Can a Hot Woman Like Me Hold Out on Sex Until I Get a Commitment?

Can a Hot Woman Like Me Hold Out on Sex Until I Get a Commitment?

I’m a 31-year old woman, and have been dating a lot but have had little success. I’d say I’m in the very attractive category and have no trouble getting casual dates, but few guys seem serious. (I did see, and really appreciated, your post dedicated to the plight of pretty girls!) My last failed attempt has me really wondering what I’m doing wrong.

After about 4 dates (each time he’d follow up right away to tell me he had fun and wanted to see me soon), I spent a lot of time with this new guy one weekend and he introduced me to all his friends, who were very welcoming. The next weekend, we had a great evening together and went to his place, but I told him I wasn’t ready to have sex. He asked me why, and I told him truthfully that I really liked him, and that I wanted to be sure that we weren’t seeing other people first. I told him I could see myself getting more attached to him if we got really physical and just wanted to know there might be something there. Then I said that I was perfectly willing to talk about it all now if he was too. He said he understood, but didn’t say anything more just cuddled with me. We fell asleep together, then spent the next morning out for brunch and wandering around the local farmer’s market (his ideas). He seemed that day to be truly enjoying my company. But since then, he never called me again.

I accept that he’s no longer interested, and I’m prepared to be realistic and move on from this particular guy. I feel like it’s a good thing that I made my feelings clear — he responded by showing his true intentions were not to have a relationship but to just get laid. But how can this possibly keep happening? It’s pretty hard to think that he did such a 180 for any other reason than that I put my feelings out there. I feel fairly confident that if I had slept with him he would have made sure to see me again. You have said in your posts that sometimes you have to take a leap, but it can’t possibly be true that I have to “leap” and have sex with someone who’s just not quite willing to commit *yet* and then wait for him to decide that he’s willing to admit that he has feelings for me a few months later. Maybe in this case he really is seeing other people, but this scenario keeps repeating itself for me.

I think I must be doing something wrong, but I just refuse to accept that not having sex until he commits to me is the wrong decision. How many times do I have to go through this painful process before a guy (and a guy that I’m into) will be so crazy about me that he just says, okay, whatever you need – time, commitment, you’ve got it! I guess what I’m really asking for is some reassurance that a hot girl can hold out on sex without lowering her chances of finding a great, sexy and confident guy who’s really into her.

Thanks in advance for helping a girl out,

Colette

Dear Colette,

Guys want sex. Factor in that “great, sexy, confident guys” are more likely to be able to get sex in most circumstances, and, well, if you won’t give it to them, someone else will.

“Can a hot girl hold out on sex”? Yes.

“Can a hot girl hold out on sex and still hope to find a great, sexy and confident guy who’s really into her?” Yes.

Can a hot girl hold out on sex without lowering her chances of finding a great, sexy and confident guy who’s really into her?” No. Holding out on sex will inherently lower your chances of finding a guy.

Why? Because guys want sex. Factor in that “great, sexy, confident guys” are more likely to be able to get sex in most circumstances, and, well, if you won’t give it to them, someone else will.

But that doesn’t mean it’s impossible.

In fact, I want to laud you for waiting for a commitment before sex. If more women did that, there would be a lot less post-coital heartbreak. Alas, there would be a lot more of the pre-coital disappointment you’ve described above.

Choose your poison.

You feel “fairly confident” that he would have called you again after sex. What about all the other women who felt the same way and got burned? Clearly, you’re damned if you do, and your damned if you don’t.

So what’s a girl to do?…

Well, if you follow my advice – and, by refusing sex before a commitment, you have been – you get to see a man’s true stripes. If he steps up and commits to you, you have an answer. If he bails on you, you have an answer.

The only thing you can do differently is consider HOW you’re refusing to have sex. From your story, it sounded like you approached it in a healthy, adult fashion. But I wasn’t there. You may have felt that you were just speaking your mind and explaining your deep-seated reasons and ethics. Maybe all he heard was, “No. I don’t find you attractive.”

