Is Your Checklist Getting Too Long?

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It’s a fact that most of us have checklists describing the qualities of our ideal mate.

I’m not going to say whether this is a good thing or a bad thing. I’m just going to acknowledge that it’s real. When you’ve been on the planet for close to 40 years, you probably have a pretty good idea about what you’re looking for in a man.

I don’t blame you for a second, and I’m not going to tell you which things you should give up in order to find the man of your dreams.

What I will do today is illustrate to you how even your simplest list of non-negotiable dealbreakers is the very thing that is keeping you from finding love.

Take it from a guy who has a pretty high sense of self-esteem and wanted a woman who was his equal and more: holding onto the idea of a person prevents you from seeing the real person inside.

Even though I’m not a big advocate of lists, I think an ideal mate checklist can be a useful exercise and teaching tool. But because I don’t want you to work too hard, I’m going to make your list for you. Please forgive me if I get a few things wrong. I’m a guy, after all. 🙂

Even when you’re getting 17 out of 18 of your needs met, you’ll pick the ONE that makes you want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

You want a man who is:

Attractive
Honest
Intelligent
Kind
Funny
Financially Stable

This is entirely normal. Then again, you probably ALSO want a man who is:

Loyal
Family-oriented
Sexy
Generous
Interesting
Confident

Solid list, huh? Except the list gets longer when you really think about it…

Fit
Chivalrous
Charming
Ambitious
Tall
Creative

You like the fictional person that we’re putting together? I sure do.

I want to be him for Halloween.

In case you’re wondering, there is nothing wrong with this list.

Except that it can keep going and going and going. For each quality you add, there’s another justifiable reason that a man is not suited for you.

Maybe he’s got 17 out of 18 qualities, except he’s…

Not close with family. That’s a big one. After all, you’re tight with yours and you think it’s strange that he doesn’t enjoy spending time with his brothers every Thanksgiving.

Not funny. The ability to laugh is paramount, isn’t it? And even though this guy is perfect in every other way, that’s not something you can live without.

Not confident. He’s an amazing guy, but he just tries so damn hard to please that you can’t even respect him. If he just grew a pair, he’d be perfect!

Not tall. You can’t go out with a guy you can literally see eye-to-eye with. No matter how amazing he is. It just doesn’t make you feel feminine or turned-on.

Not sexy. You know what it’s like to feel lust and you just don’t feel it with him. You can’t go the rest of your life without that chemical rush.

We can continue, of course, but I think you see the point. It’s not that any of these desires are unimportant. It’s that, no matter what, you’re ALWAYS going to find a deal breaker.

Even when you’re getting 17 out of 18 of your needs met, you’ll pick the ONE that makes you want to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

End of relationship. Back to the drawing board.

Does this resonate with you? Do you always find fault in the men you’re dating and dream that somewhere out there is a man who gives you everything on your ever-expanding list?

If so, join the crowd.

My 60-year-old, twice divorced client, Katherine, did the same thing for many years.

She’d most recently had her heart broken by a charming, but commitment-phobic man from Match.com, and she turned to me for guidance through the dating process.

I quickly wrote her a new profile and started getting her more responses.

Next thing she knew, she had a bunch of options from quality men.

Do you always find fault in the men you’re dating and dream that somewhere out there is a man who gives you everything on your ever-expanding list?

One guy even reminded her of the heartbreaker.

They went out once. He said he’d call her again.

He didn’t.

But this other man did.

He wasn’t the most compelling candidate in the bunch, but he just kept asking her out.

Every time my client would go on a date with him, she would have fun. And then she’d complain on the phone that he wasn’t what she was looking for.

A sample of our conversation:

“He’s 5’7”. I’m 5’7”. And I like to wear boots so that doesn’t work for me.”

Okay, I told her. What else doesn’t work for you?

“He’s not exactly the rugged type. That’s what I’m attracted to. Men who can work with their hands. Fix things around the house. Saddle up a horse. You know, manly men.”

Got it. Apart from those two things, how is he? Is he cute? Is he thoughtful? Does he make an effort to see you? Does he have the same values as you? Can he keep up with your upscale lifestyle?

“Yes. Yes, to all of those things. He’s actually pretty great. It’s just — he’s not what I’m looking for. He’s not my type.”

Which guys are your types?

“My two ex-husbands. And the Match.com guy who broke my heart.”

Do you see a pattern there?

“Maybe. So what do you think I should do? I can’t help what I’m attracted to.”

