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Basically though, I was blindsided the other day because after everything, he said that I am not his “girlfriend” and he doesn’t want the expectations that come with the title. Yet he says all the important people in his life know about us (family, close friends, few of which he has) and that he doesn’t want to be with anyone else. I asked what would change with the title? We already have exactly what a relationship is and he “checks in” with me even though I don’t ask that of him.
He tells me to please be patient, that he’s never been with a woman like me, one who trusts and loves unconditionally and makes him feel good when he’s with me, yet he says he’s not with me with the whole girlfriend/boyfriend thing! I don’t know if I should wait and see, since what we have is basically the committed relationship — until he made the comment that I m not his girlfriend, everything was great. Or should I move on at this point? Even his friends address me as his girlfriend and he doesn’t correct them, so why can’t he say the words to me? Yes, we are exclusive, and everything seemed and felt right, but I feel like he negated everything we have had now and feel like maybe I shouldn’t trust him. I hope you can answer! Thank you! —Kris
Dear Kris,
I’ll admit it. I don’t get men like this.
It doesn’t matter what an amazing guy he is if he’s told you things like “I never want to be married,” “I’m too busy for a relationship,” or “I’m not looking for anything serious.”
If he’s acting like a boyfriend, what’s the harm of calling you his girlfriend?
Beats the hell out of me.
And I can understand why it’s mystifying and why you’d be tempted to run.
Personally, I’m of two minds about the whole thing. Which is why I can’t weigh in all that heavily and tell you exactly what to do. But I hope to lay out the pros and the cons for you so that you can make an informed decision on your own, okay?
Cons: One of my dating credos is “believe the negative, ignore the positive”. In other words, it doesn’t matter what an amazing guy he is if he’s told you things like “I never want to be married,” “I’m too busy for a relationship,” “I’m not looking for anything serious,” and so on.
Women waste years on men who said they want a casual relationship on their terms only – and then claim to be shocked when it turns out he was telling the truth.
Next, I’m a big believer that good men do whatever it takes (within reason) to make their partners happy. Sometimes it’s sleeping at the hospital or taking care of your dog or fixing your car. And sometimes, it’s saying “I love you” or referring to you as his girlfriend, just because it makes you feel safe.
And if I have one big opposition to this man’s behavior, it’s that he’s standing on some sort of principle, putting his needs above yours, and refusing to take the very simple step of calling a spade a spade: yes, you’re his girlfriend.”
Add in the fact that “he doesn’t want the expectations that come with the title,” and, well, this is the one thing that I’m not sure I’d be able to get past if I were you.
I’m a big believer that good men do whatever it takes (within reason) to make their partners happy.
Then again, I don’t know how old he is, I don’t know his relationship history, and I don’t know his family history. Maybe he’s really young and doesn’t know how to compromise and please women. Maybe he’s really old and set in his ways. Maybe he got burned by his ex-wife and is unduly cautious of making a mistake or making promises he can’t keep. Maybe he comes from a divorced family where his father never said “I love you” to his mother. There are lots of possible explanations for his behavior.
Which is what brings me to the Pros. In your words:
Exclusive relationship with a man for 6 months now. Has shown up in every way AND more. I had major surgery and he stood by me, slept in the hospital, and took care of me at my worst for my 3-week recovery. He just took me on our first trip away. He wants to see me every day and I love that.
He tells me that he’s never been with a woman like me, one who trusts and loves unconditionally and makes him feel good when he’s with me.
Those are no small feats, in a world where you consistently hear about the lack of good men. Those things are the foundation of your six month relationship and the reason that you’re agonizing over this man who claims not to be your boyfriend.
And I must say: it’s entirely possible that he’s acting in full integrity, letting you know that he’s afraid of hurting you, that he wants to go slow and choose wisely, and that he really does value you and your relationship. He wants to be judged for his actions, not his words.
So what do you do, Kris?
I’d have this conversation with him. Try to get it on the table. Not to negotiate for the title of girlfriend, but to fully understand why it’s so important for him to reject the title and the responsibilities when he’s already acting like a full boyfriend to you. Make it clear that you’re trying to understand him and let him know that he wouldn’t have to do anything different, but that it would make you very happy if you could feel safe in knowing that he was your boyfriend.
And if, after this conversation, he can’t give you this nominal gift of safety, I would highly consider moving on to a man who has the ability to step up and make you feel safe.
It’s not that this is a bad guy at all, but rather that you might be waiting your whole life to hear some words that shouldn’t cost all that much to say.
helene says
I have known guys like this, and have to say I would not take Evan’s pro’s and cons view of the whole thing.I’m afraid this is a big red flag. Basically, this guy wants the “good bits” (or what he sees as the good bits) of being in a relationship, without what he considers the “bad bits”.
He wants the company, security, cuddles, sex, outings, phonecalls, meals together, weekend plans, but he doesn’t want the EMOTIONAL RESPONSIBILITY of being someone’s partner. Ths guy is what you might term “the monogamous player.” Not all men who shy away from commitment and marriage are necessarily interested in sleeping with hundreds of women – some of them, in fact, prefer to have one woman, but they are just as commitment phobic as the promiscuous players.
He likes things “as they are”. He has no wish to be caught up in a situation that logically, if things go well, would lead to expectations of marriage and kids in the future, on your part and on the part of his family and friends. I agree that for a woman its hard to understand why a man who is clearly enjoying the relationship he is in would not WANT it to progress to something deeped and more long lasting, but that’s the way some men are. “So why is he with me??” you might ask? Quite simply, because it suits his purposes, for now. He likes you, he enjoys how you make him feel, he’s having fun – he even may enjoy the “going to the hospital” bit as it allows him to play at being “protective guy” for a while and makes him feel good about himself, but he IS only playing. He doesn’t want to be your protector FOR REAL. He doesn’t want you relying on him emotionally – he said it himself.
I suggest you show him this post, if you want to, to demonstrate to him the image he is giving of himself by making this remark,how it can be interpreted by a woman, and see what he says – if he vehemently disagrees with my interpretation – GREAT. If not….well at least you know now. Good luck!
Lola says
Whoooo you almost made me catch the holy ghost with this post Helene!! That was exactly what I needed…you broke it DOWN. Thank you!
Sandy says
RUN from this guy!!!! He’s telling you he has 1 foot out of the relationship. That way if he wants to cheat he can. You are a place holder till something better shows up, or he can have more then one till caught. Spending time with you bc nothing better is there atm.
Then he can say I told you I wasn’t yor bf when you find him in bed with someone else. I know. He is playing you.
Deborah says
Helene. all I could say is that your my hero. I have been dealing with something similar to this for quite a while now and you have no idea how much you comment means to me. And to the author please girl. RUN!!!! And don’t look back.
starthrower68 says
I’m kinda thinkin like Helene. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and has webbed feet like a duck, it’s a duck.
Mira says
Been there. Done that. In my case, the guy would say he wasn’t interested in a relationship, but then shower me with flowers on V-day’s. I was honest and upfront, saying that I did not want to be romanced by a guy that adamantly says “he doesn’t want a relationship right now” because of the plethora of excuses he had. I understood. He didn’t have a stable job. He didn’t have the education background he wanted. That was okay with me. But please don’t do romantic things for a girl without the intention to eventually commit. It is unfair.
He ended up accusing me of being a horrible, combative person for always refusing his gifts and advances. It was ridiculous. After I stopped talking to him, he moved onto another girl that he did the same thing to, but she actually fell for it and was strung along for over 12 months. She had introduced him to all her friends and family thinking that eventually she would get girlfriend status. In the end, she discovered that he was highly active on online dating sites and he was just keeping her around to boost his own ego until he found “someone better.”
I don’t think this type of behavior is ever a good sign of anything. You need to dump the guy. He’s only using you for his own personal gain.
Annie says
You couldn’t be more right!!!
Karen says
Helene –
Holy crap. Thank you!!
Mine went thru a brutal divorce, got burned, fell in love again, got burned again, I get all that. We’ve all been hurt and we all need time to get over stuff.
We’ve been exclusively dating for 6 months (a little over). [Sidebar – we knew each other back in HS but lost touch for 30+ years. Reconnected last Nov. Had crushes but never followed through.] I broke it off after 3 months because I felt it was just too much of a struggle for him to be in a relationship while still decompressing from the difficulties of the divorce/becoming a single dad to 2 teenagers, etc. He wants a relationship, exclusivity, etc., but I didn’t think he really had the time to devote to a relationship, nurture it, etc., because the kids take priority always, and he had a problem telling people that we were dating exclusively (I wasn’t even looking for the GF title at that point).
Won me back after about 3 weeks (intense pursuit, tears, the whole 9 yards), and we’re about 2 1/2 months further down the line now, and sometimes it feels like we’re just about right back where we started. In fact, I just had a conversation with him that it’s almost no different than it was before I broke it off. Same conversations, same crap, different week/month. Of course he disagrees, but it’s what I see/feel that matter to me, now what he thinks or whether he agrees/disagrees.
He says we’re way further down the path now, that we are bf/gf (semantics really because we’re both voluntarily exclusive, but an important distinction) and to please give it a little more time. I said that I would, but I almost feel as if I’m being dishonest and just “biding” my time, waiting for the moment when I can say “see, same sh*t, different day” and then I walk for good. I know he means well (ah, look at me defending him). I know the depth of his feelings for me, but I also see our relationship and his words in what you wrote (more so than what Mark wrote) and it’s frighteningly on point. I’m not looking for kids (nor his he). We’re both in our 50s and I’ve never been married (nor is that really a goal of mine).
But while he says he’s going to introduce me to his family, he hasn’t. To this friend or that (that isn’t already a mutual friend, as we have many of those and they all know we’re dating exclusively), he hasn’t. They know he’s dating (his family asks about me all the time) and that’s all very nice, but … still haven’t met the fam, he’s still not ready to tell the kids (his daughter is 13) because it’s going to be difficult for her…
I guess I’m writing my own response, aren’t I? Handwriting on the wall is sometimes so obvious and yet so easy to look past…
Anyway, I really liked your comment. Hit very close to home.
I agree says
100% agree, he was upfront and shes still investing in what she sees as his/their potential as well as completely vaunerable for the worst heartache ever when “Its time to go seperate ways”. She needs to ask herself how its gonna feel, and dosent take much to imagine, when he says “look, i dont have time for this emotional crap, i was honest, didnt lie, you hurt yourself”. Narcissist much? Yes im experienced with one, one of the best and im a smart cookie. And inside of a year i lost my home, career, car, and am having the baby completely unsupported. But like another poster stated, no progression, no deal. She needs to be clear that shes trapped in the honeymoon stage because thats where he wants to live. Read: “women who love too much”. The best way to let go of a dream is to wake up.
I agree says
I just wanted to add, as i keep reading others’ advise, there seems to be a lot of “how toos” attached. How to put him in a corner, lay down the law, manipulate and push him and repress herself, settle, and lastly, how to teach herself the art of devaluing. NOT COOL. I have been, as stated previously, in an incredibly contradictory relationship with a narcissist and heres the map out of OZ…
Our core needs, for each of us, need to be met. If yours are different than your partners, than pointblank and period its going to be a long good-bye. All this bliss and somethings missing…gues what? THAT is the SOMETHING she needs! Someone has it for you girly, i promise! I think you need to make room for THAT guy to come along. Too invested in mr fun, go find mr future.
Lisa says
Exactly Helene I dated the man you describe and I think this is him too. I will add that this type of man also will usually throw this back in your face if later you have some expectation he is not meeting. Wait what you were on a date with someone else, well I’m not your boyfriend I told you that! All the while sure as heck acting like a boyfriend.
Janie says
Thank you for posting this and your comment. This was exactly what I needed to hear. I’m stuck in this position
me says
wow you nailed it..right there. thank you 🙂
Chris says
Helene,
You are right on. This guy wants to have his cake and eat it too…to have an easy “out” if he finds a situation that he prefers better. In his mind he can easily tell other females, “I don’t have a girlfriend.”
Deborah says
Helene, you say is so true ! I have been with a guy like this for 5 years. He did call me his girlfriend and we have done everything together as a couple, but he would never talk about the future or marriage. I was happy how things were..we are in our 50;s and I have young adult children with me, so was happy to coast along living in our respective homes.
Then, this past year he was diagnosed with cancer. I was with him every step of the way-surgery, chemotherapy, staying with me as he needed care and support. Now hes through it and hopefully cured, I found myself needing surgery. Nothing serious or life threatening, but he was no support to me at all. When I mentioned it..his reply..”well I didnt ask you to do all that for me”
Im now questioning myself as to how I spent 5 years with this man. Ive ended the relationship, wishing I had done much earlier.
Vanessa says
I am the female version of the person you described, and you hit the nail on the head.
Bella says
Who ever u r that wrote this just made me cry. Everytbing u wrote is what I’m goimg through right now. Me and this man, its our second time around. He is exactly what u said…..he told me he refuse to introduce me as his girlfriend because he doesn’t want people in his business. What??!! He’s 46. This is krazy. I’m 47….i don’t have time for this. I’ve decided already to slow things down because he is comfusing me. I’m good with us being friends.