The disconnect between what we mean and what other people hear is at the heart of many relationship issues. Which is why it’s always valuable to step into the shoes of your partner – to attempt to see things through his eyes.

One thing that most women don’t know about men – in fact, one thing that MEN don’t even know about themselves – is that we are like sharks. We always need to be moving forward and making progress. If we’re not, we might as well be dead.

Consider a man who writes to you on Match.com. “You look hot. I want to meet. Here’s my number.”

An inartful come-on line, to say the least. But it’s how you deal with it that determines whether he sticks around for more. If you tell him, “I don’t feel comfortable talking to strangers on the phone. Why don’t you email me more about yourself?” you can pretty much say goodbye. It’s not that your desire to get to know him better was wrong. It’s that you told him “No! Your way is wrong. My way is right. Follow my rules.”

We want to make progress in the bedroom…to know that we’re headed in that direction EVENTUALLY.

A better way to approach this would be to be playful. “You’re right. I am hot. :-) But you know that good girls like me don’t call boys like you first. So, before we go any further, why don’t you tell me about the first time you…visited Europe . And don’t leave out any details. Inquiring minds want to know. Talk to you soon, sweetie!”

See the difference? One is terse and negative. The other is playful and encouraging. Playing a little hard to get – while still remaining completely available – raises your value. It makes him want to chase. It makes the process of getting to know you fun. And, most of all, it doesn’t tell him NO. It tells him, LATER. All he has to do is follow your directions and he’ll get what he wants.

Your job is to make your directions fun for him to follow.

Similarly, men want to feel we’re making progress in the bedroom. It’s not that we need to sleep with you on Date 1 or 2 or 3. It’s that we want to know that we’re headed in that direction EVENTUALLY. How you handle us in this delicate arena is a big factor in whether we choose to come back for more.

Put it this way: if I go out with a woman and kiss her on Date 1, that’s great. If I go out with her, and can’t do any more than kiss her on Date 2, I might get a little frustrated. If I go out with her and get stuck in the kissing zone on Date 3, I’m pretty sure that that will be the last date. I know. It sounds awful. But I can’t be the only guy who works this way.

A woman is not wrong for keeping her shirt on. But her refusal to make any sexual progress unintentionally makes a guy feel rejected, and most guys aren’t going to like it. I’m pretty sure it’s why they invented “bases” in high school. We don’t need to go all the way, but getting to second and having a view of third shouldn’t be out of the question. Regardless of whether you agree with me, for most confident, sexy, 35-year-old men, staying on “first” for a month is not a viable option.

So without getting all sordid, Colette, ask yourself how you made your partner feel on this fourth date. Was it all about you? Your morals, your desires, your past heartbreak? Or did you consider that he might like you – and that it’s hard for him stick with a woman who doesn’t make him feel attractive or desired?

I don’t know him. Maybe he was just a run of the mill player.

I don’t know you. Maybe you did all the right things.

But just because a man’s desires run counter to yours doesn’t mean they’re wrong. It means you have to find a way to let him know that, with proper communication, you can BOTH get what you want.

This, by the way, is the key to ALL dating and relating – understanding the opposite sex and finding a path that keeps both man and woman satisfied.

To learn how to get your needs met, while still keeping a man satisfied, check out my audio series, Finding the One Online. In a few hours, you will learn the secret to attracting the best men online and screening them, using my “The 2/2/2” rule, to ensure the highest quality first dates.

In three months, you will view dating and men in an entirely new way. And that’s a good thing!

Click here to learn more.

Much love,

Your friend,

Evan

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Comments:

  1. 1
    Loving Annie

    Evan,
    I so disagree with you. She told him that she found him attractive and she just wanted to wait until they were monogamous and she knew something was there between them.

    She was still willing to kiss and cuddle so she wasn’t being a tease or frigid, – she just wanted to wait before going all the way.

    He bailed because he didn’t get laid – his instant gratification was denied. He showed he right there that he was an assclown – and also that he didn’t value her enough to SHOW her over the next few dates that he cared/this was going to go somewhere.

