I Want To Stop Having Sex With My Boyfriend Until We Get Married.
Hi. My boyfriend and I have been together for almost a year. I waited until I was officially his girlfriend (2 months) before we had sex. It’s been amazing, but this New Year I want to get closer to God and stop having sex until we get married. It seems like he can’t sacrifice sex for the man above or for me, and when I talk to him about it he tries to ignore the subject.He agreed to not have sex, but I feel like he’s just saying it to say it. Should this be a big concern? Or am I taking it too far since we’ve already been sexual for the past 10 months?
Thanks! Yasmin
Dear Yasmin, I’m sorry, sweetie, but you really wrote to the wrong guy. I’m pro-sex, pro-logic, and pro-consistency, and your letter fails all three tests. I can understand a woman who sleeps with a man too quickly, like, date 1 or 2 – pulling back to say, “Hey, we should get to know each other a little better first before we embark on a sexual relationship.” The guy may grumble a bit at moving “backwards,” but, if he likes her, he’ll be pleased to wait a few weeks until she trusts him enough to resume the physical part of their relationship. You, on the other hand, were patient enough to wait two months to sleep with your guy. Good for you, really! – for showing restraint and seeing what he was made of as a man. As a result of your patience, you’ve been rewarded with an amazing boyfriend, and, not incidentally, 10 months of good sex.
And, correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t God all-forgiving? I’m sorry. I really tuned out during Hebrew school.
Then, suddenly, you had a New Years Revelation (stronger than resolutions, I hear), which told you that in order to “get closer to God,” you should stop having sex. Got it. Now, forgive my ignorance of religion, but I’ve got a handful of questions: What does “closer to God” mean? What happens to all the unfortunate God-fearing women who have been having pre-marital sex without changing their minds? Are they screwed? Are they all going to hell? Or will they just not be as “close” with God as you are? And, correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t God all-forgiving? I’m sorry. I really tuned out during Hebrew school.Oh, there’s one more thing that begs a question: what about your boyfriend’s feelings? It would be like you driving your parents’ car for a year when you were 16, and then, when you turned 17, hearing from Dad that you were losing your driving privileges. Why? Because Dad read a statistic that girls under 18 get into a higher percentage of car accidents. Does he have a point? Maybe. But that wouldn’t make you feel any better. In fact, having your privileges taken away will probably make you feel much worse than if you hadn’t been driving that whole year at all. You’d understandably be resentful of your Dad, even though you know he was doing it for the right reasons.
And if you cut off your boyfriend from having sex after 10 months, don’t be too surprised if he cuts you off in return.
No matter how I slice it, I see your predicament as an arbitrary, self-imposed one, based on a lack of understanding of both religion and human nature. And if you cut off your boyfriend from having sex after 10 months, don’t be too surprised if he cuts you off in return. Not because he’s a selfish jerk. But because he has a girlfriend whose actions and needs are not properly aligned with his own. Finally, I’m sincerely sorry if I misinterpreted the doctrine of your religion. If you, or anyone reading this, wants a more religious take on the Church’s position on pre-marital sex, consult your clergy. But since you asked a dating coach a sex question, you got my irreverant take on it. Hope it gives you some clarity.
Evan, sorry, but this is like the world’s worst answer. First of all, you compare stopping sex to cutting off car privileges??? Did I miss something here? There is no comparison.
Second of all, this woman does not owe this guy sex. You talk like, this guy is totally entitled to have sex with this woman, well guess what Evan – they’re not married!! I direct you to this line again – they’re not married!! If they were, I would say, yes, he is totally entitled to have sex from her. Maybe there is no real commitment on his part and that is what is also why she is making this decision. I think you should rethink this answer. You make it sound like she is a prostitute and he’s her pimp. Seriously! Again, they are not married – she does not owe him a thing.
Thank you
Yes I agree with the above too
Thanks Amelia, finally another woman brave enough to speak the truth and give some common sense and balance to these sex topics. I say this all the time, but people, mostly guys get so offended and jump all over me and say I am a troll, just because I have my own opinion as a woman.
Many of the men on relationship sites, and some women site owners, are always telling women what we should do to keep a man. I say if it is that much work, then it is not worth it. They always threaten that the boyfriend will cheat on us or leave us, because of this or that . I say “Who cares, let him cheat, let leave.” Women have got to stop allowing men to argue their guy code doctrine, about how they need sex and we shouln’t deny them. One thing I know is that women can cheat as well. 3-22-14
Even married women are allowed to say no.
Do married women say anything else after the children are born?
Please tell me that you are trying to be funny, @Peter 51. I know plenty of heartbroken wives who confide that their husbands have lost all interest in sex. And I know even more couples who maintain a happy, vibrant intimate life well after their children are born.
Good point Aly 🙂
Yes!
No one’s stopping any woman from saying no. They are informing them that there will be consequences for that action. A woman is well within her right to decide she doesn’t want to have sex anymore for whatever reason. And a possible consequence to this could be her boyfriend/husband exercising his right to leave and go find a partner that wants to have sex with him.
The “entitlement” here falls on the OP not the man. He doesn’t feel entitled to sex (or I should say nothing in the post suggests that he does). He doesn’t just think he can get sex whenever he pleases without doing anything. That is what him being entitled to sex would mean. He is being her boyfriend, aka the same thing he was doing while they’ve been having sex for 10 months. The relationship requirement that she made him fulfill before they started having sex. So it’s not unreasonable to expect your girlfriend that has been having sex with you becasue she is officially your girlfriend, to continue to have sex with you becasue she is still your girlfriend.
What is unreasonable, and somewhat entitled, is to change the terms of the relationship on your own, with no input from your boyfriend, expect him to go along with it, then become upset when he doesn’t. She changed things and just wants him to be ok with it and say nothing. He waited until it was official – sounds like that what she wanted. No issues there at all. But she has now decided she wants to stop and wait until things become more official. And she writes in because he has a problem with it. That is a perfect example of entitlement. No sex for him until he terms are met. Being that it is her body, she is entitled to let/not let anyone enter her. But her unilateral decision is now affecting her boyfriend’s body. So he is just as entitled to not buy into this and move on if the matter is important and he so chooses – just like she can.
Whether intentional or not, she is using sex to try and manipulate her boyfriend into doing what she wants, with zero consideration for what he wants. and that is just a shitty thing to do to your significant other.
God says through Paul in his word that actually married couples are not to say no to each other sexually unless they are both in agreement about it for some reason. Withholding sex from your married partner could lead them into temptation to cheat.. just like not having sex is a big deal to God when you’re not married, having an intimate sexual relationship between a married couple is a big deal to God as well.
Um no lol. The analogy was spot on.
Not even getting into the religion thing cause many religious ppl have closed minds & narrow viewpiints. Great, and funny, advice 🙂
hey Elon, many non-religious people are narrow minded and have closed minds too, so what is your point? Have no idea how old this post is by the way 😀
Walking a narrow path is not the same as being narrow minded. 😀
Non religious people look at every religions few so yeah..
It always amazes me when people claim “religious” people are closed minded or narrow view pointed .I would encourage you to first try and understand why you see it that way, if you feel too lazy to try and comprehend I would have to point the finger at you being closed and narrow minded. (Not religion by the way) God is God and will always be weather you see it to be religious or not. That’s the awesome thing about him and his word of life. But most people who believe in God know our foundation, it is not that we are closed minded but why be open to a thought or action that we know will destroy or tamper our relationship with the creator. And that makes us closed minded? We value his ways, Narrow minded in your eyes because we are well aware that certain actions we choose to take (which everyone has experienced ) can turn out to be damaging to the soul because we did not simply guard our hearts. When you have sex with someone you become one. But drink your tea and act like you dont understand what sex feels like. It feels GOOD!!! and yet. Everything that God has made for Good the enemy has used for evil. Sex is supposed to be fulfillment through your loved one, not to just negate your urge and satisfy your lusts. Funny how men expect us to give up one of the most precious things about us and fail to see the significance in putting a ring on it. They are asking for everything with no true efforts. Marriage proves to a woman she is all yours. And when shes all yours. Take her to bed she will bave no problem giving it to the man that makes her feel secure.
