)
    “If he really wants to see you more than once every 7 days – especially if you’ve expressed interest in seeing him more than once every 7 days – then he will find a way to make it happen.”
     
    I agree with this assessment. If you let him know that you’d like to see him more frequently, either he will ask you out more frequently, or you’ll know he’s not interested.
     
    m said: (#5)
    “So … dude gets dinner and the company of his lovely gf.  She has to call him up & invite him, make the plans, buy the groceries, plan the meal, make the whole thing (three courses at least, I’m sure), find the time to decorate both the house and herself, and charm him all evening …? I hope dude brings at minimum his best behavior, some thanks for the excellent meal, and two bottles of her favorite wine.”
     
    I agree with Frimmel (#12). Reverse the genders and it’s a normal date night from a man’s perspective. If things go well, he gets her best behavior and some thanks.
     
    I’ve never gotten two bottles of wine out of the deal.
     
    m,
    You have a very one-sided view of “reciprocity”.

  22. 22
    m

    @Frimmel -
     
    Not the first idea where you were going with that.  Principally becaus:
     
    a) two words:  wage gap.
     
    b)  in the scenario you’ve pseudo-created up there (seriously, dude; you’re going to just jack my hypothetical?  Maybe a little originality next time) “gal” is usually, at minimum, the sous chef and doing the dishes.  At least *this* gal is, when her man offers to cook dinner.  I don’t know what lazy girls *you’re* dating — maybe that’s worth some thought on your part. :-) :-)

  23. 23
    starthrower68

    I was married to a passive beta male for 12 years.  It was very difficult.  

  24. 24
    Yuri

    I suppose some betas fall into this category, and some don’t.  Perhaps others are more omega as Henriette likes to call them (I think that’s quite witty and cute).
    In high school, my  beta ex didn’t ask me to be his girlfriend until he was sure I liked him…but we never went out on dates – it was just the ultimate question.  Now in my 20s, I’ve noticed that betas will text and make plans for dates.  If I went on one date, and I’m receptive to their texts afterward, they will ask me out almost immediately.
    I’ve honestly never experienced a beta who didn’t ask me out on dates if I was communicating openly with him, so this is a bit weird to me. Believe me, I’ve been out with some pretty shy guys.  So if he didn’t make plans, I would think he wasn’t interested much like the writer.
    Perhaps if he is expecting her to make plans…or doesn’t know what to plan, that would make sense.  If it bothers her, I would just tell the guy that I would like it if he planned some activities that he enjoys.  I would hate to just do things I want to do.  Switching it up is fun.  Tactically, this is fairly assertive…I use it on my boyfriend sometimes. ha

  25. 25
    S

    I’m just so excited to even see this post about men who aren’t necessarily take charge all the time.  I wish more dating advice folks would speak more to this.
    And yes, Evan do add that caveat to Why He Disappeared.  Maybe a section on why the beta (for lack of a better term for it I can think of at his second) disappeared?  So much advice is based on the idea that men like to be men and pursue and that a woman be in her feminine energy and let him do that.  Well, much of your advice Evan is like that. But as someone above said, it’s not always so binary.  Sure a woman should adjust to the man she’s with but if she’s asking advice or reading books, she’s not sure who she’s got just yet.
    Even though I don’t believe males and females are always so squarely one way or the other, I do wonder if the less assertive male ever changes. You once wrote that men don’t go both ways and I think about that.  Sure, a woman can take charge now and then but with some men she’ll always have to take charge.  I really hope there are more men out there in the middle.  But not much advice out there talks about that.
    Anyway, just so pleased that you chose this letter. More info on different types of men and women!

  26. 26
    Frimmel

    M in #23
     
    With regards to A, this is not the blog/place for that discussion. I’ll just throw out my own old canard — fatality gap. Men are 92% of workplace fatalities (yes I can link to the stats.) I’ll also ask again, “Do men have to pay for dates because they make more money or do they make more money because they have to pay for dates?” I’m willing to leave it at that in a we’ll have to agree to disagree and will cede you the final word.
     
    With regard to B, I’m simply pointing out you most likely wouldn’t date a man with the attitude you expressed. But did you consider how that attitude sounds to men? But as Karl R. pointed out it is the expectation nearly all the women here expressed/express. It is business as usual for men. Men make plans. Men take charge. Men pay. Men initiate. Men step up and take responsibility. Men earn a woman’s affection.
     
    But then you want to throw out “wage gap?”
     