Nancy says
EXACTLY!!! If he can’t be your boyfriend, then he doesn’t deserve the perks of having a girlfriend. You love him, but he only enjoys your company. But if someone else prettier or skinnier or whatever comes around, he can say that he doesn’t have a girlfriend. Meanwhile, you might be wanting a family – a husband. Don’t expect that when you don’t even have a real boyfriend. You’re just something temporary and convenient to fill up his time. I suggest you get someone else. If he’s jealous, then just snap your fingers in front of his face and go, “You coulda had ALL DIS, but you’re too late a$$hole!”
some guy says
as a guy i disagree why don’t we flip this round shall we as a guy i love it when girls hanging out chill cuddle phone me call me over for company talk to me about problem tell me about there day it nice buy all mean but i do come clean from the start and to tell them just FRIENDS and when i do find a new girl i give here all the power i give her my number i let her call me some times we both change numbers some of them even have boyfriend and still we chill nothing wrong with a great friend or BFF
say 6mouth 2 years 4 years with out a guy doing this for you your lucky to even get a what we call a nice guy
what in tell u get a dick head or a hunter that views you like a trophy or the sticker
then come back and say hmm that guy that respected me give me flower hanged out
watch moving made me lough had great times. understand that life is shot
and 1 year go’s buy in a blink
Dee says
Oh my!!!! I am in that situation right now…. 5 months!!!! Seems impossible that I will ever have a guy that is loving, genuine, caring and not afraid!!! Thanks for the insight!!
Mr. Burns says
Wow. You have summed me up better than I could. I understand myself more. Weird but amazing. You speak truth. There are men like that. If it’s made clear to you from him take those words… Otherwise it’s a chance your taking to allow him to change his perspective
Tatum says
Agreed!
I had been seeing this guy for only a month and a half, but he kept bring me around his friends, introducing me as his “girlfriend”, doing/saying all the right things…
It was making me uncomfortable because we had never had “the talk”. So before I went out of town on a trip (that he wobbled about attending, but eventually scheduled work), I asked him what was going on here. He said, “I don’t know”, so I cut and ran.
He had some other issues too which did not exactly count in his favor.
After doing all the right things – you SHOULD know. If the answer is not a resounding, “yes”, I don’t want it. And I’m not going to sit around in anxiety (while possibly developing real feelings) while you make up your mind.
Thanks!
FIONA says
Honey Helen, you have said it all. Dam, those guys that fall under that category.
Estelle says
Preeeeach! I totally agree!!!
SS says
Damn Helene. You know my life. I’m so happy I searched this topic and found your response. I had to comment and give you your props. Thank you.
Agatha says
Soooo annoying when men try to pull this. I don’t go for it – if he’s not willing to say he’s my boyfriend then he doesn’t get all the good stuff that comes with being a boyfriend.
I know it can be hard to put your foot down, but I have found that us women get strung along by dudes like this when we don’t.
Steve says
Hi Kris;
I and my friends have been in this situation a number of times before. If a person says that they are not your boy/girlfriend they really are not. It doesn’t matter how they act.
Brace yourself for it ending.
After 6 months he shouldn’t have a problem calling you his girlfriend. Resolve this issue with him or end the “relationship” him, now. Life is too short to be with people who don’t want to be with you.
Fusee says
Mmm that’s a tricky one! He acts like a boyfriend in the NOW but he seems to want to remain free of expectations in the FUTURE. Makes me smile as we are curently debating about the topic of freedom in relationship in another thread. “Absolutely no loss of freedom in relationships”, really? : )
I agree 100% with Evan in suggesting a curiosity-based conversation about this situation. Some of my questions would be:
1. “What are the expectations that you imagine I/you would have with the title that I/you would not have yet?”
2. “What is uncomfortable about these expectations?”
3. “Regardless of the title and the expectations, how do you see our relationship progress in the next few months?”
My last question addresses a crucial aspect that is not enough evaluated: PROGRESSION. Sure, we want to see more actions than words. Sure, we want to see words and actions aligned. But we also want to see progression in the relationship. A relationship that does not progress will eventually die.
Nothing beats progressing towards more emotional intimacy and more commitment. Safety is a big one, thanks, Evan for the right choice of word. People can fake words and actions and even plans. But it’s much harder to fake deep emotional conversations, compromises that require being a bit uncomfortable for the sake of the other party’s happiness, or increasing levels of commitment. (Sure they can also be faked, but at that point the effort would not be so much worth it for the player involved).
My suggestion to the letter writer is to have the discussion that Evan suggests, but also carefully evaluate how the relationship actually progresses (beyond being lovely and all the fluff of meeting friends and family). Like helene #1, I see the rejection of the word boyfriend as a red flag that has written on it “I do not want to go down the path to fiance and then husband” in big letters. After all if you are not a even boyfriend, it’s going to be hard to become a husband.
That’s why we must not be fooled by words and actions only. And that’s why we must not get stuck in a multi-year relationship, playing the perfect partner and “waiting for a proposal”. It can lead you to a three-year status-quo relationship that the other party would have zero intention to progress towards marriage. If what you want is a solid and happy marriage, you need to encourage the relationship to progress into that direction from the beginning, and not be afraid to talk about your needs early on. Not on date #1 (!), but certainly before the one-year anniversary.
Really glad that the Letter Writer is asking herself the right questions at the six-month mark! If you are interested in marriage, the six-month mark is a good place to start talking about your plans, see if they are compatible to the other party’s, and if so, move into a more serious investigation of one another (character, compatiblity, timeline, etc).
desert says
Excellent post!
Wendy says
I dated a man like this for 18 months. After about four months I started asking “Why are you with me? Why am I here?” He would always blow me off with no real response, telling me I was “silly.” Needless to say, it didn’t get better and I am sooo angry that I wasted a year and half on this guy! I’ve heard he’s with someone new now and is doing the same thing to her. When we first met he was quick to tell me he was looking for the right woman to settle down with and marry. Fine. After four months, or six, or 12, if I’m not her, then why not let me go? I have no idea what his problem is; I only wish I’d gotten out sooner. My gut was telling me something wasn’t right, and I suspect it’s this same feeling that prompted Kris to write. Honey, do yourself a favor, and RUN. The right man will be PROUD to call you his girlfriend (as my new boyfriend does every chance he gets)!
Ruby says
I don’t know how old he is, but he sounds very immature. “The expectations that come with the title” of boyfriend are – eventually – a committed relationship with marriage and/or kids. The other possibility is that, while he cares and enjoys being with Kris, he still wants to keep his options open for meeting other women, should someone else more appealing come along.
If a woman “trusts and loves unconditionally and makes him feel good” when he’s with her, yet he still can’t call her his girlfriend, then maybe he’s not ready for the responsibilities a committed relationship brings. It’s one thing to tell someone within the first couple months or so of dating that you’re not ready to be boyfriend/girlfriend yet, but after 6 months, it’s not acceptable. I also remember reading a similar example in the book, He’s Just Not That Into You, and you can guess what the verdict was there. If a man doesn’t want to be called a boyfriend, why should he get all the perks of a loving relationship?
richard says
A good guy will be happy to call you his girlfriend after two months. At least if brought up in traditional, or “normal” social circles, rather than poly, or player circles.
mary anne says
I totally agree with Helene and Steve. I have been exclusive with my guy since January and he has actually done less than your man, and my guy has no problem calling himself my BF and letting all of his friends and family know. So I see a real problem with your guy not wanting that emotional responsibility. To me it’s really stupid….if he’s acting like your BF there is no real valid reason NOT to call himself your BF unless he is as Helene put it, the “monogamous player.” I would definitely talk to him about this and try to find out exactly why he feels this way. Only when you know his reasons will you be able to make the decision to either ride it out or move on. Good luck.
Kimmy says
Oh c’mon Evan, don’t get soft on us now. The man gave his reasons for why he doesn’t want the title of boyfriend, “he doesn’t want the expectations that come with the title.” That statement is as clear as crystal, there are no two ways about it, he’s a good guy, but if something better comes along, if he wants to have a one night stand with the hot girl he met at the bar, if he wants to go on dates or talk to women that he’s met on the dating site she doesnt know about… then he can do so with no remorse or guilt, because he doesn’t “technically” have a girlfriend. He is acting like her boyfriend in every way execpt in the way that counts the most– he won’t commit to her. Read: he’s keeping his options open. Havinging a deep involved conversation with him will only lead to more confustion and more doubt as he will not admit what his true intentions are. After all he does care about her and probably doesn’t want to hurt his feelings.
Listen, I’ve been there, and that’s exactly what i meant when i’ve told someone that I’m not ready to be in an official relationship with them, even though I was supportive in everyway a girlfriend should be. I’m sure Kris too has been on the other side of this cunundrum, as well as most of the posters on this blog. We just fail to see it for what it is when it’s happening to us though.
Kris shouldn’t dump him yet though, they have only been dating six months. She just needs to open her eyes and see the relationship for what it is. However having a so called “exclusive” relationship with a man that won’t even call you his girlfriend is beyond me.
I agree says
100% agree, he was upfront and shes still investing in what she sees as his/their potential as well as completely vaunerable for the worst heartache ever when “Its time to go seperate ways”. She needs to ask herself how its gonna feel, and dosent take much to imagine, when he says “look, i dont have time for this emotional crap, i was honest, didnt lie, you hurt yourself”. Narcissist much? Yes im experienced with one, one of the best and im a smart cookie. And inside of a year i lost my home, career, car, and am having the baby completely unsupported. But like another poster stated, no progression, no deal. She needs to be clear that shes trapped in the honeymoon stage because thats where he wants to live. Read: “women who love too much”. The best way to let go of a dream is to wake up.
Rachael says
What i’m getting out of all this is: It’s ok for you to be his girlfriend and live up to all the expectations that come with the title, but it’s not ok for him to be your boyfriend and live up to all the expectations that come with the title. I won’t get into my own experiences, but take it from someone who went too far with a man just like this, and ended up a divorcee….RUN.
He’s never been with someone like you, and you are amazing. True, but useless. I heard the same things. He’s “there” for you. True, but also useless. My ex was there for me too. Not wanting to live up to expectations is the biggest red flag there is IMO. Totally apathetic. Don’t you want someone who is driven to live up to expectations? What happens when the expectations are that of a husband, or a FATHER?
Run.
Lynn (the other one!) says
Late to the party, going through the archives. And just had a first date with a guy I met online, amazing initial connection, who has now run because he’s adamant about no expectations. (He’s in his 60’s, I’m in my 50’s).
He heard me say I had expectations of my last boyfriend – which is true. We’d been together over a year when he distanced himself so I never knew when I would hear from him or see him. And I came second after everything, even the laundry. That was so not ok with me that I ended it. New guy said wow, I really do mean I don’t want any expectations. You had expectations of your boyfriend! My reply: I have standards. I don’t do crumbs. I’m not anyone’s fck buddy. Standards are good. Valuing myself is good. I aspire to a committed LTR. My version of ‘no expectations’ is we’ll date, we could become exclusive if we both agree, and no expectations that it will result in marriage or living together. We’ll let it unfold. Especially early on each person gets to bow out. No pressure. Dating is for discovery.
So he’s bowed out. Fair enough!
Clare says
I’m perplexed as to how Kris got to 6 months with someone who won’t call himself her boyfriend. It seems to suggest an emotional distance for which there does not seem to be a cause, from her letter. And whilst his supporting her through her surgery was wonderful, it’s also something that a best friend might do.
There’s a lot of information that we don’t have about this relationship that should influence things – what is the quality of their sex life, does he demonstrate affection in public, does he say “I love you”, is he progressing the relationship to become gradually more serious. All these and many other little signs could give clues as to his real intentions. If literally every other sign of a real relationship is there, the boyfriend title should not be a difficult thing to add, in time.
But I do think it’s worth it for Kris to really ask, am I a girlfriend or a best friend here?
Rachael says
In addition to my previous comment, this is what I would do in her shoes:
Sit down with him in a relaxed environment (have a beer, wine, coffee whatever). Tell him you are having doubts about your relationship. I would say “You are really great, and I enjoy our time together. You have been there for me and I appreciate that a lot. But when I hear that you don’t want to be my boyfriend I can’t help but worry that this is not the relationship I hope for. After this much time with someone I like so much, and who likes me too I hope for a man who wants to be my boyfriend. It is something I need to feel safe and happy. I respect your desire for freedom from expectations, but if you can’t or won’t provide what I need i’m afraid I have to move on.”
Sadly, but honestly, I think he won’t put up much of a fight. Breaking up sucks, but not every relationship can be nurtured into something more. If he does put up a fight, then go from there.
BeenThruTheWars says
Or — you can hedge your bets. If he wants to keep his options open, you should, too. You don’t “technically” have a boyfriend, so now is the time to multi-date, try out a new online dating site, join a new organization that is male-rich, and just generally be on the lookout for opportunities to meet new single guys. You can continue to see this guy… or not. No reason to share your activities with him because he is not your boyfriend — he’s made that abundantly clear. Not his business what you do in your private time. Only see him once or twice a week, in other words don’t be quite so available. Be busy, enjoy your life, see your friends and family, take on a special project at work. I don’t necessarily agree that you need to go all the way to cutoff with this guy at six months; however, I would hate to see you hanging in there monogamously, holding out hope for something that may never happen. By the way, “date around” does not need to mean “sleep around.” I’m just saying, protect yourself, do whatever you want with regard to this relationship but don’t have any expectations beyond enjoying each other’s company. And if you want marriage and kids, don’t waste time thinking you’re in a committed relationship when you’re not. I was already dating two other guys (non-sexually) when I met my now-husband, and just added him to the mix. It was great, as I always had a date whenever I wanted one, and eventually two of the three stepped up and declared themselves, and I picked. This is what your technically-not-your-boyfriend wants the ability to do for himself, and what’s good for the gander is good for the goose.