She owes him the same respect that she would expect to get and/or deserve if earned. If they are serious enough that she wants to get married then by now sex is an integral part of the relationship. You might as well cut off love for some reason and expect the other person not to change and accept it. Sex is part of a relationship and should be treated as such, it is no a doggie treat or a tool to punish or reward. The divorce rate is so high in this country because people have come to treat relationships and marriage as disposable when the first bump or inconvenience comes along, not to mention that so many can’t grasp (or have never really been) being IN Love. I learned all of these things the hard way via my parents who both went through multiple divorces. My wife and I have been together for twenty years now.
…and lets be honest, if you treat sex as a tool or plaything now with him before you get married, no matter your reasoning, what makes you think he is going to think things will change when you marry him?
I had the same situation with my girlfriend, and thats exactly what I’ve been wondering @ Logan
But whats the difference then if we live as a marriage already, what difference will it make to get married? There will be no interest in getting married if were already living as one? And if so then what to do if i want to get married with him though? Thanks
Simple, Ashley.
If marriage is that important to you, you have to draw a hard line.
Tell him that marriage is very important to you. And that you would prefer to marry him rather than anyone else.
But if doesn’t feel he would be willing to get married within a year (or whatever time table you can accept), then it’s better that you know now so that you can free yourself to find someone else who WILL marry you.
Basically, do you feel marriage is important enough to break up with him over?
You have to have the strength and courage to stand by your convictions. So if the answer is yes, then you need to break up with him.
If the answer is no, then you accept you won’t get married…AND you don’t get resentful.
If the answer is not sure, you get sure before you talk to him. Know what your bottom line is.
I agree. I am trying very hard situation from sex for my boyfriend. But it had been part of our relation since the beginning. Here’s to trying to do the right thing.
Don’t withold sex with the intention of trying wrest a marriage proposal from your boyfriend.
Break up with him and tell him that you’ve decided that since you’ve decided you can’t have sex without being married, the only fair thing to do is to free him to find a woman who WILL sleep with him without marriage.
You do realize that IS the fair thing to do if you love your bf right? He has a right to find someone who will make him happy, just as you have a right to find someone who will marry you before you have sex again.
We grow and change our minds. It’s ok.
Most relationship are based on sex and not love, and if she leaves my dear then he’s not the one. You were having sex and you realised is wrong, and if you want to do this to please God then don’t worry about what people say. Man need to learn the basic of relationship are not based on sex, not all man but some man. Respect yourself enough to wait for the right time and he will respect you too. Rather loose people than God
I agree with Amelia. You are never obligated to have sex with someone, and if your boyfriend threatens to break up with you due to the lack of sex, screw him. If he really loves you that wouldn’t matter to him. Overall, I found this article sososososo offensive.
“If he really loves you that wouldn’t matter to him.”
Right here is where things get really one sided. Lets turn this around; Maybe if she really loved him she would put her god fearing ways aside and have sex with him because she truly loves him. In my opinion this girl loves god, a piece of paper from the state, and a an expensive party more than she loves him. Her boyfriend potentially loves her through and through, emotionally and physically, and in greater depth than whatever else is going on in his life.
The writer needs to find a guy who is just as committed to god as she is.
Her boyfriend on the other hand needs to find someone who is as committed to their relationship as he is.
There is nothing wrong with either of them. I think Evans response was pretty fair to both sides. He was giving her insight on something she may or may not have understood, which is exactly why she wrote her story in the first place. Quit freaking out ladies.
Well thats the main point mate as a believer God is supreme over all…we are taught to love God with our whole heart and soul not man…it is wise to be Godfearing and foolish to follow the carnal ways of man…there is no point non-religious people responding to her post as her issue is religious based
Carsade said:
“there is no point non-religious people responding to her post as her issue is religious based”
Interesting.
Yasmin specifically sought advice from Evan (who is agnostic). She was clearly seeking the advice of at least one non-religious person.
In addition, part of issue revolves around her boyfriend, who is either less religious or non-religious. Therefore, the people who are less religious or non-religious may have better insight into her boyfriend’s perspective.
And if you really want to compare a non-religious response to a religious person’s response, look at what Evan said (in comment #74) and what starthrower68 said (in comment #117). To me, it’s the same advice, just using different words.
I agree-someone may start off on the wrong foot but God allows U-Turns.If he values his relationship with God he should appreciate trying to correct getting off course-Plus I believe the Creator that made us knows what will give us the best happiest life ever- Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden paradise a perfect sinless blessed environment for the worlds first couple ruined by the entrance of sin and disobeying and rebelling against Gods one rule-dont eat of this one tree in the garden-have all the rest of any tree but leave this one alone or you will die-obey Gods word and live blessed- His word is his will- he doesnt leave us in the dark on how to live blessed-we choose blessings or curses-cast out of paradise because of sin in the human heart spirit and mind- dont forget the devil and all the lies and deception he used to slander Gods goodness to the first couple to blind their minds with lies about all the good things their sin and rebellion would bring them- it didnt turn out like he said at all but they lost everything that was good and got cursed and cast out and began to die and suffer from the first moment they sinned. Sin is always sin no matter how lovely its disgusied- and it always brings death and separation from God – But The Lord Jesus Christ suffered and died for our sins to save us from the ultimate separation from God -Hell -the place designed for satan who also fell and the fallen angels that rebelled with him-God never wanted any of that for humans and grants atonement for all sin when people receive christ and repent and turn from what they know is wrong.Being right with God is eternally important heaven or hell one day-the boyfriends feelings are important but not over Gods Word which teaches no immoral person straight or gay will be in heaven-all sinners who dont repent choose hell for themselves-God provides a way of escape take it.You and your boyfriend preferably- get married for the right reasons also or get out of it all together- there are good fair respectful reasons to readjust a bad original decision- Marry a guy who respects Gods word and isnt selfish or makes sex his god even over whats good for you both- he may see the light one day- but till then you follow Gods word so you can live blessed and have eternal life in heaven one day for doing whats right no matter what it requires.You have a conscience to keep peace with too-its there to keep you on track- some people have messed their conscience up as well and cant tell right from wrong anymore.If being right with God is important try not to be a bad witness anymore to your boyfriend-do the right considerate thing for all involved but Gods Word comes first you will answer for what you have done on earth one day -him too.
I agree that he is not entitled to have sex with her. No one is obligated to have sex with any other person, and this idea of entitlement to sex is an effect of a strong rape culture. She has every right to adhere to her religion in any way she sees fit or even say she wants to stop having sex. But even if they were married he is not entitled to sex either. If a spouse does not want to have sex, they shouldn’t be obligated to or forced to (which is what entitlement would imply).
It’s not really an “obligation” to have sex. It’s just that sex is a fundamental part of a happy relationship, and if she is not meeting his need for sex he is also under no obligation to meet her need for anything, really.
I believe that Evan means that it is wrong of her to have her man believe that sex will be readily available in the relationship and then telling him that she has decided that sex will no longer be on the menu. In the same way he could decide that anything else in the relationship, that he has also led her to believe is fun for both of them, will no longer be made available by him. And allowing it to be further like sex, not allowing her to have that need that he is not satisfying, be met by anyone else.
Not everyone thinks this way.
Sex is a fundamental part of a happy marriage. Having sex in a relationship that is not marriage is fornication, which is a sin because it goes against what God intended, because God intended sex for marriage.
Manda, I was totally with you up until you said that even once married, she is under no obligation to have sex with him. My understanding of the Bible says differently. If you are talking about state laws, then you are right, to an extent. It is legal grounds for divorce however. But the Bible tells both the man and the woman not to deny each other sex. It even goes so far as to say that once you get married, your body does not belong to you anymore. It belongs to your spouse. I do not believe this means that either can simply have sex on demand, but the implication is clear. Do not withhold sex. I suppose that is subjective. To me it means that unless you have a legitimate reason, such as illness, extreme fatigue from a hard day at work, or some other legitimate reason, then you should be open to having sex. In practice, this means that you simply make it a priority in your life sufficient that your spouse does not feel they are being denied sex. They have to be able to accept the occasional, “Not tonight Honey.” But, they should not have to accept a whole lot of them.