    For most guys, they follow orders. We do what others tell us at work. For most men, particularly men under thirty/thirty-five they’ve been taught all their lives to respect and defer to women. Women teachers. Their mother who divorced their father that they never got to see. “Don’t be that guy.” Look at the derision in which the “Game” guys/PUA are typically held for what at  reducto ad absurdum amounts to “stop putting women on a pedestal.”
     
    Men’s spaces in society have been eliminated. The person at work who tells him what to do is just as likely to be a woman as a man. A woman might have gotten the scholarship and his place in the prestigious school. Then she got his job and expected him to pay for dinner after condescending to go out with him.
     
    Fathers on TV are held in contempt and constantly portrayed as dupes and idiots. “Middle aged straight white male” is frequently used as derogatory. Unless the “bad guy” in movies is a middle eastern terrorist he’s probably a white male. There aren’t a lot of positive images of masculinity allowed. You should here a couple of my married men friends when I tell them they can’t defer to their wives all the time. They can’t process it.
     
    Yet many of the women in this thread seem a bit out of sorts that men aren’t manly enough?
     
    ***smh***
     
     
     

  27. 27
    Kiki

    Mirroring is a great concept, and works wonders in all walks of life. Actually, it is a concept that I heard about many years before this blog, in a game theory class (prisoners dilemma, etc). It boils down to the following common sense advice: give reward for behavior that you like, withhold reward for behavior you dislike.
    So, Evan’s advice in this case is to discontinue mirroring, which I find illogical. I find it strange that this concept would not apply to the so-called beta men.  I think we need Evan to elaborate a bit more on this.
    By the way, I am married to someone who was shy and would not hit on a woman even if she was walking around with a huge sign “I have a huge crush on you” on her head.  Getting him to the point of claiming me as his girlfriend took months, and then it took almost five years of ripening to the idea that he wants to marry me (I knew much earlier than him, but bit my tongue, and waited). I never dared to rush him, now I am wondering whether I could have had things faster.
     

  28. 28
    josavant

    The problem is that you don’t know whether you’re dating a beta or a guy who is not just that into you.  How are you supposed to tell the difference?
     
    Evan gives advice here as though this guy were definitely a beta as the OP said, so give him a chance.  The problem is that this is also the way a guy acts when he’s not that interested, but might as well get some free sex (and meals while he’s at it). We have nothing but the OP’s word to go on that he’s a beta. The truth is that the OP herself may not know.
     
    Tom answered in another page that he didn’t act interested or initiate for two ladies who were into him at the same time. he said that if they had taken a step back and saw how little effort he was putting into being with them, they would have stopped after a few days. This OP hasn’t stopped after a month. It makes you wonder if her guy is like Tom (just not that interested) rather than being beta.
     
    Sorry OP. Being “kind, attentive and affectionate” is not that much effort. I can do that to anyone I’m not into, and it just sounds like justification for you wanting to stay with him.

  29. 29
    Paula

    How are we defining Beta/Alpha? I as well think these are bogus terms. To me a true ‘Alpha’ is someone with real power and runs a company with thousands of people under his leadership. Someone like Obama or Gates. Most men by my definition would be considered Beta.
     
    Anyways, I had one guy hit on me and was very aggressive but I would classify him as Beta. Very passive, not really a strong leader. He obviously was hungry for a girlfriend and I wasn’t interested in him but I think Betas can be aggressive when necessary.
     
     

  30. 30
    Karl R

    Kiki said: (#28)
    “So, Evan’s advice in this case is to discontinue mirroring, which I find illogical. I find it strange that this concept would not apply to the so-called beta men.”
     
    You misunderstand how this works. Even for men (under more normal dating situations), the concept of mirroring still has value. It just changes slightly.
     
    When I was dating my wife (and previous girlfriends), I didn’t start out by mirroring them. Instead, I initiated, then watched to see if they were mirroring me. If not, I adjusted my actions to a more appropriate level based on their response.
     
    For the most part, I was effectively mirroring the woman’s response to my behavior. The only times I moved beyond that was when I wanted to move the relationship to another level. After taking the initiative, I sat back and waited to see what the response would be.
     
    josavant said: (#29)
    “The problem is that this is also the way a guy acts when he’s not that interested,”
     
    Women (usually) don’t take the initiative. However, I’m willing to bet each woman recognizes the difference in how she acts when she’s dating a man that she’s into versus one she’s indifferent to.
     
    It’s less obvious, but there still should be some indications.
     
    m said: (#23)
    “two words:  wage gap”
     
    Does that mean that you do all the planning and paying when you’re dating a man who earns less than you?
     
    If not, I fail to see where “reciprocity” enters your equation.

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