Karmic Equation says
Well said! Agreed.
belle says
Completely agree.. I would scale back physical intimacy, as you do not appear to be in a committed relationship and begin multi dating. It is a reasonable action, as he is giving you very important information that he either wants to keep options open or is not truly commitment minded. These are the type of people that will date you, then fall completely in love with someone else and be married within a year. Perhaps he views you as wonderful company and has feelings for you yet not as a future partner. Who wants to be the placecard holder for Mrs. Future?
Shay says
That’s great advice and answer my question.
Dria says
Look. I am sorry, but it is doubtful that you will have a meaningful future with this man. I dated a man when I was 26 (he was 33) who acted like this. He kept telling me that I could not be his girlfriend because he was “testing our relationship” to determine if we should date long term. Excuse me? We had already been dating eight months by then. Like the young fool I once was, I accepted his lame excuse. By the end of my tenth month of dating him, he was checking out other women whenever we went to restaurants together. I broke it off, simply because I deserved better. Yes, he acted like my boyfriend. Yes, he brought me flowers. Yes, he encouraged me to pursue my dreams. Yes, he was charming, but he was not the right man for me. Now, that I am in my late thirties and in a healthy, happy relationship, I cannot fathom being with someone like him again. By the way, my guy asked me to be his exclusive girlfriend five months into dating. That’s what men do.
SS says
I pretty much agree with all the commenters here.
I dated a guy about a decade ago who was recently divorced. Big mistake (well, it was for me since I was looking for someone who wanted marriage and family, and he was just getting out of that and not in that mindframe). But I was young and didn’t know better. Anyway…
I remember when I was getting frustrated by his blowing hot and cold and him not wanting to spend certain periods of time with me. He said, “You’re looking for a boyfriend, and that’s okay. There’s nothing wrong with that. But I’m not in a position to act as a boyfriend to you.”
That said it all. He wanted to date me and continue to spend time with me, but on his terms. Which meant that this situation would be at his convenience only, and he had no intentions of sacrificing any time and energy for me or catering to any emotional needs or concerns that I might have.
From that point on, I realized the importance of titles. Because even though he didn’t want the title of boyfriend, he completely understood that calling himself a boyfriend meant something. It meant having more of a commitment to a particular woman than he wanted to have… and by not accepting the title (and by not giving me the title of “girlfriend”) it freed him from having to behave in a certain way.
Jaime says
So true. Your post really helps me!!!! I have someone who says the same to me… He can’t give me what I need. He can’t be my boyfriend. Meanwhile, stupidly I am two years in!!! He can’t understand why I get upset if he flirts in front of me. :-/
Angie says
I’ve been this boyfriend… well, girlfriend… before! (almost)
I think Evan is right that you need to get to the bottom of it. I think there are many people who don’t want to be rushed into things, and it’s all just a stairway to marriage. Did your boyfriend have a bad breakup, perhaps the girl he expected to marry? Now, he is renegotiating everything with you?
When I had my own version of this situation, I knew that I was moving. It was also during my senior year of college, so factor in that I was 22 (You didn’t mention how old you are), and I knew after I finished I was moving to another state. A friend had a crush on me for a year, decided to “go for it” and we went out a few times. When he asked if I wanted to be his girlfriend, I said no, I didn’t want that title. He was as confused as you. I explained it was because I was moving. He said “So…?” and I said “What’s the point? We can hang out now, or not, but I’m 100% moving”. He still didn’t get it.
Then, he was shocked when I moved and didn’t want to talk on the phone anymore, etc etc.
So…
(a) Is your boyfriend bringing his past girlfriend issues into the relationship? (Lame, but something you can definitely work on).
(b) Does he have other future desires in life outside the relationship, and is being kind of a love hedonist? (in which case, then you may have issues down the line)
I sort of get the hedonism/commitaphobia, although now I am 30 and no longer in that mindset. Some people like to come around on their own time. I could see him thinking that if he agrees to be your boyfriend, next you will be pressuring him to move in / get engaged / be your obligatory date to everything, whereas him visiting you in the hospital and being otherwise great is all on his terms.
Emma says
Hey,
I couldn’t disagree more, who care what he calls himself – he is right there with you, sleeping in your hospital room when you need support. Does it really matter that he’s your ‘boyfriend’ he’s you friend!! Maybe this guy is not forever, but enjoy the moment and realize that sometimes folks come along when we need them. Maybe this is the friend that gets you to the place you need to be, so when the real thing comes along you’re ready.
I would say enjoy the time with this man, take it for what it is, and stay strong and healthy. He may be the love of your life.
David T says
I am going to fence sit with Evan on this one. It is odd that he does not want that moniker. If he truly is committed to her, what is the big deal ? His refusal is strange and maybe a red flag, but he might have some hangup. OP needs to find out why he doesn’t like that word. Is it because he does not like the implied progression of the relationship? Is it because he wants to still date other women? Is it because he has some obscure hang up about the word in particular because of how a past girlfriend treated him? From the sounds of what the OP wants, if yes is the answer to either of the first two, they need to breakup or at least scale it back. If it is the third or something similarly innocuous then she should not act hastily.
This behavior is causing her fear and doubt and she owes to the relationship and more importantly to herself to get to the bottom of it.
maria says
Kris,
BELIEVE THE NEGATIVE, IGNORE THE POSITIVE. I dated a guy like this for a year and a half and he ended up bailing. EXCEPT, he actually called me his girlfriend. His actions are GREAT. Calling you his “girlfriend” is a “claim” and a “title”. He likes the security of you.
If I were in this situation AGAIN, I would have a conversation with him. After 6 months, what is wrong with claiming you? Is he dating other people, although your exclusive. Sometimes exclusive means that you both are not sleeping with other people but still DATING others. This is what happen with me.
I SWORE on EVERYTHING we were going to get married, we even went to look at rings , planned our future etc. Then one day, he just said, we are not meant for each other.
Talk to him, then tell him you do not want to close off your options until he knows what he wants to do. He will either leave or claim you. BOTTOM LINE.
-Evan has a article on here about a conversation with a guy in regards to moving to the next level.
KRIS, ITS AMAZING HOW A GUY WORKS WHEN YOU STOP BEING SO AVAILABLE.
I feel is his comfortable with you and doesnt thing you will leave. Shift some things a little. He gave you your answer. The ball is in your court.
XOXO
AmberD says
wow Maria…
were we dating the same guy!?? the exact same thing happened to me…. 11 months… i meet the mom the sister… his child… he actually told everyone that I was his wife when ever I was ready…..talked to my dad about marriage …the whole 9 yards….then poof…..he broke up with me…. that break up happened over a year ago and i still get a little misty when i think of how it all went down…. title or
Kris…
I hate to say it but I dated a guy for 2 years that never gave us the title… needless to say I eventually could not handle the endless ambiguity and broke things off…he did not stop me…..did not even try….
SO…..exclusive or not… friends lovers…benefits … or not…. I think the only time you can trust the situation and love with out fear or reservation is when he puts the ring on your finger …walks down the aisle and says I DO….
then you can relax and trust him….for a while ….
Mia says
This is a tough one. But generally a man who cares about a woman and knows there is something bothering her that he could easily rectify would make an effort to do so. No, a lot of men don’t naturally know to do the right thing, but if it’s brought to his attention and the guy KNOWS something small would make you happy, that’s his cue to do it. And if he doesn’t, if he can’t, that’s a huge red flag.
I remember back in college that during a summer break my relatively new boyfriend and I had to be apart for a few months. He was terrible on the phone, and I was in a lot of anxiety about him not calling regularly, but after I got up the courage to bring it to his attention, he called me every evening because it was a small thing he could do that he knew would make me happy. And even before, I had initiated “the talk,” and it turned out he liked me a lot but was just not the suavest guy about dating; once it was out in the open he was happy to be my bf and turned out to be a pretty good one. In both cases, I don’t hold it against the guy for not doing exactly what I wanted, but I would have held it against him if hje didn’t do what would make me happy AFTER it was clear how I felt.
So –make clear one last time how much this means to you and why, and if he still won’t do this minor thing to make you happy, I’d seriously question the point of hanging around.
Margo says
I agree with Evan 100%. Kris, tell this a**hole to go take a flying f*ck at the moon!
Henriette says
Not good enough. B’bye!
sarahrahrah! says
This was basically my last relationship except we didn’t make it to the six months mark like Kris.
It was hard to walk away at first, but that didn’t last long. I came out of it feeling better than I went in because I knew that I had made a healthy decision, honored my own boundaries and — most importantly — felt I wasn’t stuck in a long-term relationship with a man who felt ambivalent about me.
I don’t know why this guy is so nice to you. Maybe he is just nice and it isn’t love. What I think you should be asking yourself, Kris, is why is he so ambivalent about you that he can’t commit. Only you have the answer to that question and can decide when is too long to wait for a guy.
Mark says
I would go with your gut here. And your gut should be screaming something’s wrong.
If it was me and the woman wouldn’t call herself my girlfriend then I would let her know that if she wasn’t my girlfriend the we could and should both date other people.
No girlfriend no commitment.
Heather says
It sounds like this guy is kind of selfish. He’s wanting things on his terms. I have a girlfriend who’s dating a guy that’s like this. He wants to be with her but only on his terms. This kind of guy would drive me nuts. If I were the OP, I’d just sit the guy down, have a non-confrontational type conversation and go look, I respect your views and values, but I respect myself and my values as well, and it doesn’t look like our views and values mesh at this point. Good luck to you.
My boyfriend has told me he’s in no rush to get married, and I believe him. And for right now that’s fine, we have only been dating for about 7 months. But I’m also not going to let him use that as free rein to drag me around for years on end, either. After the 2 year mark, if he’s not ready still, I may have to revisit the whole “why are we in this relationship” thing, but for now, it’s fine. I’ve watched too many people waste years of their lives with people who won’t commit, and I promised myself that like Poe’s raven, “nevermore.”
Tina in Italy says
I wonder if he’s met another girl and is keeping his options open…I hope not, but that was the first thing that popped up in my head. 🙁
belle says
Exactly. I think he has someone on his radar. He is playing the role but doesn’t want the title, I believe, as he wants to keep options open. Some people will date, hell, even stay in marriages until they are certain they have someone else lined up. (My ex husband did this with me). He may enjoy spending time with her and even doing things for her but likely wants to be free to end it if someone reciprocates or comes along..and it can’t be said that he ‘cheated’ bc there was never a ‘title’…
Mia says
Another thought: I was having drinks with a single, 29yo guy friend this weekend who was telling me about a girl who seems really into him, is easy to be around, and who’s company he’s enjoyed in their five dates. But .. He doesn’t feel like being in a relationship with her. He shrugged over his beer and said he wouldn’t even try sleeping with her bc he didn’t see it going anywhere and didn’t want to be a jerk. Cognizant of my own dating woes, he informed me this is what guys do most of the time — shrug over their beer when talking about the girl, say she seems nice but I don’t know, I don’t think it’s going anywhere and I’ll keep seeing her but don’t want to give her the wrong idea.
This was a horrifying thought, that many guys we’re hung up on are talking about us that way, but I also found this to be very informative. If a guy is not banging down your door to be your bf in the first month, somewhere, he’s sitting at the bar shrugging about you with his friends. You can’t prevent it, but neither should you stick around too long.
amy says
There is no fence to sit on here. He told you that he liked you because you are easy to be with and put no demands on him. If you put a demand on him, he will run.
It’s unclear what you want. If you want to “just have a good time” take poster Emma’s advice. If you want to have an LTR that leads to marriage and/or kids, then he doesn’t sound like the guy, and you should find that out sooner than later.
I love the shrugging over beer analogy. Yes, someone is always doing that somewhere to someone else!
Aubrey says
I would definitely sit him down and talk to him. Miscommunication has been the killer of many a relationship. I was with a guy like this once, I thought we were completely committed then he ended up dating one of my friends and there was nothing I could say because we “werent official”. I ended up finding a great guy online after getting a great pic taken by dating headshots but it was a rough time.
Ruby says
Shrugging over a girl over a beer might not be so bad after 5 dates, but not after 6 months! It’s time to put some conditions on that “unconditional love.” It also occurs to me that this would be a perfect situation in which to implement Rori Raye’s “Circular Dating,” if the OP wanted to go that route.
Tonya says
Just totally got rid of a guy like this after three months of dating. He was the one who was all about being exclusive from the get go and liked the whole bf/gf thing and was enjoying the relationship – until he said 3 words – which I’m sure he regrets. He orchestrated the crash and burn of the relationship from that point on..picking fights, cold behavior, silent treatment, blaming ME for things and being defensive. I think he just got scared sh*tless at the fact that emotional responsibility as a partner was suddenly looming nad he couldn’t deal. I ended it – pushed to the brink by being treated not as the gf anymore, but as a fwb with NO consideration to my needs in the “relationship”.
He had the nerve to contact me and let me know he ruined a good thing and that he knows the problemd stemmed from his side and wanted to talk about it. Whatever…I’m done and you’re wasting your time dude. Do yourself a favor and GET OUT…I know you feel like it’s 6 months of a waste but be relieved it wasn’t longer for you to find out his true intensions of you.
Hope says
I agree with pretty much everyone here. Doesn’t sound like he’s “all bad,” but he doesn’t have to be. If he doesn’t want to be called your boyfriend after six months, move on. That’s sort of insulting.