Since her reasons for not having sex now are religious and Bible based, she would be a hypocrite if she then went against what the Bible commands, once she is married. If she starts treating it as a reward, “only when I am happy with you,” or if she simply decides she doesn’t want sex in the marriage, she is going against what the Bible teaches and so she would be a hypocrite.
Perfect answer
Very well explained…
Even in marriage you are not supposed to defraud one another of sex without mutual agreement for a limited time for prayer and fasting legitimate cause- not manipulation- Never assume that because you are married and your bodies are not your own -they are Gods temple first and belong to Him-respect the temple and dont try to turn your spouse into some xxx porn star-dont marry a porn trained person to start with- perversion-adultery-pedophilia-the book of Leviticus teaches proper sexual boundries- no mother- sister- in-law sex-the book of song of solomon is very graphic erotic styled lovers poetry.Beautiful godly married sex- the best there is.You can always say no to sin and selfishness- just not to manipulate or defraud- marriage is a type of christ and the church- his bride- no room for perversion and playboy thankfully good sex is Gods idea . Learn from the best-Intercourse is vaginal -oral is not clear-other stuff is perversion-Stay with what you know is right till you are sure of the rest-dont fall for all the crap out there sick people who dont know God want. Dont marry a pervert to start with-You can say no for valid true sincere reasons but protect your closeness but start on good ground now if you didnt at first. Nobody can force anybody married or not to have sex against their wishes that is rape-sex crimes are a related topic to include in whats right and wrong in marriage-if it cant be done well and good why bother with it at all-Love is patient and kind not selfish- sacrifices for the good of another- has self control-sex isgood but Love is greater-The character of a man or woman is important also in sex-
I agree !
I am a man, my fiance has recently done this to me.
It’s 4 months before the wedding, and I’m having serious doubts about our relationship because of this very big move she made without considering my feelings.
I feel exactly like Evan describes and I came to this site for help on this specific topic.
I’m sorry if all this happened to years ago, and I’m reviving an extremely old comment, but I can’t seem to see dates on this site.
You’re right to reconsider. If two people have such diametrically opposed values, they probably aren’t a good match.
@Gerhard: sorry to hear about your troubles, but at least she did it before you got married, not after.
It is interesting to note so many of the comments about how a man is not “entitled” to sex from his girlfriend/wife. True enough! But should you marry this woman and then have her exercise her right to refuse you sex, she would most certainly be entilted to half your assets and income for many years/perpetuity.
In a marriage, or even in any committed relationship, sex is the one thing that you can only do with your partner. If that partner unilaterally decides to refuse sex on a regular basis, they are negating the terms of the relationship IMHO, and at that point the terms need to be re-negotiated. If the couple can not come to terms that both accept, the relationship should end – penalty-free for both partners. As I said, you are lucky that you can end it penalty-free at this point, with no alimony payments or asset division hanging over your head.
That’s the ONLY thing you CAN do? Man you sure a multi creative outside the bedroom.
@Gerhard:
This is one of those times that the world makes no sense to me. My friend has recently ended his engagement to his gf of SIX YRS, a girl who by his accounts was a fantastic gf. But u’re getting married in 4 months to a woman who is so selfish and unpredictable (in a bad way). I wish I could do a swap where his ex-fiancee was your fiancee and your fiancee was his fiancee (but he’d dump her, of course, lol).
Look, i know this is a serious issue and after all u do love her i’m sure. But please think about what the others have said, esp Jeremy’s comment. This selfish unilateral decision-making is a giant red flag. I’d say the same thing to any loved one, male or female, who told me their fiance/fiancee had done something like that.
@twinkle, @jeremy and @starthrower68
Thank you guys so much. You really helped me put things in perspective. It’s great to know there’s people like you around.
Keep it up!
Thanks for the props Gerhard but I bet you’d get a lot of disagreement on my being out there having any value. 😉
I don’t know how old this comment is, or the replys that followed but I think a lot of people on here are pretty silly.
Gerhard, I hope you talked to your fiancé about this before making any rash decisions to end your engagement. What she is doing IS selfish, but only for one reason, she did not ask your opinion on the matter, she just decided.
But then at the same time, why the hell is this such a big deal? So she cut you off of sex for 4 months until you will be getting married and having sex together for the rest of your lives together! I have heard of people stopping having sex for whatever periods of time before their wedding even though they had sex before, and the reason? To make their first night as man and wife even more exciting! She is cutting you AND herself off! You are both cut off of something that felt great for the two of you so that once the night comes that you get married it makes it ten times better because you have both been wanting it so bad for this entire time! She isn’t “exercising her right to refuse you sex” as some people seem to be saying here, she if trying to make that first night even better! Maybe trying to make it feel like the first time without downsides.
as for some of the other comments I read, of course you dont OWE anyone sex, it should always be a decision you make, do I want to have sex or not? But if you decide not to before you are married, it doesn’t mean that you will always deny sex after you are married! And hopefully when you are married it isn’t to someone who will try and push and push sex on you if you really aren’t up for it. You obviously shouldn’t deny your husband or wife sex. And if there is no sex happening at all after you are man and wife, this might not be a healthy relationship. This is when smart people go to a couple therapist to find out what is wrong, or try new things to try and pick up their fallen love life.
And to Yasmin. He obviously isn’t going to be too thrilled with the idea, you have been having great sex for 10 months and then tell him you cant do that anymore. if you love doing something with someone and are told you can’t do it anymore until something else has happened, you won’t love it either. Evans warning is valid, not all guys will stick around through and decision like this. But as mentioned as well, it IS your body and you get to decide what you do with it! If you don’t want to have any more sex until you are married then don’t! But definitely try to discuss it deeper with your boyfriend as well. He said ok to no sex, but you seem to feel it isn’t sincere. Try asking him if he feels this is unfair. And find out if there is a way you can both meet in the middle. There are other ways to ‘have fun’ other than sex.
This might not make scene to you but in laying down sex you will prepare you for her ,and thirsting for her I am a christian as well and God asked me to do same thing it’s about knowing her and saverying the union to come, and showing commitment ..I believe God can carry you through and make it even better then what you expierenced..if not whose to say God wouldn’t yank u out of herr life,, if you know bible story abraham and sarah God promised a child and in time they had one issiak God then ask him to sacrifice his son,Abraham did as God called him God was testing him to to see if he would trust him and he did and brought the lamb ..sex is flesh still sin with marriage its beautiful I understand there’s a lot of views but if you love her isn’t she worth the wait showing no matter time changes that,it shows her your honering her, Gods little princess and in knowing you will walk it out with her,she will care more for you because your sacrificing your flesh as well.
You don’t need to worry about it, Gerhard. I don’t know how old this comment is, though. She’s doing the right thing. And she loves you. And what she’s doing might even show how much she loves you. Respect what she’s doing, and tell her you respect it, but explain how you feel about her not considering your feelings. Just make her aware of the fact that you feel like she didn’t consider your feelings, or make her aware of whatever you feel. But be nice when you talk to her about it.
Amos 3:3
Do two walk together unless they have agreed to?
It’s biblical…you both should hv agreed to this together …
That too is biblical …she can’t pick and choose parts of the bible 😞
So .. Let me get this straight, when people are married, they’re owed sex? The man/woman is not allowed to withhold his/her body if he/she feels like it whilst married?
That is correct. If a woman is going to withhold sex from her boyfriend or fiancee, until they are married, for Biblical reasons, then they should also accept the other side that says they are not allowed to withhold sex, or should not withhold sex from their spouse.
Most Christians today don’t see this as being able to demand sex at a specific moment, rather a broader interpretation meaning that you don’t make a practice of withholding sex to the point that the other person feels deprived of sex, which would lead to them being tempted to be unfaithful to their spouse. If you have a headache 5 or 6 nights a week, that’s a problem. The suggestion would be to seek counseling with the pastor to get marital problems solved that are eating away at the love between the two people.