No, but you can help the choices you make. Instead of investing your energy in another charismatic Marlboro man with a lot of money and a wandering eye, keep seeing this new guy and getting to know him. Maybe you’ll find that being tall and handy isn’t as important as you think it is.

One month later, Katherine had made her decision.

Her new boyfriend would meet her children and they’d all take a trip to Portugal together.

This is one of my favorite success stories because the solution was so simple.

Drop the checklist. Give this amazing guy a chance.

You can do the same.

You’re so close to having that relationship you truly desire. Time to make it happen.

Join our conversation (168 Comments).
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Comments:

  1. 141
    Christie Hartman

    Karl (148):
    “I don’t believe in paying for porn.
    I think porn is pretty silly.
    I’ve only been to strip clubs twice in my life (for a bachelor party & a farewell party).
    Does that mean I don’t look at porn either?
      
    If you aren’t busy looking at the free stuff, then yes, in my book that qualifies as not looking at porn.

  2. 142
    Bettina

    [email protected]: No, I don’t read the stuff you cite because I have in the past and found it a waste of my time. No offense, but I work in a quantitive field and the stuff you post would not pass muster when scrutinized by academic  peers. Sorry. Just my opinion.

    And by “desire” I mean what turns women on. True, though, by “satisfaction” I do mean orgasms, which have been studied somewhat. But I will repeat, paraphrased: We need much, much more study of female desire and satisfaction to balance out the veritable onslaught of info (both good and bad) that we have on the male side of the equation.  Don’t  you all want to know?        

    Also, in #119 I never used the phrase “at all,” so not sure why you’re saying that I said that. I think you introduced that idea,  in your discussion about studies.  There are also men who watched once, didn’t like it, and don’t even watch occasionally, as Christie points out.

    It’s curious that you don’t use it yourself and yet seem hell bent on convincing me that my boyfriend does. And also hellbent on telling me that I won’t find a guy unless I accept that every guy uses it.  Except you, of course. And even though I have a guy. Very curious.

  3. 143
    Jadafisk

    149. I think he’s saying that he does look at the free stuff. An entire generation of adults have grown up with the idea that you don’t pay for music or porn, they’re already covered in the price of an Internet connection. Also, men who find porn stars overwrought and/or the mainstream porn industry demeaning to women often look at sex videos made by everyday exhibitionists and posted online, which is still porn.

  4. 144
    Karl R

    Bettina said: (#150)
    “It’s curious that you don’t use it yourself”

    I have used porn. I have used it regularly in the past.

    Let me try an analogy to explain to you (and Christine) why I find the statements of “proof” you offer to be so funny.

    Up to 80% of women have faked orgasms at least once in their lives. Women find it hilarious when most men insist that no  woman has ever faked an orgasm with them. Why are the men sure? Because they would know if it were to happen. Why do the women find this funny? Because no man has ever figured it out when they faked an orgasm.

    So the when the men indignantly insist that no woman has ever faked an orgasm with them, they are simply restating what the women have already seen with their own eyes: the men are unable to discern a real orgasm from a fake one.

    You (and Christine) have offered numerous statements as “proof” that these men didn’t watch porn. They are similar to (or identical to) true statements that I have made to downplay my own porn use to women who disapproved.

    You (and Christine) are utterly convinced that these men don’t watch porn. In saying that, you are telling me what I already know: when women hear these statements they assume the man watches little or no porn.

    I just saw an article (which cited a peer-reviewed journal) which  stated that secretive porn viewing damaging to a relationship, while watching porn with your partner was beneficial (presumably when both partners wanted to watch porn).

    I’m not recommending that you start watching porn with your boyfriend. But I am suggesting that forcing your boyfriend into a position where he has to lie about his porn viewing (or lose you) is not ultimately beneficial to your relationship.

    Bettina said: (#150)
    “I work in a quantitive field and the stuff you post would not pass muster when scrutinized by academic  peers.”
    Bettina said: (#124)
    “The researchers you mention should have gone outside the US.”

    If you’re in such a quantitative field, and you understand more about studies than researchers at universities, then why did you suggest that the researchers go outside the U.S. (actually Canada)  to find research subjects who hadn’t watched porn? Wasn’t it blatantly obvious to you why that would invalidate their research?

    To answer the question you asked in #124, if you’re doing a comparison about the effects of porn, you can’t take people who use it regularly (from Canada) and compare them to people who have never been exposed to it (from Saudi Arabia) and run a valid comparison. Because you’ll never be able to determine which differences are caused by culture, which are caused by religion, and which are caused by viewing porn.