Kris says
Thank you Evan, and everyone for all your comments. The reason I’ve been confused is because he does tell me he loves me, wants a future but doesn’t want to rush because in the past when he has rushed things fell apart quick, which I can relate to. We had the talk. He does want the relationship and the things that come wIth it, he said he isn’t stable financially ( I know this but I believe in him) and he’s afraid that I will expect him to provide everything, which he can’t do right now. Safety is the biggest thing though, and he says if we dated other people it would be cheating at this point, yet I feel a little unsafe anyway. He is a good guy and I love him but I do want to progress soon.
Evan Marc Katz says
Thanks for reporting back, Kris. I believe that he loves you and that he doesn’t want to make a mistake. Be the kind of woman who trusts instead of living in fear and playing games like some of the other commenters have suggested. You get a lot more out of being authentic than insisting on power struggles and guessing games. Please keep us posted.
desert says
Financial reasons is just a lame excuse too. If he were truly in love he would hope you didn’t notice those things. You’re supporting yourself now. It’s not like you’re a damsel in distress waiting for a rescue. Move on and find a real man! This guy is a time waster.
Karl R says
Evan said:
“I’ll admit it. I don’t get men like this.”
I don’t get it either.
Fortunately, I know someone who was like this. I asked her.
My fiancée was clearly more into me than any woman I had dated in the previous 10 years. We saw each other at least five times per week. We were physically intimate. She was introducing me to lots of her friends, family and acquaintances.
However, for the first two months (or more) of our dating, she introduced me to people as her “dance partner”. Since I would describe about 200 women as my “dance partners”, I don’t consider it to be a term of endearment or significance.
So in response to Kris’ question, I asked my fiancée what her mindset was during that period of time.
My fiancée’s response:
“I guess I was still keeping my options open.”
My fiancée wasn’t seeing anyone else. She wasn’t actively pursuing a relationship with anyone else. In all other regards, she was acting like a terrific girlfriend.
But in her mind, she will wanted the option to find someone else.
That’s where I think Kris’ date is at. But unlike my fiancée, he still feels that way after 6 months. My fiancée had decided that she was my girlfriend by the 3 month mark.
Susan61 says
I dunno. Having just read Evan’s advice, I think having “the talk” can be a relationship killer, having learned this the hard way. She also puts herself at his mercy, since she is on a “one down” position trying to negotiate for a higher status, in having this talk to try to understand why he does not want to take on the title of boyfriend. Being in the “one down” position, a place that many of us single women find ourselves, is very precarious.
In dating and in such a situation as this, one sometimes has to do the opposite of what we think would be the logical, adult thing to do – which would be – TALK to the guy about it, in a calm measured way. That’s what adults do, right? Well yes, but when you are dating it can often backfire – in a big way. I say, step up to the plate and play his game. Play BALL. Dating is often a game in a sense, as life is. I don’t mean that in a negative way, it’s just a fact. Too much honesty and talking, I feel, can ruin romance and mystery and can make a man who already has one foot out the door to get the other foot ready. Yeah, she could do the adult thing and have the “talk” and he will feel pressured and antsy and she won’t get anywhere. They may stay together but that tension that has been created will remain and HE has the upper hand because SHE wants it to be official and HE wants to hold on to the power to say no to making it “official”. She remains in the “one down” position and wastes time and energy, with endless conversations with her girlfriends trying to figure him out and what to do.
So girl needs to play hardball. She can start slowly becoming unavailable and making other plans, seeing him half as much as she used to and being vague and uncommitted. She cannot be resentful nor accusatory nor mean about it. She’s always friendly and happy, just busy and she’s living her life. She doesn’t do this out of spite, she is just taking care of herself and opening herself up to other opportunities. She is LIVING her LIFE. When he confronts her (which he will because he does not expect this behavior) she can be light and breezy, and put him off a bit, saying “things are good, I am just super busy with (work) (family) (school) (stress) and let’s get together next week! Great, this week is crazy…gotta run, let’s talk next week, see you then!” CLICK. He will not like this and HE will initiate the TALK. Then SHE says, feigning surprise, “oh I thought since we’re not really boyfriend and girlfriend, which is FINE, that you’d naturally be fine with me doing other stuff, and hanging out with other people. “HANGING OUT WITH OTHER PEOPLE?” he says, in a threatened tone…”Are you DATING other people”? Oh not really, but you’re not my BOYFRIEND so yeah, I’m going to be hanging out with other people. Based on our last conversation that seemed like that’s where things were going.”
NOW she has some leverage. Yes, this is the game that needs to be played. OR she can just break up with him and get it over with if she doesn’t have the chutzpah to play the game. Breaking up with him will *also* make him want her. Many women, including myself, when we are in love and a man is giving us the runaround, hang in there….because we were raised to be nice. So we play nice…..sleep with them…have fun with them…..be their “friend”….support them….and…inevitably….we….get….dumped.
David T says
@Kris 33
Good for you for having that talk. That is a little scary. Even if it wasn’t quite what you wanted to hear, now you know and that must be a relief to you. Congratulations on being bold enough to take that step.
I have something to say though about the outcome. When someone does not feel ready to commit to a course of action (from as trivial as starting a term paper to as serious as having a child) they will find reasons why they “can’t right now” and maybe even believe them. The real reason is something deep down like fear.
There is never an ideal time to start a committed relationship or get engaged or get married or have the kitchen remodeled. There will always be something that could be better or more complete. “Wait until my big project is done at work so I can give the relationship enough energy so the beginning is perfect” “Wait until I know her family likes me”, “Wait until I know I am not going to get laid off” etc. If you wait for everything to be perfect before a big step, you will never take it. If something is important, and there aren’t any clear fatal problems, go forward and deal with any difficulties.
Solve the financial problem, then see where he stands. If this loomed large for him he will be full steam. I think he still will balk at calling you gf or balk at the next relationship milestone, because he has fear (speculative). Then you have to decide how long you want to wait for him to come around. Is he worth it? Sounds like he is, as long as you have enough time, but establish a boundary or time limit for yourself and make him aware of your needs as it comes close.
Some couples that are committed to trying to make it work will go into engagements and marriage in spite of their doubts. Some are married for a while before they know the marriage will work. (see link) 🙂
Kris says
Thanks again Evan and everyone. David T, I agree with you too-there is no good time, I need to set boundaries for myself. I’ve been giving him a “long” leash in this situation right now and been trying to keep myself busy and he keeps coming around again. He keeps saying he doesn’t want to look for anyone else, and brings up the fact that we are talking about these feelings, which is good, since if I was just some girl that wouldn’t be the case. He said I’m the girl he’s “with” but still hasnt said girlfriend. In response to other posters, his last relationship he thought he would marry this girl and she cheated and lied to his family and him. Playing games though isn’t me, I’ve tried and it never works out for me and backfires.
desert says
Maybe you need to find ways to improve your “game” not give up 😉
Clare says
I have to say, I’m a believer in being authentic about yourself and your feelings, and working to try and understand and accept people *as they are*, and I must say I am troubled by all the talk of game playing, “red flags” and “deal breakers” in the comments section. It seems to suggest a fear-based mentality, and I’m not sure where it leaves us except as a bunch of cold, somewhat manipulative people who run at the first sign of something we don’t like.
I just don’t think that’s what we should be striving for. Men are human beings. I was horrified at the suggestion that one poster made (@ Margo # 21) that Kris’s man, who has been nothing but loving and supportive, was an a**hole??!! And if our stated aim is for connection and relationship, we should be working to understand, appreciate, build trust, express our love without this “with the one hand we giveth, and with the other we taketh away”. I agree with Evan @ 36.
Kris’s guy’s fears are every bit as valid as hers, and he deserves the benefit of the doubt.
I know a lot of this is borne out of fear, but take it from me, you have to let this go. We’re all fools at some point, and I can guarantee unconditional love is a better driver of relationships than fear.
Chau says
Kris,
I’d believe him.
I was that guy during my 4th year of college…and it took me a whole year to finally get my head straight and asked her to be my girlfriend.
We were also dating exclusively. Seeing other people also meant cheating (Since he said the same thing, it’s a HUGE sign that he’s serious about you).
But because she was so understanding, I appreciate her SO MUCH. It was one of the main reasons why I’m willing to jump through so many hoops just for her.
Was it easy for her?
No. But I will never forget the fact that she was willing to give me the extra time to think things through.
People are confused and shocked as to “Why he can’t just call you his girlfriend.”
It sounds crazy but it can actually be a good thing. It shows that he actually takes the boyfriend/girlfriend title seriously.
You’d never want to marry some guy who wants to get married “just because he felt like it”….the title isn’t a big deal to him.
Then you’d have the title, without the substance.
Be patient. It’s hard. I’m sorry you have to go through this too.
And be sure to tell him how you feel about it as the two of you go through this together. Others will disagree but he does care about how you feel.
He’ll eventually see how much he wants this relationship and how much he wants YOU.
Trust him Kris.
It’s worth it.
-Chau
Meera says
I think you were really young, and at that age, it is okay. However mid-twenties onwards, guys have a tendency to dangle a carrot to lead women on for years without ever having to sacrifice anything on their own behalf.
Robinincarolina says
It’s possible that this man has had women in the past that once they get the girlfriend crown have raised the expectations and tried to change him. I have known a few men who feel this way. They fear that they won’t be able to meet the expectations and will no longer be able to make the woman happy. It’s not really a realistic way to look at it, but it may be his way of avoiding what has happened in his past. In his mind he may associate girlfriend with drama. Until he breaks this association, he may remain this way for a while.
That being said, don’t turn this into drama and prove him right and add to his layer of baggage. If you are filled with doubt after the no girlfriend clause, he will feel it. It will take some time to help this man to feel safe, but I imagine it can be done. Good luck!
nathan says
Kris, it’s sounds like he has some work to do around financial fears, and expectations. In this day and age, a lot of men are facing this kind of thing, myself included. The “male bread winner” story is really falling apart, even for those who still believe it’s the way to go. I don’t know what you expect of him in terms of financial contributions to the relationship, but if you’re hoping for a main provider, it could be awhile, despite his best efforts. And if he feels that hope from you, he may be thinking “I don’t know if I can do it, and it wouldn’t be fair to commit to her if I can’t.”
I really wish people, especially men, could let go of the idea that self-worth is tied to how much money they make. It’s a major degrading of who we are as humans. I am not my job. Not my income. Not the possessions I own. I am so much more than any of that. If your boyfriend is struggling with this kind of stuff, I hope for him that he can break free of it.
Evan and Clare are right. Being authentic and honest is the best way to go. Whatever decisions you end up making in the future, you’ll feel a hell of a lot better about who you are, and how you have acted.
Two Of Us Dating says
Being a guy I know how we think, and if he will not call you his girlfriend something is wrong. Men will move mountains for a woman if he is serious about her. When someone will not have the title it means that they want to see other people on the side. If the woman finds out he can always fall back on the not his girlfriend line. Ladies if this happens to you its time to run. If you spend a large amount of time with this person and they wont be your boyfriend, leave the relationship. I know it will be hard, but there will be a man who will call you his girlfriend and do everything in his power to show you he cares.
Liz says
I am afraid the collective reasoning is right. If a man is in love with you, wants a future with you, and a relationship, he would be capable of calling you his girlfriend after 6 months. Although pain and financial strain could prevent getting engaged, married, and having children, I don’t see it as an excuse for not calling you a girlfriend (this is basic, its not fiance, wife, ect). I have run into these great men, that do everything right, but for one reason or the other can’t jump completely into a relationship. It has never been finances, but a lot are wrecked because of nasty divorces, or completely passion filled rebounds that make their whole head spin. No matter how wonderful, patient, loving and kind you are, this is the other person’s problems, and to save yourself heart ache, all you can do is step back and let them heal themselves and get themselves in a position to mentally take on a relationship. You are subjecting yourself to more pain later down the road, and if you try to help him “fix it,” show disappointment or frustration (which you are bound to do), it will also destroy the relationship.
Heather says
@ Susan61:
HA!!!! I got a good laugh after reading your post. Not in a bad way, but because I like the way you think!
And it’s true! I did that once to a guy who was all into me, then poof. After three or four dates and getting intimate, he was suddenly busy. Cancelling dates left and right. So, I became less available. Didn’t text back right away when he would text, and I would only answer him if he asked me how I was doing with, “I’m doing fine.” After a few weeks of that, I decided that I was the one who deserved better and I just emailed him and said, “I wanted to do the courteous thing and let you know that I am seeing other people. It seems like you’re not too interested so I’m ready to move on. Best of luck to you.” I got this really defensive, angry email about how HE was tired of MY terse text message responses.
It’s funny how things work, when the tables get turned on a guy. I agree with what you say, one hundred percent. If it’s good for the goose then dammit, it’s good for the gander too. If guys can do what THEY want, well then, so can we.
Thank you for making me smile today. 🙂
Margo says
Kris, you have been warned by a lot of us on here. If he’s not willing to call you his girlfriend, he’s just not that into you. I’d kiss him goodbye.
David T says
@Heather 45
Did you ever tell him how you were feeling unimportant to him when he would cancel dates? Did you let him know you were feeling frustrated and uncertain and wanted him to be more demonstrative? You might know more about why he was cancelling than you told us, but if you don’t, it is possible he really was busy with important things in his life. He ought to have shared what was going on, but you owed it to yourself and the relationship to find out why he had become more distant.