I agree! If anything,if he were to “cut her off” or leave then he would be showing how selfish he really is, its true hes not entitled to this womans body! I hope she didnt take evans advice
Amelia, Stop being a fuckboy. They have been going out for 10 fucking months. She need to be smart and realize, a) she already fucked by having sex (since it is against her beliefs) B) Her boyfriend’s sexual tension will reach its limit and he will make a back choice in the heat of the money. Yasmin needs to fucking accept human nature. You people need to stop being fuckboys because she can’t un-fuck herself. Also she would rather ruin a perfectly good relationship just to try and gain a better relationship with a fictional being. This is ludicrous.
God forgives our mistakes and no one is too far gone to not change course and follow a path for success. Christianity believes in sex being in a committed marriage bond between a husband and wife. There is no obligation , only love and true love waits for the other one because sex is not about getting what we want … It is about unselfishly giving our whole self to the one we are with… And if she believes that she should get closer to God because he says that sex is for marriage- then good for her! If you don’t stand for something…. You fall for anything!!
Wow really Jack?
she obviously does know that she messed up that is why she is trying to stop, hence her telling him she needed to stop having sex. Also she obviously realized it was a good relationship, one that she didn’t want to risk ruining any more by a worldly sin. And this “fictional being” you speak of “ruining” her relationship over isn’t fictional in any means. The is more evidence of God walking this earth then you would realize. There is more PROOF of God’s life on this earth then there is of the first president of the United States being alive.
Its a shame no decent parents raised you to be respectful of others-Your using constant profanity isnt cool- its ignorant and low class-If you cant communicate unless you f- word everything there are dictionaries that can help you expand your teenager vocabulary- grow up – show respect to others reading this blog or get off it.
Amen! And yes God is forgiving but there is nothing wrong for her wanting to honor Him by waiting til marriage.
Which God?
There are so many in the news at the moment, I get confused.
You may be demonstrating ethnocentric presumption here.
I’ll be honest , he makes a legitimate point. For women sexual activity isn’t a big deal, but men are different , usually once you start. You are “entitled” to sex or some form of sexual activity. If we are refused this our mind wanders to other people thinking about whether or not they would satisfy us in the ways that our girlfriends refuse. On another note , Evans comparison to driving privileges was spot on , I’m not really sure how you didn’t understand that , it was perfectly explained. It’s underhanded to take that away once you’ve given it to a guy , because we all know that the girl enjoys it too. Men crave it , women don’t , fact of life. Ignorance and simple mindedness is what was just displayed by you , try to look at things from both sides instead of one. Just trying to help
@Jonathan, you couldn’t be more wrong if you tried. It is not like talking away driving privileges. Driving privileges have nothing to do with a person’s religious beliefs. What you seem to miss here is that this is an opportunity for him to show that he cares about her as a person, as a friend, not just as a sperm receptacle. It’s an opportunity for him to show that the relationship is about more than his dick. It’s an opportunity for him to help make the love bond between them much stronger. Respecting her wishes here, would pay huge dividends in the future.
Some little boys will whine that it feels like they are being pressured. Boo hoo! Cry me a river, because you men don’t care that many women feel pressured to have sex if they want to get to the relationship phase. But smart women are waking up to the fact that a truly quality man will wait, and build a good relationship first.
Having the attitude of, “if you won’t give me sex, I’ll go find someone who will,” isn’t going to win a woman’s heart. What will do is kill what love and respect she has for you. Sometimes, to make a relationship grow, you have to put your desires on the back burner, and move your woman’s needs to the front burner.
A man would simply sit down with her and talk about it. When he learns that this is very important to her, he would simply accept that he has to make some decisions. He first has to ask himself what he expects out of the relationship. Does he love her? Does he want a lasting relationship with her, or is he “just kickin it?” If he loves her and wants a lasting relationship with her, then it shouldn’t be too hard to wait for a little while. If he isn’t sure, then he has to figure that out.
The simple fact is that this is all about choices. And in this instance, he has to choose between her heart and his dick. He can choose to take the easy way out, and go find a new sperm receptacle, or he can stay and build a strong relationship with her. Or, he can also just whine about how unfair it is, like a little boy would. The choice is his. Nobody is forcing him.
Actually, YOU couldn’t be more wrong if you tried, Jenn. She’s changing the terms of their agreement, and expecting there to be no ramifications. It would be like a guy who says he wants to quit his six figure job to meditate. Would the woman have a right to move on to a more financially stable partner? I would think so.
So stop suggesting that he’s all about sex. He’s not. But if any partner in any relationship (male or female) turned around and decided that sex was off the table, the other partner would be well within his rights to reconsider. To suggest otherwise is puritanical and foolish.
That’s why it’s generally a good idea for people of strong faith to only date other people of strong faith. The beliefs and values are far too different, and there’s no way to reconcile the two unless the person of strong faith compromises.
Evan, I never said he didn’t have the right to move on. In fact, I said he had to make decisions. I’ve said before, in other posts that he has the right to move on. What he doesn’t have the right to do is whine like a little baby about it, like some of the guys here do. She has a right to make that choice for herself. If he can’t live with that choice, he can move on. His choice. He doesn’t have the right to try to guilt trip her over this when this is something that is obviously very important to her.
And, there is NO agreement to have sex. as a condition for a relationship to exist. I don’t know a single women whose man sat down with her and said, “OK, we can have a relationship so long as you give me sex.” People just start having sex. For most of us, we just respond to the guy’s advances.
The problem here is that this is a very important thing to this woman. Nobody is asking you to agree with her beliefs, but how can you honestly sit there and not agree that IF he loves her, and is interested in the long term relationship, he would stay with her through this. Men need to stop acting like they are slaves to their dick. Real men can control themselves. I know men who have gone to sea for many months at a time. Women sometimes get medical conditions that make it hard to have sex for a while. If I were this woman, I would ditch him unless he can be understanding and supportive. If a man can’t agree to be celibate for a short period while they determine if they will marry, and then actually get married, then is he likely to remain celibate if life causes an interruption in their sex life, such as rough pregnancy, injury, illness, or being separated by distance for some reason. Some men won’t wait, and those men are not high quality. If he is understanding and supportive, then he’s a keeper.
He doesn’t have to like it, but he does have to deal with it, IF he wants a relationship with her. How he conducts himself if he does want a relationship, is also important. Acting like a victim isn’t going to help things. At the same time, she is expecting too much if she expects him to like it. They should both act like adults. Sit down, talk about it, make a decision, and then move forward, whether it is on separate paths, or the same path. If you choose the same path, do so in a positive manner. And tell me Evan, what is wrong with this? What couldn’t be more wrong about it?
I wholeheartedly agree you Jenn! Evan’so response Yasmine’s question concerning sec in a relationship is very one-sided. I understand if you aren’t religious, but I don’t agree with the way his viewpoint was presented. I, myself believe that there are certain sacrifices that would need to be made if you’re looking to gain a closer relationship with God and one of them would be holding off having sex in a relationship since it is stated in the Bible that fornication (premarital sex) is a sin. It would be difficult to have a deep, intimate relationship with God while committing a sin and knowing in your heart that it’s wrong. True, Yasmine could have asked the church, but to discredit or mock her beliefs is ignorant. And for anyone who thinks she’s holding off sex for commitment is also ignorant and small-minded. Sex is not an easy thing to give up especially if it’s been a consistent part of their relationship for a long period of time so for her to suddenly decide to omit sex for the ring wouldn’t make any sense, unless of course, she’s trying to grow spiritually and yes, if she means anything at all to her boyfriend he would at least try to understand and support her decision. If he’s not into then he or even she can move on and they can both find someone who they’re more compatible with.
As a feminist, I think this article is well-written and clever. You guys are misunderstanding the author’s intent. In NO WAY are they saying that she owes her boyfriend sex. On the contrary, she is free to make deny sex to whomever she chooses. Only she has the right to ddictate what she does with her body. Her boyfriend is not entitled to her body. However, she is not entitled to her boyfriend either. She certainly doesn’t owe her boyfriend sex. But we can assume, like most of us, her boyfriend prefers a relationship with both emotional and physical intimacy. She may choose the path of abstinence, and in return he may decide to end the relationship. Neither of them would be wrong in doing so. I agree with the author that this would be a poor decision on her part, since she would deny her own pleasure and possibly make someone who cares about her very dearly feel unfulfilled and unwanted, all to be “closer to God” somehow. Whatever that means. But it is her choice to make. FYI, all of you who say married women owe their bodies to their husbands are wrong. I don’t care what’s in the Bible. Your body belongs to you and only you.