    That is different from not letting him know there was chemistry.
    Of course someone will walk if they feel they aren’t wanted – this wasn’t the case with her.

    If a guy can’t wait for date 9 or 10 – he’s showing by his actions a lack of respect and genuine interest in HER. He can jack off for a few nights without it killing him.

    Yes, it may mean that few guys wait – that doesn’t mean the RIGHT guy won;’t be thrilled that she respects herself not to give it us easily, is intrigued by her healthy boundaries, and know they have a 1,000 times for wild monkey sex after just a few other weekends go by.

    A little frustration leads to increased desire as two peoplem begin to know each-other, it’s sort of like foreplay, you want it, you fantasize about it, when it finally happens things are incredibly intense between the two of you.

    She didn’t say he had to wait 6 months or something really hardcore that might have made him felt she was playing games/didn’t like or want sex with him.

    Your e-mail/phone example wasn’t comparable with this. Gently encouraging someone while taking it slow was exactly what this woman WAS doing.

    You’ve got to kiss a lot of frogs before you find a Prince.

  2. 3
    Kris

    Wow. Evan, you make men sound like SO MUCH WORK. Are they really?

    This is an interesting situation because this man has done all the “right” things in terms of introducing her to his friends, respecting her wishes, etc. It does sound to me like he wasn’t ready to commit. Personally I have never had this particular sex/no sex problem. Rather than put it on the man, trying to get him to say something about his feelings or status, I simply state my end, which is, “If you’re sleeping with other people I can’t sleep with you.” I sometimes go on to explain it’s not safe disease-wise, and is likely to hurt my feelings. Historically if the man is interested but has any other things going, he will excuse himself, wrap up or disengage from any loose ends out there, and put focus on getting to know “us” more. I don’t usually expect a man to expose his feelings so soon. In fact, sometimes they’ve asked me what mine are first!

    So, I re-read your statement: “…I wanted to be sure that we weren’t seeing other people first. I told him I could see myself getting more attached to him if we got really physical and just wanted to know there might be something there. Then I said that I was perfectly willing to talk about it all now if he was too…” It’s a lot and seems like you’re asking him to reveal a lot, verbally, about if he’s seeing someone, and if there’s, “something there.” I think it can be hard for men, or anyone, to do this on date 4. Then there’s the “if” of getting physical. I agree with Evan that men need to know it’s an eventuality, not an, “if.” So, again, my advice is, you just state YOUR position without working on getting information out of him. If he is interested, he KNOWS you are, and he’ll will act accordingly.

    Since this guy did all the right things, but time has passed and you haven’t heard from him, why not call him up and get some feedback? Like, “It seemed we were on the road to getting to know each other and I was really enjoying that. It’s fine with me to not continue since it seems you don’t want to…I’m just wondering if I offended you in some way?” You may be surprised by what you hear. Maybe he got a little freaked out and he’s been hoping YOU will call. Or, maybe he’ll just say, “You know, I did have someone else I was interested in and that suddenly took off.” Either way, you’ll have your answer! Better than sitting around wondering…

    Good luck,

    Kris

  3. 4
    BeenThruTheWars

    I agree with Annie’s post no. 1. The right guy will ABSOLUTELY wait for sex with his dreamgirl. I don’t care how old or how experienced the players are, or how “hot” or “plain” they are. This is just a fact. Decent men who are the “marrying kind” want to know that the woman they are considering making a lifelong commitment to is not sexually easy for them to get — because that means she will be sexually easy for other men to get, and I don’t care what men say in jest about how fun it is dating a nympho or whatever, they DO NOT want to think about their sweethearts being promiscuous.

    I was 44 and my now-husband was 34 when we were courting. We kissed beginning on the second date and we didn’t seriously make out until about the 9th date, after he asked me to be exclusive. We went to bed shortly after that. He asked me about sex early on and I smiled and said lightly, “I’m a really generous woman, but the one thing I won’t share is my man. If I think there’s any possibility of our doing this really special thing together, then the next night you’re off doing that same special thing with another woman, that just doesn’t appeal to me, sorry.” He loved it! All the other women who jumped in bed with him, thinking it would be the way to hook him or hold onto him — wrong. He would take what he wanted and be outa there. He’d been waiting his whole life for the woman who valued herself enough to hold out for at least the promise that exclusive dating might lead someplace permanent. That kind of woman is rara avis. ESPECIALLY when she is hot!