Suppose he was overwhelmed with his brother being ill and then he wrecked his car and had a big project dumped on him at work? He reacts as he needs and then his girlfriend becomes terse (cold), and shortly after that tells him she is seeing other people. From his perspective he got dumped and does not know why.
Canceling plans is rude. He should have helped you understand why he had to cancel dates, and maybe he was over promising his time when he made those dates. Shame on him, but communication is a two way street.
If he became angry when you broke it off, that means he did value his relationship with you. Maybe he did not value it enough; maybe he was losing interest and simply did not have the courtesy to tell you, or maybe he actually was busy. Sounds like that ship has sailed, so you will never know. In your future relationships communicate directly like Kris did before you are ready to walk. “Becoming less available” in response to a perceived wrong is not communication. Be open and you can avoid the death spiral.
@43-46 Kris should keep talking to him. They can work together to resolve his money concerns regarding the relationship. If Kris decides his real reason for balking is coming from a place of fear, then she should think about walking, but it is up to her to decide what she can tolerate and how long, if at all, she wants to wait for him to heal.
helene says
I think its important not to regard making yourself less available to him as “game playing.” This is definately NOT a game. It is your life and your heart. One of the most important things in a budding relationship is reciprocity. If he is not making himself fully available to you, you should not be making yourself fully available to him. He is holding back – so should you. Right now, it is clear that you are in deeper than he is, so you need to pull back to a level of commitment that mirrors his. This means ensuring he is NOT the centre of your universe – because you aren’t the centre of his. In order to do this, as other posters have said, you need to see him less, in order to regain some perspective. This will not feel “natural” but that does not mean it is inauthentic or a game – going to physiotherapy to correct a tilted pelvis does not feel “natural” but it is very necessary, when things are out of kilter. There is nothing inauthentic about reestablishing healthy boundaries, and right now this relationship is unbalanced. Spend more time with other people – any people – and focus on other aspects of your life. CONSIDER accepting dates with others, if the opportunity arises – you don’t necerssarily have to go mad and join “adultfriendfinders” on line, but you would be wise to at least consider the possibility of spending more time with other men, in a mixed group, at least. Join a dance class or take up volunteering. Have coffee with your new dance partners. Above all, you need to take on board the fact that this man is NOT YOUR BOYFRIEND. You are giving him boyfriend status and boyfriend privilages, but he should not be receiving them because he has explicitly rejected the position.
Ruby says
I’m in agreement with Helene. Sorry, but I don’t see that having a plan for your romantic life is playing games. Men seem to hate when we women do that because it actually works. Living your own life, and hanging out with friends of both sexes isn’t cheating. If someone is so hesitant, why give them unconditional love? I’m not advising Kris to break up, but definitely pulling back and initiating some fear of loss is a good plan.
I also believe in avoiding men who are not over their exes. In my past, I could have saved myself a lot of grief if I’d left these men to work on their issues without allowing myself to be dragged into it. It’s one thing to be cautious, but I don’t think that is a valid fear to bring into a new relationship, and it only seems to serve as a convenient excuse not to move forward.
Chau says
@helene, that’s “game playing.” I know you meant well and you want the best for Kris. And it has worked for other people before, but is that really the foundation you want to build for a lifelong relationship?
“If you pull back, so will I?”
What if she pulls back later on…should he pull back too?
@Kris, if you’re going to stay with this man for the rest of your life, there will come MANY turning points where you will not want to talk to him and thus pull back…
And it’s during these crucial moments where you don’t want him to say anything but just … BE THERE. The last thing you want him to do is to pull away from you.
Anyone who holds back their love is going to be in a whole lot of pain.
I’ve made the same mistake before and the best alternative is always to just talk it through and understand each other’s world.
If you were my own sister, I’d give you a big hug right now because you’ve probably cried over this once too many times already.
Now ask yourself this question, “Is he worth waiting for?”
Your answer will let know you what you need to do.
Rachael says
No matter what this woman decides to do she shouldn’t be advised to do it in a manipulative way. If she stays and is patient with him communication must be open. She must have her boundaries clear and concise. She must uphold those things until he figures it out, or she gets tired of waiting. If she leaves she must be authentic and honest about why, and clear it is no ones fault. She loves this man. There is no reason she needs to screw around with his mind! CAN does not mean SHOULD!
It’s one thing to be overly patient and waste time or be jaded and unwilling to wait. It is entirely another to behave a certain way for the sole purpose of manipulating someone into doing something you want! THAT would be games. Recognize that in yourself if that’s what you do. Fix it.
Helen says
Kris, if he says he is not your boyfriend, then you should stop allowing him the privileges that are usually allotted to boyfriends: exclusivity, intimacy, sex, extended company.
In other words, walk away.
If he doesn’t want to be called your boyfriend, he is not that into you, period.
Susan61 says
Thanks Heather! I had a glass of wine in me when I wrote that which brought out my feisty side. I do think that women often get dumped when they hang around too long with a non-committal man, hoping things will change, and being afraid to rock the boat or not be nice. We often fear that if we don’t please a man, or we are unavailable and don’t always agree to HIS terms, that that will make the man leave when often, being too nice and available and passive IS what will make the mean leave! I am 51 and single and I am learning these lessons, sigh, rather late in life.
I believe a non-committal man who doesn’t want to use the word “girlfriend” after 6 months, is not going to respond positively to inquiring questions from said non-girlfriend as to WHY he would say such a thing. Why should she give him the satisfaction and why put herself in such a compromising position, and possibly face even more rejection? She got her answer when he told her he did not consider her his girlfriend!
I say to Kris, get busy being unavailable and let HIM ask HER where things stand when he realizes he is losing her. She doesn’t have to be mean about, she is merely taking care of herself. She needs to start making other plans and becoming scarce and denying access to her whenever HE wants. When he approaches HER to have the talk, she lets HIM tell her what he wants. If he still doesn’t want to call her his girlfriend, then she should just disappear. Poof! Nowhere to be found on planet earth. If he WANTS her, as others have said, he will move mountains to find her.
There is an excellent book by David Burns, MD called “Intimate Connections” that really had an impact on me, especially the chapters about getting the runaround from a man. Another great book was “The Passion Paradox: Where is your Relationship Going?” by Dean C. Delis which describes the power dynamics in relationships and how one person becomes the “one up” and the other becomes the “one down”. The “one up” is the one who is less emotionally invested in the relationship and thus holds more of the power. Both of these are great reads that I highly recommend.
And of course, “Why He Disappeared” by EMK is a must read! 🙂
Anonymous Editor says
While I’m inclined to agree that it’s difficult to see why a guy would hesitate to call you his girlfriend, I think I can somewhat relate to him. I don’t lightly label all of my colleagues as ‘friends’, despite seeing them everyday. Even when I refer to them in dialogue to my fiancee, I usually say “My colleague did this today…” instead of by name (as opposed to “Bryan did this today…”). I feel that I don’t know them well enough to refer to them personally by name.
When I first started going out with my fiancee, it took me a while to get used to calling her my girlfriend or using terms of endearment such as “honey” or “babe” (she, on the other hand, had no problem using it immediately). It was something that I wasn’t always comfortable using, especially since I also used the same terms with my ex-girlfriend. I was even afraid of calling her “angel” for several months, since that was the name of a long-time crush and I didn’t want to trigger any unnecessary emotions or memories of my crush while using that term with my fiancee. But the more I became used to my fiancee, the more comfortable and secure I was in using such terms of endearment.
I can somewhat relate to Kris’ partner’s predicament. Once burned, twice shy. Kris’ partner is on the extreme end of the spectrum since his previous partner cheated on him after lying to him and his family. So his hesitation of not calling you his girlfriend could be his defense mechanism kicking in, to spare him any embarrassment in the event that the relationship didn’t work out. Since Kris has already spoken to him about the subject, I suggest she give him some more time to become more comfortable with her.
Clare says
I think I am just going to have to agree to disagree with Helene, Heather, Susan61 and Helen.
Don’t get me wrong, that *does* give you some short-term power, any man will sit up and take notice when you are suddenly less available. I must say I very much used to think that way, but I realised that the real power, or security, as a word I prefer, is when a man loves you, and the fear of losing you and the desire to please you is internal to him. You don’t have to initiate it or make him realise it, when a man loves you, it comes naturally to him.
But it takes time. It takes actually practising all those things we claim to value: loyalty, fidelity, trust, consideration, communication. David T is right, becoming less available in response to a perceived wrong is not communication, nor is it practising the kind of relationship we want to have.
Don’t get me wrong, if your fundamental needs are not being met within a reasonable period of time, you *should* walk away. But I simply cannot imagine being in a relationship which is about power dynamics, and “one up”, “one down”, or being driven by the fear that you are more invested than he is. Too exhausting. I would rather spend my time seeking out people with integrity.
I am sure people are going to strongly disagree with me here, and this is ok 🙂
Tina says
Two Of Us Dating #43
“Men will move mountains for a woman if he is serious about her.”
and
“If you spend a large amount of time with this person and they wont be your boyfriend, leave the relationship. I know it will be hard, but there will be a man who will call you his girlfriend and do everything in his power to show you he cares.”
I absolutely agree. The whole truth.
helene says
I think there’s some cnfusion going on here about what is being advised – for my own part, I am not advocating that Kris should make herself less available to this man to give her “power” over him, or as a strategy to make him want her more, I am advicating it because she is investing too much in this budding relationship at the moment and that is not a healthy thing to do. Equally, I think there is confusion about what is appropriate behavious in a longterm, committed relationship, such as a marriage, and whaty is appropriate whilst dating. I would agree with Chau that once in a committed relationship, you cannot operate a day to day “tit for tat” policy – there will be times in life where one of you has to give much more than the other is able to – for instance when a partner is ill, depressed, or overwhelmed with work or a new baby. No, I would not advocate pulling back at those points simly because your partner has nothing more to give – in a longterm relationship, sometimes you have to go the extra mile to keep tghe partnership strong and loving when your partner is not able to contribute their share. However, this si a completely different situation from a dating scenario, where the man in question does not want to be your boyfriend! In this situation, giving more is absurd and unhealthy. Until there is a commitment to be there for each other for the long haul, neither partner should be offering more than the other, and the relationship will progress, if it progresses at all, at the speed of the slower partner.Givne that this man has not made a commitment to Kris – and actively resists doing so – she should offer the kind of availablilty and input appropriate to this stage of the relationship – which is simply uncommitted dating.
Mia says
I can’t believe these people who are telling the questioner to work through things with her boyfriend and be patient. Women do that all the time, and guess what? They get dumped. Men – well, people – respond better when someone else has a willingness to walk away calmly when their needs are not being met. This statement by Evan to assume the best in men only goes so far — until they raise giant flags. Overall, any relationship that requires a lot of effort to mirror, or step back, or strategize probably won’t go that far.
nathan says
Clare @55″But it takes time. It takes actually practising all those things we claim to value: loyalty, fidelity, trust, consideration, communication. David T is right, becoming less available in response to a perceived wrong is not communication, nor is it practising the kind of relationship we want to have.” Exactly. Absolutely right on.
What’s interesting to me is how women who tend to get so upset when men pull a fade or disappear don’t seem to have any problem telling each other to do the same thing to men. It’s pretty petty, no matter how you dress it up. Also, women are always talking about wanting good communication, and placing it as a centerpiece (rightly) of a healthy relationship. Becoming “unavailable” without a clear warning is NOT good communication.
With all that said, there is a way to do what Helene and others suggest without getting into game playing. If you feel that the best way to care for yourself in an ambiguous situation is to pull back in some manner, then you lay that card directly on the table. Kris, for example, could tell the guy she’s dating that she’s not sure how to take his refusal to call her his girlfriend, and that she’s going to take some time to reflect and enjoy other parts of her life. She could also request that he reflect on their relationship some more. And perhaps they could even agree on a specified amount of time apart, if there is enough communication present. But it might end up just being that she makes her statement of need, steps away, enjoys some extra free time, and sees how he responds. The main point, though, is that she is clear and sets the needed boundaries.
Susan61 “I believe a non-committal man who doesn’t want to use the word “girlfriend” after 6 months, is not going to respond positively to inquiring questions from said non-girlfriend as to WHY he would say such a thing. ” If the guy can’t handle either inquiring questions, or a request for some space to reflect, then you have your answer about him. Instead of living on the defensive, use these situations as an opportunity to gather information about the person you are dating. Being on the defensive almost always means assuming the worst, which closes doors that may actually be open.
It makes total sense to have taking some space as an option in a situation like this. And certainly, that space and reflection time might provide some important insights that could help both people involved. But do all of this respectfully. Don’t hurt your partner just because you have been hurt.
Susan61 says
I agree with you Clare and I don’t practice “game” playing in my real life, believe it or not. I was just using that as a metaphor. I think she can certainly try to talk to her non-boyfriend, I just don’t think it will get her anywhere. When I was being jerked around by guys, in retrospect I should have broken up with them or just made myself unavailable….nicely. In a long term, established committed relationship, yes communication is key and yes, essential. But in short term dating, through my own experiences, talking with male friends, etc. too much communication and processing and discussion of feelings can (and certainly there are exceptions) kill the romance in relationships.
Most relationships go out of whack at some point and yes, there are power dynamics at play. Perhaps it sounds unloving or harsh to refer to a relationship as such but I believe it is a fact of life. It is indeed exhausting to be in a relationship where this happens and one does not know where one stands but with a 50% divorce rate and most relationships ending and not being successful, it can be a bit pollyannish to think that power struggles do not occur.
in a sense, this guy is holding onto to some of his “power” in the relationship (for lack of a better term) by refusing to call her his girlfriend. She will remain powerless and vulnerable until she deals with it and it is up to her to choose which action she wishes.