Kristin at 1.15 said “But it is her choice to make. FYI, all of you who say married women owe their bodies to their husbands are wrong. I don’t care what’s in the Bible. Your body belongs to you and only you.”
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I am a heathen, so I don’t care what’s in the bible either, but if a woman doesn’t want to share her body with a man, then she shouldn’t marry him. If it feels like a chore or an obligation, she shouldn’t marry him. If she is not joyfully and willingly able to share her body with a man (most of the time) she shouldn’t marry him. If a woman marries a man and wants to take some hardline stance that she doesn’t “owe” him her body, than I say he no longer owes her his fidelity.
Let’s turn the this statement around, and instead of sex, let’s change that to conversation. If a man came to this blog and said “Married men don’t owe it to their wives to talk or listen to them. I don’t care what any marriage counselor says. Their lips and their ears belong to them and only them. ” How do you think a statement from a man like that would go over ?
I’m not sure if you missed the finer points of my argument, but I never defended this woman’s decision as deserving of sympathy. Many people in the comments section said that a woman’s body belongs to her man and I was simply arguing against that point. But if you re-read my statement, you will also see that I argued that if she entered an intimate, loving relationship with a man she truly cared about and then she later went on to decide to withhold intimacy from him in the future, that is her right as a person. Do I think it’s totally idiotic? Yes. But I’m an atheist, so I can’t imagine giving up real, tangible love in return for a better relationship with “God”. She loved this man and she was intimate with him in the past and it must hurt him to know that she is not interested in any further intimacy. But it’s her life and she can’t change the way she feels. No matter how nonsensical it is to me, being abstinent is the only way she feels she can be closer to God and that is very important to her. She owes her boyfriend nothing and he owes her nothing. There will be consequences for her actions and they will be deserved. If her boyfriend is unhappy with a non-sexual relationship, then by all means, I would encourage him to leave her. And if their relationship does end as a result of her choice, then that’s unfortunate for the both of them. But that is the path she must choose, and her decision isn’t wrong. Neither is his if he chooses to leave her. Sometimes people never find compromise and have to go their separate ways as a result. It’s a normal part of life.
Kristin replied to me: “Many people in the comments section said that a woman’s body belongs to her man and I was simply arguing against that point.”
Thanks for clarifying. In your post that I was replying to, you used the word “husband” instead of man.
to wit: “Kristin at 1.15 said “But it is her choice to make. FYI, all of you who say married women owe their bodies to their husbands are wrong. I don’t care what’s in the Bible. Your body belongs to you and only you.”
Your initial comments were speaking of MARRIAGE, but you are now speaking of NON-MARRIED relationships.
However, as a fellow heathen, I don’t care what the bible says either.
As far as anyone “owing” sex to anyone or “owing” their bodies to anyone,in a marriage or relationships, (weather you think the sex “obligation” starts on date 3 or the wedding), I think if couples, married or not, are in a continuous mode of meeting their sexual “obligations” with each other, the relationship or marriage is in SERIOUS trouble.
Love making should be a JOY in a relationship, not just one more chore to do like taking out the garbage or sweeping the floor.
Occasionally, one partner might not be really feeling in the mood, but see’s that their partner is really needing their physical affections, and that’s fine. But when the entire relationship becomes about one person collecting the “sexual debt” owed to them, then YIKES, time to examine and heal the relationship or end it.
One of the problems with marriage is that the law, and courts view it as a contract, yet very few people draw up a contract, a prenup, to give details to that contract. Thus we fall back on what the government cares about, which is primarily things such as money, child support, alimony, property, child custody, etc… Nowhere does the law care about sex. It used to, before no-fault divorce. One person or the other not meeting their “marital duty” was grounds for divorce, as was infidelity. In this way, it was understood that even if the other person didn’t literally “own” your body, they had exclusive sexual rights to it; rights that you willingly granted them through marriage. And it was fair because it went both ways, and again, it was a voluntary understanding.
Today, even though the courts seem to care very little about sex, so long as it is not sex that breaks the law, most people still see it as a part of marriage. If you poll thousands of people, the vast majority are still going to say that they believe sex is an integral part of marriage. Many would even say, “what’s the point of getting married if you aren’t going to have sex?”
I’ve always thought that the way the contract of marriage in this country is viewed by the courts, is a bit off. For instance, if I marry a man who went to college, and has turned that into a lucrative career, and then he marries me, and we now live together, I will share in his lifestyle, and I fully expect that to happen. But if I divorce him, I do not believe I have some God given right to part of his paycheck, just as he no longer has rights to my body. The notion that I have the right to continue living the life he provided me as his wife, if I leave him is a silly one at best. A lot more women feel that way, now that they may be the one who makes more money in the relationship. They see that the old way was not actually fair to the person who made more. I do however, think this should not be no-fault. I would feel differently about it if I have been faithful with both my heart and body, and then one day he runs off with his secretary. When it comes to contracts, there is always a penalty for defaulting, and not honoring your commitment to the other party involved.
So, now we come to my belief on sex, and what is “owed.” Sorry, but I feel very strongly that you owe your spouse sex. If you don’t feel you can honor that, get out of the marriage. Free the other person up so that they ca go find somebody who will honor their commitments.
That said, I don’t think this means sex on demand. You may legitimately have a headache, feel sick, be tired, feel super stressed (though sex actually relives stress) due to a pressing issue at work. Then you have the right to say, “not tonight.” However, if “not tonight” turns into a nightly saying, your marriage is in trouble. Don’t be the least bit surprised if he/she finds somebody who makes them feel wanted. If you were constantly denying them sex, or if you only give it as a reward, then you have no right to complain when you find out your spouse is cheating on you.
Kristin you nailed it.
I am FEMALE and my boyfriend just did this to me. He decided, without consulting my feelings, that we are going to be celibate now after a year of being physically intimate. Then when I asked him when we would get married he had no clear idea. So you want me to be celibate until marriage but you’re not sure when you want to get married. Ok, I think not.
It is not fair of any party in a relationship to change expectations midway through the relationship out of nowhere. I understand that now he wants to be celibate but guess what – he can be celibate with someone else because I am leaving. I am not going to wait around being celibate with someone who may or may not ever marry me.
Your last sentence totally contradicts your whole speech.
And from HIS point of view, it could be said, “If she loves me she will continue to have sex with whether or not we’re married. Her not doing so means she loves the idea of marriage more than she loves me.”
Tell him flat out you want to get married now or you’ll end the relationship, pregnant or not.
If you got pregnant to force his hand, shame on you.
If you want to get married because you got pregnant even though you practiced safe sex, well, you should have been practicing safer sex (he uses a condom, while you’re on another form of bc). It’s not fair to ask him to pay the price of marriage if that was not a foregone conclusion before you got pregnant.
Im Not forcing marriage at all truthfully idk if I want to and we both was foolish and did care about the fact I could get pregnant. It just happened a relationship has to work together if he isn’t going to respect her for what she wants and it’s right this world is just making sex b 4 marriage 2nd nature and completely ignoring the fact that it’s a comittment to one another for the rest of our lives and sex is a gift to married couples then they are not equally yoked and they both need to pray about things.
Hi Amelia, I disagree. The reason being that, if she knew that, why did she accepted it the first place? It shows that, even if they were married it could still be the same story all in the name of God. So marriage or not she was suppose to seek for his concerns before taking that decision
no matter what her reason was, even if it was not related to religion, she has her reason for not wanting to have sex anymore.
