What If People Said What They REALLY Thought on First Dates?
I was a comedy writer in my 20’s. 11 screenplays. 15 sitcom specs. Agents. Managers. Meetings at every studio and network. Warner Brothers Writers Workshop. Project Greenlight. UCLA Film School. I pretty much did everything one could do in Hollywood without making a living. And while I am much happier as a dating coach than when I was a penniless screenwriter, every time I read something funny that sounds like something I could have written, I get a twinge of envy.
Entitled “If People Had Honest First Date Conversations,” it requires no further introduction. If you’ve been on some bad first dates (and I’m betting you have), you will find this piece both true and entertaining, which, to me, is the hallmark of first-rate comedy.
A small excerpt (as told by the woman author):
Me: By the way, what are you looking for?
Him: Well I sure as hell don’t want to be in a relationship. I just want someone I can fuck, who’s cool with me fucking other people.
Me: So you can avoid your feelings by keeping things on the surface?
Him: Yup. You cool with that?
Me: Well, I really like you, so I’ll say I’m cool with that, because I believe that I can change your mind by proving how fun and entertaining and worthy of your love I am.
Him: That sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. But you’ll still fuck me, right?
Me: Oh, yeah, totally.
Click here to read the whole thing and let me know in the comments section which line you found to be the most embarrassingly accurate.
“Oh yeah, just, if I sleep with you tonight, you’ll call me afterwards, right? You’ll ask me out again? Because if you don’t I’ll feel like I’m going to die from the God-sized hole inside me.”
Rachel, I totally loved/identified with your comment. At least it made me smile…now. At the time the God-sized hole you speak of engulfed my self-esteem.
I have had a particularly hard time the past year because I had breast cancer and a mastectomy with no reconstruction. What a crappy road to navigate -I have been dating, and I am aware of my own drama with it all, but it has been hard. I know I am a good catch though. I dated someone earlier in the year and waited 2 months to be intimate with him – and then once we were, I never saw him again. Was the first person I slept with since my surgery 2 years ago – that was disappointing.
He is the one who loses Rach. Not you. There are men out there that will accept you just the way you are! ❤️❤️
Rachel, that guy was an ass and I’m sorry he let you down. Keep your chin up and keep moving forward. You deserve the best!
A toss up between:
Him: That’s because I’m hot and cold. I can be very loving, and then completely withdraw.
and:
Me: Great, both of my parents are workaholics, so that’s totally in my wheelhouse. Don’t worry, I’m completely comfortable feeling neglected by you because your top priority is your job.
In a way I feel better because it’s not only me? LOL. I just dropped the workaholic as a friend. Good luck to him. And I wish men would just say the hot and cold thing off the bat. But they act like it’s perfectly normal. It’s not.
“Perfect! Your wounds will get along great with mine.”
So true!
This reminded me of something my shrink told me: “you need to find someone who has a compatible pathology.”
I think he’s saying the same thing but in shrink-talk.
Me: I enjoyed your company. Would you like to go out again later this week?
Her: I realized I wasn’t feeling any sparks, chemistry or butterflies – an hour ago. Thank you for the free dinner and entertainment, though. If you call me again, I’ll make vague excuses not to see you in hopes that you will get the hint and leave me alone.
Yeah like “Can I take a raincheck?” more than once. I get the hint. Thanks
Yeah, it’s amazing how things are always presented from a woman’s perspective and the man rejecting her (or the “avoidant”, according to NewSpeak, which implies the man has intrinsic psychological problems for dismissing a woman as LTR material, while a woman has every right to dismiss a man for anything – which of course it’s true, but for both sexes) is always one of those guys who has options and is in the position to demand sex because he can move to the next willing woman, never one of the majority of men whose options are scarce.
Personally, I dealt with soulless men in dating, but I had moments when I was, more or less consciously, soulless. I ghosted and I was ghosted. A couple of men used me just for sex and ego validation, but I used some men just for emotional support and ego validation, with no intention to give something in return, even when I knew they loved me. That’s how dating is and that’s how the world works.