    You convinced me in post #124 that you knew nothing about doing a proper research study. It’s a little late to start telling  us that you know more than the people who did the studies.

    Nice try though.

  5. 145
    Helen

    Honestly, I think this is one of these “Don’t ask, don’t tell” situations.  I don’t believe that it damages a relationship to  keep a few subjects that way. I am certain my husband has viewed porn,  and I simply don’t care, because I have too in the past.   But neither of us is going to drag that  subject out into the open, because… who cares?   There is enough drama in everyday life (with kids) that you may as well avoid creating more.

    Karl R, thank you for listing the four traits above.    

    Unrelated to that, I hope you’ll forgive my seeming critical (Karl R) about your approach to discussions.   I’ve always appreciated your logical viewpoints.   But when you are talking about something  very personal to another person, such as  her  beloved, of course you are going to put  her on the defensive.   And the more you keep doing that without taking the hint that someone’s ire is being raised, the more you anger them, even if it was not your intention to be personal.    Because seriously, who cares?   Is it  so important to win a debate  with an anonymous (or even known) person if it would end up hurting  them or making them doubt someone else?
          

  6. 146
    Helen

    To add to my point above: Karl R, it’s actually your statistics that have proven faulty in several ways.   Since you don’t seem to mind statistical discussions:
      
    First: your argument about why studies can’t be conducted outside North America is invalid. You bring up culture and religion, which in statistics would be called “confounders” or “co-factors” if one were doing a predictive model, such as multiple regression.   But this isn’t a predictive model.   We are only interested in one very simple statistic: what proportion of men view porn.   It is IRRELEVANT why they do or don’t; hence, confounders are meaningless in this case. Of course this is something that can be studied across cultures.
      
    Second: your “proof” by analogy (of women faking orgasms) is not the kind of proof that would be acceptable at all even in pure mathematics, let alone statistics. One could start by asking whether this is even a relevant analogy.
      
    Third: you cannot make ANY statistical statements about Bettina’s man based on what all or most men do. In a specific field of statistics, biostatistics (usually applied to epidemiology), researchers are careful to only make inferences about whole populations, not about individuals within a population. Predictive models are only developed for and applied to populations. They do not attempt to describe how an individual will respond using the model (e.g., risk factors of cardiovascular disease or colon cancer), given the large uncertainty and variability around each point. And that’s for a well-established predictive model. This example of porn-viewing is just a summary statistic! There is such a huge amount of uncertainty and variability (let’s not even start with how the sample size or population was drawn) that it’s useless to try to generalize this point estimate to what one man does or doesn’t do.
      
    I think it’s valid if you make points about what most men do based on a summary statistic. But you’re overreaching if you try to say what Bettina’s man does, given that you don’t even know him.

  7. 147
    Ruby

    This debate about Bettina’s boyfriend is really starting to baffle me. Can’t we just assume that he is in the *small* (13% or whatever) minority of men who don’t watch porn and call it a day?

  8. 148
    Bettina

    [email protected] and 154: Well put. People also get annoyed when someone presumes to know more about someone else’s life and the people/practices in it than they themselves do based on, well, nothing at all expect a preening need to be “right” at all costs–even to the point of spouting nonsense till people just start tuning out.

    Great article in FT yesterday about statistics and their use:

    http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/dfe55458-ccb6-11e0-b923-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1VyFtea1J

  9. 149
    Bettina

    [email protected]: Not just questioning your use of statistics but also your understanding of grammar. In no post did I  say that you HAVE NOT used it or NEVER  used it (both past tense) because you have clearly stated otherwise. I said that you ARE NOT (present tense) using it. Here is the string of statements.

    I said: Also, in #119 I never used the phrase “at all,” so not sure why you’re saying that I said that. I think you introduced that idea,  in your discussion about studies.  There are also men who watched once, didn’t like it, and don’t even watch occasionally, as Christie points out. It’s curious that you don’t use it yourself and yet seem hell bent on convincing me that my boyfriend does.

    This  I took from your own  post: Since it’s been more than a year since I last watched porn (unlike 87% of men), I could honestly claim that that I can “take it or leave it”. I could also claim that I don’t watch porn regularly (which is completely accurate for the last two years, even though I watched it regularly beforehand).

  10. 150
    Karl R

    Helen said: (#154)
    “your argument about why studies can’t be conducted outside North America is invalid. […] We are only interested in one very simple statistic: what proportion of men view porn.”