If she feels that having sex with her boyfriend is distancing her from her spiritual endeavours, then that is HER truth and a logic amongst many others (hers being divine). and life changes with time, sometimes we do things and we learn and we want to build things in a different way. If she talked with her boyfriend about it and feels like he is not willing to give up sex for HER wellbeing, then maybe it is a concern and she needs to sit down with her boyfriend and get into a process of choice. Or he chooses or she does. Sometimes, we have to loose things to reach a greater state of mind and fulfil a humble and worth-a-thousand-of-losses type of desire.
Amelia, I totally agree with you. I’m so ashamed of Evan. He often has really brilliant answers to questions. But this is down right offensive. She has no legal or moral obligations to continue sleeping with a guy if she doesn’t feel comfortable doing it.
To be fair, Evan does not say she has a moral or legal obligation to sleep with him. This boils down to one simple concept, which covers many things besides sex. If you renegotiate the terms of the relationship, do not be surprised if the other person opts out of the deal, and leaves you. I support her decision to abstain for religious reasons. I would also say that if the man truly lived her, this would NOT cause him to leave her right away. If a man truly loves her, this would make him want to talk to her, but not leave. They would have a very deep, thorough discussion about the future. If they have been together for a year or two, he would need to step back and think about whether he can truly see himself ever marrying her. He has to make a value judgement. Does he stay, and continue to get to know her, or does he bail out immediately. In my opinion, his decision rests on one thing…does he truly live her. If he loves her, but can’t see himself getting married in the next year or two, then he probably doesn’t live that much, or he just wants to remain single. Either way, it would be better for her if he chose to move on.
I would think that if he truly loved her, but was unsure, he would not want to make a decision to leave. Maybe give it a year for him to sort through his thoughts and feelings.
Thank you, Amelia. I totally agree with you. That answer was horrible. I completely understand where this woman is coming from and unless you understand (which Evan clearly does not) the conviction one feels when trying to move closer to God and have your steps ordered by Him, one would not be in the position to reply to the writer’s question. He should have skipped this one
She asked a question. I gave an answer. If you (and God) don’t like it, you may frequent another site where an unseen deity has a say over your private parts. It’s just not this one.
I think his reply is quite spot on, and you’re right, married or not, she doesn’t owe him a thing. But vice versa, he doesn’t have to stay with her if she doesn’t meet his needs, in a sense, he doesn’t owe her a thing.
Thanks dear, God bless you
Even if you are married that doesn’t mean your entitled to sex from your partner.
Well said. Thank you so so much
you are right with your sincere and polite answer
Absolutely right. And even married, you can set up boundaries for your BODY. After sex, you are the one that has to live with the idea that maybe some nobody has been inside of you, who does not even care. If my husband does not care about my feelings, I do not care about his needs. Period
Good Answer. The car does not have a life, is not needed to survive, it is not mandatory to be a biological being and does not have emotions, or feel pain. It is no comparison at all, just like her dad can not be compared to her bf/gf
Thanks Amelia! You don’t know how much your comment has helped me!!!
very well said dear…you rock..we should never have sex unless we get married. he will not buy the cow if he gets the milk for free.
Thank you Amelia.. i couldn’t read all of his reply bcus i got really pissed. Just so i make this clear to you Evan… drawing closer to God entiles you to be clean.. this lady is not married to this guy and my Bible tells me that sex before marriage is a SIN. It is shameful what this generation has turned into.. SEX which is meant for married people is now being used by many to buy relationships.
I like your comment you are very right
totally agree..
Youre right Amelia, she doesnt owe him sex, just as he does not owe her his cellibacy, but what do you think this woman would do if this guy said “ok we wont have sex” and then went out and got it elsewhere. Or what if this guy said “you know what, i wanna get closer to god and in order to do that I cant get you any more gifts or take you out on any more dates because it would be sinful to indulge you.” Im sure she’d leave. Same goes here, hes just lettimg her know, dont expect him to stick around for this BS and Im sure like some of the other commenters you think ” Well good! A worthy guy should never care about sex.” Im sure thats true in your utopian fantasy land but in the real world its insanely naive. If you want a guy to agree to something like that you need a man thats either asexual or a complete pushover. Short of that, its not happening. Just being real. The fact that shes under no obligation to have sex with anyone DOES NOT MEAN a man has to stay with her and put up with it. He is not ENTITLED to sex, and she is not ENTITLED to be loved. Too many unfortunate souls have bought into the feminist lie that you dont have to consider a mans feelings whatsoever while you deserve to be treated like a princess because vagina.
To answer your question: “And, correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t God all-forgiving? I’m sorry. I really tuned out during Hebrew school.” God is not all forgiving if you don’t confess and repent. You have to be sorry and promise to try to live in his ways and try not to sin.
Yeah, I don’t get this at all. But then again, I’m an atheist who’s happily been having pre-marital sex for 12 or 13 years…
Evan,
Were you in a bad mood when you wrote this? You seem to be laying on the sarcasm thicker than normal with someone who came to you for advice.
FWIW, I have no problem with pre-marital sex and agree that changing the rules of the game in the middle is unfair to her boyfriend. This issue may be a sign that they are going on different paths and may no longer be right for each other.
On the other hand, the girlfriend is not wrong if she has a sudden desire to follow more ‘rules’ (as some people interpret them) from the Bible, whether that be not engaging in sex outside of the confines of marriage, not getting drunk or not doing any work on the Sabbath. To each their own.
She is wrong though, imo, for being surpised that her boyfriend is not anxious to jump on this bandwagon with her and for just assuming he would. Once her life choices start to effect him, as this one does, he gets a say in the matter.
So I don’t really disagree with you Evan, I just think you were pretty mean about it. In case you cared 🙂
You cannot say that she is wrong. That is your opinion. You cannot decide what is wrong in their relationship.. She did what was good for her, just as when he does something that is good for him. . She may have made him uncomfortable in the change of habit, but she is not wrong for wanting what she wants. She decided that sex is no longer needed for her.
Why do we constantly make everything in a relationship about sex. Emotional connection is just as important for women, but I don’t see any articles that scold, criticze, then threaten men that their women will cheat if they are not satisfied emotionally. when we do not stress to men that they should satisfy us with foreplay and cuddling, and touch.
. We beat the “men need sex” horse to death. We need to stop with the push for sex, unless we are going to push for emotional connection too. Women get sick and tired of being scolded, criticized, and blamed, for not being wired like men. 3-22-13
The people in the world who want and love sex so much, jhave got to respect those whon hate it. Okay??
I don’t know how old this reply is but this has to be said:
WHAT THE F***?
Did you even read Jennifer’s answer before replying? Or did you just read the “she is wrong” on that paragraph and stopped there?
What she said in the first paragraphs was that it WASN’T wrong for Yasmin to change the rules, but that she WAS wrong to assume the boyfriend would just be OK with that. What part of that bothers you?
Jennifer is right, this change of her beliefs/attitude affects him as well so it’s natural for him to have a say. I’ll tell you, I try to be as supportive as I can with my boyfriend, but that “support in everything” is pure bullshit. I’ve had a boyfriend who suddenly had a change of heart and starting acting selfishly with everyone and everything around him, to the point where he actually tried to kill a dog that had bit him. We had been together for 2 years and it was great, but under the influence of some friend he started changing a lot. I feel no remorse for getting out of that relationship and not supporting him “no matter what”.
On a different scale, it may be the same case for them two. Her life changes may simply make them incompatible from now on and it’s not at all wrong for him to want out. Try putting yourself in his shoes (empathy, people, empathy) For example, if your boyfriend would suddenly decide for whatever reason that he didn’t want to kiss you for two years would you simply support him?
Evan’s answer does make sense — esp. when he’s trying to see the situation and (lack of) logic through a guy’s — more specifically — her guy’s eyes.
Like that Chris Rock bit, “A man cannot go back sexually, a woman cannot go back in lifestyle.” (Kill The Messenger)
First off, Yasmin never said anywhere in what was posted that she was a Christian (you said someting about the New Testament, which is Christian). She may be, but you cannot assume that. Many non-Christian religions/spiritual practices advise celebacy. And Yasmin is an Arabic name, so she could be Muslim. Also, the “Church” refers specifically to the Catholic Church–besides not saying she was Christian, she certainly never indicated that she was Catholic. Neither did she say that she was doing this for religious reasons–she said that she is doing it to get closer to God. And even further–she never said anywhere in what was posted that the sex was good.