    I do think you’re messing up in terms of your approach, though, Colette. It sounds like in response to “Let’s get intimate” you initiated a big relationship talk (which most men HATE), wanting to know where he stood right then and there. That scares men off, even when they’re seriously interested in a woman. A far better response, after only a few dates, would be something like, “I’m flattered you’re that attracted to me; I really dig you, too. It’s kind of early though. Why don’t we see where things go? I’d like our first time to be really special.” Make the words fit into your own mouth, but that idea. Or use a variation of the “rationale” I used, and keep it short and sweet. Notice how I set forth my boundaries (“We need to be exclusive/monogamous before I will sleep with you”) without coming out and saying those words. I said what I said in a very playful tone of voice. You should, too. Don’t turn “Wow, do I ever want to take you to bed and ravish you” into an excuse for finding out a man’s intentions. Just smile and enjoy it and tell him how flattered you are, while still laying out your own boundaries. Like Evan says, give the guy hope! That’s what will keep him hooked, not easy sex.

    Sherry Argov in her book “Why Men Love Bitches” talks about sex during courtship in terms of “giving it up one Jujube at a time.” Very similar to Evan’s talking about “bases.” It sounds like what you really need are “what to say when” ideas. Be light and witty and a little mysterious, and give the guy something to look forward to in the future, without giving away more than you’re comfortable with. And without “offering” to nail down your relationship right then and there. That’s the man’s job, Colette. It’s your job to consider whether you like the parameters he sets over time and either accept or reject them and move on. It is not our job as women to drive the relationship, and I think maybe that’s the source of your bad luck, if this tends to be a pattern for you.

  4. 5
    zann

    Well said, LOVING ANNIE!!!!

    Just one more thing that has not been mentioned in this debate…maybe because it’s obvious, but…. having him claim he is ready for commitment STILL doesn’t guarantee — “post-coital” that he actually is. In other words, he can still hide his true stripes, tell you he is ready to make that leap, and still be gone before the breakfast dishes are washed. I don’t mean to sound like the Grim Reaper, but unfortunately, there are no guarantees any way you look at it. That said, though, I have to keep believing, as Evan says, that if a woman (and not just “pretty” women) determines her personal healthy boundaries and learns to communicate them in a non-rigid, non-frigid, encouraging way, she’ll eventually get to a man of substance and integrity, who is also hot. Just plan to do a lot of frog kissing first.

  5. 6
    Cathouse Teri

    Evan, you make some great points.

    But I don’t think there is ever anything wrong with saying, “I am just not ready for sex.” There are many, many, many, many men who (although they may want sex) are willing to wait and see where it goes. I do not think a woman (or man, for that matter) should have to explain their reasons for wanting to wait, either.

    Believe me, if a man is put off by the fact that you open up and say, “Hey, I wanna wait,” then he is nothing like ready to be open to understanding where you may be coming from, relationally. And that makes him NOT a candidate for a future.

    I think this is a great way to weed out the frogs. They hop along on their merry way and find sex with some other hot girl and whateverthehell else they are looking for.

    Stick to your guns, babe. I guarantee a prince of a man will come along at some point.

  6. 7
    Cleo

    “It sounds like in response to “Let’s get intimate” you initiated a big relationship talk (which most men HATE), wanting to know where he stood right then and there. That scares men off, even when they’re seriously interested in a woman.”

    I fully agree. This is the part that set off alarms for me. It was way to early to say this to him. Oh well. Live and Learn.

    1. 7.1
      Nissa

      Me three. I immediately thought, what’s all this talking? I’d probably just have gotten up for a drink of water, smirked and said “wow, I need to cool off…is it hot in here?” Both messages conveyed – I’m into you, but I’m slowing it down.
      Men tend to see what you do, instead of hear it.