Ruby says
One of the best dating quotes I’ve ever heard came from a male relationship advisor (not EMK), who said, “Men respond to distance, not words, ” mainly because men tend to be action-oriented. Having a man experience what it’s like to not have a women around so much, to not be automatically receiving her patient, unconditional love, can be a very powerful experience for a man on the fence. It’s also not a good idea to consistently give more than you are getting back – it’s called giving too much too soon.
Sherel says
@Helene This is golden!!!!
“There is nothing inauthentic about reestablishing healthy boundaries, and right now this relationship is unbalanced. Spend more time with other people — any people — and focus on other aspects of your life.
“I would add let time take you where you need to be.” Maybe he is a bit ambivalent at 6 months, and needs more time. There is no absolute 3 month or 6 month rule as others have suggested. But realize that at some point soon you will have to make a decision about what is important to you.
Also know there are many BFs and GFs that willingly accept the title but do not do any of the work like this guy
Kathleen says
I agree with Ruby about men responding to distance . Post 61 and 62 make a lot of sense. This dilemma would make me feel very guarded.
David T says
@Susan61 60 53 (hut, hut, HIKE! 🙂 ) You keep writing like the OP has not spoken with her boyfriend yet. Did you see Kris 33 back there? In the process of openly talking she learned better where she stands, and they probably grew a bit closer. Now, he may be completely lying, but that will come out soon enough.
Having a man experience what it’s like to not have a women around so much, to not be automatically receiving her patient unconditional love, can be a very powerful experience for a man on the fence..
Umm…sounds like the love is actually rather conditional or at least the expression of it is. That is OK. You should never be completely unconditional, because that means putting up with abuse or anything thrown your way. I wanted to point out the contradiction.
Any well rounded man will see that a woman is inexplicably becoming unavailable, won’t feel safe counting on her and turn away further to make himself content in other pursuits, like hobbies, male friends and yeah, maybe dating someone else.
If you have a man who has completely isolated himself, then cutting him off might generate a frantic response, (I have been that man, so I know this is the case), but withdrawing without discussing why or what is bothering you will send a healthy person looking elsewhere for fulfillment.
Obviously there are two nearly diametrically opposed opinions here and I have said my perspective a few times now. I am going to agree to disagree and leave Kris to pick the perspective that suits her, or something completely different. I do hope she checks in again and we learn how it turned out. Good luck, Kris! 🙂
Leigh says
In going to keep this short.
Do not spend anymore of your youth with this guy.Move on now.
Ruby says
David T #64
I’m not suggesting that Kris disappear, cut off her friend, or even date others, I’m suggesting that she should not have daily contact with her guy, as it sounds like she was doing. Daily contact and the unconditional love and trust that she had been giving him should be reserved for a committed boyfriend, and this man is not that. They have already discussed this, so it’s not “inexplicable” at all. As Kris herself said, “I need to set boundaries for myself.” If he doesn’t want to lose her, he will give her the reassurance she needs.
Susan61 says
Oops. thanks David T. You’re right, I missed that update from Kris. I hear what you are saying. Navigating relationships is tricky stuff indeed, “healthy person” being the operative word here. I suppose when one is dating a healthy person then this types of issues are not presented as often…
Also, I don’t believe this quote can be attributed to me, that would be Ruby @61: Having a man experience what it’s like to not have a women around so much, to not be automatically receiving her patient unconditional love, can be a very powerful experience for a man on the fence…
David T says
@Susan67….sorry about that. See the confusion when you put a number in your alias? 🙂 Healthy is an important point, and it is not clear to me the OPs bf is there if he is hung up on that word so much. Sounds like he feels like he doesn’t deserve her, or he is generally afraid for some reason. But, all of us have our quirks or problems in one way or another. It is about what you can accept in a partner. If it turns out he simply can’t commit, then yeah, she needs to protect herself, but if it really is about money fears, that is workable.
@Ruby66 I am guilty of lumping your opinion in with all the other folks who were simply saying “run away”. Sorry about that. I can see dialing back on the intimacy for self protection if she feels that is appropriate, but I still object to just doing that with no explanation of why, which some posters seem to advocate.
The “unconditional love” thing got me spun up too, because I don’t think that is ever realistic (and I did not see the OP ever say that was where she is). People sometimes change and become misbehavers in unacceptable ways. You can call that a breach of trust or that the other partner just didn’t know them well enough, but the fact is you do see this even ten or twenty years into a marriage sometimes where someone become abusive or neglectful. In a committed relationship or marriage you make a try to work on it, but ultimately, you walk if the other partner won’t work with you.
Rachael says
@Clare Hell-to-the-yes!
I’m with you…I find all the talk of power and one up, one down unsettling.
People of course struggle for some power, and butt heads in relationships. Totally normal, and even healthy. The active pursuit of power over someone however is not right, selfish, and emotionally destructive.
Have power over yourself and maybe someone will give you a little power over them.
Rachael says
I should add when I say “…maybe someone will give you a little power over them.” I’m not talking about the power to control how they act, feel, what they do, or who they are to you. Just…When you have power and control over yourself people are more inclined to trust you, and see you as an amazing person. They are more inclined to allow your very existance to change how they see things. Like a passive sort of power.
Hope that makes sense.
Clare says
@ Rachael, yes that is exactly what I was trying to say. People do respond to power plays in a relationship *if* you make it about that. Personally I think the only power worth having is personal power, over yourself.
I think it completely possible to remove power struggles and ego from any relationship whilst still operating within the limits of your own boundaries. My most wonderful and fulfilling relationships are where I don’t worry about giving too much because I *know* the other person will give back to me in their turn. These are the only relationships I’m interested in having. I agree with you and honestly do believe that people are drawn to those who respect themselves but also strive to respect and understand others.
I’m not going to close my heart off and be a way that I don’t wish to be because I fear looking foolish or being taken advantage of. I trust that I will know when to do what I need to do and have the strength to stand up for myself.
Katarina says
IMHO I think he is using the “past relationship” expectations, and the financial issues as an excuse to whittle Kris down to the point of expecting nothing from him. The one last bastion of keeping low expectations of him is to keep the “boyfriend” title at bay.
When you get to a point of asking yourself: “why would he continue to do this if he loves me and cares for me? I wouldn’t do this to him” I think you have your answer. The Golden Rule: Do unto others…
It may be hard, it may hurt. But I say cut your losses. He will probably tell his next girlfriend, “I was in this relationship once, and I told her I had some financial issues, and I wasn’t ready for the boyfriend title, and she dumped me. I hope you don’t do that to me too.” The cycle continues….
Rachael says
Well said Katarina. I personally would be long gone…Those excuses wouldn’t stand a chance. You can’t say “It’s just a title” while at the same time say “It’s a big step, it’s too important and I can’t do it.”. It does mean something. It means alot, and he’s intentionally holding it back from her.
Puff up your chest girl, and walk away into the sunset.
Marina says
I’m in the same exact position, but I haven’t met his family nor his friends, so all of the comments are helping me out in this situation. I’m glad I came across this issue. For some odd/stupid/foolish reason I believe him when he says “the title will come just be patient…”
Katarina Phang says
As a person who has just written a book on this very subject, I have to tell Margo and others who think this guy isn’t into her: really? Would a guy who isn’t into a woman do what he’s been doing?
Absolutely not. You won’t hear much from a guy who isn’t into you, much less pursuing, taking you to vacation, taking care of you when you are sick and calling you every day.
Guys are simple but there are a few things that make them look more complicated than women are. One of them is this very subject.
I write all about it in my book, why guys like Kris’s “bf” behaves the way they do. And “being not into” isn’t one of the reasons.
If he’s courting her and by the sound of it he is, let him lead and trust his leadership. Guys who are not serious about a woman WON’T court her for 6 months and beyond. They know the ramifications of continuously seeing a woman if their heart isn’t in it. Number one he wont be able to do it if his heart isn’t in it. Number two, no guy in the right mind would want to deal with the drama unless he has a plan of some kind with her, only he’s not telling her yet because he’s worried about the expectations that might ensue.
Don’t throw the baby with the bathwater.
Katarina Phang says
And interestingly, mind you, I title the book “He’s Really That Into You, He’s Just Not Ready” for this very reason. Do not listen to simplistic approach to love/relationship. I’ll go for substance than label without substance each and every time.
marymary says
“And if, after this conversation, he can’t give you this nominal gift of safety, I would highly consider moving on to a man who has the ability to step up and make you feel safe”.
I agree. It’s been six months and he can’t even call you his GIRLFRIEND?! It’s not exactly a marriage proposal.
He has shot a straight and clear warning right across your path. “Do not depend on me however nice I am.” Ignore at your peril. it’s been six months and he’s been treating you well so it is worth having the conversation. But do listen to what he says and even more to what he doesn’t say.
and, unfortunately, I believe some men AND women will do all the right things for six months or a year, or longer and you can still be wondering “am I his girlfriend?” “will he marry me?” “where is this going?” “will this ever be a real marriage?” You’ll be wondering if you’re too needy. You’ll be telling yourself he’s a good guy/good woman. You’ll be telling yourself if you act a certain way he/she will come up with the goods. They aren’t doing anything WRONG but it’s not entirely right either. Your friends, family and dating sites will be giving you conflicting advice. And it’s been so many months/years already.
it’s not called a headf*ck for nothing.
Heather1982 says
I am so happy I stumbled upon this blog! I was dating a guy for 3 months (just ended) who I saw almost every day, professed his strong feelings for me, communicating constantly throughout the day, met all his friends, said he has no interest in dating other people….and yet when I asked the big question he said he wasn’t ready and there was no difference. My first piece of advice: don’t bring it up first, ruins it. If the guy wants you to be his gf he will ask you. And if you must be prepared to walk away if you don’t like his response. Because it was all downhill from there. I questioned if I was being stupid for thinking: well if we are exclusive, what’s the difference? And shouldnt you be proud to call me your gf?! I ended up bringing it up again and we got into a heated fight where he said I was pressuring him took much and needed space. He asked to speak after the holidays….but not without saying how much he already misses me. Good riddance! I should have never stopped dating others without the title.
Kris says
Well, if anyone is still reading this post, basically I just walked away on New Years. He practically was living with me at that point, came home for the holidays with me, and on New Years when asked if I was his gf, by women who always sees us together, he said no. He claims it’s the financial thing still, that he loves me, that he’s just this way for now, and ppl who care for one another compromise, I asked then why can’t he say a couple of words if it is just to make me feel validated. I’m heartbroken, but I have to move on.
Ruby says
Kris #79
Thanks for the update, sorry it didn’t work out. Your ex doesn’t sound like a bad person, and I think he really does care about you, but he’s not ready to take on the responsibilities of a more committed relationship, and probably won’t be for some time. I said it before and I’ll say it again, your “unconditional love and trust” should be only be reserved for someone who can reciprocate that. Otherwise, you are giving too much too soon, and the relationship becomes too one-sided. I can’t remember when you originally wrote, but I think it was a few months ago, so you’ve invested a fair amount of time at this point. Sounds like you made the right decision, though, and if he changes his mind, he knows where to find you.
marymary says
Kris
good call, better things await in 2013.
Amelia2.0 says
Wow. That is unbelievable! You really deserve a lot, lot better than that utter bullshit, Kris, I’m glad you could find the strength to end things with this gentlemen and not allow him to set the terms of your relationship any longer. If “he’s just this way for now”, then he needs to be that way on his own time until he realizes that excuse does not cut it in a mature relationship. I know how much it sucks and that the only cure for heartbreak is a healthy dose of time. However, I would take immense pride in standing up for yourself and in voting with your feet. There is no excuse for him not getting over himself and showing that he appreciates you and respects you in the way that you need after all this song and dance.
I recommend cutting all contact/deleting phone numbers if you haven’t already. Call up a trusted relative or a friend and talk about it if you find yourself overwhelmed by feelings. I wish you all the best.
Susan61 says
Wow. I’m not sure how I revisited this thread but I was googling stuff about my own current dating situation (which is not going all that well….)
Sorry this happened to you, Kris, but it does appear to be for the best although I’m sure it hurts like hell. You definitely did the right thing and it is best to have full No Contact in these situations.
Best of luck. You may even hear from him in the future….and will have to figure out how to deal with that. They often do “come back” in one form or another…
ImThere says
I’m in a similar situation, and I read everyone’s comments and thoughts. IMHO it is wrong to just label the situation and set expectations that may not be realistic. “If he’s not willing to call you GF at 2 months he wont be”. Thats silly.
My guy has a dating history he doesn’t like to talk about. We’ve known each other for years, in fact he was the guy that other girls warned girls to stay away from. Fast forward a few years and friendship turned into more. I have my own history, divorced, bad relationships, less than proud moments.
But being labelled as “BF or GF” doesn’t work for him. He hadn’t dated in almost 2 years when things went our way… and because I dont care about the past, I dont pry.