    My arguement was why the researchers weren’t interested in a study conducted outside North America.

    If you’re talking about why we aren’t interested in the proportion of men who watch porn outside North America it’s a different (but even more valid reason). Are you going shopping for a husband in China or Saudi Arabia? If not, how is that statistic remotely valid?

    For most people, the proportion of porn viewers in Sacramento is irrelevant if they live in San Diego. Most of us look for a spouse in the near vicinity.

    Helen said: (#154)
    “your ‘proof’ by analogy (of women faking orgasms) is not the kind of proof that would be acceptable at all even in pure mathematics,”

    In pure mathematics, we have to assume the existence of the number one.

    Rigorous pure mathematical proofs might prove something (in the most literal sense of “prove”) but it’s not going to provide information that’s remotely useful to anyone reading it.

    It’s an analogy. Given that the number of men who watch porn exceeds the number of women who fake orgasms, I’d say it’s a fair comparison.

    Or are you saying that it’s not relevant because you would know if a man was downplaying his porn usage?

    Helen said: (#154)
    “it’s useless to try to generalize this point estimate to what one man does or doesn’t do.”

    I don’t know (nor do I care) what one man does.

    But if my fiancée had shown Bettina’s intolerance to porn, she wouldn’t know that I watched it. (I was only willing to discuss it because my fiancée  clearly didn’t care whether I had watched it.)

    If your boss says he’ll fire any employee who has used drugs, how many do you think will ‘fess up?

    I don’t know what Bettina’s boyfriend does. But (going back to #119) if she finds it “offensive/repugnant” if he looks at “certain kinds of magazines”, then she doesn’t know either. Statistics will be a lot more informative than the words coming out of his mouth. It’s in his best interest to tell her what she wants to hear.

    At this point, he’s committed to telling the same story that he told her the first time, regardless of whether it’s the truth.

    People lie. If you want to get the truth out of people, don’t make them pay a high price for telling it.

    Bettina said: (#157)
    “Not just questioning your use of statistics but also your understanding of grammar. […] I said that you ARE NOT (present tense) using it.”

    Is that your standard of measurement?

    I’m at the office. Of course I’m not using it.

    The last time my fiancée was out of town, I was working 12 hours per day. By the time I got home from work, I just wanted to sleep. The previous time she was out of town, I was working 9 hours per day. I watched porn a couple times.

    The next time she’s out of town … that depends on my work schedule.

    If you want a man who prefers sex to porn, that’s easy to find. If you want a man who doesn’t watch porn when he’s exhausted, that’s easy to find. If you want a man who doesn’t watch porn when he’s bored and horny … you may have difficulty.

    It has nothing to do with grammar. If I’m going to claim that “I don’t watch porn,” I mean in general, not just for this week.

  11. 151
    Gem


    Karl, #158
    But if my fiancée had shown Bettina’s intolerance to porn, she wouldn’t know that I watched it. (I was only willing to discuss it because my fiancée  clearly didn’t care whether I had watched it.)

    It’s in his best interest to tell her what she wants to hear.

    Does your fiancee’ know your weak threshold for lying? Does she know that the only way you’re going to tell the truth is if you KNOW she’ll agree with you?

    People lie. If you want to get the truth out of people, don’t make them pay a high price for telling it.

    When I’m dating/getting to know someone, I don’t lie about things that I KNOW could be deal breakers or even potential cracks. The whole point is to find someone who is right for us. I would not misrepresent myself to make myself appear to be something I’m not but knew the guy wanted.

    If you had lied to your finacee’ about porn or anything else, you’d have to keep lying for the entirety of your relationship. What happens when you get caught? This is why I don’t do it, Karl, and many other people don’t either. Some people –  maybe it comes with age, integrity, confidence, whatever –  tell it like it is because they are who they are and like who they are, and it’s not rewarding to lie or hide.

    Maybe instead of convincing Bettina why the stats support that her man is a secret porn watcher, you should be more introspective about your own compulsion to lie when you’re seeking acceptance. 🙂
      

  12. 152
    Joe

    What makes you think Karl lied to his fiancee?   If she doesn’t ask about the matter of porn, and he doesn’t bring it up, that’s not lying.   If she mentions it in passing but does not ask Karl if he’s ever watched it, that’s not lying.