  7. 8
    Robert

    Annie, your views are noble, but way out of line with reality. Here’s the reality for guys(I’m paraphrasing the book title): She’s just not into you!

    Evan, your response as usual, was pretty close to the way I feel. In the relationships in my life that I had with women that were most long term and most meaningful to me, sex happened much sooner than the 9-10 dates that Annie referred to. Why? Because there was so much good energy in the air between us, that we couldn’t stay apart. I’m not referring to just sexual energy. I’m talking about a strong emotional connection.

    I once dated a lady that I sincerely liked a lot. She wasn’t ready to “go all the way” after 5-6 dates and countless hours on the phone together because she first wanted a commitment of monogamy from me. While I understood her sentiment, the discussion took some romantic breeze from my sail. I was really into this girl and I wanted our lovemaking to stem from romance and mutual, not from a contract.

    I thought that I was a good “risk” to her but she needed the verbal promise, which I wouldn’t give. Not because I wasn’t ready for it. I just thought that it was a foolish thing to say, knowing that if things didn’t work out for either of us, she’d run for the hills as fast as I would if I was the unhappy one.

    Ladies, do you want some guy to B.S. you and say what you want to hear in order to get laid or do you want emotional intimacy? I suspect the latter. Pinning him down to an agreement so early that YOU may not even want to live up to may or may not yield the results you want.

  8. 9
    Honey

    If I were single, I think things would either fall into a “friends with benefits” category or a “monogamous-this-might-be-leading-somewhere” category. And which one it was would have to be clearly established before I’d hop in the sack.

    The BF and I had sex on our first date…on our second date (a day and a half later) we agreed to be exclusive. Like some others here said, we had so much good energy the sex was inevitable…but the energy was also so good that agreeing to be exclusive was easy.

  9. 10
    JuJu

    Kris,

    right on, every point you made.

    Me? Well, I personally wouldn’t even consider committing to a man if I don’t know what he is like in bed. Why on earth should the guy?

    Listen to what Robert said, ladies. All this “prince” talk is a bit, shall we say, naive.

  10. 11
    JuJu

    Oh, as for men being so much work, the guy who writes “your hot” is not worth my time or effort. Attempting to extract any semblance of an intelligent exchange out of that would be akin to juicing a stone.

    In other words, be very discriminate as to whom you choose to “work” on.

  11. 12
    Kris

    Hi Juju,

    Thanks for the props.

    By, “work,” I just meant all the thinking women are told to do to phrase things correctly for the men…to be “playful,” encouraging, playing hard to get, mysterious, light…whatever. Most men who like me…I can just tell them what’s up and they’re cool with that. It’s a lot of work, otherwise, for something that probably won’t work, anyway…if it needs that much of a delicate touch. Phew. I’m tired just thinking about it.

    I would say to any men on this blog: feel free to ask questions of women for clarification. We might not have said it EXACTLY right! And then the two go their separate ways…what a shame! Que lastima!

    Bueno!

    Kris

  12. 13
    Kris

    It sounds like, from reading the above, when it’s right he wants what you want, no matter, whether it’s right-away-sex or let’s-wait-sex. Which leads us back to the mythological: you just haven’t met the right one yet. Maybe it’s true. It would put Evan out a job, though! ;~)

    I still think she should call him. I live in a small enough town that inevitably you run into the person and you can say, “What’s up?” But in bigger towns, gotta p/u the phone. Do it! Do it! Now even I’m curious, after all this speculation.

    Kris

  13. 14
    downtowngal

    “You may have felt that you were just speaking your mind and explaining your deep-seated reasons and ethics. Maybe all he heard was, No. I don’t find you attractive.”

    c’mon, Evan, gimme a break. If he really felt that way he wouldn’t have stayed with her through the end of the next day.

    So what’s a girl to do – put out just to keep the guy if it doesn’t feel right to her?