The situation described in this imaginary dialogue (the “avoidant” man and the “bottomless pit of needs” woman) is not even true for the majority of dating situations. But it’s always the most reminded and advertised because it’s the most hurtful for the female ego: the man with options who can reject and involuntarily humiliate an average woman by considering that he can do better for a relationship. Basically, the minority of men who can behave like women (or at least like atractive women of fertile age) in dating. It stings for women, so it’s always presented as a common dating situation. But it is not. The more common dating situation is the one you described: thanks for the free meal and thoughtful date, but I don’t feel the chemistry.
Let me add from my experience:
ME: So I have a very good relationship with my ex-husband. He’s one of my best friends. It helped that I did some post-divorce therapy.
HIM: I’ll say it’s cool that you like your ex in this moment but I’ll let you know it’s not by making unkind comments about him at every opportunity. I’m guessing you really did therapy because you have issues. All women are crazy. I know because every woman I’ve ever dated has been crazy. Not just regular crazy either; I’m talking completely out of her mind insane. I’ve dealt with unprovoked anger and yelling on many, many occasions. What’s wrong with women? You should know that you will be relegated to the same “crazy” category after our relationship goes up in flames. BTW I hate my wife and one of my children hasn’t spoken to me in over three years. I think she turned the kid against me. It’s only one of the many ways she’s been a monster to deal with. The real reason she divorced me is that she sees all of her divorced friends having a blast with their husbands’ hard earned money and wanted to join in. It certainly was nothing I did or didn’t do. I was an angel of a husband. She didn’t appreciate me enough. It’s my absolute belief in that I am a victim that has kept me from doing any sort of therapy or soul searching so I can avoid the same mistakes in future relationships.
I both laughed and cringed at these first date conversations! This really spoke to me:
Your wounds will get along great with mine. Because I like to abandon myself and focus all my energy into taking care of and healing deeply wounded men
I’m not proud to admit that was me. However, I can also say that no longer is me. I’m really done playing Florence Nightingale, to men who need a therapist more than a date. I’m happy to now be with someone who doesn’t need to be “fixed”.
In a way I almost wish people would be that upfront, right off the bat, so that the parties have a better idea of what they’re getting into…but I don’t see that actually happening in the real world. All the more reason to proceed with caution and get to know someone slowly before making any major decisions.
The whole thing was pure genius and she really got my respect when she mentioned Harville Hendrix. I think another title for it could be, Speaking From The ID.
This is hilarious and reminds me a bit of of a musical I saw off-Broadway (almost 20 years ago!) called, “I Love You, You’re perfect, Now Change!”
This conversation doesn’t resonate so strongly with me personally but, like everyone, I have my own heap of insecurities and idiosyncrasies which lead to my own ridiculous unspoken scripts. One would be something along these lines.
Me: I only feel attraction to men once I’ve come to know them, a bit: 3 or 4 weeks, minimum
Him: I’ll pretend to be okay with this. But, in fact, I’m certain women are like men: attracted immediately or not at all. So, if you do end up falling for me, I’ll never truly believe it. Also, it’s an ego boost when women want me from the get-go so although I’ll continue to date you while you get to know me and figure out if there’s attraction on your part, you’ve already insulted me by not wanting me from the first moment you saw me. Although I’d never admit it, least of all to myself, I’ll be sure to hold that against you, you uppity b*tch.
Me: Cool. I’ll get to know you. And if I find there’s an attraction blossoming, I’ll grow more and more attached to you.
Him: Right. And I’ll lose interest bc the chase is over, and maybe I’ve discovered that I’m not particularly attracted to you, after all. Also, I’ll want to put you in your place bc you made me work longer than other women have and now I have the upper hand. So, I’ll stick around, act ambivalent, make snarky put-downs and you’ll put up with it?
Me: Of course. Bc, by the time I actually like you, I’ll have invested time and have made myself vulnerable, so I’ll be hooked. Also, I’ll remember how sweet and eager you were at the beginning and I’ll be certain that if only I try harder, you’ll be that way again.
Him: Cool. Just to summarize: when you need time to know if your interested in me, it activates all my insecurities which I can then unleash on you once you’ve decided you like me?
Me: Yup. I’ll stick around for waaay longer than I should while you treat me like crap, hoping you’ll return to acting like you did during those initial weeks… and, of course, you never will.