  13. 153
    Bettina

    [email protected]: Re your comment: “But (going back to #119) if she finds it “offensive/repugnant” if he looks at “certain kinds of magazines”, then she doesn’t know either. Statistics will be a lot more informative than the words coming out of his mouth. It’s in his best interest to tell her what she wants to hear.”

    I never cited what I find offensive/repugant”–you’re putting words in my mouth and twisting my comments around in a very lame, transparent way to get out of the illogical position you have boxed yourself into.

    [email protected]: We all assume now that Karl lies because he is so insistent that all guys do (except for the 13% that he is sometimes in, sometimes not). Further, he accuses people of being “intolerant” as a way to justify  deceptive behavior. In other words, he thinks lying is OK if you’re with an intolerant person. No explanation for why you’d want to be with someone who finds your behavior so intolerable that you have to lie about it.

    But this statement of Karl’s is clearly, so obviosly true: “I don’t know what Bettina’s boyfriend does.”

    A fitting conclusion to 161 posts.

  14. 154
    Gabe Asher

    @84 Your last paragraph was spot on! Guilty as charged here. Never noticed before. A date might say “oh, our waitress is cute, don’t you think” I may reply “mildy, but the sharpie eyebrows are creeping me out…(after a surprised look by my date I reply)…..”Im just kidding, relax”. But the truth is sharpie brows are a NO-NO for me. Would never even consider dating a girl with those.
    .
    @90   Good post Sacha. As for the number question. As a man, we can’t win either. If you have a high number you look like an AIDS infected skeev. If it’s low, you look undesireable. Yes a (perceived) low number for a woman is important to me. I don’t want to think my gf or wife has been used as a cum receptacle. It’s bad enough she wasn’t a virgin, but I accept how times evolve, and people don’t have one partner typically. But to think she had like 50 meat sticks in her? Not a good program..
    .
    I’ve also found a womans favorite number to claim is 5! (laughable for most, but I appreciate the effort).  I never ask if I am even mildly interested in the girl. If I’m not interested in her, and it comes up, I have asked.  
    .
    Random thought. I feel like both men and women think that they are in the  league  of the highest value person they dated in the past. That they can at least repeat that, if not do better. You must take that person as the highest, then take the lowest. Your league is somewhere in between the two. Water finds it’s own level. Most people shoot high then slowly lower their standards until they find their league. I feel like many people here on this blog have yet to capitulate. They are the hold-outs.

  15. 155
    sephornet

    Bettina @ 161: “…why [anyone would] want to be with someone who finds your behavior so intolerable that you have to lie about it”

    I have often wondered this. If a person cannot be accepted as they are, why stay in the relationship?

  16. 156
    Helen

    Karl R, where are you?   I miss your logical comments, even when we’ve disagreed.

    Went back and read through this entire thread… wow. Very entertaining.  Not too much of it was related to the original point, however, which is of making sure the checklist is not too long.

    I wonder if we couldn’t simplify things and simply state that what really matters is the quality of the heart of the person you’re with – how s/he treats you,  AND how s/he treats other people.   I’ve always found this to be the best barometer of the quality of a person’s heart, and how likely you are to feel happy with the person, whether s/he’s a lover, friend, or colleague.   This is true of both the men and the women I interact with.   If they treat you nicely at first but  you see that they are  mean to others (waiters, other colleagues, strangers), you can bet that they will turn out to be mean to you as well.   If they are courteous and gentle to everyone, they are a prize.

    The other stuff just doesn’t matter, gals (and guys). The looks, the travel, the clothes, the exotic cooking – NONE of it matters. None. Care about yourself enough to care about how you are being treated, and value that first and foremost.    