So, given your misunderstanding of where she is coming from, your advice is way off, in my book.
I applaud Yasmin’s decision to follow the dictates of her heart and listen to her spiritual calling. I also urge her to ignore your uninformed advice. One misstep on her part–besides writing to this site, which I doubt will be sympathetic to her situation–she cannot make others follow the dictates of her heart, and a spiritual calling is usually a private matter between oneself and however one defines “God.” True, others might join us in our callings, but generally speaking, they are subjective experiences. So she cannot impose her beliefs on her boyfriend. He may be just fine with premarital sex, and he may be fine with her reversal on the matter, even if he’s finding it difficult in practice. He may have issues himself with premarital relations (if he has a religious/spiritual practice similar to hers, let’s say) and he may be happy that she is setting the boundary. Or her reversal might be a deal-breaker for him.
If hers is a true calling, she can accept any of those scenarios. If he is not in agreement with her and decides to leave the relationship, perhaps it is because there is someone more appropriate for her waiting in the wings.
And here’s another news flash: Having sex with someone for a few months does not give them ongoing access to your body–not even in a marriage, and certainly not outside of it. Each person decides for herself what are the appropriate conditions under which she will have sex, and things can change. And yes, when things change, the partner may leave. You accept that, and this is what being true to oneself is all about. Other people have the right to be true to themselves. (Which brings us back to the discussion with Lorianne–if she doesn’t want to be married to a guy who has online affairs, she gets to leave. Who is going to stop her? Karl?)
Men leave women all the time because they just “have to have” some kind of sexual experience–that is their right, and we all know this based on the scores of men who do it everyday. Let’s not suggest that a woman has to keep putting out and give up her spiritual pursuits just to keep her guy. Really. Such backwards thinking.
Thnk u sharie…. I second yasmin
I also had the thought that her boyfriend might be on the same page with her in terms of making their relationship more serious, partly because the LW says “until we get married” which implies they are already planning a wedding. If they aren’t and the LW is planning one in her head, then this issue is a hidden blessing that tells the guy that they have totally different expectations. While I understand (and agree with) Evan’s point about this feeling like the LW is “switching the rules”, it makes sense that as the relationship deepened and got more serious, that the LW began to feel differently about her choices.
For example, if a guy met a girl in a time when he was open to love but his circumstances did not really support it (just started a business, just out of a bad breakup), he might act similarly. By this I mean the guy might start out being more casual, less consistent and attentive; but become more consistent, serious and attentive over time. The guy would probably be willing to have sex during this initial time, but once the girl became “the one” in his own mind, he would be more open to switching to “serious relationship rules” vs “GF/BF” rules, not because either of them is a jerk, but because they are both reacting to a shift in the relationship that has already occurred. However, it is likely that both of them will miss the intimacy of sex, having already gone down that path.
However, I don’t think that is what is happening here. The LW says “he just tries to ignore the subject” or “he agrees but I think he’s just saying it“. I think this is an example of ignore the positive, believe the negative. I think the boyfriend is hoping that the girlfriend will change her mind or agree to continue sex to keep him. If she doesn’t, get ready for the disappearing act. That’s what his behavior is saying. I hope the LW will realize that her boyfriend is being consistent here; she has changed. If her desires have changed, it makes sense that a new partner would be a better match for her new convictions. Frankly, I think he’s doing her a favor by dumping her so she can find someone who shares her values. I doubt the LW will see it that way, though.
Yasmin,
I think you’re about to become single. Do the next dude a favor and tell him exactly where you stand on sex, so he knows what he’s getting himself into.
Well said, Marc. I am female and agree.
Thanks for echoing my point, Sharia. She can absolutely follow her true calling… she can also potentially lose her boyfriend in the process. That’s why she was writing me the email; because she was afraid of doing so.
I don’t blame Yasmin for putting religion first. I point out the inconsistency of her stance from a lay person’s (and maybe her boyfriend’s) point of view. Now that she sees another side to the story, she will be fully informed about making the right decision for her.
You don’t have to agree with my point of view to agree that it’s a valid point of view.
Evan Marc,
Neither do you need to agree with women’s point of view, about her right to stop sex, because ….. “It is still a valid point.” 3-22-13
We boys at first look for LOVE
When we fall in love and try to impress a girl, other girls become jelous
@6: What makes me see your view as not valid is your apparent ignorance about religion/spiritual matters and, by extension of that, your mocking tone toward her beliefs. Who is invalidating whom here?
Also, the phrase “lay person” refers to 1) someone who is not a member of the clergy or 2) someone who does not have specialized knowledge. It does not refer to someone who has no general knowledge and, coincidentally, a bias against something.
My comments in 8 were directed toward EMK@7, not Marc@6.
No sympathy from me either. This is bait and switch! You can’t change the rules of the game in the middle of the game.
If a man I was with suddenly discovered god… well, I personally am not a good example – any kind of religious adherence is a deal-breaker for me, but sex-wise, if we suddenly stopped having it, that would be the end of the relationship. After all, what do I even need a man for??
The folks who are defending the letter writer seem to be forgetting that we are talking about the type of relationship that’s based on sex. If you just want someone to spend time with, hang out with your friends.
I thought it was the type of relationship that is based on love. The bottom line is that she has decided she wants to be closer to God. She appears to have had a general belief in God, but now wants to try to do what she believes she is supposed to do. We’ve all known people like that. They weren’t going to church, but if asked, they would admit that they believed in God. Then one day they start going to church and make some changes in their lives as a result. Her boyfriend simply has to decide if he can live with that. If not, he is free to move on, and that might even be the best thing, if he has no interest, or belief in God. This will be a growing wedge between them. He may want to go to parties and drink until he passes out. She may no longer be accepting of that. He may want to listen to gansta rap, or death metal music, but this may be upsetting to her now. He might like porn and she may not put up with it now. So both need to sit down and have a heart to heart talk. It might be better for them to move in different directions. If they agree to stay together, both need to understand there is no right to a victim status once the agreement is made to move together in one direction, presumably marriage.
I agree. You can’t change the rules. My girl friend of 18 months wants to stop. I have no say in the matter
You are wrong that you have no say, Mike. You can walk. If you feel that your GF is acting unilaterally, is not taking your feelings into consideration, and is not listening to you – WALK. Because once you are married, walking will cost you dearly and you will have to decide whether having a decent sex life and a certain amount of self-respect is worth your family life and half your assets in perpetuity.
You are not entitled to her sexuality. She is not entitled to a relationship with you.
I think Evan is right on the money here (religious affiliation assumptions aside). Sounds like the girlfriend wants to dangle the sex carrot in front of the guy so he proposes. Nowhere in her letter does she say that they decided to get married, so her boyfriend can see it as a desperate ploy to “push him over the edge.” Believe me, any hot-blooded male will see through it and is likely to walk away. In his mind he’ll wonder, “What if I get married to her and one day she decides that we will no longer have sex until [insert the desired result to be achieved before renewing sex here].” That’s a scary thought for a guy. Believe me “bait and swithch” technique never works long-term. Those of us who are realists (Evan included), sex for a guy is like talking is for a girl – very important in a relationship. Yasmin, imagine if your boyfriend decided in January that he no longer wants to talk to you until you get married?
Not a fair comparison. That has no logic. Talking and sex, are not on the same plane, whatsoever. Sex is a strong desire. Talking is not just a strong desire, but it is a strong need and is one of the best means of commuication needed to inform people and give valuable information.
Imagine that you are trapped on a bus with one way out, and with people who are asleep. What will you do first, have sex with them, or yell at them and shake them to get out? What will sex do, will it save anyone’s life? When a man gets locked in prison for 10 years, what does he do about sex? Does he die, or keep living?
@HR Goddess, I wish you and others with like minds, would stop insinuating that women offer sex for marriage proposals. That is sooo left field. She may have given him sex, to satisfy his needs. It may have been tearing her up inside. Wow, the people here are so crippled by this sex thing. I really feel sorry for some of you. Sex has some of you in a stronghold. Some men are so blinded by getting some sex, that they do not put any work into the other part of the relationship.