    Collette clearly stated what she’s looking for – she didn’t say she was looking for him to totally commit to her right then or there, just that she wasn’t ready to sleep with him yet after ONLY 4 DATES. and she wasn’t playing any games, just being straight up.

    And maybe the guy realized he wasn’t ready for that type of committment at all – not from her nor from anyone else.

    That doesn’t mean Collette did anything wrong – only saved herself from future heartache. If she slept with him she would have gotten very attached and on an emotional roller coaster.
    And I’ll be you anything that this guy respects her as much as she respects herself. And a couple of years from now when he’s ready to settle down he’ll be kicking himself realizing what a schmo he was.

  14. 15
    JuJu

    It’s a lot of work, otherwise, for something that probably won’t work, anyway if it needs that much of a delicate touch.

    Exactly. I am with you on that. Which is why I don’t subscribe to any of the “seduction rules” so abundantly dispersed to women. If I can’t be myself with this person and, particularly, if we are on such different wavelengths that he can misunderstand / misinterpret me like that, then… well, it isn’t much of a relationship.

    As for commitment, whenever I hear people talking about that (what I perceive as prematurely), or this no sex before marriage thing we discussed here recently, I just itch to ask all involved: would you commit to a person if you didn’t know what s/he looked like? What their personality / worldview was like? Why exactly is this any different?

  15. 16
    Ron

    I agree 100% with Loving Annie…and I’m a dude. Go figure.

    The right man will wait for the right girl. Unless something dramatic happened at that date at the farmer’s market, it’s obvious the guy 86′d you because he couldn’t get in your pants.

    Anyone with high self esteem would say, “his loss, not mine.” Good thing for you you didn’t have sex with him. Imagine how you would’ve felt if you did and never heard from him afterwards.

    The right guy will wait for you. Unfortunately, ordering the right guy or the right girl is not as easy as ordering out for a pizza delivery.

  16. 17
    Ron

    I disagree STRONGLY with Kris.

    Don’t call this guy. It will be a big mistake. Move on. This guy has dumped you like cargo because you would not have sex with him on his terms.

    He’s driftwood. Move on. There are shitloads of quality people out there. You will lose all your personal power if you call this “man” up and ask him what happened.

    TRUST ME. If you meant everything to that “man,” HE would still be calling you.

  17. 18
    just saying...

    Evan, it’s one thing to discuss how a woman gets her point across to a guy she’s emailing on line. It’s another when you’re talking about having sex with someone for the first time.

    this guy is only looking for sex.

    Collette, keep at it; you said you have no problem getting dates so you have plenty of opportunities to move on and find a guy who respects you for you.

  18. 19
    Steve


    I feel like it’s a good thing that I made my feelings clear he responded by showing his true intentions were not to have a relationship but to just get laid.

    Some people want both and may leave if they are not getting one need or another met.

  19. 20
    Cute Redhead

    I think the answer is no. If you are a woman you cannot hold out on having sex with a man, especially if you are hot. It is your responsibility as a woman to take care of the sexual needs of a man if you hope to have a relationship with him. The sooner you can demonstrate that you are willing and able to take care of his sexual needs, the more likely it is that he will commit, if only for a short time, and maybe even love you enough to be exclusive, if only for short time. I’m not sure what the woman gets in return for this, but I’m sure that he will let her know what he is willing to offer her once they are committed. It isn’t really right to make deals for sex, so you can’t really expect anything in return for having sex with him — that’s a bit whorish. The most you can expect is the CHANCE that he will pick you out of all the women out there that he is sleeping with, wants to sleep with, or may someday meet and sleep with.

    Ahem. OF COURSE you can have sexual boundaries, and if the guys you meet don’t get it, their loss. You sound great, Collette, and like you have your head on straight. Hold out for the right guy and the right relationship, if that’s the way you want to do it.

  20. 21
    bella

    A woman shouldn’t have to be a politician/motivational-speaker/nurturer/sex kitten all at once, just to get a guy to commit to her.