He’s good to me. Better than anyone ever has been. Ever. He is caring, and kind. Physically we’re perfectly matched. We have fun together, have similar interests, and spend a few nights a week together. We’re both successful and busy with our own lives, but have comfortably found a good balance. our friends know we’re together, we’ve met each others parents – but we do not drag each other to visit family constantly. we’ve been “together” almost 7 months. And yet, he does not want to be called boyfriend. At first, I felt a little sick… but when I sat back and looked at the whole picture – who cares. he is with me, and only me, and he’s not looking to date anyone else, nor is he dating anyone else. So who cares? We’ve both in our mid-late 30s – we’re not teenagers.. who cares really. When I introduce him, I introduce him by name – not by label. We are appropriately affectionate in public, so I never feel like he’s hiding me.
So thats my story. Im sorry things went how they did for Kris. I’m not her, I have no idea what it is like to be her. I have no idea her or his history, or how she felt when she looked at him.
But I know how I feel. And I feel happy. And what I have going on right now with my guy either will or will not work out and become something more in the future whether I call him my boyfriend or not. Its just a label people.. actions always speak louder than words.
Katarina Phang says
Here’s an update after I wrote my well-received book. Yes I have had many women come to me with the same problems and I will tell them all the same: focus on being an attractive and secure woman a man naturally seeks for commitment, practice being a woman and all feminine skills that will hook any man up and do not pull all your eggs in one basket.
I did ALL that myself dating my EUM (emotionally unavailable man AKA a man who is not ready for relationship or to label your relationship a relationship or you his girlfriend). In December he pulled away for 9 days after 10 months seeing each other regularly 3-5 days/week (Holidays, personal issues and stuff, I guess it was just too much for him). I met a guy on Thanksgiving who showed interest in me. And I ended up hanging out with him a lot especially during the time he was pulling away.
When he was back after the New Year, this new guy was very much hooked on me and was courting me. And weeks later it was obvious he didn’t want me to see other guys and claimed me.
The rest is history. I had to choose. If I could I would have seen them both because I wasn’t really over my EUM (we had a great time and great memories together). My new guy didn’t want any of that so finally after a couple of months of inner conflict I decided to let the old one go since the new guy showed up in such a way that I just couldn’t say NO.
Don’t worry about labels, and do not initiate the conversation. Guys who are ready and into you WILL ask you. If he hasn’t, do not stop dating others and yet absorb all the positive energy to raise your vibration. When you are ready (meaning you are really the type of woman a man can’t resist thanks to your inner beauty mostly), the right guy will step up and claim you provided that you put yourself out there.
Be in the moment, enjoy every day like it is your last. Love happens when you least expect it. I never thought I would be in relationship with a great super doting man who would want to give me EVERYTHING I wanted in a man in such a short notice :), and when I was still seeing a man who didn’t want to label me/our relationship.
My ex EUM still calls me every day. He’s hooked on our friendship. A woman who knows the trick with guys don’t chase. She is “chased.”
R says
I got out of a relationship like this last summer. I started dating someone new this past month and already I can see the *DAMAGE* the previous guy did. Having someone “date” you (OH, BUT HE WAS NOT MY BOYFRIEND) for almost a year and then say he never wanted you, and he told you, will really, REALLY mess you up.
Basically, Kris? He’s not trying to avoid the “expectations” of the relationships. He’s trying to avoid the inevitable break up. He knows he’s going to eff it up, or he doesn’t want you enough, so he doesn’t want to be the one to blame. It’s cowardice. Everyone should know two simple things:
1. Break ups suck
2. Everyone hurts
Plenty of guys out there who will not waste your time. Trust me. And more importantly, you can be happy by yourself FIRST and then you’ll find that person who thinks you’re so great they cannot let anyone else have you. 😉 Good luck.
Courtney says
Wow I actually googled this question and this site came up, then I read through every response carefully. I needed this. I needed this so bad. I’m “with” someone but he says we don’t need titles, yes were in college but so what. Wow, this is mind blowing but not surprising at all at the same time. I know this is a huge red flag now. it hurts to have someone you care about so much say that they don’t want a title. When he told me that I thought why not? We are basically dating. But then it hit me, duh he doesn’t want to date me for real. So now this sucks, I am with him but it’s not official and to be honest we probably never will be. Yeah we’ve been through a lot together and I like him a lot, but a lot of actions arnt reciprocated. It’s weird because even though we have made it clear that we’re single, it’s I hard for me to see other people because I feel like I’ve invested so much time in him. But I’m going to have to unfortantely. Everything I thought we would be will never be, and I’ve slowly accepted that. I’m going to wait a few weeks before I completely pull back, before I pull back to the point he thinks I’m seeing someone else. of course it would warm my heart if he explained why he doesn’t want a title but I know it’s all bullshit. I agree with everyone else said, if he really truly liked you and wanted you, he’d make it known. I’m stupid. thank god I’m only a sophomore and I have 2 and a half years left. and actually after reading all of this it made me feel like it won’t be so bad to know other women go through this all the time. He’s not the end of the world and I learned my lesson the hard way. Thank you all so much, this is a true blessing.
Glyo says
I have been dating someone for almost 2 months who went backwards…he is in a weird place in his life and understandably doesn’t want to feel serious (I’ve been there)…he doesn’t want a label. But says he really likes me, and cares about me, I’m the only one he’s sleeping with, and in every way acts like my boyfriend. He did say he didn’t know if he’s going to date other women at this point because he just got out of a long relationship. I decided that I am going to continue seeing him and not put all my eggs into one basket, and I told him that. I will be going out with other guys, see what happens. I figure if things get deeper with another guy I’ll go for that one. I also decided that when he gets lovey-dovey and says sweet things like I miss you…etc…I’m not going to respond. I’m not going to give him myself as a girlfriend. I’m going to give him myself as a potential girlfriend and check out other men. See where things go. If he doesn’t come around I won’t be sticking around.
RTAYLOR says
What a phenomenal thread filled with intelligent, well-spoken people. I eagerly read through all 87 posts, given that I’m in a similar situation, and I’ve come to this conclusion as an advocate for authenticity vs. game-playing…We only have today, this moment, to live, be happy and thrive. Your personal choices are a reflection of who you probably are throughout many parts of your life, not just romance. If you are the type of person to insist upon eating healthy food, despite the price availability or proximity, unwilling to make exceptions for junk food thats closer, more affordable or a quick fix, you are probably the same person who, no matter the moment in time, will always insist on the best in your relationships, from our clients, from your friends and with strangers for that matter. Bottom line is that if you are living for the moment, as we should, you should expect that your environment is in alignment with your needs RIGHT NOW. Living for the future means you are postponing your needs today, which creates resentment no matter hard hard you try to be “patient” or “understanding”. Those two emotions are 2-ways streets, not reserved to be giving only to the party who “isn’t ready”. A man can be a great person/friend/business partner/son/brother, and STILL be a lousy partner in the end. Just like one poster said, he’s giving you everything ACCEPT the most important thing…commitment, and that’s enough reason to refocus your energy into investing in yourself. I am choosing to focus on myself, kids and career NOT “making myself available for other men”, only because I think that is a more authentic reason for letting go. I’m not swapping him out for “something better”, I’m simply honoring his comfort level of no commitment, and while my inevitable absence may feel like a blow to him, its simply more important to me to honor and protect my needs as much as he is his own. I’ve given it 18 months of a committed relationship, with a 2-month “no contact” period where is did a ton of self-work, then reconnected on mutual friendship terms. Ironically we’re more committed as friends than we were with the label, but he has verbalized that he does “not want to be accountable to anyone but himself” due to financial pressures and career stress (which will ALWAYS be there, if you ask me, thats LIFE!), so i HAVE to retract my natural “girlfriend” habits or loyalty and accountability or I AM the one responsible for making it nice and cozy to be emotionally distant and unaccountable, and I can’t live with that responsibility. I am 43/kids, he’s 40/no kids. We’re marriage-worthy in 99 ways, but not being able to compromise in little ways for me is the straw that breaks the camel’s back for me. And I’ll bet if Kris came back with another update, we’d see that in hindsight, she was likely happy with her decision to move on. I want to finish by saying that women place too much importance on a man labeling/claiming them, and not enough importance on labeling/claiming themselves as the most important person! This entire thread comes down to self-worth and the value that we place on ourselves, TODAY. -7/24/14
Esther says
Just leave him. I went out with a guy like this, and it was not worth my time. Despite the fact that his relatives and friends married and had kids already. He kept saying we weren’t FWB nor were we BF-GF. The only thing I regret is not leaving sooner.
A. says
This was/is something that has bothered me in my most recent relationship. I just ended it after 7 months. I got so confused by the actions being present and seemingly progressing. But then the words were “My life to too unstable right now. I’m emotionally unavailable until I get it sorted.” This can be confusing because we are told that actions speak louder. He was very actions based… in all things. So I read the actions, but I still felt like something was missing and this made me wonder if I just wanted to much or wasn’t appreciating what I had or something else I couldn’t put my finger on. Finally it struck me… Sometimes actions don’t speak louder. Actions need to MATCH words. I’m pretty sure he was just as confused and ambivalent as I was. The timing was just way too off… but we were both trying to hold out to see if that would change. It didn’t.
kimmy says
6 years with my boyfriend and after noticing he was kind of keeping me private i asked to let me know where i stand with him and he says we dont need a title. wow 6 years and now i thought i meant more to this guy. this truly touched me and opened my eyes.
Stacey says
I’m so glad I found this post. I read through every comments carefully I’m currently in this situation. I’ve been dating someone for 6 months going 7 and he’s unwilling to call me his girlfriend. He keeps saying that i should be patient but yet does what a loving boyfriend would do. Take me out on dates, support me in every way, met my family met his. But one thing is that he’s never said I love you. I’ve asked him several times why he’s so scared of commitment he’s refusing to give me a reply. when his family member calls ne his GF he puts them straight abd says otherwise. After putting everything into consideration I decided to make myself less available to him, don’t usually text, see each other call as we used to. I know my worth but I think he’s failing to realise how much I value. My descion is to walk away and invest more time in myself.
Joie says
I read through the first page of all the replies and I thought that I should leave mine here so that someone in the universe might find it and read it someday and learn something from it because I can honestly say that I did learn a lot from reading all of the replies… So I want to thank all you beautiful women for sharing your stories.
was seeing someone for about a year, and we were living together
Cherry says
Hi Evan and Kris,
Evan, hands down you give the best advice. I didn’t read any other comments here, because I know in this kind of situations, women are ready to bash the guy, accusing him with using her for sex, blah blah blah. All the ideas from insecure women who wants to tie up the guy as soon as possible.
I can completely understand where this guy is coming from. He is an unconventional thinker. He doesn’t want to follow the common rules that everyone is following. Nothing is wrong with that. Like Evan says, he wants to show his love with his actions, not words. And ladies that is exactly what you need to look at when you evaluate a guy. It doesn’t matter if he “labels” it or not, does he show that he cares about you? Women always know. Deep down we know if a guy cares about us, and if you do know it, then don’t push the guy for labels.
Kris, my five cents, just go about your own business. Go out, have fun, take care of yourself, exercise, have exciting plans for your future, have fun dreams and share it with him time to time. Have different interests. Show him that your life is going on as exciting as it has been before you met him. I promise you he will want to be a part of your life. He will come around and tell you romantic things that you never thought you would hear from him.
This guy is taking his time to make sure you are the right person for him and vice versa. Don’t nag him, don’t push him about it. Just show him that he has a lot to lose if he loses you by living a full life with a positive attitude. Don’t tell him that, show him that.
All the best.
desert says
Cherry: you have probably not dated a guy like this…they are time wasters. I just ended a “friendship” with someone like this who was willing to do anything for me. I do mean anything. His actions were that of my most loving bf’s… But not the one thing that mattered most: commit.