Him: Hell, naw.
Well, my version isn’t witty like the original. But it’s embarrassingly accurate.
True story. This happened to me today. Not on a first date. But on a dating site. A guy sent me a message. Here’s how it went:
Jay: Hi, would you be interested in having a fling? Me: Thank you for the invitation but no. Your profile says you want to find someone to marry. Obviously, I’m not your type for your end game, just a fling. You are attractive. I think you won’t have a problem getting dates. Good luck in your search. Jay: But I’m really not looking to get married, just sex for now.
After a few minutes I went back to view his profile again. I was a bit confused because I could have sworn his profile showed his intention for dating was marriage. Well, he wasted no time in making revisions. Now his profile makes his intentions perfectly clear.
Intent: Casual dating/ No commitment. About me: Friends with benefits. First date: Sex on the first date
His tag line reads “Looking for a good woman”. What it should say is ” Looking for a good woman to f*ck.” LOL
The real story here isn’t what HE said, it’s that YOU actually wasted your time and gave him any response at all….LOL
JB, I disagree. It was not a waste of my time. I am curious about what men say and how they choose to do things. I found humor in it and I wanted to share it.
My typical dating experience:
Me: I am enjoying getting to know you. If you could have only one meal for the rest of your life, what would that be?
Her: I don’t want to talk about shallow things. My ex-husband was abusive and he even yelled at me in front of my parents.
Me: Wow. That’s heavy. Where would be your ultimate fantasy vacation spot?
Her: I don’t know. I haven’t had a real vacation in 5 years. My boss is a jerk. He always makes me work on Saturday.
Me: Your getting too heavy for me on the first date. How about telling me about your friends.
Her: I don’t have time to talk about frivolous things. I work 60 hours a week and I don’t want to waste time if we are not compatible.
Me: “Check please.”
@John: Not sure if I should laugh or cry at your sub-text conversation. Ouch!
John, I’ve been thinking a lot about your words. I’d like to respond with some ideas, with the intention of helping you have a better dating experience.
My first thought was that I, a quality woman, would also have not known what to say to your questions. For example, what I want to eat and what I eat are very different! I would have felt put on the spot and not known what to say. I get the sense that what you really want is to really get to know this person, to know their passions and what they want in life. I get the sense that your dates are responding with silence and coldness, when what you want is a sense of who they are and warmth.
What would be most effective here, IMO, is leadership from you to help these women get where you want them to go. I think this would make the date much more pleasurable for both of you, if you model the behavior you want from the woman. For example, instead of your first question, you say “if I could only….it would be pizza! I love the gooey cheese, the rich tomato flavor of the sauce…it feels decadent. What about you? …Any foods that you love?
The above is very different because: 1) while you are talking, she has time to think about your words and formulate a response, so she is much less likely to feel taken by surprise by the question at the end. 2) your example gives her an idea of what kind of response you expect, so she is much less likely to be worried about giving you a “wrong answer” because you just gave her a template. Therefore, she won’t need to pause, and your example will encourage her to match your level of description and liveliness. 3) By using words that are food-related and feeling words, a woman is much more likely to respond than to words like “fantasy”. A lot of people (both genders) are so ground down by life it is genuinely difficult to extract their mind, not to mention emotionally painful to think about all the things they want that they currently don’t have (we are not all success stories,yes?). If you bring up something painful to them, that would explain why they are shutting down or bringing up negatives when you say this. Using feeling words can help them connect to what they feel is available (which is more likely the past than the present or future). If they connect to your words, they will perceive you as easy to talk to and connect with, even though they don’t know why. Then you can talk about your passion – what you desire, what stirs your blood, what gets you pumped up – which will inspire them to tell you all about what does it for them.
That sounded like a bunch of psycho babble. I doubt too many people “actually think” in such terms. May be if it were two shrinks on a date lol. Most first “blind” dates suck in much simpler ways. Sort of like:
Him: sorry I am late [i can’t believe I agreed to come out of my neighborhood]
Me: Don’t worry about it! [15 min late? Strike one, dude. While I am at it, strike two for being 2 inches shorter than advertised, and for failing to make a reservation]… So where do you live?