    I think what you said was fine. Don’t beat yourself up over it. We are not computers, prepared with perfect speeches every time we are in an intimate situation. You were perfectly human in your reaction, feeling somewhat vulnerable, and acting truthfully. You’re allowed to be yourself, express yourself, and say what you want. Guys certainly do it all the time.

    If what you said scared him off, then fine, he wasn’t right for you.

    There are absolutely men who are cool with waiting. And there are even some who will suggest it themselves. Patience is sexy. Willpower is sexier.

    And regarding those guys who write dumb emails that include the phrase, “ur hot, can i call u?” and so forth….. I disagree that a girl should write some catchy, come-hither reply to encourage him to write more.

    Puhleeze.

    That’s Neanderthal communication.

    If a man isn’t savvy enough to know how to talk to a woman from the get-go, why should she waste her time encouraging him to pursue her even more?

    The goal isn’t to get EVERY man to like you.

    The goal is to not give up until you find the RIGHT one.

  21. 22
    hunter

    I like post #20 from Cute Red Head….

  22. 23
    downtowngal

    Ron, you’re totally right. This guy is very immature. Collette told him that she didn’t feel comfortable sleeping with somone untill they’re both exclusive – gee, what’s wrong with that? especially in an age of rampant STD’s.

    CuteRedhead said “If you are a woman you cannot hold out on having sex with a man, especially if you are hot. It is your responsibility as a woman to take care of the sexual needs of a man if you hope to have a relationship with him” – WTF???????? Yeah, maybe after being in a committed relationship you both have to serve each other’s needs, but c’mon.

    Collette, it sounds like you have tons of options – keep at it. Maybe you’re choosing to date the wrong guys? Try paying attention to the more quiet guys, not these jerky types.

  23. 24
    Jojo

    I agree with Loving Annie and DownTown. I think that there’s a high emphasis placed on sex which is so superficial. I don’t think that no sex means not interested. What’s wrong with getting to no someone before having sex. I don’t understand how people sleep together after a date or two. Yes, I do feel that sex is important, but I need to get to know the guy before becoming intimate.
    I was friends with a guy where we pretty much just spoke on the phone. We admitted that we liked each other and decided to go on a date for VD. For a second date, he invited me to his house to watch a sex show that we used to watch together on the phone; which came on at midnight. He lived an hour away and said he would pick me up around 9PM. I took this as a bootie call because he wasn’t planning dinner or anything during the day; especially that we were both off that day! I expressed my feelings and he was sorry I felt that way. We spoke two days later and I noticed a change in him. He made excuses about not wanting to ruin the friendship and then didn’t speak for like 10 days. I kept wondering what if I would have gone? I called him and we spoke and I told him that I wanted to go out and get to know each other in a personal level because talking on the phone is not the same as personal interaction. We went on a second date and fooled around, but no sex. A time after that, he invited me to his house and then we had sex. I asked him if we were exclusive and he said “well you’re not seeing anyone and I’m not.” He went away on a trip for 10 days and never heard from him, but called me when he returned and brought me back something. It took 10 days before I got to see him and when I did see him it was for a short time and basically just had sex with him. We even had a weekend trip planned in which he canceled. I started to feel like he wasn’t that interested because we would only see each other like once every 3 weeks. When I spoke to him and told him that I would like to spend more time with him, he said ” I do what I can.” I ended it and told him that I didn’t want a phone relationship.
    It looks like he was just interested in just sex with me and nothing more. My point is that when he saw I didn’t go to his house that first time, we lost contact. When he did finally sleep with me, it didn’t change anything. Like Evan says you’re dammed if you do and dammed if you don’t!
    Collette it looks like he wanted to get in your pants and if you had, he still might not have called or pulled away slowly!

  24. 25
    Cat

    I havent been on this mailing list for too long, so I may have missed this. Where in the midst of all the talk about sex and intimacy, do you bring up the topic of safe sex? it seems to me that ALWAYS has to be in any discussion about sex. And if you are going to have it at all, with anyone, it assumes that the person you are discussing it with , is going to be honest. Trust and honesty develop over time, so what is even the question about waiting for sex? Don’t people care enough about themselves to safeguard their own lives and health?
    I went out with a guy recently who told me that every woman he ever dated had sex with him on the first date!! He seemed offended that I would even bring up the question of whether he had ever been tested. Can you talk about this? Cat

  25. 26
    Damie

    My husband made me wait months before he would have sex with me. He was scared and didn’t want to get burned. I, of course, thought he wasn’t really that into me. Now here we are almost 2 years later and I’m feeding out baby as I type this.