It hurt and cost me a lot of sleepless nights. But in the long run it’s best. I deserve better.
sweetlife says
You guys are all amazing. I too have been in this situation with a guy I had been dating for the past6 to 7 months. Everything started out great, he asked to see me a lot..we met online…he even told me that he deleted his online profile…which lead me to believe he was a bit more serious than I…and truth be told at the time I was not taking him seriously…so I thought it was only fair that if he was taking me seriously that I should do the same…we ended up together for another 3 months..and thats when I sort of asked him what we were doing..we had not been intimate either..he said he wanted to create a solid friendship before progressing. I’ll skip all the details but I had “broke up” with him because I felt that I was liking him more than he liked me…i told him this and he said he agreed. Then four days later I was like maybe I’m overreacting I mean we hadn’t spent much time together because of the winter weather and so I called him up and told him I wanted to be “friends” knowing well this time to be prepared for it not working at all.. The next three months were great..we spent pretty much every weekend together..he would make plans to include me…invite me to his coworkers going away events..to events with his college friends…and we had little disagreements when it came to certain things with relationships..but we were silly together..ahd similar goals when it came to homes (I’m 24 and he’s 25) and do just silly things that made our “relationship” unique..he told me all these great things about myself and I could tell he was falling for me but still not title…so recently we had an argument about something because he said words that hurt me…i told him that if he feels that way then he shouldn’t act the opposite..anywhoo i told him he could easily fix the situation by apologizing or even attempting to fix it and if he couldn’t do that then he wouldn’t see me again. I don’t think he thought i was serious but I ended up having him take me home and told him that we were ending..i just can’t be the only one fighting for a title or fighting to make things work…we gave each other a goodbye kiss and even before i arrived home I told him that i don’t think its either of our fault because honestly we just were not on the same page..i let him know Im looking for something more serious and I feel he just hasn’t explored or did what men feel they need to do before committing to someone…i gave him advice to take into life about himself and we kissed goodbye…he called me later on that night but I will admit I was pretty sad and cried myself to sleep…i called him back the next day to see if i had left something important at his house…but I did not want to contact him…he told me he had called to check to see if I was ok..and that he wished the world for me and how the night before was pretty hard without me there…how he would miss the things we did together and he can’t go to certain locations because it will remind him of me..i said I will miss u too and was basically saying yeah to everything he said because i was crying…I know that this is the right decision for me and this time I can make it because I expected this to happen…things like this cannot easily be brushed off..his actions were great and he treated me very well…like Kris’ guy…but also like her guy he was not wlling to say those words..and he had the reason of theres too much responsibility that comes with it…so in time he may be ready but for right now..im not waiting on him to be ready and I’m attempting to resume my life and actually get what i deserve out of love and relationships..though i am apprehensive now and just want to be single because I cannot believe how difficult this is…i never imagined that it would be hard for a man who likes a woman…says good things about her..treats her well..to not want to be in a relationship..but i digress..you life and you learn
JennLee says
It sounds like he wanted a relationship with you, but he was afraid of transitions. He wanted it to be good, and fun, and wanted you to be sweet to him, and patient, and attentive, etc… He has likely seen where when relationships are new, the women were sweet, but later in the relationship, and usually after it is officially a long term one, he sees the women become different…less sweet, patient, less nurturing, less affectionate. it may also have happened to him. So he wanted to keep the relationship suspended in that early limbo area where you don’t feel so sure about it that you take him for granted, or start to get bossy. Who knows what things he is afraid of happening, but it seems clear to me that he wanted a relationship with you, he just wanted to keep it in a state that made him feel safe. I feel that he fears what will happen to the relationship once it transitions into a committed long term relationship.
sweetlife says
Thanks JennLee for that insight. I am confused as to what to do, well maybe I know what to do (which is what I’m doing now…leave him…maybe he will realize it is better to take a chance than not have me…but then again lets not hold on to that). How do you work with people or men like this..when will they get over their fear? And how can I help myself to move on..I cried so many times already and it’s only been four days
Karmic Equation says
Sweetlife,
You’re only 24. You have a lot of life to live.
You may not think so, but there WILL be another guy for you to love…and who will love you the way that you need to be shown love.
Let this one go. Date. Have fun. Pay attention to a guy’s character and how he treats you. Accept only the ones with good character and who treat you well. If he’s hot and funny but makes you feel anxious, dump his *ss, even if the sex rocks your world.
A lot of women say “sex isn’t important in a relationship, it’s character” — yet a lot of women will stay in relationships with men even when he treats her badly BECAUSE of the great sex. So women are lying to themselves, imo. Sex is MORE important to her than to the man because she’s willing to live an unhappy life to keep getting it. Men will not. No matter how hot the woman or how great the sex, eventually the man will leave if he’s treated badly. Which is a great shock to women who think hot sex will keep men around.
Be good to yourself. Drama does NOT equal love. Love makes you feel content, not anxious, not upset.
Find a guy who makes you content.
Lisa says
Something that really stood out to me about this letter that you do not comment on is that the writer states all his friends and family know about me. To me this means she has no meant them, unless I am reading it wrong? She needs to leave this relationship if that is true. I’m sorry but six months in is a long time to go without meeting friends or family. Something is shady to me here, it just is. And even if it is not, she is not getting what she wants from this man. Unless these two are in college this is a long time to waste and she has given him enough time to decide what he wants. She’s not asking for marriage or engagement just to be a girlfriend.
RebelAngel says
To add my two cents worth in (although you already have a vaults worth of those! :p). I agree with the comments above… he’s not committing in any meaningful way, and he’s trying to be honest. As to treating you like a boyfriend. … i think he’s a decent enough sort… doesn’t want to relationship to feel or be sleazy…. doesn’t want to feel like he’s using you…. so he treats you well – while he’s with you. He’s just reserving the right to not be with you at some point in the future and you need to decide if the whole thing is worth it for you or not…
Gen says
I dated one of these he claimed he didn’t want a girlfriend cause he didn’t have “time” but wanted all the perks of a relationship this lasted 2 months we had a falling out about him keep asking for home cooked meals and staying at my apt 5 out of 7 days a week (looks like he had time to me) anyway he got mad cause he was tired of red meat and wanted me to buy chicken when I told him he could purchase it and I’ll cook it all hell broke loose we never texted/called eachother again !
Russell says
You are better off without him. He was clearly using you. A lot of that going around. There are a lot of men who would gladly buy the meat if you offered to cook it.
I also agree that if he is staying over 5 nights a week, he is a boyfriend. If he doesn’t want the title, dump him. Then gladly run away from him as fast as possible because he is using you.
Denise says
Denise says
This is becoming quite common. I’ve dated a guy like this. He was recently divorced. I asked him what his intentions were with me and he told me he wanted to be friends first and see if we’re a match. Yet, he was questioning my whereabouts and making snide comments about me possibly going out with somebody else. These guys waste your time and are lonely or bored looking for somebody to pass the time with until somebody better comes along. I refuse to act exclusive with someone I’m not exclusive with.
Unknown says
Im in a “relationship” with a girl like this. I dunno what to do either. We were together for about 4 yrs on n off and now she says she isn’t gay but we still act like were together she just thinks the title complicates things and makes things worse I dunno what to do leave her completely or just see where it goes but reading these comments is kinda helping
Victor says
In the same boat but my partner is a female. I love her to Death. She just doesn’t like the label part. She acts like a girlfriend but doesn’t want the label. I’m literally in the same boat.
Christine says
I dated a guy who is exactly like this a bout a year ago. We went on romantic dates, went on vacations together, even met his friends but never called me as his girlfriend. One day, his realtor asked him if i am his girlfriend and he said no. That answer got me pretty shocked, because up until then, I thought I was his girlfriend. We had lunch as if nothing happened and he was all romantic again at the restaurant. But the whole time I was really upset. Later that day, I texted him saying that I thought of us as bf/gf for the last 3 months and his answer was that he doesn’t remember him putting a title on our relationship, So, angrily I asked him what I am to him, He goes “Do I really have to tell you that? Why can’t you understand labeling a relationship doesn’t do any good to people? Well, stupidly I let him stringing me along for the next 4 months afterwards. But, I finally had to end this show of his. Now, I am with a good man who is always there for me and not afraid to introduce me as his girlfriend. My point is that this self-centered, immature, commitment phobic guy made me realize what kind of traits I should look for in a real man. Probably the very opposite of what this selfish guy did to me. I learned that if there is no title, there is no relationship. The so-called “relationship without a title” is just not a real thing. And a real woman doesn’t need that.
Natalia says
I really agree with you! Though I want to point out when one thing actually – those guys usually have some emotional stuff going on… Like if you think about it. Perhaps his ex-girlfriend messed up his life? Maybe he got hurt? Cheated on? Or like.. he put so much effort in a relationship that eventually didn’t work out at the end, so he got devastated and stopped believing in a happy relationship.
Another thing I noticed among these guys is that I feel like they forgot what love means and how it feels. I think they can’t define what they feel. Of course, maybe they just don’t give a damn about you and don’t care, but perhaps they like you a lot, but have committment issues and don’t want to let themselves develop anything more. A good question is – what would he do if you left? If you said you just want to leave because his actions are hurting you. If he’s okay with it, just go. Seriously, just go. There isn’t much more he can do. If something is meant to happen, it will happen and if he wants you in his life and values your ‘being’, he will do what it takes to keep you.
I think guys like the one you talked about have problems with defining themselves. They like you and they like everything what is, theoretically, reserved for a relationship like kissing, sleeping with you, cuddling, playing with your hair, complimenting you, just being close with actually reasling YOU’RE NOT a friend anymore, but they emotionally can’t handle the title. They’ll tell you they don’t want a girlfriend, they don’t feel anything more, but in fact.. they realise you’re not a friend anymore. You’ve never been just a friend. He might tell you you should take a break, stop doing what you’re doing at the moment, but in fact – he likes it. It feels good. And at some point, I believe, he doesn’t know what’s up with his life – many thoughts are going through his mind – “I like her”, “it feels good”, but “i don’t love”, “i don’t want a relationship”, “but i dont wanna let her go”, “she brings a lot to my life”, “but im confused”.
Guys like that are truly not what you want. Yes, you will keep believing you want them, but you dont. You can do so much better. Yeah sure it probably seems like the most difficult thing to do – to actually walk away, but if you know you cant hadle the pressure – just go. Seriously – just go. The chance that they will grow up is very little and I wouldnt really count on that.. Unless a hurricane goes through the city and blow away their minds haha.
I feel like I’ve been there-maybe not fully, but kinda experienced this. If you have good abilities to deal with people’s committment issues, maybe you can give it a try, but if remember – there is something wrong with that guy. Maybe thats the reason why you like him – he’s ”different”, but yeah. They need to grow up so dont waste your time waiting for it. 🙂
Kyra says
I may be a little broken, but I’ve done a lot of thinking on just this thing the past few months. I’ve been in a relationship like this off and on for 11 years. In my heart, he’s my life partner, though unconventionally which really doesn’t bother me at all. And, in dating, I’ve waited 11 years for men to move from first dates to second dates to exclusive dating to a relationship and label of girlfriend and boyfriend. No man in dating has done this. I’m, sadly, inundated with offers and requests for “FWB” and “casual hangout partners with sex.”
And, I began thinking, why is it I am waiting for a man to tell me who I am and who I can be? If I want to be a girlfriend, be a girlfriend. If I want to call a man my boyfriend after 3-6 mos. of exclusive dating, call him my boyfriend.
So, with this man in my life, I’ve taken the time to have talks. I’ve handled very deep discussions on love, loss, attachment and anxieties with respect, aplomb and care. I had a heart-to-hearts with him about both of our fears/anxieties/aversions/worries/distancing/discomfort/etc. I’ve heard his issue with the label “boyfriend.” I’ve recognized, educated myself on and learned to work on and with his dismissive avoidance attachment (as well as my anxious attachment). We’ve discussed these issues and our triggers and how we trigger one another together. I’ve committed myself to being better, working toward a more secure attachment individual.
I came to the conclusion that I can be whomever I choose to me to a man. He can try to force a “casual” or “friend” label on me, but it’s up to me to appoint and assign who I want to be in my life. If I want to be a girlfriend, I will be one. I will no longer spend the rest of my life waiting for a man to anoint some label on me or himself. If we’ve been seeing one another for 3-6 months or more, we’re exclusively in a sexual relationship and have deep, emotional care and love for one another, you’re my boyfriend. I’m calling you my boyfriend. There will be no debate or discussion about my use of the term boyfriend. There will be no debating me in order to get me to lower my value of myself to suit your anxieties.
From this day forward I’m calling the man in my life my boyfriend. To his face. In his presence. At all times.
He can choose what he wants to do. Stay in a loving relationship that’s made it through some rough times and had some amazingly incredible times. Or leave, because who I unabashedly choose to be in my life hurts his sensibility to “labels.”
If the word bothers you, move on. If not, stay, get used to it, realize it doesn’t change a thing and accept all of this good lovin’ I’m giving you and will continue to give.
And, I will do this with every man I am seeking exclusively following.
Those that can’t handle it will be weeded out easily without a single worry in my head about “who I am or what label do I wait for him to give to me.”
I’m a girlfriend. End of story.
HeatherF says
I’m late to the game, but in my quest for answers about guys and commitment, I came across an article Evan wrote and he advices the woman to move on if he doesn’t commit to boyfriend status after 3 mo. https://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/understanding-men/believe-the-negatives-ignore-the-positives/ Seems like Evan has made it pretty clear what to do in a sitch like this. I like the idea of having a convo with him to figure out why not. If he can’t give a good reason for this and/or help you to feel great about whatever his intent is then I’d let him go. Hope the best for you!!
Tami says
A Relationship without a Title is Called Convenient
yang wang says
I dated this guy exclusively for 3 months, he mentioned that he only date one girl per time. I’m super nice, but there is one rule I set for myself is no matter how happy we are, 3 months I ask for labels, only yes and no as outputs. he said he doesn’t know if there is a future, which means no to me. And I decided to be friends with him, I asked on Friday so if I can’t control my emotions, I have whole weekends to cry and be emotional, Monday I’m back like sexy lady~, Tinder is on and smiles are at work.
Surprisingly, I was sad only on Friday night, and I feel so fucking good after that. don’t be afraid to stand for yourself. I learned it from tons of dating and pains.
LADIES!!!Keep telling urself this: My man would be the most adorable guy in the world, he would hold my hands and tell everyone I’m his, he will show me the clear future and stare at me with the infinite galaxy in his eyes. he will never be some weak coward hesitated in front of me and sugar-cover the so-called white lies.
Anon says
I agree with the posts although the article works too. I was given the gf title then it was taken away then I thought it was given back to me only to realize he was placating me. And he treated me very well too but at the end of the day he was dictating all the rules of engagement becasue he had issues with commitment. If it’s important to you then really consider whether you can overlook it. Your values and needs matter too. Friends and being nice is awesome but if you want a partner in every sense why not go for it?
Pop says
I got in early and asked a guy after a week what he wanted from me as things were moving at light speed. He replied ‘I’m not ready for a relationship and it’s too early’. I agreed with him. But I now know what’s going on in his head and can act accordingly. I’m not going to slam the door shut on him but I’m going to keep dating around, and I’ll worry about myself and he can worry about himself. No more being outcome dependent. Just enjoy dating, something will happen naturally.