Him: I am in an UpAndComing neighborhood. It’s really fun! [We should have just met there as I suggested]
Me: oh yeah I know that area. There are some cool ethnic restaurants on the corner of X and Y [what a shithole. Next he’s gonna tell me he lives in a walk up. Thank God I am only meeting him for coffee I would hate to be stuck here for more than 20min]
etc.
Funny.
Stacy–yikes! I bet most guys can smell that one a mile away. I’d run before we ever made a date.
This is a funny thread. However, I have to ask: what the hell kind of men are you women going for, who treat you like this? Seriously, I am not this way, and neither are most of my friends. I only have one or two who act this way, on a date. (Primarily referring to asking for sex almost immediately and/or ghosting after getting sex)
While we’re at it, since some are picking on deceptions concerning appearance and stated intent, here is a conglomeration of my recent dating experiences:
Woman I don’t recognize walks in, spots me, and comes to my table. 20lbs heavier, and not immediately unrecognizable from her profile pics.
Her: ” Hi! You must be Scooter Nice to meet you! Let’s cut to the chase. Are you willing to be a dad to my two kids, despite me saying that I am not looking for someone to be a dad to my kids? Also, do you make enough money to take care of us? Do you have your own house? What kind of car do you drive?”
Me: “Umm.. what? I’m just looking to get to know someone, with the hope it leads to a fulfilling relationship. By the way, are you really ‘active’? What kind of fitness classes do you teach? For that matter, how in the hell can you honestly describe your body type as ‘fit’, in a profile? I only find you mildly attractive, now that I see you in real-life, but I am going to finish this date cordially, if just to be polite, and see if there is a connection.”
Her: “Look, you’re short. That means you are at my mercy, regardless of my ‘mild’ profile deceptions. I’m only here because according to your profession, you should offer financial compensation for your lack of height. After all, I can’t wear my heels around you, since I might be 1-2 inches taller. I’m going to have a hard time with certain friends and family concerning that, and I’m just not independent enough of a person to not give a damn about what others think, despite the fact that I may find you otherwise attractive. Besides, you’re probably just someone I’ll date a few times until I find someone to date who is more socially acceptable, with regards to your deficiency.”
Me: “Look, I have been attentive during this date, as well as entertaining and accommodating. I have listened to you talk about your ex-husband and kids. *YAWN* And besides, FFS lady.. I stated my exact physical description on my profile. My pics are recent. Nothing in my profile is embellished (unlike your profile). At least I make the best of what I have, both physically and intellectually. Can you say the same? No.. and you clearly over-rate yourself.
Now, I’m not attracted to you at all. Let’s just finish this dinner; I’ll pay, and then we can be on our merry ways. When you text me later in the week, I’m going to be evasive, and answer with one or two words. Please get my point.”
meant to say, “not immediately recognizable”, in my italicized, third paragraph.
Him: And when you express your needs, I’ll project that you’re my mother smothering me with her needs and destroying my childhood. That’s when I’ll probably disappear, and escape through workaholism, binge-drinking, or one of my other avoidant behaviors that I use as coping mechanisms.
Wow. For the first time I understand what happened in my marriage. Bam!
Her (1st date), so we are going to meet somewhere and I’m going to check you out and see if you are safe.
Me (1st date) ok I get that and I’ll try to be open and honest so you can get an idea of who I am. You in turn will be quite guarded. If the interrogation reveals some empathy in you and I find you attractive I’ll ask you out again.
Her (2nd date) So you are safe now I’m going to talk about my work and home.
Me, ok, me too. I wondering if she expects me to kiss her tonight. Kind of not feeling it right now. I guess I don’t know her enough right now but I’d like to see her again.
Her (3rd date) So I really like that you are attentive and have started building a fantasy in my head. I’m feeling quite vulnerable right now so I’m going to ask how you feel and demand honesty.
Me, well I don’t really know you yet and we agreed to take it slow. I’m happy to see you again but this where I get confused.
Her, you’re right we’re not a match due to this list of reasons I kept in my head and now I going to open up.
Me, I guess that’s it if we’re not a match, thanks for your time and good luck.
Her, Now I have opened up I’m going to continue this conversation.
Me, ok but I’m moving on now….