  17. 157
    EmeraldDust

    My “check-list” is pretty short.
    Most dating experts say that the “no cheating, no physical abuse, etc” go without saying, so that’s not really on my list.   Treating me well is of course “on the list”, but that is such a basic, that should be on EVERYONE’s list, that it seems silly to mention.
    1. Non-Smoker     I really HATE the smell, and I don’t want to witness another slow painful death of a loved one to smoking related diseases. I know, I know, people can die slow painful deaths from other causes, but I would like to at least eliminate this one.   And the smell, and the taste, and the after sex smoke.
    2. Non drug user, although now that medical marijuana is legal in my state, and recreational use is becoming legal in some states, I might let pot smoking slide.   It’s always been a legal issue for me.   In fact, I think it’s ridiculous that it’s illegal, and when it becomes across the board legal for recreational use, I can scratch this off my bucket list.   No hard drugs.   Social drinking fine, no alcoholics, unless they’ve been in recovery for a long time.
    3.   I must be attracted.   One would think that this would go without saying.   But I’ve been accused of holding out for a 6 foot tall rock star.   There was a big pile on when I objected to the advice to lowering the bar to “go out with a guy who doesn’t repulse you”.   Look, I haven’t experienced that level 10 over the moon attraction in DECADES, but I would like to feel a little excited by a guy.   Not being repulsed is really not being attracted.   I’m not asking for the moon and the stars, but a guy who puts a little spring in my step would be nice.   I have been attracted to all types of looks.   I generally like guys who are kind of cute but not gorgeous.   Both my ex hubbies were around 5’7″, so no, height is not a big deal for me.     I don’t mind a little bit of a gut, but please, not morbid obesity.   I actually LOVE silver hair on a man, so bring on the old gray guys !   For some reason tons of facial hair is a turn off for me.   Wasn’t so much in my youth, don’t know why I dislike it now.   A well trimmed moustache or a small beard, I’m usually OK with, but the big white bushy Santa Clause beard grosses me out.   I wish I didn’t, because the Duck Dynasty crowd seems to be what I mostly attract online.
    4.   Financially stable.   Please note, I am not asking for filthy rich, or even just plain rich.   But I am fairly low income myself, but I am self supporting.   I can’t afford to be a man’s ATM machine, nor do I expect him to be mine.
    5.   Must want a relationship — with ME.   Again, you would think this would go without saying, but women are constantly shamed as being “clingy” or “needy” for knowing our own hearts and wanting to be IN LOVE, not in a FWB situation.
      
    6.   Physically affectionate, in and out of the bedroom.   Never took that love test, but I suspect, that physical touch is my main “love language”.   I’m a cuddler.   I need the same in a man.  
    7.   Appreciative – again, one would think this goes without saying.   Thank you is in my vocabulary.   I expect it to be in his.   (Last guy I almost got involved with did not say “Thank you” when I made dinner for him.   I thanked him for every date and every time he opened my door.   I assumed he did not like the dinner I made for him.   That’s not the sole reason why we didn’t work out, but it sure didn’t raise my opinion of him)    
    8.   Reliable– I won’t accept constant flaking out on plans.
    Of course, overall compatibility is important, but how am I supposed to list that out, and of course that should go without saying.   Good communicater, some common interests, and we give each other the freedom to pursue any individual interest that don’t overlap.   I guess the litmus test for compatibility is this:   Do we feel good when we are together ?   Do we seek out ways to be together, or look for excuses not too.   “Busyness” is usually a sign of dis-interest.   When a man and a woman like each other, they look for ways to be together.
      
    So, is my check list unreasonable ?   Or do I not ask for enough ?   (Rhetorical question)

  18. 158
    Kristin

    For me, my deal breakers:

    Got to have physical attraction to them. Can’t be repulsive.

    At least 5’10” – hey I’m 6 feet tall and anything shorter than that I feel like a fat beast, even those I’m athletic and toned.

    A Christian who goes to church at least once a week, maybe even Bible studies – faith is non negotiable.

    I’m super allergic to dogs and cats.   Just not a good way of life having them around. Love them! I’d never ask an owner to get rid of an animal.

    Non-smoking. I’m an asthmatic, don’t want to end up in a casket before my time.

    I’m still questionable on whether or not I’d date someone with kids. I hear stories about how kids will be the #1 priority, and I already know in my past engagement, what it feels like to come last after my ex’s schooling, rumba class, softball, bible study, and church.   I would prefer that the mere mention of having kids is on the dating profile and not be ambushed on a date by a bomb being dropped you weren’t expecting.   You don’t need pictures or a name, just a mention you have kids.   If you’re one something other than Tinder, then one has to fill in the drop down.

    Divorced – still questionable. I’ve been told 3 years is a good amount of time. 1.5 years (my ex-fiance) doesn’t seem like enough time as he mentally dealt with that when we were engaged and was in denial that was the source.   You have to see what baggage they bring from being in a marriage/divorcing and do they ever want to get married again in their future?

     

  19. 159
    Keith

    As a male I have a list.    When the time comes and I divorce my current wife,   I know exactly what I will deserve.    Although my list match  will have to be found through an intimate compatability survey that I can’t put examples of here due to its nature.   Therfore nothings wrong with a list.   I know I check all of a woman’s boxes,   soooooo they better check off mine too.   If they don’t no need to date her.    How is that for fair play lol.

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