    I didn’t read through every single response, so maybe someone said this already, but women want sex too. If women stopped acting like they were doing guys some kind of favor giving them sex then maybe it wouldn’t be this big power struggle thing.

    Some guys don’t want to continue with a relationship unless they know it’s going to be physical. Why? Because it feels good and that’s one of the reasons people get in relationships. You can’t deny that. It might have been better to talk about your sex boundaries before you’re in a room half naked getting all close. Maybe he didn’t hear “I’m not attracted to you.” Maybe he heard, “small boner.”

  26. 27
    Kris

    Cute Redhead indicates she was *kidding* in her first paragraph when she starts the next one with, “Ahem.” Catch the subtleties.

    So much speculation going on about this man’s intentions and thoughts which, in fact, only he knows. It seems filtered by stories of some who have dated some cads. We don’t really know anything about this guy, and if there were only 4 dates, the writer also knows just a bit. Personally I have had MEN ask to wait and one even say to me, “I would have liked to have known you better first,” after our premiere. They are not all about getting some right off the bat.

    What matters is what she does now, and she has lots of advice. Colette, OF COURSE you didn’t do anything, “wrong.” If you really want to know what happened this man is the only one who can tell you. Otherwise it’s just a guess. If this happens to you repeatedly, the feedback might be worth it. But, don’t give up…at some point you’ll meet someone who gets YOU, and this is the point of dating!

    Good luck,

    Kris

  27. 28
    vino

    Interesting posts.

    Am I the only one besides Cute Redhead who noticed this was a bartering transaction? (If you give me commitment, I may give you sex)

    If he doesn’t want to spend his relationship negotiating for sex, he’s absolutely right to move on.

    Also, Collette wants to put her preconditions on sex and in general, the relationship. I don’t say she is right or wrong for doing so and it may be perfectly right for HER, but I find it interesting that so many posters assume her guy is a cad or jerk or immature for not wanting to accede to HER preconditions. I don’t know that he’s a cad or jerk any more that Collette is a controlling egoist for wanting to control the relationship & parcel out sex on her terms… See how it can go both ways? Or is it only that “must make men commit and also to our ground rules before sex” is the only acceptable paradigm? Maybe there’s plenty of room for other ways of viewing relationships without the hate & name calling, no?

    Cute Redhead’s #20 was spot on. It looks like Collette wants to set all the ground rules for the, or any, relationship because she’s hot (or thinks she is), and therefore guys should wait and kowtow to her ground rules. In return, she may dole out sex. Right minded guys who don’t want to deal with that should, as this guy did, leave. Smacks of hubris. I bet this turned him away, at least in part.

    Fact -the more preconditions before sex, the more likely it is he’ll look someplace else for fewer (or none) preconditions. There’s a large market of women out there who won’t barter in such a fashion. That’s cold, but it is the reality. In effect, her guy had other choices, and preferred to exercise them.

    Besides, if Collette were really ‘into him’ all of this wouldn’t have occurred…she would’ve happily done the horizontal mambo (or kneeling rhumba, or…?) for that matter ;-)

  28. 29
    Lisa

    Cat

    I have had lots of dates, and I NEVER slept with any of them on the first date. That guy was totally bs’ing you or he goes out with alot of sleazy women.

    I agree with Loving Annie, Downtown, and Ron on this subject.
    Cute Readhead…WTF?????? You are warped!

  29. 30
    JuJu

    Cute Redhead is the only one on here in touch with reality.

    The big disconnect between men and women is that men are able to just enjoy the moment, while women think of any relationship not leading to [their preferred form of commitment] as a waste of their time.

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