Often women deny themselves being satisfied by their men in bed, all throughout the marriage. This is a true fact. Give a survey and allow the women participants to complete it anonomously. You will find out some startling facts. I know, I hear women talk all the time about this. Sex becomes a chore for a woman, when a man just thrusts. Thrusting is satisfied for him, but null and void for the woman.
A man’s ego can cause his wife to hold back on telling him that he is a lousy lover and that she has not been satisfied since she was dating, all while he is getting satisfied through the thrusting in one of her body cavities. These women do not look forward to sex with their husbands, because the men are either too selfish, too lazy, or just simply, do not know how to satisfy them. 3-21-14
Boyfriends like the one mentioned in the article, may never find success in a relationship, if he is going to bail out simple because someone does not to do things his way. If she is worth him having sex with, why not go ahead and marry her? Good point. You see, evidently, he just want to get the milk, with ot buying the cow. Typica males, often, just want to play.
We must stop criticizing women for wanting to be married and having babies.
You are vicious.. So can you go back and fix our evolution? Sorry its easy for men to get satisfaction, evolution did not give us anything other than that. No man is perfect, i’m actually terrified of women because of things like this. I avoid women because of these very things being said, its true, in this day and age a woman doesnt need a man. That terrifies me, it makes me feel as if the only way i’ll find love, is if I get lucky and she decides to put up with me for the rest of her life.
So I do have a question, since you like examples so much. What do you trust more? Actions or words? As the boyfriend in the article above was having sex, and suddenly it stops.. lets just assume..for a moment, that he’s sensitive? Caring? Wants to know why his girlfriend is no longer wanting sex? She gives him “to be closer to god” Now that is empowering, and totally her right, however, how is he going to know that she loves him? Is he simply just going to take her word for it. “I love you, i’ll just never show it or show you that I think your attractive” That’s basically what it means to men who care when sex is cut off… we like being told and shown that women love us, how else can it be done? I cant read minds, i’m just supposed to take her word for it that she loves me, and that cutting off sex and intimacy is proof of that? Its confusing.
Yikes. This guy’s response reminds me of a bad abstinence PSA. You know the one where the boy said, “Oh come on, it’s no big deal, if you really loved me you’d do it. ”
There are many different ways a woman can demonstrate love for a man. She doesn’t need to rip off her clothes for him.
Ken, expresting love can be done in many ways other than sex. We are not animals. Unlike them we can control our desires, we’re just too weak most of the time and give in. HaVing a closer relationship with God doesn’t mean that they love you any less. Some people who are in relationships and decide to follow Christ, hold off on sex so their union may be blessed. God created us, He would know us better than we know ourselves, including what we THINK we need.
BTW, I am a woman.
I agree with Evan’s take on this. She may have asked for guidance from her clergy, but I don’t recall seeing it in her letter. She asked for advice from a dating coach how her boyfriend might react. She got an honest straight forward answer. Just because it didn’t sound considerate of her new found religious convictions is beside the point. What did you want Evan to say? Good for you Yasmin. Go ahead and confuse the heck out of your boyfriend. No, she doesn’t owe him sex like one poster wrote. But 10 months into a relationship I assume there is love and some commitment. She does owe him some consideration for HIS feelings and wants and needs too.
I agree Sally, sometimes its hard to hear the truth. People just want to be told what they want to hear, and realize that she’s dealing with another human being with wants and needs of their own, and not a customizable item that she bought on ebay. God or no God, its never bad to consider the feelings of another person, when she cut off sex because of god, although she didnt come out and say it, that was a class “Its my way or the highway” Situation. The difference? The boyfriend didnt claim that it would make him closer to god..
Oops I forgot to write this at the end…. 10 months into a relationship, sex isn’t just sex. It’s intimacy, sharing, some might even say a spiritual connection with the person you are committed to. If her boyfriend feels that way, he has every right to balk at her unilateral decision to remove that aspect of their relationship.
I agree with Evan 100% as well – this is about consistency. Re-read her post – She didn’t say she confessed her sins and swore herself to celibacy, but even if she did rethink her faith – then that alone is something that can drive a wedge in a marriage bound relationship. This has nothing to do with sex, but with her possible tendency to change like the wind, and change the rules mid-game. Not someone I would call stable or self-aware, and in fact might even be manipulative. (sex-carrot dangling) BTW -marriage doesn’t guarantee sex, either! That carrot can keep on moving. This guy just might run, and have good reason that has nothing to do with sex specifically.
Yasmin, do I feel that you have taken it too far? No, because the best one can ever do is follow what feels right to them. But it’s also not fair to your boyfriend to introduce such a change in your relationship and expect him to freely get on board with you. This life heart decision that you are making will give him pause to do the same, and that is to be respected, too.
Are you willing to accept the risk that you may lose your boyfriend for waiting until marriage to be intimate again, in order to support your new belief? Are you willing to accept the risk that if you decide to continue to behave in a way that does not feel right to you that your relationship may wither on the vine regardless, due to tension, resentment, guilt, unhappiness, betraying your values, losing respect for yourself?
My personal belief is that if your boyfriend truly loves you, and believes you are the one, true woman he wants to marry, and depending on how you have presented and discussed this issue with him, he will be willing to wait until marriage.
Only you can determine what you are willing to sacrifice, should it come down to that. Nothing in life is free. Listen to your heart, and very carefully, I might add. An amazing relationship is not something to lightly toss aside, as you know.
Whoever said she never said the sex was good clearly missed the part where she explicitly states it’s AMAZING.
And while obviously each partner always gets to determine under what circumstances s/he will/will not have sex, most people reasonably expect that the circumstances under which they’ve been operating over the majority of the relationship will continue. So if you’ve been having sex for a year and then suddenly don’t want to have it any more until you’re married (which is how long in the future…?) that’s a pretty radical change. Similarly, if you used to be really lean and jog 3-5 times a week and suddenly stop and gain 30 lbs., it’s not necessarily shallow or “because you’re fat” that he loses interest, it’s because you stopped being the person he fell in love with.
So just as the boyfriend shouldn’t hold it against her that she wants to be closer to her idea of god, she shouldn’t hold it against him if he wants to leave her because that’s incompatible with his value system and his understanding of their relationship. Question, though – if he leaves her over this, and she starts dating someone else, is she not going to have sex until she gets married, or would she do the same thing all over again? Her answer to that question would tell us a LOT…
I agree with Evan wholeheartedly and actually really enjoyed the ‘car privileges’ analogy.
If the poster has been having sex with her boyfriend for 10 months, I do think it’s a lot to ask of him to just turn to celibacy until they get married. Like someone else said, she hasn’t even mentioned if they’ve talked about marriage yet or if a proposal is even close. Who knows how long it will be before a marriage even takes place?
It’s great that she’s decided to be more religious and closer to God, but that’s a choice she made and now she’s asking her boyfriend to support her choice for reasons he may or may not agree with. If he’s not religious, I can still see how he may respect her choice, but even then, if he doesn’t agree with it then the lack of sex might be a deal breaker.
I know several men who would respect Yasmin for her decision and would see her as a better partner for it. Perhaps her boyfriend is one of them. We don’t know anything about him, so let’s not assume that he’s only with her for sex–if they have enough intimacy to have sex, then perhaps they have enough intimacy to not have sex if the circumstances are not appropriate for one of them at this time. Being able to abstain and remain faithful is a sign of true intimacy and commitment.
I love your attitude. NOt all men are sex crazed lunatics. Some of us actually enjoy loving one woman for the rest of our lives:)
@Sally #13
fwiw, I can’t see myself staying in a sexless relationship until marriage and if I were the boyfriend I’d be royally pissed.
But it’s not just what you say, it’s how you say it. Evan made some good points, but she may not get it because he came off as so dismissive.
She may focus on the ‘you’re stupid for the revelation you had’ part rather than the ‘you are being unfair to your boyfriend by assuming he should go along with a change in the rules of engagement at this stage’ part. To help the letter writer, she’s got to be able to hear the advice, and a lot of sarcasm can get in the way of that.